This is one of the most comprehensive bleed tutorials I have seen, though methods vary, there is still some stuff to clear up here. The first one that will help the most people, is that shimano has made maybe 5-10 different servo wave designed hydraulic handles over the years, and each one is a bit different than the others. This tutorial is using one of the older handles, where the stock screw happens to actually do something. Rest assured there are many shimano handles where the stock screw does NADA. If that is you, you ARE NOT IMAGINING IT. That is simply due to the varying designs, all using the same exact length screw. Shame on Shimano. I sourced screws that were 2mm longer, and suddenly my XTR "free stroke" adjustment actually worked. Be aware, however, that you can only move the lever piston a short distance before you cover the secondary orifice in the piston housing. If you do cover it, your brakes will never have consistency untill you back that screw out enough to uncover it. That orifice serves to allow fluid from the master in to the brake line to compensate for pad wear, and also compensates dynamically for fluid expansion-contraction with heat, it also serves to let air out as it evolves upwards toward the handle, as it does in all brakes over time. Just going to higher elevations will allow air dissolved in the mineral oil to bubble out, and it needs somewhere to go. What is also super important to point out, is that using this method of piston advancement to shorten free stroke, also changes the servo-wave equation that Shimano is famous for in the patent world. It is a nuance, but advancing the piston with the screw creates more modulation in the system, albeit not everyone will feel it, or care. If you hate the brick wall feel of shimanos, this will lessen it a bit, and add a bit more squish modulation. This could be very important also if using magura calipers that use a very short piston rollback, for example. Shimano, by comparison has a much larger piston roll back because servo-wave moves a lot of fluid in the first part of the stroke. This shimano combination is famous for all of this as a very maintenance friendly brake, servo.wave also serves to eliminate pad rub issues because the pads are further from the rotor (large piston rollback) than other manufacturers who cannot use the servo-wave technology. I wont beat this to death, but my opinion is that if you want to shorten free stroke, do it with the caliper removal (or wheel removal) process described in the comments. If you want to tailor the handle to calipers with shorter pad rollback, use the free stroke screw to modify the servo wave curve, in turn creating a more powerful brake, as the most power is obtained from the shimano handle when it is deep in the lever stroke, or more accurately when the servo-wave cam attached to the handle has the most leverage on the piston rod.
I wish I wasn't so behind on responding to messages, so I could have thanked you sooner for such a clear and detailed explanation of the effects the bleed screw has on the system. I honestly tried to go into it a bit deeper into the mechanics of it all, but it ended up sounding like a bunch of babble, (which I already have a problem with 😉), so I decided to delete the clips and leave it at a high level. You laid it out perfectly in only a few words,👏👏👏 which I highly appreciate. Thank you for sharing your knowledge with others. 👍
That's up to you myman. what ever feels best for YOU! And don't let anyone tell you otherwise. Ride your favorites trails and try it both ways to see which feels best. just make sure to ALWAYS returns the lever to the preferred position after adjusting the freestroke
Wow! Imagine watching a 29 minute brake bleed video and being glued to the screen the entire time, wanting more at the end?! Getting ready to do a build using these brakes, and this video is a MTB Godsend! For rear brakes I would imagine you want the bike angled back in the stand, correct? Anyway, thanks for taking the time to explain everything!
Thank you very much for such a gracious comment. I'm very happy to hear you found the video informative. Yes, for the rear brake, tilt the rear end down and make sure the brake handle is at the highest point, including the cable that wraps around the headset. Take your time with the bleed, and I'm sure all will go well. Let me know if you have any other questions
Brake bleed went very well. Couple hiccups on my end where I'd let the funnel go dry and have to start over, but not a huge deal. Took my time and was done pretty quickly. Took the bike out on the trails the other day with no issues. Thanks again.
This is a very good video regarding free stroke adjustment and good explanation on bleed procedure. I would point out few potential problems that could occur while bleeding when following this: - when creating vacuum with syringe to pull oil there is a slight chance to pull in air between threads of bleed nipple bolt and caliper, this should not happen if you are careful not to unscrew more than minimum needed and threads are like new. If you pull air like this you should see it in the syringe hose but this is not always the case and there is a chance that air stays in the calipers bleed bolt and when you compress oil back from the syringe you push that bubble in the caliper and then it could be tough fight getting it out - what has not been stressed out enough is that this bleed procedure will work for most cases where air is trapped at brake leavers and caliper bleed bolt, there could be so many places trapped air could sit and this procedure will never get that air out mainly because "gravity bleeding" is not being explained/used - this procedure works better at faster flows of oil but also this has tendency to break big air bubbles in to many small bubbles (or even creating foam) which makes it harder to dislodge them from walls on calipers and hoses, if you see this happening my advice is to stop bleeding and let it rest for hours if not a day until small bubbles come together in to one big bubble If this procedure does not work for someone and they are sure brake system does not have failure point where brake system is sucking in air past seals I would strongly recommend to learn and understand how gravity affects bleed procedure. It's simple in a way that air being lighter than oil will always try to move to highest point in the system and stay there. Most common problems are air trapped in rear caliper behind pistons on the opposite side of bleed bold and or in the "bent" hose where apex of the bend is at higher level and if you don't enough oil in one push, oil will keep floating back to that high point in the hose and you will never get it out
I couldn't agree more with everything you said. I tried touching on each of these points in this video, as well as some other similar Shimano brake videos, but you're right that I should have emphasized them more. It's such a balance to try to deliver as much information as possible and keep videos relatively short at the same time (which the latter is obviously a bit of a challenge for me 😉 ). There is still a lot for me to learn when making these videos. Thank you very much for the insight. Comments like this, which can really help others have a better experience, are what I was hoping for when I decided to continue making these videos. Greatly appreciated! 👍
I completely understand that going through all the details and problems would be more like making documentary than a guidance video 😂 and most people would not watch that. My comment is to hopefully avoid having someone disliking this video or not recommending it because this method didn't solve their problem. I find it shocking how many people ride brake sets for bicycles and motorcycles are not bleed properly or at all and they complain about how bad they are. One more thing I would also mention is that wondering bite point of any brake systems is also directly related to brake pads being used and to how caliper poistons recract after releasing the brake.
@@nikolasestan2049 All I know is that the info you provided is worth gold to me, as simple as it may seem to others. I fundamentally believe in repetitive learning, and having others point out small details, whether I knew about them or not, helps with retaining information for the long term. A great example is using crow's feet. For decades, I've known that they are supposed to be used in a 90 degree manner, yet in the couple of videos I made, I had forgotten to do so. After a few people pointed this out, it's now a natural response again. To everyone out there. If there is ANYTHING that you see in a video that is either off, missing, or just plain wrong, please point it out. As much as I'd like to help others, I also like to keep learning. My only request is that it's not based on "BRO" science.
So I just bought a second hand grand canyon SLX 9.9 and the brakes were a bit too soft and needed work. So I found a video about what settings for the brakes etc. Free stroke al the way in and lever the furthest away from the handelbar. Yeah that didn't do a great job. Thanks for making the vid! I understand it a lot better now.
This comment (plus a few others) slipped through the cracks, so apologies for the late response. Very glad to hear it worked out for you. Bleeding with the free stroke fully out offers more viable options for brake feel imo. I like the options of hard and a bit harder. if you bleed in then the options are hard and a bit softer. I've never heard anyone complain that their brake are to hard. only the opposite. thanks for the comment
I've had bubbles affect performance. Originally was thinking I had a punctured bladder, but never saw any leaks. I'll give them a good bleed and see if this sorts it out. Thank you for your in depth explanation. Great video with great details
I'd say a solid bleed solves the majority of brake issues. the trick is a touch patience. Now, I will admit that a sense of OCD kicks in when it comes to me and bleeding, (especially with shocks and forks) but if your only doing this for yourself, what's an extra few minutes for what's going to be a year's worth of enjoyment. Let me know how it goes.👍
This was a fantastic guide. Would love to see more closeups though. Would help if I can see exactly what you’re talking about. It doesn’t NEED it though. Still loved it!
Thank you very much. I totally agree with you and want closer shots as well, but the GoPro has ~ 13" minimum focus distance, which makes it impossible to get close-up shots. I'm still trying to figure out a camera setup that will allow me to do this. My concern is that I get grease and oil on the GoPro during every session. It's a super easy to clean, especially with the media mod on it. Finding a mirrorless camera capable of 4K at 60 fps, plus lenses that are easy to clean, is proving to be a challenge. I don't mind spending the money, but I would hate to destroy it with grease and oil. I need to figure this out.
@@zoubtube Yeah the oil and dirt is an issue for sure. If you could find a nice camera that you like, you could always use a remote with it too so you never have to touch it. They usually let you zoom in and out to a predetermined distance with one button so you’d only have to set it up once. That will certainly help to minimise getting it too dirty. I’ve subbed now though, so hope to see more videos in the future. Cheers!
This is the most thorough brake hose air removal process ever. An extra ordinary medical syringe might help with pouring the mineral oil into the reservoir.
Glad to hear you found the video informational. I'm super behind on releasing videos due to unexpected family health issues. it's been one thing after another these past two months. If you have any questions let me know and i'll try to respond as soon as I can
Thank you for this! Excellent! I modified my SLX levers free stroke screws a while ago so I could use a flat blade screw driver instead of the U-shaped tool. Anyway, it's been a while since I've bled those brakes and this was the perfect video for doing it right. My SLX levers are now coupled to Magura MT-7 calipers. The power is simply amazing! And soooo much easier to bleed. Shigura for the win!
Thanks for the comment and I'm glad to hear the video was of some use. i'm curious to know how the slx levers compare in feel against the magura levers. it the bite more consistent through the stroke?
SLX levers with Magura calipers and Galfer purple pads, stop on a dime and do it right now. I would say the bite is very consistent and powerful throughout the stroke. I tried the Magura levers for one ride and just couldn't be satisfied with how soft the lever felt.
YUP! I'd say 99% of the time, that's how I pour it. For some reason, when I make these videos, I find that sometimes I do things that literally have me scratching my head during post. Hell, sometimes I can't help but think that I had some kind of stroke! I don't script any of this stuff, as it takes too much time. But because of this, there's so much going through my mind when making these videos that every once in a while it shorts out (though if you ask my GF I'm sure she'd say it happens more often than that! 😁 ) Thanks for watching the video and for leaving a helpful comment that will help others. It's much appreciated. 👍
I can't fault anything really here, Shimano brakes are easy to bleed, any bleed aim should be to get air out of the system, I simply funnel and syringe, pushing from calliper up to funnel, checking lever feel after a few air bubbles pop up, finished up with a lever burp, literally done in 15mins. Also alcohol spray is great for cleaning up any mineral oil spill :)
Totally agree. I always tell people to never rush the job, especially considering most people will only need to do it once a year. A few extra minutes can go a long way. The same goes for bleeding shocks, forks, etc. Once you get used to it, both Shimano and SRAM brakes bleed easily and fast. Thanks for taking the time to watch the video as well as the comment
Hello. The problem I have is that the new m8100 right hand brake lever, once pressed, does not return as quickly as the left hand brake handle. The delay is approximately 0.3 seconds. I bled the brakes, checked the piston and cylinder surface - everything is fine, but the handle is slow. What could be the reason?
I'm sorry to hear about your issues. Assuming the system is fully bled, and you're having this issue, then your best bet is to warranty the lever if it's new. Take advantage of the warranty. There is a good chance the issue is with one of the lever piston seals. There is a way to check this, but you might as well get a fresh replacement since it is not supposed to do this when new. let me know how it goes
That is totally up to you. Whatever you feel most preferred. The most important thing is to find the most comfortable position for your finger. From there, you use the free stroke to find the preferred "feel" when pulling the lever and having your brakes bite. . Just remember to ALWAYS return the lever to the same position after adjusting the free stroke
I haven't done one as its the same process but harder to record since the caliper is much further than the lever. I can try and do the rear brake on the next brake video
Im not sure if I got it right lmao. I like my brakes with the lever all the way out and the brake/ bite point as early as possible. So in order to get the earliest brake/bite point do I have to take the lever distance to the lowest and then unscrew the free stroke? After bleeding and screwing back in the free stroke screw + adjusting the lever distance to the " all the way out" position, would I then achieve my desired brake point? I hope that what I wrote makes sense or someone understands what I’m asking :D Thanks in advance
Adjust both the freestoke out, and the lever as far out as you like it. then bleed. then screw the free stroke all the way in, which will bring in the lever. then adjust the lever back out to the preferred position. this will be the most you will get out of free stroke shortening the bite point. hope this helps
To me it sounds like I say Mmmokay! never noticed I sounded like that until I stated recording this videos. then again, I never realized how many words come out of me sounding like a short circuit took place in my brain while saying them 😁
What do you think about that, when they do the full bleeding process with a bleed block installed in the caliper, then putting in the pads and the wheel and leaving the funnel on the lever, then they start pulling the lever, basically overfilling the system, saying that there won't be a vacum in the system if the pads are worn. What do you think? Will this make the brakes feel more stiff and the only down side will be that you have to bleed again if you put in new pad or it might damage the diaphragm/seals? Please share your idea about this cos' I'm in rabbit hole trying to find the best option.
This actually incorporated everything ive seen on bleeding shimano . You can follow this and be done. Only thing that i can add is if after cleaning pistons , if one or both are sluggish, just apply some brake fluid around piston AFTER cleaning. If one piston is not retracting then hold good one back with tool and let bad one come out a bit more and thoroughly clean and lube a few times and retry both pistons again. Keep going until you get improvements. Thanks for the excellent video esp the free play screw
"If one piston is not retracting then hold good one back with tool and let bad one come out a bit more and thoroughly clean and lube a few times and retry both pistons again" YES!! I couldn't agree more and I mention this to people all the time. I think I even mention in in one of my other videos. but I plan on making another brake video soon (changing the brake cable and full clean and bleed for a rear brake) where I plan to go into what you mention. 👍 Thanks for such a great comment. 👌
Thank you sir. this was a friends bike and I want to say the handlebar is a PNW but honestly don't remember. Its a standard 3.18 handlebar if that helps.
Wow !! Again super nice video !! I've seen many vid on bleeding the brakes but this free stroke explanation is pure diamond !! Thank you so much 🙌 ! I just bled both my brakes in 25 min with the free stroke properly set !! Thank you 🙏
thanks for the gracious comment. always super happy to hear that others had a good experience. Plan is to create an equivalent video that goes deep into the SRAM contact point adjustment as well 👍
totally Agree. That's how I pour it for engines as well. though I will say, This bottle design deeper than typical inward lip that has a tendency to pull oil toward the body. I've given up on it! 😁
Glad to hear the video was informative for you. In a nutshell, yes, or at least the goal is to get to the bite a bit quicker. michselpatton4105 did an excellent job explaining the finer details in his post below. I tried when recording the video, but realized I did a crappy job explaining some of the details clearly, and removed those clips during the edit. Thanks for taking the time to watch the video
I dont know If i should buy the Parktool bleed Kit or the jagwire. Parktool Looks very good and makes everything easier. I rly Love Ur Videos and Ur knowledge. U gonna make a Video someday on bleeding Magura? Thats why i wanted another Kit i have Problems to bleed the caliper With the Standard one idk IT Drives me crazy. Lg
I've never tried the Jag wire kit, so I can't speak to it outside of saying that it looks like a nice kit. My opinion on the Park tool kit is that it is too expensive, especially if you only need to service one company's brakes. The one part I love about the park tool kit is the syringe holders. I use them all the time. You can now buy them individually, which is another nice option with the park tool kits. You can buy just the parts you need for your bike/s, which will cost you much less, and add to the kit later as is needed. The one part the park tool kit that is missing is a reservoir holder. It seems like a big miss to me, especially considering the cost of the kit. A subscriber on the channel mentioned that he uses a toilet paper roll, which is a great idea, but let's face it, for ~$140, we should have to resort to something like this.
Hey there! Great video! Question; i like my lever max open, so the adjuster knob is turned all the way. When i turn my free stroke adjust, it pulls the leaver in, but i have no travel left on the adjust to bring it back. So, using the free stroke adjust doesn't help me. thoughts? I'm guessing the only thing i can do is use a thinner bleed block to get my pads in tighter to my rotor during the bleed process? Also, what;s strange, is my left (front) lever feels great, but i can't seem to get the same position on rear (all brand new parts, except rear rotor is not brand new, but surely it hasnt worn down significantly...) EDIT: (maybe i missed this step? ".... 15:44 mark in the video, after I install the bleed block, make SURE to press the lever a".. my bleed block slides in easily with the pad removed, but doesn't fall out.. idk, still strange front and rear are quite different...
If both lever is the way out you limit your options. When the lever and freestroke are both all the way out, it the farthest out the lever can go. Screwing the freestoke all the way in will bring the lever in a bit, but now you have no room to adjust the lever to the preferred position since the lever is already in its maximum extended position.. Basically, the lever needs some headroom for the free stroke to work As for bleeding with a thinner block, this can help, BUT,, it increases the chances of having too much pressure in the system, which might lead to a leak at the weap hole. I am not saying this will happen, just mentioning that there is a slight chance It is very important that you make sure both pistons move at a similar rate. They will never move perfectly together, but if the walls are clean, they should respond very close to each other. Many people skip this step, as my buddy did at the beginning of the season and complained that he couldn't get rid of the rubbing noise. I told him to go back and thoroughly clean his pistons and BOOM. Problem solved. Hopefully this helps some Thanks for the comment
thank you very much for the compliment. When prepping the caliper (cleaning the piston side walls) leave the system closed. After the bleed block is installed, compress the system so the pistons can squeeze against the bleed block, then open the reservoir port. This way you maximize the amount of oil in the system as well as center the piston for the bleed, making it easier to center to rotor to the pistons after you install the wheel when the bleed is done. 👍
@@zoubtube I think @gokkunguru is referencing the risk of puncturing the bladder in the lever with excessive pressure by pushing the pistons back in while the lever bleed screw is closed. This is a common problem with the delicate bladders in the levers (xt, xtr and saint), a very weak point in the design.
My apologies for the late response, but I'm still very behind on responding to comments. The piston can be removed without removing the free-stroke screw. Hopefully, this helps
How can one get out of the jammed situation you describe at 11:00 in the video. I'm afraid my brakes could have this issue as I got them used and the screw is currently jammed. On both levers. I suspect the previous owner had made this mistake.
My sincerest apologies for the late response, but I'm still a couple of months behind on messages. If the small bolt jams the internal lever, your best bet is to unscrew it and tap the handle to see if it loosens the lever while leaning the bike a bit on the same side as the brake handle, then screw the bolt in again. I hope this helps
Best freestroke screw explanation I've seen with those marks on paper :) Thers's one small but very CRUCIAL remark - if that wasn't you who last bled the brakes, you MUST open the lever bleed screw before pushing pistons in, or you risk puncturing the very weak shimano membrane in the lever if the brakes are overfilled. Happens more often than you think. I just do it this way every time, just in case.
Yup! I should have mentioned it, and my bad for not doing so even though I don't really practice it (though I do believe I mentioned to push piston back slowly). I need to script this stuff in order to remember to mention certain details, regardless of whether I practice them. Thogh I will say that I've done hundreds of Shimano bleeds, and only once have I come across a leaky bladder, and not during a bleed. A buddy showed up with one at the shop after a ride about a decade ago. Next bleed video, I'll make sure to mention it
It's a bit hard to see the one's that should really know their craft push dirty contaminated fluid up and out through the lever, as well as continuing to use gravity bleed. Your method here should be the industry standard and I say that because it just simply makes so much more sense. I applied this method to my own bike the other day and even though I also changed rotors and pads, my brakes have never felt this good before. Even when my bike was new I was just disappointed with the feel and bite of my brakes. Now my brakes feel like I expected brakes to feel at this price level. I know there are obviously better brakes out there, but there are also a lot worse than this. A set of M8100(with M8120 calipers) brakes should be pretty good out of the box and they can be very good with the right maintenance and rotors/pads.
Thank you so much for your gracious comment. From my perspective, the vast majority of people are only going to need to do this once a year. Taking a few extra minutes to ensure a positive bleed isn't much to ask for when considering the return. No matter the brakes, I always bleed them when new, as I do forks and shocks. Oil is cheap. Peace of mind is priceless😉 Now go out there and enjoy the season. Winter is around the corner 😉
@@zoubtube The only thing I will add to this method from now on is something that will only add a few extra minutes at the most. Just after you have cleaned the calipers inside and out with isopropyl alcohol, as well as the sidewalls of the pistons. After this has dried, you apply a thin coat of mineral oil with a q-tip(same as in the braking system) to the sidewalls of the pistons. Then cycle them in and out a few times and visually make sure they operate freely and in unison. After this I just apply isopropyl alcohol on a new q-tip and wipe off any excess mineral oil inside the caliper that shouldn't be there. After this you just proceed to throw in the bleedblock and continue on with the rest.
I'm glad to hear that you found the video helpful. As for the bleed screw after the bleed, it's totally up to you. The freestroke screw offers nothing more than a minor adjustment in feel. This is a personal thing that you will need to test on your own to see what your preference is. The one thing to remember is to adjust the lever to your preferred position after adjusting the freestroke screw, as it will move the lever. The effects are minor, and it will most likely take a few rides on trails you are very familiar with to feel the difference, so feel free to play with the freestroke at will. You won't break anything in the process. But again, remember to reposition the lever after you adjust it.
Thank you very much for the thoughtful comment. Always an internal battle with me with trying to add as much info, but keep the videos short. why do I always feel like I'm losing one of those battles 😁
I am very glad to hear that the video was informative for you. If you want even more info on how this all works, look at michselpatton4105 post below. I attempted to explain these additional details, but failed to do so clearly and deleted the clips. He does an excellent job of explaining the finer details of the system. Thanks for taking the time to watch the video
I don't understand. I have a XTR 4 pistons M9120. Some people are telling me the screw needs to come out in order for brakes to grab quicker snd shorter distance. Is this correct?
in the video I try to explain how the free stroke works. it basically moves the lever piston forward as can be seen in this video. by doing this, it also shortens the distance of the lever throw in order to fully lock the brakes (~1 cm shorter), which is also seen in this video. basically, it adds pressure to the system, so don't think of it as actually moving the caliper pistons (which I've technically never measured, but pretty sure it doesn't do at all (might make for a good future video)). Think of it as adding pressure to the system in order for the caliper pistons to more quickly lock the pads to the rotor (hence the shorter lever throw) I would bleed the brakes as mentioned in this video, with the free stroke out. then go for rides at your favorite trials and reposition the free stroke on different days, make sure you DON'T forget to put the lever back to the preferred position everytime you move the free stroke or else it will not do anything for you. in ONLY works when the lever is put back to YOUR preferred position, which can be different for each hand btw (I so wish I mentioned this in the video). the free stroke is very subtle but will be noticeable over time, you might like with with quicker bite, you might not. Just like to many features on mountain bikes, this is personal preference and don't let anyone convince you otherwise 👍
👍 Just remember, it all starts with your preferred handle distance, always return the handle to the same distance. and don't expect drastic change. The change is very subtle, as it was designed to be, and you really should decide after a few rides on your favorite trails going back and forth between the in and out position. pay attention to down hill turns and tight a windy technical sections. that's where I felt it most with the back wheel
Thank you thank you thank you 🙏 just bought some XTs and couldn't work out the best process for adjusting free stroke. You're explanation was pure gold 👍
Glad you found it helpful. highly recommend taking the time to see which free stroke screw position works best for you. Most people expect an immediate response. it not. it becomes noticeable over time after going back and forth on trial you know well. Eventually you will find the sweet spot that will feel right for you. 👍
Thanks. the effect the free stroke has is very subtle, but noticeable once you try it a few times. the biggest issue I find is people don't adjust the handle after they adjust the screw. one doesn't work without the other.
The push-pull method works well on my front brake but not my back brake. I used a tip mentioned elsewhere which was to use a bike stand to keep the bike upright so that the rear caliper is lowest (and closed off) and the brake lever bleed port is at the top. I then screw a tube with a bit of fluid in it into the bleed port (brake lever horizontal and tube open ended). I then gently tap, beginning at the caliper, along the hose all the way to the brake lever. I then leave it overnight and the next morning I remove the hose, re-seal the bleed port and hey-presto, a solid brake lever. Another tip to prevent air getting in at the caliper bleed screw is to put thick grease around the threaded part.
Thanks for sharing your experience with everyone. I couldn't agree more with you, and I believe I posted a rear brake video that talks to tilting the bike to assist with the bleed. First time and Heard of applying grease to the ports screws. Might give it a shot for next season. 👍
You are exchanging volume and pressure incorrectly interchangeably. Changing the free stroke adjustment change the position of the master piston in the lever assembly. CORRECT! But that effects VOLUME of fluid in the master cylinder of the lever, NOT PRESSURE. There is no pressure until the system is closed and in use with master piston moving in the master cylinder against the brake pads on the rotors system closed. Extra fluid VOLUME restores free stroke adjustment to original setup position before pads start wearing. Everything everything in the video is correct except for the misuse of pressure and volume. But that’s a big error in expressing the understanding of hydraulics to someone else with no education of that subject. Still…. Great video.
"misuse of pressure and volume" I'll by that. I tend to mix up words occasionally. I really should script this stuff. Someone recently pointed out that I was saying hydro instead of hygro. Definitely my bad.
Very good video finally someone does it right! Shimanos free stroke is more than capable just never let out on people's videos for it to work! I done it this way last week my new XT 4 pot 203m bite is amazing now, no crushing fingers!
SUPER glad to hear that it all worked out well for you. And thank you very much for leaving a comment and letting me know. Now it's time to reap the rewards! Now go out there and crush a run for me because I've been out of town on work travel lately, and I'm itching to get back for a ride. There's only so much walking I can do without my mind driving me nuts!
Uploader could you possibly put some more longer ads. They are almost as long as the video. Definitely not subscribing to or watching more videos with these ads 👎👎👎sorry but it's just greed and since it's all your own content the ads are down to the uploader
You really are an awesome ANGRY biker. If I could, I would add more and longer adds, but only for you 😁 Dude, Complain to youtube! The ONLY control I have is the click of an on/off button. THEY are the ones that determine what adds get played, how many get played, when they get played, how long they will be, etc, per person. And trust me when I say that I'm not to worried about your .000000000000000021 cents out of the $3 a month the channel makes. Shit, if it was up to me, AAAAALL the adds would be 5 minute bikini ads, I'd get at least $6 a month for that I'm sure! 😁. I make these videos for my friends and those who would like to perform certain jobs but can use a bit of a confidence booster in order to do them. That's my target, if they are to long for you, there's other videos out there, enjoy! 👍
Im in a position where if the brakes are close to my grip, and i one finger brake, it smushes my other finger. I got the lever throw all the way out. Do I need more oil in the line or something? otherwise I had to scoot the brakes further away from the grip, but that also puts my shifters kinda far away. What am I missing. If I just 2 finger brake then Im fine but what the heck thanks?
Interesting. If I was to guess, I would say you have air in the system. If the lever is all the way out, (which unless you have like really big hands it shouldn't be) and you are able to hit your fingers when pulling the lever,, that shouldn't happen when properly bled, or at least I've never seen this with Shimano brakes. I'd bleed the brake since it's easy and relatively quick, take your time though and make sure all the air comes out of the system and try it again. please keep me updated. thanks
Fantastic explanation and again a very informative video. I have the XT brake system and the free stroke confused me even after other videos but your explanation just hit the nail on the head. Thank you. please keep the videos coming.
Very glad to hear you found it helpful. The plan is to keep making videos but at the moment I'm WAY behind making them due to some unexpected family health issues as well as other issues. I'll get back on track soon. 👍
Very good video my friend! Just a quick question, I have a pair of SLX brakes, that are identical but the free stroke screw has a diferent head, I was thinking of changing them to a philips or even hex head screws, I know the thread is an M4, but i'm not quite sure on the length, could you please enlighten me on that measure? Thank you!
Thanks for the kind words. You'll need a U-shaped spanner like the following: amzn.to/4amUEq6 to remove the bolt (you might have to shave it a bit to fit, I made my own with a flat head bit and a dremel). If memory serves me correctly, I believe a 10mm m4 works. I could be a bit off, so I would buy a 10 and 12mm stainless steel m4. Remember not to force the bolt in too deep. Once it naturally stops, you're done.
Hello, Thank you for the video. If you decrease the free stroke (thread the free stroke bolt in more), will this bring you pads at the callipers closer all the time (when you are not braking)? I have hydraulic disc brakes on the mtb (MT8000) and road (R8100). I like to have as less free stroke as possible, but I want to avoid brake rub more then having less free stroke. Thank you for the help! (I'm not having brake rub at the moment, but when I ride in the dirty rainy conditions, it does rub).
I've never measured to see if the pistons actually move forward when the free stroke is screwed all the way in from the all the way out position with a caliper. (Maybe do this for a future video?) The way I see it is it is more of a pressure response. When bleeding the system with the free stroke all the way out, you are maximizing the amount of oil in the system. From there, when you screw in the free stroke, you are "slightly" increasing pressure in the system, basically you need less lever travel to get the same response. Whether that increase in pressure is enough to "actually move" the pistons,,, I've never actually measured with a precise tool to say for sure. But I do know that if you want more lever stroke, or software feel, then bleed the brake with the free stroke all the way in, then unscrew the free stroke. This will be the least amount of pressure possible in the system.
Great video! But, I have a question. I just blead my breaks, and I came back to it a couple days later, and it drained a lot out. I tightened the caps on the top, and the bottom, but it was leaking out from within the break. Do you think a o ring could of broke within the break? Thanks
Thanks for the comment. So you're losing pressure but you see no signs of oil outside the system? first Check for a cracked piston, check for an oil leak on the piston seals. check under the hood that covers the hose to lever connection, check the inner side of the lever where the shaft pushes the piston and check around the reservoir cap on the side. Best way to check the above with remove the wheel and pads, install a block and pulse the lever with good pressure. this will let you know if your losing immediate pressure and give you some sign of where it might be coming from. let me know how it goes There is no seal that would fail in the system that would create an internal leak that would lose significant pressure. seals that fail will show signs of failures externally, but sometime they can be very deceiving and not immediately noticeable.
@@zoubtube I just took out the break pads and when I squeezed the breaks, a lot of oil would come out from the pistons. Also, I saw remanence of oil in the breaks. I am probably going to take it to a shop, but thanks for the help.
@@hollisterwithtomo504 piston or the seals are worn, check around the cylinder for any dents or burrs, I had this problem with my slx m675 on one side, be prepared to get messy and pump the pistons out correctly, new seal and piston , doesn't need to be ceramic piston, I did get a little oil showing after but i think it just needed a few pumps to set the seal in around the piston, no leaks since.
Thank you for this great explanation of free-stroke! Most other vids ignore it entirely. I've heard many conflicting versions of what it does and your video made it clear!
Super glad to hear you found it helpful. The two key takeaways on adjusting free stroke is always return the lever to your prefered position, and it's all about what's most comfortable for you, based on the trials you ride. 👍
I recommend that you pour the mineral oil from the container with the handle parallel to the handlebars instead of perpendicular to it, I assure you that it will be much easier to avoid spills. Sorry for my English, thanks for the video.
YUP! I totally agree, and it's how I've been doing it for YEARS! One thing I've noticed since I started making these videos is that there have been many times that I've deviated on some of the details from how I normally do things. Usually, it's just me, in a quiet room, taking my time while working on a bike. When recording, the entire dynamic changes. I start overthinking things, constantly feel like I'm in a rush, always think of how a clip turns out, have to work around lights and cameras, etc. LOTS of distraction. I just need to get more used to the recording part, but again, you are right as to pouring the oil from the bottle
Excellent tutorial! I’m not sure why shimano call it one way bleed though . I did get the plastic holder for the reservoir cup with a cheap kit, indispensable
Thank you very much. glad you found it helpful. I look at shimano like an aircraft carrier. lots of firepower but VERY slow to turn. 😉 It takes alot for this company to make a change, or to admit that they should have looked at things differently.
Apologies for the late response. A #2 should work fine. Checks to see if the head is stripped. Unfortunately, bike companies don't use the strongest metals. If the head is not stripped, is it possible that the screw was fully removed at some point and crossed-threaded when installed again? There's a slight possibility that it jammed internally, as mentioned at the beginning of the video, but that's a slight chance.
So I was doing a bleed and for some reason I couldn’t pull the fluid out with the syringe, had reservoir on top and it was open and then syringe and bleed port opened and no matter what pushing or pulling it wouldn’t move , any idea why ?
I've seen this happen a few times before and in every case it what the piston that was jammed due to the level being pulled to deep when the system was open, many times by mistake. If nothing else works, separate the lever from the cable, use a 1.5 allen to push the piston back, connect the cable to lever and try bleeding again. let me know how it goes.
a question please : what about the lever position adjustment , how should it be during a bleed ? is it all the way out like the stroke ajustment or in , or it doesnt matter thanks in advance
I bring both lever and free stroke out. Just make sure to measure both before moving them, lever with a measuring tape or ruler from handlebar, free stroke by counting the turns. (unless it was at the all the way in position when you started). When done, bring the return the free stroke to where it was, then do the same to the lever.
This is typically a sign of too much pressure, which could be based on multiple reasons. But it doesn't necessarily mean the system is damaged. The job of the weep hole is to equalize pressure when needed. What you will most likely have to do is remove the cap and the bladder. I have a video that shows how to do it (I believe it is the M9100 brake video). You don't need to disassemble the lever to do this. Once removed. Check the bladder. If there is no damage, re-install it. Make sure the bladder and cap are seated correctly (this is VERY important). If the bladder does have visible damage, like a hole, clean it with alcohol, then apply glue; crazy glue, gorilla glue, etc. Again, When installing, make absolutely sure that the bladder and the cap are seated correctly, as shown in the video.
So the people putting vids up stating that freestroke is pointless and to set up by removing the wheel and slightly pulling the lever to closen the pads do not understand the system?.
I'm not sure if I would say they don't understand the system, as much as have higher expectations of what it can do. Both freestroke and SRAM's contact point adjustments are VERY subtle. It takes a few rides on VERY familiar trails to feel the difference, IMO. Also, The vast majority of people I've come across don't adjust freesroke correctly. They were unaware that the lever position is affected by adjusting the freestroke. If the lever isn't brought back to the exact preferred position after adjusting freestroke, it will literally have zero effect. This is the key adjustment to make in order to feel the effects of the adjustment
All of the videos I saw seem to show more info than needed and make me more confused. For example, you sucked out the bad fluid in the 1st stage-makes Sense. After getting rid of it, you fill the syringe with new fluid, and push it back-that's ok as well. Why do you keep playing with the new fluid back and forth now? This should go up with no bubbles and that's it, am I wrong?
Good question. Just like in a syringe, small air bubbles can potentially stick to the walls of a brake system. To add to that, brake systems have very small holes that the oil needs to flow through, especially in the caliper, which can be seen in a video I made a while back where I change the pistons in a Shimano caliper. An air bubble can get stuck in front of one of these holes, allowing oil to flow around it. By agitating the system (gently pushing and pulling the syringe during the bleed process), it helps move air bubbles that might potentially be stuck on the walls. Think of it as a belt and suspenders approach to bleeding brakes. This goes for all brakes. It takes an extra minute or two, but it is worth the added assurance. Hopefully, this will help better explain the reasoning.
This is totally up to you base don what feel better for you. Take a few rides on your favorite trails testing the brakes with the the screw both in and out. just remember to reposition the lever to your prefered position each time after adjusting the screw. this is the most important part. It will most likely take a few ride before you feel a different as the distance is subtle. In the end, which ever feels better for you is where you should keep it
I've found having the freestroke screw all the way in causes the initial pull to be longer than subsequent pulls (pumps up). With the screw all the way out the pull amount is consistent. Bled with the screw wound out.
I'm happy to hear that you are at least putting an effort to see what feels best for you. 💪👏👏Most people I come across are afraid to touch it. Just remember, there is no right answer. Whatever feels best for YOU on the trials you mainly ride is all that matters. 👍
@@zoubtube Sure. I should be clear that I only saw the issue when I bled the brakes with the screw fully out, and then after finishing the bled screwing it all the way back in. I compared this with my SLX brakes which have the screw all the way in from factory and you need a special tool to wind it out. I also couldn't find anything in the Shimano bleed documentation about winding the screw out prior to bleeding. I enjoy playing with all the options and finding what works best for me. Happy trails.
@@zoubtube thanks. much appreciated. i indeed have a question. one of my brake levers needs service and i am not sure what to do. the big screw to adjust the lever position is stuck. when i try to move it in any direction it doesnt move. any ideas how to adress that?
@@ephraimki7783 if the reach adjustments screw move clockwise or counterclockwise and nothing happen than chances are its stripped, though I can't say for sure without seeing it. If this is the case, you should be able to find lever handle replacements for it. it not hard to swap out. let me know how it goes
Technically yes, but I wouldn't expect to feel a drastic difference. I find SRAM brakes are designed with modulation in mind. Shimano, not as much. Chances are you will feel a touch more feathering at the mid-stroke, but the end will be an abrupt stop as usual. Just remember to return the handle to the same position after adjusting the screw, or else it doesn't do anything.
@@zoubtube thanks for the response! if i were to want more modulation for nose pivots and rolling stoppies, should i look into switching to sram? are the sram levers/masters compatible with the shimano calipers? i'm running m8000 xt atm.
@@floppywonka That's a tough one. In my experience, SRAM brakes provide more modulation in general. They offer a greater band of pressure before the hard bite. Some people like the feel of this; others don't. Expertise aside, a wider band of pressure will help with control. I like having a wider band of pressure available when riding very technical stuff. If you feel that it's difficult to find a comfortable level of control when performing a stoppie for instance, because the brake locks or gets too close to locking quickly, then you might want to consider trying an SRAM brake. I guarantee that you will feel a difference; what I can't say is if you will like the difference in feel. It's a very personal thing.
@@zoubtube awesome, thanks again for your view on this. i play bike polo and there's a lot of stopping quick from a relatively fast speed, nose pivots, and other bike handling maneuvers that require good front brake control. there's no rear brake on this bike so everything's done with the front. i got my m80000 xt setup used from a friend but it feels pretty wooden and grabby. this is my first experience with hydraulic brakes on a bicycle tho so i just assumed that's how they are. maybe i'll keep an eye out for a sram setup to try. do you have a recommendation to which sram setup i should look for? thanks again!
My limitation is only having experience with shimano and sram brakes. For that type of application, you might want to consider Magura Brakes. Seems to me Magura is popular with free style type riding. If you choose SRAM, I would get a brake with contact point adjustment (ex: rsc, ultimate etc) for fine tuning.
I never tried it so I can't be absolutely sure, but my guess is you can't. You would need to change more than just the lever. the push rod to the piston in the 9100 is attached directly to the lever handle. The pushrod on the 9120 sits on a barrel which contacts the level body (7:32 in the video). the 9100 won't have the seat of the barrel to sit in on the lever body. Because of this I can't see it working. I have another video that shows the 9100 disassembled. If you compare the two you will see the differences on how the levers connect to their pushrods
Wow.. thank you ! The best bleed tutorial on youtube !! I did two times the bleeding and somehow i had a “soft” break lever afterwards. Once i unscrewed the free stroke screw and perform the bleeding again.. my break system it is as good as new ! Thank you again !
I'm super happy to hear the video was helpful for you, and I'm glad that it all went well. It might not be the quickest method out there, but brakes are one of those services where a few extra minutes to ensure a good bleed can go a long way. Now go out there and enjoy the season! 👍
Apologies for the late response. Yes, but that's just my preference. most important is what feels comfortable for you. Brake feel is a personally thing. go back and forth with adjustments until you find what feels best for you 👍
I recently did a routine bleed on the slx m7100 brake, as I've done loads of times before but when I pulled the lever with a bit of pressure, (not too much).....I blew out the seal on the lever. This also happened on the 2nd lever I got. What the Hell happened????
Apologies for the late response, and I am sorry to hear about the issue. But just so I'm clear, which seal are you referring to? There are about four seals on that lever, not including the olive. Where is the oil leaking from?
@@damienmitchell3080 So it's the cap at the end of the reservoir. If yes, then its possible that there is/was too much pressure in the system when bleeding. Did you bleed using the proper bleed block in the caliper? Did you start the bleed with worn pads, then changed the pads to new pads after the bleed? What you can try is to remove the cap and bladder in order to check the bladder. (I have another video that shows this process in detail: th-cam.com/video/yoHH7qV3dIc/w-d-xo.html. Only follow the part that removes the cap) To do this, you need to remove the set screw that is holding the cap. Once removed, use a small Allen key to remove the cap through the set screw hole. Take your time; don't force it; it will come out. When the cap is removed, remove the bladder. Inspect it to make sure there is no damage. If there is damage to it (typically from too much pressure), it needs to be replaced. If all looks well, reassemble correctly. Make sure the bladder AND the cap are sitting in the right position, then redo the bleed as seen in the video. Make sure to a proper bleed block, and don't change worn pads for new pads after a bleed. This needs to be done before a bleed. Keep me updated 👍
Awesome vid. This is how I've been doing it after trying many different techniques. I still notice the the bite point changes as the pads and rotors heat up. Cool down and returns to original bite point. All 3 of my bikes do this. Is this just how shimano brakes are, or is there a fix?
Apologies for the delayed response. To answer your question, "Is this just how shimano brakes are?" For the most part, Yup! As far as I know, there is no absolute fix for a wondering bite point. Though the feel is very inconsistent, as in even if you had multiple pairs of the same model brake, you might feel it a lot with one brake, and yet with the other, you will rarely feel it. Making sure you have air out of the system will definitely help, so check the bleed port periodically through the season and top off the handle when needed
@@zoubtube I do notice it's usually the rear brake that this happens to. But I tend to drag that more than the front on down hill runs. If I top off the fluid without using the bleed block the bite point is slightly more consistent. Just be sure to not push the pistons back unless the fill port is open.
So you are essentially overfilling the system to get a better bite point. I’ve done this and it works but I also wondered when the fluid heats up there is no expansion room in the system and the brake could lock? Hasn’t happened to me this far with general trail riding but perhaps on a gravity focused bike with really hard brake use it could be a problem? Just conjecture. And yes when you install new pads and push the pistons back in you need to open the system with the cup installed to remove excess fluid.
@@zoubtube I meant, it's not going to give you any option to change the bite point. How can I get a better bite point. I suspect I can't without pushing the pistons out (which isn't ideal)
Thanks for the kind comments, and I'm glad you found the video helpful. As for the drivers, the one with the orange handle I bought on Amazon a while ago; below is a link. I love this thing. Great grip, strong magnet, super versatile, and it lets me change bits easily, and if a bit goes bad, I can buy just that bit. www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0972SYPTJ/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1 as for the driver with the blue handle. The driver is about 40 years old. It has been used and abused COUNTLESS times, and it still works flawlessly on just about any phillips head. I don't know what kind of steel they used back then, but I wish they kept using it today.😉
@@Les_GrossmanNo worries. Many of these drivers look the same, and except for my torque wrenches. I don't really get attached to my tools. 😉 But that blue driver phillips driver in the video is literally from the 70's. I'm not kidding when I say this thing has been totally abused by both me and my dad before me. Barely any wear on the edges. Need to remove a partially striped 4" #8 screw from a 2x6,, No problem! Need a punch,, Hammer away! I'm convinced it will outlive me, like it did my dad! 😁 The orange-handled one fits my palm comfortably, has a good grip with greasy hands, and has a strong magnet. I was VERY skeptical when I bought it, as most of these usually have crap magnets. Amazon reviews were accurate with this one. For $10, it was worth it, and I use it more than I do T-handles. I will say I've been pretty disappointed with park tools these past few years. I plan on making a video on this eventually. 👍
Yup. my guess is the screw was pulled out to far at one point, and the mechanism seen in the video that it connects to got jammed on the side of it after it was screwed back in. I could be wrong but if the free stroke screw is jammed, there's not much that can cause it. try taking a pick and gently move it around to see if that works
@@vin374 WOW! It really shouldn't be that tight. Give it some force and try and break it loose (make sure to use a phillips head that fits properly). it's literally just a screw that goes in out. Unless they messed up at the factory, then there really isn't anything to break
Man, I was really hoping the freestroke adjustment would make these levers feel nice but nope. The amount of travel before they actually bite is insane for an XT model. I had magura trail sl brakes and they felt amazing but I couldn't stand the constant rotor noise from magura rotors (they warp easy) and the super small pad clearance so it was just constant rubbing from warped rotors that would take hours to true by eye.
Freestroke, as well as contact point adjustment, are very subtle. In no way will the difference be drastic. Both are a small tweak to the system in order to provide the option of a more comfortable feel either way. In order to get more bite you can try a wider rotor, bleed with a thinner bleed block, or even move to a larger rotor or larger brakes in general. I would try bleeding with a thinner bleed block first to see how it feels for you. If there is a bit of a warp in the rotor, you will have to adjust it when doing this, so you won't hear the rubbing
@@zoubtubeI did see a video that a guy said to remove the rotor and pull the lever to bring the pistons in closer which I may try. I used a magura rotor and that did make it feel better as they are slightly thicker than shimano rotors but they warp so easy.
Best way to adjust bite point: 1) remove the caliper bolts, 2) lift caliper off rotor. 3) squeeze the pistons closer then slide caliper back on rotor. Check to see if you like the bite point, if you do… 4) clamp the caliper back on. (If your pistons came out too much, use a plastic tire lever or bleed block to pry them open until you get bite point just right. 😉👍
I just put a bit of positive pressure in the system with the syringe and then close it off. It makes a world of difference in pad engagement with less lever travel.
could be a couple of things, still have air trapped ( try a burping from lever only ), loose or bad fitting on lever or brake ( check for any oil around connections ), shimano wandering bite, leak from pistons.
@zoubtube @zoubtube I do actually. Does the free stroke feature work with newly installed pre bled brakes, or do they need to be topped off with the screw in the out position to get functionality? I'm not very tech savvy but these new xtr brake levers take way too long to engage their bite point in my opinion. Would love to be able to move that point away from the bars more
@@thereignofthezero225 The free stroke works at all time. It's just a question of how effective it will be. Technically, if you bleed the system with the bleed screw out, you will be adding a bit more oil to the system. This, in turn, will create a bit more pressure when dialing the free stroke screw all the way in than if you were to bleed the system with the free stroke screw in. But this can potentially have a negative effect, which is brake rub, especially if you have newer pads and rotors. My assumption is Shimano recommends bleeding with the free stroke in order to avoid this. If you find that you still want a quicker bite, then two other options are to bleed the system with a thinner bleed block or install a wider rotor. Both of these will accomplish this, but again, there is the potential for brake rub.
Thanks. rider preference. the freestroke (as well as contact point adjustment) is a personal thing. It's all about YOUR comfort. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. just remember, both freestroke and CPA offer a subtle difference or minor tweak, not drastic.
This is one of the most comprehensive bleed tutorials I have seen, though methods vary, there is still some stuff to clear up here. The first one that will help the most people, is that shimano has made maybe 5-10 different servo wave designed hydraulic handles over the years, and each one is a bit different than the others. This tutorial is using one of the older handles, where the stock screw happens to actually do something. Rest assured there are many shimano handles where the stock screw does NADA. If that is you, you ARE NOT IMAGINING IT. That is simply due to the varying designs, all using the same exact length screw. Shame on Shimano. I sourced screws that were 2mm longer, and suddenly my XTR "free stroke" adjustment actually worked. Be aware, however, that you can only move the lever piston a short distance before you cover the secondary orifice in the piston housing. If you do cover it, your brakes will never have consistency untill you back that screw out enough to uncover it. That orifice serves to allow fluid from the master in to the brake line to compensate for pad wear, and also compensates dynamically for fluid expansion-contraction with heat, it also serves to let air out as it evolves upwards toward the handle, as it does in all brakes over time. Just going to higher elevations will allow air dissolved in the mineral oil to bubble out, and it needs somewhere to go. What is also super important to point out, is that using this method of piston advancement to shorten free stroke, also changes the servo-wave equation that Shimano is famous for in the patent world. It is a nuance, but advancing the piston with the screw creates more modulation in the system, albeit not everyone will feel it, or care. If you hate the brick wall feel of shimanos, this will lessen it a bit, and add a bit more squish modulation. This could be very important also if using magura calipers that use a very short piston rollback, for example. Shimano, by comparison has a much larger piston roll back because servo-wave moves a lot of fluid in the first part of the stroke. This shimano combination is famous for all of this as a very maintenance friendly brake, servo.wave also serves to eliminate pad rub issues because the pads are further from the rotor (large piston rollback) than other manufacturers who cannot use the servo-wave technology. I wont beat this to death, but my opinion is that if you want to shorten free stroke, do it with the caliper removal (or wheel removal) process described in the comments. If you want to tailor the handle to calipers with shorter pad rollback, use the free stroke screw to modify the servo wave curve, in turn creating a more powerful brake, as the most power is obtained from the shimano handle when it is deep in the lever stroke, or more accurately when the servo-wave cam attached to the handle has the most leverage on the piston rod.
I wish I wasn't so behind on responding to messages, so I could have thanked you sooner for such a clear and detailed explanation of the effects the bleed screw has on the system. I honestly tried to go into it a bit deeper into the mechanics of it all, but it ended up sounding like a bunch of babble, (which I already have a problem with 😉), so I decided to delete the clips and leave it at a high level. You laid it out perfectly in only a few words,👏👏👏 which I highly appreciate. Thank you for sharing your knowledge with others. 👍
Do you have to screw the freestroke screw back in after bleeding? That was the best explanation I've ever seen so far.
That's up to you myman. what ever feels best for YOU! And don't let anyone tell you otherwise. Ride your favorites trails and try it both ways to see which feels best. just make sure to ALWAYS returns the lever to the preferred position after adjusting the freestroke
Wow! Imagine watching a 29 minute brake bleed video and being glued to the screen the entire time, wanting more at the end?! Getting ready to do a build using these brakes, and this video is a MTB Godsend! For rear brakes I would imagine you want the bike angled back in the stand, correct? Anyway, thanks for taking the time to explain everything!
Thank you very much for such a gracious comment. I'm very happy to hear you found the video informative. Yes, for the rear brake, tilt the rear end down and make sure the brake handle is at the highest point, including the cable that wraps around the headset. Take your time with the bleed, and I'm sure all will go well. Let me know if you have any other questions
Brake bleed went very well. Couple hiccups on my end where I'd let the funnel go dry and have to start over, but not a huge deal. Took my time and was done pretty quickly. Took the bike out on the trails the other day with no issues. Thanks again.
This is a very good video regarding free stroke adjustment and good explanation on bleed procedure. I would point out few potential problems that could occur while bleeding when following this:
- when creating vacuum with syringe to pull oil there is a slight chance to pull in air between threads of bleed nipple bolt and caliper, this should not happen if you are careful not to unscrew more than minimum needed and threads are like new. If you pull air like this you should see it in the syringe hose but this is not always the case and there is a chance that air stays in the calipers bleed bolt and when you compress oil back from the syringe you push that bubble in the caliper and then it could be tough fight getting it out
- what has not been stressed out enough is that this bleed procedure will work for most cases where air is trapped at brake leavers and caliper bleed bolt, there could be so many places trapped air could sit and this procedure will never get that air out mainly because "gravity bleeding" is not being explained/used
- this procedure works better at faster flows of oil but also this has tendency to break big air bubbles in to many small bubbles (or even creating foam) which makes it harder to dislodge them from walls on calipers and hoses, if you see this happening my advice is to stop bleeding and let it rest for hours if not a day until small bubbles come together in to one big bubble
If this procedure does not work for someone and they are sure brake system does not have failure point where brake system is sucking in air past seals I would strongly recommend to learn and understand how gravity affects bleed procedure. It's simple in a way that air being lighter than oil will always try to move to highest point in the system and stay there. Most common problems are air trapped in rear caliper behind pistons on the opposite side of bleed bold and or in the "bent" hose where apex of the bend is at higher level and if you don't enough oil in one push, oil will keep floating back to that high point in the hose and you will never get it out
I couldn't agree more with everything you said. I tried touching on each of these points in this video, as well as some other similar Shimano brake videos, but you're right that I should have emphasized them more. It's such a balance to try to deliver as much information as possible and keep videos relatively short at the same time (which the latter is obviously a bit of a challenge for me 😉 ). There is still a lot for me to learn when making these videos.
Thank you very much for the insight. Comments like this, which can really help others have a better experience, are what I was hoping for when I decided to continue making these videos. Greatly appreciated! 👍
I completely understand that going through all the details and problems would be more like making documentary than a guidance video 😂 and most people would not watch that. My comment is to hopefully avoid having someone disliking this video or not recommending it because this method didn't solve their problem.
I find it shocking how many people ride brake sets for bicycles and motorcycles are not bleed properly or at all and they complain about how bad they are.
One more thing I would also mention is that wondering bite point of any brake systems is also directly related to brake pads being used and to how caliper poistons recract after releasing the brake.
@@nikolasestan2049 All I know is that the info you provided is worth gold to me, as simple as it may seem to others. I fundamentally believe in repetitive learning, and having others point out small details, whether I knew about them or not, helps with retaining information for the long term.
A great example is using crow's feet. For decades, I've known that they are supposed to be used in a 90 degree manner, yet in the couple of videos I made, I had forgotten to do so. After a few people pointed this out, it's now a natural response again.
To everyone out there. If there is ANYTHING that you see in a video that is either off, missing, or just plain wrong, please point it out. As much as I'd like to help others, I also like to keep learning. My only request is that it's not based on "BRO" science.
So I just bought a second hand grand canyon SLX 9.9 and the brakes were a bit too soft and needed work.
So I found a video about what settings for the brakes etc. Free stroke al the way in and lever the furthest away from the handelbar. Yeah that didn't do a great job.
Thanks for making the vid! I understand it a lot better now.
This comment (plus a few others) slipped through the cracks, so apologies for the late response. Very glad to hear it worked out for you. Bleeding with the free stroke fully out offers more viable options for brake feel imo. I like the options of hard and a bit harder. if you bleed in then the options are hard and a bit softer. I've never heard anyone complain that their brake are to hard. only the opposite. thanks for the comment
@@zoubtube don't apologize haha, no need to. I'm just thankful for your upload and explanation. Have a good one!
This answers the question I had about the free stroke. Thank you
Thanks for the comment and I'm glad to hear that you found the video helpful. If you have any questions let me know 👍
I've had bubbles affect performance. Originally was thinking I had a punctured bladder, but never saw any leaks. I'll give them a good bleed and see if this sorts it out. Thank you for your in depth explanation. Great video with great details
I'd say a solid bleed solves the majority of brake issues. the trick is a touch patience. Now, I will admit that a sense of OCD kicks in when it comes to me and bleeding, (especially with shocks and forks) but if your only doing this for yourself, what's an extra few minutes for what's going to be a year's worth of enjoyment. Let me know how it goes.👍
This was a fantastic guide. Would love to see more closeups though. Would help if I can see exactly what you’re talking about. It doesn’t NEED it though. Still loved it!
Thank you very much. I totally agree with you and want closer shots as well, but the GoPro has ~ 13" minimum focus distance, which makes it impossible to get close-up shots. I'm still trying to figure out a camera setup that will allow me to do this. My concern is that I get grease and oil on the GoPro during every session. It's a super easy to clean, especially with the media mod on it. Finding a mirrorless camera capable of 4K at 60 fps, plus lenses that are easy to clean, is proving to be a challenge. I don't mind spending the money, but I would hate to destroy it with grease and oil. I need to figure this out.
@@zoubtube Yeah the oil and dirt is an issue for sure. If you could find a nice camera that you like, you could always use a remote with it too so you never have to touch it. They usually let you zoom in and out to a predetermined distance with one button so you’d only have to set it up once. That will certainly help to minimise getting it too dirty. I’ve subbed now though, so hope to see more videos in the future. Cheers!
This is the most thorough brake hose air removal process ever. An extra ordinary medical syringe might help with pouring the mineral oil into the reservoir.
Thank you very much for the gracious feedback. It's much appreciated 👍
Love your videos, man! I just bought a 2020 Giant Reign and plan on servicing it completely myslef so I'll be watching a lot of your videos.
Glad to hear you found the video informational. I'm super behind on releasing videos due to unexpected family health issues. it's been one thing after another these past two months. If you have any questions let me know and i'll try to respond as soon as I can
@@zoubtube Thanks, I really appreciate it! Hope your family gets well soon!
Thank you for this! Excellent!
I modified my SLX levers free stroke screws a while ago so I could use a flat blade screw driver instead of the U-shaped tool.
Anyway, it's been a while since I've bled those brakes and this was the perfect video for doing it right.
My SLX levers are now coupled to Magura MT-7 calipers. The power is simply amazing! And soooo much easier to bleed.
Shigura for the win!
Thanks for the comment and I'm glad to hear the video was of some use. i'm curious to know how the slx levers compare in feel against the magura levers. it the bite more consistent through the stroke?
SLX levers with Magura calipers and Galfer purple pads, stop on a dime and do it right now.
I would say the bite is very consistent and powerful throughout the stroke.
I tried the Magura levers for one ride and just couldn't be satisfied with how soft the lever felt.
Pour with the bottle on the side instead. It won’t spill that way.
YUP! I'd say 99% of the time, that's how I pour it. For some reason, when I make these videos, I find that sometimes I do things that literally have me scratching my head during post. Hell, sometimes I can't help but think that I had some kind of stroke! I don't script any of this stuff, as it takes too much time. But because of this, there's so much going through my mind when making these videos that every once in a while it shorts out (though if you ask my GF I'm sure she'd say it happens more often than that! 😁 ) Thanks for watching the video and for leaving a helpful comment that will help others. It's much appreciated. 👍
I can't fault anything really here, Shimano brakes are easy to bleed, any bleed aim should be to get air out of the system, I simply funnel and syringe, pushing from calliper up to funnel, checking lever feel after a few air bubbles pop up, finished up with a lever burp, literally done in 15mins. Also alcohol spray is great for cleaning up any mineral oil spill :)
Totally agree. I always tell people to never rush the job, especially considering most people will only need to do it once a year. A few extra minutes can go a long way. The same goes for bleeding shocks, forks, etc. Once you get used to it, both Shimano and SRAM brakes bleed easily and fast. Thanks for taking the time to watch the video as well as the comment
Hello. The problem I have is that the new m8100 right hand brake lever, once pressed, does not return as quickly as the left hand brake handle. The delay is approximately 0.3 seconds. I bled the brakes, checked the piston and cylinder surface - everything is fine, but the handle is slow. What could be the reason?
I'm sorry to hear about your issues. Assuming the system is fully bled, and you're having this issue, then your best bet is to warranty the lever if it's new. Take advantage of the warranty. There is a good chance the issue is with one of the lever piston seals. There is a way to check this, but you might as well get a fresh replacement since it is not supposed to do this when new.
let me know how it goes
What about the freestroke screw, after bleeding, should you just leave it 2 threads out or you need to screw it back in?
That is totally up to you. Whatever you feel most preferred. The most important thing is to find the most comfortable position for your finger. From there, you use the free stroke to find the preferred "feel" when pulling the lever and having your brakes bite. . Just remember to ALWAYS return the lever to the same position after adjusting the free stroke
Do you have a rear brake bleed video?
I haven't done one as its the same process but harder to record since the caliper is much further than the lever. I can try and do the rear brake on the next brake video
Hi. My problem is I don't have any free stroke on my rear brake lever (specifically). It's hard to press. Hope you can help me. Thanks!
Merry christmas myman! what brand and model brake do you have?
@@zoubtube Merry Christmas! Shimano XT m8120.
Im not sure if I got it right lmao. I like my brakes with the lever all the way out and the brake/ bite point as early as possible. So in order to get the earliest brake/bite point do I have to take the lever distance to the lowest and then unscrew the free stroke? After bleeding and screwing back in the free stroke screw + adjusting the lever distance to the " all the way out" position, would I then achieve my desired brake point? I hope that what I wrote makes sense or someone understands what I’m asking :D Thanks in advance
Adjust both the freestoke out, and the lever as far out as you like it. then bleed. then screw the free stroke all the way in, which will bring in the lever. then adjust the lever back out to the preferred position. this will be the most you will get out of free stroke shortening the bite point. hope this helps
@@zoubtubethanks :)
I use a toilet paper roll to hold my funnel
That is a really good idea. thanks for the tip! 👍
okay?
To me it sounds like I say Mmmokay! never noticed I sounded like that until I stated recording this videos. then again, I never realized how many words come out of me sounding like a short circuit took place in my brain while saying them 😁
Best ever brake bleed video ever. I watched hundreds, and never got it 100% right. Finally, this one works. I wish bikeshops would do the way you do.
Thank you so much for such a gracious compliment. And I'm very glad to hear that it worked out for you. if you have any questions just let me know
What do you think about that, when they do the full bleeding process with a bleed block installed in the caliper, then putting in the pads and the wheel and leaving the funnel on the lever, then they start pulling the lever, basically overfilling the system, saying that there won't be a vacum in the system if the pads are worn. What do you think? Will this make the brakes feel more stiff and the only down side will be that you have to bleed again if you put in new pad or it might damage the diaphragm/seals? Please share your idea about this cos' I'm in rabbit hole trying to find the best option.
This actually incorporated everything ive seen on bleeding shimano . You can follow this and be done.
Only thing that i can add is if after cleaning pistons , if one or both are sluggish, just apply some brake fluid around piston AFTER cleaning. If one piston is not retracting then hold good one back with tool and let bad one come out a bit more and thoroughly clean and lube a few times and retry both pistons again. Keep going until you get improvements.
Thanks for the excellent video esp the free play screw
"If one piston is not retracting then hold good one back with tool and let bad one come out a bit more and thoroughly clean and lube a few times and retry both pistons again"
YES!! I couldn't agree more and I mention this to people all the time. I think I even mention in in one of my other videos. but I plan on making another brake video soon (changing the brake cable and full clean and bleed for a rear brake) where I plan to go into what you mention. 👍
Thanks for such a great comment. 👌
Great Video! What handlebar model do you fit on this bike?
Thanks!
Thank you sir. this was a friends bike and I want to say the handlebar is a PNW but honestly don't remember. Its a standard 3.18 handlebar if that helps.
Wow !! Again super nice video !! I've seen many vid on bleeding the brakes but this free stroke explanation is pure diamond !! Thank you so much 🙌 !
I just bled both my brakes in 25 min with the free stroke properly set !! Thank you 🙏
thanks for the gracious comment. always super happy to hear that others had a good experience. Plan is to create an equivalent video that goes deep into the SRAM contact point adjustment as well 👍
The best way to pour from any rectangular type bottle is to tip the bottle sideways when you pour it. Works in the car without using any funnel too.
totally Agree. That's how I pour it for engines as well. though I will say, This bottle design deeper than typical inward lip that has a tendency to pull oil toward the body. I've given up on it! 😁
The best explanation I’ve seen on free stroke!
It basically primes up the servowave and gets right to the bite
Glad to hear the video was informative for you. In a nutshell, yes, or at least the goal is to get to the bite a bit quicker. michselpatton4105 did an excellent job explaining the finer details in his post below. I tried when recording the video, but realized I did a crappy job explaining some of the details clearly, and removed those clips during the edit.
Thanks for taking the time to watch the video
I dont know If i should buy the Parktool bleed Kit or the jagwire. Parktool Looks very good and makes everything easier. I rly Love Ur Videos and Ur knowledge. U gonna make a Video someday on bleeding Magura? Thats why i wanted another Kit i have Problems to bleed the caliper With the Standard one idk IT Drives me crazy. Lg
I've never tried the Jag wire kit, so I can't speak to it outside of saying that it looks like a nice kit. My opinion on the Park tool kit is that it is too expensive, especially if you only need to service one company's brakes. The one part I love about the park tool kit is the syringe holders. I use them all the time. You can now buy them individually, which is another nice option with the park tool kits. You can buy just the parts you need for your bike/s, which will cost you much less, and add to the kit later as is needed. The one part the park tool kit that is missing is a reservoir holder. It seems like a big miss to me, especially considering the cost of the kit. A subscriber on the channel mentioned that he uses a toilet paper roll, which is a great idea, but let's face it, for ~$140, we should have to resort to something like this.
Hey there! Great video! Question; i like my lever max open, so the adjuster knob is turned all the way. When i turn my free stroke adjust, it pulls the leaver in, but i have no travel left on the adjust to bring it back. So, using the free stroke adjust doesn't help me. thoughts? I'm guessing the only thing i can do is use a thinner bleed block to get my pads in tighter to my rotor during the bleed process? Also, what;s strange, is my left (front) lever feels great, but i can't seem to get the same position on rear (all brand new parts, except rear rotor is not brand new, but surely it hasnt worn down significantly...) EDIT: (maybe i missed this step? ".... 15:44 mark in the video, after I install the bleed block, make SURE to press the lever a".. my bleed block slides in easily with the pad removed, but doesn't fall out.. idk, still strange front and rear are quite different...
If both lever is the way out you limit your options. When the lever and freestroke are both all the way out, it the farthest out the lever can go. Screwing the freestoke all the way in will bring the lever in a bit, but now you have no room to adjust the lever to the preferred position since the lever is already in its maximum extended position.. Basically, the lever needs some headroom for the free stroke to work
As for bleeding with a thinner block, this can help, BUT,, it increases the chances of having too much pressure in the system, which might lead to a leak at the weap hole. I am not saying this will happen, just mentioning that there is a slight chance
It is very important that you make sure both pistons move at a similar rate. They will never move perfectly together, but if the walls are clean, they should respond very close to each other. Many people skip this step, as my buddy did at the beginning of the season and complained that he couldn't get rid of the rubbing noise. I told him to go back and thoroughly clean his pistons and BOOM. Problem solved.
Hopefully this helps some
Thanks for the comment
Best bleed video and explanation I've ever watched, many thanks!!!
Thank you very much. Working on a SRAM contact point adjustment equivalent should be done soon. 👍
Best video on this topic on YT. And I’ve seen many.
Should we open the system BEFORE pushing those pistons back in?
thank you very much for the compliment. When prepping the caliper (cleaning the piston side walls) leave the system closed. After the bleed block is installed, compress the system so the pistons can squeeze against the bleed block, then open the reservoir port. This way you maximize the amount of oil in the system as well as center the piston for the bleed, making it easier to center to rotor to the pistons after you install the wheel when the bleed is done. 👍
@@zoubtube I think @gokkunguru is referencing the risk of puncturing the bladder in the lever with excessive pressure by pushing the pistons back in while the lever bleed screw is closed. This is a common problem with the delicate bladders in the levers (xt, xtr and saint), a very weak point in the design.
Question.....I have to change the piston, do I have to completely remove the screw, i.e. 2 threads maximum?
My apologies for the late response, but I'm still very behind on responding to comments. The piston can be removed without removing the free-stroke screw. Hopefully, this helps
How can one get out of the jammed situation you describe at 11:00 in the video. I'm afraid my brakes could have this issue as I got them used and the screw is currently jammed. On both levers. I suspect the previous owner had made this mistake.
My sincerest apologies for the late response, but I'm still a couple of months behind on messages. If the small bolt jams the internal lever, your best bet is to unscrew it and tap the handle to see if it loosens the lever while leaning the bike a bit on the same side as the brake handle, then screw the bolt in again. I hope this helps
Best freestroke screw explanation I've seen with those marks on paper :) Thers's one small but very CRUCIAL remark - if that wasn't you who last bled the brakes, you MUST open the lever bleed screw before pushing pistons in, or you risk puncturing the very weak shimano membrane in the lever if the brakes are overfilled. Happens more often than you think. I just do it this way every time, just in case.
Yup! I should have mentioned it, and my bad for not doing so even though I don't really practice it (though I do believe I mentioned to push piston back slowly). I need to script this stuff in order to remember to mention certain details, regardless of whether I practice them. Thogh I will say that I've done hundreds of Shimano bleeds, and only once have I come across a leaky bladder, and not during a bleed. A buddy showed up with one at the shop after a ride about a decade ago. Next bleed video, I'll make sure to mention it
It's a bit hard to see the one's that should really know their craft push dirty contaminated fluid up and out through the lever, as well as continuing to use gravity bleed. Your method here should be the industry standard and I say that because it just simply makes so much more sense.
I applied this method to my own bike the other day and even though I also changed rotors and pads, my brakes have never felt this good before. Even when my bike was new I was just disappointed with the feel and bite of my brakes. Now my brakes feel like I expected brakes to feel at this price level. I know there are obviously better brakes out there, but there are also a lot worse than this. A set of M8100(with M8120 calipers) brakes should be pretty good out of the box and they can be very good with the right maintenance and rotors/pads.
Thank you so much for your gracious comment. From my perspective, the vast majority of people are only going to need to do this once a year. Taking a few extra minutes to ensure a positive bleed isn't much to ask for when considering the return. No matter the brakes, I always bleed them when new, as I do forks and shocks. Oil is cheap. Peace of mind is priceless😉 Now go out there and enjoy the season. Winter is around the corner 😉
@@zoubtube The only thing I will add to this method from now on is something that will only add a few extra minutes at the most. Just after you have cleaned the calipers inside and out with isopropyl alcohol, as well as the sidewalls of the pistons. After this has dried, you apply a thin coat of mineral oil with a q-tip(same as in the braking system) to the sidewalls of the pistons. Then cycle them in and out a few times and visually make sure they operate freely and in unison.
After this I just apply isopropyl alcohol on a new q-tip and wipe off any excess mineral oil inside the caliper that shouldn't be there.
After this you just proceed to throw in the bleedblock and continue on with the rest.
Awesome video, do you screw the freestoke screw back in after bleed?
I'm glad to hear that you found the video helpful. As for the bleed screw after the bleed, it's totally up to you. The freestroke screw offers nothing more than a minor adjustment in feel. This is a personal thing that you will need to test on your own to see what your preference is. The one thing to remember is to adjust the lever to your preferred position after adjusting the freestroke screw, as it will move the lever. The effects are minor, and it will most likely take a few rides on trails you are very familiar with to feel the difference, so feel free to play with the freestroke at will. You won't break anything in the process. But again, remember to reposition the lever after you adjust it.
thanks...simple,accurate and no time waste.. :)
Thank you very much for the thoughtful comment. Always an internal battle with me with trying to add as much info, but keep the videos short. why do I always feel like I'm losing one of those battles 😁
Unbelievable knowledge about Free Stroke 👏 thank you very much.
I am very glad to hear that the video was informative for you. If you want even more info on how this all works, look at michselpatton4105 post below. I attempted to explain these additional details, but failed to do so clearly and deleted the clips. He does an excellent job of explaining the finer details of the system.
Thanks for taking the time to watch the video
I don't understand. I have a XTR 4 pistons M9120. Some people are telling me the screw needs to come out in order for brakes to grab quicker snd shorter distance.
Is this correct?
in the video I try to explain how the free stroke works. it basically moves the lever piston forward as can be seen in this video. by doing this, it also shortens the distance of the lever throw in order to fully lock the brakes (~1 cm shorter), which is also seen in this video. basically, it adds pressure to the system, so don't think of it as actually moving the caliper pistons (which I've technically never measured, but pretty sure it doesn't do at all (might make for a good future video)). Think of it as adding pressure to the system in order for the caliper pistons to more quickly lock the pads to the rotor (hence the shorter lever throw)
I would bleed the brakes as mentioned in this video, with the free stroke out. then go for rides at your favorite trials and reposition the free stroke on different days, make sure you DON'T forget to put the lever back to the preferred position everytime you move the free stroke or else it will not do anything for you. in ONLY works when the lever is put back to YOUR preferred position, which can be different for each hand btw (I so wish I mentioned this in the video). the free stroke is very subtle but will be noticeable over time, you might like with with quicker bite, you might not. Just like to many features on mountain bikes, this is personal preference and don't let anyone convince you otherwise 👍
I have never touched that screw, tomorrow I'm going to mess with it! 👆🏻
👍 Just remember, it all starts with your preferred handle distance, always return the handle to the same distance. and don't expect drastic change. The change is very subtle, as it was designed to be, and you really should decide after a few rides on your favorite trails going back and forth between the in and out position. pay attention to down hill turns and tight a windy technical sections. that's where I felt it most with the back wheel
Thank you thank you thank you 🙏 just bought some XTs and couldn't work out the best process for adjusting free stroke. You're explanation was pure gold 👍
veyr glad to hear it helped. if you have any questions please let me know.
Excellent explaination, just what I was looking for while getting ready to service the brakes! Thanks!
Glad you found it helpful. highly recommend taking the time to see which free stroke screw position works best for you. Most people expect an immediate response. it not. it becomes noticeable over time after going back and forth on trial you know well. Eventually you will find the sweet spot that will feel right for you. 👍
12:10 holly f*** I usualy screw it 1cm out, thanks
glad you found the video helpful. tell other as that's a common mistake, as I experience many years ago
Awesome tutorial! Thank you.
Happy to hear that you found the video informative. If you have any questions just let me know. thanks for watching
Good Video
I have a XT chrome cap - never fiddle with it.
I also have Magura MTS with BAT Knob - also don't fiddle with it. - Magura is just Gimmick.
Thanks. the effect the free stroke has is very subtle, but noticeable once you try it a few times. the biggest issue I find is people don't adjust the handle after they adjust the screw. one doesn't work without the other.
@@zoubtube too bad you don't Have Magura brake with BAT adjustment to make a Video. I look at the Shimano XTR does not have this option
Impressive....thank you
Thanks you very much. hopefully it helps out. 👍
Best toutorial free stroke. Complete.
Thank you sir. Glad to hear you found it helpful. More videos to come
The push-pull method works well on my front brake but not my back brake. I used a tip mentioned elsewhere which was to use a bike stand to keep the bike upright so that the rear caliper is lowest (and closed off) and the brake lever bleed port is at the top. I then screw a tube with a bit of fluid in it into the bleed port (brake lever horizontal and tube open ended). I then gently tap, beginning at the caliper, along the hose all the way to the brake lever. I then leave it overnight and the next morning I remove the hose, re-seal the bleed port and hey-presto, a solid brake lever. Another tip to prevent air getting in at the caliper bleed screw is to put thick grease around the threaded part.
Thanks for sharing your experience with everyone. I couldn't agree more with you, and I believe I posted a rear brake video that talks to tilting the bike to assist with the bleed. First time and Heard of applying grease to the ports screws. Might give it a shot for next season. 👍
You are exchanging volume and pressure incorrectly interchangeably. Changing the free stroke adjustment change the position of the master piston in the lever assembly. CORRECT!
But that effects VOLUME of fluid in the master cylinder of the lever, NOT PRESSURE. There is no pressure until the system is closed and in use with master piston moving in the master cylinder against the brake pads on the rotors system closed.
Extra fluid VOLUME restores free stroke adjustment to original setup position before pads start wearing.
Everything everything in the video is correct except for the misuse of pressure and volume.
But that’s a big error in expressing the understanding of hydraulics to someone else with no education of that subject.
Still…. Great video.
"misuse of pressure and volume" I'll by that. I tend to mix up words occasionally. I really should script this stuff. Someone recently pointed out that I was saying hydro instead of hygro. Definitely my bad.
Very good video finally someone does it right! Shimanos free stroke is more than capable just never let out on people's videos for it to work! I done it this way last week my new XT 4 pot 203m bite is amazing now, no crushing fingers!
SUPER glad to hear that it all worked out well for you. And thank you very much for leaving a comment and letting me know. Now it's time to reap the rewards! Now go out there and crush a run for me because I've been out of town on work travel lately, and I'm itching to get back for a ride. There's only so much walking I can do without my mind driving me nuts!
nice tutorial about free stroke.
i just bought xt quad piston today👍✌️
Glad you found the video helpful. XT quads are really good brakes, especially for the money. dial them in and they should do you just fine. 👍
Uploader could you possibly put some more longer ads. They are almost as long as the video. Definitely not subscribing to or watching more videos with these ads 👎👎👎sorry but it's just greed and since it's all your own content the ads are down to the uploader
You really are an awesome ANGRY biker. If I could, I would add more and longer adds, but only for you 😁 Dude, Complain to youtube! The ONLY control I have is the click of an on/off button. THEY are the ones that determine what adds get played, how many get played, when they get played, how long they will be, etc, per person. And trust me when I say that I'm not to worried about your .000000000000000021 cents out of the $3 a month the channel makes. Shit, if it was up to me, AAAAALL the adds would be 5 minute bikini ads, I'd get at least $6 a month for that I'm sure! 😁. I make these videos for my friends and those who would like to perform certain jobs but can use a bit of a confidence booster in order to do them. That's my target, if they are to long for you, there's other videos out there, enjoy! 👍
Money 👍 THANKS
Thanks for watching. let me know if there are any questions
Im in a position where if the brakes are close to my grip, and i one finger brake, it smushes my other finger.
I got the lever throw all the way out.
Do I need more oil in the line or something?
otherwise I had to scoot the brakes further away from the grip, but that also puts my shifters kinda far away.
What am I missing.
If I just 2 finger brake then Im fine but what the heck thanks?
Interesting. If I was to guess, I would say you have air in the system. If the lever is all the way out, (which unless you have like really big hands it shouldn't be) and you are able to hit your fingers when pulling the lever,, that shouldn't happen when properly bled, or at least I've never seen this with Shimano brakes. I'd bleed the brake since it's easy and relatively quick, take your time though and make sure all the air comes out of the system and try it again.
please keep me updated. thanks
Fantastic explanation and again a very informative video. I have the XT brake system and the free stroke confused me even after other videos but your explanation just hit the nail on the head. Thank you. please keep the videos coming.
Very glad to hear you found it helpful. The plan is to keep making videos but at the moment I'm WAY behind making them due to some unexpected family health issues as well as other issues. I'll get back on track soon. 👍
@@zoubtube I hope those issues get better very soon. stay safe.
Very good video my friend! Just a quick question, I have a pair of SLX brakes, that are identical but the free stroke screw has a diferent head, I was thinking of changing them to a philips or even hex head screws, I know the thread is an M4, but i'm not quite sure on the length, could you please enlighten me on that measure? Thank you!
Thanks for the kind words. You'll need a U-shaped spanner like the following: amzn.to/4amUEq6 to remove the bolt (you might have to shave it a bit to fit, I made my own with a flat head bit and a dremel). If memory serves me correctly, I believe a 10mm m4 works. I could be a bit off, so I would buy a 10 and 12mm stainless steel m4. Remember not to force the bolt in too deep. Once it naturally stops, you're done.
Hello, Thank you for the video. If you decrease the free stroke (thread the free stroke bolt in more), will this bring you pads at the callipers closer all the time (when you are not braking)? I have hydraulic disc brakes on the mtb (MT8000) and road (R8100). I like to have as less free stroke as possible, but I want to avoid brake rub more then having less free stroke. Thank you for the help! (I'm not having brake rub at the moment, but when I ride in the dirty rainy conditions, it does rub).
I've never measured to see if the pistons actually move forward when the free stroke is screwed all the way in from the all the way out position with a caliper. (Maybe do this for a future video?) The way I see it is it is more of a pressure response. When bleeding the system with the free stroke all the way out, you are maximizing the amount of oil in the system. From there, when you screw in the free stroke, you are "slightly" increasing pressure in the system, basically you need less lever travel to get the same response. Whether that increase in pressure is enough to "actually move" the pistons,,, I've never actually measured with a precise tool to say for sure. But I do know that if you want more lever stroke, or software feel, then bleed the brake with the free stroke all the way in, then unscrew the free stroke. This will be the least amount of pressure possible in the system.
Great video! But, I have a question. I just blead my breaks, and I came back to it a couple days later, and it drained a lot out. I tightened the caps on the top, and the bottom, but it was leaking out from within the break. Do you think a o ring could of broke within the break? Thanks
Thanks for the comment. So you're losing pressure but you see no signs of oil outside the system? first Check for a cracked piston, check for an oil leak on the piston seals. check under the hood that covers the hose to lever connection, check the inner side of the lever where the shaft pushes the piston and check around the reservoir cap on the side.
Best way to check the above with remove the wheel and pads, install a block and pulse the lever with good pressure. this will let you know if your losing immediate pressure and give you some sign of where it might be coming from. let me know how it goes
There is no seal that would fail in the system that would create an internal leak that would lose significant pressure. seals that fail will show signs of failures externally, but sometime they can be very deceiving and not immediately noticeable.
@@zoubtube I just took out the break pads and when I squeezed the breaks, a lot of oil would come out from the pistons. Also, I saw remanence of oil in the breaks. I am probably going to take it to a shop, but thanks for the help.
@@hollisterwithtomo504 Sorry to hear that. chances are it's a cracked piston. hopefully it'll turn out to be something simpler.
@@hollisterwithtomo504 piston or the seals are worn, check around the cylinder for any dents or burrs, I had this problem with my slx m675 on one side, be prepared to get messy and pump the pistons out correctly, new seal and piston , doesn't need to be ceramic piston, I did get a little oil showing after but i think it just needed a few pumps to set the seal in around the piston, no leaks since.
Thank you for this great explanation of free-stroke! Most other vids ignore it entirely. I've heard many conflicting versions of what it does and your video made it clear!
Super glad to hear you found it helpful. The two key takeaways on adjusting free stroke is always return the lever to your prefered position, and it's all about what's most comfortable for you, based on the trials you ride. 👍
Thank you. This was a great tutorial, and i learned from it.
It makes me happy to hear that you found it informative and thank you for taking the time to watch it. If you have any question just let me know
I recommend that you pour the mineral oil from the container with the handle parallel to the handlebars instead of perpendicular to it, I assure you that it will be much easier to avoid spills. Sorry for my English, thanks for the video.
YUP! I totally agree, and it's how I've been doing it for YEARS! One thing I've noticed since I started making these videos is that there have been many times that I've deviated on some of the details from how I normally do things. Usually, it's just me, in a quiet room, taking my time while working on a bike. When recording, the entire dynamic changes. I start overthinking things, constantly feel like I'm in a rush, always think of how a clip turns out, have to work around lights and cameras, etc. LOTS of distraction. I just need to get more used to the recording part, but again, you are right as to pouring the oil from the bottle
Excellent tutorial! I’m not sure why shimano call it one way bleed though . I did get the plastic holder for the reservoir cup with a cheap kit, indispensable
Thank you very much. glad you found it helpful. I look at shimano like an aircraft carrier. lots of firepower but VERY slow to turn. 😉 It takes alot for this company to make a change, or to admit that they should have looked at things differently.
I cannot turn the free stroke screw. I assume it is a #2 Phillips head but my screw driver is slipping. I am using a Snap On #2 screwdriver.
Apologies for the late response. A #2 should work fine. Checks to see if the head is stripped. Unfortunately, bike companies don't use the strongest metals. If the head is not stripped, is it possible that the screw was fully removed at some point and crossed-threaded when installed again? There's a slight possibility that it jammed internally, as mentioned at the beginning of the video, but that's a slight chance.
Great video, thanks
So I was doing a bleed and for some reason I couldn’t pull the fluid out with the syringe, had reservoir on top and it was open and then syringe and bleed port opened and no matter what pushing or pulling it wouldn’t move , any idea why ?
I've seen this happen a few times before and in every case it what the piston that was jammed due to the level being pulled to deep when the system was open, many times by mistake. If nothing else works, separate the lever from the cable, use a 1.5 allen to push the piston back, connect the cable to lever and try bleeding again. let me know how it goes.
a question please :
what about the lever position adjustment , how should it be during a bleed ?
is it all the way out like the stroke ajustment or in , or it doesnt matter
thanks in advance
I bring both lever and free stroke out. Just make sure to measure both before moving them, lever with a measuring tape or ruler from handlebar, free stroke by counting the turns. (unless it was at the all the way in position when you started). When done, bring the return the free stroke to where it was, then do the same to the lever.
When I pushed in my pistons l blew the diaphragm. Oil weeps out of that hole from the end of the cylinder.
This is typically a sign of too much pressure, which could be based on multiple reasons. But it doesn't necessarily mean the system is damaged. The job of the weep hole is to equalize pressure when needed.
What you will most likely have to do is remove the cap and the bladder. I have a video that shows how to do it (I believe it is the M9100 brake video). You don't need to disassemble the lever to do this.
Once removed. Check the bladder. If there is no damage, re-install it. Make sure the bladder and cap are seated correctly (this is VERY important).
If the bladder does have visible damage, like a hole, clean it with alcohol, then apply glue; crazy glue, gorilla glue, etc. Again, When installing, make absolutely sure that the bladder and the cap are seated correctly, as shown in the video.
So the people putting vids up stating that freestroke is pointless and to set up by removing the wheel and slightly pulling the lever to closen the pads do not understand the system?.
I'm not sure if I would say they don't understand the system, as much as have higher expectations of what it can do. Both freestroke and SRAM's contact point adjustments are VERY subtle. It takes a few rides on VERY familiar trails to feel the difference, IMO. Also, The vast majority of people I've come across don't adjust freesroke correctly. They were unaware that the lever position is affected by adjusting the freestroke. If the lever isn't brought back to the exact preferred position after adjusting freestroke, it will literally have zero effect. This is the key adjustment to make in order to feel the effects of the adjustment
All of the videos I saw seem to show more info than needed and make me more confused.
For example, you sucked out the bad fluid in the 1st stage-makes Sense.
After getting rid of it, you fill the syringe with new fluid, and push it back-that's ok as well.
Why do you keep playing with the new fluid back and forth now?
This should go up with no bubbles and that's it, am I wrong?
Good question. Just like in a syringe, small air bubbles can potentially stick to the walls of a brake system. To add to that, brake systems have very small holes that the oil needs to flow through, especially in the caliper, which can be seen in a video I made a while back where I change the pistons in a Shimano caliper. An air bubble can get stuck in front of one of these holes, allowing oil to flow around it. By agitating the system (gently pushing and pulling the syringe during the bleed process), it helps move air bubbles that might potentially be stuck on the walls. Think of it as a belt and suspenders approach to bleeding brakes. This goes for all brakes. It takes an extra minute or two, but it is worth the added assurance. Hopefully, this will help better explain the reasoning.
@@zoubtube many thanks for the comprehensive and prompt reply, much appreciated!
After you are done bleeding, do you put the free stroke screw all the way back in or leave it out?
This is totally up to you base don what feel better for you. Take a few rides on your favorite trails testing the brakes with the the screw both in and out. just remember to reposition the lever to your prefered position each time after adjusting the screw. this is the most important part. It will most likely take a few ride before you feel a different as the distance is subtle. In the end, which ever feels better for you is where you should keep it
I've found having the freestroke screw all the way in causes the initial pull to be longer than subsequent pulls (pumps up). With the screw all the way out the pull amount is consistent. Bled with the screw wound out.
I'm happy to hear that you are at least putting an effort to see what feels best for you. 💪👏👏Most people I come across are afraid to touch it. Just remember, there is no right answer. Whatever feels best for YOU on the trials you mainly ride is all that matters. 👍
@@zoubtube Sure. I should be clear that I only saw the issue when I bled the brakes with the screw fully out, and then after finishing the bled screwing it all the way back in.
I compared this with my SLX brakes which have the screw all the way in from factory and you need a special tool to wind it out.
I also couldn't find anything in the Shimano bleed documentation about winding the screw out prior to bleeding.
I enjoy playing with all the options and finding what works best for me. Happy trails.
This was really thorough and extremely helpful. Thank you so much for putting in the effort to make this.
My apologies for the late response. I'm glad to hear you found the content helpful. if there are any questions just let me know. thanks for watching
It kind of reminds me of tension screws on the derailleur. Very nicely explained!
Thanks. let me know if you have any questions
Thanks for this... Now I can confidently handle my XT brakes
Super glad to hear the video was helpful for you. If you have any questions let me know
@@zoubtube I sure will sir👍 thanks and more power
When you did the bag bleed and pulsed it 3 times was the free stroke screw backed out 2 threads or in all the way?
Thanks
I bleed with the free stroke screw out for the whole bleed process.
great video. thank you
Thank you for taking the time to watch it and for leaving a comment. If you have any questions let me know 👍
@@zoubtube thanks. much appreciated. i indeed have a question. one of my brake levers needs service and i am not sure what to do. the big screw to adjust the lever position is stuck. when i try to move it in any direction it doesnt move. any ideas how to adress that?
@@ephraimki7783 if the reach adjustments screw move clockwise or counterclockwise and nothing happen than chances are its stripped, though I can't say for sure without seeing it. If this is the case, you should be able to find lever handle replacements for it. it not hard to swap out. let me know how it goes
would you want the free stroke screw out for more modulation?
Technically yes, but I wouldn't expect to feel a drastic difference. I find SRAM brakes are designed with modulation in mind. Shimano, not as much. Chances are you will feel a touch more feathering at the mid-stroke, but the end will be an abrupt stop as usual. Just remember to return the handle to the same position after adjusting the screw, or else it doesn't do anything.
@@zoubtube thanks for the response! if i were to want more modulation for nose pivots and rolling stoppies, should i look into switching to sram? are the sram levers/masters compatible with the shimano calipers? i'm running m8000 xt atm.
@@floppywonka That's a tough one. In my experience, SRAM brakes provide more modulation in general. They offer a greater band of pressure before the hard bite. Some people like the feel of this; others don't.
Expertise aside, a wider band of pressure will help with control. I like having a wider band of pressure available when riding very technical stuff. If you feel that it's difficult to find a comfortable level of control when performing a stoppie for instance, because the brake locks or gets too close to locking quickly, then you might want to consider trying an SRAM brake. I guarantee that you will feel a difference; what I can't say is if you will like the difference in feel. It's a very personal thing.
@@zoubtube awesome, thanks again for your view on this. i play bike polo and there's a lot of stopping quick from a relatively fast speed, nose pivots, and other bike handling maneuvers that require good front brake control. there's no rear brake on this bike so everything's done with the front. i got my m80000 xt setup used from a friend but it feels pretty wooden and grabby. this is my first experience with hydraulic brakes on a bicycle tho so i just assumed that's how they are. maybe i'll keep an eye out for a sram setup to try. do you have a recommendation to which sram setup i should look for?
thanks again!
My limitation is only having experience with shimano and sram brakes. For that type of application, you might want to consider Magura Brakes. Seems to me Magura is popular with free style type riding. If you choose SRAM, I would get a brake with contact point adjustment (ex: rsc, ultimate etc) for fine tuning.
Thanks for a easy to understand explanation!
Do you know if it’s possible to add the reach adj dial from a M9120 xtr lever to the M9100 lever?
I never tried it so I can't be absolutely sure, but my guess is you can't. You would need to change more than just the lever. the push rod to the piston in the 9100 is attached directly to the lever handle. The pushrod on the 9120 sits on a barrel which contacts the level body (7:32 in the video). the 9100 won't have the seat of the barrel to sit in on the lever body. Because of this I can't see it working. I have another video that shows the 9100 disassembled. If you compare the two you will see the differences on how the levers connect to their pushrods
Ok awesome man, I’ll have a look at the 9100 video, but that does make sense to me, cheers for the quick reply mate..
+1 just subbed you.
@@Lil_tylenol anytime myman!
Thanks!
Hopefully the video was helpful for you and thanks for the comment
very nice.
thank you very much!
Wow.. thank you ! The best bleed tutorial on youtube !! I did two times the bleeding and somehow i had a “soft” break lever afterwards. Once i unscrewed the free stroke screw and perform the bleeding again.. my break system it is as good as new ! Thank you again !
I'm super happy to hear the video was helpful for you, and I'm glad that it all went well. It might not be the quickest method out there, but brakes are one of those services where a few extra minutes to ensure a good bleed can go a long way. Now go out there and enjoy the season! 👍
I will try this tommorow tried bleed last week and lever had no pressure, I never new about the freestroke screw will try this bleed method tommorow.
love this tutorial step by step scientific brake bleeding...❤❤❤
Apologies for the late response. I'm glad to hear that you found the guide useful. If there are any questions just let me know
tks ,
Glad to hear the video of informative for you. If you have any questions let em know
Phenomenal video! Great explanation and bleed.
Thanks. Your profile pic just reminded me that I need to post some scuba videos. On my Last trip I came across my first frogfish. Super cool! 👍
Did you screw the free stroke screw back in when you were done I didn't notice?
Apologies for the late response. Yes, but that's just my preference. most important is what feels comfortable for you. Brake feel is a personally thing. go back and forth with adjustments until you find what feels best for you 👍
I recently did a routine bleed on the slx m7100 brake, as I've done loads of times before but when I pulled the lever with a bit of pressure, (not too much).....I blew out the seal on the lever. This also happened on the 2nd lever I got. What the Hell happened????
Apologies for the late response, and I am sorry to hear about the issue. But just so I'm clear, which seal are you referring to? There are about four seals on that lever, not including the olive. Where is the oil leaking from?
@zoubtube Thanks for your reply. I tried to take a picture but I can't upload in a reply here. I think it's known as the weeping port.
@@damienmitchell3080 So it's the cap at the end of the reservoir. If yes, then its possible that there is/was too much pressure in the system when bleeding. Did you bleed using the proper bleed block in the caliper? Did you start the bleed with worn pads, then changed the pads to new pads after the bleed?
What you can try is to remove the cap and bladder in order to check the bladder. (I have another video that shows this process in detail: th-cam.com/video/yoHH7qV3dIc/w-d-xo.html. Only follow the part that removes the cap)
To do this, you need to remove the set screw that is holding the cap. Once removed, use a small Allen key to remove the cap through the set screw hole. Take your time; don't force it; it will come out. When the cap is removed, remove the bladder. Inspect it to make sure there is no damage. If there is damage to it (typically from too much pressure), it needs to be replaced. If all looks well, reassemble correctly. Make sure the bladder AND the cap are sitting in the right position, then redo the bleed as seen in the video. Make sure to a proper bleed block, and don't change worn pads for new pads after a bleed. This needs to be done before a bleed.
Keep me updated 👍
Very well explained, thanks for the detailed video.
Glad to hear you liked it. let me know if there are any questions
great video, your hilarious man 😂
Awesome vid. This is how I've been doing it after trying many different techniques. I still notice the the bite point changes as the pads and rotors heat up. Cool down and returns to original bite point. All 3 of my bikes do this. Is this just how shimano brakes are, or is there a fix?
Apologies for the delayed response. To answer your question, "Is this just how shimano brakes are?" For the most part, Yup! As far as I know, there is no absolute fix for a wondering bite point. Though the feel is very inconsistent, as in even if you had multiple pairs of the same model brake, you might feel it a lot with one brake, and yet with the other, you will rarely feel it. Making sure you have air out of the system will definitely help, so check the bleed port periodically through the season and top off the handle when needed
@@zoubtube I do notice it's usually the rear brake that this happens to. But I tend to drag that more than the front on down hill runs. If I top off the fluid without using the bleed block the bite point is slightly more consistent. Just be sure to not push the pistons back unless the fill port is open.
So you are essentially overfilling the system to get a better bite point. I’ve done this and it works but I also wondered when the fluid heats up there is no expansion room in the system and the brake could lock? Hasn’t happened to me this far with general trail riding but perhaps on a gravity focused bike with really hard brake use it could be a problem? Just conjecture.
And yes when you install new pads and push the pistons back in you need to open the system with the cup installed to remove excess fluid.
Very nice bleed guide 👍
Thank you. I'm very glad you liked it
@@zoubtube You always take your time to explain stuff too 👍
What if you've already got the lever position all the way out before changing the free stroke?
No issue, as long as the level is out to a point where there is a gap between the lever arm and roller bearing.
@@zoubtube I meant, it's not going to give you any option to change the bite point. How can I get a better bite point. I suspect I can't without pushing the pistons out (which isn't ideal)
Nice step by step procedure, 👍
Glad you liked the video. If you have any questions let me know and answer them first chance I get
Absolutely great professional video and awesome instructions! Really helpful!
But WTF where did you win these screwdrivers 🤯
Thanks for the kind comments, and I'm glad you found the video helpful. As for the drivers, the one with the orange handle I bought on Amazon a while ago; below is a link. I love this thing. Great grip, strong magnet, super versatile, and it lets me change bits easily, and if a bit goes bad, I can buy just that bit.
www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0972SYPTJ/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1
as for the driver with the blue handle. The driver is about 40 years old. It has been used and abused COUNTLESS times, and it still works flawlessly on just about any phillips head. I don't know what kind of steel they used back then, but I wish they kept using it today.😉
@@zoubtube interesting - do not judge a book by its cover I guess... I had similar looking ones and they were 🤔crap 🤣
@@Les_GrossmanNo worries. Many of these drivers look the same, and except for my torque wrenches. I don't really get attached to my tools. 😉
But that blue driver phillips driver in the video is literally from the 70's. I'm not kidding when I say this thing has been totally abused by both me and my dad before me. Barely any wear on the edges. Need to remove a partially striped 4" #8 screw from a 2x6,, No problem! Need a punch,, Hammer away! I'm convinced it will outlive me, like it did my dad! 😁
The orange-handled one fits my palm comfortably, has a good grip with greasy hands, and has a strong magnet. I was VERY skeptical when I bought it, as most of these usually have crap magnets. Amazon reviews were accurate with this one. For $10, it was worth it, and I use it more than I do T-handles.
I will say I've been pretty disappointed with park tools these past few years. I plan on making a video on this eventually. 👍
Does this apply to the 9120 XTRs? Both sets of 9120s I have the free stroke screw is all the way in and I can’t seem to break it loose to adjust
Yup. my guess is the screw was pulled out to far at one point, and the mechanism seen in the video that it connects to got jammed on the side of it after it was screwed back in. I could be wrong but if the free stroke screw is jammed, there's not much that can cause it. try taking a pick and gently move it around to see if that works
@@zoubtube they are brand new on a new bikes. The screw is all the way in and tight. I’m not sure how much force I should use to break it loose.
@@vin374 WOW! It really shouldn't be that tight. Give it some force and try and break it loose (make sure to use a phillips head that fits properly). it's literally just a screw that goes in out. Unless they messed up at the factory, then there really isn't anything to break
Hello everyone, congratulations for the video!
Thank you very much and glad to see that you enjoyed it. hopefully it'll come in handy the next time you bleed your brakes
Man, I was really hoping the freestroke adjustment would make these levers feel nice but nope. The amount of travel before they actually bite is insane for an XT model. I had magura trail sl brakes and they felt amazing but I couldn't stand the constant rotor noise from magura rotors (they warp easy) and the super small pad clearance so it was just constant rubbing from warped rotors that would take hours to true by eye.
Freestroke, as well as contact point adjustment, are very subtle. In no way will the difference be drastic. Both are a small tweak to the system in order to provide the option of a more comfortable feel either way.
In order to get more bite you can try a wider rotor, bleed with a thinner bleed block, or even move to a larger rotor or larger brakes in general.
I would try bleeding with a thinner bleed block first to see how it feels for you. If there is a bit of a warp in the rotor, you will have to adjust it when doing this, so you won't hear the rubbing
@@zoubtubeI did see a video that a guy said to remove the rotor and pull the lever to bring the pistons in closer which I may try. I used a magura rotor and that did make it feel better as they are slightly thicker than shimano rotors but they warp so easy.
Best way to adjust bite point:
1) remove the caliper bolts,
2) lift caliper off rotor.
3) squeeze the pistons closer then slide caliper back on rotor. Check to see if you like the bite point, if you do…
4) clamp the caliper back on.
(If your pistons came out too much, use a plastic tire lever or bleed block to pry them open until you get bite point just right. 😉👍
I just put a bit of positive pressure in the system with the syringe and then close it off. It makes a world of difference in pad engagement with less lever travel.
Great video! Thanks for this content!
Thank you for taking the time to watch the video. If you have any questions let me know
Mine doesn’t get a hard bit point even after bleed it keeps going down if you use a lot of pressure what does that mean
So after a bleed you seem to lose pressure the more you use the brake?
could be a couple of things, still have air trapped ( try a burping from lever only ), loose or bad fitting on lever or brake ( check for any oil around connections ), shimano wandering bite, leak from pistons.
👍
thanks for the kind gesture! let me know if you have any questions
@zoubtube @zoubtube I do actually. Does the free stroke feature work with newly installed pre bled brakes, or do they need to be topped off with the screw in the out position to get functionality? I'm not very tech savvy but these new xtr brake levers take way too long to engage their bite point in my opinion. Would love to be able to move that point away from the bars more
@@thereignofthezero225 The free stroke works at all time. It's just a question of how effective it will be. Technically, if you bleed the system with the bleed screw out, you will be adding a bit more oil to the system. This, in turn, will create a bit more pressure when dialing the free stroke screw all the way in than if you were to bleed the system with the free stroke screw in. But this can potentially have a negative effect, which is brake rub, especially if you have newer pads and rotors. My assumption is Shimano recommends bleeding with the free stroke in order to avoid this.
If you find that you still want a quicker bite, then two other options are to bleed the system with a thinner bleed block or install a wider rotor. Both of these will accomplish this, but again, there is the potential for brake rub.
@@zoubtube thanks
Super video. Congrats. One question. At the end, how should you leave de FreeStroke screw? Acording to rider preferences? In the initial position?
Thanks. rider preference. the freestroke (as well as contact point adjustment) is a personal thing. It's all about YOUR comfort. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. just remember, both freestroke and CPA offer a subtle difference or minor tweak, not drastic.