Q&A on Zone 2 Exercise with Peter Attia, M.D.
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 พ.ค. 2024
- If you want to dive deeper into Zone 2 exercise, please see our podcast with Iñigo San Millán (bit.ly/3JtVNzJ) and our Ask Me Anything episode #19 (bit.ly/32wP86Y).
In this Q&A, Peter answers all your questions around Zone 2 exercise and training. Originally recorded as an Instagram Live in March 2021, Peter answers the following questions:
00:00:00 - Intro
00:00:23 - What is Zone 2 exercise?
00:02:52 - Why does Zone 2 exercise matter?
00:03:20 - How often should I do Zone 2 exercise?
00:06:42 - Can I do other exercises before or after Zone 2?
00:07:52 - Does it matter if I slip into Zone 3, 4, or 5 during my Zone 2 workout?
00:09:48 - What are the benefits of Zone 2 exercise?
00:11:18 - Is Zone 2 exercise beneficial at any age, young or old?
00:12:54 - Why should I do Zone 2 exercise compared to HIIT?
00:14:20 - How can I use a lactate meter to measure if I’m in Zone 2?
00:16:53 - How do I measure if I’m in Zone 2 without a lactate meter?
00:18:54 - Peter begins to answer live questions
00:19:11 - Why do some wearables have different definitions of zones?
00:20:22 - How do you find Zone 2 on a treadmill?
00:21:27 - How to use a lactate meter to test your lactate levels?
00:22:50 - Does your Zone 2 range change over time as you change your fitness level?
00:24:31 - How does MAF work in measuring Zone 2?
00:25:58 - Should I do Zone 2 before or after eating?
00:28:00 - How does Zone 2 compare to Functional Threshold Power (FTP)?
00:29:58 - Zone 2 for patients taking metformin?
00:33:47 - Does Zone 2 exercise increase HRV?
00:35:33 - What is the role of Zone 1 exercise?
00:37:12 - How do you find max heart rate on a treadmill?
00:38:31 - Does it matter if I do Zone 2 exercise on different devices (bike, treadmill, rower)?
00:40:15 - Can you swim for Zone 2 exercise?
00:42:24 - In Zone 2 on a rower, is 3 watts per kg good?
00:43:10 - Why can’t you do Zone 2 at 3 mM of lactate?
00:44:00 - What are the differences in lactate thresholds and functional thresholds?
00:45:42 - When do I check my lactate post-workout?
00:46:15 - Have you used your CGM to check Zone 2?
00:46:48 - Is there a benefit of hot and cold therapy to bolster Zone 2?
00:48:13 - Does Zone 2 exercise help the CNS?
00:48:40 - Can you take UCAN before Zone 2 exercise?
00:49:44 - Will your lactate be the highest at the end of a ride?
00:50:56 - What do you do for Zone 5?
00:53:06 - How does body comp fit into watts per kg?
00:54:06 - How does glucose disposal increase longevity?
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About:
Peter is a physician focusing on the applied science of longevity. His practice deals extensively with nutritional interventions, exercise physiology, sleep physiology, emotional and mental health, and pharmacology to increase lifespan (delay the onset of chronic disease), while simultaneously improving healthspan (quality of life).
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Notes: min 0-19 (until live questions)
Peter's Definition of Zone 2:
-Highest energy you can put out while keeping Lactate below 2 mM (milimole)
-Higher than 2 mM makes you produce lactate at a rate faster than you can clear it. Equilibrium is thrown off.
-Peter likes to be between 1.7-1.9 mM (previous video)
--
Why is it important?
-"Most important place to be training your mitochondria."
-Mitochondrial degeneration contributes to aging, so slowing that process down helps.
--
How often?
-Depends. If you're deconditioned = 30 minutes 3x/week, for example
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Where does Peter mainly do his zone 2 training?
- Stationary Bike.
-Why? (1) Measures Wattage (2) Able to keep Wattage at a constant value (so he doesn't go into other zones)
-Note: zone 2 can also be reached via swimming, treadmill, stair master, *insert cardio machine*
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Peter's Zone 2 Weekly Schedule:
- 3-4 hours a week of zone 2. 3 hours is the target for his patients.
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How Long should i do it for?
-45 minutes per session should be the minimum.
-30 minutes if you're new
-45 minutes if not.
-20 minute blocks or anything below 40 is not ideal. Short intervals < Long intervals
--
Strength training before/after zone 2?
-Strength Training -> Zone 2 = Not good for hypertrophy.
-Zone 2 -> Strength = Less of an issue for hypertrophy.
-Peter only does strength training + zone 2 combined on one day, where he separates zone 2 in the morning and strength in the afternoon (separated by several hours).
--
Slipping into z3,z4,z5 during workout, is it a problem?
-Yes. Once you get into z3,z4,, and z5 you start producing more lactate than your body can clear, which is counterproductive to that "sweetspot" of z2.
-In order to prevent this, Peter does his training in-door on his wahoo kickr (stationary bike) so that he can keep his wattage at a constant value (barely changes). Outdoors makes it harder to do that.
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Most important benefits?
-Mostly physiologic. More zone 2 = better you are at insulin sensitive and insulin independent glucose uptake. Makes for very efficient mitochondria when it comes to glucose disposal, one of the hallmarks of metabolic health.
-Every day you age, you become less insulin sensitive so you want to push that boundary as much as possible. Also helps combat ROS (reactive oxygen species) & other processes involing inflammation.
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Beneficial at any age?
-Yes. However, younger aged individuals have a greater ability to explore other energy zones.
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Zone 2 vs High intensity interval training (HIIT)?
- Long answer short, ask yourself "why cant I do both?"
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Can I use a Lactate meter sparingly?
-Absolutely. Peter has a lactate meter device to measure his lactate levels. Measures his lactate levels, HR, Watts, and Power after every single zone 2 session (this is optional). Pretty expensive, $4 per lactate strip + $150 Lactate device
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Don't want to use a Lactate Meter, how do I know if i'm in z2?
-Measure via two things (1) HR (2) Perceived Exertion
-Start off at 80% maximal HR. How to figure that number out? Need to really exert yourself via treadmill stress or some other way.
-Perceived Exertion. He can mostly nasal breath, but he also breathes through his mouth although he's definitely not out of breath or breathing rapidly from his mouth.
-Best strategy: measure your lactate periodically (i.e., once a month) and learn to rely on your HR + Perceived Exertion
Awesome notes, thanks for sharing!
- Inigo San Milan shoots for 4-5 times a week / 1-1.5-hr long training sessions
- he says if you can do 2-3 hours at some point, do it
Amazing 🤩
Hmm Idunno. I do about 5-7 hrs a week and I’m still overweight.
@@purplegirl8036 reduce carbs and sugars!
You’ll get the shape you want!
Good luck
Peter’s whole book he compiled takes this video to another level, times 1000. Outlive, it is called. This video takes his book to another level as well! Thank you, Dr. Attia; I found a Doctor in Prescott, AZ, who read that same book, was four years out of medical school, and was on fire-helped me A LOT. Genetic testing, the whole nine. But.. he treated every patient that way - he was the facility's medical director and had to see patients from 9-6, then do his charts.. 6 days a week!
It taught me two main things: one, it would be great for a second book to come out that is called ‘In Actual Practice ‘ or something for medical providers to implement medicine 3.0 on the day-to-day. Secondly, if a provider would do what was outlined in the book - finding the guy throwing the eggs - it would take about 45 minutes to 1 hour per patient. At least, that was my experience. Then again, I am 39y old, with three genetic clotting predispositions, one kidney, in phenomenal shape - and am SUPER interested in the information. I teach the local college Paramedic and EMT classes, work as medic FF, and am going back to school for advanced practices and degrees. Probably too old for medical school!
Thank you, Peter, you rock, man! May the Lord bless you, your family, and your patients! ❤
It’s REALLY amazing to have access to this kind of knowledge so easily
So true. Only problem is that most people never find the right sources like Peter, Rhonda Patrick etc. Too many egomaniacal snake oil salesmen out there making it difficult for gen. pop. to get good info. Great for us that do know how to weed out the rubbish, but I'd like the bar to be raised on a societal and even global level.
i know I am pretty off topic but does anybody know a good place to watch newly released series online ?
@@Badabinger problem is they don’t care
@@merrickroman5782 on his website
What's not so amazing tho is not having access to $800-1000 device to measure watts or a lactate monitor for a cpl hundred more dollars and god for I'd you wanna monitored glucose consistently that's $300 per month subscription. This guy claims to want to give access to preventative health measures to everyone but I'm still waiting for the how to follow his advice on a budget content. Not seeing any
My curiosity was peaked. I went to Duke Med School in the athletic facility where they test the Duke Cycling Team to have my zone 2 calculated. They first determined my max HR, 183. I’m 57. So the 180-age or the 220- age are way off if I used those for calculating Max HR. The med team put me on the ERG bike and worked me for 45 minutes bleeding and testing my blood continuously. They calculated my 2mmole HR at 157-160. If I used the 180-57 (age) as max hr I would undershoot my zone 2 by 34 beats per min. If I used (220-57) x .8 I would undershoot my zone 2 by 27 beats per minute. My point is to get your lactate tested to find YOUR zone 2. I would hate to think I wasted a workout outside of zone 2 based on a calculated number and not my biologically calculated number. I post this because like many of you I am genuinely interested in longevity and optimal health.
How do you recommend a normal person who doesn't have access to a facility like Duke's cycling team to get a lactate test?
@@postskeetclarity that’s unfortunate. Maybe google a local VO2 max testing place or lactate testing facility that is perhaps close to you. I had to drive 3 hours to Duke because this was that important to me. The next thing, possibly, would be try to schedule it near your next vacation or time off. There is no other way because you do not know your max hr without testing and the 1.7-1.9 mmole that you need to maintain is incalculable without the lactate test. During Peters interview with Inigo San Millan Peter mentioned that he did a zone 2 ride and tested his lactate at the end and it was 1.35-1.5 and Dr San Millan said that was too low for zone 2 but 2.0 is too high so you can see how incredibly important it is to make it important enough to get tested. Good luck.
@@king28401 thanks for the insight
sounds weird. 'zone 2' is typically considered gentle. 85% of your max is not gentle exercise. weird.
I wish Peter had said 'my max heart rate is x and my zone 2 is x'.
@@nonfictionone Agreed. I'm truly interested in this whole topic, but sort of hitting a brick wall. It appears what Peter is talking about is going to be a very specific and unique zone for each one of us...which I understand, but also bummed about. I"m a very deconditioned 52 year old, wanting to restart a fitness journey. At this point, I'm going to have to just use the old rules of thumbs, since I am not going to be able to test for my specifice definition of Zone 2. One would think that even if you got the test, that each persons math would change over time as well....so I assume in a perfect world, one would test monthly. The good news is that ANY good movement for me (in my current state) will improve my fitness.
Only 3 minutes in and i already feel way smarter 🙏🙏🙏
I was diagnosed with PACs and PVCs. that troubled me a fair amount throughout the day and often while working out. I started riding a stationary bike and maintained zone 2 for 30 to 45 minutes a day for weeks. My PACs and PVCs are rare now. I had no idea this would happen. Zone 2 felt safe, good for my heart, and this kept me going. Just thought I would share this.
I have PVCs also. It took years before my cardiologist finally gave me a carry along meter that caught what was worrying me for years. They probably didn't figure out all that is wrong with my heart, but I found that after they told me it was one of the safer conditions a heart could have that isn't normal I have been less worried about working out in a way that might kill me. I still feel the pvcs occurring but don't think they are as bad since I lost weight and exercise regularly now. They might be milder, but I still would really like to know more specifically why they occur so I can tweak my lifestyle the best way for me to get rid of them or reduce their influence on me as much as possible. I quit drinking too, and am waiting to make any judgements as to whether it changes the pvc frequency. Thanks for sharing.
Garmin was mentioned here and interesting thing about it it can actually try to detect your zones. I forgot about it initially and then went to test my max HR, and after that workout it told me that it detected my lactate threshold and can adjust my zones. And then it put zone 2 edge almost exactly on 80% max HR
As an aspiring triathlete, this is absolute gold. Thank you Peter
Thank you Dr. Attia, you have a gift for making the complex easier for me to understand.
Been following a Zone 2 calculation of Heart Rate Reserve. As a newbie I could produce 80 watts on the cross trainer at the target 140bpm heart rate. 6 months later after on and off training I'm up to 165watts at the same heart rate. The lactate method you mention will be something I look into. My sessions will only consist of Zone 2 + all out sprints (like sets of 40-100m sprints). I guess that's extreme polorasied training!
I also massively enjoy walking/hiking which is Zone 1. I do a minimum of 2 hours a day of it, at weekends it's 4-5 hours. I wonder if there are benefits of spending hours in this zone? The thruhikers around the world spend 10-16 hours a day for months on end at this zone.
Edit: 2 months after this post I hit 200w at the same HR
Literally just searching youtube to learn more about this! Perfect! Thank you!
While it just seems like purely data driven science to you, having free access to this kind of information is among some of the most progressive and helpful work being done out there at the moment. The societal effects these resources have are phenomenal. You’re doing good work Doc P!
Awesome as always, Peter! You make Toronto proud!
Dr. Attia, I feel like I am going back to college for free listening to your channel. THANK YOU SO MUCH
Tracking lactate with this level of precision looks expensive for someone on a budget, but it is good to understand these concepts. Another fascinating presentation.
Thank you so much for posting this, it really helped me and I truly appreciate it!
I Peloton 45 min classes in zone 2, 4 times a week based on Dr Attia’s suggestion. Yup, I ignore the class and pedal on. The leaderboard is motivational. Also, I borrowed Dr Attia’s moniker for motivation “KickAss100YrOld”. Dr Attia, keep the information rolling. Thank you!!
you just say in zone 2 despite what class does, or have any luck finding zone 2 classes
@@Juan-ws9sy it gets a little frustrating when riders blow by you but I focus on my HR the entire time. My lactate is between 1.7 - 2.0 when my HR stays between 149-154. So I focus on HR.
@@king28401 awesome, got it. New rider. Will be ordering a heart rate monitor soon
How do you determine what Zone 2 is for you, Jim? I weigh 75 kilo's so am i aiming for 2X that for wattage? 3 X? Thanks
@@DeansDesk without any gadgets available the best way is by perceived exertion i.e. a level of effort where you can still talk in sentences without being forced to pause to gasp for air.
THis is the most informative and clear video I've seen about the topic. Thank you!
Really nice for a brazilian to see so many things from Ayrton while you explain interesting things.
Thanks for sharing on TH-cam!
Great Q&A discussion, keep up the great videos and podcasts.
Phenomenal information. Thanks Peter
Thank you so much for going on JRE I never would’ve found your TH-cam channel and would’ve have started working out correctly!
Right lol, same.
Very informative, thank you!
Thank you for your work!
Just listened to the podcast with Inigo. With 12 years experience in critical care, I had a light bulb moment while listening why watts/kg is a better tool to use than MAF training for insight into fitness. Watts/kg actually provides some insight into mitochondrial function. That's amazing! Thanks for doing all of the research.
Exceptionally fine video. Thanks for your time and sharing knowledge.
Incredible video and I love the deep dive with Inigo San Millan. These videos caused me to subscribe on you website.
You are awesome and thank you for all your efforts and for sharing with us!
Awesome video! Started biking agressibely at beginning of Covid. I understand the value of zone 2....but everyone defines it differently relative to maximizing the benefits of the "endurance" zone adaptations for building the aerobic engine. I'm also a type 1 diabetic. Zone 2 is crucial. My insulin sensitivity has gone up dramtically since riding a bike. Thanks for the very detailed definition of zone 2....thats what I've been looking for! I like that you explained the 7 zone cycling vs. the actual 2mmol of lactate. Thanks!!
Thank you for another excellent, Doctor Attia.
This is great, thank you.
Thanks for putting all this information out there.
Peter you are a brilliant “Experiment” that we all get to enjoy, bravo 🎉 Good Doctor
I wondered why I had never heard of this man before. If he could give this information in a way that most people could understand he would be a wonder.
Dr Attis is a fine tuned specimen’ in explaining the whole zone 2 formula’ very interesting ‘ and will follow his lead
Brilliant video. Got a lot out of this. Thank you Peter
Great Q&A thanks! Just two comments.
1. There are very few swimmers who have the skill/efficiency and fitness level to truly maintain zone two performance at least while swimming freestyle. Better to stick to breastroke or gentle kicking if swimming is the preferred activity.
2. Cycling outdoors while remaining in zone 2, contrary to what was stated here, is relatively easy. With two caveats: The rider is able to let go of his/her ego while keeping an eye on our heart rate monitor. So much more enjoying than indoor cycling as there’s the added benefit of being outdoors and the forward motion, both of which have been shown to increase healthy mitochondria function.
Just my two cents worth here. 🤷🏻♂️
Thanks again for such an in-depth Q&A 🙏🏻
If you live in a hilly area like SW Pennsylvania with constant small hills it is almost impossible to find a route (not to mention a safe one) that can keep you constantly in zone 2 for 45 minutes.
I agree that cycling outdoors is MUCH more enjoyable.
Yes, the hardest part of zone 2 is letting people pass you who have no business being able to pass you. Got to let them go though.
Not a chance in hilly areas every down hill your HR would drop
Thank you! God bless
I am 61. Started jogging 35 minutes 5-6 days a week. After jogging I am doing 5, 4 minute rounds of heavy bag boxing, non stop, with 30 seconds rest in between. I dropped 25 pounds and feel great. It took me 3-4 months to get into that level, with time increments in the routines by month.
How often are you doing your 5x4 stuff???
@@jesseb5447 i'm sorry to report that my father, the original commenter (Indupac S.A.) recently passed.
@@fredlebhart1393 Sorry to hear that, man...
@@jesseb5447 thanks. we found him next to his heavy bag. his heart gave out. at least he died doing something he loved.
@@fredlebhart1393 I'm sorry for your loss. That's sad.
I am a 67 year old woman and just started exercising regularly, after retiring and immediately gained 20 lbs. I wasn't thin or fit to start with (BMI =26, now more like 28😞). Though I lost 50lbs on a keto diet 3 Years before. Been listening to a lot of Peter's podcasts for 3 years, but not so much the exercise ones til recently.
I joined a sport with many people around me, so hopefully if I collapsed, there will be intervention. I HAVE thought about this....my heart is in questionable state. Modern medical field really should offer more diagnostic tests as we age. I have been doing this for about 8 months. I think I'm okay by now, as I feel stronger than ever. But I did gain another 10 lbs right off the bat! 🤔 I think it may be stress/cortisol related because I jumped right in and pushed through, even though I was obviously struggling. Hoping this regulates itself eventually.
As I improved, I started to attend all 3 practices per week, then I added a treadmill walk for 1/2 hour in between days to help with aerobic fitness. I do love the new sport (dragon boat), but an hour on a treadmill is just too boring. Just picked up a used weighted work out gym set. Will add weights to my fitness regime. 💪 Not as boring.
This sounds like the perfect ad for Peloton. 😊 All this stuff is controllable, measurable and motivated in that system.
Very interesting and informative. Much appreciated.
Dr. Attia, I believe you are saving my life fine sir!
Thank you so much for explaining that! I'm a senior here 74 years young lol going to gym tomorrow lol I have an old life cycle 20 years old lol will try my best on it,....
I am so grateful for all the Health longevity and performance oriented information you are providing all of us!
Awesome content, thanks
Awesome1 Thank you Peter...
Very informative. Thank you
Great info, thanks
I am 72 and have done s tristhlon in 14 hrs. I love this video...as my goal is now as yours. I sm a retired RN currently decompressing years of service and hoping to not loose muscle mass ss I balance diet and exercise. Wt 139 lbs
I watched u on JRE.. I do various kinds of hiit, and cardio.. I do 1 exercise which can take 30 sec to 3 min, then I rest upto 1 minute then I move to the next.. I do the clean and jerk which I read helps mitochondria.. but I do calisthenics, weights, odd objects and bikes, jump rope, run hills, new road everytime, trampolining..
That was fun. Kind of liking meeting to discuss over a coffee, or your favorite fitness beverage
Thank you!
Always good info
the correct term is zone 1 of 3 zone model bellow lt1, where blood lactate
Nice conversion with other important philosophies in the endurance field.
Dr. Phil Maffetone is one very important one with very simple guidance and referring to heart rate for controlling. One important observation is that Dr. Phil Maffetone's method is de-coupled from max heart rate. His formula was based on his decades of testing athletes, he used actual gait balance/imbalance observation to model his formula. The great advantage of using heart rate for controlling Z2 is simplicity (much easier to control hr during training than having to measure lactate). Also the idea that we accumulate stress and heart rate accounts for that. Dr. Phil explains that yes, your efficiency will improve as you get better but it does not really require you to move your Z2 number because you are still able to keep developing with time, at the same HR.
I think the more research Peter puts into this, the more convergence we will see with the Maffetone method.
In any case, the more people gaining good understanding of Z2 training, the better!!! kudos Peter for always posting great content!
Peter interviewed Phil. It's podcast #144.
Zone two 3 mile run in AM. I just got the uric acid devise (listening to Dr Rick Johnson’s talks) so I will get it next. I am studying the science of me for healthy longevity.
Thanks for the video. I am just getting started on this using a treadmill walking at 3 mph for 1hr and hitting an hr of around 136. I am considering switching to an elliptical machine in order to preserve my joints. My calculated max hr is 171. I have hit a 181 hr on a stair master.
Still trying to find the sweet spot.
Doc, your awesome. I kinda wan be your patient, student and subscriber at the same time. Thank you for your great contributions to humanity.
Lactate post exercise measurement peak might depend on intensity. Zone 2 probably within 60sec but zone 4 and above may take 2-4mins to peak in blood.
I did a hike with a guy for about six hours and he wasn’t accustomed to hiking. It was not a really hard hike but it was a lot of uphill and downhill and by the time we were done he was literally limping with walking sticks to his car and I almost had to carry him. I wouldn’t even say that we were doing zone to hiking it was really just slow and we took a lot of breaks. Some people are really out of shape and I think the people that are in shape can’t understand how difficult it is for them just to do a little bit of exercise.
Great video
Excellent session.. Tons of information.. Million thanks..
Dr. Peter is putting me into shame zone. My zone 2 average watts is around 137.
Ultimate motivator 😊
Thanks 🎉
I’m an accomplished adult swimmer from the Total Immersion tribe. I’ve done a couple of open water 5K swims the past couple of years. I reached my pre-determined yearly volume and intensity peak a while back and decided to try
Z2. I have no early background in swimming so I’m not a speed demon by anybody’s standard. I do lots of intervals, Z3/4, maybe. Long story short I guesstimated wrong and went Z3ish for the duration. I was pretty happy with myself until the next swim with one day off. That’s when I discovered how I had used up practically all my glycogen stores on the previous swim. It took a lot of ice cream to get me back to normal (5 scoops over the weekend). Three days later I swam fine and that Friday I tried Z2 again. It was fine. My Z2 zone is approximately 96 to 110. The pace was 2:10 to 2:15 per hundred, glancing up every 50m to check. No stressing for the pace.
It can’t be done in the pool without superior technique. Most people kick to stay up and therefore tire quickly or blow right through Z2. You have to train for buoyancy.
Then, you can “relax” for the hour.
In 8 months or so I’ll have a hundred hours of zone 2 and VO2max in the bag. The proof will be in the mitochondrial pudding.
Thanks to my cousin for steering towards Peter.
This is awsome information
Thank you, Peter! One doubt: what affects lactate accumulation other than power output? You mention two very different lactate readings despite same watts and HR. How come? I understand why HR is affected by temperature, stress, sleep etc. But why lactate accumulation?
You should mention how ERG mode works on a trainer. It really is pretty amazing.
Great information and thank you to take the time to do this. But if you're a cyclist and like to compete a few times a year can you do 2 sessions of an hour each a day? Would that be beneficial to improve your zone two and ultimately your FTP?
Was doing this back in the 90’s & lactic acid measuring was an expense negative issue back then. HRM & use trial & error but get watts from pedals or cranks or performance measures.
Love the pp 5270g - classy
A lot of the comments sound like people are not doing zone 2.
Very few people do zone 2 correctly. It feels "too easy" to them, and so they do what they always do and go harder up into zone 3 and 4. Some are even describing HIIT - 2 minutes all out on their heavy bag and then 30 seconds rest, and keep doing sets? Crazy stuff.
Fine if that is what you want to do, but don't kid yourself that you are doing zone 2.
Most people can find zone 2 using the zone calculators. very, very few are unicorns and outside of that and need lactate meters and drawing blood while working out...
Great format of the video. Thanks.
2 CGMs on arms, but what the sensor under cap's visor? :)
I have 2 to 3 hours of deep sleep when i run in zone 2 constantly.
Good vid. Thanks alot.
How would you build your zone 2 training up? Can you do 45 min zone 2, some recovery and then 10-20 min more zone 2 (all cycling in one session).
Lactate test strips should be used promptly when removed from its sealed container - moisture may influence test results. Ideally, its best to have someone other than the subject perform the test.
This was really cool and great information, but overwhelming. This is not for average person.
My biggest question I haven't seen answered anywhere at all beyond offhand opinions is how much zone 2 you should do if you're already doing strenuous resistance training.
Great discussion. Thanks Peter. Ok now I feel dumb, I feel I need to read up on so many things. Saving this video to watch later after I read some more.
@Curt Landry ? ok wow; really. What should we think about that. Is it going to cost him for this?
@Curt Landry will I be talking to a Nigerian Prince that needs 1500 dollars to fly to South Africa to collect my million dollars for me?
Im all in!
Please call me.
My name is Joe Biden and I live on Pennsylvania Avenue in DC.
Looking forward to talking to you!
Call me!
“what really gets you in these damn strips” 😂😂😂 that caught me off guard! excellent Q&A otherwise - attention to the watt/kg metric is a major takeaway to implement moving forward, thank you
Dr,
Do you use creatine to improve mitochondrial function? Does Creatines effect on atp status inhibit autophagy?
Thank you
On the rowing machine vs bike question, I would suspect that it has more to do with the fact that rowing recruits more muscle (i.e., more muscle groups and presumably thus fibers) than cycling (particularly if you are on a road bike or on a trainer - you could make an argument for MTB have more muscle recruitment).
Can you explain to me the following basic: why is one exercice sufficient to train whole body? I understand the whole body muscle get "eaten" during marathon? But if the Z2 is below the point of accumulation of lactate why do we get sore only from the muscle group that we work out? I thought that is the lactate no?
Excercise has been my drug of choice since childhood. 59, 17% fat. Thks Dr. Attila, many years ago I started high fat and changed my life, your teaching was instrumental!
could you roughly define zone 2 as the maximal steady effort you could hold for some long enough duration of time? and if yes how long would that be?
This is great, but im still confused. Do you need to train below at an intensity lower than 2mmols for 45mins, so 2mmols is just low enough for you to clear the lactate build up? What do you do if the gap between low intensity and over 2mmols is super short? IE you can either do training at super low intensity or super high lactate?
nice video
The MAF method is not 80% of max HR. For me it’s ~70%. Nor is Z2 at 2mml/l of lactate. Nor is Z2 corresponding to low Z3 power in most people, rather very few. Also, Z2 is infinitely doable outside, unless you are continuously trying to wrongly maintain power at the top of Z2.
So I've listened to Peter's podcast with Inigo San Millan twice, his Zone 2 AMA twice and this video and I still have a fundamental question about how to train for optimal metabolic health with a limited amount of time.
As a background, I'm a male in my late 40s, cycle 4-6 hrs per week depending on time of year, variety of formats: outdoor group rides, TrainerRoad, Zwift, Peloton, occasional racing with lots of intervals/efforts in all zones. My FTP is around 300, 4.5 w/kg. Yes, I am interested in performance but ultimately optimizing metabolic health.
I understand that what Peter and ISM define as Zone 2 threshold, i.e. blood lactate 1.8 - 2 mmol is a proxy for mitochondrial efficiency, mitochondrial density, efficient fat oxidation, etc and generally overall metabolic health.
What's not clear to me is whether primarily training in zone 2 with the amount of time I commit per week (4-6 hrs) is the optimal way to improve my zone 2 threshold.
Based on years of accumulated personal experience, I believe that if I shifted my current training to primarily zone 2 sessions, my FTP would drop and I suspect my zone 2 threshold would also fall. This seems counter-productive to me.
My hunch is that for ISM's elite athletes who are training 20+ hrs per week, extended zone 2 is perhaps more beneficial and ultimately necessary to sustain such high levels of training.
I'm just not convinced that for a lower volume athlete such as myself, extended zone 2 training is the best way to stimulate and improve zone 2 efficiency.
Would love someone with the right background and experience to shed some insight...
I think it all depends on your goals. Given that you seem to be more on the competitive side of cycling (TR and some racing), extended time in Z2 while on low volume (6 hrs/wk) tends to be counter productive. Once you get to above 10-12 hrs/wk, then mixing in high intensity with Z2 makes more sense. TR is geared towards maximum improvement with minimum training dose - this is part of their mantra. FYI - I'm 61, former racer, now just riding to maintain fitness and keep up on group rides and I do 14 hrs/wk - mostly Z2. Only get hi intensity on group rides.
@@rayF4rio it seems like Peter is also devoting about this much time per week (4-6 hours) in total to several aerobic efficiency (zone 2) rides and one anaerobic performance ride (for him, currently 5-7 near all out one min efforts with 3 mins rest). I'm a huge believer in optimizing zone 2 aerobic efficiency and all the benefits that delivers, but I'm not convinced that Peter's protocol is the optimal way to get there or stay there given a low training volume (4-6 hours).
If the question is whether or not training Z2 4-6 hours per week will boost your FTP, it's obvious that it won't, so in that sense it's easy to believe you're "losing fitness" or otherwise not optimizing your training time if you only ride in Z2.
However, if you're periodizing your training, and ramping your TSS up/down dependent upon what stage in that training you're at, it would be easy to modulate your training stress by changing the proportion of your rides that are Z2. In TrainerRoad terms, a "base" phase would involve exclusively performing Z2 rides. Undoubtedly your FTP would drop by the end of that base training phase, but your aerobic fitness/mitochondrial efficiency would be higher.
You could then ramp up your training ("build" phase in TR nomenclature), at which point you might be looking at more of a 50/50 split between Z2 and more anaerobic workouts. You'll be able to get more out of those more intense workouts at that point because you'll expend less muscle glycogen in the rest periods between work intervals, and your heart rate will likely drop faster once you complete an interval as well.
When you're smashing it on a weekend group ride, you're spending a lot of time scavenging energy from just about anywhere but your mitochondria, so it's not exactly productive when it comes to general aerobic fitness. In my experience, if I ride outside for 60 minutes, I tend to ride pretty hard, and I might spend 10-15 minutes in Z2 (lots of hills around me). Keep in mind, that is definitely not a continuous 15 minutes in Z2, it's sprinkled throughout the ride. And without those long, consistent intervals spent under my lactate threshold, I would eventually lose aerobic fitness if I only rode in that manner.
In fact, I did exactly that over the course of September and October. I got busy with school and work, and I saw my riding time drop from 8-10h/week to 3-5h/week. I switched over to exclusively doing hard workouts indoors, and when I could find an hour to ride outside I would just clip in and go smash up some hills. Over the course of those two months my FTP dropped 40W, and I could feel the fatigue building up in my body. It was hard for me to understand why this was happening, because I was spending as much time (if not a little more) at or above my threshold, but because I had subtracted about 4 hrs/week of easy Z2 pedaling that I was previously getting, my aerobic fitness really began to crater.
Anyways, long story short, I think there's something to using exclusively Z2 rides to build aerobic efficiency, which if your time constraints remain the same, you can then cut back as you train/utilize the other energy systems in your body for more intense riding. I'm in my second week of exclusively Z2 training, so I'll come back to this comment and let you know from my little n=1 experiment if it translates to better performance in the spring.
Hi, great listen and very informative.. thank you.
But..., at around 10:48, you suggest that the fitter you are the more carbohydrate sensitive you will be - contrary to this, Tim Noakes, says when he was a test subject in the 80's, he was actually insulin resistant.
Could you clarify this?
Thanks again, love your work and commitment to provide knowledge to the people👍.
Hi Peter. When precisely should one measure their lactate level? For example, should I ride for an hour using RPE and/or HR AND then immediately measure my lactate after the ride? Or should I wait for some period of time, etc.? Thank you and keep up the great work. Love your podcast.
On the podcast he said you should test your lactate within 60 secs of finishing your workout.
I find that any calculations of my Zone 2 would put my Zone 2 HR around 150bpm. This is way way higher than what I can actually maintain while and staying within the zone 2 perceived effort at that HR .
Me too. I thought some 2 was easy.
Is there any benefit to consistently getting into z3-4 above lactate of 2.0? Does your body become more efficient over time and not need to make as much lactate when testing these zones ?
Even rowers can maintain higher watts on the bike than the rowing machine. It’s more efficient as it’s continuous application of power whereas rowing is intermittent
Looking fresh af brother - love the content you’re putting out. I’m 32 now have been weight training since 15, but anecdotally found high intensity cardio left me feeling like I’d taken some all encompassing health drug - glad I can regiment this into my training now I understand it better
looking forward for the 50 pages deep dive into HRV
Please stop saying deep dive. That shit was already old the day it started.
@@scottk1525 what do you prefer ?
@@felixwhise4165 Literally anything else (in-depth, thorough, extensive, etc...) Or even nothing else (ie: Looking forward to the 50 pages on HRV.) Aside from spreading like herpes, being absurdly overused, and often misused, "deep dive" is kind of redundant. When a video, or report, or show is focused on a single topic, it's implied that it will be explored in-depth.
@@scottk1525 thanks for the reasonable answer. As a non native speaker that's good advice. Cheers and have a great day 💪
@@felixwhise4165 Anytime. Cheers!
Where can I get a detailed program for zone 2 cardio program. I have type 2 diabetes. My BMI is down from 24 .5 to 20.2 but I’m still diabetic. I would like to reduce my waist to 28” from 31”. I’m 5’7” and 125lbs
Question... Is the watts/kilo metric based on average wattage for the ride or steady state output towards the end? I find after an hour,, I'm riding at about 110-120 watts, but the average ends up around 95. I guess one workaround would be to start my tracking after warming up for 5 minutes. I love this metric for tracking and want to get it right. Thoughts anyone?
Indirect calorimetry via a metabolic cart done at a high end fitness facility may be a viable option. They won't be able to measure blood lactate( for obvious reasons), however they can measure oxygen, carbon dioxide, respiratory quotient, heart rate, VO2 peak, zone 2 and anaerobic threshold. Zone 2 would be where the most amount of fat grams oxidized per minute and AT would be the point where fat utilization significantly drops off. Probably the next best thing if you can't get blood lactate measured or just really want some objective metrics.
I have broken my nose twice so nasal breathing does not really work for me but if I can speak or converse I'm probably in zone 2 that and heart rate is how I train and it seems to work for me.