Now I really want Clifford the big red dog to be earth's defense mechanism against Cthulhu. Every time Cthulhu attacks they promote Clifford's instagram to make him big enough to fend off the Old god.
The question is, which studio/publisher has the rights to Clifford, and what else do they have the rights to? Could we see a team up between Clifford and the Famous Five, for instance, against some otherworldly threat?
I mean, I wouldn't call them Kaiju at all, but I won't explain why because spoilers lol I get what you mean though. But I wouldn't consider what they're doing "rampaging" or even doing monster stuff. Some of the Angels attempt to communicate as well. What Kaiju ever does that with humans?
@@JelloFluoride Godzilla? Of course it doesn't "talk" to us, but you can definitely argue there is some communication happening there. And King Kong communicates even more. It's usually monsters that are suppose to be destroyed that don't communicate much (which makes sense... you don't want to feel sorry for it being destroyed...)
I would def call the angels Kaiju. Mechs are kinda different. A mech from Gundam is not a Kaiju but I might call the Evas Kaiju. But that’s more the genre/context of the story.
The important part of Kaiju isn't necessarily "big" it's "significantly bigger than than should be" Clifford is a Kaiju because he's Bigger than a Dog should be. Ents are the size of trees, so they aren't Kaiju, but when Swamp Thing took over a Redwood forest he did become a Kaiju because he was formed of enough redwoods to become much bigger than he should be and bigger than any tree should be.
I have two kaiju requirements that never came up in your discussion. 1) They are unique. 2) They have limited, animal-like intelligence. Great conversation!
Couple of things about kaiju. Kaiju means "strange beast" and I personally see that as an important element, and part of what separates kaiju from simply large creatures. Kaiju are by nature a bit of an unknown, they have an inherent weirdness to them, which is also where setting plays an important factor. Ents are known creatures in LotR, they're big yes, but they're supposed to be big, we expect an Ent to look like an Ent. Godzilla on the other hand is just kinda there. Pacific Rim Jaeger's however also get disqualified through this view, as unlike the beasts they fight we understand the Jaeger, we know how they're built and how they work, they're not a mystery but a machine. Another factor is size. Kaiju are BIG. Not just big but bigger than expected, again tapping into that strangeness. Nessie if viewed as a dinosaur, even a supernatural immortal one, is not a kaiju therefore, but a weird dinosaur. Admittedly this one straddles the line but then there's almost in my head a similar but separate category for ""sea monsters" which are in many way kaiju, and can be kaiju, but kinda stick to their own thing and play more on the inherent unknown of the sea than they do destroying cities and such. Going back to size though by a similar token the T-Rex in Jurassic Park is known, and while big is expected to be such a size. It's not a giant T-Rex, but a T-Rex, which are giant. Mechagodzilla tends to (afaik in most interpretations) have some weird alienness or strange sentience of its own. It's a kaiju because there's a weirdness to it we simply don't get. We may build it in some versions, but we don't understand it, nor critically do we really control it. I've yet to watch all of Evangelion, but from what I know we generally can control them, and I think in universe they're more or less understood as to what they are and how they work, but they certainly walk the line between mecha and kaiju, and I'd say cross it at times. Something like Transformers however aren't kaiju as one, they're usually not big enough for the generally accepted "bigness" of kaiju, and two they're too intelligent to really be seen as "beasts". Rather they're just giant alien robots. We understand them, sure they're an other, but they're an other we more or less comprehend and we can communicate with them. Similarly I wouldn't call Susan a kaiju. She's kaiju sized yes, and can play in many ways the role of a kaiju, but is critically not herself one. She's an empowered human that can take the a kaiju-like form, similar yet distinct. To better define kaiju, they're big, bigger than expected, generally around city building size, but not too too big. They're strange, weird, with an element of the unknown, they're not just monsters but monsters that shouldn't be as they are. They can be sentient, and intelligent even, but they must really still be "beasts", foreign to us an our general communications (although some, notably Kong, can stretch this point, which I think works due to the inherent connection of man and ape). They're not piloted or controlled, possessing some sort of wills of their own. I also think destroying, or at least entering a city kinda plays a factor in being a kaiju, idk admittedly how well this holds up but it at least feels right. This gets less definitional and more into the meta of it all but they're naturally beings out of place from the expected, at least the vibes feel right for that for me, though again I'd have to think more on that part. I'd also say that in many cases what makes a kaiju is not a hard and fast ruleset but a combination of qualities that together make a kaiju. Kinda like you need enough kaiju traits without any of the disqualifiers, so you may lack certain quality possibly but still be able to count.
> Kaiju means "strange beast" I hadn't actually checked the kanji before now, but I've been assuming the "kai" was from "dekai" ("huge"). Apparently you're correct (per Wikipedia), and "dekai" doesn't even _have_ kanji (colloquial). en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaiju
Adam should get a mic! (Just as a producer, like on the MKBHD pod. they don't talk as much, but sometimes chime in for info. so nice to have an info guy! Thanks Adam!)
Could it be that an implicit part of the definition of Kaiju is that it is a term used by humans to describe a rampaging monster that is giant in scale to them. Thus grounding scale and size. So SpongeBob would have a different cultural term as would the Transformers.
Brandon's whole long-con here is exactly the way I debate with my friends and I love it... Also they hate it. :P I love the way your brain works, Brandon.
Brandon is inconspicuously laying the ground for an epic Sanderlanche that ties it all together, and is having so much fun doing it. And Dan is all of us, good-naturedly playing along. This has been the best Intentionally Blank episode in a while by far. 😂
What I want: more of this episode specifically. Dan's face whenever he's thinking about what if this is a Kaiju? is just absolutely what I needed this week at work. Thanks Dan!!!
If Treebeard visited the Shire and stomped through there, would he be a Kaiju? Is the relative size of the city/victims relevant? If I destroy an ants nest, do I become a Kaiju? Edit: of course I wrote this before finishing the episode and they built to the question of relative size.
The EVAs from Neo Genesis Evangelion (NGE) are totally Kaiju. They're organic, they're born from the same source as the Angels canonically. They way that they "pilot" them is confining them in a mechanical shell, and empathy linking / mind controlling them. The link breaks, they loose control and they become unpredictable. NGE is totally a Kaiju vs. Kaiju story.
Agreed! They are capable of rampaging, due to berserk mode, and rampaging is definitely a core part of kaiju. Also, EVA 01 is 80m tall, so most definitely qualifies.
I agree except for a couple of exceptions. We do see one or two small angels, like the one that is human. That's not a kaiju. As for the Evas, I think not a kaiju when being piloted and fully under control but when they act independently and destructively, absolutely a kaiju
@wingracer1614 I would argue the existence of the smaller angels, then, reinforces the idea that the large angels are themselves kaiju, as that would make the large angels giant versions of a thing, as a kaiju is meant to be.
The sequel to Pacific Rim has a Jaeger that is being controlled by an alien brain, and I'd definitely consider it a monster/kaiju. Several of the things they debated about could have been settled pretty easily not just by size but also by their nature. Hasslehoff is not a monster, and therefore not a kaiju despite his large relative size. I was wondering if Brandon was going to bring up Unicron. Ultimately not all that different from Galactus, so probably a Kaiju, but I'd almost argue that world ending beings of that size and power don't really count as kaiju
Yeah I feel like I'm going crazy watching this. Two accomplished authors but neither is even _considering_ the narrative role filled by the candidate-kaiju.
I think one of the defining characteristics of kaiju are the fact that they represent something else that feels unstoppable, such as the atomic bomb (Godzilla) or cosmic horror (Cthulhu). Nessie and the Ents actually would fit into that category for me.
It FEELS like a slippery slope but really it just proof that children (and children’s authors) are the true kaiju pros. We adults just exist in the fringes of the shadows of kaiju. Long live NIMH!
I used to work at the NIH, and the admin office of NIMH was in the same building. I always squeezed against the opposite wall when I had to pass their door. 😬
Ive always thought kaiju monsters have to break the square-cube law. But theres no hard and fast rule with this either. But Kaiju are my favorite monsters so ive probably thought about this too long lol
I think a certain alienness is a required part of being a kaiju. A useful question to interrogate one's kaijuness might be "can you have a conversation with it?". If you can that surely disqualifies them as being a kaiju.
For Men in Black 1, humans would be in that "bigger than Kaiju" category for the civilations inside Orion's Belt. Plus those aliens playing marbles at the end would be in that category for humans.
As a fan of giant monster and robot movies, I can say with a certain air of confidence that there is no 100% catch-all definition for what constitutes a kaiju because you are always going to find some THING that doesn't fit the mold. If size is the cutoff, you're leaving out things like Ymir from "Twenty Million Miles To Earth" and the ants from "Them", to say nothing of the 1933 King Kong (related question: does Mighty Joe Young count?) Do dinosaurs not count? What about "The Valley of Gwangi" or "Beast of Hollow Mountain"? Or even Toho's own Gorosaurus, who is basically a generic dinosaur? What about the Indominus Rex? Frankly, I think a whole episode about whether or not Jurassic Park counts as a kaiju series would be good, since it ticks a lot of the boxes. Only non-piloted mechs count? 90's and 2000's Mechagodzillas were piloted. So was 90's Moguera. A lot of the time, there is no definition, you just kinda "know" by context.
Brandon's comment about the perspective has me questioning is an automatic dog treat dispenser magic because to a dogs perspective it must be so, but clearly we can see it isn't? Furthermore if it is magic, is it soft magic system because the dog doesn't know the rules (physics) or is it hard magic system because we know the rules the magic has to obey? I can't stop thinking about it and couldn't find clear answer in Brandon's lectures so any help appreciated.
Tripods from war of the worlds are piloted vehicles, the Martians in side are described in the book. Giant robots can be kaiju, but if the machine has a pilot it's a mecha. My person rule is that a kaiju has to be bigger than any animal to have lived on Earth, and not a typical animal of Earth. Transformers are not typical kaiju, but the combiners and titans like Metroplex or Trypticon could be kaiju. This sparked intense discussion in the lab.
OMG - NO ONE know serendipity. IT was a whole series of books about little creatures who learned lessons. The dragon who was a neat freak was my favorite one.
I think the monster element is key. Something needs to be gigantic and monstrous. Both of those things can be relative, but they don't transfer when the perspective shifts.
Is the Iron Giant a Kaiju? He's "only" 50 feet, and generally benevolent, though unthinkingly destructive in his initial phase, and in the original book, he defeats an Australia-sized monster through wits rather than brute force. On the other hand, I would say that Gulliver in Lilliput is a Kaiju, despite being both around 70 feet tall, relative to the natives, and a reasoning and reasonable ally. Or at least that he's one of the precursors of the Kaiju concept.
The evas are actually deceptively huge. There's a Small Worlds exhibit of Evangelion and the visual scale of those really drives it home. Now, whether or not that's canonically accurate size is another issue.
I was hoping Evangelion would come up. My opinion, most of the angels are kaiju. One or two aren't but most are. The Evas are not when being piloted but I would say the couple of times we see them act destructively without a pilot, they are.
As someone who wants to make a kaiju collection/battle game, I found this was fascinating. The relativity argument feels smuggled in from prior videos though. I would argue the size of the kaiju is also relative to the world it is in as a whole, so David Hasselhoff in a specific part of Earth doesn't count.
I am surprised qualities of human-like sentience and how similar they are to a humanoid didn't make the list. In my mind a kaiju s an animal...but then again Kiryu makes a good case for machine kaiju.
Yooooo!!!!! Overly Sarcastic Productions did a video on kaijus a few years ago, and I remember it being pretty good. Edit: yeah I just rewatched that and I highly recommend
I grew up watching the old Disney cartoon of Paul Bunyan where they said he was 63 axe handles tall. He and Babe the big blue ox should be counted as Kaiju, IMO.
In the final boss fight of most of the recent main line Mario games, Bowser gets a growth upgrade the raises him up to Kaiju scale. Does it being a temporary upgrade disqualify him? Does the temporary nature of growth and shrinking in Wonderland put Alice out of the running as well?
17:25 I found it weird that they didn't start with MG, but it was all a plooi from Brandon! 30:47 Kaiju is a human made term, so it is in reference to human scale In my oppoinion Ant-man isn't a kaiju, because that giant form is not his standard form/size. Other wise every charcter that can grow tall would be a kaiju
I would argue that regardless of size, Hasselhoff does not fulfill the narrative role of Kaiju. However, the human in the diving suit that SpongeBob and Patrick fight has a much better claim to being a Kaiju
This reminds me of the endless debate over "how big should 40k Titans be to really seem 'titanic'?". I think kaiju are meant to be monstrously destructive without meaningful intelligence. If they have intelligence that should change the narrative in any story that's using giant creatures. Because at that point it's just a kind of war vis-a-vis 'Stormlight Archive' and the Voidbringers (or the aptly-named 'War of the Worlds'). Those then require some proper handling otherwise it's sentient races engaged in slaughter....and...my goodness we're back to the premise of Warhammer 40k! To that end, kaiju typically belong (categorically) to kind of story telling that we may just want to call 'monster slaying'. H.P. Lovecraft posits a different kind of alien entity that is just so different from us that we can't understand it, and its destructiveness is just a side effect of its all-encompassing might. This is a kind of story detail and nuance that typically doesn't exist in kaiju stories. To Dan's point then, I'd love the idea of a Clifford story where he becomes the Ur-Dog and is so beloved that he transcends normal, rational existence and begins doing things like: 'his bark is so powerful it lays waste to a continent on accident' or something else equally ridiculous. That's slightly Lovecraftian, though I believe the Elder Gods were probably beyond descriptions of size and power intentionally. That kind of distinguishing lore makes for a different kind of entity.
Bowser 100% has a Kaiju mode. In one of the recent games, he goes full giant city sized Kaiju and Mario has to turn into a giant cat suit Mario to fight him.
My definition of a Kaiju is an inhuman monster that is typically the size of sky scrapper or bigger. My first thought was sky scrapper size, I think that's important
I agree with the argument about relative scale, but that entails that "Kaiju" is a relative term. According to this definition, nothing is inherintly a Kaiju, but Kaiju is a term used to describe monsters which are huge in scale compared to the observer
Look, if Ant Man is a Kaiju because he *Can* grow to Kaiju size, then Bowser certainly counts as one. It's like, his second favorite thing to do after kidnapping Princesses!
So One Punch Man is, more or less, set in a world of kaiju? Which brings up the question of sheer destructive power because some of the monsters aren’t humongous but can still certainly level buildings.
Gargamel from The Smurfs is a Kaiju. He actively terrorizes them and tries to eat them all the time. I think terror/threatening intent needs to be an element of if a thing is a Kaiju.
My definition of Kaiju is: One. Monstrous appearance. Two. Living natural disaster. So size is less of a factor when compared to scary potential and destructive force.
If I pirate your app does that mean I DragonSteal?
Dragonstole^
@marcomontero4261 and if I lift a lot, I become Dragonswole
@@Painter99 That would be if he pirated it.
😂😂😂
Now I really want Clifford the big red dog to be earth's defense mechanism against Cthulhu. Every time Cthulhu attacks they promote Clifford's instagram to make him big enough to fend off the Old god.
"1 like = 1 foot of growth for Clifford, Defender of Earth."
I would so go watch a Clifford vs Cthulhu movie.
The question is, which studio/publisher has the rights to Clifford, and what else do they have the rights to? Could we see a team up between Clifford and the Famous Five, for instance, against some otherworldly threat?
Clifford as be our big red spirit bomb against the monsters!😳
My favorite part of this episode is canonizing Brandon's thoughts on big bird as a "traditional monster".
The angels from evangelion are huge! One of them is the size of multiple sky scrapers. One of them even posses an Eva. Angels are 100% kajiu
Sachiel is the same height as Eva 1, which is 80 m, or 262 ft.
I mean, I wouldn't call them Kaiju at all, but I won't explain why because spoilers lol I get what you mean though. But I wouldn't consider what they're doing "rampaging" or even doing monster stuff. Some of the Angels attempt to communicate as well. What Kaiju ever does that with humans?
@@JelloFluoride Godzilla? Of course it doesn't "talk" to us, but you can definitely argue there is some communication happening there. And King Kong communicates even more. It's usually monsters that are suppose to be destroyed that don't communicate much (which makes sense... you don't want to feel sorry for it being destroyed...)
I would def call the angels Kaiju. Mechs are kinda different. A mech from Gundam is not a Kaiju but I might call the Evas Kaiju. But that’s more the genre/context of the story.
The important part of Kaiju isn't necessarily "big" it's "significantly bigger than than should be" Clifford is a Kaiju because he's Bigger than a Dog should be. Ents are the size of trees, so they aren't Kaiju, but when Swamp Thing took over a Redwood forest he did become a Kaiju because he was formed of enough redwoods to become much bigger than he should be and bigger than any tree should be.
This makes perfect sense.
But clifford is also a fully trained pet which fails to meet the literal translation of kaiju of "strange beast". Clifford is familiar pet.
I love to see Brandon playing with Dan's mind... watching the wheels turning was great as Brandon sought to find loopholes in the definitions
This is the first time I've seen sassy editor in these videos, and I need more please
I have two kaiju requirements that never came up in your discussion.
1) They are unique.
2) They have limited, animal-like intelligence.
Great conversation!
So Son of Godzilla is not a kaiju?
Couple of things about kaiju. Kaiju means "strange beast" and I personally see that as an important element, and part of what separates kaiju from simply large creatures. Kaiju are by nature a bit of an unknown, they have an inherent weirdness to them, which is also where setting plays an important factor.
Ents are known creatures in LotR, they're big yes, but they're supposed to be big, we expect an Ent to look like an Ent. Godzilla on the other hand is just kinda there. Pacific Rim Jaeger's however also get disqualified through this view, as unlike the beasts they fight we understand the Jaeger, we know how they're built and how they work, they're not a mystery but a machine.
Another factor is size. Kaiju are BIG. Not just big but bigger than expected, again tapping into that strangeness. Nessie if viewed as a dinosaur, even a supernatural immortal one, is not a kaiju therefore, but a weird dinosaur. Admittedly this one straddles the line but then there's almost in my head a similar but separate category for ""sea monsters" which are in many way kaiju, and can be kaiju, but kinda stick to their own thing and play more on the inherent unknown of the sea than they do destroying cities and such. Going back to size though by a similar token the T-Rex in Jurassic Park is known, and while big is expected to be such a size. It's not a giant T-Rex, but a T-Rex, which are giant.
Mechagodzilla tends to (afaik in most interpretations) have some weird alienness or strange sentience of its own. It's a kaiju because there's a weirdness to it we simply don't get. We may build it in some versions, but we don't understand it, nor critically do we really control it. I've yet to watch all of Evangelion, but from what I know we generally can control them, and I think in universe they're more or less understood as to what they are and how they work, but they certainly walk the line between mecha and kaiju, and I'd say cross it at times.
Something like Transformers however aren't kaiju as one, they're usually not big enough for the generally accepted "bigness" of kaiju, and two they're too intelligent to really be seen as "beasts". Rather they're just giant alien robots. We understand them, sure they're an other, but they're an other we more or less comprehend and we can communicate with them. Similarly I wouldn't call Susan a kaiju. She's kaiju sized yes, and can play in many ways the role of a kaiju, but is critically not herself one. She's an empowered human that can take the a kaiju-like form, similar yet distinct.
To better define kaiju, they're big, bigger than expected, generally around city building size, but not too too big. They're strange, weird, with an element of the unknown, they're not just monsters but monsters that shouldn't be as they are. They can be sentient, and intelligent even, but they must really still be "beasts", foreign to us an our general communications (although some, notably Kong, can stretch this point, which I think works due to the inherent connection of man and ape). They're not piloted or controlled, possessing some sort of wills of their own. I also think destroying, or at least entering a city kinda plays a factor in being a kaiju, idk admittedly how well this holds up but it at least feels right. This gets less definitional and more into the meta of it all but they're naturally beings out of place from the expected, at least the vibes feel right for that for me, though again I'd have to think more on that part.
I'd also say that in many cases what makes a kaiju is not a hard and fast ruleset but a combination of qualities that together make a kaiju. Kinda like you need enough kaiju traits without any of the disqualifiers, so you may lack certain quality possibly but still be able to count.
This very well phrases what I was thinking on this topic. Very well said!
> Kaiju means "strange beast"
I hadn't actually checked the kanji before now, but I've been assuming the "kai" was from "dekai" ("huge"). Apparently you're correct (per Wikipedia), and "dekai" doesn't even _have_ kanji (colloquial).
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaiju
@edbrannin I know I'm late to the party, but I thought I should inform you that でかい is written 巨い.
Adam should get a mic! (Just as a producer, like on the MKBHD pod. they don't talk as much, but sometimes chime in for info. so nice to have an info guy! Thanks Adam!)
Could it be that an implicit part of the definition of Kaiju is that it is a term used by humans to describe a rampaging monster that is giant in scale to them. Thus grounding scale and size. So SpongeBob would have a different cultural term as would the Transformers.
Brandon's whole long-con here is exactly the way I debate with my friends and I love it... Also they hate it. :P
I love the way your brain works, Brandon.
YES! Serendipity is one of my favorite childhood books, I don't remember a whole lot about it but it is indeed a real book Mr. Editor
This is just the improved version of Socrates's question to define a human
*Throws featherless chicken on the ground* - "BEHOLD! A MAN!"
Going along with the Transformers, Trypticon and Metroplex are the big ones you're looking for.
Brandon is inconspicuously laying the ground for an epic Sanderlanche that ties it all together, and is having so much fun doing it. And Dan is all of us, good-naturedly playing along. This has been the best Intentionally Blank episode in a while by far. 😂
What I want: more of this episode specifically. Dan's face whenever he's thinking about what if this is a Kaiju? is just absolutely what I needed this week at work. Thanks Dan!!!
If Treebeard visited the Shire and stomped through there, would he be a Kaiju? Is the relative size of the city/victims relevant? If I destroy an ants nest, do I become a Kaiju?
Edit: of course I wrote this before finishing the episode and they built to the question of relative size.
This might be my favourite episode of this podcast
The EVAs from Neo Genesis Evangelion (NGE) are totally Kaiju. They're organic, they're born from the same source as the Angels canonically. They way that they "pilot" them is confining them in a mechanical shell, and empathy linking / mind controlling them. The link breaks, they loose control and they become unpredictable.
NGE is totally a Kaiju vs. Kaiju story.
Agreed! They are capable of rampaging, due to berserk mode, and rampaging is definitely a core part of kaiju. Also, EVA 01 is 80m tall, so most definitely qualifies.
I agree except for a couple of exceptions. We do see one or two small angels, like the one that is human. That's not a kaiju. As for the Evas, I think not a kaiju when being piloted and fully under control but when they act independently and destructively, absolutely a kaiju
@wingracer1614 I would argue the existence of the smaller angels, then, reinforces the idea that the large angels are themselves kaiju, as that would make the large angels giant versions of a thing, as a kaiju is meant to be.
@@WizardSkeni I agree. I was only arguing that small angels would not be kaiju and we saw at least one of those.
Kaiju have to be monsters. Most giant robots aren't monsters, mechagodzilla is a monster AND a robot.
It was almost annoying how this point of monster resemblance wasn't considered/glossed over.
@@no_problem8023 Yeah. The rampagability is core to the kaiju category.
The sequel to Pacific Rim has a Jaeger that is being controlled by an alien brain, and I'd definitely consider it a monster/kaiju. Several of the things they debated about could have been settled pretty easily not just by size but also by their nature. Hasslehoff is not a monster, and therefore not a kaiju despite his large relative size.
I was wondering if Brandon was going to bring up Unicron. Ultimately not all that different from Galactus, so probably a Kaiju, but I'd almost argue that world ending beings of that size and power don't really count as kaiju
@@seidmadr2024 Exactly. The "Rampagability index" for each creature has to be measured!!!
Yeah I feel like I'm going crazy watching this. Two accomplished authors but neither is even _considering_ the narrative role filled by the candidate-kaiju.
I think one of the defining characteristics of kaiju are the fact that they represent something else that feels unstoppable, such as the atomic bomb (Godzilla) or cosmic horror (Cthulhu). Nessie and the Ents actually would fit into that category for me.
It FEELS like a slippery slope but really it just proof that children (and children’s authors) are the true kaiju pros. We adults just exist in the fringes of the shadows of kaiju. Long live NIMH!
I used to work at the NIH, and the admin office of NIMH was in the same building. I always squeezed against the opposite wall when I had to pass their door. 😬
Totally get that!
THESE PODCAST EPISODES SHOULD BE 1 HOIUR LONG MINIMUM thank you
Ive always thought kaiju monsters have to break the square-cube law. But theres no hard and fast rule with this either. But Kaiju are my favorite monsters so ive probably thought about this too long lol
To Brandon's point about Hasselhoff, Gargamel would probably be a Kaiju for the Smurfs.
100% he is.
I love everything about this episode, other than how short it is
This episode was excellent and entertaining (they all are generally, this one stood out).
I love this conversation so much. Thanks dudes.
I love the inclusion of the pictures in the stream. :)
now we're tackling the great philosophical questions :) what a great episode
I think a certain alienness is a required part of being a kaiju. A useful question to interrogate one's kaijuness might be "can you have a conversation with it?". If you can that surely disqualifies them as being a kaiju.
Kaiju must have beast level intelligence.
Kaiju can be smart. Kaiju No. 8 has human level intelligence.
I didnt wake up this morning, thinking that I would get a socratic dialog on what is a Kaiju but I'm here for it.
I enjoyed that conversation far more than I expected too haha amazing
Aww, that was really sweet. Ben is too big for this world! But he is often destructive even though it’s accidental 😢
I couldn't hear what Adam was saying at all 🫠 very entertaining/creative episode tho! Thank you for the many hours of entertainment.
I always said Ant-Man 3 should have been a Kaiju movie where he has to fight Fin Fang Foom.
For Men in Black 1, humans would be in that "bigger than Kaiju" category for the civilations inside Orion's Belt. Plus those aliens playing marbles at the end would be in that category for humans.
The aliens in the end of MiB are FAR to big to be kaiju, as established by the rules in this episode.
@@Merecir Yes, thats what my post says.
@@Seth1459 Right. 😅
"Fukui-san?" will always be my favorite interrupt.
As a fan of giant monster and robot movies, I can say with a certain air of confidence that there is no 100% catch-all definition for what constitutes a kaiju because you are always going to find some THING that doesn't fit the mold.
If size is the cutoff, you're leaving out things like Ymir from "Twenty Million Miles To Earth" and the ants from "Them", to say nothing of the 1933 King Kong (related question: does Mighty Joe Young count?)
Do dinosaurs not count? What about "The Valley of Gwangi" or "Beast of Hollow Mountain"? Or even Toho's own Gorosaurus, who is basically a generic dinosaur? What about the Indominus Rex? Frankly, I think a whole episode about whether or not Jurassic Park counts as a kaiju series would be good, since it ticks a lot of the boxes.
Only non-piloted mechs count? 90's and 2000's Mechagodzillas were piloted. So was 90's Moguera.
A lot of the time, there is no definition, you just kinda "know" by context.
Brandon's comment about the perspective has me questioning is an automatic dog treat dispenser magic because to a dogs perspective it must be so, but clearly we can see it isn't? Furthermore if it is magic, is it soft magic system because the dog doesn't know the rules (physics) or is it hard magic system because we know the rules the magic has to obey? I can't stop thinking about it and couldn't find clear answer in Brandon's lectures so any help appreciated.
Cant stress enough how better Brandon looks with the beard.
Wooo! New episode!
Tripods from war of the worlds are piloted vehicles, the Martians in side are described in the book. Giant robots can be kaiju, but if the machine has a pilot it's a mecha. My person rule is that a kaiju has to be bigger than any animal to have lived on Earth, and not a typical animal of Earth. Transformers are not typical kaiju, but the combiners and titans like Metroplex or Trypticon could be kaiju. This sparked intense discussion in the lab.
David Haseloff is a Kaiju architype but is not an actual Kaiju, it's about the context. Really enjoyed this one gentlemen lol.
Hey! I used to have all the Serendipity Books! Im glad Im not the only one who remembers them.
OMG - NO ONE know serendipity. IT was a whole series of books about little creatures who learned lessons. The dragon who was a neat freak was my favorite one.
I was typing up the example of 100s of Godzillas not being kaiju when Dan said that, good stuff guys.
If Clifford destroys a city wouldn't people stop loving him and he would shrink?
Evas themselves are absolutely organic with a will of their own, despite the cockpit
Super fun episode, loved it!
I think the monster element is key. Something needs to be gigantic and monstrous. Both of those things can be relative, but they don't transfer when the perspective shifts.
Hearing that Susan/Ginormica qualifies is so cool
Is the Iron Giant a Kaiju? He's "only" 50 feet, and generally benevolent, though unthinkingly destructive in his initial phase, and in the original book, he defeats an Australia-sized monster through wits rather than brute force.
On the other hand, I would say that Gulliver in Lilliput is a Kaiju, despite being both around 70 feet tall, relative to the natives, and a reasoning and reasonable ally. Or at least that he's one of the precursors of the Kaiju concept.
The evas are actually deceptively huge. There's a Small Worlds exhibit of Evangelion and the visual scale of those really drives it home. Now, whether or not that's canonically accurate size is another issue.
I was hoping Evangelion would come up. My opinion, most of the angels are kaiju. One or two aren't but most are. The Evas are not when being piloted but I would say the couple of times we see them act destructively without a pilot, they are.
Alt title: Branderson and Dwells Upset Every Daikaiju Fan
As someone who wants to make a kaiju collection/battle game, I found this was fascinating. The relativity argument feels smuggled in from prior videos though. I would argue the size of the kaiju is also relative to the world it is in as a whole, so David Hasselhoff in a specific part of Earth doesn't count.
I am surprised qualities of human-like sentience and how similar they are to a humanoid didn't make the list. In my mind a kaiju s an animal...but then again Kiryu makes a good case for machine kaiju.
Stay Puft Marshmallow creature from Ghostbusters. Is that a Kaiju? YES! They did cover it!
I love these nerd discussions so much. 😂❤
The loch Ness monster is a cryptic. I feel like that's its own category, like Bigfoot or chupacabras
I don't know much about Kaiju, but I feel like there's an aspect of mindlessness to Kaiju.
Yooooo!!!!! Overly Sarcastic Productions did a video on kaijus a few years ago, and I remember it being pretty good.
Edit: yeah I just rewatched that and I highly recommend
Trypticon and Metroplex are kaiju! Love it
I grew up watching the old Disney cartoon of Paul Bunyan where they said he was 63 axe handles tall. He and Babe the big blue ox should be counted as Kaiju, IMO.
for the galactus size issue, I would say categories are cumulative, so it can be a kaiju, but its also another thing
Ive been waiting for this episode 😊
Small Kaijus are obviously Kawaiijus
Nessie acted very much like a Kaiju in the classic Doctor Who, "The Terror of the Zygons"
In the final boss fight of most of the recent main line Mario games, Bowser gets a growth upgrade the raises him up to Kaiju scale. Does it being a temporary upgrade disqualify him? Does the temporary nature of growth and shrinking in Wonderland put Alice out of the running as well?
Not sure if you already know this, but there is a clip of the Bearglar stealing the lasagna
I loved the kaiju quiz.
You should make a website as a progressive web app, a web site that behave both as a web page and an app
17:25 I found it weird that they didn't start with MG, but it was all a plooi from Brandon!
30:47 Kaiju is a human made term, so it is in reference to human scale
In my oppoinion Ant-man isn't a kaiju, because that giant form is not his standard form/size. Other wise every charcter that can grow tall would be a kaiju
I would argue that regardless of size, Hasselhoff does not fulfill the narrative role of Kaiju. However, the human in the diving suit that SpongeBob and Patrick fight has a much better claim to being a Kaiju
My 7 year old overheard this podcast and I've never heard so many opinions.
I call creatures that can destroy a planet, Gargonealon.
This reminds me of the endless debate over "how big should 40k Titans be to really seem 'titanic'?".
I think kaiju are meant to be monstrously destructive without meaningful intelligence. If they have intelligence that should change the narrative in any story that's using giant creatures. Because at that point it's just a kind of war vis-a-vis 'Stormlight Archive' and the Voidbringers (or the aptly-named 'War of the Worlds'). Those then require some proper handling otherwise it's sentient races engaged in slaughter....and...my goodness we're back to the premise of Warhammer 40k! To that end, kaiju typically belong (categorically) to kind of story telling that we may just want to call 'monster slaying'.
H.P. Lovecraft posits a different kind of alien entity that is just so different from us that we can't understand it, and its destructiveness is just a side effect of its all-encompassing might. This is a kind of story detail and nuance that typically doesn't exist in kaiju stories. To Dan's point then, I'd love the idea of a Clifford story where he becomes the Ur-Dog and is so beloved that he transcends normal, rational existence and begins doing things like: 'his bark is so powerful it lays waste to a continent on accident' or something else equally ridiculous. That's slightly Lovecraftian, though I believe the Elder Gods were probably beyond descriptions of size and power intentionally. That kind of distinguishing lore makes for a different kind of entity.
Bowser 100% has a Kaiju mode. In one of the recent games, he goes full giant city sized Kaiju and Mario has to turn into a giant cat suit Mario to fight him.
Mecha-G is a cybernetic being, though, so he’s a kaiju because of his organic bits.
Paul Bunyan and Babe are my favorite Kaiju.
Brandon's hand is going to get cramped from all the signing he is gonna do.
Lol, you must be new here.
12:47 😆 YES!! 😃 I was going to mention Clifford if you guys didn't!
Revenge of The Fallen Devastator is pretty much a Kaiju.
This was a fun episode.
No one out-Brandons the Brandon on Kaiju logic.
My definition of a Kaiju is an inhuman monster that is typically the size of sky scrapper or bigger. My first thought was sky scrapper size, I think that's important
I agree with the argument about relative scale, but that entails that "Kaiju" is a relative term. According to this definition, nothing is inherintly a Kaiju, but Kaiju is a term used to describe monsters which are huge in scale compared to the observer
Bowser from Yoshi's island is a kaiju, though only temporarily and majically induced.
Look, if Ant Man is a Kaiju because he *Can* grow to Kaiju size, then Bowser certainly counts as one.
It's like, his second favorite thing to do after kidnapping Princesses!
Kaiju are often connected with environmental messages. In that way, Trents are totally Kaiju.
So One Punch Man is, more or less, set in a world of kaiju? Which brings up the question of sheer destructive power because some of the monsters aren’t humongous but can still certainly level buildings.
Gargamel from The Smurfs is a Kaiju.
He actively terrorizes them and tries to eat them all the time.
I think terror/threatening intent needs to be an element of if a thing is a Kaiju.
Great episode, boys.
My definition of Kaiju is:
One. Monstrous appearance.
Two. Living natural disaster.
So size is less of a factor when compared to scary potential and destructive force.
I think Dan is underestimating how big a Blue Whale is.
14:05 But wouldn't Clifford shrink after the retraction of love for destroying people? Then, he would no longer be Kaiju-qualified. Hmmmm.
If it takes more than one shot from a large caliber rifle to kill it, it's probably a kaiju.