Don’t Learn About Stoicism From YouTube.
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 พ.ค. 2024
- The absolutely best thing you can do if you are interested in Stoicism is to read books by the Stoics and books about Stoicism. So, here is my guide to Stoic texts. We discuss beginner texts, primary texts, and some advanced academic works. You could use this video to create a reading plan which includes a popular introduction (or two), lots of primary texts, and a few advanced academic works.
Beginning 0:00
Popular Introductions 0:48
Four Famous Stoics 3:47
A Great First Read 9:20
Advanced Reading 10:48
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Don’t Learn About Stoicism From TH-cam; Do Learn About How To Learn About Stoicism From TH-cam
🤣
Bro 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
I really laugh a lot
To the folks who just want the list to copy and past in their to-be-read :)
(ps: I still highly recommend watching the video to understand why Jared chose to recommend these books specifically)
How to be a Stoic by Massimo Pigliucci [ 01:36 ]
Lessons in Stoicism by John Sellars [ 02:32 ]
Meditations by Marcus Aurelius [ 04:20 ]
The Enchiridion by Epictetus [ 05:15 ]
The Complete Works by Epictetus - Translation by Robin Waterfield [ 05:50 ]
Letters From a Stoic (also called The Moral Letters or Letters on Ethics) [ 07:32 ]
*** He recommends the version from the University of Chicago Press: Letters on Ethics [ 07:59 ]
Also from the University of Chicago Press: Anger, Mercy Revenge; On Benefits; and Hardships and Happiness. [ 08:41 ]
Essay: On The Shortness of Life by Seneca [ 08:56 ]
That One Should Disdain Hardships by Mosonius Rufus [ 09:19 ]
Bônus - Advanced Reading
The Roman Stoics by Gretchen Reydams-Schils [ 11:20 ]
The Morality of Happiness by Julia Annas [ 11:53 ]
The Therapy of Desire by Martha C. Nussbaum [ 11:53 ]
Thanks,I have screenshot your book list 👍
Stoicism is really similar to Buddhism when it comes to the key concepts and "rules". Very interesting
its the werstern answer to buddhism...and you can see where catholic church took some ideas and twisted it
@@pouetpouetdaddy5 what exactly do you mean by "western answer"?
@@carpediem5232 They used it metaphorically. The East invented Buddhism so I suppose as a reaction we had Stoicism. Stoicism is, more or less, at least in the context of letting things out of your control, hardships etc., the equivalent of Buddhism in the western civilization.
@@gavriilkremastiotis1914 The question is if it was a "reaction" or developed more or less independently. The phrasing as an "answer" implies that it was a reaction to Buddhism, for which I haven't seen any good evidence for.
You find similar ideas in several cultures sometimes more or less abstract and more or less "complete".
Also why "we had Stoicism"? To separate "western" and "eastern" civilisation like that doesn't make a lot of sense.
@@carpediem5232 I mean, your answer was to clarify what he linguistically meant about "western answer", no? You are answering yourself.
We have stoicism because Zeno envisioned it and developed it. He may or may not have been influenced by Buddhism, given that it was being practiced way before his birth.
There is a dichotomy being implied strictly between those two principles, Stoicism and Buddhism, not civilizations. And even then,
Ancient Greece and Ancient India were different civilizations and therefore they projected different influences onto their people, including the Stoic Zeno and the Buddha themselves. It is only natural that there is a separation being established between those two disciplines, not only because of their vastly different origins but because of the individual differences in their components as systems of thought.
Again, Stoicism wasn't really an "answer" to Buddhism per see. It is a figure of speech.
I second waterfield, brilliant translator and scholar
Ward Farnsworth’s The Practicing Stoic is another great contemporary introduction.
Enjoying these recent clips, thank you very much for putting them together.
This is the video I've always been looking for on stoicism. I wish I could like it a dozen times. Thank you.
What a great overview. Thanks Jared!
Thank you for posting thia video Jared. I have been reading Greek and Roman plays and history for a while, and am now attempting the philosophy, so your list of introductory works and source material is very useful. I have read Peter Adamson's first two books on the period, but have noted your suggestions, and will order some today. Your suggestion re reading other works before Marcus Aurelius is exxellent. Thank you for all you do, I love your channel.
jared im so thankful u took some time to educate me on this topic, keep up the good work.
Thoroughly enjoy listening to this scholar. Please keep up the excellent work.
You mentioned you liked the cover of the book.
I made a 4 foot replica of the structure which is at the bottom of my
garden.
Always loved ancient architecture, just started watching your channel
fascinating.
Thank you.
Useful work!
I'm getting the most pleasure from reading and re-reading the original sources, but among the saturated market, there are also some valuable secondary texts. I've read and enjoyed both of your first two suggestions, and if I may, I would also add Fideler's 'Breakfast with Seneca' and Farnsworth's 'The Practicing Stoic' as excellent introductory books. A really useful and timely video-thank you, Jared.
Okay, this video is fantastic. So much better than the last one. Very inspired to read everything on the list that I haven’t already read. BTW, a great version of “On the Shortness of Life” can be found ing Penguin’s Great Idea series. Inexpensive and well typeset.
Yes! Sick to see that you also favor Epictetus. I just finished my second read through of the Enchiridion. I learned about his philosophy about things we do and do not control from my college band director. He’s easily the stoic who left the strongest impression on me.
Edit: I’m also happy that you mentioned “That One Should Disdain Hardships.” I cannot recommend it enough, especially for anyone fond of Epictetus’s lectures.
People always say Meditations is the best but I think it's more of a way into learning about Stoicism, so I think Epictetus and Senecas works are more important if you want to learn about it. Also Epictetus was the most pious so he's better for religious readers, especially as you can adapt the way he speaks about God into your own religion.
Love your recommendations, wondering why didn't I find this channel earlier :). I follow Stoicism myself and love reading about this philosophy
“You should be extending your stay among writers whose genius is unquestionable, deriving constant nourishment from them if you wish to gain anything from your reading that will find a lasting place in your mind.
To be everywhere is to be nowhere.”
- Seneca
Excellent video! You are on point sir!
Thanks so much for your videos!
I had Gretchen Reydams-Schils as a professor at Notre Dame and I had forgotten that she had written a book on stoics. I was really interested in stoicism a while ago and love the Enchiridion but kind of slipped away from stoicism. Maybe I'll go read some more! I heartily agree with your overall message that reading actual stoic philosophy is far superior to trying to learn it on youtube.
Massimo's book is fantastic!
Robin Waterfield's new translation of The Meditations is fantastic! I much prefer it to other translations I've read.
I completely agree with this video, and definitely recommend reading the original stoic writings. I do want to say that Justin Sledge's channel, Esoterica, has a great video on occult stoicism, which explores the undeniable spiritual aspect of stoicism. His channel is awesome in general, but that video seemed particularly relevant.
The original writings are probably good, but they will be more useful if you have an understanding of hermeneutics. You discover a deeper meaning of text by digging deeper into what they meant in the context of their times.
As far is non original writings, there is a very well read author in modern times who wrote a number of books on rhetoric, stoicism, law, chess, and other topics, by the name Ward Farnsworth. His work is excellent imo. He is a good gateway into the subjects imo.
Alright, you have my attention.
Thank you for this video 🫶
Mic drop at 5:32 !!! Get it, Jared! 🔥🙌🏻💪🏼❤
Love your content. This is what's great about TH-cam
I always enjoy a tiered list of subjects. I've been guilty of jumping in too far. I just did it with an economics book with an author I really enjoy. Not too many reviews so I bit the bullet....and man, $40 and I have no clue what's going on lol.
Hey Jared. Love your work
Can you make a video about beginner friendly philosophy books for non native English speakers?
I would 100% recommend the practicing stoic by ward farnsworth. It’s such a great compilation of stoic teachings and wisdom with examples from all the major sages throughout the ages.
This is a good overview for starting to study Stoicism. I appreciate the balance of secondary to primary texts as well as the progression from introductory to more advanced texts. Also, that collection of Seneca looks very interesting, and I would recommend the Penguin paperback of "On the Shortness of Life" for people on a budget or who are not yet sure if they are desiring to fully commit. I read it while riding the subway on the way to work and it was very absorbing.
I would say, however, that there is a place for initially learning "about" Stoicism on youtube as opposed to actually learning or studying Stoicism, which should be done from books as you say. The former is no replacement for the latter, but the former has its place, especially if you are someone who has not had any real introduction to philosophy. Secondly, do you find Pigliucci to be helpful? I have only read some of his articles, such as his critique of Stoicism and the military, and he seems to be a poor reasoner who lacks a sense of history or society, at least in these articles.
I have already read Marcus Aurelius and am finishing Epictetus!)
great video!
Agree with the Massimo recommendation... heard him on a podcast many years ago... before the trend took off.
I really like your vibe
THANK GOD SOMEBODY FINALLY MADE THIS VIDEO! THANK YOU
Aurelius, Seneca and Epictetus. Wonderful everyday common sense .❤
This is a great content. Thank you very much for these recommendations. While watching, I played the idea of you making commentary about Aristotle (your favorite philosopher) vs. Stoic Philosophers - whether similiarities or disagreements in their philosophies. What do you think?
I'm going to do some contrasting of Aristotle with the Stoics in a few other videos. For instance, I want to talk about happiness according to Aristotle and the Stoics.
Hi Jared,
Great video! I’m really interested in Stoicism and its principles. I’m particularly keen on learning how to apply these principles to my daily life, especially when it comes to living a content life, dealing with challenging and rude people, navigating social situations, and handling generally difficult situations.
Given this context, would you still recommend ‘How to be a Stoic’ by Massimo Pigliucci and ‘Lessons in Stoicism’ by John Sellars as introductory texts for someone who has never read any Stoicism? Or would you suggest something different for a beginner with these preferences in mind?
Thanks for your guidance and keep up the great work!
Hello! Can you please tell me what camera do you shoot with and how many light sources do you use? The picture is great and the content is great! Thanks for the content!
thanks for the recommendations. I tried reading Meditations a while ago but found it boring and impenetrable. I will check out the two primers you recommended first.
Very nice and informative video. However, it is generally agreed that Chrysippus was more important than Zeno. Your recommendations are very useful. I would like to add that book 2 of Long and Sedley's « Hellenistic Philosophers » is quintessential for those who want to go a bit further.
Long & Sedley's work is certainly very helpful and informative.
TY.
New to the party, just stumbled upon your channel and finished Pigliuccis take on stoicism. Looking into what to read next and wondering about the different translations. Obviously this is very subjective, but do you have some insight on the different translations regarding seneca and aurelius?
For me the best way to learn is by learning the book The Daily Stoic, one chapter or less a day, and then actually meditate on it by myself, and spend 1 or 2 days trying to apply what I read. I'm not interested in being erudite about stoicism, or discussing it with other people, or understanding what Aurelius or Epictetus said (after all they are imperfect human beings who don't know my life).
And it could be any book, but it just happens The Daily Stoic has the perfect format for the way I learn/practice.
I would like to hear your thoughts on Epicurean philosophy compared to stoicism
I’m interested in Stoicism, started off with Meditations, How to think like Roman Emperor, Daily stoic, Stoicism in modern Life, all on Audible, all so brought few more books 🇦🇺👍
Waterfield's translation of Xenophon is pretty remarkable too.
Hey Jared , would you be open for videos in which you more concretely and deeply discuss books that the community could recommend? I for example really enjoy and appreciate your top ten books type of videos and have already read "The death of Ivan I." and "The Dispossessed" because of you and would for one really love more detailed thoughts and explanations on some of major themes and takeaways of yours from these so highly praised books. Greetings from Germany
I would like to do stuff like this in the future, but it would probably be better either as a livestream or off of TH-cam. I'd have to think about it.
@@_jared D Live?
@@_jaredthat would be great ;D maybe a second channel would be an option (for longer book reviews)
Would you recommend Pierre Hadot’s The Inner Citadel as a secondary text on stoicism?
I tried to read Senecas “letters from a stoic” first and I had to temporarily DNF the book because personally it was hard for me to get into, I was intimidated to read Meditations after because of that but I’m glad I did because it was easier for me to get into and now I’m back reading Senecas works and it’s a lot easier for me to read after that. Thanks for the other recommendations, I will be sure to check them out when I can ❤.
Start by the Manual from Epictetus, the easiest, and then goes for Seneca's dialogues who gonna help you with the letters and finish with Marcus Aurelius, a book who is repetitive, opaque a lot of times because it was wrote as a reminder not for the general readings for century!
Was at the end of the video your dog running around and scratching the bowl? There is some sound in the background I would say that you were glancing at something moving outside of cameras view.
The first book on Stoicims I ever read was „a guide to a good life - the ancient art of stoic joy” by William Irvin and it was lifechanging for me and I feel pretty practical. Have you read it? If yes, it would be nice to hear what you think about it and so i could figure out what to read next to fill my gaps :)
Excellent book!
The second chapter is really helpful.
I would strongly recommend reading a good introductory book on Stoic theory FIRST. A book like "Stoicism" by John Sellars (an actual authority unlike most modern pop-stoics and advocates of bro-isism). Do not read the primary sources or begin Stoic practice until you know the theory. This is how the ancient Stoic curriculums were run day-to-day with new students. Theory before practice!
Would be interested to hear you talk about how stoicism is a foundation for Christianity. A massive amount of crossover between the two imo.
I would say Christianity is the foundation of stoicism, and I’m wondering what stoicism has to offer that the Bible hasn’t already covered?
@@user-on7zd8yi8gfor me personally as a Christian. I found that through Stoicism certain topics were covered in a different way, which made me realize that I had understood them wrong. So I think stoicism can sometimes help on stuff that's already mentioned in the Bible, because it's phrased differently. However I say this very carefully and do not mean that the Bible is incomplete or anything. Just interesting that the different pov made me realize a bit more and made it live for me.
I'm also interested in this question. Especially some of the early Church fathers seem to either have taken a lot from stoic philosophy or have developed parallel lines of thought.
@@user-on7zd8yi8gIt's the other way around I'm afraid. Stoacism predates the birth of Christ.
@@user-on7zd8yi8g...no? The development of Stoicism pre-dates the arising of Christianity
Gregory Sadler have a TH-cam channel with tons of stoicism lectures. Good resource imo
What is your opinion on the daily stoic?
That Jordan Peterson burn tho 💀😂
Oh, I guess I missed it. I was only listening though, but that's what I get for multitasking
@@anibal5845it's at 5:34. Basically says the book is the kind Jordan Peterson wishes he could write
‘‘Twas pathetic. I had high hopes for this utoob channel. Let’s hope he isn’t another woke mouth breather.
Funny Thing, Two days ago i finished 12 rules for life, and i didn’t like how presents its ideas, then i just realice that its made for other audiences (probably people from Canada and US), and here in America Latina we look politics, religion and philosophy in a very different way due to our history and context.
It’s not a larger than life book, not universal examples
I just wanted to comment this for no reason at all ewe
@@ignacioenriquemendezchavez5912 bien dicho
What are the top 10 books essential for developing your intellectual curiosity.
I read meditations translated by George Long. Just order a new translation by Gregory hays.
@Jared Henderson what do you think of the book "The Practicing Stoic: A Philosophical User's Manual"?
+1 on the jordan Peterson thing
I struggle with vertigo and sometimes rely on videos for the audio because reading is too difficult. I realize I can get these books on tape? Cheers.
I have multiple friends with different conditions that make it necessary to read by audio, and it's been very exciting to learn from them about the resources available for it these days. I know LibriVox (free classics, has Aurelius, Epictetus, Seneca, etc.), Libro fm (paid, has Piggliucci), and the app Libby (for utilizing local libraries' digital collections) are popular options.
I'm kind of disagreeing with you. I start to read stoicism by the Ryan Holiday's books. They never seemed to me sensationalist ( even though I feel he milked the concept sometimes) and he is to me a better introduction than academics on the subject, more simple. (and his bibliography brings you to the academics and the real text of stoicism)
So, I started reading about stoicism and I think one part I'm finding myself disagreeing on is basically not being upset with things out of your control. What is a Stoic's response to the Holocaust or genocide in general? Should queer people not seek acceptance by society and instead try to change themselves to not need it? This doesn't seem right to me.
alright *closes video*
Good advice. And just like youtube read critically.
Are you and Ryan Holiday best friends? He lives in Bastrop, Texas. If you haven't had a nice chat with him. Do so.
Thanks for the recommendations even though William b Irvine teaching is also good.
His book is good. It isn’t my top recommendation, but it is good.
hey Jared, I would like to know your opinion , and if you recommend, the works of Ryan Holiday, do you think they can be called a “modernized” version of stoicism or it’s faithful to the original source back at Zeno’s era?
I partly agree to you that, it's cannot be learned through youtube and internet, but the point of stoicism in internet is to enlighten people about Stoicism, to introduce them to it, it's hard to find out about stoicism at all ages especially during your teen years (you are not thinking, hmmm which philosophy should i follow), but when stoicism is in internet, where lots of teens (and adults) spend their free time, sooner or later they will find out about Stoicism, will understand what it is, and if they want to spend their time to deeply understand it (by reading books, and studying them).
How to think like a roman philosopher is also a good entry
Vox Stoica has the sources on here.
"It is not the man who has too little, but the man who craves more, that is poor." - Seneca
I dont think I agree that you shouldnt read Meditations as your first book. Epictetus and Seneca are both philosophers by profession, they know more about it, whereas Marcus' main focus would have been his role as emperor, so he is more helpful to those who are getting to know Stoicism as beginners because they can sympathise with him in that he doesnt speak with as much knowledge on it as the others. What the 2 others say can be more heavy since their entire career is Stoic Philosophy, so I think Meditations is better for beginners
I have meditations and letters from a stoic. It’s hard for me to read it and comprehend it. It’s like reading the Bible. It feels like work and makes me fall right asleep
I see no Ryan Holiday books here...
I don't suppose Stoic books have much to say. I mean, it's not like they can complain about a whole lot :D
Here you talked mostly about Roman Stoicism.
You are talking about Stoicism but you didn't mention Chrysippus anywhere.
Early and middle Stoicism was a holistic system, embracing all knowledge. And then came the Roman Stoicism, practiced by Roman Aristocracy as a way of life.
Chrysippus was the one who wrote extensively and laid the foundation for systematic Stoicism.
Ok, I get learning Stoicism through the books, of course! But I also learn about Stoicism from podcasts and TH-cam. I mean, by that logic in the video title and intro, I shouldn't even be listening to you then.
Psuedo intellectuals confuse being a Stoic with being Ryan Gosling from the movie Drive
So I just learned about stoicism from this TH-cam video. Ironic.
Forget about stoicism and embrace Catholicism. You get everything you get from the stoics but a lot more.
Completely agree. Always go back to the source and not the interpretation, where possible (I add this caveat, because a lot of stoicism has actually come from second hand sources throughout history).
How about No. Number one idea of stoics is to cut the crap. Some idiot has too much time and writes 500pages about idea which is one sentence.
Why can't the effects of the toil remain (i.e. bad knees from toiling in building an orchard for orphans) while the good passes (i.e. the orphans die and orchard is destroyed to pave a parking lot). You need a just, all-powerful and eternal God for this to be true.
i believe the toil is meant to be seen as a periodic state in which you acquire whatever it is you need. although i definitely see your perspective as it makes sense
I'm literally the reincarnation of Marcus Aurelius, so I don't have to read any of those books. Also, I wish people would stop picking me for making that claim. 😜
How many of the smart read that much? Do you even have time to formulate your own observations without interference of other peoples thoughts?
College of Stoic Philosophers
Shortness of life essay
No Ryan Holiday?
Hello? Its literally Buddhist teachings.
Please reconsider recommending "How to be a Stoic" as a place to start. The title is misleading. This book has multiple views that may be off putting to many beginners. My guess is you align with these viewpoints based on your unnecessary insult of Peterson. Pigliucci has excellent youtube videos but this book is not a starting point for Stoicism. In the spirit of insults, this book could have been titled "How to be a Liberal New Yorker". Pigliucci himself has called Stoicism a big tent. No reason to keep people out of the tent based on religion or politics. I much preferred "A Guide to the Good Life" by William Irvine. I purchased 2 of your recommendations. Thanks for the video.
Stoicism and Buddhism 90 same
You can really cope life with this ism. Yet ppl prefer nihilism.
Ironic
Most of the youtube videos I've seen are modern pop psychology masquerading as stoicism.
A Guide to Good Life by William B Irvine
The Jordan Peterson comment did take away from what was otherwise an excellent video. To each his own.
Западная Сибирь слышит
Thank you for this but why the little slam against Jordan Peterson? Doesn’t make sense
"It is what it is" is not Stoicism