Charlton: A follower of Sanatan Dharma
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.ค. 2024
- In this conversation I speak to a follower of Sanatan Dharma, which is a Hindu-based philosophy in which logic is of no value and answers are to be found inside of us.
00:00 Highlights
00:38 My Impressions & Intro
01:37 Do you have any faith?
04:42 What do you think of Jesus?
12:47 How can we know who God is?
17:06 Spirituality vs reason and logic
31:01 Religious foundations
32:30 Moral judgments
42:22 Exploring Christianity
49:46 Judging and discerning critically
The person agrees he does not know anything about sanatan dharma and christianity.
It is true.
Though he is speaking in English but he is not understanding christian concept of
God;
sin;
evil ;
Claims;
exclusivity.
Thanks reading Rajiv Malhotra books, i know all these concepts and Hindu counterview. Abrahamic world and sanatan dharma world is different.
Thanks. Agreed. Clarity seems to be a foreign concept in Hinduism.
@@christianstreetconversatio3115 You can't get clarity from an average non learned follower of Sanatan Dharam. Just like if you ask some random unlearned Christian about Christianity.
There is only one God(Allah). Jesus was a respected messanger of Allah. Muhammad (peace be upon him) is Allahs last messenger. Quran is Allahs last book
@@SalmanSiddiquey That is not something everyone agrees with. Although, almost everyone agrees there is one God.
@@vcs99 Is it necessary "everyone should agree" something to be true?
This individual is clearly not a following Hindu, but this is very common in Hinduism. Since congregation is not a mandatory practice, most Hindus know their religion by word of mouth(family, friends and media) or some sort of occasional communal gathering. Also since the cast system has always been a thing in the sub-continent it is not unusual for people of non-bhramin(anyone who is not from the priestly class) to not study the scriptures. Here is my understanding of the topic.
Sanatana Dharma and Hinduism:
Sanatana Dharma, often referred to as Hinduism, is an ancient and complex system of beliefs and practices originating in the Indian subcontinent. Unlike Christianity or Islam, it doesn't have a single founder, holy book, or set of universal doctrines. Instead, it's more of an umbrella term encompassing various philosophical and spiritual traditions.
Way of Life vs. Religion:
Hinduism is often described as a way of life rather than a rigid religious system. It's flexible, allowing for diverse beliefs and practices. There's no single "right way" to be a Hindu. It emphasizes personal spiritual experience and philosophical inquiry over strict dogma.
Advaita Vedanta:
One of the most influential schools of Hindu philosophy is Advaita Vedanta. "Advaita" means "non-dual," and this philosophy teaches that ultimate reality is one unified consciousness (Brahman). Our individual souls (Atman) are not separate from this ultimate reality but are identical to it. The goal is to realize this unity and transcend the illusion of separateness.
This might sound quite different from the God-human relationship in monotheistic religions. In Advaita Vedanta, the ultimate aim isn't to worship a separate deity but to realize one's own divine nature.
Schools of Hindu Philosophy:
Hinduism has six main orthodox or 'Asthik' (belief in Vedas the foundational books of Sanatana Dharma) schools of philosophy:
- Samkhya: Focuses on dualism between consciousness and matter.
- Yoga: Emphasizes physical and mental disciplines for spiritual growth.
- Nyaya: Concentrates on logic and epistemology.
- Vaisheshika: Explores the nature of the universe and reality.
- Mimamsa: Focuses on the interpretation of Vedic texts and rituals.
- Vedanta: Includes Advaita Vedanta and other sub-schools, emphasizing spiritual knowledge and self-realization.
Apart from these schools, there are 4 non-orthodox or ''Nastik' (does not believe Vedas the foundational books of Sanatana Dharma)
- Buddhism: Life is suffering, and the path to liberation lies in understanding and overcoming the causes of suffering.
- Jainism: Non-violence (ahimsa) is supreme, and liberation comes through strict asceticism and purification of the soul.
- Charvaka/Lokayata: Materialism is key; only what can be perceived exists, and pleasure is the ultimate goal of life.
- Ajivika: Everything is predetermined by cosmic principles and fate; human effort cannot change one's destiny.
Monism vs. Monotheism:
This is an important distinction when comparing Hinduism (particularly Advaita Vedanta) with religions like Christianity:
Monotheism: Belief in one God who is separate from and superior to creation. This God is typically seen as personal and intervening in human affairs.
Monism: The philosophical view that all of reality is essentially one substance or principle. In Advaita Vedanta, this means that everything - including what we perceive as separate individuals - is ultimately part of one universal consciousness.
So while both monotheism and monism involve "oneness," they conceive of this oneness very differently. A monotheist might say, "There is one God," while an Advaita Vedantin might say, "All is God."
In conclusion, Sanatana Dharma offers a rich tapestry of spiritual and philosophical approaches to life's big questions. Its flexibility and emphasis on personal spiritual exploration make it quite different from the more structured monotheistic religions of the West. While it can seem complex at first, many find its diverse teachings offer profound insights into the nature of reality and human existence. It does not define the creator god, rather believes in experiencing the creator by living a good life. While this is very different from the monotheistic version of the world it is far from 'Illogical', infact as I mentioned above there is literally a whole school of philosophy call 'Nyaya' i.e Logic in this worldview. Hopefully this helps you get some clarity. The scriptures in Hinduism is not just one book, there are literally libraries full of scriptures just to give an example the 'Bhagvad Geeta' (the most famous Hindu Text)is a small part of the the epic 'Mahabharat' which is the longest poem in the world, five times the length of the New Testament.
Well, my talking companion said that logic is irrelevant to his beliefs and this came up when I challenged him about Jesus, in whom he said he believed, but he didn't believe Jesus's own words about himself. That sounds like cognitive dissonance to me.
Ultimately, it's fine to have a warm and fuzzy philosophy, but if a religion cannot make a claim that is worth examining critically then it's just a fanciful story - and a not very good one. On that basis I'd rather follow Marvel characters than Hindu gods.
I am sorry but what exactly is your point here? Since you claim to be logically and analytically superior to the individual in the video, would you like to logically tell me why should anyone believe in the ‘words of Jesus’ from a book that was written 40-120 years after his death by approximately 16 different authors in Greek and not Aramaic that Jesus would have spoken. Then it was translated and retranslated by hundreds of clergy to fit the narrative of the hour but according to you that ‘word’ is more relevant than thousands of years of actual teaching. If you want to be logical then religion is not for you, religion requires you to buy into a specific dogma and then it starts making sense, in this example you believing that Jesus actually said those words that you are spreading as ‘word of god’. All is see is projection and bigotry here and no real logic. Hinduism is not about the storytelling or the gods in it but about the morals of the story. Its is not about the destination but about the journey itself. It is also not a ‘Religion’, I would equate it to Civil law or a constitution where the clauses are explained by story telling, you are allowed to have different interpretations of the ‘law’ and choose your path to live a life within the allocated system but not break it, and like civil law or constitutions you are also allowed to modify and append the clauses since they are not literal words of ‘A God’. The idea here is you can choose to believe in Marvel characters if you want to but the universal law of ‘Karma’- actions and ‘Dharma’ - Duties must be maintained. Also here is a list of all the modern schools of learning that have come out of the Hindu Scriptures generated by ChatGPT:
1. Mathematics:
• Zero: The concept of zero as a number originated in ancient India and is attributed to the mathematician Brahmagupta. The use of zero and the place value system are detailed in Hindu texts like the Brahmasphutasiddhanta.
• Decimal System: The decimal system, including the use of zero and positional notation, was developed in India and is mentioned in texts such as the Rigveda.
• Algebra: Indian mathematicians like Aryabhata, Brahmagupta, and Bhaskara made significant contributions to algebra. They solved quadratic equations and developed algebraic notation, as documented in texts like the Aryabhatiya and Lilavati.
• Trigonometry: Indian scholars introduced trigonometric concepts, with Aryabhata being one of the first to use the sine function. Their work on trigonometry is found in texts like the Surya Siddhanta.
2. Astronomy:
• Heliocentric Theory: Aryabhata proposed that the Earth rotates on its axis, explaining the apparent motion of the stars and planets. This concept is discussed in the Aryabhatiya.
• Planetary Motion: Indian astronomers accurately calculated the periods of planets and developed models for their motion. These are detailed in texts like the Surya Siddhanta and the Siddhantas.
3. Medicine:
• Ayurveda: Ancient Hindu texts like the Charaka Samhita and Sushruta Samhita form the foundation of Ayurveda, an ancient system of medicine. These texts cover topics such as surgery, anatomy, and pharmacology.
• Surgery: The Sushruta Samhita, attributed to the sage Sushruta, describes surgical techniques, including plastic surgery and cataract surgery.
4. Logic and Philosophy:
• Nyaya: The Nyaya Sutras, composed by the sage Gautama, are foundational texts in Indian logic and epistemology. They discuss methods of reasoning, debate, and inference.
• Vaisheshika: The Vaisheshika Sutras, attributed to the sage Kanada, outline an early form of atomism and classify knowledge into categories.
These contributions from ancient Hindu scriptures and scholars have significantly influenced various fields of science, mathematics, and logic, and their legacy continues to impact modern knowledge and practices.
@@christianstreetconversatio3115 Also here is literal breakdown of your statement with all the 'Logical Fallacies' in it, hopefully this will help you understand that what you believe is not exactly 'Logic', also this is not my 'Belief' its generated by ChatGPT:
"Well, my talking companion said that logic is irrelevant to his beliefs and this came up when I challenged him about Jesus, in whom he said he believed, but he didn't believe Jesus's own words about himself. That sounds like cognitive dissonance to me."
- Appeal to Authority Fallacy: The speaker challenges their companion's beliefs by implying that because Jesus said certain things about himself, their companion should logically believe those things too. This relies on the assumption that Jesus's words are an ultimate authority, which may not be a shared premise for everyone.
- Straw Man Fallacy: This can be considered a straw man because the speaker simplifies and misrepresents the companion’s belief system (belief in Jesus but not in his words) to make it easier to attack.
"Ultimately, it's fine to have a warm and fuzzy philosophy, but if a religion cannot make a claim that is worth examining critically then it's just a fanciful story - and a not very good one."
- False Dilemma Fallacy: This statement presents a false dilemma by suggesting that if a religion cannot make a claim worth examining critically, it is merely a fanciful story. There could be a spectrum of value and truth in religious beliefs beyond these two extremes.
- Hasty Generalization: The speaker generalizes about religions being fanciful stories based on the inability to critically examine certain claims, without considering the complexity and diversity of religious experiences and teachings.
On that basis I'd rather follow Marvel characters than Hindu gods.
False Equivalence: This compares fictional Marvel characters to Hindu gods, suggesting they are equally fanciful without acknowledging the cultural, historical, and philosophical significance of Hindu deities to millions of believers.
Red Herring: This distracts from the main argument about the validity of religious claims by introducing an irrelevant comparison to Marvel characters, diverting the conversation away from the core issue.
@@bhushan1987 Bruh, you've just "appealed to authority" by deferring to ChatGPT :)
I've never accused anyone (not even my talking companion) of logical fallacies, but I have just agreed with his own explicit assessment of his beliefs i.e. that he didn't use logic (meaning 'critical assessment') as part of his beliefs.
BTW, logical fallacies are useless in a conversational context - when we have a general chat with someone we are usually not constructing syllogisms. You can apply ChatGPT to most conversations in the same way and almost all would have some 'logical fallacies' in them.
A more important question is - when are you going to read the Bible so we can have a fruitful discussion about it? That would be a much better use of time than running my comments through ChatGPT.
@@bhushan1987 Hmm, perhaps you misunderstood my point then. I'm not deriding Indian philosophy as a whole, but just the religious elements of it that are making claims about god(s), creation, afterlife, karma, etc. I would wish you would seriously look at the Bible and see the difference. You are correct about some of the claims you made about it, but not others (for example, Bible translations were not generally used to fit any narratives of the hour). I would love to connect with you and continue the discussion in person (over zoom), if you are up for it. Just let me know. You know my style of conversation from my videos and I that I try to respect the person even if I disagree with them.
There is only one God Allah
Wrong again
@@subhomazumder7559 Allah is Almighty. Quran is his last book for mankind. All praise belongs to Allah
@SalmanSiddiquey if he's last doesn't mean he is right
@@subhomazumder7559 Quran is Allah's Last book. Muhammad (peace be upon him) is Allahs last messenger
@@SalmanSiddiquey that doesn't mean ther will be more books to come