58 yo here. Started on piano at age 12, then quickly moved to acoustic guitar, then onto bass guitar semi-professionally for decades. Eventually picked up some mandolin. Now I got myself a nice Roland synth and I'm back to learning keys. I'm a rocker so I'm working on things like Toto's Hold the Line, BOC's Joan Crawford, Zep's Trampled under Foot, Yours Is No Disgrace by Yes. I suppose I'm a mix of early through late intermediate. Music theory skills are there, I know all the chords, scales, I can read music etc.. I know how to construct something like, an Ebmaj7. It's just...making my fingers go there, and quickly is the challenge. My hand independence needs a lot of work. I guess I should focus more on finger exercises. I try to get in 20-30 min at least a day - many sessions go longer. Thank you for the breakdown. It makes me feel good that if I keep on this, I'll be getting close to advanced in another year or two.
Awesome! For someone like you who knows how to read music and has extensive theory knowledge, the best thing you can do to "catch your hands up" is to pick piano rep that is at your level or BELOW so you're going through a ton of new music. If I were you, that would be the majority of my practice for a while, with maybe 1 piece that's more challenging musically and kind of like a goal piece. Good luck!
@@PianoRoadmap , thanks for your reply. Wow, that is different advice than I expected. So I should forego the "do 2 octave scale and arpeggio" exercises to get yoiur chops up for right now and mostly focus on learning lots of "easy" music?
@@user-zt2wc3uh1l Honestly, yes. At this stage, there's no need to be able to play every single major scale. Will you eventually want to be able to do this? Yes, for sure. But right now, if you are trying to gain hand independence, I would just practice pieces. Maybe take 1 new one every week that is easy for you, and work on polishing it up as best as you can. This will develop really great practicing habits, get you a bunch of music under your belt, and begin to develop solid hand independence technique. And if you want, warm-up with a scale. But don't make that your focus.
Thanks for this extremely helpful video. I played piano as a child and teen and was at a late intermediate level, but then wasn't able to play for decades. Now, in my 60's, I'm picking it up again. I find that I can struggle through intermediate music IF it's a piece that I played previously, but learning new music is much harder and puts me at more a late beginner level. My music reading and theory skills are really low now, I am working to regain confidence with the notes below and above the staff, counting out rhythms, multiple sharps/flats, etc. And I was never taught chords or scales properly, so I'm starting at the beginning with those. It's great to get a sense for how my skills or lack thereof fit into the larger picture. It's amazing to find such wonderful resources online, a huge improvement from 50 years ago! Thanks for the great videos.
Self-taught here, and I’m working through your Major/Minor scale challenges right now. I really appreciate this breakdown, even if it sets me back around late-beginner, early-intermediate. 😂 Hope your health improves quickly! Thanks so much for your teaching, I really appreciate this channel. ❤
get well soon Susan, I always look forward to your post, it's very true that it's difficult to find what level your at, for me i went to the abrsm books and then used that to find the right composer, so far it has worked fairly well. At the moment i use the grade 4 pieces which to take me around a couple of days to learn and then a couple more days to nail, practicing around 2 hours a day. I am shortly going to step it up to grade 5 pieces 🤞🤞
Susan, thank you so much for making the levels clear. I’m working through your Piano Roadmap, and it’s so helpful to me, since I’m doing this on my own. I’m at the beginning level. 🥰
I love watching piano vids on TH-cam, but few people actually know something about music. And you are damn sure one of them!! First off: you know that Etude/Prelude in G wasn’t written by JS Bach but by Petzold, and you knew that Für Elise and Moonlight Sonate (movement I) aren’t pieces for beginners. You earned a sub, keep up the good work!!!
@@andersnielsen6044 I agree. L. Van Beethoven wrote it with the intention for it to fit together. The movements can be Played as a standalone though. And evens if it’s not the complete sonate, it’s still a good way to start.
I 10000% agree with you about Gymnopédie! I tried to learn this as one of my first pieces a few hundred hours ago, and I gave up primarily because of the leaps not sounding musical at all (hahaha). I will probably revisit this piece again soon! (I have about 450 hours total practice time right now, self taught/youtube).
Definitions of levels are clear and make complete sense. Thank you. Wanted to know which levels the following pieces correspond to: 1. Chopin waltz in C# minor (op 64 no 2) 2. Sibelius Etude (op 76 no 2)
To answer, Chopin's C# minor Waltz op. 64 no.2 is grade 6 in Henle's scale (Henle Verlag publications) So, on par with Chopin's Polonaise Dramatique (op. 26 no. 1 C# minor) or the Eb Major Nocturne op.9 no. 2. Also the F minor Nocturne op. 55 no. 1 which I'm starting to work on now in hopes of playing for the Fall recital. Henle 6 is solidly late intermediate, possibly blurring a just a little bit into early advanced repertoire depending on the piece. Mozart's D minor Fantasie K.397 (which I'm performing at our recital in June) is also Henle grade 6. Oh, and looking at the Sibelius Etude, seeing the intended tempo, movement and quick interval jumps in the left hand, and how constant they are, I'd say likely Henle grade 7 which would put it in the early advanced category. Even though Sibelius isn't published by Henle. It might be a grade 6, but I'd think that would be a very "late" grade 6 piece with the speed and the motions in the right hand, so more likely a grade 7. So I'd say either very late intermediate or earlier advanced repertoire. It's not unlike Chopin's Etude f minor op. 25,2 "The Bees" which is Henle grade 7.
Wow, I was really hoping to get an idea of how I should be progressing, but then you put so much together in the late beginner that it is well beyond where I am at now… so disheartening
Don't be fooled by the "beginner" in late-beginner. These are very broad categories, and it can take some years to get to the late-beginner stage. I can't remember exactly, but I believe it took me about 3 years to reach that level. Someone else here mentioned that they think there should be an added "mid-beginner" level, and I agree. These terms are used because a lot of piano music is categorized this way (beginner, late beginner, early intermediate, etc). It's obviously never my intention to dishearten any aspiring pianist! I made this video to help self-learners have a starting point when looking for music, not to judge themselves and their progress. ❤️
Late beginner for me. I have a few of the skills in early intermediate, but have gaps in skills that my teachers never told me to practice, like scales lol. But I am good at sight reading easy beginner pieces and lead sheets. I wish I had access to online resources like this channel when my teachers were not very thorough and didn't tell me what to practice aside from repertoire (which was usually above my level). Thank you!
This is really helpful for my self-taught goal setting and pieces to try out! I'm late beginner with some early intermediate knowledge and skills (I looove arpeggios). I want to be moving around the keyboard more and feel so "stuck" around C4, but I can see I've been getting ahead of myself in terms of my note-reading and cords skills. Knowing how to progress and what to practise is so helpful. :)
Thank you for explaining in clear terms the different levels. One of the pieces that is not often mentioned in an early intermediate level is the Gnossienne no4 by Erik Satie. It helps to have the left hand play arpeggio like passages. Not terribly difficult to learn but difficult enough to interpret beautifully. I know because I am an adult amateur pianist. Great video, thanks again.
I am early intermediate with some intermediate skills (2 years in). I practice about 2 hours a day. My goal is not necessarily to become an advanced player but just to be able to enjoy playing pieces that make me feel happy. I am in my 50s and retired early and decided to learn piano as my new “job”. Really like your teaching style.
Excellent explanation of levels. There are some relatively easy pieces to read but fairly difficult to interpret beautifully, for example some of the Album Leaves by Schumann. Thank you for breaking down a subject that many teachers leave to the side.
I have my first lesson with a teacher in a week and I'm trying to find out my current level after my self study for ~6 months. With this video I'd probably place myself around late beginner. But I'll see then %) Thank you very much for the informative video, it was very helpful.
Thank you so much I’ve been wondering what level I am any have been searching it up but all it comes up is that there is no levels so you having this video has really helped me Also I am between early intermediate and intermediate
This is very informative. From what you said here, I consider myself a mid to late beginner. Your voice is not weird at all by the way. I know this was posted months ago, but please get and stay well. Thanks for sharing.
As a fellow teacher, I find it fascinating to hear what other teachers use to measure “levels.” In my opinion, I feel like there’s a big jump from the skills described from Late Beginner to Early Intermediate. I might split the Beginner levels into 3 parts as well, Early, Mid, and Late. And then I might use your description for Late Beginner as a Mid-Beginner and bridge the gap a little better to Early Intermediate. All that being said, I do agree with quite a few things mentioned here! I just wish there was more technique addressed than just balancing hands or voicing to mark levels.
Yeah, it's difficult to measure levels! I get why it's important for adults (especially those learning on their own) to have some kind of measure, but even my opinion on levels changes from week to week. I agree with you about splitting the Beginner level up - great thought!
@@PianoRoadmap I actually believe further splitting the Beginner level adds no value whatsoever. The whole Beginner phase is about acquiring a set of fundamentals to open the door to the next Intermediate level. I would prefer listing the knowledge and set of technical skills one is supposed to have at the end of the Beginner level to make clear when the transition to Intermediate starts taking place. Splitting the levels (especially the Beginner level) only introduces an artificial skill acquisition roadmap that will not reflect reality. So, I would stick to Complete Beginner -> Beginner -> Early | Middle | Late Intermediate -> Advanced. And you could add a "Professional" or similar level at the end. Keep on the good work!
Thank you for this "know thyself" video😢. I studied (struggled with reading the music) piano when I was 9 and havnt played at all for 50 years. Been re learning for about 6 month now and today aftee watching your "late beginer" 'tests" I know my level ..😢😢😢😢 😅. Your video is very helpful. Thank you!❤
Very nice . Thank you … I do feel better about my progress… enjoying the journey… I do play a number of the pieces you mentioned…. Always learning and practicing but enjoying and loving the process … Chopin my favorite 🎹thank you for the explanation…. I feel better about where I am and level ..
Much needed. Much appreciated. I particularly appreciate the notion that one's skills may span two or more levels. So true. Love the suggested repertoire. My problems include punch-outs, such as pedalling and ornaments. Sigh.
Thank you Susan for your effective teaching. I have learned so much just from the few videos I've watched. I appreciate that you are very frank & honest with us but yet kind at the same time. Because as beginner I was told Gymnopédie No.1 would be easy because it is such a slow piece. Good to know now. By the way your voice is comforting and easy to listen to, even when sick ;))
I hope you are feeling better! Thank you. I have been playing my scales with a metronome for the past two months. I had some metronome trauma as a young violinist, but with a digital metronome I can keep the volume low, and that helps. And so does doing scales with a metronome!! What I would like a video on, is a way to get competent at playing the melody hand louder than the accompaniment. Most of the exercises I’ve seen keep one in a five-finger position, playing a single note at a time. That hasn’t translated for me to actual music.
It's common to find individual movements out of a set such as "Bourree" from Bach Lute Suite #1 (BWV996) in Em in "First Lessons in Bach" without Prelude, Courante, Sarabande, etc. Very few beginners or lower intermediates including myself would play all the movements of the Beethoven "Moonlight Sonata" but it's common to see learners attempt the 1st movement. The Bach "Prelude in C" from the WTC Book 1 is a piece commonly found in lower level repertoire books without any of the other movements. Beethoven "Fur Elise" as a beginner piece is usually without the "technical" middle section. Beginner repertoire books would include "Fur Elise" without the middle part. Today we find books for Easy Piano with simplified arrangements of pieces such as Chopin "Ballade", Debussy "Clair de Lune" etc. often in a different key with fewer sharps or flats for beginners. Otherwise many people wouldn't attempt to play the original versions until at least 4 years into piano playing.
always wondered about my level....self-taught, retired and at 68yrs old....been playing piano on/off since my teen years....this is my second coming year of constants playing with close to three hours a day practicing....now i'm starting to play Chopin Aeolian Harp and besides others....i think the one that really help me is Czerny op 740....i tackled that constantly....its like a marathon on steroids for your fingers....if i can play three Chopin Etudes or Liszt Un Sospiro before the year is over, i'll be very happy.....i don't know any thing about scales, don't use metronome and don't know anything about sight-reading....i don't follow the dynamics but i do my own interpretation....my only obstacle now is memorize a score...i just don't have that talent...also have small hands....can't extend to the10th keys....i don't have the right speed yet...i figure that it'll eventually come within two more years....they say it'll normally takes 8yrs to be proficient in playing a piano....i think i can do it in 5yrs....thank you for the summarization on skill levels....i have ONE question though: can you call yourself a pianist if self-taught?
I restarted playing the piano after years without one. I took lessons as a child and a few years as a teenager. I never learned chords. Mostly learned from Thompson graded books. I started working on Poet and the Peasant as a teen, but never could play the last several pages. 55 years later I finally can play the whole thing! So I figure without knowing chords I'm still a beginner? But Poet and Peasant Overture is no cakewalk! I'd like to know where you think I stand. I can play 13 of 15 Scenes from Childhood by Schumann. Woo!
Thank you Susan for the helpful video! How long should it take to learn a piece which matches the level I am currently at? Or rather, what is a good amount of time to spend on any given piece appropriate for my level?
That all depends on your current level. But for beginners to early intermediate pianists, I would say *generally* that a piece at your current level should take no more than a month to learn. If a piece is taking longer for you, it doesn't mean you shouldn't practice it, but it's just in your "challenging" zone.
Very much enjoy your videos and your soothing voice (:. I do have a teacher and also a couple beginner students and am learning from you as well. Thank you specifically for this video - I appreciate the recommendation to play pieces at several levels and am attempting to prevent burnout. Thank you again!
I am Day 1. Got myself a used Yamaha P90. My goal is to reach where I can feel Chopin and give me goosebumps as I play. Hello practice, hello routine. Ty so much for this video ❤
How exciting, and good luck! Regarding the comment below (or above?), I can't imagine ever hating Chopin 😆 Ever. But I will say that if you can learn to love the process and all the beautiful music along the way to get to Chopin, you'll have no regrets.
Very good - puts it in perspective, I'm way ahead in technique and knowledge and way way behind in playing capability - difficult to be honest with oneself in the self teach world.
Although I believe myself to be a late beginner, as a self taught pianist, I feel like I'm in this weird spot where I have very huge gaps in knowledge both music theory and playing wise. For instance, I don't know how to name or play any piano chords and such technical stuff, however I'm very comfortable playing in any key signature and using the entire piano as well as quickly moving around quickly like in gnossienne no.5. I think my ability to understand the nature and feeling of a song is good enough and many people I know who are skilled in piano claimed my musical expression was great when I performed Gymnopedie no.1 (one of the first pieces I have ever learned) and Gnossiennses 1-5. So I'm just a bit confused as where I would be classified
Yes, sometimes levels overlap, especially when going the "non-traditional" route of being a self-taught pianist. If you are able to find piano music that interests you and is somewhere around your level, maybe it doesn't matter too much what level you are. If you were constantly picking music that was too easy or too difficult, then knowing your approximate level can be helpful.
Hi Susan, I'm wondering if you could comment on, or perhaps even make a short video on, the challenges of learning on a digital piano. I do, and I am somewhat aware of its shortcomings but they are about to come into sharper focus as I am going to start in person lessons in 3 or 4 weeks and like most instructors she has an acoustic piano. This will be a new challenge to add to my late beg/early int practice. And to my budget as well as I know it will make me desperately want an acoustic (i already do). Incidently I have a fair quality digital, good for its price range of about $600, a yamaha P225. I am 61, but if my R thumb joint will hold up (and all else) I plan to play for many more years. Thank you for your generous content.
@@PianoRoadmap The lessons are great, I'm so glad to be able to do it. But the digital piano is certainly an issue, as I can see that as I slowly improve I will become more and more aware of its many shortcomings. But when I do get an acoustic it will almost certainly need to be upright since my house is very small, then there are the many shortcomings compared to a grand!! I found a lot of valuble content on the Merriam Music account if you have anyone who is looking for an intro to the complex world of acoustic pianos...Thanks for your reply and as always your great videos. I'm currently working throught the practice tips playlist.
@@leeciap My two cents. Get a digital piano with the best keyboard action you can afford. It will *not* limit your practice for many years. You can be sure that your technique will be the limit, not the instrument. You will need to be playing quite advanced repertoire to start noticing some limitations and most will be related to the sound. Note that an upright acoustic piano also has limitations when compared to a grand piano. A high-end digital piano will actually feel closer to a grand piano than an upright. And if you live in a small place, especially with neighbours, the sound of an acoustic can easily create problems and a digital is better in such cases. Have a look the Yamaha N1X and Kawai Novus NV10 (these models use an adapted action from a grand piano). You can also consider the Casio GP 310/510 or Kawai CA901/701 as slightly more affordable options. I would get any of these digital pianos over an entry- or mid-range upright (a very good acoustic upright costs as much as a small grand piano...) In 10 years' time, consider investing on grand and keep the digital for night practicing ;-)
Great information. This appears to describe classical music. As a beginner jazz pianist I am more interested in learning scales, inversions, chord progressions, harmonic function, and improvisation. But I remember the late great jazz pianist Kenny Kirkland who played with Sting was classically trained, as well as Billy Joel. I wonder if there are any memorization of the pieces in classical music and or reinterpretations with improvisation.
Even with your goals that are geared towards improv, spending a little time with classical music is great fuel for creativity (I think!). Music is made of patterns, so if we read these and understand them from classical music, I do believe we subconsciously use and reinterpret them.
I learn piano for 20 weeks, practice 10 hours / week. Now i am working with Beyer opus 101, on exercise 24, Hanon exercise 3, Faber piano adventure for adult 1, page 80, also faber clasic song and popular song And my teacher said i am at prepatory level, and i need another 20 weeks to be ready to join lv 1 So can you make another illustration for pre beginner, earlier beginner, beginner, and late beginner? I believe many people are beginner Also may be there is a playlist video for each level, so i can find which video i should watch
Wonderful suggestion! Yes, the whole range of the "beginner" level is vast, and I'll try to add more detailed suggestions in the future. As far as playlists go, I do have a beginner, late-beginner, intermediate, etc playlist with repertoire suggestions. I'll keep adding to them too!
😮😢 oh my, not very encouraging, this being my third week, but I am enjoying just my simple exercises, enjoying the journey rather than an end goal at my age:86
I'm older too, just make challenging yourself fun! Hang in there. Progress is always slow at all levels. Once you can sight read even simple pieces your fun will increase I promise!
You don’t need to take this long. Learn chords not notes and you’ll be able to play songs much more quickly. The classical approach outlined in this video is designed to take years and even decades to progress through. It doesn’t have to take anywhere near this long to learn. If you focus on chords you can learn to play thousands of songs in just a few months.
@@andybarker8787 It's an entirely different mindset to want to play an instrument reading only lead sheets and not music. I used the Pianote platform so I've been introduced to both and strongly dislike the lead sheet/chord route. It works for many, not me, I enjoy the challenge of sight reading, classical music, and prefer to take the slower classical route.
Few days ago i started playing stardew valley.. i was not getting any progress so i watched some yt videos..i realised many mistakes i made..so i had to start a new game to play it right.. Somehow i am getting the same feeling while watching this video
Hi Grace (sorry i could not find your name and thought i needed to address this to you). I think there are a lot of extra additional grades between late intermediate and advanced. According to your scale i am an expert but I considered myself late intermediate and i have been stuck at that level for more years than it took me to progress from beginner. i learned All 24 Chopin etudes, played many JS Bach Preludes and Fugues and the Italian concerto and at least 5 different Mozart piano sonatas for performance to a Jury of piano performance professors. Here is should say i am very unsatisfied with my level. I do not play with ease and it takes me considerable time to learn these pieces (months, years) and i will mess up consistently. I am taking a break away from the piano for now over 10 months. I do not consider myself an expert sometimes i even want to say intermediate, not late intermediate.
Very helpful. Thank you. It actually is very much comparable with my teacher’s curriculum, as far as the levels of playing is concerned. On the other hand, The Wild Horseman is RCM (Royal Conservatory of Music) Level 4 (Intermediate)
No harm in setting a challenging goal, especially if you know it's ambitious! Worst case scenario, you don't reach your goal, but you still improve a ton. Good luck!
Not sure I agree that the Mozart Sonata k 545 is late intermediate. Seems more like early advanced. Interesting video! One Beethoven sonata is late intermediate for sure and that is op 49 no 2. I would add another two categories, late advanced and virtuosic. I’m sure you are very well aware of all this but thought I’d add my thoughts
Yup lol, you can't pull Mazeppa/Feux follets out just because you're an advanced player. I mean you could learn it, but.. yea there are still gaps between advanced (virtuosic) players
To me, the Beethoven Op. 49 No. 2 is more advanced than Mozart's K 545, but that might be because I find Beethoven ALWAYS more challenging! I definitely skipped advanced and virtuosic in this video, mostly because I figure that if you're at the late advanced/virtuosic stage, you already know 😆 Thanks so much for adding your thoughts!
Thank you! I always feel a little pretentious if I say I play at an advanced level. Would love to know whether I’m “early advanced” or later, though it probably doesn’t matter in the end. 😊
started my journey 4 month ago. so im between late beginner and early intermediate.would be good if you would make a video with MORE pieces for each level. Because we beginners really struggle to find good stuff to play
I would be interested in a video that breaks down the advanced phases more. There is obviously very great differences in the pieces beyond the later intermediate levels. I'm doing Bach Inventions right now now but still consider myself at that middle intermediate level.
Is there something in particular you would like to know, or are you interested in piano repertoire suggestions at early advanced, advanced, & pro levels?
Back in the 80's when I learned to play the piano, we were not let anywhere near the grand piano before we have learned all notes, keys and chords.. It was simply just basic knowledge for our teachers to expect. So only theory at the music school - and all playing happened at home ;)
Did you grow up in the US? We didn't have grand pianos at my school in the 80s, just old uprights, but I think our teachers would have truly appreciated the rule your school implemented 😆 We were "Heart & Soul" playing machines...
Thank you for the video. Although you talk about the broader levels, ABRSM did give me some sort of path to take to climb up in skill. As for most beginners there is plenty to learn and plenty of resources, your skill will skyrocket in the first few months. But at some point, around intermediate level, this drops significantly. There is nothing really that shows you what steps to take next. Using ABRSM's scaling gives you an idea what you need to know and able to play to get to the next grade. Ofcourse you don't have to take their exams, but I highly recommend their apps and literature. They just give an overal idea of progression you can follow.
My sister, the Lord bless you for being a blessing to many. I wish you a very speedy recovery. Please, drink a lot of water, fruits, have enough sleep and rest from time to time.
Get well Susan, thank you for very interesting and helpful video for the beginners. P.S. I hope you are well and strong at the time of posting this video.
Thanks for this description.. very helpful delineation of skills. One question, is reading music correlated to abilities on these levels? It does seem there are non-traditional learning journies, where people learn techniques far ahead of their ability to read. Many of the techniques seem correlated from a development standpoint in the different level, but I am curious as to whether reading level should be distinguished from playing level?
Really great observation! As adults, we often tend to be more advanced with theory, musicality, and other intellectual skills. It can take a minute for our technique to catch up. But it also works the other way for people. Some have a very natural ability to "just play", without a thorough knowledge of what they're really doing.
i loved the video, but it left me a little confused can anyone explain to me how this works because this video gave me the impression that a lot of things are learnt by rote. for example, playing chords and chord inversions. i got the impression the video meant that knowing what the inversions of the chords are, or even being able to play the chords, is tricky and different chords are separated into different levels. is this because the video refers to being able to play/construct them quickly, or because it assumes you don’t know how major and minor chords are constructed. so when i started, i knew that a major triad was made up of the root note, then a note up four semitones, then a note up three semitones again. theoretically i could construct any major chord, just not quickly. when i learnt you could move the notes around and maintain the same chord, i could construct any inversion but again, very slowly. the same thing applies with reading sheet music and scales (knowing, not playing): i just can’t tell if people (this video and a few others i’ve seen) are talking about playing/reading or whatever quickly, or if everything is learnt by rote. sorry this comment is so long i probably missed something in the video tl;dr is the video talking about doing stuff quick or learning by rote
Hope you’re feeling better Susan! This was very informative. Thanks! BTW, I really like the “fuzzy slippers” pedaling! Does that make the sustain softer? 🙄
i think im actually in the middle of late beginner and early intermmediate, but more in late beginner 😢 im a grade 9 student (and I have been playing piano for 1 year and maybe 2-3 months?) and unfortunately i do struggle managing time with school and practicing + i dont have a piano yet, not even a pedal 😭 but, I go to my teachers house for lessons sometimes and of course I make sure I use my time well there (I know how to play sonstina in c major, and of course minuet in g 😁)
It sounds like you're making amazing progress, considering that you're a busy student without a piano at home! Keep at it, because if you can set aside regular practice time and get better access to a piano, you'll probably see lots of gains!
I don't teach private online lessons anymore because all my focus is spent on TH-cam and my teaching through the Piano Roadmap Membership (www.PianoRoadmap.com).
@@PianoRoadmap Thank you for your reply, I have watched all of your videos many times. I am a struggling piano player for the passed 15 years, i have had many teachers and i practise a lot most days. Thats why i asked about on line lessons. Keep the great videos coming.
Hello Susan, new subscriber as of today. Thank you for this informative video! I've been an adult on and off pianist for many years and I've been recently feeling that familiar void of not having music in my life after a hiatus of about 7 years now. I've always struggled with understanding my "level" and, as you alluded to, I've often crossed the boundaries beyond my true level just to try, often fail , only to end up scurrying back to simpler pastures! Your explanations made sense and helped validate my personal assessment of my level which I'd place as intermediate. Although not explicitly discussed in your video, I believe you made a vague reference to our "technical" skill level as something that would naturally progress as our level of proficiency progresses. However, I'm curious to better understand how you'd assess hand independence, speed of execution in scales, arpeggios and other exercises as well as being able to reach the metronome indications in a given piece of music. I do struggle with this and find it difficult, especially when focusing on "technique" exercises, to see any significant progress. Looking forward to any feedback you can share. Thanks again for the content and I'm looking forward to viewing past and future content. Marc
Thank you for subscribing, and welcome to the channel :) Once one reaches an intermediate level, it becomes more difficult to notice progress because it becomes more subtle, like being able to shape a phrase beautifully or have more control when playing softly. If you feel that you're struggling with making significant progress in any area, the first thing to do is to keep a journal so you KNOW whether or not you're progressing. You might find you actually area!
I know this is nearly impossible, but given someone studying 1 hour a day, there would a way to estimate how long in your experience it would take to reach those levels? at least to intermediate?
Unfortunately, you're right. It is nearly impossible to estimate how long it would take a unique individual to reach an intermediate level from scratch. Even with the same amount of practice per day, some are able to practice more efficiently, retain information more easily, be more "natural" at the piano, and the list goes on. If we're talking averages with tempered expectations, to go from 0 to intermediate with an hour a day, plan on a journey of about 2-7 years. How's that for broad??? And with all skill-based activities, the more you know, the more you know you don't know 😆 But I suppose that's the fun of it. Good luck to you!
It depends on how well you play your early advanced repertoire and what specific degree you would like. There's music performance, music education, music minors, music tech, music therapy, music composition...I think I got them all, but I'm sure there's something I missed 😆 Do you work with a private piano teacher?
Hi! I'm not familiar with this piece, but just had a quick peek at an arrangement of it. While I haven't played it, to me it looks more like early advanced.
58 yo here. Started on piano at age 12, then quickly moved to acoustic guitar, then onto bass guitar semi-professionally for decades. Eventually picked up some mandolin. Now I got myself a nice Roland synth and I'm back to learning keys. I'm a rocker so I'm working on things like Toto's Hold the Line, BOC's Joan Crawford, Zep's Trampled under Foot, Yours Is No Disgrace by Yes. I suppose I'm a mix of early through late intermediate. Music theory skills are there, I know all the chords, scales, I can read music etc.. I know how to construct something like, an Ebmaj7. It's just...making my fingers go there, and quickly is the challenge. My hand independence needs a lot of work. I guess I should focus more on finger exercises. I try to get in 20-30 min at least a day - many sessions go longer. Thank you for the breakdown. It makes me feel good that if I keep on this, I'll be getting close to advanced in another year or two.
Awesome! For someone like you who knows how to read music and has extensive theory knowledge, the best thing you can do to "catch your hands up" is to pick piano rep that is at your level or BELOW so you're going through a ton of new music. If I were you, that would be the majority of my practice for a while, with maybe 1 piece that's more challenging musically and kind of like a goal piece. Good luck!
@@PianoRoadmap , thanks for your reply. Wow, that is different advice than I expected. So I should forego the "do 2 octave scale and arpeggio" exercises to get yoiur chops up for right now and mostly focus on learning lots of "easy" music?
@@user-zt2wc3uh1l Honestly, yes. At this stage, there's no need to be able to play every single major scale. Will you eventually want to be able to do this? Yes, for sure. But right now, if you are trying to gain hand independence, I would just practice pieces. Maybe take 1 new one every week that is easy for you, and work on polishing it up as best as you can. This will develop really great practicing habits, get you a bunch of music under your belt, and begin to develop solid hand independence technique. And if you want, warm-up with a scale. But don't make that your focus.
@@PianoRoadmap thank you, liked and subscribed!
Thanks for this extremely helpful video. I played piano as a child and teen and was at a late intermediate level, but then wasn't able to play for decades. Now, in my 60's, I'm picking it up again. I find that I can struggle through intermediate music IF it's a piece that I played previously, but learning new music is much harder and puts me at more a late beginner level. My music reading and theory skills are really low now, I am working to regain confidence with the notes below and above the staff, counting out rhythms, multiple sharps/flats, etc. And I was never taught chords or scales properly, so I'm starting at the beginning with those. It's great to get a sense for how my skills or lack thereof fit into the larger picture. It's amazing to find such wonderful resources online, a huge improvement from 50 years ago! Thanks for the great videos.
Self-taught here, and I’m working through your Major/Minor scale challenges right now. I really appreciate this breakdown, even if it sets me back around late-beginner, early-intermediate. 😂 Hope your health improves quickly! Thanks so much for your teaching, I really appreciate this channel. ❤
get well soon Susan, I always look forward to your post, it's very true that it's difficult to find what level your at, for me i went to the abrsm books and then used that to find the right composer, so far it has worked fairly well. At the moment i use the grade 4 pieces which to take me around a couple of days to learn and then a couple more days to nail, practicing around 2 hours a day. I am shortly going to step it up to grade 5 pieces 🤞🤞
Thank you for your informative videos. They are so well presented. Thank you!!
Thanks so much for your support, and glad they're helpful!
Susan, thank you so much for making the levels clear. I’m working through your Piano Roadmap, and it’s so helpful to me, since I’m doing this on my own. I’m at the beginning level. 🥰
❤️
Thank you. This is tremendously helpful and inspiring with great ideas.
I love watching piano vids on TH-cam, but few people actually know something about music. And you are damn sure one of them!! First off: you know that Etude/Prelude in G wasn’t written by JS Bach but by Petzold, and you knew that Für Elise and Moonlight Sonate (movement I) aren’t pieces for beginners. You earned a sub, keep up the good work!!!
Playing Moonlight Sonata without all the movements is NOT playing Moonlight Sonata.
@@andersnielsen6044 I agree. L. Van Beethoven wrote it with the intention for it to fit together. The movements can be Played as a standalone though. And evens if it’s not the complete sonate, it’s still a good way to start.
I 10000% agree with you about Gymnopédie! I tried to learn this as one of my first pieces a few hundred hours ago, and I gave up primarily because of the leaps not sounding musical at all (hahaha). I will probably revisit this piece again soon! (I have about 450 hours total practice time right now, self taught/youtube).
Definitions of levels are clear and make complete sense. Thank you.
Wanted to know which levels the following pieces correspond to:
1. Chopin waltz in C# minor (op 64 no 2)
2. Sibelius Etude (op 76 no 2)
To answer, Chopin's C# minor Waltz op. 64 no.2 is grade 6 in Henle's scale (Henle Verlag publications) So, on par with Chopin's Polonaise Dramatique (op. 26 no. 1 C# minor) or the Eb Major Nocturne op.9 no. 2. Also the F minor Nocturne op. 55 no. 1 which I'm starting to work on now in hopes of playing for the Fall recital. Henle 6 is solidly late intermediate, possibly blurring a just a little bit into early advanced repertoire depending on the piece. Mozart's D minor Fantasie K.397 (which I'm performing at our recital in June) is also Henle grade 6.
Oh, and looking at the Sibelius Etude, seeing the intended tempo, movement and quick interval jumps in the left hand, and how constant they are, I'd say likely Henle grade 7 which would put it in the early advanced category. Even though Sibelius isn't published by Henle. It might be a grade 6, but I'd think that would be a very "late" grade 6 piece with the speed and the motions in the right hand, so more likely a grade 7. So I'd say either very late intermediate or earlier advanced repertoire.
It's not unlike Chopin's Etude f minor op. 25,2 "The Bees" which is Henle grade 7.
Wow, I was really hoping to get an idea of how I should be progressing, but then you put so much together in the late beginner that it is well beyond where I am at now… so disheartening
Don't be fooled by the "beginner" in late-beginner. These are very broad categories, and it can take some years to get to the late-beginner stage. I can't remember exactly, but I believe it took me about 3 years to reach that level. Someone else here mentioned that they think there should be an added "mid-beginner" level, and I agree. These terms are used because a lot of piano music is categorized this way (beginner, late beginner, early intermediate, etc).
It's obviously never my intention to dishearten any aspiring pianist! I made this video to help self-learners have a starting point when looking for music, not to judge themselves and their progress. ❤️
Late beginner for me. I have a few of the skills in early intermediate, but have gaps in skills that my teachers never told me to practice, like scales lol. But I am good at sight reading easy beginner pieces and lead sheets. I wish I had access to online resources like this channel when my teachers were not very thorough and didn't tell me what to practice aside from repertoire (which was usually above my level). Thank you!
This is really helpful for my self-taught goal setting and pieces to try out! I'm late beginner with some early intermediate knowledge and skills (I looove arpeggios). I want to be moving around the keyboard more and feel so "stuck" around C4, but I can see I've been getting ahead of myself in terms of my note-reading and cords skills. Knowing how to progress and what to practise is so helpful. :)
Thank you for explaining in clear terms the different levels. One of the pieces that is not often mentioned in an early intermediate level is the Gnossienne no4 by Erik Satie. It helps to have the left hand play arpeggio like passages. Not terribly difficult to learn but difficult enough to interpret beautifully. I know because I am an adult amateur pianist. Great video, thanks again.
This was really helpful! I studied percussion in college, but have rudimentary skills at the piano. This helps me know where to start
I am early intermediate with some intermediate skills (2 years in). I practice about 2 hours a day. My goal is not necessarily to become an advanced player but just to be able to enjoy playing pieces that make me feel happy. I am in my 50s and retired early and decided to learn piano as my new “job”. Really like your teaching style.
Excellent explanation of levels. There are some relatively easy pieces to read but fairly difficult to interpret beautifully, for example some of the Album Leaves by Schumann. Thank you for breaking down a subject that many teachers leave to the side.
I have my first lesson with a teacher in a week and I'm trying to find out my current level after my self study for ~6 months. With this video I'd probably place myself around late beginner. But I'll see then %)
Thank you very much for the informative video, it was very helpful.
Thanks! Very helpful. N hope u r much better now.
Thank you so much, and thank you for your support ❤️
Thank you so much I’ve been wondering what level I am any have been searching it up but all it comes up is that there is no levels so you having this video has really helped me
Also I am between early intermediate and intermediate
Glad you found what you needed!
Thank you for always posting very informative videos. I hope you feel better soon :)
This is very informative. From what you said here, I consider myself a mid to late beginner.
Your voice is not weird at all by the way. I know this was posted months ago, but please get and stay well. Thanks for sharing.
😊
FINALLY- I’m self-teaching wandering-around aimlessly- your experience gives guidance goals.
THANKS ❤
Ditto
As a fellow teacher, I find it fascinating to hear what other teachers use to measure “levels.”
In my opinion, I feel like there’s a big jump from the skills described from Late Beginner to Early Intermediate. I might split the Beginner levels into 3 parts as well, Early, Mid, and Late. And then I might use your description for Late Beginner as a Mid-Beginner and bridge the gap a little better to Early Intermediate.
All that being said, I do agree with quite a few things mentioned here! I just wish there was more technique addressed than just balancing hands or voicing to mark levels.
What for techniques? :)
Yeah, it's difficult to measure levels! I get why it's important for adults (especially those learning on their own) to have some kind of measure, but even my opinion on levels changes from week to week. I agree with you about splitting the Beginner level up - great thought!
@@PianoRoadmap I actually believe further splitting the Beginner level adds no value whatsoever. The whole Beginner phase is about acquiring a set of fundamentals to open the door to the next Intermediate level. I would prefer listing the knowledge and set of technical skills one is supposed to have at the end of the Beginner level to make clear when the transition to Intermediate starts taking place. Splitting the levels (especially the Beginner level) only introduces an artificial skill acquisition roadmap that will not reflect reality. So, I would stick to Complete Beginner -> Beginner -> Early | Middle | Late Intermediate -> Advanced. And you could add a "Professional" or similar level at the end. Keep on the good work!
First video of yours I've seen and it was fabulous! Will definitely check out more
Thank you for this "know thyself" video😢. I studied (struggled with reading the music) piano when I was 9 and havnt played at all for 50 years. Been re learning for about 6 month now and today aftee watching your "late beginer" 'tests" I know my level ..😢😢😢😢 😅. Your video is very helpful. Thank you!❤
You're welcome!
Thoughtfully done and very informative.
Very nice . Thank you … I do feel better about my progress… enjoying the journey… I do play a number of the pieces you mentioned…. Always learning and practicing but enjoying and loving the process … Chopin my favorite 🎹thank you for the explanation…. I feel better about where I am and level ..
Your voice was as lovely as always is. Great video ! 👏🏻
Much needed. Much appreciated. I particularly appreciate the notion that one's skills may span two or more levels. So true. Love the suggested repertoire. My problems include punch-outs, such as pedalling and ornaments. Sigh.
So many wonderful pieces to look forward to. Thanks so much! ‘Reverie’ by Tingley really took my breath away, can’t wait to reach that stage
The Reverie is one of my favorites!
❤Thank you so much Susan this video is really Great! and help to clear my mind so much.
Wishing you get well very soon.
Thank you so much! Very helpful, and well explained.. I wasn’t sure where I was on the spectrum, but now have a better understanding. 😊
Hope you feel better. Thank you for the guidance. I know now where I should be in the process. Thanks again
Happy to help!
Thank you Susan for your effective teaching. I have learned so much just from the few videos I've watched. I appreciate that you are very frank & honest with us but yet kind at the same time. Because as beginner I was told Gymnopédie No.1 would be easy because it is such a slow piece. Good to know now. By the way your voice is comforting and easy to listen to, even when sick ;))
I believe I am in between a beginner and late beginner. You also gave me some great pieces to try out to see my skill level so thank you very much.
You're welcome!
I hope you are feeling better! Thank you. I have been playing my scales with a metronome for the past two months. I had some metronome trauma as a young violinist, but with a digital metronome I can keep the volume low, and that helps. And so does doing scales with a metronome!! What I would like a video on, is a way to get competent at playing the melody hand louder than the accompaniment. Most of the exercises I’ve seen keep one in a five-finger position, playing a single note at a time. That hasn’t translated for me to actual music.
Thanks for the suggestion! Hand balance is very tricky and a great topic for an upcoming video.
It's common to find individual movements out of a set such as "Bourree" from Bach Lute Suite #1 (BWV996) in Em in "First Lessons in Bach" without Prelude, Courante, Sarabande, etc. Very few beginners or lower intermediates including myself would play all the movements of the Beethoven "Moonlight Sonata" but it's common to see learners attempt the 1st movement. The Bach "Prelude in C" from the WTC Book 1 is a piece commonly found in lower level repertoire books without any of the other movements. Beethoven "Fur Elise" as a beginner piece is usually without the "technical" middle section. Beginner repertoire books would include "Fur Elise" without the middle part.
Today we find books for Easy Piano with simplified arrangements of pieces such as Chopin "Ballade", Debussy "Clair de Lune" etc. often in a different key with fewer sharps or flats for beginners. Otherwise many people wouldn't attempt to play the original versions until at least 4 years into piano playing.
always wondered about my level....self-taught, retired and at 68yrs old....been playing piano on/off since my teen years....this is my second coming year of constants playing with close to three hours a day practicing....now i'm starting to play Chopin Aeolian Harp and besides others....i think the one that really help me is Czerny op 740....i tackled that constantly....its like a marathon on steroids for your fingers....if i can play three Chopin Etudes or Liszt Un Sospiro before the year is over, i'll be very happy.....i don't know any thing about scales, don't use metronome and don't know anything about sight-reading....i don't follow the dynamics but i do my own interpretation....my only obstacle now is memorize a score...i just don't have that talent...also have small hands....can't extend to the10th keys....i don't have the right speed yet...i figure that it'll eventually come within two more years....they say it'll normally takes 8yrs to be proficient in playing a piano....i think i can do it in 5yrs....thank you for the summarization on skill levels....i have ONE question though: can you call yourself a pianist if self-taught?
Yes, of course you can call yourself a pianist if self-taught!
@@PianoRoadmap thank for your reply back, always been wondering about that....i thought only academic pianist has the honored to be called so
Just found more than a couple of interesting pieces for my level right here. Thank you so much!
You're welcome!
Very helpful, I thought I was intermediate level but not quite have everything you mentioned yet.
The best explanation I have heard. Thank you.
You sound like an incredible teacher.
Thank you so much that's help me a lot.
I restarted playing the piano after years without one. I took lessons as a child and a few years as a teenager. I never learned chords. Mostly learned from Thompson graded books. I started working on Poet and the Peasant as a teen, but never could play the last several pages. 55 years later I finally can play the whole thing! So I figure without knowing chords I'm still a beginner? But Poet and Peasant Overture is no cakewalk! I'd like to know where you think I stand. I can play 13 of 15 Scenes from Childhood by Schumann. Woo!
From what you state, you are between early intermediate and intermediate!
Thank you so much! This was very informative. I hope you feel better soon
Playing piano was always my dream mam 😊. Thank for fulfilling it mam❤.
Please 🙏 I know you'll be fine.😊 You are a great teacher 💝😊
Thank you Susan for the helpful video! How long should it take to learn a piece which matches the level I am currently at? Or rather, what is a good amount of time to spend on any given piece appropriate for my level?
That all depends on your current level. But for beginners to early intermediate pianists, I would say *generally* that a piece at your current level should take no more than a month to learn. If a piece is taking longer for you, it doesn't mean you shouldn't practice it, but it's just in your "challenging" zone.
Very much enjoy your videos and your soothing voice (:. I do have a teacher and also a couple beginner students and am learning from you as well. Thank you specifically for this video - I appreciate the recommendation to play pieces at several levels and am attempting to prevent burnout. Thank you again!
You're welcome!
Nice, exactly what i was looking for
Thank you for the list of pieces, this helps a lot
I am Day 1. Got myself a used Yamaha P90. My goal is to reach where I can feel Chopin and give me goosebumps as I play. Hello practice, hello routine. Ty so much for this video ❤
By the time you'll be able to play Chopin advanced pieces on a decent level, you'll begin to hate them LOL.
How exciting, and good luck! Regarding the comment below (or above?), I can't imagine ever hating Chopin 😆 Ever. But I will say that if you can learn to love the process and all the beautiful music along the way to get to Chopin, you'll have no regrets.
Very good - puts it in perspective, I'm way ahead in technique and knowledge and way way behind in playing capability - difficult to be honest with oneself in the self teach world.
That's common for adults learning on their own!
Although I believe myself to be a late beginner, as a self taught pianist, I feel like I'm in this weird spot where I have very huge gaps in knowledge both music theory and playing wise. For instance, I don't know how to name or play any piano chords and such technical stuff, however I'm very comfortable playing in any key signature and using the entire piano as well as quickly moving around quickly like in gnossienne no.5.
I think my ability to understand the nature and feeling of a song is good enough and many people I know who are skilled in piano claimed my musical expression was great when I performed Gymnopedie no.1 (one of the first pieces I have ever learned) and Gnossiennses 1-5.
So I'm just a bit confused as where I would be classified
Yes, sometimes levels overlap, especially when going the "non-traditional" route of being a self-taught pianist. If you are able to find piano music that interests you and is somewhere around your level, maybe it doesn't matter too much what level you are. If you were constantly picking music that was too easy or too difficult, then knowing your approximate level can be helpful.
This was extremely helpful! Thank you!
Susan, great rational video. Thank you.
Hi Susan, I'm wondering if you could comment on, or perhaps even make a short video on, the challenges of learning on a digital piano. I do, and I am somewhat aware of its shortcomings but they are about to come into sharper focus as I am going to start in person lessons in 3 or 4 weeks and like most instructors she has an acoustic piano. This will be a new challenge to add to my late beg/early int practice. And to my budget as well as I know it will make me desperately want an acoustic (i already do). Incidently I have a fair quality digital, good for its price range of about $600, a yamaha P225. I am 61, but if my R thumb joint will hold up (and all else) I plan to play for many more years. Thank you for your generous content.
Thank you for your suggestion! Have you started your in person lessons? How have you found going back and forth between digital and acoustic?
@@PianoRoadmap The lessons are great, I'm so glad to be able to do it. But the digital piano is certainly an issue, as I can see that as I slowly improve I will become more and more aware of its many shortcomings. But when I do get an acoustic it will almost certainly need to be upright since my house is very small, then there are the many shortcomings compared to a grand!! I found a lot of valuble content on the Merriam Music account if you have anyone who is looking for an intro to the complex world of acoustic pianos...Thanks for your reply and as always your great videos. I'm currently working throught the practice tips playlist.
@@leeciap My two cents. Get a digital piano with the best keyboard action you can afford. It will *not* limit your practice for many years. You can be sure that your technique will be the limit, not the instrument. You will need to be playing quite advanced repertoire to start noticing some limitations and most will be related to the sound. Note that an upright acoustic piano also has limitations when compared to a grand piano. A high-end digital piano will actually feel closer to a grand piano than an upright. And if you live in a small place, especially with neighbours, the sound of an acoustic can easily create problems and a digital is better in such cases. Have a look the Yamaha N1X and Kawai Novus NV10 (these models use an adapted action from a grand piano). You can also consider the Casio GP 310/510 or Kawai CA901/701 as slightly more affordable options. I would get any of these digital pianos over an entry- or mid-range upright (a very good acoustic upright costs as much as a small grand piano...) In 10 years' time, consider investing on grand and keep the digital for night practicing ;-)
Great information. This appears to describe classical music. As a beginner jazz pianist I am more interested in learning scales, inversions, chord progressions, harmonic function, and improvisation. But I remember the late great jazz pianist Kenny Kirkland who played with Sting was classically trained, as well as Billy Joel. I wonder if there are any memorization of the pieces in classical music and or reinterpretations with improvisation.
Even with your goals that are geared towards improv, spending a little time with classical music is great fuel for creativity (I think!). Music is made of patterns, so if we read these and understand them from classical music, I do believe we subconsciously use and reinterpret them.
I learn piano for 20 weeks, practice 10 hours / week.
Now i am working with Beyer opus 101, on exercise 24, Hanon exercise 3, Faber piano adventure for adult 1, page 80, also faber clasic song and popular song
And my teacher said i am at prepatory level, and i need another 20 weeks to be ready to join lv 1
So can you make another illustration for pre beginner, earlier beginner, beginner, and late beginner?
I believe many people are beginner
Also may be there is a playlist video for each level, so i can find which video i should watch
Wonderful suggestion! Yes, the whole range of the "beginner" level is vast, and I'll try to add more detailed suggestions in the future. As far as playlists go, I do have a beginner, late-beginner, intermediate, etc playlist with repertoire suggestions. I'll keep adding to them too!
😮😢 oh my, not very encouraging, this being my third week, but I am enjoying just my simple exercises, enjoying the journey rather than an end goal at my age:86
Keep going…I am 78 and at intermediate level…Have fun…❤
I'm older too, just make challenging yourself fun! Hang in there. Progress is always slow at all levels. Once you can sight read even simple pieces your fun will increase I promise!
You don’t need to take this long. Learn chords not notes and you’ll be able to play songs much more quickly. The classical approach outlined in this video is designed to take years and even decades to progress through. It doesn’t have to take anywhere near this long to learn. If you focus on chords you can learn to play thousands of songs in just a few months.
@@andybarker8787 It's an entirely different mindset to want to play an instrument reading only lead sheets and not music. I used the Pianote platform so I've been introduced to both and strongly dislike the lead sheet/chord route. It works for many, not me, I enjoy the challenge of sight reading, classical music, and prefer to take the slower classical route.
@@leeciap I agree, although figuring out and playing chords along with songs I love by ear is still fun. But I would never want to just stop there!
Few days ago i started playing stardew valley.. i was not getting any progress so i watched some yt videos..i realised many mistakes i made..so i had to start a new game to play it right..
Somehow i am getting the same feeling while watching this video
Thank you.
Hi Grace (sorry i could not find your name and thought i needed to address this to you). I think there are a lot of extra additional grades between late intermediate and advanced. According to your scale i am an expert but I considered myself late intermediate and i have been stuck at that level for more years than it took me to progress from beginner. i learned All 24 Chopin etudes, played many JS Bach Preludes and Fugues and the Italian concerto and at least 5 different Mozart piano sonatas for performance to a Jury of piano performance professors. Here is should say i am very unsatisfied with my level. I do not play with ease and it takes me considerable time to learn these pieces (months, years) and i will mess up consistently. I am taking a break away from the piano for now over 10 months. I do not consider myself an expert sometimes i even want to say intermediate, not late intermediate.
Thank you
Very helpful. Thank you.
It actually is very much comparable with my teacher’s curriculum, as far as the levels of playing is concerned.
On the other hand, The Wild Horseman is RCM (Royal Conservatory of Music) Level 4 (Intermediate)
You're welcome!
Very informative
4 months beginner here. I think hitting the late beginner mark will be my goal for end of the year. I know this is quite ambitious though!
No harm in setting a challenging goal, especially if you know it's ambitious! Worst case scenario, you don't reach your goal, but you still improve a ton. Good luck!
Not sure I agree that the Mozart Sonata k 545 is late intermediate. Seems more like early advanced. Interesting video! One Beethoven sonata is late intermediate for sure and that is op 49 no 2. I would add another two categories, late advanced and virtuosic. I’m sure you are very well aware of all this but thought I’d add my thoughts
Yup lol, you can't pull Mazeppa/Feux follets out just because you're an advanced player. I mean you could learn it, but.. yea there are still gaps between advanced (virtuosic) players
To me, the Beethoven Op. 49 No. 2 is more advanced than Mozart's K 545, but that might be because I find Beethoven ALWAYS more challenging! I definitely skipped advanced and virtuosic in this video, mostly because I figure that if you're at the late advanced/virtuosic stage, you already know 😆 Thanks so much for adding your thoughts!
I don't know why you had to apologize for your voice. I mean, it's fantastic. I subscribed to your channel immediately after I heard your voice.
Thank you 😊
Early intermediate pianist (now I know!), but advanced video producer. Compliments to your beautiful lighting!
😊 Thank you, that means a lot!
Thank you! I always feel a little pretentious if I say I play at an advanced level. Would love to know whether I’m “early advanced” or later, though it probably doesn’t matter in the end. 😊
LET THEM KNOW! 😃
started my journey 4 month ago. so im between late beginner and early intermediate.would be good if you would make a video with MORE pieces for each level. Because we beginners really struggle to find good stuff to play
Coming soon!
Hoping you’re back on top form 🎉very soon 🔜, your videos are brilliant! 🙏🧡🌈
Thank you!
I enjoyed it.
I looove the Venetian boat song 😊
thankyou 🌱
I would be interested in a video that breaks down the advanced phases more. There is obviously very great differences in the pieces beyond the later intermediate levels. I'm doing Bach Inventions right now now but still consider myself at that middle intermediate level.
Is there something in particular you would like to know, or are you interested in piano repertoire suggestions at early advanced, advanced, & pro levels?
Back in the 80's when I learned to play the piano, we were not let anywhere near the grand piano before we have learned all notes, keys and chords.. It was simply just basic knowledge for our teachers to expect. So only theory at the music school - and all playing happened at home ;)
Did you grow up in the US? We didn't have grand pianos at my school in the 80s, just old uprights, but I think our teachers would have truly appreciated the rule your school implemented 😆 We were "Heart & Soul" playing machines...
Thank you for the video. Although you talk about the broader levels, ABRSM did give me some sort of path to take to climb up in skill. As for most beginners there is plenty to learn and plenty of resources, your skill will skyrocket in the first few months. But at some point, around intermediate level, this drops significantly. There is nothing really that shows you what steps to take next. Using ABRSM's scaling gives you an idea what you need to know and able to play to get to the next grade. Ofcourse you don't have to take their exams, but I highly recommend their apps and literature. They just give an overal idea of progression you can follow.
Completely agree!
Your explanations place me at an early intermediate level. Do you have any examples outside of classical literature?
What genre are you looking for exactly?
Country/contemporary Christian/gospel
My sister, the Lord bless you for being a blessing to many. I wish you a very speedy recovery. Please, drink a lot of water, fruits, have enough sleep and rest from time to time.
Get well Susan, thank you for very interesting and helpful video for the beginners.
P.S. I hope you are well and strong at the time of posting this video.
Thank you! Yes, this weekend I've begun to feel human again!
Thanks for this description.. very helpful delineation of skills. One question, is reading music correlated to abilities on these levels? It does seem there are non-traditional learning journies, where people learn techniques far ahead of their ability to read. Many of the techniques seem correlated from a development standpoint in the different level, but I am curious as to whether reading level should be distinguished from playing level?
Really great observation! As adults, we often tend to be more advanced with theory, musicality, and other intellectual skills. It can take a minute for our technique to catch up. But it also works the other way for people. Some have a very natural ability to "just play", without a thorough knowledge of what they're really doing.
i loved the video, but it left me a little confused
can anyone explain to me how this works because this video gave me the impression that a lot of things are learnt by rote. for example, playing chords and chord inversions. i got the impression the video meant that knowing what the inversions of the chords are, or even being able to play the chords, is tricky and different chords are separated into different levels. is this because the video refers to being able to play/construct them quickly, or because it assumes you don’t know how major and minor chords are constructed.
so when i started, i knew that a major triad was made up of the root note, then a note up four semitones, then a note up three semitones again. theoretically i could construct any major chord, just not quickly. when i learnt you could move the notes around and maintain the same chord, i could construct any inversion but again, very slowly.
the same thing applies with reading sheet music and scales (knowing, not playing): i just can’t tell if people (this video and a few others i’ve seen) are talking about playing/reading or whatever quickly, or if everything is learnt by rote.
sorry this comment is so long i probably missed something in the video
tl;dr is the video talking about doing stuff quick or learning by rote
Hope you’re feeling better Susan! This was very informative. Thanks! BTW, I really like the “fuzzy slippers” pedaling! Does that make the sustain softer? 🙄
Hehe, not really, but I highly recommend always practicing with fuzzy slippers. The "poofier", the better!
10:38 yea let's try Mazeppa ;)🎉
i think im actually in the middle of late beginner and early intermmediate, but more in late beginner 😢 im a grade 9 student (and I have been playing piano for 1 year and maybe 2-3 months?) and unfortunately i do struggle managing time with school and practicing + i dont have a piano yet, not even a pedal 😭 but, I go to my teachers house for lessons sometimes and of course I make sure I use my time well there (I know how to play sonstina in c major, and of course minuet in g 😁)
It sounds like you're making amazing progress, considering that you're a busy student without a piano at home! Keep at it, because if you can set aside regular practice time and get better access to a piano, you'll probably see lots of gains!
Do you teach piano on line ?
I don't teach private online lessons anymore because all my focus is spent on TH-cam and my teaching through the Piano Roadmap Membership (www.PianoRoadmap.com).
@@PianoRoadmap Thank you for your reply, I have watched all of your videos many times. I am a struggling piano player for the passed 15 years, i have had many teachers and i practise a lot most days. Thats why i asked about on line lessons. Keep the great videos coming.
Great video. Thank you! New subscriber. 🙌🙌
🥳 Welcome! And I've been loving reading your comments every week!
@@PianoRoadmap My pleasure! I am happy to support awesome people! 😻
Feel better 🩷
I came from the roadmap from 2 years ago and Susan looks more beautiful than ever
How can i be the combination of late beginner , early intermediate and intermediate.
Adults tend to be more advanced as far as theory, note reading, etc goes. It might just take awhile for your hands/technique to catch up.
Hello Susan, new subscriber as of today. Thank you for this informative video! I've been an adult on and off pianist for many years and I've been recently feeling that familiar void of not having music in my life after a hiatus of about 7 years now. I've always struggled with understanding my "level" and, as you alluded to, I've often crossed the boundaries beyond my true level just to try, often fail , only to end up scurrying back to simpler pastures! Your explanations made sense and helped validate my personal assessment of my level which I'd place as intermediate. Although not explicitly discussed in your video, I believe you made a vague reference to our "technical" skill level as something that would naturally progress as our level of proficiency progresses. However, I'm curious to better understand how you'd assess hand independence, speed of execution in scales, arpeggios and other exercises as well as being able to reach the metronome indications in a given piece of music. I do struggle with this and find it difficult, especially when focusing on "technique" exercises, to see any significant progress.
Looking forward to any feedback you can share. Thanks again for the content and I'm looking forward to viewing past and future content.
Marc
Thank you for subscribing, and welcome to the channel :) Once one reaches an intermediate level, it becomes more difficult to notice progress because it becomes more subtle, like being able to shape a phrase beautifully or have more control when playing softly. If you feel that you're struggling with making significant progress in any area, the first thing to do is to keep a journal so you KNOW whether or not you're progressing. You might find you actually area!
Feel better.
I know this is nearly impossible, but given someone studying 1 hour a day, there would a way to estimate how long in your experience it would take to reach those levels? at least to intermediate?
Unfortunately, you're right. It is nearly impossible to estimate how long it would take a unique individual to reach an intermediate level from scratch. Even with the same amount of practice per day, some are able to practice more efficiently, retain information more easily, be more "natural" at the piano, and the list goes on. If we're talking averages with tempered expectations, to go from 0 to intermediate with an hour a day, plan on a journey of about 2-7 years. How's that for broad??? And with all skill-based activities, the more you know, the more you know you don't know 😆 But I suppose that's the fun of it. Good luck to you!
I wanna go to music university, do you guys think an early advance repertoire is good enough?
It depends on how well you play your early advanced repertoire and what specific degree you would like. There's music performance, music education, music minors, music tech, music therapy, music composition...I think I got them all, but I'm sure there's something I missed 😆 Do you work with a private piano teacher?
2 year late intermediate and I’m playing my dearest by Animenz. I have no trouble playing it is it perhaps not enough for my level?
Hi! I'm not familiar with this piece, but just had a quick peek at an arrangement of it. While I haven't played it, to me it looks more like early advanced.
I am a late beginner. Self taught, learning from past two years.
Bonne rétablissement.
Thank you ❤️ Feeling much better now.