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As someone who has been responsible for installing extra bus lanes alongside an existing highway, I can attest to the utility nightmare. They have a statutory right to install anything in the public highway, so water, electricity, gas, and particularly fibre telecoms all have to be relocated. They are allowed to install them at a lower separation under a pavement or verge so if that is to become a traffic lane or bus lane or tram lane, then they have to be lowered, at the project's expense. We get an estimate, pay the invoice in full!, up front, then the utilities start to plan the works. Some are pretty efficient and also allow our contractor to do the grunt work, only using their in-house contractor to do the specialist work. Thames Water are one of the worst and often don't even know where their mains are located (some are so old) so it is not surprising that it is TW who seem to be the problem here. Network Rail will have given them the required notice and the NR contractor will have been tearing their hair out to keep the works on track. Best of luck.
It sounds like an absolute nightmare. A guy I know recently gave me the rundown. People have commented that Network Rail should have planned the works better, but it doesn't seem like the current system allows time to properly consider all the options nor make allowances for any changes that may need to be made during work.
Thank you so much for making this video, it’s really helpful to get some insight into what is going on with the project. As you say, the disruption is immense. The city has been cut in half. If you want to go from one side of that unfinished bridge to the other, you have to drive all the way to the ring road and around and back in.
This might be a pain in the neck now, but when Oxford becomes more busy and those two terminating platforms can be turned into through platforms, passengers will be happy. I think this also demonstrates that rail viaducts are a lot more flexible than embankments, as they provide a large number of arches that can easily be used to divert pedestrians or pipes under the railway, without the need to shut the railway down.
To route the eastern span to the terminating platforms, they will have to run the track through the middle of what is currently the main station building!
Obviously it would be a lot of work, but it's good that they appear to be providing the option now, rather than making more work should the 6th go ahead
Another cracking video Chris. hopefully NR are able to sort things out as it has seemed to have major effects to Oxford. I went to Oxford last autumn and the sheer size of the construction site is not done justice in the video! Once they complete it all with the new 5th platform though it should be a great addition for extra capacity.
Thanks. Just as this video went out it was reported that pilling is due to commence, so at the very least it seems that progress to build the bridge will be made soon.
Chris thank you for the detailed report-out at Oxford Station. Things can _only_ get better ! 😁 This a challenging multi-mode upgrade (will it be similar to lowering Old Oak Common Lane for DD bus transit under tracks ? And similarly OOC Lane upgrade (or is that DOWN-grade, heh) then Widening the road to create new cycle and pedestrian pathways.) Some Engineering challenges are perhaps too vague in requirements and planning ? who knows. Cheers from across the Pond.
An interesting video - thank you. I can't help but thinking that all these problems should have been anticipated before the road was closed. As to the inverted arch, I can remember reading years ago that when the railway was built in 1850, it altered the water table so much that the road under the bridge often flooded. To resolve this, an inverted brick arch was built. So how come they've only just discovered it? It could only happen in the UK!
If capacity at Oxford Station is so tight, by all means expand it but also take some of the pressure off by extending all westbound EWR services from any starting point to terminate at either Cowley or Didcot ( ideally serving both by trains alternating throughout the day between the two ) but with every EWR train running north or south stopping at Oxford itself? Cowley has ample room for growth and as housing pressure in Oxford is intense, what would in effect be a new town needs to be built there. The private sector developers could usefully pay the cost of building a new Cowley station with ample turnback/reversal tracks and of course re-doubling the line back to Oxford. Naturally, this line should be future-proofed, have provision for OHE electrification and allow for further extensions of the Cowley branch line ( something we only seem to be thinking about now, hence the third bridge span for a future platform 6, which will be needed as our roads clog up ). It seems that EWR has similar ideas about Bedford, extending all westbound trains ( one day! ) that would have terminated at Bedford to call there but terminate instead at an expanded station on the Marston Vale line that will have turnback facilities but which is also a destination station in itself ( at the proposed theme park? ). As for the epic Botley Road bodge-up of Network Rail, the council, and umpteen utilities all getting in each other's way, why can't we get projects like this right? China has, Spain has, and France has. It seems we have good engineers ( those actually building HS2 are doing great, innovative and even beautiful work ) but our planning and management of large projects is weak and fragmented. Maybe we need to call the French or Spanish in to run things for us ( oh sorry, they are evil Europeans so we can't have them..maybe China? They love us and can't possibly have malign intentions..can they?).
4.95 metres is the maximum height of a double decker bus in the UK. The normal height in practice is about 4.45 metres. As far ad Botley Bridge goes, then the height limit was 4.11 metres, not 4 metres which allowed some double decker buses built to that height limit to be operated on that route. However, the drivers of those buses still had to be very cautious, as any excessive speed on the down slope meant that could bounce on their springs causing them to scrape the roof. I know a bus driver who drove a couple of routes down the Botley Road, and they appear to have no idea when it is going to be reopened. As for what has happened on the Botley Road, it's yet another sign of this country's seeming inability to build anything remotely on time or budget. We can point to any number of railway projects in recent years. It was always known that, due to the proximity to the Thames, this was going to be a difficult project, but it seems that they were still unprepared. The residents of Oxford have become somewhat resigned to this saga. Just outside Oxford on the A40 there is a vast car park which cost £51m to build, yet has remained empty for the year since it was built. It is designed for park-and-ride, but it is not connected to the road system, and it looks like it will not be operational until at least 2027. Road and other works near the Peartree roundabout by the A34 have been going on interminably for years, and some nearby work on the A44 with a cycle track and and some widening also seemed to run on and on. The state of civil engineering in this country is shocking, and I think we are being taken to the cleaners by the big civil engineering companies. Even quite simple work seems to take forever. A zebra crossing a few tens of metres from me took 2 weeks, and the crews were packed up and gone by 3pm.
I remember the halcycon days of Tony Blair's "joined up government", where all these schemes had to be planned from the outset with all utilities involved at political level: "who is paying for this?" The Tories never wanted such schemes in the first place (austerity), and scrapped all cross-departmental consultation in order to make rebuttal easier for the politicians. So instead of a Blairite "everything planned in parallel", we now have everything planned in series, so that oops, that won't work, and oops, that won't work continually and on site. It is the reason why these complex building projects become so expensive.
Considering utilities are privatised they seem to hold a lot of power over where pipes/cables can and can't be laid. The government should just be able to say your pipe is going here, like it or lump it
Utility providers have statutory rights like they did before privatisation. It means the Contractor has to agree method statements with the service provider for diverting, altering or building over .
As someone who lives in Oxford, the whole thing is a bit of a farce however unlike most people in Oxford, I actually don't mind the cost overruns too much. Its very annoying yes because it bisects Oxford annoyedly, however the benefits are going to be very VERY good for Oxford
Money, as usual. A wealth tax of just 2% on the wealth of those with assets worth over £10 million has been proposed by Labour and this could help pay for electrification, but of course, it won't happen as the wealth holders ( who drive ) will whip up support from the non - wealth holders ( who have to use public transport ), and shout it down.
@@adrianbaron4994 Wealth tax is a dumb idea. Would it include jewellery, pictures, race horses, shares, antiques? How would they be valued? Labour resists the tax that would actually be effective land value tax
This road closure blocks any motor vehicle access into the centre of the city from the west, forcing you to take lengthy diversions. It has also made the Seacourt Park and Ride basically redundant as the buses now end before the bridge.
I'd love EWR when it goes to Cambridge, but would I still need to change twice (at Didcot Parkway and Reading)? Why can't I change once (at Bristol Parkway, Swindon or Didcot Parkway)?
@@Rail_Focus OK, would love that! Swindon or Bristol Parkway or Bristol Temple Meads would be even better (Newport or Cardiff Central is asking too much),
I feel like there’s no point opening the Cowley branch, Cowley has a bus to Oxford & Rail Station around every 3-7 mins, so I don’t see the point with a half hourly train. Littlemore has a good bus service aswell, buses to Oxford are around every 10-15 mins
This problem is very annoying for people who are using the 400 Bus service in Oxford (mostly Brookes students getting from Headington Campus to Harcourt Hill) as it splits that bus line in 2 causing the Harcourt campus to be essentially cut off. Having taken this many times it sucks having to do the transfer just to get to the the other side of the bridge. But here's to hoping that the new platform works because overcrowding on Platform 3 sometimes is a problem (Especially when GWR cancels trains)
The process is a bit convoluted, but there is only a short window between agreeing the cost with the utility companies and carrying out the work, so I imagine Network Rail had agreements in place, but the utility companies underestimated the scale of the work. But imagine trying to negotiate with 11 separate utilities companies on where cables and pipes should go.
Just as well that Network rail are not managing any major rail projects in Germany, the Stuttgart project wouldn’t be completed before 2100. In Germany during large construction projects the utilities such as gas and water are rerouted to overhead gantries, in Berlin you see long utility pipes about 4 metres above the surface, also in Stuttgart. Not sure how they manage sewage systems in these circumstances. I’d make Thames Water pay for water related works and fine them on a daily basis for any delay after the agreed completion date.
Why did they put the utilities there in the first place. It's obviously stupid to put them under a major road rather than under minor roads nearby. The should cross the railway with their own tunnel or gantry further up or down the line.
Whilst the bridge belongs to Network Rail the road underneath is still the responsibility of the local authority, so it's Oxford CC who probably allowed the utilities to be laid, but Network Rail foots the bill for the diversions
These are utilities connecting central Oxford with Botley, and there are no minor roads nearby to run them under - Botley Road is the only option. This is also why the work has been so disruptive compared to other works, because there is no alternative way around!
It is historical. Some, like water likely go back to mid Victorian times and gas not long after. Then followed electricity, telephones and so on. It is very common to have major utilities following major road routes as, among other things, the properties they serve will branch off those major routes.
If you would like to consider supporting the channel click: www.patreon.com/Chris_Rail_Focus or become a Member here on TH-cam
Or you can support the channel by making a purchase on my Redbubble gallery
www.redbubble.com/people/engphotography/shop
Or alternatively by becoming a TH-cam member
this project looks like it makes the whole of the HS2 line a breeze
This feels like a good example to point to when people say HS2 could have been routed next to the M40 instead
Indeed, HS2 is having to deal with enough motorway interfaces as it is. Running alongside the M40 would've been a nightmare.
It appears these multi-mode upgrades and expansions can be a sticky wicket nest of unknown unknowns.
Brillant Video and a clear explanation of why the project is dragging on. Love your videos - keep up the excellent work.
As someone who has been responsible for installing extra bus lanes alongside an existing highway, I can attest to the utility nightmare. They have a statutory right to install anything in the public highway, so water, electricity, gas, and particularly fibre telecoms all have to be relocated. They are allowed to install them at a lower separation under a pavement or verge so if that is to become a traffic lane or bus lane or tram lane, then they have to be lowered, at the project's expense. We get an estimate, pay the invoice in full!, up front, then the utilities start to plan the works. Some are pretty efficient and also allow our contractor to do the grunt work, only using their in-house contractor to do the specialist work. Thames Water are one of the worst and often don't even know where their mains are located (some are so old) so it is not surprising that it is TW who seem to be the problem here. Network Rail will have given them the required notice and the NR contractor will have been tearing their hair out to keep the works on track. Best of luck.
It sounds like an absolute nightmare. A guy I know recently gave me the rundown. People have commented that Network Rail should have planned the works better, but it doesn't seem like the current system allows time to properly consider all the options nor make allowances for any changes that may need to be made during work.
Thank you so much for making this video, it’s really helpful to get some insight into what is going on with the project. As you say, the disruption is immense. The city has been cut in half. If you want to go from one side of that unfinished bridge to the other, you have to drive all the way to the ring road and around and back in.
This might be a pain in the neck now, but when Oxford becomes more busy and those two terminating platforms can be turned into through platforms, passengers will be happy.
I think this also demonstrates that rail viaducts are a lot more flexible than embankments, as they provide a large number of arches that can easily be used to divert pedestrians or pipes under the railway, without the need to shut the railway down.
To route the eastern span to the terminating platforms, they will have to run the track through the middle of what is currently the main station building!
Obviously it would be a lot of work, but it's good that they appear to be providing the option now, rather than making more work should the 6th go ahead
Another cracking video Chris. hopefully NR are able to sort things out as it has seemed to have major effects to Oxford. I went to Oxford last autumn and the sheer size of the construction site is not done justice in the video! Once they complete it all with the new 5th platform though it should be a great addition for extra capacity.
Thanks. Just as this video went out it was reported that pilling is due to commence, so at the very least it seems that progress to build the bridge will be made soon.
Chris thank you for the detailed report-out at Oxford Station.
Things can _only_ get better ! 😁
This a challenging multi-mode upgrade (will it be similar to lowering Old Oak Common Lane for DD bus transit under tracks ? And similarly OOC Lane upgrade (or is that DOWN-grade, heh) then Widening the road to create new cycle and pedestrian pathways.)
Some Engineering challenges are perhaps too vague in requirements and planning ? who knows.
Cheers from across the Pond.
An interesting video - thank you. I can't help but thinking that all these problems should have been anticipated before the road was closed. As to the inverted arch, I can remember reading years ago that when the railway was built in 1850, it altered the water table so much that the road under the bridge often flooded. To resolve this, an inverted brick arch was built. So how come they've only just discovered it? It could only happen in the UK!
If capacity at Oxford Station is so tight, by all means expand it but also take some of the pressure off by extending all westbound EWR services from any starting point to terminate at either Cowley or Didcot ( ideally serving both by trains alternating throughout the day between the two ) but with every EWR train running north or south stopping at Oxford itself?
Cowley has ample room for growth and as housing pressure in Oxford is intense, what would in effect be a new town needs to be built there. The private sector developers could usefully pay the cost of building a new Cowley station with ample turnback/reversal tracks and of course re-doubling the line back to Oxford. Naturally, this line should be future-proofed, have provision for OHE electrification and allow for further extensions of the Cowley branch line ( something we only seem to be thinking about now, hence the third bridge span for a future platform 6, which will be needed as our roads clog up ).
It seems that EWR has similar ideas about Bedford, extending all westbound trains ( one day! ) that would have terminated at Bedford to call there but terminate instead at an expanded station on the Marston Vale line that will have turnback facilities but which is also a destination station in itself ( at the proposed theme park? ).
As for the epic Botley Road bodge-up of Network Rail, the council, and umpteen utilities all getting in each other's way, why can't we get projects like this right? China has, Spain has, and France has.
It seems we have good engineers ( those actually building HS2 are doing great, innovative and even beautiful work ) but our planning and management of large projects is weak and fragmented. Maybe we need to call the French or Spanish in to run things for us ( oh sorry, they are evil Europeans so we can't have them..maybe China? They love us and can't possibly have malign intentions..can they?).
4.95 metres is the maximum height of a double decker bus in the UK. The normal height in practice is about 4.45 metres. As far ad Botley Bridge goes, then the height limit was 4.11 metres, not 4 metres which allowed some double decker buses built to that height limit to be operated on that route. However, the drivers of those buses still had to be very cautious, as any excessive speed on the down slope meant that could bounce on their springs causing them to scrape the roof. I know a bus driver who drove a couple of routes down the Botley Road, and they appear to have no idea when it is going to be reopened.
As for what has happened on the Botley Road, it's yet another sign of this country's seeming inability to build anything remotely on time or budget. We can point to any number of railway projects in recent years. It was always known that, due to the proximity to the Thames, this was going to be a difficult project, but it seems that they were still unprepared.
The residents of Oxford have become somewhat resigned to this saga. Just outside Oxford on the A40 there is a vast car park which cost £51m to build, yet has remained empty for the year since it was built. It is designed for park-and-ride, but it is not connected to the road system, and it looks like it will not be operational until at least 2027. Road and other works near the Peartree roundabout by the A34 have been going on interminably for years, and some nearby work on the A44 with a cycle track and and some widening also seemed to run on and on.
The state of civil engineering in this country is shocking, and I think we are being taken to the cleaners by the big civil engineering companies. Even quite simple work seems to take forever. A zebra crossing a few tens of metres from me took 2 weeks, and the crews were packed up and gone by 3pm.
I remember the halcycon days of Tony Blair's "joined up government", where all these schemes had to be planned from the outset with all utilities involved at political level: "who is paying for this?" The Tories never wanted such schemes in the first place (austerity), and scrapped all cross-departmental consultation in order to make rebuttal easier for the politicians. So instead of a Blairite "everything planned in parallel", we now have everything planned in series, so that oops, that won't work, and oops, that won't work continually and on site. It is the reason why these complex building projects become so expensive.
Considering utilities are privatised they seem to hold a lot of power over where pipes/cables can and can't be laid. The government should just be able to say your pipe is going here, like it or lump it
Utility providers have statutory rights like they did before privatisation. It means the Contractor has to agree method statements with the service provider for diverting, altering or building over .
As someone who lives in Oxford, the whole thing is a bit of a farce however unlike most people in Oxford, I actually don't mind the cost overruns too much. Its very annoying yes because it bisects Oxford annoyedly, however the benefits are going to be very VERY good for Oxford
No electrification ?
Money, as usual. A wealth tax of just 2% on the wealth of those with assets worth over £10 million has been proposed by Labour and this could help pay for electrification, but of course, it won't happen as the wealth holders ( who drive ) will whip up support from the non - wealth holders ( who have to use public transport ), and shout it down.
Not as part of this work. But hopefully EWR electrification will mean the missing link to Didcot will also be electrified
@@adrianbaron4994
Wealth tax is a dumb idea. Would it include jewellery, pictures, race horses, shares, antiques? How would they be valued?
Labour resists the tax that would actually be effective land value tax
This road closure blocks any motor vehicle access into the centre of the city from the west, forcing you to take lengthy diversions. It has also made the Seacourt Park and Ride basically redundant as the buses now end before the bridge.
Wrightbus and Alexander Dennis buses fit under the old height.
Some buses can apparently fit, but they still had to be driven cautiously under the bridge
I'd love EWR when it goes to Cambridge, but would I still need to change twice (at Didcot Parkway and Reading)? Why can't I change once (at Bristol Parkway, Swindon or Didcot Parkway)?
They are now looking at starting/terminating the Cambridge services at Didcot Parkway
@@Rail_Focus OK, would love that! Swindon or Bristol Parkway or Bristol Temple Meads would be even better (Newport or Cardiff Central is asking too much),
See the Edinburgh Tram …
I feel like there’s no point opening the Cowley branch, Cowley has a bus to Oxford & Rail Station around every 3-7 mins, so I don’t see the point with a half hourly train. Littlemore has a good bus service aswell, buses to Oxford are around every 10-15 mins
This problem is very annoying for people who are using the 400 Bus service in Oxford (mostly Brookes students getting from Headington Campus to Harcourt Hill) as it splits that bus line in 2 causing the Harcourt campus to be essentially cut off. Having taken this many times it sucks having to do the transfer just to get to the the other side of the bridge. But here's to hoping that the new platform works because overcrowding on Platform 3 sometimes is a problem (Especially when GWR cancels trains)
Yes, thank you for the on-the-ground detail. At times engineering is difficult; especially with a high water table underfoot.
I live on becket street and it is so bad I had to take my picture and my stuff down of the walls and put my kettle on the floor
😟
@ it will take 5 years for them to sort it out as there is to many cowboys doing the work
Sounds like someone allowed the disruptive part of the work to start before there was a proper comprehensive plan.
The process is a bit convoluted, but there is only a short window between agreeing the cost with the utility companies and carrying out the work, so I imagine Network Rail had agreements in place, but the utility companies underestimated the scale of the work.
But imagine trying to negotiate with 11 separate utilities companies on where cables and pipes should go.
Just as well that Network rail are not managing any major rail projects in Germany, the Stuttgart project wouldn’t be completed before 2100. In Germany during large construction projects the utilities such as gas and water are rerouted to overhead gantries, in Berlin you see long utility pipes about 4 metres above the surface, also in Stuttgart. Not sure how they manage sewage systems in these circumstances. I’d make Thames Water pay for water related works and fine them on a daily basis for any delay after the agreed completion date.
"Until 2030..." Yeah, they might have finished the bridge works by then.
Apparently the entire £161m budget has gone already.
I can believe it, it's just worrying that not much actual work has taken place 😬
How depressing.
Still no start date for Oxford to MK trains, either.
Severe competency deficits everywhere.
Hopefully the service will be introduced in the summer 🤞
....ahhh.... Thames Water....... 🤦♂️
Why did they put the utilities there in the first place. It's obviously stupid to put them under a major road rather than under minor roads nearby. The should cross the railway with their own tunnel or gantry further up or down the line.
Whilst the bridge belongs to Network Rail the road underneath is still the responsibility of the local authority, so it's Oxford CC who probably allowed the utilities to be laid, but Network Rail foots the bill for the diversions
These are utilities connecting central Oxford with Botley, and there are no minor roads nearby to run them under - Botley Road is the only option. This is also why the work has been so disruptive compared to other works, because there is no alternative way around!
It is historical. Some, like water likely go back to mid Victorian times and gas not long after. Then followed electricity, telephones and so on. It is very common to have major utilities following major road routes as, among other things, the properties they serve will branch off those major routes.