Thanks for all the suggestions of either making a pressurized tank to put the SEM in. I think this would have been doable, but a bit tricky, as you have to deal with routing wires in and out of it, and give yourself enough room to load samples, and figure out ways of dealing with heat and things. I also really went into this wanting to show off this cool product that's supposed to be portable and work anywhere. Putting it inside of a big pressure chamber felt a bit antithetical to that! I also appreciated the suggestions of pressurizing the entire room, but that sounded like a real challenger - most rooms are very, very leaky from a pressure perspective, and my shop is no exception 😁 Things like vents in the ceiling, cracks around the doors, not to mention the sink drain. It all would have been a huge challenge to seal!
Couldn't you just dip the circuit boards in silastic, or any rubber based glue to help prevent arcing? Silastic is usually used to waterproof circuit boards but it also helps to insulate them, maybe that would make it work and keep it portable (i dont know exactly what is arcing and if it could be dipped but you could try)
Simplest fix would be to get a large fish tank, and place the whole machine in it. Then have a flat glass lid, and feed through wires and such though a hole cut in the glass, and sealed with a bung of either rubber, which you slit in half and carve out channels to carry the wires, or just use some silicone sealer or simply putty. Then simply take the whole tank and get some SF6 gas, and fill the tank with it, displacing the air inside. The SF6 will act as a quench agent, but you do not have to pressurise the tank, merely displace most of the air inside. Slip top off and you can change the samples easily, no pressure difference, and the gas is dense, so slow to diffuse out, just keep the lid closed for the most part, and then after sample change simply have a brief puff of SF6 to make up, which even a small cylinder should last a few months, as the lid will keep it in. A simple silicone rubber extrusion on the top to act as a seal will hold the gas in for a good amount of time. As SF6 is very much inert, and the symptoms of it being in the atmosphere is a deep voice, just having in the shop with normal ventilation will not be much of an issue.
Being an electron microscope scientist myself, I have three ideas what might have caused the imaging problems with your cardboard sample: 1. Inhomogenous coating. The deeper fibres were probably not coated well with Ag - so there was still charge building up within the sample. This might have caused the fibres constantly moving apart from against each other due to static electricity. 2. Cardboard is quite moist. And it wasn't dried properly beforehand, I guess. In the vaccum of the chamber, it es being dehydrated which might also cause the fibres to move due to the deformation caused by the dehydrating process. 3. You might just be using too much acceleration voltage. Cardboard is a very light material. You are losing lots of detail when hitting organic matter with too much energy since those fast electrons penetrate quite deeply and return signals from the underlying fibres as well.
iv been and SEM tech for about 10 yrs. The imaging issue doesn't look like a charging problem to me. You would expect the top to look normal and the underlying bits to be problematic not the whole thing. Looks like it could be the vacuum isn't high enough. Would explain the low resolution, poor signal to noise, and arching that you've been having. Try it with something conductive like a coin and let it pump overnight.
@@stuartmicklethwaite5427 when he said the product was failing because of altitude of his lab, I immediately though, of course the vacuum pump must be weak. It makes total sense to be a problem with the vacuum.
@@monad_tcp Maybe but I'm guessing the entire circuit system isn't in the vacuum chamber. The manufacturer certainly would have considered that as it's very obvious. My guess is the arcing is happening in the circuit that's outside the chamber and isn't fixable without a pressure chamber.
I view a lot of natural fibers such as plant, paper, spores, pollen, and organic compounds on our SEM. I find that a Gold-Palladium covering helps increase conductivity and therefore picture resolution with comes to natural fibers. Also it is helpful to put the items in a vacuum oven for an hour to make sure there is no moisture in the sample.
@@tonymorris4335 I won't pretend to know anything about these type of machines but, if electrical arcing is the only problem, couldn't you seal the problematic part of the circuit with epoxy or silicon?
As a material scientist myself, I think the issues are related to sample prep and ill-prepared microscopist. Not trying to criticize just for criticize but your expectations are way higher than what they should be. The fact that this SEM is table top, is a huge achievement in itself.
Just a little tip when working with samples outside a sterile cage: Along with gloves you should wear a mask (preferably a shield) to avoid contaminating the sample with saliva droplets, especially if you are talking above them.
It wasn't that bad, it was frustrating yes, but you got to thinker around with something out the reach of millions of people. Thank you for your content!
Observations: 1) Your semiconductor samples show charging, and would benefit from sputtering. 2) The working distance was not listed on the UI, and is key to thick samples like cardboard (which needed full-coverage sputtering, too ). 3) Samples should be thoroughly dried. 4) Vacuum quality and chamber cleanliness are critical. It sounds like both were compromised early in your experimentation. 5) ThermoFisher has a useful guide to SEM sample preparation that could help with these common problems.
need a 4 psi pressure tank.... that should be easy to make ... did you take the SEM to a low altitude truck stop? "SEM images on the road" seems like a good show title... did high altitude operation cause damage to the machine?
That EDS feature is so goddamn cool! it's a shame that it doesn't perform efficiently, but I mean damn, the result you're getting now is still pretty impressive, which means that at full potential, this machine is game-changing.
SF6 is a wonderful gas. It's heavy and dielectric. Take an aquarium and put the SEM into it, fill up with SF6 and run. Should easily reduce arcing at altitude. As a level indicator you could use a balloon with ordinary air. SF6 is used in modern SEM and TEM as insulator inside the high voltage tank. SF6 is also used in under ground power stations to reduce the size compared to power stations above ground. I ran into this technology when reading up on SEM and TEM a number of years ago when I got a couple of old microscopes. My old SEM and TEM use standard transformer oil though.
Agreed. If it's simply an altitude issue and the manufacturer can determine a reliable limit, they just need to add this to the working specification and it's fine as long as the user can meet the environment requirements. Once the altitude range is increased they can release a new model.
Yeah I want one bad. I bought a mountain in Eastern KY and I been finding tons of coal and fossils and it would be really sweet to look at some of these things imo
I'm very happy that you're posting videos, even if they're not going quite right in some ways! And the message at the end of this video was very powerful and made me think about how seriously I take all my 'great ideas' thanks for doing what you do
How far would you have to travel to reach lower altitude? A car, a motel room, and a couple of days on the road should have given you at least the opportunity to show the difference between your high altitude experience and the normal operation.
It would be totally fine to tell the name of the product! That SEM seems to be freaking awesome and the issue wasn't exactly their fault, even if they couldn't communicate more efficiently beforehand! Anyone with enough knowledge to look for a SEM product wouldn't be scared away by this video at all!
From the colour scheme and desktop miniaturisation of an SEM, I would hazard a guess that the company is SRI Instruments, which makes small gas chromatographs.
I got curious and searched for "world's smallest SEM" a few weeks ago, and I found this thing. Probably why this video was recommended. I live near sea level and I really want one.
I just read an article in the news about how one of these is making its rounds around schools across Ontario, Canada. I think it's awesome that kids these days have access to this level of technology. Not just awesome. Mind blowing is more like it.
I work for a leading mfg of electron beam lithography machines which can also do SEM functions. Arcing is an issue even with million dollar machines. Machines run in a very good vacuum, and many fancy pumps to create ultra low vacuum. Also heat is used to burn off any contaminants. If you put this machine in a bigger vacuum chamber and or stronger vacuum pump you'll likely have more success. Note on big machines takes about a day to get a good vacuum. Also the tip voltage is ramped up slowly as in 5-10v/s to reduce arcing risk
Additionally these machines are in cleanrooms, ppl in bunny suits and everything is cleaned and cleaned again with IPA due to contaminants. Can't even bring paper inside as it creates too many contaminants
Yup. I feel the machine doesn't have a sufficient vacuum pump to maintain a good vacuum while blasting away at stuff that can outgas like the cardboard sample. The thing has both the roughing and a tiny turbo pump in that little red box. 😳
Even with a device that did not work well for you, you still made a really awesome video to watch. Thanks for your time in this. Hopefully that company resolves the high altitude issue and is able to send you a fix or a new one.
Any high voltage equipment should be designed with Paschen's law in mind. As the density of air decreases with altitude its electrical resistance also decreases. A small flow of argon where you are having arcing issues might resolve the problem as argon is less conductive than air, is readily available, and relatively safe. It'll be more effective if you can bag where it's arcing and put a small flow of argon into the bag.
Couldn't you submerge the board that is arching in some liquid that has a higher dielectric strength than air? For example mineral oil needs 100 times more voltage than air to break down and that's why it is used in transformers.
Real people making real videos is what I enjoy watching on TH-cam. You fit that bill, which is why I continue to watch your videos. Thank you for being you.
Having worked on SEM-EDS systems, I got a bit excited by the title and agree that it's a cool idea in theory. Desktop SEMs are becoming more of a thing nowadays and I can at least think of one from one of the bigger companies that seems fine. Not sure what the specs are or the settings/reference samples that were being used for the SEM in this video but it'd be great to have a bunch of them that small but function just as well as one of the massive ones one day. Loved your videos for a while by the way - keep it up!
I still thought the results were cool even if they did not live up to what you wanted. But... couldn't you just have moved to a lower altitude to demo it?
Seems like a lot of cost and effort to go into demoing a product where the company is I'm trying to convince you to lie and deceive your audience to hide the problem.
@@93DavidJ How is demoing it at a lower and more typical altitude deceit? Like going to the middle of nowhere with a smartphone and complaining it has no reception
@@_BangDroid_ did you not watch the video? In the video he made it clear that the manufacturer of this product wanted him to be deceitful and hide the issues he was having.
@@_BangDroid_ And your comparison about being in the middle of nowhere is complete nonsense because lots of people live in parts of the world with a higher altitude, basically the entire state of Colorado has a relatively high altitude, it's not like he is living in a remote place at the top of the mountain. The simple fact that he's uploading the video makes it obvious that he's still living in a normal area to live in. Your phone in the middle of nowhere analogy just doesn't track at all, especially because the manufacturer tried to convince him to lie and be deceitful about his trouble with the device.
@@93DavidJ I don't think that's the whole story. A) This thing is on the ISS and it doesn't get more high altitude than that. B) It's just one side of a story that doesn't make sense. He's no stranger to filming on location, it would be so easy to just demo the thing at a lower altitude and be done with it and completely avoid all this additional stress and work. C) there are MANY electronic devices that will have complications at higher altitudes: Plasma TV's, laptops, HDD's. Other things like generators or propane fridges will have problems too. Scotty is not including the name to avoid this *rare edge case* becoming synonymous with the device, as this is probably the only video of it on TH-cam. He has no problem featuring Apple products and they're arguably the biggest and dodgiest company out there.
Like a number of folks have already said, it would be interesting to know how many of your issues were down to the altitude and whether your experience would have been different if you had moved location. It still seems like a pretty cool piece of equipment to me.
It seems like the perfect target for this product would be geologists, archeologists, and paleontologists. They could use it on site, without having any problems from moving a sample.
Knowing all the time you spent on this, the least I could do was watch the entire video including the ad, something honestly I never do. This to me is an adventure channel, just like someone exploring a foreign country I'll never get to see. When they drove up to find the place closed due to Covid, that disappointment was part of the adventure. What we got here seems like a summary of your journey, but you can take us for the ride good or bad. Videos showing failures along the way are okay. Don't be apologetic when showing the losses, that's all part of the trip. And makes the victories that much sweeter.
Pressure chamber would be too difficult, but what about co2? Has a ~ 20% higher breakdown so could work, if you put it in a fishtank or something with a lid that you routed the wires through roughly, and you feed a stream of co2 from a welding cylinder/dry ice or something to replace the loss, which you might already have. Doesn't have to be air tight so likely easier than a pressure chamber, but make sure to do it in a well ventilated area
Could you make one of those lightning captured in acrylic sculptures on a small scale? I think they use an electron beam to charge an acrylic block, then hit it with a nail to release the static charge into the block which melts the "lightning strike" inside the block. That would be cool to try.
Regardless of all the problems that you have had with this project, it was appreciative that you could still try and highlight the SEM features by showing some of the samples that could be seen at a lower voltage. Even though, you weren't able to name the company that this SEM was from, it is very awesome that you still showed the product in some light to allow people who aren't necessarily aware that something like this exists. It was still a solid video and continued good wishes on the rest that you will make. :)
I'm really impressed with the tact that you showed while pursuing this video. I know it's a bummer, but as a viewer, I'm really excited that you took us on the journey. "Failures" are interesting too!
When the manufacturer fixes the problem, I would love to see 2 videos. A) This device working properly, and B) a tour of their factory showing everything they did to solve this issue, even if it is an "edge case". THAT would be fantastic! Hopefully it happens. I really appreciate the tact you showed in this video. It's a bummer it didn't work out as well as you or the manufacturer wanted it to, but I still got to see a great video, and hopefully the manufacturer got to learn about and solve an issue before it becomes a "real problem". It's always a great day when Strange Parts posts a vid!
The really fancy SEMs that take up most of a room can run into the millions of dollars. A midrange unit is in the hundreds of thousands. This one is in the $50-100k range. So yes, a lot cheaper, but not really hobbyist level affordable either...
Probably more cost effective to get a second hand SEM from the 1980s off ebay, if you want to do serious stuff with it. These small SEM are nice toys to play with, but can't get anywhere near in resolution to a good field emission SEM.
@@StrangeParts 50k - 100k is way too much, I would have guessed under 1k but for that price I expect better resolution, better software and a unit that actually works.
@@hinz1 But does those SEM come with EDS? To me that's the greatest selling point of this machine. I do geology so the EDS imaging function is really appealing to me.
The aluminum that you see on the part is likely an aluminum oxide deposition layer. It's usually used as an insulator or as a passivation layer. Probably just part of the passivation, if they're worried about interactions from atmospheric conditions. I doubt it has anything to do with thermal isolation, since you're not actually sensing heat you're sensing IR with those type of sensors.
I really appreciate your honesty in pursing this video, after the last one it seemed the company was ready to solve this issue, but hearing they were also asking you to down play it / exclude it from the videos makes mess less excited about the company. It sounds like a little of both honestly and you made the right choice to protect them from those missteps in hope they continue along to resolve the issues and make more products. Thanks!
When I started working in the semiconductor industry I would take scrap wafers down to the SEM lab where we had a Hitachi 4500. This was a great machine! I would break the wafer and prepare a small sample for cross sectional analysis. It would have been fun to do that with the iPhone processors you had, but that machine may not have had enough magnification… To get the focus in, I learned that the best focus was always when the circular feature was fuzzy and round. Set it there and bring in the perfect focus by optimizing the x and y stig. Cool video, too bad it did not work out better, but these are expensive machines. Our SEM machines now are actually optimized for much lower voltages and probe currents, and we get resolution down to 0.5nm on a production system. These are used for automated defect imaging, and can image 100’s of defects per minute. Really amazing what they can do now.
Hi, I love your videos! The field you've chosen to pursuit is very hard and it is completely fine by me to fail to bring video you intended to. It would be super interesting to see how did you tried to solve problems along the way. I would love to see "failed" project videos, they can be as educational and entertaining as the typical ones, but they allow you to tackle much more complicated topics. In my opinion not only it would bring different type of content to platform but it would show how hard any creative process is and that it's ok to fail as long as it's learning experience (when you are learning or pursuing experimental area). Keep up the good work and don't let the pressure to crush your spark.
Dude. Call Fran at FRANLAB and spend some time with the machine in her lab. Pretty sure she's near sea level. You two would make a great collaboration.
This is so very cool! Using a very sophisticated electron microscope to pick on some detail on these electronics. And then realize that these electronics were made by machines, on these scales. Really puts into perspective what an incredible human achievement it is to be able to make these chips, and put them in cheap throw away phones.
The cardboard box was not close to being coated well enough from my experience. Whenever we had to use SEM for samples we would coat it in Pt to the point where it is completely metallic color even for silicon MEMS chips we made. and definitely a lot more coating for non conductive materials. For the higher voltage/magnification we had to coat the sample even thicker, otherwise the charge will gather faster than it can be grounded ruining the image or worse simply burn/melt the sample. In my opinion it looks pretty good for machine that is 1/10th of the size of the one I used XD But I understand your position. And I respect that you remained professional to the end.
Scotty in another comment: "Yes! It's an automatic camera switcher for when I stream on Twitch - it switches to the microscope camera when I look through the eyepieces, using a simple photoresistor. "
As a SEM-EDX user, this device seems like a super fun thing to play with. Sample preparation seems to be your main problem, also focusing nicely on high magnifications takes some practice. Instead of pressurising the room, a better solution might be to use an antivibration table, like the ones for lasers.
About capacitor. So the common information is that the charge sits on surfaces of mating plates, but the dielectric doesn't hold any charge. I saw an experiment that shows a glass as a dielectric that separates plates, and after the capacitor was charged, the glass being switched to other 2 plates and this new capacitor gets a charge from an old one with the glass...
This was great. Glad you did what you needed to make it. Just be confident in yourself and don't let your problems get you down. The trial and error and an honest experience is what makes your videos great. Thanks for the tip on the Allen wrenches. I'm getting some at harbor freight tomorrow.
At 12:45 regarding the accelerometer, I think it is measuring the capacitance based on the amount the fingers are meshed, not the distance between them. The same way a rotary variable capacitor was used for tuning in old radios.
I just wanna say i really liked this video even though there were lots of issues you had making it. I appreciate what you do and hope you have some smoother projects next. I enjoy your content!
Hey great video! I ran electron microscopes for 14 years in the semiconductor industry. I can say you were pretty accurate on all your info. I can tell you really did your homework. I knew you knew what you were talking about when you mentioned the depth of field being a lot deeper on SEM over optical. Good job. Maybe you could buy some time in SEM or STEM at a collage? TEMs can see actual atoms (if you align the lattice on a silicon wafer just right). Also there is a whole world of sample prep that could help your semiconductors look better. If you get a polishing wheel and use acid to open the semiconductor die packaging you can go down layer by layer and see actual devices top down.
YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO THAT COLORED EDS IS TIGHT. It's literally like when you analyze something in video game and it gives you an overlay of what it's made of. There's something incredibly futuristic about that.
Dang I had been waiting on this video and really hoped you got the microscope working but still I think its really cool. Have you tried coming down from the mountain and testing the microscope? I'd be curious if it works well then. If so then I think you should revisit this video just to show off the samples. I appreciate you for being honest here though.
great content. shame you had these issues with the device, atleast the company is actively working on fixing the issues you are having. good luck stay safe duder!
Crazy how small the accelerometer was! I can see how the components of a CPU or RAM could be made extremely small, but this is a chip with _springs_ inside, and I never knew such small springs could still be used for this purpose. It's a shame that high altitude makes the SEM so unreliable, this was already a great video with the (relatively) low-voltage mode and had so much potential.
I have so much admiration for your ambition. This was a huge undertaking, and it was fascinating hearing about how you figured those issues out and worked through them. I think the secret sauce of your channel is breaking open things they don’t want you to break open, and playing Around with proprietary designs that are the opposite of modular. Thanks man.
The product obviously is poorly designed with not enough gap margin for isolation. How come other products designed at near water levels that are also present in his lab have no issues?
@@StrangeParts Ehh I was expecting someone to bring this up, shame it's you and you don't get it. The thing is that this "offset" is a percentage of the nominal voltage, meaning that if same standards are applied to a product that runs 10kV and one that runs 110V then if the 10kV one fails in X conditions, the other 110V product running in same X conditions also would fail. So if you have professional equipment running just fine at your lab, then if you have something that fails, it didn't adhere to the standards and so has been unprofessionally designed.
@@Arek_R. Well where he is a plasma TV will be pretty much at the edge of operation, simply because the design relies on atmospheric pressure to allow internal structures to be supported, which is a reason they have to be transported in pressurised cargo, and the pressure altitude has to be low enough that they do not fail during transit.
@@Arek_R. I think you have a poor understanding of the differences between high and low voltages. And also a poor understanding of just how unique a device like this is compared to virtually any other electronic you might encounter.
I think the machine worked great considering it is being operated in conditions that are considerably removed from sea level, where most of the World’s population actually live and work. Any commercial enterprise that needed to operate at that altitude would find it relatively trivial to create a pressurised containment for either the equipment or a room to work in. Overall a very promising bit of kit.
Scotty this video was awesome. I think by adapting your narrative to working through the issues would have been really interesting, especially for such a cool product.
Not only for the quite awesome electron microscope images, this is also cool to get to know how those tiny microphones, acceleration and gyroscopes work! Thanks :)
Have you thought about using some dielectric spray on the pcb? Like 3m 1601, 40kv/mm and manages 120°c. It will for shure make it harder to repair the pcb, but many of these sprays have another spray for ease of removal. There can definitely be some part I'm not thinking about that makes the SEM not work with this...
SEMs usually require a high or ultra high vaccum to operate (with diffusion or turbo molecular pumps). Is this thing able to operate on just a roughing pump or is there some fancy ultra compact high vaccum system. I'm not an expert, just a very interested EE.
On the cardboard, you do not short the surface. Just put some conductive tape on the front surface near the area of interest. The Ag/silver is for short distance conductivity, not long distance.
Make a small pressure chamber that you can put it in, it doesn't even need to hold that much pressure. Maybe a 55 gal. drum with a window cut in it or something. You can make a video on it.
I think this product even with the issues raised would be ideal for many level 3 education locations (6th form and collage) as it is great enough to give those students hands on experience with a electron microscope and other built in features and the quality is good enough for them to have a fair result.
Thanks for all the suggestions of either making a pressurized tank to put the SEM in. I think this would have been doable, but a bit tricky, as you have to deal with routing wires in and out of it, and give yourself enough room to load samples, and figure out ways of dealing with heat and things. I also really went into this wanting to show off this cool product that's supposed to be portable and work anywhere. Putting it inside of a big pressure chamber felt a bit antithetical to that! I also appreciated the suggestions of pressurizing the entire room, but that sounded like a real challenger - most rooms are very, very leaky from a pressure perspective, and my shop is no exception 😁 Things like vents in the ceiling, cracks around the doors, not to mention the sink drain. It all would have been a huge challenge to seal!
Couldn't you just dip the circuit boards in silastic, or any rubber based glue to help prevent arcing? Silastic is usually used to waterproof circuit boards but it also helps to insulate them, maybe that would make it work and keep it portable (i dont know exactly what is arcing and if it could be dipped but you could try)
Why did you not test in a lower altitude? I think you could hire an airbnb for 1 or 2 days
@@SuperStrikeagle SEMs rely on the targets being conductive so you would need to leave the target area uncoated
Simplest fix would be to get a large fish tank, and place the whole machine in it. Then have a flat glass lid, and feed through wires and such though a hole cut in the glass, and sealed with a bung of either rubber, which you slit in half and carve out channels to carry the wires, or just use some silicone sealer or simply putty. Then simply take the whole tank and get some SF6 gas, and fill the tank with it, displacing the air inside. The SF6 will act as a quench agent, but you do not have to pressurise the tank, merely displace most of the air inside. Slip top off and you can change the samples easily, no pressure difference, and the gas is dense, so slow to diffuse out, just keep the lid closed for the most part, and then after sample change simply have a brief puff of SF6 to make up, which even a small cylinder should last a few months, as the lid will keep it in. A simple silicone rubber extrusion on the top to act as a seal will hold the gas in for a good amount of time. As SF6 is very much inert, and the symptoms of it being in the atmosphere is a deep voice, just having in the shop with normal ventilation will not be much of an issue.
A bespoke enclosure for the SEM would work. It would be easier to pressurize.
Being an electron microscope scientist myself, I have three ideas what might have caused the imaging problems with your cardboard sample:
1. Inhomogenous coating. The deeper fibres were probably not coated well with Ag - so there was still charge building up within the sample. This might have caused the fibres constantly moving apart from against each other due to static electricity.
2. Cardboard is quite moist. And it wasn't dried properly beforehand, I guess. In the vaccum of the chamber, it es being dehydrated which might also cause the fibres to move due to the deformation caused by the dehydrating process.
3. You might just be using too much acceleration voltage. Cardboard is a very light material. You are losing lots of detail when hitting organic matter with too much energy since those fast electrons penetrate quite deeply and return signals from the underlying fibres as well.
iv been and SEM tech for about 10 yrs. The imaging issue doesn't look like a charging problem to me. You would expect the top to look normal and the underlying bits to be problematic not the whole thing.
Looks like it could be the vacuum isn't high enough. Would explain the low resolution, poor signal to noise, and arching that you've been having.
Try it with something conductive like a coin and let it pump overnight.
@@stuartmicklethwaite5427 when he said the product was failing because of altitude of his lab, I immediately though, of course the vacuum pump must be weak.
It makes total sense to be a problem with the vacuum.
@@monad_tcp Maybe but I'm guessing the entire circuit system isn't in the vacuum chamber. The manufacturer certainly would have considered that as it's very obvious.
My guess is the arcing is happening in the circuit that's outside the chamber and isn't fixable without a pressure chamber.
I view a lot of natural fibers such as plant, paper, spores, pollen, and organic compounds on our SEM. I find that a Gold-Palladium covering helps increase conductivity and therefore picture resolution with comes to natural fibers. Also it is helpful to put the items in a vacuum oven for an hour to make sure there is no moisture in the sample.
@@tonymorris4335 I won't pretend to know anything about these type of machines but, if electrical arcing is the only problem, couldn't you seal the problematic part of the circuit with epoxy or silicon?
As a material scientist myself, I think the issues are related to sample prep and ill-prepared microscopist. Not trying to criticize just for criticize but your expectations are way higher than what they should be. The fact that this SEM is table top, is a huge achievement in itself.
Just a little tip when working with samples outside a sterile cage: Along with gloves you should wear a mask (preferably a shield) to avoid contaminating the sample with saliva droplets, especially if you are talking above them.
I was thinking about that when he was talking in direction of his sample before putting it in.
Noted
It wasn't that bad, it was frustrating yes, but you got to thinker around with something out the reach of millions of people. Thank you for your content!
*billions of people
*trillions of ants
0 Martians
@@officialspock 12 googleplex space bacteria
@@GamingStepByStep 1 me
Observations: 1) Your semiconductor samples show charging, and would benefit from sputtering. 2) The working distance was not listed on the UI, and is key to thick samples like cardboard (which needed full-coverage sputtering, too ). 3) Samples should be thoroughly dried. 4) Vacuum quality and chamber cleanliness are critical. It sounds like both were compromised early in your experimentation. 5) ThermoFisher has a useful guide to SEM sample preparation that could help with these common problems.
need a 4 psi pressure tank.... that should be easy to make ... did you take the SEM to a low altitude truck stop? "SEM images on the road" seems like a good show title... did high altitude operation cause damage to the machine?
I'd just put the whole SEM in a bucket with SF6 (or R134A from the local auto parts store.)
The DLP chip from a projector looks awesome in a SEM!
Yeah, I had one prepared - sadly, because the SEM wasn't working properly, it really limited the samples I could look at :(
@@StrangeParts Give that microscope to Photoniduction to blow up and destroy !
@@harezy so happy his channel is back and uploading...🙌
Sonya: Take a look at Creative Electron: th-cam.com/video/75y2eZKlyNM/w-d-xo.html
Send him one, alone with a bottle of SF6....
That EDS feature is so goddamn cool! it's a shame that it doesn't perform efficiently, but I mean damn, the result you're getting now is still pretty impressive, which means that at full potential, this machine is game-changing.
SF6 is a wonderful gas. It's heavy and dielectric. Take an aquarium and put the SEM into it, fill up with SF6 and run. Should easily reduce arcing at altitude. As a level indicator you could use a balloon with ordinary air.
SF6 is used in modern SEM and TEM as insulator inside the high voltage tank. SF6 is also used in under ground power stations to reduce the size compared to power stations above ground.
I ran into this technology when reading up on SEM and TEM a number of years ago when I got a couple of old microscopes. My old SEM and TEM use standard transformer oil though.
I'm really impressed with this machine, I've never thought that it would be a desktop system so soon
It is going to be very useful in the not to distant future I would think.
Me too, does anybody know whats the MSRP?
you can DIY it yourself with cathode ray tude,electron detector & a microcontroler.
me too
$65,000
So far this Electron Microscope comes out looking like an awesome product to me lol
Agreed. If it's simply an altitude issue and the manufacturer can determine a reliable limit, they just need to add this to the working specification and it's fine as long as the user can meet the environment requirements. Once the altitude range is increased they can release a new model.
Yeah I want one bad. I bought a mountain in Eastern KY and I been finding tons of coal and fossils and it would be really sweet to look at some of these things imo
Living at sea level in a flat land... where do I get one of those things.
I'm very happy that you're posting videos, even if they're not going quite right in some ways! And the message at the end of this video was very powerful and made me think about how seriously I take all my 'great ideas'
thanks for doing what you do
How far would you have to travel to reach lower altitude? A car, a motel room, and a couple of days on the road should have given you at least the opportunity to show the difference between your high altitude experience and the normal operation.
Really does seem like an easy problem to solve, at least for the sake of proving it should work as advertised, doesn't it?
@@dizzy2020 idk about you, but I wouldn't mind a multi day trip to solve a problem I've been pulling my hair out over the last 8 weeks for.
It would be totally fine to tell the name of the product! That SEM seems to be freaking awesome and the issue wasn't exactly their fault, even if they couldn't communicate more efficiently beforehand! Anyone with enough knowledge to look for a SEM product wouldn't be scared away by this video at all!
From the colour scheme and desktop miniaturisation of an SEM, I would hazard a guess that the company is SRI Instruments, which makes small gas chromatographs.
`world's smallest sem` kind of gives it away.
I got curious and searched for "world's smallest SEM" a few weeks ago, and I found this thing. Probably why this video was recommended. I live near sea level and I really want one.
The name of Japanese rice cake but with an extra i
I just read an article in the news about how one of these is making its rounds around schools across Ontario, Canada. I think it's awesome that kids these days have access to this level of technology. Not just awesome. Mind blowing is more like it.
its a freaking scanning electron microscope the size of a coffee machine
Check out the nGauge Atomic Force Microscope. It fits in your palm.
I work for a leading mfg of electron beam lithography machines which can also do SEM functions. Arcing is an issue even with million dollar machines. Machines run in a very good vacuum, and many fancy pumps to create ultra low vacuum. Also heat is used to burn off any contaminants. If you put this machine in a bigger vacuum chamber and or stronger vacuum pump you'll likely have more success. Note on big machines takes about a day to get a good vacuum. Also the tip voltage is ramped up slowly as in 5-10v/s to reduce arcing risk
Additionally these machines are in cleanrooms, ppl in bunny suits and everything is cleaned and cleaned again with IPA due to contaminants. Can't even bring paper inside as it creates too many contaminants
Yup. I feel the machine doesn't have a sufficient vacuum pump to maintain a good vacuum while blasting away at stuff that can outgas like the cardboard sample. The thing has both the roughing and a tiny turbo pump in that little red box. 😳
Even with a device that did not work well for you, you still made a really awesome video to watch. Thanks for your time in this. Hopefully that company resolves the high altitude issue and is able to send you a fix or a new one.
Any high voltage equipment should be designed with Paschen's law in mind. As the density of air decreases with altitude its electrical resistance also decreases.
A small flow of argon where you are having arcing issues might resolve the problem as argon is less conductive than air, is readily available, and relatively safe.
It'll be more effective if you can bag where it's arcing and put a small flow of argon into the bag.
Couldn't you submerge the board that is arching in some liquid that has a higher dielectric strength than air? For example mineral oil needs 100 times more voltage than air to break down and that's why it is used in transformers.
A conformal coating would be easier. Though it seems they don't know where the problem lies, so any application would be blind.
Real people making real videos is what I enjoy watching on TH-cam. You fit that bill, which is why I continue to watch your videos. Thank you for being you.
Having worked on SEM-EDS systems, I got a bit excited by the title and agree that it's a cool idea in theory. Desktop SEMs are becoming more of a thing nowadays and I can at least think of one from one of the bigger companies that seems fine. Not sure what the specs are or the settings/reference samples that were being used for the SEM in this video but it'd be great to have a bunch of them that small but function just as well as one of the massive ones one day.
Loved your videos for a while by the way - keep it up!
I still thought the results were cool even if they did not live up to what you wanted. But... couldn't you just have moved to a lower altitude to demo it?
Seems like a lot of cost and effort to go into demoing a product where the company is I'm trying to convince you to lie and deceive your audience to hide the problem.
@@93DavidJ How is demoing it at a lower and more typical altitude deceit? Like going to the middle of nowhere with a smartphone and complaining it has no reception
@@_BangDroid_ did you not watch the video? In the video he made it clear that the manufacturer of this product wanted him to be deceitful and hide the issues he was having.
@@_BangDroid_ And your comparison about being in the middle of nowhere is complete nonsense because lots of people live in parts of the world with a higher altitude, basically the entire state of Colorado has a relatively high altitude, it's not like he is living in a remote place at the top of the mountain. The simple fact that he's uploading the video makes it obvious that he's still living in a normal area to live in. Your phone in the middle of nowhere analogy just doesn't track at all, especially because the manufacturer tried to convince him to lie and be deceitful about his trouble with the device.
@@93DavidJ I don't think that's the whole story. A) This thing is on the ISS and it doesn't get more high altitude than that. B) It's just one side of a story that doesn't make sense. He's no stranger to filming on location, it would be so easy to just demo the thing at a lower altitude and be done with it and completely avoid all this additional stress and work. C) there are MANY electronic devices that will have complications at higher altitudes: Plasma TV's, laptops, HDD's. Other things like generators or propane fridges will have problems too.
Scotty is not including the name to avoid this *rare edge case* becoming synonymous with the device, as this is probably the only video of it on TH-cam.
He has no problem featuring Apple products and they're arguably the biggest and dodgiest company out there.
Like a number of folks have already said, it would be interesting to know how many of your issues were down to the altitude and whether your experience would have been different if you had moved location. It still seems like a pretty cool piece of equipment to me.
It seems like the perfect target for this product would be geologists, archeologists, and paleontologists. They could use it on site, without having any problems from moving a sample.
was thinking the same, not really lol, though only about geologists - yeah, portability is interesting
Not even close to standard SEM magnification but but the EDX function was a nice surprise.
Knowing all the time you spent on this, the least I could do was watch the entire video including the ad, something honestly I never do. This to me is an adventure channel, just like someone exploring a foreign country I'll never get to see. When they drove up to find the place closed due to Covid, that disappointment was part of the adventure. What we got here seems like a summary of your journey, but you can take us for the ride good or bad. Videos showing failures along the way are okay. Don't be apologetic when showing the losses, that's all part of the trip. And makes the victories that much sweeter.
You are a good front-line warrior.
Stay true to yourself.
Keep up the good work. Looking forward to your next video.
Pressure chamber would be too difficult, but what about co2? Has a ~ 20% higher breakdown so could work, if you put it in a fishtank or something with a lid that you routed the wires through roughly, and you feed a stream of co2 from a welding cylinder/dry ice or something to replace the loss, which you might already have.
Doesn't have to be air tight so likely easier than a pressure chamber, but make sure to do it in a well ventilated area
micro-electro-mechanical systems are so cool, nice video man.
Could you make one of those lightning captured in acrylic sculptures on a small scale? I think they use an electron beam to charge an acrylic block, then hit it with a nail to release the static charge into the block which melts the "lightning strike" inside the block. That would be cool to try.
Where'd you go man its been 4 months
Regardless of all the problems that you have had with this project, it was appreciative that you could still try and highlight the SEM features by showing some of the samples that could be seen at a lower voltage. Even though, you weren't able to name the company that this SEM was from, it is very awesome that you still showed the product in some light to allow people who aren't necessarily aware that something like this exists. It was still a solid video and continued good wishes on the rest that you will make. :)
I'm really impressed with the tact that you showed while pursuing this video. I know it's a bummer, but as a viewer, I'm really excited that you took us on the journey. "Failures" are interesting too!
When the manufacturer fixes the problem, I would love to see 2 videos. A) This device working properly, and B) a tour of their factory showing everything they did to solve this issue, even if it is an "edge case". THAT would be fantastic! Hopefully it happens.
I really appreciate the tact you showed in this video. It's a bummer it didn't work out as well as you or the manufacturer wanted it to, but I still got to see a great video, and hopefully the manufacturer got to learn about and solve an issue before it becomes a "real problem".
It's always a great day when Strange Parts posts a vid!
This is awesome Scotty @strangeparts. How does the price compare to a professional unit? Is it by orders of magnitude cheaper?
The really fancy SEMs that take up most of a room can run into the millions of dollars. A midrange unit is in the hundreds of thousands. This one is in the $50-100k range. So yes, a lot cheaper, but not really hobbyist level affordable either...
Probably more cost effective to get a second hand SEM from the 1980s off ebay, if you want to do serious stuff with it. These small SEM are nice toys to play with, but can't get anywhere near in resolution to a good field emission SEM.
@@StrangeParts 50k - 100k is way too much, I would have guessed under 1k but for that price I expect better resolution, better software and a unit that actually works.
@@leothecrafter4808 SEMs are not cheap at all. I guessed this cost a lot upwards of 50k.
@@hinz1 But does those SEM come with EDS? To me that's the greatest selling point of this machine. I do geology so the EDS imaging function is really appealing to me.
The aluminum that you see on the part is likely an aluminum oxide deposition layer. It's usually used as an insulator or as a passivation layer. Probably just part of the passivation, if they're worried about interactions from atmospheric conditions.
I doubt it has anything to do with thermal isolation, since you're not actually sensing heat you're sensing IR with those type of sensors.
I just would build a pressure chamber to simulate sea level.
the old phone's camera will take better pictures than that wannabe electron junk telescope
@@mariquevandermerwe8516 yeah sure. Sure.
I really appreciate your honesty in pursing this video, after the last one it seemed the company was ready to solve this issue, but hearing they were also asking you to down play it / exclude it from the videos makes mess less excited about the company. It sounds like a little of both honestly and you made the right choice to protect them from those missteps in hope they continue along to resolve the issues and make more products. Thanks!
I like strange parts your videos are entertaining and I like your personality keep up the great work dude
When I started working in the semiconductor industry I would take scrap wafers down to the SEM lab where we had a Hitachi 4500. This was a great machine!
I would break the wafer and prepare a small sample for cross sectional analysis. It would have been fun to do that with the iPhone processors you had, but that machine may not have had enough magnification…
To get the focus in, I learned that the best focus was always when the circular feature was fuzzy and round. Set it there and bring in the perfect focus by optimizing the x and y stig.
Cool video, too bad it did not work out better, but these are expensive machines.
Our SEM machines now are actually optimized for much lower voltages and probe currents, and we get resolution down to 0.5nm on a production system.
These are used for automated defect imaging, and can image 100’s of defects per minute. Really amazing what they can do now.
Hi, I love your videos! The field you've chosen to pursuit is very hard and it is completely fine by me to fail to bring video you intended to. It would be super interesting to see how did you tried to solve problems along the way. I would love to see "failed" project videos, they can be as educational and entertaining as the typical ones, but they allow you to tackle much more complicated topics. In my opinion not only it would bring different type of content to platform but it would show how hard any creative process is and that it's ok to fail as long as it's learning experience (when you are learning or pursuing experimental area). Keep up the good work and don't let the pressure to crush your spark.
even if it doesnt work 100 % perfect , the idea itself is amazing , and those people must not give up on it , its amazing
Dude. Call Fran at FRANLAB and spend some time with the machine in her lab. Pretty sure she's near sea level. You two would make a great collaboration.
Scotty “The Plan Was” Allen haha, love this guy :)
Kudos for choosing integrity. It shows that you're truly passionate about the subject and in the long term it will pay dividends.
This is so very cool! Using a very sophisticated electron microscope to pick on some detail on these electronics. And then realize that these electronics were made by machines, on these scales. Really puts into perspective what an incredible human achievement it is to be able to make these chips, and put them in cheap throw away phones.
dude, sumerge the electronics in transformer oil, or build a box to put the sem in and fill the box with Sulfur Hexafluoride gas or nitrogen
The cardboard box was not close to being coated well enough from my experience. Whenever we had to use SEM for samples we would coat it in Pt to the point where it is completely metallic color even for silicon MEMS chips we made. and definitely a lot more coating for non conductive materials.
For the higher voltage/magnification we had to coat the sample even thicker, otherwise the charge will gather faster than it can be grounded ruining the image or worse simply burn/melt the sample.
In my opinion it looks pretty good for machine that is 1/10th of the size of the one I used XD
But I understand your position. And I respect that you remained professional to the end.
Random question, what is the Arduino on top of your "normal" microscope for?
Seems to be an ESP8266 or ESP32, two wires are going to the side of the lens and seems to be connected to a photoresistor.
Scotty in another comment:
"Yes! It's an automatic camera switcher for when I stream on Twitch - it switches to the microscope camera when I look through the eyepieces, using a simple photoresistor.
"
As a SEM-EDX user, this device seems like a super fun thing to play with. Sample preparation seems to be your main problem, also focusing nicely on high magnifications takes some practice. Instead of pressurising the room, a better solution might be to use an antivibration table, like the ones for lasers.
Sounds to me that you are overly critical of a desktop SEM. The semiconductor devices looked really good.
About capacitor. So the common information is that the charge sits on surfaces of mating plates, but the dielectric doesn't hold any charge.
I saw an experiment that shows a glass as a dielectric that separates plates, and after the capacitor was charged, the glass being switched to other 2 plates and this new capacitor gets a charge from an old one with the glass...
Hey man where have you been? Are you good?
Why did he dissapear?
This was great. Glad you did what you needed to make it. Just be confident in yourself and don't let your problems get you down. The trial and error and an honest experience is what makes your videos great. Thanks for the tip on the Allen wrenches. I'm getting some at harbor freight tomorrow.
I'm impressed who those people are able to desing those circuits, just look at them, a really complicated devices, that's amazing
I seriously think there was no loss here! Super cool stuff, I learned a ton, thanks for the video!
Physical laws are immutable. Doesn't mean the product is bad in any way.
Wow, that final segment was touching and uniquely motivating, I feel like I'm gonna cry. How was I not subscribed?
Anyone know what happened to Scott
Brain injury, but he has started to make videos again.
At 12:45 regarding the accelerometer, I think it is measuring the capacitance based on the amount the fingers are meshed, not the distance between them. The same way a rotary variable capacitor was used for tuning in old radios.
Pressurize your whole shop so the SEM will work
why not pressure the whole state ? or if we increase earths atmospheric pressure that should work aswell lul
Positive pressure ventilation is totally a thing. An expensive thing but a thing.
@@TheWittyGeek it's not the same as you actually need to increase the static pressure
I just wanna say i really liked this video even though there were lots of issues you had making it. I appreciate what you do and hope you have some smoother projects next. I enjoy your content!
Hey great video! I ran electron microscopes for 14 years in the semiconductor industry. I can say you were pretty accurate on all your info. I can tell you really did your homework. I knew you knew what you were talking about when you mentioned the depth of field being a lot deeper on SEM over optical. Good job. Maybe you could buy some time in SEM or STEM at a collage? TEMs can see actual atoms (if you align the lattice on a silicon wafer just right). Also there is a whole world of sample prep that could help your semiconductors look better. If you get a polishing wheel and use acid to open the semiconductor die packaging you can go down layer by layer and see actual devices top down.
Really nice video..so not get frustrated..sample preparation is an art. Even with lab scale SEM's the same issues are observed.
Where are u man? Are u getting kidnapped by Apple?
YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
THAT COLORED EDS IS TIGHT.
It's literally like when you analyze something in video game and it gives you an overlay of what it's made of. There's something incredibly futuristic about that.
Dang I had been waiting on this video and really hoped you got the microscope working but still I think its really cool.
Have you tried coming down from the mountain and testing the microscope? I'd be curious if it works well then. If so then I think you should revisit this video just to show off the samples.
I appreciate you for being honest here though.
Right, it was supposed to be compact and easily movable. Perhaps it could have been used in a tent or something.
You should had tried different source filaments in SEM. (Electron beam generators).
I feel so bad for him, he’s just trying to make good content. And he’s trying so hard to make it work ):
Thanks for your Using My Music // Keep up the fresh & Spacey content ✊🏽✨🙏🛸
Thanks for being honest
Would potting the joints that arc help?
Miss working with a SEM. Good memories.
Sorry to hear that its not working for you.
great content. shame you had these issues with the device, atleast the company is actively working on fixing the issues you are having. good luck stay safe duder!
I would have just rented a room at sea level and called it a day
Crazy how small the accelerometer was! I can see how the components of a CPU or RAM could be made extremely small, but this is a chip with _springs_ inside, and I never knew such small springs could still be used for this purpose. It's a shame that high altitude makes the SEM so unreliable, this was already a great video with the (relatively) low-voltage mode and had so much potential.
Please add some lighting in the background. I really want to see some of the background. It will also make the video more popping.
I have so much admiration for your ambition. This was a huge undertaking, and it was fascinating hearing about how you figured those issues out and worked through them. I think the secret sauce of your channel is breaking open things they don’t want you to break open, and playing Around with proprietary designs that are the opposite of modular. Thanks man.
Where are you Scotty?
I love your honesty, AND the quality of the footage here is ...
As someone that had privy info in a factory things are not as they seem even to the people that work there.
Super happy your making videos again. Love this channel; keep up the awesome work man.
The product obviously is poorly designed with not enough gap margin for isolation.
How come other products designed at near water levels that are also present in his lab have no issues?
The reason other products in my shop don't have this issue is that nothing else I have runs at such high voltages!
@@StrangeParts Ehh I was expecting someone to bring this up, shame it's you and you don't get it.
The thing is that this "offset" is a percentage of the nominal voltage, meaning that if same standards are applied to a product that runs 10kV and one that runs 110V then if the 10kV one fails in X conditions, the other 110V product running in same X conditions also would fail.
So if you have professional equipment running just fine at your lab, then if you have something that fails, it didn't adhere to the standards and so has been unprofessionally designed.
@@Arek_R. Well where he is a plasma TV will be pretty much at the edge of operation, simply because the design relies on atmospheric pressure to allow internal structures to be supported, which is a reason they have to be transported in pressurised cargo, and the pressure altitude has to be low enough that they do not fail during transit.
@@Arek_R. I think you have a poor understanding of the differences between high and low voltages. And also a poor understanding of just how unique a device like this is compared to virtually any other electronic you might encounter.
Thank you for putting honesty above all else. That really resonates with me as I do the same in everything I do
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I think the machine worked great considering it is being operated in conditions that are considerably removed from sea level, where most of the World’s population actually live and work. Any commercial enterprise that needed to operate at that altitude would find it relatively trivial to create a pressurised containment for either the equipment or a room to work in. Overall a very promising bit of kit.
You have some of the most interesting content on TH-cam. I love your videos, keep up the great work!
Scotty this video was awesome. I think by adapting your narrative to working through the issues would have been really interesting, especially for such a cool product.
So glad you made me aware of the issues at higher altitudes. Its going to change a ton of my plans lol.
Not only for the quite awesome electron microscope images, this is also cool to get to know how those tiny microphones, acceleration and gyroscopes work! Thanks :)
Thanks for this video. It gives depth to your work. Feels premium and scarce.
Have you thought about using some dielectric spray on the pcb?
Like 3m 1601, 40kv/mm and manages 120°c. It will for shure make it harder to repair the pcb, but many of these sprays have another spray for ease of removal. There can definitely be some part I'm not thinking about that makes the SEM not work with this...
SEMs usually require a high or ultra high vaccum to operate (with diffusion or turbo molecular pumps). Is this thing able to operate on just a roughing pump or is there some fancy ultra compact high vaccum system. I'm not an expert, just a very interested EE.
On the cardboard, you do not short the surface. Just put some conductive tape on the front surface
near the area of interest. The Ag/silver is for short distance conductivity, not long distance.
Make a small pressure chamber that you can put it in, it doesn't even need to hold that much pressure. Maybe a 55 gal. drum with a window cut in it or something. You can make a video on it.
Exactly what I was thinkin'
Liked the technical content...appreciate the integrity!
I think this product even with the issues raised would be ideal for many level 3 education locations (6th form and collage) as it is great enough to give those students hands on experience with a electron microscope and other built in features and the quality is good enough for them to have a fair result.
I'm still impressed with how far it did get and the UI design for it. Hopefully with further development it will improve.