The stranglers are a perfect example of how prog and punk meld, as you said. Their first album ends with a multi part mini epic., during the height of punk!😮
Gone to Earth is great and I love it but it sounds like a lot of other albums that Sylvian was on. Secrets of the Beehive on the other hand, sounds like nothing else he has done before. It has its own unique vibe and there is zero fluff on it. Every second is meaningful including the long pauses. Secrets is even more special, but it's definitely not prog, so it does not belong in this list.
Your Zappa choice is spot on. When I hear the hit from that album I cannot get the Ess-Eating grin off my face. It's been that way ever since I first heard it when it came out. Zappa's sense of humor is incredible.
Great list Andy, Japan are definitely Prog, let people shake their heads, but it’s true, Sylvian’s “Gone To Earth” is a great album and Voivod’s “Nothingface” is too, glad you mentioned Cardiacs too, yes, Prog and a most unique and great band, Ollie Halsall was a bonkers guitar player for sure, Andy Partridge is a big Ollie fan and he also played on almost all of Kevin Ayers albums too, plus he was left handed and I relate to that has I am a lefty too, Kate Bush’s “The Dreaming” is my favorite by her, it’s a bonkers album, but a masterpiece too, Kate IS the queen of Prog, the lyrics on “Indiscipline” are actually a letter from Adrian Belew‘s then wife responding to a painting that was sent to her. I would argue that there are 3 bands from this era that are not considered Prog, but to me are Prog, those three bands are Wire, Magazine and Ultravox.
Another great prog perspective relating to an era I know very little about progwise. Thanks Andy. When you get a minute could you do something on Hatfield and the North? Their stuff is pure magic.
My top prog albums of the 80s: 1. 4visions by Eskaton 2. First live by Fushitsusha 3. Gunesh by Gunesh 4. Girl who was death by Devil Doll 5. Les morts by Shub Niggurath 6. Un peu de by Aksak Maboul 7. Uzed by Univers Zero 8. Familiesprickor by Zamla Mammaz Manna
So glad you mentioned Voivod. Nothingface is great and so is Dimension Hatross (though I prefer NFace). Their version of Astronomy Domine is a treasure.
When I saw Opeth, Mikael Akerfeldt declared on stage that Voivod is the best band in the world. I've been a fan since 1988. I saw them on the Outer Limits and Negatron tours.
What a great list, Andy. Huge artists with huge selections. David Sylvian is probably the one I'm going to go and listen to now. Every selection is dynamite! Great bands emerged during the dark 80s. Of course, I love everything about Cardiacs and the stories you are revealing make me feel like another Cardiacs episode is needed. Extreme English aesthetics. I agree Residents deserve an album on the list. Glad you raised Patto. Do, check out Money Bag from their 1970 debut album. We're talking epics here. It can go on and on and on....definitely for an hour.
Was great to hear you mention Ollie Halsell in this episode! And i still hope that one day in the not too distant future i will be hearing your musings and analysis of one of the greatest and most lunatic Individuals of the contemporary Jazz and beyond scene, the Busker, Soprano Sax Virtuoso, crooner and zen entertainer Lol Coxhill.
I always learn some new musical stuff to check from your videos! I'm a huge Yes-Oldfield-ELP-Genesis and more recently Neal Morse fan. And now I discovered IQ by You. Thanks. I love their re-recorded album "Seven Stories into 98" and "Ever". Similar video with the 90s? Do you know Amarok by Oldfield?
Couldn't agree more about Cardiacs, and the RES solo. I'm really glad you gave them some time. Also, I'm a massive Rush head from years back so even though Moving Pictures is a go to, almost predictable choice, I can't disagree!
R.E.S. is most certainly a nod to The Residents and the main melody of R.E.S. is taken from 'Act of Being Polite' on the brilliant 'Commercial Album''. It is lovely to hear your evangelical enthusiasm for Cardiacs, which tends to afflict fans of the band.
Thanks Andy for conferring (and rightly so) outsider status on Canadian prog - take a look at Harmonium's 1976 L'Heptade for a unique take on prog. I still listen to it regularly - very melodic and very proggy I think.
Great video as always. Really I love your channel and your wise and sincere appreciations of equally sincere musical projects. I'd add to this very fine "list", Cheap At Half Price by Fred Frith released on the Residents label, Ralph records. A seamless blend of pop and avant guarde ideas cheaply yet very ingeniously organized with a 4-track tape recorder. I rewatched the "documentary" Step Across The Border yesterday about Fred and his friends. It is surely one of the most beautiful movies about Art I have ever seen but I digress. Haha
I'm so grateful to you, Andy! Another solid video about Prog music. I could not agree more about what you said in the last bit about the relationship between Punk and Prog and how stupid people don't like Prog music. It definitely comes down to taste, but I think the ultimate truth is that those who gravitate towards Prog and Jazz and anything experimental are generally smarter and more sophisticated than folks who listen to Pop, Country, simpler music. I personally don't know any non-musicians who listen to Prog the way I do, and I'm not even a Prog guy in the way that you are, so I think that's saying something. It's more likely you enjoy Prog if you're a musician as opposed to any average music consumer. Thanks for another good one, Andy! I hope you made it to your appointment on time!! 😛
A couple of my favourite musicians Cynic/Death/Gordian Knot’s Sean Reinert and Sean Malone (Cynic/Gordian) were massive David Sylvian fans. The results can be found on the Gordian Knot albums. This list is a new world try of for me apart from Voivod..time to get the cheque book out!
Thanks for reminding one about "The Wake" -- haven't listened to it in a good while. Listening now and loving it. Also, great call on "The Dreaming". Hands down my favourite Kate. EVERY track is exceptional.
It's your list. Here's mine: 1. King Crimson-Discipline 2. Talking Heads-Remain in Light 3. David Bryne & Brian Eno-My Life in the Bush of Ghosts 4. David Sylvian-Gone to Earth 5. Kate Bush-Hounds of Love 6. Peter Gabriel-IV 7. Joy Division-Closer 8. Kate Bush-The Dreaming 9. Peter Gabriel-So 10. Laurie Anderson-Mister Heartbreak
@@AndyEdwardsDrummerIt's the American again. Keep in mind, Remain In Light was released prior to Decipline. Talking Heads were a great "prog" band. The prior album "Fear of Music" was amazing as well. Also, recently saw Belew with Heads keyboard player Jerry Harrison, celebrating Remain In Light. Awesome, just saying. Also, yes, Kate is the Queen. And always love to hear Bill Nelson's name thrown around. Big Be Bop Deluxe fan. I'm a rare American who actually seen them live. Great video, thanks!
Love all these choices especially Moving Pictures, Gone to Earth, The Dreaming and Discipline but I had a huge grin on my face when you mentioned three of my favourite bands in Talk Talk, XTC and Tears for Fears who I’ve always considered prog or at least influenced by prog. Thank you for the brilliant video.
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer Well it was your list, so do your thing, we all know you know what you're talking about so trust yourself. Very few on TH-cam are truly honest to themselves. Say and do what you really think, that's why I watch you, I thought you did that already? The list could have been a lot longer adding especially, the brilliant XTC, The Cure, Talk Talk, New Order and more David Sylvian. Oh and Frank Zappa of course.
"Is this the life" was my intro to cardiacs around 2010, I had to check them out after that, such a funny video. Who are these guys hamming themselves up and the guitar solo was fantastic! Wiki stated Tim was considered a "Mozart like figure in pop" so I divided in deep. Love those guys so much and I love you love them too!
Oh man....your comment about having a few drops of patchouli oil on the Wrangler jacket had me in stitches! So reminds me of the Handyside arcade on Percy st, Newcastle in the 80's! Great choices! Zappa, Kate Bush, David Sylvian, Cardiacs etc. Might have to add Once around the world by It Bites, a prog pop gem!
brilliant trees,secrets of the beehive,gone to earth are a 3 album killer run,all excellent,though gone to earth is my personal fave,the other 2 arent far behind
I actually saw avantgarde group The Residents perform in Pasadena, California. They remained hidden behind a screen while costumed performers acted out the story of the Mole People. About 1/2 way through, the on-stage narrator (I think it was Penn Gillette) started complaining that The Residents were asked to speed up the show. He went into a 5 minute rant about the evils of commercialism & was rushed off the stage. Soon after, the lights went out. When they came up, the performance continued with the narrator off to the side of the stage, bound, gagged, & tied to a chair!
Ozric Tentacles-Jurassic Shift. XTC-Oranges And Lemons. Apocrypha-The Eyes Of Time. Voivod-Angel Rat. Talk Talk-The Colour Of Spring. Anderson Bruford Wakeman and Howe-ABWH. Jethro Tull-Crest Of The Knave. Present-Triskaidekaphobia. Pallas-The Sentinel. Rush-Permanent Waves.
I have always wondered if there was some powerful producer who came up to Yes, and said "Ok, all good; but there's just too many words". So Jon Anderson went, and got rid of all the verbs. Nothing ever really happens in Yes songs LOL. This is there, and that is over there, and big, purple wolfhound, Caesar's palace. Great music though. I love when you do your Prog/Punk lecture. Very smart.
Thanks Andy. I'll check out the Cardiacs and Zappa picks. That version of Crimson was the greatest guitar group ever. The Absent Lovers live album is stupendous. Gabriel's Melt or Security would be in my top 10.
Cardiacs and Zappa are forever carved in marble as top 5 artists for me. Absent Lovers is indeed a monster recording....I've owned that since it came out on CD way back when.
I believe Allan Holdsworth has said that he was influenced by Ollie Halsall and possibly the white SG he is pictured with on Velvet Darkness was given to him by Halsall. Holdsworth and Halsall were both in Tempest for a few weeks and the live cd has Holdsworth and Halsall jamming with just Paul Williams on congas. I also believe Patto's Loud Green Song could be the best rock song ever.
Andy, where would you put Peter Gabriel in all of this. I mean his 3rd and 4th solo albums are purely Prog to me, like your meaning. And love your video's
great post Andy, thank you for talking about so many wonderful musicians that more than deserve it. Damn it, did you really need to bring the speck back? Sorry to talk more about 90125, when so many mentioned here deserve more blabla than Yes.. but so many album deeper cuts are so blatantly prog I don't know how older Yes fans (like me) can deny 90125 prog consideration. Side 2 right off the bat, we have an instrumental, absolutely soaring, cosmically, and totally off the wall. Where's my effing back beat dammit?!?. Not Prog?!?! Leave it is completely odd, with amazing Squire lines, and vocal arrangement to die for.. juxtapositions and counterpoints that groove.I won't go on. Old Yes fans can truly be the most close minded conservative brains going, which is totally anti Yes. So happy you continue to champion Cardiacs, more than deserved
twelfth night's "fact & fiction" proved that prog was not dead but their "live & let live" proved that prog had life in it. for my two cents, two great prog albums from any decade.
As soon as a I saw Voivod in there, I knew Cardiacs would be in the conversation. 'A Little Man and a House and the Whole World Window' was the moment when I realised punk and prog could coexist in the same point in time and space. Discussing Cardiacs without gushing is impossible.
Andy, I recently saw The Cure on tour here in Florida, and it got me thinking about their more epic, symphonic pieces from albums like Wish, Bloodflowers, and Disintegration. Would love to hear your thoughts, despite the “Goth” label, are The Cure Prog? Or at least elements of their music? Perhaps there is something of the English Aesthetic in their work? Their musical roots are certainly not American. Maybe an idea for a video. In any event, thank you for all that you do. Be well.
I love Cure music and Robert Smith is one of the most talented musicians with a unique voice. Basicaly he is a multi-tool for the band. Singer, song writer, main guitarist. But as an album the very best from this band is Pornography. Steeped in darkness, this atmospheric, mystifying, nightmarish and hellish psychedelic post-punk is a true masterpiece.
In my opinion Script by Marillion is maybe a progressive album but nothing after that is. Totally agree on Cardiacs and RES. I would have liked to see them higher on the list. And yes, there are many elements of prog in Abba and Kate Bush. I’m with you on 90125 too. My fav there is Our Song. The short prog period of Talk Talk’s makes them as unique as Zappa. The Stranglers are really proggy too. And Allan Holdsworth is my number 1 in the 80s.
Folks, check out Ollie Halsall’s solo on “Give it all Away” from the second Patto album “Hold Your Fire”: pretty advanced, especially for ‘71. Also on “Blue” by Kevin Ayers (1976 “Yes, We have no Mananas”album) . He was one of the greatest. Anyway, back to the 80’s.
Wonderful video. Thanks so much for sharing. I get crazy (annoyed) by labels with music, it's so hard to define (for me) what's prog versus what's fusion, versus whatever. What's the point. I appreciate the inclusion of people like Holdsworth and Kate Bush. Most of the greatest musicians are really beyond category. People who argue about what is or is not prog, it's like talking about what it or isn't jazz. It's all subjective. Oh, man. Drowning Witch. A lot of your picks are beyond category, which is one of the best things you can say about music really.
Time and Tide bt Split Enz. Concise, intricate, edgy pop eschewing the usual prog excesses. Australian album of the year, beating Cold Chisel's fantastic Circus Animals LP, as well as brilliant efforts by Midnight Oil and Icehouse. Released 1982.
Great list. I was never a huge fan of Japan, but I love David Sylvian and "Gone to Earth" is his greatest work. "Brilliant Trees" another great Sylvian album. The Residents would be a good call for a list like this. Their album "Eskimo" was released in the 80's. Yes' 90125 is a good choice, but another album from them worthy of mention is "Drama", released in 1980 with Trevor Horn as a singer/bassist. Ian Carr's "Bella Donna" is a wonderful fusion album and Holdsworth's playing is remarkable. With Frank Zappa, I might also include "Jazz from Hell", which, IIRC, won an album instrumental grammy. KC's Discipline is # 1 for me and is one of the great albums released during the 1980's of any genre. Rush and "Moving Pictures" comes in 3rd for me.
I was glad to see "The Dreaming" on your list. My intro to Kate Bush was "The Kick Inside". I did not like it. I found her voice irritating. But in 1982, I bought "The Dreaming". I can't remember why I bought it, but it was probably because Eberhard Weber played on Houdini. I was blown away by the album. I've been a fan ever since.
Thank you for this talk. Japan felt more like art rock, as was mentioned below. It might be an interesting exercise to define the boundaries between prog and art rock. As a kick-off, a lot of prog was about the playing, and where your instrument could take you; whereas art rock seems to put the "canvas" of sound first, and instruments second. Put crudely, Japan played atmospheres a whole lot more than Genesis did. Or, Tony Banks is all about the keyboard, but David Sylvian...could be playing anything, it doesn't matter to him as much.
Awesome... You just won me over with including Voivod. Pity Cynic - Focus didn't come out until 93. But I was swallowing my own vomit still after the false start mention of Marillion (AOR yacht prog, ewwww :p ). Cardiacs! You're killing it. You're not there yet but I trust that Discipline is going to get a high spot for the Kings. Possibly my favorite KC record after Larks Tongues...
Kate Bush. OMG. Discovering her changed my life. Like the first time I heard Joni Mitchell, King Crimson, John Coltrane, Rush, Elton John, Led Zeppelin, etc. etc. etc.
I suppose debates about the boundaries of "prog" proper could go one indefinitely. If we want to include the experimental, outsider, conceptual works without necessarily possessing virtuosity or mythical/mystical subject matter, there are definitely bands from the minimalist movement side of new wave that became a new version of "prog" where bands came up with new ways of structuring and composing music that both fascinated and pertrubed the mainstream of the 1980s. My top pick from that sort of category would be The Art of Noise. A lot like King Crimson in that they were more of a charter / manifesto than a band. Their persona was more opaque than Tool would be in the 90s, though maybe less than The Residents. (Who's Afraid) was the first cassette I went out and bought as a kid in the 80s. All I knew was that album didn't sound like anything I ever heard before or anything on any of the radio stations, and I listened incessantly. But were they actually musicians? Yes if you count studio wizadry, creative sampling and electronic manipulations as new kinds of instruments to convey meaning. ; )
As far as the UK is concerned, I would have thought that "Spirit of Radio" was, by far their most well-known song. In fact, I would bet that this track is the only Rush track that the vast majority of UK citizens would be able to name.
@@Frip36 Rush are well-known amongst UK prog aficionados but not the population as a whole. The only Rush single release to enter the UK top twenty was "Spirit of Radio" and more people are consequently aware of this Rush song than any other.
@@richardsutton01In their prime years Rush was just as, or more popular in the UK than the US. From '77 to '87 all Rush albums charted better in the UK than US. Often by a wide margin. 1980, 5 sold out shows Hammersmith Odeon. 1983, 4 sold out shows Wembley Arena. However in the early years UK were not aware of Rush. And post 90's the UK lost interest.
@@Frip36 "The only Rush single release to enter the UK top twenty was "Spirit of Radio" and more people are consequently aware of this Rush song than any other." 😉
I’m enjoying checking out the wake!!!!! Mine would be: Yes-drama Rush-moving pictures Rush-exit stage left King Crimson-absent lovers King-Crimson discipline King crimson - beat King Crimson-three of a perfect pair Primus-Frizzle Fry Primus-sailing the seas of cheese Phish-Junta (it is soooo prog and musically impressive) Zappa -all the studio albums until he stopped using real musicians
Andy, I would say Eskimo, The Mole Trilogy and Not Available are The Resident's most prog. The Commercial Album will fit your punk/prog via a sort of inverse square law type thing, you will love Fred Frith's solo on Moisture. Fingerprince is quite poppy but I'm sure you will find some jazz lineage in Six Things to a Cycle; my CD version has Babyfingers EP on it and Walter Westinghouse is a prog masterpiece
i would include jon hassell fourth world vol 1,a collab with brian eno in there,all shifting ambient soundscapes,with muted trumpet over the top,definitely different and progressive,david byrne/eno my life in the bush of ghosts to me is also a very important album
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer oh man,forgot talk talks spirit of eden,absoloute classic,different from the early stuff,definitely in my top ten progressive albums of the 80s,started off as a kind of 80s pop band,all you do is talk talk,dissapeared for a bit,completely reinvented themselves,bit like japan/david sylvian,and came back with a monster album,one after quite good too,but cant remember title off my head
@AndyEdwardsDrummer would you say that neo-prog of the '80s was more accessible than prog from earlier decades? e.g. 90125 vs Tales From Topographic Oceans
ur a legend. love how u argue with ur self yes 9o125 awesome moving pictures. kate bush. talk talk. tears for fears love it. legends. pavlos dog julia. was my go too. cheers. please please do acvdc u view on them. its a must. oioioi
Have you done a video about Roxy Music? They are often labeled a glam/glitter band but what glam band features an Oboe and had Eno as a member. I discovered them in the early 70’s and saw them live a few times. I also was a punk (here in Los Angeles) 77-83ish and Roxy was a huge influence on the punks I new. And I agree with you on punks and Prog. Most of the punks I new we’re from 2 camps , probers or glitter rock. I also think Roxy “Fused” pop/rock and avant garde , a historic view of popular music through the lens of English art school musicians. Anyway, I’d love to hear your thoughts on Roxy Music ; are they Prog? Can you dance to real Prog? Can Prog be sensual/sexy? I believe this needs a pondering and I think you might be the best one to do this. I trust your taste, honesty and attitude. I tried to send you this through your patreon page, but couldn’t get it to work. So I hope you see this. And yes, we need a video about Halsalle /Holdworth connection. I first heard Patto and then heard Holdsworth with Tempest. What we really need is the Halsalle Fripp album that never got released. Thank you for your vid’s, I’m a patreon and a big fan. Roxy, dude……
Early Roxy, prog/avant. After that, something else. I think we need to separate New Wave / New Romantic from Prog. We don't want things getting sloppy 'round here. Right. Carry on.
Funny you should mention Blur as i am going to see them tomorrow. Not my favourite band but I really admire them as they always pushed themselves. Pretty sure Alban is a fan of Richard Sinclair as there are moments on Parklife and The Great Escape where he is pure Caravan / Camel.
Music from the 80's that had a connection to what was considered prog from the 70's was going to have to morph or evolve into something else to be relevant or actually progress. Good to see Holdsworth being recognized and Halsall too. Unfortunately Halsall didn't put out much in the 80's even though he died in 92. FZ (fer sure, fer sure) is deserving. If you're going to embrace the heavily processed aesthetic of mullets and shoulder pads that permeated the 80's, you could mention the Police or the Cars who arguably played the pop game better than most of the Yes or Genesis guys. The Cloud About Mercury Record and the two Group 87 albums had some of that flat almost sterile heavily processed 80's slickness that maybe hasn't aged very well. Bowie Scary Monsters, the 1st Tin Machine the 1st Belew record and the Living Colour albums also gave us something new to chew on during what seemed to be a drought. There was also a fair amount of progressive music being made along a different path during the 80's. Here are few that Andy (who knows why) seldom or never mentions: Samla Mannas Manna Univers Zero Curlew Dr.Nerve Thinking Plague Holger Czukay Ragnarok The Muffins Aksak Maboul Present Daniel Schell and Karo Debile Menthol Miriodor Captain Beefheart Etron Fou Leloublan Art Zoyd
I’ve always thought of Japan and David Sylvian and Kate Bush as “art rock”, prog rock’s close cousin. I really wouldn’t lump them together, but you should do a top ten “art rock” albums from the ‘70s and another for the ‘80s. As for Yes, I think Drama is a better album from the ‘80s.
Talk Talk's 'Spirit of Eden' should also be classified as prog according to your criteria.
Cardiacs are LIFE.
As a Cardiacs fan I’d say that A Little Man etc is shaded by On Land And In The Sea, which has Everso Closely Guarded Line as its closing track.
I'd agree, the sheer explosion of energy and invention of that album is incredible. But it is close.
The stranglers are a perfect example of how prog and punk meld, as you said. Their first album ends with a multi part mini epic., during the height of punk!😮
I love 'Gone to Earth' - an amazing album, thanks for including it in your list Andy.
Ditto
Gone to Earth is great and I love it but it sounds like a lot of other albums that Sylvian was on. Secrets of the Beehive on the other hand, sounds like nothing else he has done before. It has its own unique vibe and there is zero fluff on it. Every second is meaningful including the long pauses. Secrets is even more special, but it's definitely not prog, so it does not belong in this list.
@@janluszczek1223 Thanks - will check these out
Your Zappa choice is spot on. When I hear the hit from that album I cannot get the Ess-Eating grin off my face. It's been that way ever since I first heard it when it came out. Zappa's sense of humor is incredible.
Bitchin' shoes.
Great list Andy, Japan are definitely Prog, let people shake their heads, but it’s true, Sylvian’s “Gone To Earth” is a great album and Voivod’s “Nothingface” is too, glad you mentioned Cardiacs too, yes, Prog and a most unique and great band, Ollie Halsall was a bonkers guitar player for sure, Andy Partridge is a big Ollie fan and he also played on almost all of Kevin Ayers albums too, plus he was left handed and I relate to that has I am a lefty too, Kate Bush’s “The Dreaming” is my favorite by her, it’s a bonkers album, but a masterpiece too, Kate IS the queen of Prog, the lyrics on “Indiscipline” are actually a letter from Adrian Belew‘s then wife responding to a painting that was sent to her. I would argue that there are 3 bands from this era that are not considered Prog, but to me are Prog, those three bands are Wire, Magazine and Ultravox.
Wire, Magazine & Ultravox (Foxx era), yup, I second that.
Yes, I did jump a bit for joy when you mentioned Ollie 'allsall.
Was not expecting to hear The Residents mentioned here.
Thanks for the intro to a few groups I've not heard yet. 👍
Another great prog perspective relating to an era I know very little about progwise. Thanks Andy. When you get a minute could you do something on Hatfield and the North? Their stuff is pure magic.
I believe he said he's not that into canterbury
My top prog albums of the 80s:
1. 4visions by Eskaton
2. First live by Fushitsusha
3. Gunesh by Gunesh
4. Girl who was death by Devil Doll
5. Les morts by Shub Niggurath
6. Un peu de by Aksak Maboul
7. Uzed by Univers Zero
8. Familiesprickor by Zamla Mammaz Manna
You are a real progger
@@narosgmbh5916Thanks!
Looks straight out of the gnosis website.
So glad you mentioned Voivod. Nothingface is great and so is Dimension Hatross (though I prefer NFace). Their version of Astronomy Domine is a treasure.
When I saw Opeth, Mikael Akerfeldt declared on stage that Voivod is the best band in the world.
I've been a fan since 1988. I saw them on the Outer Limits and Negatron tours.
What a great list, Andy. Huge artists with huge selections. David Sylvian is probably the one I'm going to go and listen to now. Every selection is dynamite! Great bands emerged during the dark 80s. Of course, I love everything about Cardiacs and the stories you are revealing make me feel like another Cardiacs episode is needed. Extreme English aesthetics. I agree Residents deserve an album on the list. Glad you raised Patto. Do, check out Money Bag from their 1970 debut album. We're talking epics here. It can go on and on and on....definitely for an hour.
2:22 love Andy’s video program, as a 70 year old Prog fan, not only does he talk the talk, he walks the walk.
Was great to hear you mention Ollie Halsell in this episode! And i still hope that one day in the not too distant future i will be hearing your musings and analysis of one of the greatest and most lunatic Individuals of the contemporary Jazz and beyond scene, the Busker, Soprano Sax Virtuoso, crooner and zen entertainer Lol Coxhill.
Ollie Halsall! So glad you mention him!
It's great to see your passion for the subjects you talk about great !
Glad you enjoy it!
Yes, please continue on!
I always learn some new musical stuff to check from your videos! I'm a huge Yes-Oldfield-ELP-Genesis and more recently Neal Morse fan. And now I discovered IQ by You. Thanks. I love their re-recorded album "Seven Stories into 98" and "Ever". Similar video with the 90s? Do you know Amarok by Oldfield?
Couldn't agree more about Cardiacs, and the RES solo. I'm really glad you gave them some time. Also, I'm a massive Rush head from years back so even though Moving Pictures is a go to, almost predictable choice, I can't disagree!
R.E.S. is most certainly a nod to The Residents and the main melody of R.E.S. is taken from 'Act of Being Polite' on the brilliant 'Commercial Album''. It is lovely to hear your evangelical enthusiasm for Cardiacs, which tends to afflict fans of the band.
The ABC also probably taking some encouragement for its sinister management style from The Cryptic Corporation.
Thanks Andy for conferring (and rightly so) outsider status on Canadian prog - take a look at Harmonium's 1976 L'Heptade for a unique take on prog. I still listen to it regularly - very melodic and very proggy I think.
FM - White Noise
Great video as always. Really I love your channel and your wise and sincere appreciations of equally sincere musical projects. I'd add to this very fine "list", Cheap At Half Price by Fred Frith released on the Residents label, Ralph records. A seamless blend of pop and avant guarde ideas cheaply yet very ingeniously organized with a 4-track tape recorder. I rewatched the "documentary" Step Across The Border yesterday about Fred and his friends. It is surely one of the most beautiful movies about Art I have ever seen but I digress. Haha
I'm so grateful to you, Andy! Another solid video about Prog music. I could not agree more about what you said in the last bit about the relationship between Punk and Prog and how stupid people don't like Prog music. It definitely comes down to taste, but I think the ultimate truth is that those who gravitate towards Prog and Jazz and anything experimental are generally smarter and more sophisticated than folks who listen to Pop, Country, simpler music. I personally don't know any non-musicians who listen to Prog the way I do, and I'm not even a Prog guy in the way that you are, so I think that's saying something. It's more likely you enjoy Prog if you're a musician as opposed to any average music consumer. Thanks for another good one, Andy! I hope you made it to your appointment on time!! 😛
Great list! Most of it I know and absolutely love, the rest of it I have yet to explore, got some deep dives to do!!
A couple of my favourite musicians Cynic/Death/Gordian Knot’s Sean Reinert and Sean Malone (Cynic/Gordian) were massive David Sylvian fans. The results can be found on the Gordian Knot albums. This list is a new world try of for me apart from Voivod..time to get the cheque book out!
Ollie Halsall, yes yes yes!
Thanks for reminding one about "The Wake" -- haven't listened to it in a good while. Listening now and loving it.
Also, great call on "The Dreaming". Hands down my favourite Kate. EVERY track is exceptional.
1- Frank Zappa : Jazz From Hell (86)
2- Univers Zero : Ceux du Dehors (81)
3- Present : Triskaidekaphobie (80)
4- However : Sudden Dusk (81)
5- Master Cylinder : Elsewhere (81)
6- Yes : Drama (80)
7- Kenso : II (82))
8- Asturias : Brilliant Streams (89)
9- Bellaphon : Firefly (87)
10- Rush : Signals (82)
HM : Saga "Silent Knight", Eloy : Colours, Solaris "Martian Chronicles"
Present! Yes!
Andy any chance when you do a list you could list it below so I / we can check out ones we don't know?? cheers
It's your list.
Here's mine:
1. King Crimson-Discipline
2. Talking Heads-Remain in Light
3. David Bryne & Brian Eno-My Life in the Bush of Ghosts
4. David Sylvian-Gone to Earth
5. Kate Bush-Hounds of Love
6. Peter Gabriel-IV
7. Joy Division-Closer
8. Kate Bush-The Dreaming
9. Peter Gabriel-So
10. Laurie Anderson-Mister Heartbreak
I would love to get away with a list like that
@@AndyEdwardsDrummerIt's the American again. Keep in mind, Remain In Light was released prior to Decipline. Talking Heads were a great "prog" band. The prior album "Fear of Music" was amazing as well. Also, recently saw Belew with Heads keyboard player Jerry Harrison, celebrating Remain In Light. Awesome, just saying. Also, yes, Kate is the Queen. And always love to hear Bill Nelson's name thrown around. Big Be Bop Deluxe fan. I'm a rare American who actually seen them live. Great video, thanks!
Love all these choices especially Moving Pictures, Gone to Earth, The Dreaming and Discipline but I had a huge grin on my face when you mentioned three of my favourite bands in Talk Talk, XTC and Tears for Fears who I’ve always considered prog or at least influenced by prog. Thank you for the brilliant video.
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer Well it was your list, so do your thing, we all know you know what you're talking about so trust yourself. Very few on TH-cam are truly honest to themselves. Say and do what you really think, that's why I watch you, I thought you did that already?
The list could have been a lot longer adding especially, the brilliant XTC, The Cure, Talk Talk, New Order and more David Sylvian. Oh and Frank Zappa of course.
Great list! I was thinking 'Remain In Light' and 'Closer' as well.
90125 is a phenomenal album! Love it just as much as Close to the edge. 👍
"Is this the life" was my intro to cardiacs around 2010, I had to check them out after that, such a funny video. Who are these guys hamming themselves up and the guitar solo was fantastic! Wiki stated Tim was considered a "Mozart like figure in pop" so I divided in deep. Love those guys so much and I love you love them too!
Is there a full on Cardiacs video? If not, should there be?
Love our channel.
JT
Oh man....your comment about having a few drops of patchouli oil on the Wrangler jacket had me in stitches! So reminds me of the Handyside arcade on Percy st, Newcastle in the 80's!
Great choices! Zappa, Kate Bush, David Sylvian, Cardiacs etc. Might have to add Once around the world by It Bites, a prog pop gem!
Jon Anderson's release "Animation" also works.
JT
Love your outpouring on Kate Bush, and totally right. Awesomely talented young lady ❤❤
She's 87
Highly recommend checking out Envy Of None, Alex Lifeson's post Rush music endeavor.
brilliant trees,secrets of the beehive,gone to earth are a 3 album killer run,all excellent,though gone to earth is my personal fave,the other 2 arent far behind
I learn so much listening to Andy!
Everything you know is wrong.
Talk Talk- Colour of Spring
Can we knock it off with the Talk-Talk already. Sheesh. No. Just no.
I actually saw avantgarde group The Residents perform in Pasadena, California. They remained hidden behind a screen while costumed performers acted out the story of the Mole People. About 1/2 way through, the on-stage narrator (I think it was Penn Gillette) started complaining that The Residents were asked to speed up the show. He went into a 5 minute rant about the evils of commercialism & was rushed off the stage. Soon after, the lights went out. When they came up, the performance continued with the narrator off to the side of the stage, bound, gagged, & tied to a chair!
I lived there.
Ozric Tentacles-Jurassic Shift.
XTC-Oranges And Lemons.
Apocrypha-The Eyes Of Time.
Voivod-Angel Rat.
Talk Talk-The Colour Of Spring.
Anderson Bruford Wakeman and Howe-ABWH.
Jethro Tull-Crest Of The Knave.
Present-Triskaidekaphobia.
Pallas-The Sentinel.
Rush-Permanent Waves.
I have always wondered if there was some powerful producer who came up to Yes, and said "Ok, all good; but there's just too many words". So Jon Anderson went, and got rid of all the verbs. Nothing ever really happens in Yes songs LOL. This is there, and that is over there, and big, purple wolfhound, Caesar's palace. Great music though.
I love when you do your Prog/Punk lecture. Very smart.
Adrian Belew - Desire Caught By the Tail
David Torn - Cloud About Mercury
Henry Kaiser - Remarrying for Money
Gone to Earth is one of the greatest double albums of all time!
Thanks Andy. I'll check out the Cardiacs and Zappa picks. That version of Crimson was the greatest guitar group ever. The Absent Lovers live album is stupendous. Gabriel's Melt or Security would be in my top 10.
Cardiacs and Zappa are forever carved in marble as top 5 artists for me. Absent Lovers is indeed a monster recording....I've owned that since it came out on CD way back when.
I believe Allan Holdsworth has said that he was influenced by Ollie Halsall and possibly the white SG he is pictured with on Velvet Darkness was given to him by Halsall. Holdsworth and Halsall were both in Tempest for a few weeks and the live cd has Holdsworth and Halsall jamming with just Paul Williams on congas. I also believe Patto's Loud Green Song could be the best rock song ever.
"I also believe Patto's Loud Green Song could be the best rock song ever." Better than Achille's Last Stand?
Andy, where would you put Peter Gabriel in all of this. I mean his 3rd and 4th solo albums are purely Prog to me, like your meaning. And love your video's
Gwwwaaaar, Cardiacs…I’d go and see them any chance I got…and Sylvian, Fripp & Nelson? I may have done a small wee in my trousers
great post Andy, thank you for talking about so many wonderful musicians that more than deserve it. Damn it, did you really need to bring the speck back? Sorry to talk more about 90125, when so many mentioned here deserve more blabla than Yes.. but so many album deeper cuts are so blatantly prog I don't know how older Yes fans (like me) can deny 90125 prog consideration. Side 2 right off the bat, we have an instrumental, absolutely soaring, cosmically, and totally off the wall. Where's my effing back beat dammit?!?. Not Prog?!?! Leave it is completely odd, with amazing Squire lines, and vocal arrangement to die for.. juxtapositions and counterpoints that groove.I won't go on. Old Yes fans can truly be the most close minded conservative brains going, which is totally anti Yes. So happy you continue to champion Cardiacs, more than deserved
I saw Steve Howe solo back in the late 1990's and he was still griping about 90125 era Yes.
He's become grumpy and opinonated
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer It's not like he wasn't doing pretty much the same thing with ASIA at the time.
7 out of 10 in my collection, all on original black plastic.
Pretty happy with that..
Stuart "The Blackest of Plastic" Taylor. Only fool would dare compete with him.
Once around the World by It Bites and Drama YES
twelfth night's "fact & fiction" proved that prog was not dead but their "live & let live" proved that prog had life in it. for my two cents, two great prog albums from any decade.
As soon as a I saw Voivod in there, I knew Cardiacs would be in the conversation. 'A Little Man and a House and the Whole World Window' was the moment when I realised punk and prog could coexist in the same point in time and space. Discussing Cardiacs without gushing is impossible.
Dan Mongrain is a big Cardiacs fan.
IQ Marillion It Bites Crimson Tull - broadsword, Rush , Yes 90125 etc.
Proper Prog!
Love that you love Kate. Favorite album: Sensual World, ethereal throughout
What middle aged Englishman doesn't love Kate Bush? Impossible.
Andy, I recently saw The Cure on tour here in Florida, and it got me thinking about their more epic, symphonic pieces from albums like Wish, Bloodflowers, and Disintegration. Would love to hear your thoughts, despite the “Goth” label, are The Cure Prog? Or at least elements of their music? Perhaps there is something of the English Aesthetic in their work? Their musical roots are certainly not American. Maybe an idea for a video. In any event, thank you for all that you do. Be well.
I love Cure music and Robert Smith is one of the most talented musicians with a unique voice. Basicaly he is a multi-tool for the band. Singer, song writer, main guitarist. But as an album the very best from this band is Pornography. Steeped in darkness, this atmospheric, mystifying, nightmarish and hellish psychedelic post-punk is a true masterpiece.
Voivod! Great choice
In my opinion Script by Marillion is maybe a progressive album but nothing after that is. Totally agree on Cardiacs and RES. I would have liked to see them higher on the list.
And yes, there are many elements of prog in Abba and Kate Bush.
I’m with you on 90125 too. My fav there is Our Song.
The short prog period of Talk Talk’s makes them as unique as Zappa.
The Stranglers are really proggy too.
And Allan Holdsworth is my number 1 in the 80s.
Folks, check out Ollie Halsall’s solo on “Give it all Away” from the second Patto album “Hold Your Fire”: pretty advanced, especially for ‘71. Also on “Blue” by Kevin Ayers (1976 “Yes, We have no Mananas”album) . He was one of the greatest. Anyway, back to the 80’s.
Also with Kevin Ayers 'I Didn't Feel Lonely Till I Thought Of You' from the 'Confessions of Doctor Dreams' album, I love what he does on that track
Wonderful video. Thanks so much for sharing. I get crazy (annoyed) by labels with music, it's so hard to define (for me) what's prog versus what's fusion, versus whatever. What's the point. I appreciate the inclusion of people like Holdsworth and Kate Bush. Most of the greatest musicians are really beyond category. People who argue about what is or is not prog, it's like talking about what it or isn't jazz. It's all subjective. Oh, man. Drowning Witch. A lot of your picks are beyond category, which is one of the best things you can say about music really.
Time and Tide bt Split Enz. Concise, intricate, edgy pop eschewing the usual prog excesses. Australian album of the year, beating Cold Chisel's fantastic Circus Animals LP, as well as brilliant efforts by Midnight Oil and Icehouse. Released 1982.
Big Ollie Halsall fan here. 👍
Please keep your vídeos long and witty, that’s why I watch them instead of some other bland, hollow content.
I'm a little tired of this Big Ollie Halsall business.
Great list. I was never a huge fan of Japan, but I love David Sylvian and "Gone to Earth" is his greatest work. "Brilliant Trees" another great Sylvian album. The Residents would be a good call for a list like this. Their album "Eskimo" was released in the 80's. Yes' 90125 is a good choice, but another album from them worthy of mention is "Drama", released in 1980 with Trevor Horn as a singer/bassist. Ian Carr's "Bella Donna" is a wonderful fusion album and Holdsworth's playing is remarkable. With Frank Zappa, I might also include "Jazz from Hell", which, IIRC, won an album instrumental grammy. KC's Discipline is # 1 for me and is one of the great albums released during the 1980's of any genre. Rush and "Moving Pictures" comes in 3rd for me.
Eskimo was released in 1979. Great comment though
I was glad to see "The Dreaming" on your list.
My intro to Kate Bush was "The Kick Inside". I did not like it. I found her voice irritating. But in 1982, I bought "The Dreaming". I can't remember why I bought it, but it was probably because Eberhard Weber played on Houdini. I was blown away by the album. I've been a fan ever since.
Kate Bush? Give me a break. Why don't you go suspend yourself in Gaffa.
Thank you for choosing The Dreaming, rather than Hounds of Love.
Great top 10. Cardiacs ❤️
How about a video about drummers who changed the drumming world, like how Jimi, Eddie and Yngwie changed the guitaring world?
This Yes fan didn't demand ethereal, I wanted creativity.
Yes delivered for this and the next release.
"I'm Running" does it for me.
The Residents worked with Renaldo & The Loaf who are in the English eccentrics mould..
“Girls like it” - 80s Yes. Ha ! Sometimes things become very simple to communicate, if you don’t overthink them.
"and when they do come out of the sky they don't stand there do they" . I just LOLed.😅
Thank you for this talk. Japan felt more like art rock, as was mentioned below. It might be an interesting exercise to define the boundaries between prog and art rock. As a kick-off, a lot of prog was about the playing, and where your instrument could take you; whereas art rock seems to put the "canvas" of sound first, and instruments second. Put crudely, Japan played atmospheres a whole lot more than Genesis did. Or, Tony Banks is all about the keyboard, but David Sylvian...could be playing anything, it doesn't matter to him as much.
Awesome... You just won me over with including Voivod. Pity Cynic - Focus didn't come out until 93. But I was swallowing my own vomit still after the false start mention of Marillion (AOR yacht prog, ewwww :p ). Cardiacs! You're killing it. You're not there yet but I trust that Discipline is going to get a high spot for the Kings. Possibly my favorite KC record after Larks Tongues...
Kate Bush. OMG. Discovering her changed my life. Like the first time I heard Joni Mitchell, King Crimson, John Coltrane, Rush, Elton John, Led Zeppelin, etc. etc. etc.
The Dreaming has that english esthetic vibe I relate most directly to Genesis
That falling asleep in a field of tall grass with the feint scent of barley in the air as white dandelion poofs twirl in the breeze, vibe?
Just a bit into taking the veil by David Sylvian. Fucking LOVE it ... Fripp with fretless bass
Barren Dream by Mr. Sirius, The Sentinel by Pallas and Clutching at Straws. IMO.
I suppose debates about the boundaries of "prog" proper could go one indefinitely. If we want to include the experimental, outsider, conceptual works without necessarily possessing virtuosity or mythical/mystical subject matter, there are definitely bands from the minimalist movement side of new wave that became a new version of "prog" where bands came up with new ways of structuring and composing music that both fascinated and pertrubed the mainstream of the 1980s.
My top pick from that sort of category would be The Art of Noise. A lot like King Crimson in that they were more of a charter / manifesto than a band. Their persona was more opaque than Tool would be in the 90s, though maybe less than The Residents. (Who's Afraid) was the first cassette I went out and bought as a kid in the 80s. All I knew was that album didn't sound like anything I ever heard before or anything on any of the radio stations, and I listened incessantly.
But were they actually musicians? Yes if you count studio wizadry, creative sampling and electronic manipulations as new kinds of instruments to convey meaning. ; )
As far as the UK is concerned, I would have thought that "Spirit of Radio" was, by far their most well-known song. In fact, I would bet that this track is the only Rush track that the vast majority of UK citizens would be able to name.
Is Rush not big in the UK? How many nights could they sell out the Royal Albert or The Odeon?
@@Frip36 Rush are well-known amongst UK prog aficionados but not the population as a whole. The only Rush single release to enter the UK top twenty was "Spirit of Radio" and more people are consequently aware of this Rush song than any other.
@@richardsutton01In their prime years Rush was just as, or more popular in the UK than the US. From '77 to '87 all Rush albums charted better in the UK than US. Often by a wide margin. 1980, 5 sold out shows Hammersmith Odeon. 1983, 4 sold out shows Wembley Arena. However in the early years UK were not aware of Rush. And post 90's the UK lost interest.
@@Frip36 "The only Rush single release to enter the UK top twenty was "Spirit of Radio" and more people are consequently aware of this Rush song than any other." 😉
@@richardsutton01 Yes. You keep repeating this little factoid for some reason.
I’m enjoying checking out the wake!!!!!
Mine would be:
Yes-drama
Rush-moving pictures
Rush-exit stage left
King Crimson-absent lovers
King-Crimson discipline
King crimson - beat
King Crimson-three of a perfect pair
Primus-Frizzle Fry
Primus-sailing the seas of cheese
Phish-Junta (it is soooo prog and musically impressive)
Zappa -all the studio albums until he stopped using real musicians
In my own self made rules I can only have one artist once. This stops my lists getting filled with Zappa and McLaughlin
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer😂A wise decision sir. I can see how these lists would get totally unmanageable otherwise
I'd also argue that A Flock Of Seagulls is a prog band. Their self titled debut is a concept about alien invasion.
Andy, I would say Eskimo, The Mole Trilogy and Not Available are The Resident's most prog.
The Commercial Album will fit your punk/prog via a sort of inverse square law type thing, you will love Fred Frith's solo on Moisture.
Fingerprince is quite poppy but I'm sure you will find some jazz lineage in Six Things to a Cycle; my CD version has Babyfingers EP on it and Walter Westinghouse is a prog masterpiece
trevor rabin,israeli guitarist,allready had a career of his own before yes,released a couple of hard rock albums before yes,that did quite well
I will I think
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer is trev,dani rabins dad lol
I thought he was South African?
That’s what I heard as well.
i would include jon hassell fourth world vol 1,a collab with brian eno in there,all shifting ambient soundscapes,with muted trumpet over the top,definitely different and progressive,david byrne/eno my life in the bush of ghosts to me is also a very important album
He may well get on my 90s prog album list...
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer oh man,forgot talk talks spirit of eden,absoloute classic,different from the early stuff,definitely in my top ten progressive albums of the 80s,started off as a kind of 80s pop band,all you do is talk talk,dissapeared for a bit,completely reinvented themselves,bit like japan/david sylvian,and came back with a monster album,one after quite good too,but cant remember title off my head
@@AndyEdwardsDrummer strange era,the prog big boys were going more mainstrem,and some of the electro pop boys were getting progressive.
@AndyEdwardsDrummer would you say that neo-prog of the '80s was more accessible than prog from earlier decades? e.g. 90125 vs Tales From Topographic Oceans
I don't think 90125 was Neo Prog, but yes, they are more accesible but still use prog techniques to create their sound
Hilarious stuff mate, a great discourse and certainly a most progressive rant!
ur a legend. love how u argue with ur self yes 9o125 awesome moving pictures. kate bush. talk talk. tears for fears love it. legends. pavlos dog julia. was my go too. cheers. please please do acvdc u view on them. its a must.
oioioi
Have you done a video about Roxy Music? They are often labeled a glam/glitter band but what glam band features an Oboe and had Eno as a member. I discovered them in the early 70’s and saw them live a few times. I also was a punk (here in Los Angeles) 77-83ish and Roxy was a huge influence on the punks I new. And I agree with you on punks and Prog. Most of the punks I new we’re from 2 camps , probers or glitter rock.
I also think Roxy “Fused” pop/rock and avant garde , a historic view of popular music through the lens of English art school musicians. Anyway, I’d love to hear your thoughts on Roxy Music ; are they Prog? Can you dance to real Prog? Can Prog be sensual/sexy? I believe this needs a pondering and I think you might be the best one to do this. I trust your taste, honesty and attitude.
I tried to send you this through your patreon page, but couldn’t get it to work. So I hope you see this.
And yes, we need a video about Halsalle /Holdworth connection. I first heard Patto and then heard Holdsworth with Tempest. What we really need is the Halsalle Fripp album that never got released.
Thank you for your vid’s, I’m a patreon and a big fan. Roxy, dude……
Early Roxy, prog/avant. After that, something else. I think we need to separate New Wave / New Romantic from Prog. We don't want things getting sloppy 'round here. Right. Carry on.
I think perhaps it's not Poole's solo on RES you are referring to.. isn't it Poole's solo on Fiery gun hand you mean off of Sing to God?
No it's Tim Smith's incredible solo on RES I'm talking abouy
All my life until last month I thought it was "Marlins come out of the sky and they stand there." I liked it this way better.
The thing Belew is describing in indiscipline is his wife’s musings on a painting she’d been working on for sometime
Funny you should mention Blur as i am going to see them tomorrow. Not my favourite band but I really admire them as they always pushed themselves. Pretty sure Alban is a fan of Richard Sinclair as there are moments on Parklife and The Great Escape where he is pure Caravan / Camel.
Music from the 80's that had a connection to what was considered prog from the 70's was going to have to morph or evolve into something else to be relevant or actually progress. Good to see Holdsworth being recognized and Halsall too. Unfortunately Halsall didn't put out much in the 80's even though he died in 92. FZ (fer sure, fer sure) is deserving. If you're going to embrace the heavily processed aesthetic of mullets and shoulder pads that permeated the 80's, you could mention the Police or the Cars who arguably played the pop game better than most of the Yes or Genesis guys. The Cloud About Mercury Record and the two Group 87 albums had some of that flat almost sterile heavily processed 80's slickness that maybe hasn't aged very well. Bowie Scary Monsters, the 1st Tin Machine the 1st Belew record and the Living Colour albums also gave us something new to chew on during what seemed to be a drought. There was also a fair amount of progressive music being made along a different path during the 80's. Here are few that Andy (who knows why) seldom or never mentions:
Samla Mannas Manna
Univers Zero
Curlew
Dr.Nerve
Thinking Plague
Holger Czukay
Ragnarok
The Muffins
Aksak Maboul
Present
Daniel Schell and Karo
Debile Menthol
Miriodor
Captain Beefheart
Etron Fou Leloublan
Art Zoyd
Yes 😀😀😀
hahaha, great show, andy. you have a strange way of making mostly uninteresting things seem fascinating. how? how does he do that?! ~ 😂
Do you plan to get into the 90s? Trip hop, IDM, trance and techno etc
I’ve always thought of Japan and David Sylvian and Kate Bush as “art rock”, prog rock’s close cousin. I really wouldn’t lump them together, but you should do a top ten “art rock” albums from the ‘70s and another for the ‘80s.
As for Yes, I think Drama is a better album from the ‘80s.