Hmmm... lets explore your fatal flaw for a moment. You install a trigger, with a trigger safety. The trigger safety is purposefully designed for you to press one part of the trigger to avoid accidental discharge. You depress the area 90% of most accidental discharges begin and the gun DOES NOT FIRE. Yet you call this a fatal flaw? The fatal flaw is. . 1. You need to train till you get it right. 2. If you dont know where to install the springs? Go to a gunsmith. It appears your trigger is a different weight than your stock trigger. This was the problem with the first 3 years of the sig p320. And your careless installation of your trigger may possibly not be carrying enough spring weight to avoid an accidental discharge. 3. Never LAZILY modify a weapon and leave engineered parts out without understanding why they are there. 4. Consult someone if you dont know what a trigger takedown spring is. I dont have an opinion on your mod. Do what works for you. But do your due diligence.
Seriously why wouldn’t you install the springs they include? It’s like buying high end parts for your car, and not using the hardware that comes with. It’s part of the product’s make up- don’t be like “I only did a partial install and I’m not a fan of the performance” lol and he’s an instructor but doesn’t like how the trigger safety functions like it’s designed
The channel: I don’t know what this spring is so I will not install it. That statement seems flawed. I’m not sure why. lol Anyway... I purchased a P320 but might reach out to Sig about a factory tabbed safety trigger instead of a third party. As recoil springs aren’t even available for the most popular model it might be awhile.
Yeah this guy has an IQ of about 80. He talks shit about the trigger but didn’t even properly install the full kit because he was too lazy or gay about it and when it didn’t work out how he wanted he made a video just to bash it lol
..... it's a trigger safety. Of course it binds up and doesn't allow the trigger to be pulled if you aren't engaging it properly. That's the whole idea. You have to be deliberate in you trigger engagement, it helps to avoid negligent discharge. And it's a great idea for this particular pistol with such a weak internal safety mechanism.
@@ramos5464Glock trigger safety depresses a pin in the slide thats keeping the firing pin from being able to move at all. It’s in the design of the entire gun. The problem with the P320 is that the firing pin can move even if the safety’s on that’s how some of the NDs or ADs have gone off. Glocks firing pin CANT move unless you depress that portion of the slide unlocking it. A simple drop in trigger doesn’t work as great if you do not have the rest of the key components that make the Glock trigger system successful.
The "Flaw" is actually how the trigger safety is supposed to function. That's how ALL trigger safeties are supposed to function. It's doing what it's designed to do. Thanks for demonstrating that it indeed works as intended.
I installed one on my 320c, I’m not seeing the problem with engagement on mine. Even if I crowd the frame it disengages the trigger safety. Maybe a out of spec blade?
I just got mine today and installed it. Works perfectly for me-I can pull the trigger smoothly while disengaging the safety with no issues. But for shooters who pull the trigger closer to the first joint of their index finger, they’ll naturally end up pulling the top part of the trigger. This can stop the safety from disengaging, causing the trigger to lock up. So, this product might not be the best fit for those who pull the trigger that way (and there’s nothing wrong with that style-a lot of pro shooters do it; it’s just a preference). If you're thinking about buying this, I'd suggest first checking how you usually pull the trigger to see if it’s a good match for you.
Seem like a training issue. The apex trigger with the safety does the same. It trains you to put your trigger finger toward the bottom to shoot with us how you should be pulling the trigger in the first place. Not to mention those apex trigger has been approve for duty by many police departments.
I can't find 1 example of a trigger that needs specific training to function properly on any platform. Being an instructor I could not recommend this to anyone and have reached out to multiple instructors/swat/team guys that would advocate this trigger being ok. The only pushback has been from FB/IG Agency fan boys that defend what they love. Here is a direct quote from "APEX" for their triggers : (see next comment)
If you own and have installed an Apex aftermarket trigger for your P320, and in light of the recent announcement from Sig Sauer you feel it is unsafe to use, please discontinue using or carrying your pistol immediately. Below we outline what steps to take based on which model of Apex trigger you own and when and where it was purchased.
Who pulls at the top of the trigger? Wtf? I never pull at the top of the trigger, maybe it's mh hand size or finger length but one of the reasons I didn't like the P10C was because I was rubbing my finger against the bottom of the guard.
So I have the agency arms trigger (black with gold dingus) that I have been using since February. I just tried to recreate this fatal flaw you were demonstrating and couldn't. Idk whats up with your trigger and the other people's trigger. I have a sample size of one.
That's epic you took the effort to make it work! I almost do but wanted to make a video of it completely stock. I figured it would only take a little bit of work to make it right. Too bad agency didn't do this before they released the trigger.
@@TheFallingHammer I've already told them if they decide to do it I'd be happy to test it. Hell i wish they made it completely flat without the bevel too.
I just got one installed buddy and if you grab it at a certain angle it will not go off what some folks call a fatal flaw but you just have to train with it and get used to it and it will run great squeeze don't Yank the trigger
The p320 doesn't need the 'dingus' as a drop safety because unlike other designs the trigger pull moves the trigger bar forward rather than back, so their inertias cancel eachother out. Plus there's still an internal striker block safety as well as an extra forward notch on the sear if something does jar the striker off, which is highly unlikely except for under extreme impact...much mores than just a drop. The earlier version issue of drop-firing from that one angle was fixed by safety upgrades that they all come with now, which include even less mass on the trigger shoe, the sear, the striker and the internal safety lifter. This style of 'levered' trigger may have helped prevent the earlier version of the P320 from that one drop-fire angle on the rear, but with the aforementioned changes it has been proven not to drop fire from that or any angle. What the dingus may help at least somewhat is in stray debris or clothing possibly contacting the trigger while holstered and pulling it. Considering how short and light the P320's trigger is, that may be a welcomed addition for carry, especially duty carry. But from this demo ist looks lie it is reliant on lower finger placement. I've seen CZ P10's doing a similar thing.
Here's what I found out. If you pull the trigger without pressing the safety lever on a glock, you can still fire it after pressing the safety lever. On the p320 angency arms trigger, if you pull the trigger then try to pull the safety lever it doesn't fire. So if you're not pressing the safety lever first, then it won't be able to fire it. At first, I sort of see your point but after firing some rounds and dry firing at home, I don't have the issue anymore. As with anything new, don't just put it on and assume it's okay to carry it. I mean that's really dumb not agency arm's fault.
I am just finding it weird that there are people out here pulling at the top of their triggers which is arguably the worst location in terms of leverage.
@@Osprey1994 perhaps when I had the trigger it would happy maybe after shooting a while. You know getting lazy and pulling the trigger and suddenly not being able to pull it. I also found when you’re laying down or in the dark when you can’t really see it’s possible to pull it just off center and not be able to pull the trigger. If agency arms fixes this where the trigger can pull no matter if you pull the trigger body first or the trigger safety bar that it continues after having pulled both the safety and trigger.
Good video but I feel like your grip isn't how you'd grip it while shooting. And idk anyone that would ever place their finger up that high on a trigger to shoot anyways. But it's definitely good to be aware of it.
Surprised they put the pivot point of the safety so low. Just 1mm higher would have made a huge difference. In any case though, that would stop the gun from firing if a piece of string got into the trigger guard (though maybe not in 100% of cases). That's how the Glock triggers are designed also (intentionally), because a piece of string will follow the curve of the trigger and in that center point, the string can't push the dongle in far enough to disengage it, so it would stop the trigger from firing). The same is true for the flat trigger. Any string sill slide up to the top of the trigger guard where it can't disengage the dongle.
"As long as you put your finger down there it works everytime." lol 🤦♂️ Of it doesn't work when you put your finger in the wrong place, it's by design.
This trigger is amazing if you know how to install or use it, honestly this whole review should be invalid due to the fact that 1. You don’t know what a take down spring is 2. You didn’t bother installing the sear springs to actually give a decent review on how the trigger kit was intended to be installed, If Agency ever saw this they would probably laugh as I am shaking my head. I still can’t get over the comment you made about not changing the springs because the trigger don’t work anyway but yet I heard it work just fine when you used it right, if your nervous about disassembling and assembling your FCU it’s ok man there’s plenty other videos that can walk you through, some suck, but they are out there.
Take down safety lever spring Sear springs Trigger bar spring Check out the sig guy on TH-cam for complete brake down and reassembly videos, very well done. Thanks Sig Guy 👍😉
May be a dumb question, but can you remove the trigger safety and eliminate this issue? I am all for glocks and have use several different triggers and I have an m18 I was curious about changing the trigger in. The stock sig triggers don’t have trigger safeties and thus arises my question.
I suppose you could but The trigger safety is the selling point of this trigger. Besides that it does absolutely nothing different from the factory trigger. Pre travel and over travel are the same as stock so with out a working trigger safety it's pointless
TheFallingHammer sure, I understand that. I have a manual safety though and do not require a trigger safety. In that regard, would it eliminate the issue?
@@metalgear541 I am one of the majority that believes there is no problem with the 320 at all. They were designed to be safe without a safety. The thumb safety wasn't added because it needed it, but the US government requires it for issued side arms. I just got the trigger out of curiosity and took it off as soon as this video was finished
😂 how dare the trigger safety do what it was designed for!!! Well I thank you for you’re video because I’ll definitely be ordering one after seeing how hard you squeezed it and it didn’t budge until the safety trigger was pressed in!!! I’m sold!
I’m not going to spout vitriol as this is an old video. I will point out that if you rotate your grip to the point you have the web at the beaver tail, your finger should be properly placed to hit the trigger dingus. While I don’t truly believe that the pistol are firing unbidden, I’d like to have all the safety that is available so I don’t shoot myself in the nuts or the butt. As for the springs, I’m torn. They are supposed to lighten the pull and make it crisper. I don’t have a need for a race gun spec trigger. This trigger is in the top two for missing one of my 320’s. When I’m ready, it will come down to what I can easily get a hold of. Thanks for the review.
I've never had an issue with mine - sure, I can deliberately induce that same "flaw", but I could literally do the same thing with the "hinged" triggers on my earlier M&P's. Bottom line, you should be dry firing to master trigger press as much as possible with ANY gun so that the placement and pull is muscle memory. For me, especially with flat triggers, that means finger pad goes as low on the trigger as possible to intentionally defeat the blade (or hinge) trigger safety. May not be the same experience for everyone, but I've only ever encountered this "flaw" when trying to induce it intentionally - that includes stress shooting drills, etc. YMMV.
I mean Garand Thumbs recent pistol torture test, pretty much confirmed the bladed safety on Glocks is a point of failure under extreme situations. The stock OEM p320 and M&P2.0 clearly beat it. If people are so concerned about the p320 being drop safe, then get a version with a manual safety.
I don't think it's a flaw at all. You're supposed to pull low on the trigger. If you pull high on the trigger shoe it takes more Force to pull the trigger and you need to learn proper way to press the trigger.
Hey sir. Have to ask... Did you purchase this trigger and put it in yourself? I ask because I purchased trigger work from agency arms. They have my FCU and I'll be happy to see the difference. Sorry about your issue
I’ve been very happy with my Grayguns flat trigger in my P365, and the adjustable Armory Craft trigger for my P320, adjustable for pre and over travel. Your concern about appendix is why all of my guns have a manual thumb safety. It’s not for everyone, but ALL my guns have them and I train with them so taking the safety off is natural. In the event you decide to try out either trigger I mentioned, the Sig Sauer Guy has the best TH-cam installation videos for anything Sig Sauer. All my best. Edit: Never mind. I see from your other videos you are very knowledgeable about Sig Sauer and Armory Craft.
I was doing videos for AC installs before sig sauer guy but he's now in business with AC so understandably he is now the g2guy for AC. I could have went that route but didn't want to be bound by brand loyalty and want to be able to have an unbiased opinion on all sig parts
I've considered adding the manual safety to mine. I've switched to Israeli carry because I have a small child who may be able to unholster a weapon but could not rack it (yet). He's too young to learn about firearms fully still. Having a safety like that is very useful. Definitely considering it myself.
I went with the M18 for the manual safety. Now I'm just looking for a better than stock trigger. I've been dry fire and range training with manual safety ND it's no different than running my safety on my AR. Safety on when finger leaves trigger, safety on as finger goes to trigger. Same concept and train enough and it's second nature.
I think FallingHammer is saying that the tab needs to be more forgiving so that in a panic you don't have to adjust your grip to fire the pistol. If you pull from the bottom of the trigger anyway, I guess you're good. But I think that's a no go for me.
That’s literally what the trigger saftey is for you have to disengage the saftey at the right spot to make sure nothing gets in there and accidentally depresses it
Hey bud thank you for the video. Like you, I love the feel of tactical safe action triggers (Overwatch ruined me). My trigger is doing the same. thing. Agency gave me a bunch of reasons at first I inferred to mean it was MY fault, but after taking it to a smith, it still does it. Just not as much. Have you figured out what exactly the issue is? Because I was certain my trigger return spring wasn't bent, none of the springs were bent, the smith had to have lied to me because I tested it after it stuck and fired 11 rounds fine so that means the trigger bar was NOT off but actually on otherwise the trigger wouldn't have reset. So, agreeing with you it is a huge flaw and my Sig is not a range toy. I upgraded from the apex. never had an issue with Apex. Did you find out what causes this?
No issue to say, it's the design itself. Everyone I talked to said it's the same for them. I ditched it immediately and put my keres back in. I'm sure I could have fiddled with a file and got it to work but definitely not doing that on something I EDC.
Stippled xcompact grip. 3 golf gun works did it and they do amazing work. On top of that, they are cheaper than a lot of companies that produce the quality he does
Just picked one of these triggers up and must confirm that this dead trigger safety spot does exist. I did this to prove or disprove the validity of this trigger. I even went as far as testing the trigger in a combat setting. Where after 5 quick draws from holster I had two failure to fire until sliding my finger down to release the safety. This does not instill much confidence for EDC. And this is from a person who carried a sidearm for work over 30 years. Sorry that I spent the cash on this, but now satisfied they need to correct the flaw. Maybe agency or Omaha should pay attention to this matter
I saw this video before I bought this trigger and I thought to myself - “this guy must be doing it wrong” but then I got the trigger and I completely understand now. The number of times the trigger has gotten locked up because my finger wasn’t exactly perpendicular to the safety tab is ridiculous. I never have this issue with Glock safety tabs.
I might be late to the party but the whole point of that trigger safety is to insure you're intending to squeeze the trigger by making you purposely depress the safety... 🤷♂️ Also, if you don't use the springs that come with a trigger kit, you're not really going to see an improvement in the trigger action. 🤷♂️
I base the safety argument off glock triggers, no matter where your finger is they work 100% of the time. This one binds if your finger is too high. And trigger travel is where I base my judgment, more than pull weight.
Not once has this caused an issue with me. If you are firing your pistol with your hand in that position, then you deserve for this trigger not to work. When you have your hands properly positioned ready to fire, your finger doesn’t ride that high! I have multiple sigs with these triggers and not once has that been an issue and I’ve got medium hands.
Expected the video to be terrible from some of the comments, but turns out to be a perfectly valid review, the trigger dingus should have been pivoted from much higher, so as long as your finger is on the trigger and pulling, it should be able to disengage the safety. The issue with P320's total lack of safety (or weak safety if you want to be charitable) is that this has been known to discharge even while in holster if the holster ever so slightly pinches on the trigger itself from either side, as reported by many police officers, and if their words are questionable, also a comp shooter here on TH-cam, the dingus will solve this entirely, but it should still let you pull the trigger even if you pull the trigger closer to the top of the middle.
Wait your fatal flaw is the express purpose of the trigger? That is the reason 99% of the people want to buy this trigger. And you didn't even install it correctly?
I have agency arms triggers on both my glocks, I installed this on my p320rxp and he's right the blade is so shitty on this trigger, if your finger isn't perfect you're not pulling the trigger. It's for sure, if you do like this trigger you've never used a good trigger
Bro did you just in the same breathe say you got a safety mechanism for appendix carry and you’re upset that it works properly. The little intro where you said you took a break, take another break, for good.
Sig offered the "trigger tab style' (thats' what they called it)--- from the factory. I can't find them in stock anywhere. But they offered that and even a magazine disconnect if you want one. lol
I think what it is, is that in glock triggers the safety engages/disengages the frame horizontally. On the 320 it's vertical up against the FCU. Maybe it's the difference in the physics there somewhere
Good to know! I have changed my finger placement to the top of the trigger guard. Basically drag my finger along the surface while making contact mostly with the last joint on the edge of the trigger. That works for my Austrian models, eliminating jerking, and forces me to pull straight back. Sorry you had to Guinea pig this. But I can’t count how many alterations I have done resulting in success and failure.
Then it's a defective trigger! Its literally the whole reason for a trigger safety bro. Just checked all of my cz's and if you try to press the trigger without pressing the trigger safety it will not shoot. Again isn't that literally the purpose of a trigger safety?! If you do t press it no pew pew!
@@ejohnson7062 we can agree to disagree, but a trigger should work wherever it is engaged. Every glock and every aftermarket trigger in a glock works fine. This does not. I cannot recommend a trigger that won't go bang if it's not in the perfect position for anyone to carry. I've ran this by every instructor/LEO/military/swat/SF person I know and the decision is the same. The only people that object are fanboys
You're mad because your gucci trash trigger mod works as designed, even with missing parts. You should have bought a Glock if you wanted one. Sig should only sell this model with the manual safety, so glock brainlets will stop buying them and having NDs.
I’m seriously glad you made this video. Literally the reason I want the trigger is the “flaw” so. Thanks
Lmao I know right
It only shoots when you pull it.. this is not good
Hmmm... lets explore your fatal flaw for a moment. You install a trigger, with a trigger safety. The trigger safety is purposefully designed for you to press one part of the trigger to avoid accidental discharge. You depress the area 90% of most accidental discharges begin and the gun DOES NOT FIRE. Yet you call this a fatal flaw?
The fatal flaw is. .
1. You need to train till you get it right.
2. If you dont know where to install the springs? Go to a gunsmith. It appears your trigger is a different weight than your stock trigger. This was the problem with the first 3 years of the sig p320. And your careless installation of your trigger may possibly not be carrying enough spring weight to avoid an accidental discharge.
3. Never LAZILY modify a weapon and leave engineered parts out without understanding why they are there.
4. Consult someone if you dont know what a trigger takedown spring is.
I dont have an opinion on your mod. Do what works for you. But do your due diligence.
Seriously why wouldn’t you install the springs they include? It’s like buying high end parts for your car, and not using the hardware that comes with. It’s part of the product’s make up- don’t be like “I only did a partial install and I’m not a fan of the performance” lol and he’s an instructor but doesn’t like how the trigger safety functions like it’s designed
The channel: I don’t know what this spring is so I will not install it.
That statement seems flawed. I’m not sure why. lol
Anyway... I purchased a P320 but might reach out to Sig about a factory tabbed safety trigger instead of a third party. As recoil springs aren’t even available for the most popular model it might be awhile.
Do you install both of the small springs that came with it? One looks bigger than the other
Yeah this guy has an IQ of about 80. He talks shit about the trigger but didn’t even properly install the full kit because he was too lazy or gay about it and when it didn’t work out how he wanted he made a video just to bash it lol
@@chrisb9960 don't know if you've done digging on this but Agency Arms is the only trigger that will have that tab
..... it's a trigger safety. Of course it binds up and doesn't allow the trigger to be pulled if you aren't engaging it properly. That's the whole idea. You have to be deliberate in you trigger engagement, it helps to avoid negligent discharge. And it's a great idea for this particular pistol with such a weak internal safety mechanism.
A trigger safety doing exactly what it’s designed for
Why is it different and more difficult than a Glock???? Shouldn’t be
@@ramos5464because the shape of the trigger and the associated components are totally different.
Exactly what I was going to say
@@ramos5464Glock trigger safety depresses a pin in the slide thats keeping the firing pin from being able to move at all. It’s in the design of the entire gun. The problem with the P320 is that the firing pin can move even if the safety’s on that’s how some of the NDs or ADs have gone off. Glocks firing pin CANT move unless you depress that portion of the slide unlocking it. A simple drop in trigger doesn’t work as great if you do not have the rest of the key components that make the Glock trigger system successful.
you do realize that is by design. It's a safety.
A poor designed safety at that.
@@barry33844 better than what it had originally
@@barry33844 He didn’t even install all the parts that came in the kit, then complains about the operation of it?
The "Flaw" is actually how the trigger safety is supposed to function. That's how ALL trigger safeties are supposed to function. It's doing what it's designed to do. Thanks for demonstrating that it indeed works as intended.
I've pulled my Sig 320 Agency Arms trigger like this a thousand times and never had this issue. Works great for me.🤷♂️
same
I installed one on my 320c, I’m not seeing the problem with engagement on mine. Even if I crowd the frame it disengages the trigger safety. Maybe a out of spec blade?
I just got mine today and installed it. Works perfectly for me-I can pull the trigger smoothly while disengaging the safety with no issues. But for shooters who pull the trigger closer to the first joint of their index finger, they’ll naturally end up pulling the top part of the trigger. This can stop the safety from disengaging, causing the trigger to lock up. So, this product might not be the best fit for those who pull the trigger that way (and there’s nothing wrong with that style-a lot of pro shooters do it; it’s just a preference).
If you're thinking about buying this, I'd suggest first checking how you usually pull the trigger to see if it’s a good match for you.
Mine is great put springs in that came with it breaks at 3.4-3.5.
So you're saying yours or noone else's Agency trigger won't break if you don't depress the safety on it? I'd be more concerned if it did.
It's almost as if that's what it's designed to do.
@@TripleTapHK 😂😂
The point he was trying to make is that the actuation point is much lower than that of glock triggers, so you had to be lower for it to actuate.
Did you talk to Agency about this? Is this the v2 or v1?
so is this one of the ways to mitigate that "unintended firing" of the p320 when it's dropped?
Seem like a training issue. The apex trigger with the safety does the same. It trains you to put your trigger finger toward the bottom to shoot with us how you should be pulling the trigger in the first place. Not to mention those apex trigger has been approve for duty by many police departments.
I can't find 1 example of a trigger that needs specific training to function properly on any platform. Being an instructor I could not recommend this to anyone and have reached out to multiple instructors/swat/team guys that would advocate this trigger being ok. The only pushback has been from FB/IG Agency fan boys that defend what they love. Here is a direct quote from "APEX" for their triggers : (see next comment)
If you own and have installed an Apex aftermarket trigger for your P320, and in light of the recent announcement from Sig Sauer you feel it is unsafe to use, please discontinue using or carrying your pistol immediately. Below we outline what steps to take based on which model of Apex trigger you own and when and where it was purchased.
Who pulls at the top of the trigger? Wtf? I never pull at the top of the trigger, maybe it's mh hand size or finger length but one of the reasons I didn't like the P10C was because I was rubbing my finger against the bottom of the guard.
Do you understand the trigger is larger than the glocks and you need the correct placement for any trigger and practice practice practice.
So I have the agency arms trigger (black with gold dingus) that I have been using since February. I just tried to recreate this fatal flaw you were demonstrating and couldn't. Idk whats up with your trigger and the other people's trigger. I have a sample size of one.
I'm stoked it works for you! As long as your happy with it, it's a win.
Just saw this video because I bought this trigger. IS THIS A JOKE?
Has the company fix the problem with the trigger not working right?
Love my agency trigger, But i did file the horns off of the bottom of the trigger so that I can get super low on it without the trigger bite.
That's epic you took the effort to make it work! I almost do but wanted to make a video of it completely stock. I figured it would only take a little bit of work to make it right. Too bad agency didn't do this before they released the trigger.
@@TheFallingHammer I've already told them if they decide to do it I'd be happy to test it. Hell i wish they made it completely flat without the bevel too.
Good idea mines comong today
@@chriskucharski871 if you find the bottom horns bite you just file em off.
@@chriskucharski871 Also if you run into problems with fitting it i can send some pictures and show you what i did.
I have the same issue with my apex trigger on my M&p but no one ever complains about it.
I’ve only had issues under rapid fire but I’m still learning.
I just got one installed buddy and if you grab it at a certain angle it will not go off what some folks call a fatal flaw but you just have to train with it and get used to it and it will run great squeeze don't Yank the trigger
Does this trigger system prevent accidental discharge when dropped?
The p320 doesn't need the 'dingus' as a drop safety because unlike other designs the trigger pull moves the trigger bar forward rather than back, so their inertias cancel eachother out. Plus there's still an internal striker block safety as well as an extra forward notch on the sear if something does jar the striker off, which is highly unlikely except for under extreme impact...much mores than just a drop. The earlier version issue of drop-firing from that one angle was fixed by safety upgrades that they all come with now, which include even less mass on the trigger shoe, the sear, the striker and the internal safety lifter.
This style of 'levered' trigger may have helped prevent the earlier version of the P320 from that one drop-fire angle on the rear, but with the aforementioned changes it has been proven not to drop fire from that or any angle. What the dingus may help at least somewhat is in stray debris or clothing possibly contacting the trigger while holstered and pulling it. Considering how short and light the P320's trigger is, that may be a welcomed addition for carry, especially duty carry. But from this demo ist looks lie it is reliant on lower finger placement. I've seen CZ P10's doing a similar thing.
Here's what I found out. If you pull the trigger without pressing the safety lever on a glock, you can still fire it after pressing the safety lever. On the p320 angency arms trigger, if you pull the trigger then try to pull the safety lever it doesn't fire. So if you're not pressing the safety lever first, then it won't be able to fire it. At first, I sort of see your point but after firing some rounds and dry firing at home, I don't have the issue anymore.
As with anything new, don't just put it on and assume it's okay to carry it. I mean that's really dumb not agency arm's fault.
I am just finding it weird that there are people out here pulling at the top of their triggers which is arguably the worst location in terms of leverage.
@@Osprey1994 perhaps when I had the trigger it would happy maybe after shooting a while. You know getting lazy and pulling the trigger and suddenly not being able to pull it. I also found when you’re laying down or in the dark when you can’t really see it’s possible to pull it just off center and not be able to pull the trigger. If agency arms fixes this where the trigger can pull no matter if you pull the trigger body first or the trigger safety bar that it continues after having pulled both the safety and trigger.
Very curious about the magwell on that X-Compact grip module. I'd like to know more.
Where did you go? Come back!
This has to be a joke.
Good video but I feel like your grip isn't how you'd grip it while shooting. And idk anyone that would ever place their finger up that high on a trigger to shoot anyways. But it's definitely good to be aware of it.
Only way I found it was doing drills from appendix on a timer. It was only 1 out of every 6-10 times but it still happened.
I agree grip looks forced for those pulls
What size compact grip do you have in this video?
What kind of gray is this grip module we’re did you get it I’m interested
Surprised they put the pivot point of the safety so low. Just 1mm higher would have made a huge difference. In any case though, that would stop the gun from firing if a piece of string got into the trigger guard (though maybe not in 100% of cases). That's how the Glock triggers are designed also (intentionally), because a piece of string will follow the curve of the trigger and in that center point, the string can't push the dongle in far enough to disengage it, so it would stop the trigger from firing). The same is true for the flat trigger. Any string sill slide up to the top of the trigger guard where it can't disengage the dongle.
EXCELLENT points!
so the trigger safety works..... ok lol
Look like it works
"As long as you put your finger down there it works everytime." lol 🤦♂️ Of it doesn't work when you put your finger in the wrong place, it's by design.
Where can I find an install video for this trigger?
Where did you get your grip module from.?
This trigger is amazing if you know how to install or use it, honestly this whole review should be invalid due to the fact that 1. You don’t know what a take down spring is 2. You didn’t bother installing the sear springs to actually give a decent review on how the trigger kit was intended to be installed, If Agency ever saw this they would probably laugh as I am shaking my head. I still can’t get over the comment you made about not changing the springs because the trigger don’t work anyway but yet I heard it work just fine when you used it right, if your nervous about disassembling and assembling your FCU it’s ok man there’s plenty other videos that can walk you through, some suck, but they are out there.
Has 3 springs in package not sure what to do with thrm
Don't ask agency they don't know either lol
Take down safety lever spring
Sear springs
Trigger bar spring
Check out the sig guy on TH-cam for complete brake down and reassembly videos, very well done. Thanks Sig Guy 👍😉
May be a dumb question, but can you remove the trigger safety and eliminate this issue? I am all for glocks and have use several different triggers and I have an m18 I was curious about changing the trigger in. The stock sig triggers don’t have trigger safeties and thus arises my question.
I suppose you could but The trigger safety is the selling point of this trigger. Besides that it does absolutely nothing different from the factory trigger. Pre travel and over travel are the same as stock so with out a working trigger safety it's pointless
TheFallingHammer sure, I understand that. I have a manual safety though and do not require a trigger safety. In that regard, would it eliminate the issue?
@@metalgear541 I am one of the majority that believes there is no problem with the 320 at all. They were designed to be safe without a safety. The thumb safety wasn't added because it needed it, but the US government requires it for issued side arms. I just got the trigger out of curiosity and took it off as soon as this video was finished
TheFallingHammer I like the trigger it came with, but I love modifying lmao. Great video and thanks for the reply
@@metalgear541 check out keres or armory craft. Those triggers are awesome
Does anyone know the name or website too get that grip
But that’s where your finger is supposed to go. It’s a trigger safety.
Also, Canada's SOF units are buying this trigger since SIG said it couldnt be done. Then there army will add them when they get the 320.
😂 how dare the trigger safety do what it was designed for!!! Well I thank you for you’re video because I’ll definitely be ordering one after seeing how hard you squeezed it and it didn’t budge until the safety trigger was pressed in!!! I’m sold!
It is not a flaw for me. I don't fire my P320 with my finger so high up on the trigger.
I’m not going to spout vitriol as this is an old video.
I will point out that if you rotate your grip to the point you have the web at the beaver tail, your finger should be properly placed to hit the trigger dingus.
While I don’t truly believe that the pistol are firing unbidden, I’d like to have all the safety that is available so I don’t shoot myself in the nuts or the butt.
As for the springs, I’m torn. They are supposed to lighten the pull and make it crisper. I don’t have a need for a race gun spec trigger.
This trigger is in the top two for missing one of my 320’s.
When I’m ready, it will come down to what I can easily get a hold of.
Thanks for the review.
To use that trigger need to be a x carry or any p320 ? I’m new in the gun world
I've never had an issue with mine - sure, I can deliberately induce that same "flaw", but I could literally do the same thing with the "hinged" triggers on my earlier M&P's. Bottom line, you should be dry firing to master trigger press as much as possible with ANY gun so that the placement and pull is muscle memory. For me, especially with flat triggers, that means finger pad goes as low on the trigger as possible to intentionally defeat the blade (or hinge) trigger safety. May not be the same experience for everyone, but I've only ever encountered this "flaw" when trying to induce it intentionally - that includes stress shooting drills, etc. YMMV.
I mean Garand Thumbs recent pistol torture test, pretty much confirmed the bladed safety on Glocks is a point of failure under extreme situations.
The stock OEM p320 and M&P2.0 clearly beat it.
If people are so concerned about the p320 being drop safe, then get a version with a manual safety.
I don't think it's a flaw at all. You're supposed to pull low on the trigger. If you pull high on the trigger shoe it takes more Force to pull the trigger and you need to learn proper way to press the trigger.
Hey sir. Have to ask... Did you purchase this trigger and put it in yourself? I ask because I purchased trigger work from agency arms. They have my FCU and I'll be happy to see the difference. Sorry about your issue
Damn bro, sorry it doesn't work, you can give it to me, yknow?
😂 if you would have posted this before I sold it, I would have
I’ve been very happy with my Grayguns flat trigger in my P365, and the adjustable Armory Craft trigger for my P320, adjustable for pre and over travel. Your concern about appendix is why all of my guns have a manual thumb safety. It’s not for everyone, but ALL my guns have them and I train with them so taking the safety off is natural. In the event you decide to try out either trigger I mentioned, the Sig Sauer Guy has the best TH-cam installation videos for anything Sig Sauer. All my best.
Edit: Never mind. I see from your other videos you are very knowledgeable about Sig Sauer and Armory Craft.
I was doing videos for AC installs before sig sauer guy but he's now in business with AC so understandably he is now the g2guy for AC. I could have went that route but didn't want to be bound by brand loyalty and want to be able to have an unbiased opinion on all sig parts
I've considered adding the manual safety to mine. I've switched to Israeli carry because I have a small child who may be able to unholster a weapon but could not rack it (yet). He's too young to learn about firearms fully still. Having a safety like that is very useful. Definitely considering it myself.
I went with the M18 for the manual safety. Now I'm just looking for a better than stock trigger. I've been dry fire and range training with manual safety ND it's no different than running my safety on my AR. Safety on when finger leaves trigger, safety on as finger goes to trigger. Same concept and train enough and it's second nature.
I think FallingHammer is saying that the tab needs to be more forgiving so that in a panic you don't have to adjust your grip to fire the pistol. If you pull from the bottom of the trigger anyway, I guess you're good. But I think that's a no go for me.
That’s literally what the trigger saftey is for you have to disengage the saftey at the right spot to make sure nothing gets in there and accidentally depresses it
So how do glocks work? I'm confused
@@TheFallingHammer similarly but with a more forgiving tab
What are all the springs for in the kit
I have added info regarding the springs check the comments above yours
Hey bud thank you for the video. Like you, I love the feel of tactical safe action triggers (Overwatch ruined me). My trigger is doing the same. thing. Agency gave me a bunch of reasons at first I inferred to mean it was MY fault, but after taking it to a smith, it still does it. Just not as much. Have you figured out what exactly the issue is? Because I was certain my trigger return spring wasn't bent, none of the springs were bent, the smith had to have lied to me because I tested it after it stuck and fired 11 rounds fine so that means the trigger bar was NOT off but actually on otherwise the trigger wouldn't have reset. So, agreeing with you it is a huge flaw and my Sig is not a range toy. I upgraded from the apex. never had an issue with Apex. Did you find out what causes this?
No issue to say, it's the design itself. Everyone I talked to said it's the same for them. I ditched it immediately and put my keres back in. I'm sure I could have fiddled with a file and got it to work but definitely not doing that on something I EDC.
@@TripleTapHK really? Because I didn't know that. Wow that must be it after all.
it's a damn safety
What grip module is this?
Stippled xcompact grip. 3 golf gun works did it and they do amazing work. On top of that, they are cheaper than a lot of companies that produce the quality he does
I've had zero issues its a great product and works great
Just picked one of these triggers up and must confirm that this dead trigger safety spot does exist. I did this to prove or disprove the validity of this trigger. I even went as far as testing the trigger in a combat setting. Where after 5 quick draws from holster I had two failure to fire until sliding my finger down to release the safety. This does not instill much confidence for EDC. And this is from a person who carried a sidearm for work over 30 years.
Sorry that I spent the cash on this, but now satisfied they need to correct the flaw.
Maybe agency or Omaha should pay attention to this matter
You are right. I have the same problem
I need a self-discharging trigger for my gun in a self-defense orientation!!!!!!!!
I saw this video before I bought this trigger and I thought to myself - “this guy must be doing it wrong” but then I got the trigger and I completely understand now. The number of times the trigger has gotten locked up because my finger wasn’t exactly perpendicular to the safety tab is ridiculous. I never have this issue with Glock safety tabs.
This comment made my Christmas! I hear that a lot but it never ends up here ❤️
I might be late to the party but the whole point of that trigger safety is to insure you're intending to squeeze the trigger by making you purposely depress the safety... 🤷♂️
Also, if you don't use the springs that come with a trigger kit, you're not really going to see an improvement in the trigger action. 🤷♂️
I base the safety argument off glock triggers, no matter where your finger is they work 100% of the time. This one binds if your finger is too high. And trigger travel is where I base my judgment, more than pull weight.
@@TheFallingHammer that’s how it’s meant to work it’s a safety use it how it’s intended or don’t use it
Put the stock one back on! Don’t like how bulky and sloppy the agency trigger feels
It's garbage. I'm on the AC trigger now and love it
@@TheFallingHammer can you put a link?
@@bryangartland533 I will, for what?
@@TheFallingHammer the ac trigger, which one is that ? Never heard of it
@@bryangartland533 armory craft. Just Google armory craft p320 trigger. If you use it for edc just don't adjust the pretravel screw
Not once has this caused an issue with me. If you are firing your pistol with your hand in that position, then you deserve for this trigger not to work. When you have your hands properly positioned ready to fire, your finger doesn’t ride that high! I have multiple sigs with these triggers and not once has that been an issue and I’ve got medium hands.
Another “Cool Guy” on TH-cam that carries a striker fire pistol in appendix. So original.
Expected the video to be terrible from some of the comments, but turns out to be a perfectly valid review, the trigger dingus should have been pivoted from much higher, so as long as your finger is on the trigger and pulling, it should be able to disengage the safety. The issue with P320's total lack of safety (or weak safety if you want to be charitable) is that this has been known to discharge even while in holster if the holster ever so slightly pinches on the trigger itself from either side, as reported by many police officers, and if their words are questionable, also a comp shooter here on TH-cam, the dingus will solve this entirely, but it should still let you pull the trigger even if you pull the trigger closer to the top of the middle.
Cool video! I say, do what you like 👍 with your firearms sir.
Thank you sir and I agree 1000% some people are too worried about what others think about their stuff. If you like it that's all that matters.
Your finger is supposed to be at the bottom of the fulcrum. If anything, this trigger will show you if you are fingering it incorrectly.
Wait your fatal flaw is the express purpose of the trigger? That is the reason 99% of the people want to buy this trigger. And you didn't even install it correctly?
I have agency arms triggers on both my glocks, I installed this on my p320rxp and he's right the blade is so shitty on this trigger, if your finger isn't perfect you're not pulling the trigger. It's for sure, if you do like this trigger you've never used a good trigger
Bro did you just in the same breathe say you got a safety mechanism for appendix carry and you’re upset that it works properly. The little intro where you said you took a break, take another break, for good.
That's where your ment to put your finger, towards the bottom. But hey it's your video.
Sig offered the "trigger tab style' (thats' what they called it)--- from the factory. I can't find them in stock anywhere. But they offered that and even a magazine disconnect if you want one. lol
They said they would offer it but never did.
@@Buddha23Fett "Wanting is the source of all suffering" -- Buddha
Rather have that problem with the trigger safety then blowing my b...s off when carrying
Eeehhh the fatal flaw is the whole point of the safety, all blade safetys are like that
Say u don't know how to shoot guns without saying you don't know how to shoot guns
I wanted to try one of these, guess I'll wait for V2 if they make the change.
Thanks for the info.
I think what it is, is that in glock triggers the safety engages/disengages the frame horizontally. On the 320 it's vertical up against the FCU. Maybe it's the difference in the physics there somewhere
Good jog!! Thanks
All striker fired pistol should have a blade safety, and no It doesn't make it a glock
Yeah, you’re right. You’re gonna get a lot of controversy because you started off this video talking about you just got married.
Great information... thanks.
Good to know! I have changed my finger placement to the top of the trigger guard. Basically drag my finger along the surface while making contact mostly with the last joint on the edge of the trigger. That works for my Austrian models, eliminating jerking, and forces me to pull straight back. Sorry you had to Guinea pig this. But I can’t count how many alterations I have done resulting in success and failure.
Dude thats the point of a trigger safety. So u have to press the trigger safety to shoot the gun 🙄🤦🏾♂️
Glocks don't do that, and it's their design
Then it's a defective trigger! Its literally the whole reason for a trigger safety bro. Just checked all of my cz's and if you try to press the trigger without pressing the trigger safety it will not shoot. Again isn't that literally the purpose of a trigger safety?! If you do t press it no pew pew!
@@ejohnson7062 we can agree to disagree, but a trigger should work wherever it is engaged. Every glock and every aftermarket trigger in a glock works fine. This does not. I cannot recommend a trigger that won't go bang if it's not in the perfect position for anyone to carry. I've ran this by every instructor/LEO/military/swat/SF person I know and the decision is the same. The only people that object are fanboys
@@TheFallingHammer you are delusional if it went bang by pulling anywhere else besides the lower part that would mean the gun isn’t safe
You're mad because your gucci trash trigger mod works as designed, even with missing parts.
You should have bought a Glock if you wanted one.
Sig should only sell this model with the manual safety, so glock brainlets will stop buying them and having NDs.
Lol 😆 that is what it's supposed 2 do
I was looking at on of these. Thank you for the information.
Sounds like you need to learn trigger finger placment
Sure or I can not use the trigger like all my LE/SF/instructor friends agree with me on 🤷🏼♂️
@@TheFallingHammer ignorance is bliss... have a nice day
@@TheFallingHammer right. Your video sure made me believe that.Le/Sf/instructor friends. I call bs.
That 320 looks sick bro 👍🏾
Thank you!
🤦🏻♂️
🤷🏼♂️
😂😂😂
looks like a training issue; it does what it supposed to do.
Your mistake was getting married buddy and you’ll find out if your ears pin this comment when you get divorced
Yeah agancy is high price crap qc