finally a non theoretical guide from someone who has actually played the class. And that shows in many of the small hidden gems inside this video... thanks a lot for this. Recently retired my Boneshaper at level 6, which felt so early that I was pondering to play another one directly... but to advance the campaign I chose Geminate. The class is a lot of fun if you understand the AI well.
I just started my first FrostHaven/Gloomhaven playthrough and was really excited for the Boneshaper. This helped me understand the character so much better. Love the video!
Hey, thanks a for giving new perspective to this character! One thing that I love doing with the Loot card is pairing it with the Command of the Wretched and move the “minion” to the most profitable hex before looting. Possibly even creating another Loot with the (pierce) attack! Thanks to the new Frosthaven rule which allows you to decide where the summons move when Granting.
Note that Flow of the black river's bottom, in a three player party is extremely useful. I actually use the bottom more than the top. Moving your summon out of the way is important in larger parties. I also slept on Flesh Shield's bottom. It's incredibly useful. I took solid bones and it's insane. But not because of the pierce or HP. It's the move 3 that's insane.
What a great video, thank you! I've watched quite a few of your Frosthaven videos (have I commented on one yet??) I'm watching lots of Frosthaven stuff getting ready for when me and our kids get it - probably December-ish. We are finishing up JOTL now and, per Cephalofair's recommendation, we are going to do FH next instead of waiting on GH 2.0. All that being said, I'm letting my kids pick their classes first when we get FH. RIght now they are leaning toward: Banner Spear, Drifter and Blink Blade. Our daughter who's thinking Blink Blade may want to do Deathwalker. Personally I'm thinking Geminate (because I love playing hard stuff everyone hates) or Deathwalker, or Boneshaper. The more I read and watch the more I'm leaning to Boneshaper in PART because I'd be able to help our Banner Spear set up attacks. Deathwalker just sounds cool though... the theme and all... and yes, I've seen your video on them not being that great. I think it should be called, "Shadow Walker" btw. Anyway, thanks again!! This is probably the most helpful video on Boneshaper I've seen simply because of the first part alone. The whole video was great but the first was really helpful!
@innocentgreen1338 thanks for the kind comment! Very cool that you play with your kids- that sounds lovely. Geminate is a whacky class so good luck if you give that a shot!
@@phoenicksgaming geminate has 3 level one cards that specifically consume fire and only two cards that create fire, one of which is a loss, and the other which requires consuming another element.
I'm playing Boneshaper in a bigger party (3-4 players) and I found the class has an INCREDIBLE synergy with the item Tranquil Shoes, which grants you a free 1 heal every time you go at initiative 60 or higher - and doesn't require a rest to re-use! It just procs for free every turn, and since almost every card you will ever play is 60+, you basically have permanent regenerate. It makes taking damage from summoning almost trivial and even lets you tank a hit every now and then. I've found I can be far more liberal with my card plays since I don't have to worry about summon damage or spending turns healing myself if I just sit at the back of the party. Sometimes you need to go faster and forgo the heal, but with good timing, you can do that on turns where you're at full health, then go quickly and summon something on your non-initiative card and get damaged again to be ready for next turn's healing. Also, for your start-of-scenario summon, have one skeleton with an enhancer bonus for +1 movement that you always default to. Move 2 often gets you clogged up with the rest of the party, but move 3 lets you sail past and get some good hits in. Get that enhancement as fast as you possibly can.
This is a perfect video for me. My wife and I just played scenario 0 and I have the Boneshaper. She has the Deathwalker so I guess we will see how it goes.
Sounds like fun! Good luck and let me know how it goes. I think you'll have to do a fair bit of tanking with your skeletons to run interference for the Deathwalker, I'll be curious to hear more
I put my Banshee out with that bottom perk and was very happy with it. 12 cards can easily afford to lose a round on the first lap -may even bring you into sync with your allies for the long rest
You *gain* tempo by putting the Banshee out as an extra action. It's endurance you're greedy for! If you think of it as having a whole round ahead of everyone else and saving a card you'll see that you really haven't lost anything! (no need to move yet or heal since no one else even twitched!) @@phoenicksgaming [I admit the 2 perks is a real cost]
My group played our 5th mission, the first after the heart of ice, and were looking to fail to card exhaustion, except that the enemy target took about 23 damage due to bless cards I had shuffled around with Approach Oblivion. I’m keen to try and use it at as close to max value as possible and see if the curse is that hard a detriment.
For the fire generation on the top of exploding corpse. The ranged side of the geminate uses fire. Regenerate and xp on selfless offering, Strengthen self and xp for the bottom of into my embrace and +1 damage and xp on firefly swarm. It's probably still not worth taking the card for that but adding regeneration on that heal 3 from selfless offering might be nice.
I think you're underestimating the bottom of Bone Dagger - it is indeed very tricky to get the proc on the free summon, even with Command the Wretched or Dark Tidings top it's pretty random, but the curse is still solid, especially when you need to tank with your skellies. Boneshaper doesn't have that many good bottom options in the early levels, so I sometimes play it just for the curse, which will add up when played repeatedly. Right now, my Boneshaker is just lvl 3, about to reach lvl 4, and while in 2p party with the Deathwalker, my skellies do a lot of tanking. Bottom of Putrid Cloud and curses (from Bone Dagger, Dark Tidings, perk cards and sometimes even Damned Horde) have insane synergy, and with some protective items (Warden's Robes + Protective Scepter + Horn of Command), the skellies tend to stick around. And it's really satisfying when the enemies draw curse, do nothing and take true damage back from Putrid Cloud. Even better when they die from it and you get to actually proc the summon :-)
@@phoenicksgaming Ah, ok. When you said you would have probably picked Unearthed Horror in restrospect, I just thought that you might be underestimating the curse and how much the Skellies need it in 2 player setup. Sorry, I probably just misinterpreted your words. Anyway, one one more note to the Bone Dagger bottom - so far, I had the biggest success with it when played after bottom of the Angry Spirits. Go first (26 initiative is not great, but still decent) when your skeleton is about to die, do some damage with it, and if you get the enemy to 2HP, it dies when killing your skelly. Voila, you can put him right back. I used this twice so far in scenarios when we needed the skeleton wall really early and it worked both times. The downside is that you can't have the wraith until the rest, but still, I think it worked well to our advantage. But I agree that both of those lvl 2 cards are far from gameplay defining, just kind of nice and situationally good.
I agree with everything said about corpse explosion, the actions suck. That said I brought it anyway at level 1 because I just needed one more early initiative I found. I quickly swapped it with bone dagger but you really can't underestimate move 2 initiative 21 early on. I even brought it back later for a small bit as what I was doing for the party at the time needed a certain number of high initiatives that I had to suck it up and bring it back. Te initiative was super important because I was playing with bannerspear and sometimes just needed to go before him and only having an 18 a 26 and a 30 was rough. Thankfully with 12 cards you can afford 1 that's mostly just a move 2 in order to improve your flexibility initiative wise.
Please do a bannerspear guide. I'm currently playing the BS combo and I can't really figure out if I should do a tank build or a support banner build, nothing seems to work :(
In 3-4 player parties, the Loot 1 on Eternal Torment is actually very useful since there will be more loot dropping. I use it often in my 4 player group, with much success!
In our 4 player party, the loot was insane. I was looting most of all characters, every single scenario. With 3+ skeletons out, almost every time I played this card I looted 2-4 bags. Especially when transitioning to the next room, your enfilade of the undead is almost bound to waddle across loot icons.
@@phoenicksgaming I guess it's the 4 player vs. 2 player thing you already mentioned in the video. "greedy Firstborn" is a term now in our playing group lol... I also named my skellies.
BTW you played more support centered from what I am hearing, flow of the black river is the BEST lvl 1 card actually! It only seemed a little worse because you most likely tried to make a more supportive build. Flow top is useful for the early lvls when you truly need the hp, but then around lvl 8 is when the bottom becomes ESPECIALLY potent (Bone zone!)
I used it for the top healing quite a bit! And the healing is very important but often a heal 3-4 top that only targets yourself is not that great in xhaven? Boneshaper breaks the mold tho! And that bottom at level 8 is clever!
@@phoenicksgaming Part of why this card is so good is that it's an early initiative that is great for the top early lvls when health is for sure needed, but that bottom when you start to transition to higher lvls becomes especially potent. This is because early on lets be honest move two on a SHAMBLING skeleton won't have that much output in the end unless you really need to reposition it or maybe get prepared to long rest at door. But when the bone zone becomes online, it allows you to move with the hoard and drive skeletons into it for a level 1 effect. Additionally it can be paired with wrath to allow you to stay mobile and have amazing strike effects for the hoard itself. It just does so much as you progress as the game goes on, and my personal recommendation for the first enhancement (honestly two enhancements because 135 gold for move 3 control 3 is actually very consistant)
Can you kill (placing active skeleton card into your discard pile) your skeletons at any time? Like even during an enemy turn? Or is it only during your turn? Because what if, say, an enemy moves 3, attacks 2 on your skeleton. Can you decide right before he attacks your skeleton to immediately put him in your discard pile, effectively wasting the enemy’s turn?
I'd have to double check the rules, but I don't think you could do it mid action like this. Honestly, I don't understand why you'd need to collapse the skeleton? If you let the attack go through, the attack is already "wasted" and there's a chance the skeleton gets to live?
You mention that they changed summon focus from Gloomhaven, letting them focus on the summoner if there are no monsters to focus. But you didn’t mention the other (maybe bigger?) change! When you grant move and/or attack to a summon, the person that grants the move/attack controls the summon! I missed that through my entire play through of Boneshaper! It’s huge!
I think you are underselling the top of wail from beyond. Attacking 3 targets, muddling them and adding 2 or 3 curses to the enemy deck should be a huge deal. Having your horde of skeletons attack is fine, but there is nothing wrong with adding some support fire. and muddling and cursing combine nicely, increasing the chance of the enemy not killing your skeletons.
Oh the payoff is incredible, I just found it such a pain to setup (have sufficient minions still alive, have them all in position). If you can pull it off - hats off to ya!
My experience with the class is very different to yours. Playing Boneshaper in a 4 player game means the extra moves and attacks for your skeles are much more useful, without them its going to be hard to have your skeles consistently attacking even once each every round (its also easier to either keep them alive or just resummon them since your allies can either tank or heal you). I have also regularly had the most loot tokens in a 4 player game due to that loot card you seemed to not care about (skeles get stuck much easier in small corridoors which makes looting large numbers of tokens with them much easier, also you can use the top move and attack abilities to move them to a good position to loot, or use a certain item on their turn). Additionally playing with an ally who cares about positioning requirements, like the Banner Spear (playing solo I have Boneshaper and Banner Spear), also makes the extra movement you can give your skeles incredibly powerful. Not only are my skeles regularly attacking 1-2 times a round but they are also enabling the Banner Spear to do their higher value attacks without needing the Banner Spear needing to summon their own things (though the Banner of Hope gives the Boneshaper godly levels of summoning capabilities [it gives allies a Heal 1 action at the start of each of its allies, within range 3, turns] if your Banner Spear can kept it close).
Very nice! I’ve heard of the legendary banner spear combo and that absolutely makes sense. Glad to hear the class is a threat in 4p as well, and I can see how the commanding them component becomes significantly more important when getting around your pesky allies. And you’re right, I think the loot action is generally stronger in 4p overall because more bodies are hitting the floor.
A+ phenomenal breakdown, would love to see more. Glad to have another FH content creator jump into the mix!
Thank you! I definitely plan to start adding more of these as we play more of the game
finally a non theoretical guide from someone who has actually played the class. And that shows in many of the small hidden gems inside this video... thanks a lot for this. Recently retired my Boneshaper at level 6, which felt so early that I was pondering to play another one directly... but to advance the campaign I chose Geminate. The class is a lot of fun if you understand the AI well.
Understanding the AI is definitely key for this class - both for making your skeletons efficient and for not having the monsters mow over them!
Fantastic advice. Thank you! I have a Blink Blade buddy hoping for a similar breakdown.
Thank you! It'll be a bit before I comment on blink blade, I'm yet to see them in action much
I just started my first FrostHaven/Gloomhaven playthrough and was really excited for the Boneshaper. This helped me understand the character so much better. Love the video!
That's wonderful to hear! I hope you enjoy the game as much as I have
This is a very good guide. Good explanations and gets to the point. Would love to see this for other classes.
Thank you kindly! I do plan to do others, largely thanks to all the positive feedback
Great guide
, thanks!
You're very welcome, glad you enjoyed!
Hey, thanks a for giving new perspective to this character! One thing that I love doing with the Loot card is pairing it with the Command of the Wretched and move the “minion” to the most profitable hex before looting. Possibly even creating another Loot with the (pierce) attack! Thanks to the new Frosthaven rule which allows you to decide where the summons move when Granting.
That's a nice way to get some gold laden skellies!
Note that Flow of the black river's bottom, in a three player party is extremely useful. I actually use the bottom more than the top. Moving your summon out of the way is important in larger parties. I also slept on Flesh Shield's bottom. It's incredibly useful. I took solid bones and it's insane. But not because of the pierce or HP. It's the move 3 that's insane.
What a great video, thank you!
I've watched quite a few of your Frosthaven videos (have I commented on one yet??) I'm watching lots of Frosthaven stuff getting ready for when me and our kids get it - probably December-ish. We are finishing up JOTL now and, per Cephalofair's recommendation, we are going to do FH next instead of waiting on GH 2.0.
All that being said, I'm letting my kids pick their classes first when we get FH. RIght now they are leaning toward: Banner Spear, Drifter and Blink Blade. Our daughter who's thinking Blink Blade may want to do Deathwalker. Personally I'm thinking Geminate (because I love playing hard stuff everyone hates) or Deathwalker, or Boneshaper. The more I read and watch the more I'm leaning to Boneshaper in PART because I'd be able to help our Banner Spear set up attacks. Deathwalker just sounds cool though... the theme and all... and yes, I've seen your video on them not being that great. I think it should be called, "Shadow Walker" btw.
Anyway, thanks again!! This is probably the most helpful video on Boneshaper I've seen simply because of the first part alone. The whole video was great but the first was really helpful!
@innocentgreen1338 thanks for the kind comment! Very cool that you play with your kids- that sounds lovely. Geminate is a whacky class so good luck if you give that a shot!
The Top of dark tidings is a perfect example of a win more card, a card that if you are playing then you are already winning.
I'd agree with that assessment
Of the 6 starting characters, Geminate uses fire and Bannerspear uses air. Otherwise great review of the Boneshaper!
Ah, good point! Not very regularly tho, I believe?
Bannerspear uses air in only few cards, but Geminate's ranged side cards are designed to get some neat benefits from using fire/light. :)
geminate also uses frost and light.
Geminate use fire/light or ice/light
@@phoenicksgaming geminate has 3 level one cards that specifically consume fire and only two cards that create fire, one of which is a loss, and the other which requires consuming another element.
I'm playing Boneshaper in a bigger party (3-4 players) and I found the class has an INCREDIBLE synergy with the item Tranquil Shoes, which grants you a free 1 heal every time you go at initiative 60 or higher - and doesn't require a rest to re-use! It just procs for free every turn, and since almost every card you will ever play is 60+, you basically have permanent regenerate. It makes taking damage from summoning almost trivial and even lets you tank a hit every now and then.
I've found I can be far more liberal with my card plays since I don't have to worry about summon damage or spending turns healing myself if I just sit at the back of the party. Sometimes you need to go faster and forgo the heal, but with good timing, you can do that on turns where you're at full health, then go quickly and summon something on your non-initiative card and get damaged again to be ready for next turn's healing.
Also, for your start-of-scenario summon, have one skeleton with an enhancer bonus for +1 movement that you always default to. Move 2 often gets you clogged up with the rest of the party, but move 3 lets you sail past and get some good hits in. Get that enhancement as fast as you possibly can.
Ooooo I REALLY like that choice as an item for this class. Very nice idea
I did the same, it's such a great item for this class!
That hour flew by!
Great review!
Thanks for watching!
This is a perfect video for me. My wife and I just played scenario 0 and I have the Boneshaper. She has the Deathwalker so I guess we will see how it goes.
Sounds like fun! Good luck and let me know how it goes. I think you'll have to do a fair bit of tanking with your skeletons to run interference for the Deathwalker, I'll be curious to hear more
I put my Banshee out with that bottom perk and was very happy with it. 12 cards can easily afford to lose a round on the first lap -may even bring you into sync with your allies for the long rest
Too true! I'm just very greedy on tempo. Banshee is a blast
You *gain* tempo by putting the Banshee out as an extra action. It's endurance you're greedy for!
If you think of it as having a whole round ahead of everyone else and saving a card you'll see that you really haven't lost anything! (no need to move yet or heal since no one else even twitched!) @@phoenicksgaming
[I admit the 2 perks is a real cost]
My group played our 5th mission, the first after the heart of ice, and were looking to fail to card exhaustion, except that the enemy target took about 23 damage due to bless cards I had shuffled around with Approach Oblivion. I’m keen to try and use it at as close to max value as possible and see if the curse is that hard a detriment.
That sounds like a very exciting conclusion!
For the fire generation on the top of exploding corpse. The ranged side of the geminate uses fire. Regenerate and xp on selfless offering, Strengthen self and xp for the bottom of into my embrace and +1 damage and xp on firefly swarm. It's probably still not worth taking the card for that but adding regeneration on that heal 3 from selfless offering might be nice.
Agreed, nice catch
I think you're underestimating the bottom of Bone Dagger - it is indeed very tricky to get the proc on the free summon, even with Command the Wretched or Dark Tidings top it's pretty random, but the curse is still solid, especially when you need to tank with your skellies. Boneshaper doesn't have that many good bottom options in the early levels, so I sometimes play it just for the curse, which will add up when played repeatedly. Right now, my Boneshaker is just lvl 3, about to reach lvl 4, and while in 2p party with the Deathwalker, my skellies do a lot of tanking. Bottom of Putrid Cloud and curses (from Bone Dagger, Dark Tidings, perk cards and sometimes even Damned Horde) have insane synergy, and with some protective items (Warden's Robes + Protective Scepter + Horn of Command), the skellies tend to stick around. And it's really satisfying when the enemies draw curse, do nothing and take true damage back from Putrid Cloud. Even better when they die from it and you get to actually proc the summon :-)
Oh for sure - I've played it for thr same purpose a dozen times. I think that it's more of a "nice to have" rather than" feels strong" to me
@@phoenicksgaming Ah, ok. When you said you would have probably picked Unearthed Horror in restrospect, I just thought that you might be underestimating the curse and how much the Skellies need it in 2 player setup. Sorry, I probably just misinterpreted your words. Anyway, one one more note to the Bone Dagger bottom - so far, I had the biggest success with it when played after bottom of the Angry Spirits. Go first (26 initiative is not great, but still decent) when your skeleton is about to die, do some damage with it, and if you get the enemy to 2HP, it dies when killing your skelly. Voila, you can put him right back. I used this twice so far in scenarios when we needed the skeleton wall really early and it worked both times. The downside is that you can't have the wraith until the rest, but still, I think it worked well to our advantage.
But I agree that both of those lvl 2 cards are far from gameplay defining, just kind of nice and situationally good.
@@eduardrindt3376 clever play sequence!
I agree with everything said about corpse explosion, the actions suck. That said I brought it anyway at level 1 because I just needed one more early initiative I found. I quickly swapped it with bone dagger but you really can't underestimate move 2 initiative 21 early on. I even brought it back later for a small bit as what I was doing for the party at the time needed a certain number of high initiatives that I had to suck it up and bring it back. Te initiative was super important because I was playing with bannerspear and sometimes just needed to go before him and only having an 18 a 26 and a 30 was rough. Thankfully with 12 cards you can afford 1 that's mostly just a move 2 in order to improve your flexibility initiative wise.
Very good point - getting the skeletons early in the initiative order can do the trick entirely on its own!
Please do a bannerspear guide. I'm currently playing the BS combo and I can't really figure out if I should do a tank build or a support banner build, nothing seems to work :(
It's on the list! I don't know how often you play but I hope I'll get to it in time. Well see...
One thing about Endless Numbers that you didn't mention is that it's excellent for doing both of the Boneshaper's masteries.
Makes total sense - I hadn't thought of that!
In 3-4 player parties, the Loot 1 on Eternal Torment is actually very useful since there will be more loot dropping. I use it often in my 4 player group, with much success!
A few others mentioned that and it .akes sense to me! In general the loot action isn't terribly exciting at 2p
In our 4 player party, the loot was insane. I was looting most of all characters, every single scenario. With 3+ skeletons out, almost every time I played this card I looted 2-4 bags. Especially when transitioning to the next room, your enfilade of the undead is almost bound to waddle across loot icons.
Hahaha, I bet, that's incredible! As I mentioned, I often just did the looting myself, but I love that you found a more efficient way to do so
@@phoenicksgaming I guess it's the 4 player vs. 2 player thing you already mentioned in the video. "greedy Firstborn" is a term now in our playing group lol... I also named my skellies.
BTW you played more support centered from what I am hearing, flow of the black river is the BEST lvl 1 card actually! It only seemed a little worse because you most likely tried to make a more supportive build. Flow top is useful for the early lvls when you truly need the hp, but then around lvl 8 is when the bottom becomes ESPECIALLY potent (Bone zone!)
I used it for the top healing quite a bit! And the healing is very important but often a heal 3-4 top that only targets yourself is not that great in xhaven? Boneshaper breaks the mold tho! And that bottom at level 8 is clever!
@@phoenicksgaming Part of why this card is so good is that it's an early initiative that is great for the top early lvls when health is for sure needed, but that bottom when you start to transition to higher lvls becomes especially potent. This is because early on lets be honest move two on a SHAMBLING skeleton won't have that much output in the end unless you really need to reposition it or maybe get prepared to long rest at door.
But when the bone zone becomes online, it allows you to move with the hoard and drive skeletons into it for a level 1 effect. Additionally it can be paired with wrath to allow you to stay mobile and have amazing strike effects for the hoard itself. It just does so much as you progress as the game goes on, and my personal recommendation for the first enhancement (honestly two enhancements because 135 gold for move 3 control 3 is actually very consistant)
Can you kill (placing active skeleton card into your discard pile) your skeletons at any time? Like even during an enemy turn? Or is it only during your turn? Because what if, say, an enemy moves 3, attacks 2 on your skeleton. Can you decide right before he attacks your skeleton to immediately put him in your discard pile, effectively wasting the enemy’s turn?
Specifically talking about 21:48
I'd have to double check the rules, but I don't think you could do it mid action like this. Honestly, I don't understand why you'd need to collapse the skeleton? If you let the attack go through, the attack is already "wasted" and there's a chance the skeleton gets to live?
@@phoenicksgamingthat’s a good point. I’ll check the rules out
You mention that they changed summon focus from Gloomhaven, letting them focus on the summoner if there are no monsters to focus.
But you didn’t mention the other (maybe bigger?) change! When you grant move and/or attack to a summon, the person that grants the move/attack controls the summon! I missed that through my entire play through of Boneshaper! It’s huge!
True! Grant is a very very nice change
I think you are underselling the top of wail from beyond. Attacking 3 targets, muddling them and adding 2 or 3 curses to the enemy deck should be a huge deal. Having your horde of skeletons attack is fine, but there is nothing wrong with adding some support fire. and muddling and cursing combine nicely, increasing the chance of the enemy not killing your skeletons.
Oh the payoff is incredible, I just found it such a pain to setup (have sufficient minions still alive, have them all in position). If you can pull it off - hats off to ya!
My experience with the class is very different to yours. Playing Boneshaper in a 4 player game means the extra moves and attacks for your skeles are much more useful, without them its going to be hard to have your skeles consistently attacking even once each every round (its also easier to either keep them alive or just resummon them since your allies can either tank or heal you). I have also regularly had the most loot tokens in a 4 player game due to that loot card you seemed to not care about (skeles get stuck much easier in small corridoors which makes looting large numbers of tokens with them much easier, also you can use the top move and attack abilities to move them to a good position to loot, or use a certain item on their turn).
Additionally playing with an ally who cares about positioning requirements, like the Banner Spear (playing solo I have Boneshaper and Banner Spear), also makes the extra movement you can give your skeles incredibly powerful. Not only are my skeles regularly attacking 1-2 times a round but they are also enabling the Banner Spear to do their higher value attacks without needing the Banner Spear needing to summon their own things (though the Banner of Hope gives the Boneshaper godly levels of summoning capabilities [it gives allies a Heal 1 action at the start of each of its allies, within range 3, turns] if your Banner Spear can kept it close).
Very nice! I’ve heard of the legendary banner spear combo and that absolutely makes sense. Glad to hear the class is a threat in 4p as well, and I can see how the commanding them component becomes significantly more important when getting around your pesky allies. And you’re right, I think the loot action is generally stronger in 4p overall because more bodies are hitting the floor.
Nice. Bannerlord next?
I'm doing a few spoiler classes next but could swing back to bannerspear soon!
Haha, imaging you go first at 21 for a four player game.
Bone dagger generally sucks, I think - in four player 29 is still about last, and you're always too late to get the curse off even