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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 พ.ค. 2024
- While The Legend of Zelda has always been one of Nintendo's top franchises, after The Wind Waker released to GameCube, there were major questions for Nintendo if Zelda would continue to sell. Love it or hate it, Here is how Twilight Princess SAVED the Zelda Franchise.
#zelda #twilightprincess #windwaker
The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess is somewhat controversial in the Zelda fanbase. But, Zelda was starting to struggle before its release. Nintendo was extremely disappointed with how well Zelda sold in both Japan and the West, and after Twilight Princess, the team tried Four Swords Adventure deciding innovations was what gamers were looking for. Unfortunately, it was another massive misstep and failure for Nintendo and Zelda.
So, Eiji Aonuma had a bitter pill to swallow. While he hated the realistic Zelda presentation Nintendo had shown to promote the GameCube, Western reactions had been positive to it. So, he presented a realistic Zelda to Shigeru Miyamoto, and the team went forwards with a more realistic Zelda - hoping this project would succeed. Nintendo doesn't always have the time/money/resources to spend on long development cycles, as revealed by Satoru Iwata, so, hopefully Twilight Princess would succeed. Dave Klein breaks down this story with the help of Manley Reviews.
Manley Reviews:
/ @manleyreviews
Timestamps:
0:00 - Intro
0:35 - Shigeru Miyamoto's Influence in Nintendo
1:31 - Zelda and Mario's incredible success
2:25 - Zelda: Ocarina of Time
3:08 - Zelda GameCube Space World Trailer
3:47 - Eiji Aonuma's Reaction
4:15 - The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker
5:30 - The Legend of Zelda: Four Swords Adventure
6:26 - Zelda's Downward Trajectory
7:06 - Making Twilight Princess
9:32 - The Nintendo Wii
10:41 - The success of The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess
11:38 - How Twilight Princess saved the Zelda franchise - เกม
Thanks for watching everyone! :)
Just a few things I want to clear up:
- I know it’s not pronounced “Merrio”, I was playing around sorry. :-/ I pronounced his name correctly immediately after the intro.
- I love Wind Waker, and I never personally understood the hatred for Toon Link. But, sadly, that was the general sentiment at the time.
- As I clear up at the end, I don’t think Zelda would have been ‘dead’ if Twilight Princess had underperformed. But I think the Satoru Iwata quote is telling at the end of the video, in that they may have released fewer games, or had less time/budget on future projects. Especially given Wind Waker underperformed for them.
- Yes, I agree Breath of the Wild also saved the franchise after how poorly Skyward Sword performed.
EDIT:
- I spoke with Ishaan Sahdev (after making this), who wrote "The Legend of Zelda: A Complete Development History" and a few more points from him: In a lot of ways, Twilight Princess inspired Breath of the Wild. Aonuma states Twilight Princess was the starting point for them making BotW, and they even used its map to prototype the game.
- Please find and read the wiki of it here: zeldawiki.wiki/wiki/Development_of_The_Legend_of_Zelda
- Much of my information for this video comes from Aonuma himself, link here:
www.nintendoworldreport.com/feature/13085/eiji-aonumas-gdc-2007-presentation
- There were also Iwata Asks I referenced.
Thanks all!
I actually work at Nintendo and I can confirm it is actually pronounced merrio.
Nice unopened merrio 64 lol
My dad owns Nintendo and he says it's pronounced Merryerryio.
@@rongrishaver7537 Yeah! My wife wanted to play Mario Kart 64 when we were dating, and suddenly pulled out an unopened copy of both games. I had to stop her from opening them, haha.
Now learn how to pronounce Ocarina. I’ll give you a hint it’s not Oakarina. Look anywhere and learn the correct pronunciation
I'm a little disappointed that the lesson Nintendo took from TP's sales was "Make the graphics at least a little realistic to sell in the west." They were probably right, but it was the dungeons that really made that game (for me, at least).
i guess what really happened is relatability, in zelda 1,2 and lttp, he was always a young man and not a child, OOT and MM were the first times we got child link so if “real zelda” is supposed to have child link then that wasnt evident in the very first few zelda games. also…man the hero of twilight is just straight badass why wouldnt you wanna play as him.
The night before the Wii launched, my dad went to the local Best Buy at 11 PM. he waited overnight, and when they opened their doors the next day, he was one of only 14 people that got a Wii at that location that day, as the Best Buy had only gotten 14 Wiis in total for launch. But he was only one of 7 people that actually got a copy of Twilight Princess, because they'd only gotten 7 in for day launch. I was only 9 at the time, but I remember after the Wii was setup, I played Twilight Princess for hours that day. It was the first Zelda game I ever played, and it's still my all time favorite Zelda game. Also you're not the only one who replays Twilight Princess more than Ocarina of Time. I do too
A Father's Love great story
Twilight Princess is still my favorite Zelda game. I love the dark and ominous atmosphere, plus transforming into a wolf was cool. Midna is also my absolute favorite companion.
Same here.
I wholeheartedly agree!!
And it’s the best princess Zelda design too date
I wholepenissy agree as well
I know people compare it to Ocarina, but it felt much more like the natural evolution of Link to the Past (my favorite game) and that's probably a big part of why I loved it so damn much.
That and it has one of the best dungeons ever (the twinshot dungeon) and by far, the best Ganon battle - the horseback sequence kicked ass.
I remember getting Twilight Princess gifted to me by my older brother as to spark a love for Zelda from a young age. I remember loving the music as I progressed through the game.
I was gifted the original Zelda on NES by my uncle. Also sparked a lifelong love for me.
wind waker was great. However it appears that wind waker will become truly appreciated multiple years later. More people started to appreciate its art as well.
Wind waker was my fav one!
Thats because those of us who grew up playing the toon link games finally grew up and are old enough to have an opinion now XD. Toon links awesome
Wind Waker has so many details in it. It has the most expressionate Link ever, you feel his emotions, he feels alive (I mean look at his face - it always changes depending on the situation) in most other games he feels more blank and vague.
Nah I was in my twenties when WW released. It is top 3 for me. The people that didn’t like were kids (teens) themselves. The age when you think dark is cool and too stupid to understand that for example movies like My Friend Totoro is equally for adults as it is for children.
Even if the graphic style can divide and I understand it I do not understand otherwise the criticisms towards the game with a very solid scenario some of the best dungeons and a music just incredible and then we have Ganondorf the game is really incredible !
BOTW and TOTK are great games... but Twilight Princess is my favourite. The first truly cinematic Zelda. The dark tones and themes. The well realized characters of the world. It was everything I wanted from a Zelda game back then.
You are using wrong the "but". A game being good and like it or not are not related. You can like bad games or good games.
@@pafoneto1275 No I'm not. And I never said you couldn't like a bad game. I'm saying I prefer TP over BOTW and TOTK
@@davidrawlings9288 yes you are using it wrong, the correct phrasing was "BOTW and TOTK are great games. My favorite is Zelda twilight princess" or "...I like these games but my favorite is TP" THE LATTER BEING A CORRECT WAY OF THE word "BUT".
I have played almost every mayor entry in the saga, but Twilight Princes is by far my favorite too.
Preach
It's crazy how Twilight Princess brought the Zelda franchise back from it's lowpoint and while I don't agree that Wind Waker should've been negatively received by fans when it came out I get it was a different time but it's crazy to me that Twilight Princess saved Zelda and Nintendo treats it like an afterthought.
Everyone who turned their nose up at Wind Waker sure did miss out.
It's appreciated now.
When is Twilight Princess getting a Switch Remastered
There is one incredibly important factor about the success of Twilight Princess that I did not hear mentioned: the Twilight Hack from Team Twiizers. I have never actually played Twilight Princess, but I still have my copy from ~2008.
Awesome video! Really shows how good we had it even back then! Crazy how many people hated the look of Wind waker even tho it had a phenomenal art style!
TP is one of the best games in the series for me... nostalgia-filled and everything. Also, Midna is the best companion ever
TP saved Zelda in the short term but stagnated the series in the long term. That's why Skyward Sword is poorly received as derivative. Wind Waker revitalized the series but the public wasn't ready for it until BotW.
Yeah, my biggest complaint with Twilight Princess is that we went backwards in map design. Botw did a better job at reviving the series in my opinion.
One can just as much say BotW caused TotK to "stagnate" what it started. Both TP and BotW are their own eras of Legend of Zelda.
Skyward Sword stagnated the series because it's a bad zelda game. Twilight Princess has nothing to do with it.
@@saricubra2867Windwaker was the first 3d Zelda to be an open world game that utilized cell shading to achieve it like Botw and Totk. Twilight Princess was trying too hard to be OOT which did nothing to progress the series outside of graphics which was a big reason why Skyward Sword only focused on graphics and dungeons as well. That wasn't going to keep working for Nintendo they needed to think outside the box to keep Zelda relevant.
@@felix7720 Twilight Princess made a proper big world with varied enviroments, Wind Waker is just a half baked open world game that has water as content instead of more dungeons and a better plot.
Wind Waker wasn't the first cell shaded game, A Link To The Past exists and it was launched in 1990.
Twilight Princess is totally unique compared to Ocarina of Time, i guess that no one bashes A Link Between Worlds then that literally has the map recycled from A Link To The Past, or Tears of The Kingdom recycled Breath of The Wild's map and the artstyle and graphics are basically the exact same.
I love the new Zelda games, but I would also love to see a new classic-style Zelda game, similar to TP, OOT, WW
Gamecube Era of Twilight Princess was legendary.
Having a spotty personal history with the Zelda franchise, Windwaker has always been the most fascinating because of that poor perception/reception.
I adore the art style but know basically nothing about it outside the references it has in Smash Bros. stages.
I never owned a Nintendo home console besides the Wii and I wasn’t even aware of Windwaker’s existence until well into the WiiU’s protracted deathspan.
One day I’ll play it. One day…
Oh yeah. The video was also great! Excellent editing and a well executed summation about the Zelda franchise’s legacy I had little idea about.
Tbh the reception wasn’t poor. I remember glowing reviews when it released. One of the main reasons TP sold more is because the Wii sold ten times as much as the GameCube.
@@tor2919
Guess I was of the minority. I specifically bought Twilight Princess for the Gamecube because I was very familiar with that system and motion controls just did not interest me. Still hesitant to use them even now for that matter. I just prefer a traditional controller. And I never regretted my decision. Never have played the Wii version and don't have any reason to. I loved TP and on gamecube it was just fine.
It’s my favourite
Thank goodness for Aonuma. Idc what consumers complained about, he had his finger on vision and it won the long game, even if they needed TP to make bank in the more short term.
Twilight Princess and wind waker are equal in quality tbh
WE NEED TWILIGHT PRINCESS 2
We could've got that
Don't get me wrong, Twilight Princess was great. The hype was unreal. I was one of those people who waited outside the Target for 2 days to get my Wii and TP, but Wind Waker is still to this day one of the most beautiful Zelda games made.
Oh yeah, I fully agree, Wind Waker is gorgeous.
I just, finally played WW (HD). It took a while to click with it (which happens pretty often with me and Zelda games, they can be so different from each other), but once I did, my god. By the end I was asking myself how a Zelda game could be any better. I’m playing Twilight Princess now (City in the Sky), and I love it as much. But again, totally different. I don’t get the hate some people have for it. And it’s really not that similar to Ocarina of Time. Some gameplay, sure. But all Zelda games share gameplay elements. The OoT and TP stories aren’t even remotely similar.
@@Labyrinth1010 going backwards is way harder.
@@notmephisto1375 what do you mean?
I had a friend who worked at McDonald’s with me back in the day and he wouldn’t stop talking about how awesome twilight princess is going to be. I was excited to see how this game was going to turn up.
Twilight Princess is still to this day my favorite Zelda game and honestly a huge portion of that is because of Midna. Her character development was perfect, and every few years I go back to play it just for her story.
BOTW is a better game in almost every way, and of course how couldn't it be? Just look at it lol but Twilight Princess still holds #1 in my heart.
I was 10 when the Spaceworld 2000 footage came out and I remember being hyped like everyone else. Then I remember seeing the Game Informer with the first screenshots of Wind Waker which was kind of a shock. I was still a huge Zelda fan so I was hyped for Wind Waker and got it as soon as I could convince my parents to buy it after launch. LOVED it, such great memories
They should've never shown that tech demo, especially not in the same reel as trailers for actual games. Really poor marketing decision.
Now Zelda is outselling mainline Mario games. Pretty crazy how big it's become.
It's still not more popular than Mario though
The Minish Cap is awesome! One of my favorite 2D Zeldas. Easily top 3.
I've never played Minish Cap, but it's on my list of zelda games i really want to play
@@windwakerfrog678 it’s so good. I love 3D Zelda, but 2D Zelda is something special, too. Different, but still Zelda. Another flavor, if you know what I mean. I hope Nintendo don’t abandon it.
Based Minish Cap enjoyer
@@Labyrinth1010 yeah, ive played 2 or 3 of the 2d zelda games, and I hope to play more of them
@@windwakerfrog678 they’re all great. Just start at A Link to the Past and go from there. Definitely play the DX Version of Link’s Awakening.
Wind Waker has an INCREDIBLE ending. but I think its story was too far into the future for fans to understand.
Man kept saying "Oakarina of Time"
I love the art direction of Windwaker. I know art is subjective, but the hate it gets for it's aesthetic roots to a lot of people being conditioned to stereotype the "cartoony" style as being for kids and that the edgy and more realistic art style is "superior" and is the style that suits to a more mature audience. To me that's BS, as an artist I like both styles and in fact there's a term for the art direction both styles are going for, they are both "stylized".
One of the things that was frustrating about zelda was being stuck. They were so linear that you just get stuck and dont know what to do. The new games solve that if you get stuck theres something else to do. So i never put down the game never to return like previous games
Dave Control! Cool to see you at GameSpot. When did that happen?
Hey! Thanks! :)
Started working for the gaming side of GameSpot around 2 years ago!
Another great video! Manley’s video was amazing. I saw it before, but still loved this take.
If I hadn't played Twilight Princess as a kid I probably wouldn't have been interested in Zelda nearly as much as I am now.
This is the most aesthetically pleasing and coolest Link design of all the Zelda games.
Twilight is my favorite Zelda game prior to Breath of the Wild & Tears of the Kingdom. I camped out at Bestbuy in 2006 for a Wii and this game with a buddy. I really hope Nintendo takes the HD WiiU port and brings it over to switch.
Love that you and IGN started making (again) more "youtuber-like" content. Don't overdo it (i.e. keep your focus) and even more people will flock to your channel
Mr game spot, I found an insane secret, it goes that if you have a mifa, urbosa daruk or revali ammibos gear on while have ingredients sidon tulin yonobo or riju are out, then depending on which you use they will have there ancestors helmets on this I find very cool
I agree that it’s better that OoT. It’s like link to the past to the original
Twilight Princess still holds up today so well!
I remember buying a copy of TP and not even owning a Wii at the time. Took me a few months to actually get one.
these are 1 of the few videos were i did not hear you say the cringes word even once .... "literally". keep up the good work 😉
Wind Waker HD is my favourite modern Zelda, it's just packed full of charm.
I'm still waiting for this two games in switch
I remember people not liking Twilight Princess. The game that saved Zelda was Breath of the Wild.
The Wind Waker had poor "reception" pre-release but everybody changed their tune immediately once they got to play it. Twilight Princess had a lot of hype but after release people generally thought it was eh until Skyward Sword came out and and showed just how eh a Zelda game can be so Twilight Princess looked good by comparison. Then the series went into hibernation until Breath of the Wild.
God I remember waiting for like 2 years as Twilight Princess got pushed back, I used to walk to blockbuster just to stare at the "Pre Order Now" case that had basic trailer screenshots hahaha
The real name of this video should be "How Zelda fans almost kill Zelda franchise" Because wind waker was a great game but fans hated just for the design
Yes, Twilight Princess did save the Zelda franchise, but then they squandered it by releasing Skyward Sword, which was way too linear, and the motion controls were too annoying. So then Breath of the Wild came along and saved the series again with its open world design, and now Tears of the Kingdom has cemented the future of The Legend of the Zelda.
This would be so much easier to watch if he didn't mispronounce every single game title.
twilight princess was amazing. I very much agree that its a better ocarina
Wow, that was a shock realising I was 16 when Wind Waker came out, despite my age and the hate it got, I loved the shit out of it.
I didn't realize Twilight Princess was that important. Thank you!
I’ll never forget the reaction being 15 at the time. 10 years later on my Wii U it became my favourite Zelda ever upon playing it! Windwaker has best story, best temple and best hands down best!!! Ending!
Hold up, 4 swords adventures is an absolute classic game. One of the best couch coop games of all time.
twilight princess is the best one but don't tell the others
T. Princess was my favorite zelda game even after Breathe. Thanks for making this video and proving why its one of the best :)
I got the wii and tp on Christmas when I was a kid my mom even got the strategy guide prolly the best Christmas I had as a kid
BOTW & TOTK are a decent mix of toon and realistic. It looks like Princess Mononoke, it felt like playing a Ghibli movie when BOTW first came out. But I wouldn't mind seeing Nintendo make a supercharged console with portable options but maybe having a game like zelda be only playable while docked so as to get back to a OOT MM TP style. Maybe have it switch to toon style when you undock. Might be hard to get the detail though, but i'm sure nintendo would dig the idea of a dual world, realistic to toon depending on dock.
That would need to be a magnetic non port type dock though cause if you dock and undock more because of a game mechanic, it might eventually mess up the port.
I did like wind waker I thought it was pretty good
Oh, I love Wind Waker! It was a huge shame how the general Western reaction was to the graphics.
@@DaveControlLive me and you both I really did like the wind waker it was good even after I beat it I still kept on playing it
it's a great game and it's light hearted graphic is another reason why I love it.
@@PeanutButterAndJellyBros 100% agree what you just said
Wind Waker shaped the art direction for BOTW moving forward, if Zelda kept going realisitc it would have just turned out derivative and not really in spirit of the series.
Can someone tell me what the game at 0:53 is ... The one that looks like road fighter but with shooting cars ...
I think that was Spy Hunter for the NES
Twilight princess is the one Zelda game I never played. Was hoping for a HD switch version.
its fuckin great man
3:09 lol they played this ad a million times when it came out
This game just need a remaster version
Wind water is the first Zelda that I ever cared to play. Loved it then. Love it now.
Being a big fan of jet grind radio on Dreamcast helped. Always loved the cell shaded art style.
@@chrismaple779 Amen to that. Jet Grind Radio (and Set Future) were incredible games. I’m a big fan of cel shading from that era.
Miyamoto ruined all chances of a sequel. The devs badly wanted to make one and he made a mockery of them for it.
I was one of those that shat on wind waker when it was revealed because of the kiddy graphics and that great adult Link trailer.
But the game ended up being great and it's one of my favorite Zelda now.
There could also be an argument that it was not necessarily TP that saved Zelda but the Wii itself.
Oddly, windwaker was the first zelda I played. I was part of the OG nintendo generation but it never grabbed me.
And I stopped gaming altogether in about 92.
but then in the early 2000's I bought a music magazine that came with a cd-rom of game trailers and there was one for windwaker.
So I bought a gamecube
IMO Twilight Princess deserved a sequel ala OoT and MM.
I remember buying it in elementary school like it was yesterday
I honestly don't think the Western audience made much difference. It was WW 2 trying to put Toon Link on a horse again and looking beyond awkward, making Aonuma go to Miyamoto for help and the latter said "just make it realistic then".
And then Twilight Princess turned out to be a disappointment.
Release the HD collection Nintendo
Toon Link has the most personality of any link, funnely enough
I remember skipping my first morning class in high school to buy it on its Friday release in France. All my friends were salty when I joined them in class with my copy of the game in hand (NGC version I couldn't get a Wii back then). Got slapped by the chemistry teacher but it was worth it. Played it all weekend and finished it.
I begged for my mom to buy me Twilight princess when it came out i didnt even own a GQ or wii but growing up playing all the games i just had to have it and just having it felt good id always take it over to my cuzins and we spent hours and days on end playing till i finally got my own system almost a year later.
I feel the main reason why Nintendo hit the curb a bit was showing off a more mature trailer then backing up to a kid like game instead in WindWaker.
Although I’ve never played it this one seems like it’s the most up my alley.. I really like the style here whatever it’s called judging by the footage.. I’d pick up a Switch remaster if they ever put it out
I remember being disappointed about Wind Waker initially. However when I played it, all of my disappointment was gone and I loved it. Looking back, it is one of the best Zelda games and I have replayed it many times.
Twilight Princess is my second fav, and WIND WAKER IS THE MOST BESTEST ZELDA GAME and whoever hates toon link should get kidnapped by that giant bird thing.
12:46 “peak-min” coz that franchise is peak gaming
"Eckarina of Time"
12:00
That'a right.
To copy an other zelda game like twilight princess did, is something they cant do everytime they want
Its actually wild that so many ppl dismissed Wind Waker simply because of the look. Its an amazing game, better than Twilight imo though i loved that one too.
Yeah, I 100% agree. The reaction of the time was super disappointing.
@Paco Loco speak for yourself. After a few years, most people got over it and now admit it's one of the top tier Zelda games.
@Paco Loco it wasn't what people _expected_ but those who tried and finished it all seem to love it.
This may say more about how shallow or biased consumers can be than about the game. And I include myself in that, I did not play it either.
Yeah, no. It’s not that great, the only worse mainline zelda is Skyward Sword.
@@Stonehorn It was the first 3d open world Zelda game. And it’s widely regarded as one of the best in the series, even if you dont enjoy it.
i love wind waker the same as twilight the same as ocarina and majora the same as links awakening and a link between worlds
Thumbnail match :)
Wind Waker was great, anyone who didn't play it because of the graphics is a tool
I wouldn't call them a tool because everyone has their own personal tastes.
Remember that Zelda tech demo on Wii U
Unpopular opinion but I prefer TP to BOTW and TOTK. I like the more linear and cinematic experience.
It’s true guys Manleys video might be my favorite zelda video ever
It's funny how I finished Twilight Princess and barely remember anything about it but played Wind Waker for only a little bit on my friend's gamecube and can remember sailing on the ocean like it's yesterday. TP might have saved the franchise but WW was so much better imho.
Twilight Princess is amazing and all, but OH MY GOD WHY ARE THERE SO MANY ITEMS?! where are the LAST 10 POES I NEED
You have status as a Nintendo kid if in fact you played full 4 player multiplayer on Four Swords Adventure!!
Wind waker was an amazing game, it was just not what people expected and graphics snobs started to put down the game. But WW was maybe the furst zelda game i truly got to play, as OoT i was mpre a spectator, and i have really great memories with both WW and TP and they are equally fantastic games imo. But WW i think has a slight edge because its just so fun and open.
Simultaneously at the same time?
Toon / Windwaker Link will always be one of my favorites just cuz of one simple thing…He’s literally the “fuck around and find out” version of Link. Not connected to any of the Hero of Time resurrections but just an ordinary dude that Ganon should’ve never picked a fight with 🤣🤣🤣
Is the wii controls better, this one i cant play
Thought the dude in the beginning was Guru Guru
Not accepting any hate on a top4 zelda game. Wind Waker was beyond amazing and if you judge a game because of graphics then...
Ive recently loaded both games on my steam deck and i can tell you twenty years later windwaker looks better than twilight princess. It was alwaysy favorite zelda but the art choice makes it look great
And we just need this on Nintendo Switch
I suspect that _Skyward Sword_ is starting to go though the same reversal of opinion that _Wind Waker_ went through. At release, the game was "OMG WORST GAME EVER!" (though in the case of _Skyward Sword,_ smooth brains parroting the opinions of prominent TH-camrs played a large part) but years later, I'm seeing opinion shifting towards "it's actually under-appreciated and nowhere near as terrible as people make it out to be."
Got both wind waker and twilight princess on the game cube and there both great I want a new remake for both can’t play the new ones they arent Zelda games to me