Why Skin Cycling Is Missing The Point | Dr Sam Bunting
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ก.ย. 2024
- SkinCycling is a viral TikTok trend that’s been mentioned to me by a few patients, questioning if they’re doing things wrong. If you’re not familiar, let me share what’s meant by this concept, developed by renowned NY dermatologist Dr Whitney Bowe. It’s a way of using active ingredients to reduce irritation to the skin barrier. However.... I think there are a few fundamental issues with this that shortchange you when it comes to getting the most out of your routine. Take a look.
As always, thank you so much for watching and for all your support!
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Thank you!! I’ve been waiting for someone to say this. By this cycle, a person would only be using a retinoid twice a week. For people who can tolerate it more often, that’s just ridiculous. This might be a good place to start for people just starting out but not realistic for experienced retinoid/exfoliant users.
Absolutely agree.
Love the house workers analogy! Perfect !!
And thank you for reinforcing the importance of frequency when using retinoids - and putting frequency before potency 👍
You are very articulate ! Thank you 😊
It's a topic I feel passionately about - perhaps you can tell...!
Thank you Dr. Sam! I swear the other dermatologists on here just say what the viewers want to hear. You’re the only one I truly trust. The rest just talk about skincare with links to make a buck. You genuinely care and I appreciate you so very much! ❤ I still can’t use any actives other than my Tretinoin every other day but I’m okay with that. I’ll get to every day eventually then pursue an AHA. I have had two skin cancers removed from my face and don’t want any more so I feel like the Tretinoin is my best bet.
Thanks for the message Lisa. It sounds like you're doing all the right things, at the right pace for you!
Frequency over potency is the key I’ve been missing. I’m ramping up very slowly with a low potency retinol, because I have extremely sensitive skin and don’t want to jeopardize the gains I’ve made in barrier repair. I assumed that it was more important to titrate up in potency than to increase the frequency of application. Thanks to you, I understand what’s most important.
Thank you. Compared to what the other derms on here say, your advice is straightforward and had been beneficial for me. For example, cleansing my skin in the morning is not the best for my dry (but acne prone) skin. Also, double cleansing, even when I use very gentle products often cause my skin barrier to be damaged. I also agree that many people don't know how to use retinoids which leads to the issue. I have been using retinoid serums regularly at night and that has helped with my acne issues a lot.
So glad to hear it!
Excellent explanation!! I have been on retin a for 15 years and I don’t ever want to stop it!! Greetings from Los Angeles!!
You and Dr. Dray are the best. Thank you!
Kind!
I do have an intentional AHA night every third night or so because I find that exfoliating acids help me with shaving and preventing ingrown hairs, whereas retinoids don't really help with that on my skin, and since I can't use leave-on exfoliants in the morning after shaving without causing severe irritation, they have to go at night. But...that's kind of a special circumstance that won't apply to most people, and throwing in an exfoliant or rest nights without a reason doesn't make a lot of sense, especially if someone is able to use retinoids more frequently without issue.
They do help with ingrown hairs
@@johncheffy4775 yeah, the AAD does list retinoids as a possible treatment for pseudofolliculitis barbae, so they apparently work for some people for this, but on my skin, retinoids don't really help with shaving, whereas almost all of the exfoliating acids will.
I shave my face every 2-3 days, and I've successfully prevented razor bumps and ingrown hairs by using a salicylic acid cleanser and a leave-on salicylic toner after shaving. I use the Peach Slices Acne Exfoliating Toner, a $10.99 dupe for the Paula's Choice BHA toner. I'll use the toner the night I shave and the next morning, too.
@@CarrCab I shave every morning and my skin doesn't like salicylic acid after shaving. Exfoliating acids in cleansers are okay so long as I use them before shaving or at night, but they don't work quite as well for me as do leave-on exfoliants.
Thanks Dr. I use retinoid( altreno) 5 times a week and PHA once a week and next day rest for skin with only moisturiser. My skin doesn’t like exfoliants, but ok with retinoid, so I’m heavy on retinoid. So skin cycling of 4 days doesn’t work for me.. well what I do also skin cycling of 7 days, so as you suggest, people should find their own cycle..
Definitely agree. Much better to aim for using a retinoid you tolerate daily than to try and juggle everything
Thanks for the video! Really appreciate it! and I do agree, I'd go either once or twice a week with my BHA/AHA. Also, I usually use my moisturising ingredients (inc. antioxidants and peptides) in the morning. I might take a night off from my retin A if I feel the need to recharge my skin 🙂
Exactly - there's simply no need to skip so many nights of retinoid use, if you're using the right one for the right stage in your skin journey.
You are encouraging me to aim for 5 days/wk of tret. I'm doing every other day right now. Will add a day per week for the next couple weeks.
I haven't done my glycolic acid since starting tret a few weeks ago. I may make it a monthly thing, just to slough off any dead skin. I'm feeling like less is more. Vit C in the morning with sunscreen, tret most nights and bakuchiol the other nights. Moisturizer that's emollient. That's enough for me, though I do love some snail mucin sometimes too, plus argirilene on my 11s.
Thank you so much. All the info out there is very confusing. I had been on daily retinoid, but really struggled with low grade irritation. So I tried skin cycling but it wasn't good enough to keep the acne at bay... so now gone back to daily but I've also decreased exfoliation and focusing on better hydration and for the time being its working well.
Perhaps try a lower potency retinoid or look to strip back the rest of your routine?
Thank you! This skin cycling thing annoys the crap out of me lol who uses a retinA every 4 days? This should be a beginners guide not for people who’ve used skincare for ages it’ll only backtrack you
To me, the point is if you can only use a retinoid every 4 days, you're probably using the wrong one.
People just want to invent new things and get famous 😂
I use all your products and have found my perfect routine for good skin. Your products have given me excellent results. Thankyou so much for all your hard work and superb videos.
I think the optimal formula for retinoids (for me at least) would be tretinoin 6 nights a week + 1 night a week exfoliation.
Mastery of your own skin is the ultimate goal so well done.
Bang on! Sticking to my dermatica treatment! Thanks for this x
Thank you Dr. Sam. Your skin is absolutly gorgeous.
Skin cycling is not for people who want to maintain their skin or their main purpose is for anti aging retinoid alone can help but with acne prone skin skin cycling is the best
I’m in the retinization process and use adapalene on my off days or when I have something important the next day and want to look my best. I used adapapalene for over a year daily and am now switching to Tretanoin.
It’s actually exfoliant before tret
Retinoids will regulate the cycle of the renewal of skin cells so with regular use you won't actually need an exfoliant. Plus it helps to boost collagen production in the dermis and thicken up your dermis leaving you with bouncier and healthier skin, something that exfoliants can't do. While there are some studies that suggest that Glycolic acid can also promote collagen production, it hasn't been as extensively studied as retinoids. I've been a tret user for years and I don't see the need for a separate exfoliant. You'll find many dermatologists who agree with Dr Sam on this matter (Dr Dray and Dr Emma Wedgeworth just to name a few).
@@s_shaleh I’m not disputing anything you said. I’m just trying to point out that dr. Sam got the cycle wrong. Skin cycling suggests that people exfoliate on day 1 and then use tret the next day.
Yes and this is in agreement with what Dr Natalia Spierings has said. The goal is daily use of the gold standard, tretinoin. Cosmetics are pretty much superfluous and can hinder your retinoid efficacy and increase risk of irritation.
You've been a great guide in my skincare journey. Thanks.
I'm delighted.
@@DrSamBunting ❤️
This is exactly what I think about the whole skin cycling thing.
You and dr Dray have very similar issues with this which I trust very much!
Why people want to put names on things to make it a thing is unecessary. Skin cycling. Ahkay
I think it's to simplify things for some ppl as they are just easier to follow
I totally agree! Everything has to have a label nowadays. Ghosting and quiet quitting have existed forever but we have to somehow make it seem like a modern thing.
@@SirSerents using a retinoid without an exfoliant is even more simple .....just saying' :)
@@stregadisalem732 made me think of ‘slugging.’ My goodness! That’s been going on forever! These young kids think they’ve invented the wheel!
Genius! ❤thank you for all you do! Amazingly helpful! Thank you so much!
Welcome!
Isn't retinoid itself an exfoliant too?
No - retinoids improve texture by increasing the speed of cell turnover so they're acting inside the cell rather than outside( as chemical exfoliants do).
@@DrSamBunting thank you.
Thank you for this Dr. Sam! Do you mind telling me your exact shade of lipstick you’re wearing and from what brand? Thank you 😊
When I saw this trend I immediately said Dr. Sam is not going to agree with this . I remember you doing a video saying you would never weigh the benefits of an exfoliant with daily use of a retinoid. Only you and Dr. Dray has brought compelling contradictory arguments against this trend and I am in total agreement with you all. You will always be a fave for me. Your intellectually sound. 🙌🏾
Nothing can beat a retinoid’s ability to regulate/initiate transcriptional activity of our genes, initiate epidermal proliferation that leads to epidermal thickening, stratum corneum compaction and biosynthesis and deposition of glycosoaminoglycans that may improve photoaging, nor can they influence cellular growth and differentiation, cell surface alterations etc. like it.
In other words approach retinoids with caution by using the appropriate strength, Build up the strength of your skin barrier, use azelaic acid and niacinamide where necessary to make your retinoids more tolerable/to reduce any irritation from your retinoids so you maybe able to use your retinoids more frequently because it’s benefits far out weighs that of an exfoliant.
You got it :)
I am up to every other night on my Tretinoin journey. Every time I use even a 2% niacinamide lotion or serum my skin flakes terribly but not any redness or burning. Should I work through the flakies and keep trying? My skin loved it before I started Tretinoin and I have several vehicles of it that I don’t want to sit and go bad. Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated! Thanks 😊
I have just one word: AMEN!
:)
I've found that if I use a retinoid without also frequently using a chemical exfoliant, my face peels and I look scaly and dry. I've assumed this is because the exfoliant is needed to remove the dead skin from the retinoid. Is that actually what's going on, or am I mistaken?
Its a basic regime for a beginner in skincare , I'm fine with Tretinoin and use it every night . I exfoliate with Lactic Acid 10% twice a week and Salicylic Acid 2% Exfoliating Liquid once maybe twice . My Tretinoin have Azelaic Acid 4% and Niacinimide 4% . Azelaic Acid too is amazing ! 🙌👏😊🇬🇧🌈
Exactly: it's a decent routine for beginners or those with extremely sensitive skin. In her book and certain interviews, Dr Bowe mentions that she personally has very sensitive skin, and I think that's whence this routine derives. Where I have concern is people with resistant skin who are using retinoids to manage a condition performing skin cycling because they think it's healthier for skin.
Consider someone with acne who's successfully using adapalene every night and a salicylic acid product every morning without irritation. If they think they need to skin cycle and proceed to lay this out as
Night 1: salicylic acid
Night 2: adapalene
Nights 3 and 4: rest
That may be too mild of treatment and they could experience a resurgence of acne.
@@traepalmer I hear you - but I’d argue that the use of the exfoliant amplifies the risk of irritation unnecessarily and that just using the retinoid until you’ve found the sweet spot for potency/frequency is a far better approach for a beginner.
@@DrSamBunting yes, very true! Deleting the exfoliation night and just starting with a retinoid every third night for the first few weeks is a great introductory retinoid regimen! 🙂
@@traepalmer in the end, it just feels like a dilution of all the education that's been done around how to get through retinization and the end result will be mediocre results, at best, for a lot of people, especially those with acne.
@@DrSamBunting the speed of cell turnover increase due to Retinoid means exfoliating on top will cause more irritation . I'm on Tretinoin 0.05% but before that Differin and Retinal . I do not use Glycolic , only Lactic Acid 10% twice a week . 👏💜😊🇬🇧🌈
Can you please talk about the advantages and disadvantages of Profhilo ? I am 28yrs and was wondering if this would be a good treatment to have, I have leftover acne scars and was wondering if this is a good way to boost skin appearance and hydration.
I use Differin every night and won’t cycle any other products with it. Other than maybe exfoliating once every other week.
Not related but is there a situation where you would recommend switching from adapalene to tretinoin? As I’m nearing 30 I don’t know if it is more beneficial to use one or the other for long term anti aging.
Tretinoin has far more research on it for antiaging than has adapalene, and most of the research on adapalene for anti-aging used the 0.3 % strength, which isn't OTC in the US (only 0.1 % is).
There are no FDA-approved medications for anti-aging (aka "palliation of photodamage") that utilize adapalene, whereas there are for tretinoin (Renova and Refissa) and tazarotene (Avage).
I've been using adapalène for a year but my skin hasn't reached the target yet (I still get pimples from time to time even though I've never stopped using it, use it at least 3-4 times a week)
I started this trend about two weeks ago, but I did not accept the idea of reducing my use of adapalène to twice a week only!
One last question please, is it expected that there will be pimples ( pustules) when I use azelaïc acid (once in the morning for 10 days)
Hi Dr. Sam! Thank you so much for this! I was just thinking about starting skin cycling but I'm already able to use tretinoin almost daily, so I don't think I would be doing this. But I am thinking of adding in tranexamic acid to help with hyperpigmentation...would I be able to use that and my retinoid in the same routine? Or would you recommend I don't use them on the same night? Thanks so much!
I am not convinced by the data on topical TXA - azelaic acid is more compelling and has other skin benefits too. Have you tried it?
@@DrSamBunting yes, I have the same thought about topical Tranexamic acid since Dr Dray said that oral TXA has compelling data, not the topical.
I used skin cycling because it was a pretty straight forward routine. I have just started using a Retinal (Medik8 crystal retinal 1). I also use Paula’s choice azelaic acid for some minor rosacea and have Paula’s choice BHA. After watching the video, my understanding is that I should increase the number of days I use my retinal and decrease the BHA?
Max out the benefits from maybe 2 actives....then see whether you really need a third would be my suggestion.
@@DrSamBunting Thank you! The azelaic acid has helped the redness and mini bumps I would get on my cheeks and forehead, so should I continue using that and the Retinal in my routine? Also incorporating skin barrier strengthening products (with niacinamide, hyaluronic acid and ceramides).
Since you have Roasea you must have dry skin + sensitive skin.... You already use Azelaic and Retinal which are great but I am just wondering why do you also use the BHA exfoliant then since it's made to clear pores for oily congested skin? Just curious...
@@HereDiianas Lol now that you mentioned it…good question!🤔😂 I’ve only recently started using the retinal (about 3 weeks), before that I was using the bha to exfoliate and for blackheads etc and then it just worked for my skin and fit in to the whole skin cycling trend so I just continued with it I guess. I’m thinking to reduce it to once a week now and increase my retinal to every other day, still figuring out when I’m going to incorporate the azelaic acid though.
Some dermatologists (dr dray for example) say that you don't need to use tretinoin everyday ; twice or three times a week will, in the long run, give you the same benefits as everyday use. That idea never made sense to me and i will continue to use tret everyday because my skin can tolerate it and when i look at other users, people who use tret everyday look younger than people who use only twice or three times a week.
it's only after daily use that you can cut back a little, after at least 2 years. Dr Dray did mention that somewhere.
Dafuq is skin cycling? 😂😂😂
I do absolutely need to start using retinoids, though... Right now I'm just alternating between niacinamide one day and vit C + peptides (The Ordinary Buffet) the other day because The Ordinary niacinamide and vit C apparently don't play well together. When I first heard "cycling" I thought you meant something like this, where instead of doing one active for a month and then another active for another month you just alternate between them to not overwhelm your skin, but turned out to be something wholly different
I do know some people who do a few months of tret followed by a few months of exfoliating acids and call it "pulse therapy". The main issue I see with this is that you'd have to re-retinize the skin each time you wanted to start a retinoid "pulse" again.
or you can either use a moisturiser with niac o a serum w/niac. Plus, retinol is use at night, while antioxidants (like VitC or Niaciamide) can be use in the morning (as they help with free radicals). The benefits from retinoids have way better than any antioxidant
@@traepalmer agreed - you don't want to step off, once you've done the work. It's illogical when you think about mechanisms of action.
Fun fact, I'm sure at 100% that Dr. Whitney Bowes "who made it up" never done it and never will. Why? Because she knows perfectly it's NOT effective. Another fun fact, she got all the attention from it because she made all the board certified dermatologist on TH-cam talking about it. And all of them were "kinda" disagree with it, like you with good reasons.
I'm glad that you explained professionally why it cannot work well. 😊 thanks
Yeah all this nonsense about skin cycling. I can’t be bothered. Whatever I am doing is working and my skin is happy 😂