Misunderstood History - Did Roman Legions Really Wear Red?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 พ.ค. 2024
- Did the Roman Legions really wear red? Let's explore the truth behind this common assumption!
The first 100 people to go to www.blinkist.com/invicta are going to get unlimited access for 1 week to try it out. You’ll also get 25% off if you want the full membership.
In this history documentary we seek to question the common depiction of Roman soldiers wearing red. This version of the legions is present virtually everywhere in media from movies like Gladiator and the Eagle to TV Shows like HBO Rome and Spartacus, games like Rome Total War and Assassin's Creed Origins, comics, reenactments, and more. Its really everywhere to the point that Romans in red just seems like a well established fact. However its often a good idea to question things like this that we take for granted. This documentary episode therefore asks whether or not the Romans really wore red.
To begin the video we start with a look at our remaining historical sources in the form of artistic and written records. We also talk about relevant topics like ancient dye production, the qualities of Tyrian purple, and common cleaning methods. With all this in mind we then review the colors of the Roman Legions during the Roman Monarchy, the Roman Republic, and the Roman Empire. The end result is that our initial assumptions are largely unsupported by the evidence.
Timestamps:
2:40 - Visual Evidence
4:40 - Written Evidence
7:50 - Colors of the Monarchy and Early Republic
11:40 - Colors of the Mid to Late Republic
15:00 - Colors of the Empire
Sources and Suggested Reading
"Wearing the Cloak: Dressing the Soldier in Roman Times" by Michael Speidel
"The Roman Army at War 100 BC - AD 200" by Adrian Goldsworthy
“The Babatha Papyri, Masada, and Rome” by G. W. Bowersock
Plutarch's Lives, Volume 3
The Histories of Tacitus
#History
#Rome
#FactOrFiction
Check out our latest episode on the history of Roman Fast Food: th-cam.com/video/v5Qz00eUF5Q/w-d-xo.html
Its worth mentioning that paint pigment fades with time...The pink/red salmon would almost would have been brighter. So historical pictures have to be taken in context of that.
It's also interesting to consider that during battle it would make the most sense to wear a red or brown tunic; dried blood tends to turn one of those shades and an appropriately coloured article of clothing would conceal it better, especially during long campaigns where washing and replacing tunics may have been difficult.
Red also absorbs less sunlight than most other colours which would come in use during long marches. And then there is the fact that red is just more eye catching, making it easy to tell friend from foe on the battlefield, *especially* in wooded areas where brown would act more as camouflage.
Please look at the Pompeii portrait of Mars before you make these videos
@@brokeandtired y
@@brokeandtired that makes a lot of sense. Though part of me kind of wants to envision the legions marching in a dainty pink.
This is the most upsetting thing I’ve learned since learning Santa Claus isn’t real.
Santa Claus was a roman legionnaire
He doesn't actually wear red either.
Cola made Santa Claus wear red. He should be green
You really haven't learned much...
@@stc3145 green?. I knew Coke made the image as we know it today but he was green. My God the propaganda runs deep.
1000 years from now, did the British Empire's soldiers actually wear red? Is the term 'redcoat' a metaphor for something?
Good comparison. I did find something in a newspaper from the 1800s which confidently said Britain's soldiers wore red because knights wore red under their armour, which I'm pretty certain is not the actual reason.
I don't know all of the British and it's history but I don't think the British Empire existed 1000 years ago, didn't they exist like in the 17th, the 18th and the 19th centuries and ye their army used to dress like red I'm pretty sure
@@el_gabron the English started the British empire
@@C0NSTANTINUS I know but I don't think they did it 1000 years ago bruh
@@el_gabron England became Great Britain in 1700s than the uk in 1801 . They could have . You may never know .
My boy Caesar was a red square, the greatest red square to have ever walked the Earth.
You can't possibly understand my appreciation for your username.
And Pompey was a lousy orange square...
Someone ask tribune Aquila if he allows Caesar to be red
He was a multi-faceted man for sure.
The marching tunic was probably red. Gonna go fast!
I see you're a man of culture as well
i certainly hope so
@@cpp3221 *I see you'z a boy of kultur*
Redduns go fasta
RED MAKES FINGS GO FASTA, BLU IZ LUCKY, YELLOW MAKES FINGS GO BOOOOOOOM, PURPLEZ DA SNEAKIEST, AND GREEN IZ DA BEST COLUR WAAAAAAAAAAGGGHHH
I find it oddly fascinating that Roman legionnaires essentially had name tags like modern soldiers do.
Asterix ⚔️ (headshot) Marcus +10
Obelix ⚔️ (assist) Asterix +5
@@comradekenobi6908 LOL
Our ancestors were just as smart as we are. There is a reason we have the saying originality is dead. Applies to more than just writing.
@Elivinture Intelligence is not a measurement of what you know but in how you apply what you know. In this regard our ancestors were the same. The only difference between then and now is the amount of information we have available to us. That doesn't make our ancestors less intelligent by any means.
@Elivinture Thats not true, where as the flow of information is today atributed as a positive change that increased the average iq, it doesnt, in many cases actually the reliance on technology and that almost all information is available at a click made the average person more dumb and more afraid to innovate or think for himself.
Heres a example from Germany, where a student from his last year couldnt do a simple math problem bc he didnt have his pocket computer to do the math for him.
typical: you learn all the history, memorize everything Cicero wrote, and keep the old gods but in the end it comes down to Fashion Souls
Fashion is always the end game bro
You amateurs need to stop bringing Cicero up, he wasn't one of the greats in any aspect he was an idiot who played 2 sides and still lost.
@@SH19922x Cicero was one of the greatest statesmen to ever live.you go protect the republic from civil war I’d like to see you try
@@gucciflipflop6669 Lol your a spastic if you think Cicero done anything other than worm his way around every single subject without accomplishing anything. One single youtube channel is a weeb and in love with Cicero and now all of a sudden hes one of the greatest statesman? Your a twelvie
@@SH19922x found the caesarian
_”Did Romans Wear Red?”_
Me, a Julii fanboy: *ALWAYS.*
Gods I hate Gauls
@@Apples-wi5be
Haha, those city dwellers got butchered by our forresters
Roman Steel in a Brutii fist forever
@@hoodie4439 ew, GREEN Romans tf?? 🤮
@@youvebeengreeked Green romans be rich roman followed by maniacal laughter😁
“Romans were red”
*laughs in Brutii and Scipii
And SPQR
@@KingMswatiIII purple romans best romans
@@Charles2k Although historically, purple uniforms would have been very expensive. But I have to admit, those purple Romans are very cool.
@@kingjimmycraftofcalderonia2017 True, mods like Roma Surrectum or Europa Barbororum probably have the most accurate depictions as we know it today.
....and violets were blue.
Fantastic work. Extremely Well researched. Thanks for posting!
Metatron x Invicta collab when?
@@cc0767 agree
There was endorsement I was looking for before diving in with both feet.
The metatron has spoken
@Alexander Smith at least his un-asked-for opinion was positive.. aw shit who asked for my opinion 🤔
5:41 Also a catch-22, if the default color for military tunics are red, they wouldn't say "red military tunics" they'd just say "military tunic". Which makes it seem more like red military tunics are a common color, but not the only typical color.
I thought the same ^^
Military tunic is the cut of the tunic (probably shorter than an everyday tunic). And the color red could be just one of the potential colors 😉
Maybe red was the color of military officers?
White seems to be the most common color to appear in ancient Roman art however, at least when it comes to the tunics.
No doubt red was also used & perhaps common, but the pop culture image of Roman soldiers dressed mostly in red seems to be inaccurate.
Similarly, if the Romans were about the same height as northern savages, they would never have mentioned height differences. Same with hair colours. Original romans: black hair. Northern savages: lighter in general.
Of course, Rome TW is obviously an accurate depiction of that era, especially when it comes to Egypt.
Was that sarcasm? Are you telling me Egypt didn't really have archers with golden helmets and golden chain mail?
and every gauls had no shirts and were tattooed
I’m sure a good amount of Rome 2 is accurate to what soldiers looked like, not just for the Roman faction. Id say the uniformity depicted in the game wouldn’t be as such with variations in gear. I would love to see their sources for the ‘more information’ tabs. The original rtw is kinda wack
Are you telling me the ancient Brits didn't have armies of head throwers whose hurled heads can do as much damage as small explosives?
@@Stand_By_For_Mind_Control I think it was supposed to be bronze, they just wanted to make them like Ancient Egyptians. Real Egyptians of the Roman era were heavily helenized and sported Greek-fashioned military, that was later romanized.
Yes, Romans always wore red, infact the romans only could see red, purple, blue and green.
Source: Rome total war 1
Blue Rome best rome
2:46 An important detail that you've overlooked is that while the paints used on ancient statuary have mostly faded or chipped away to the point of invisibility, traces of the pigments are still present and detectable with ultraviolet light. This, combined with knowledge of the pigments available to people in ancient times, does allow historians to colorize ancient sculptures with some confidence. From what I've been able to find of colorized depictions of the Columns of Trajan and Marcus Aurelius, there is quite a bit of variety in terms of clothing color (especially among auxiliaries and non-Romans), though red does seem to be a very common (even standard) color for cloaks and/or tunics worn by Roman legionaries. Even if this standardization is symbolic rather than literal, it would suggest that an association between Roman legionaries and the color red goes back quite a long way.
Trajan's Column: www.relivehistoryin3d.com/2019/11/10/trajans-column-full-color-reconstruction/
Column of Marcus Aurelius: www.relivehistoryin3d.com/2019/11/18/column-of-marcus-aurelius-reconstruction-is-in-progress-two-sample-colored-scenes/
You are correct, and it was too bad the video didn't include these resources, but I got the impression that the theme of this was to belittle the large amount of evidence for red military tunics, and inaccurately portray Roman soliders in combat dress in white tunics simply because "Hollywood gave them red tunics" (though in truth, many Hollywood films gave the white tunics on campaing as well!). Many of those old movies also hired the best Roman historians of their day as technical advisors so they did try their best to be accurate. As I previously mentioned, there is a fresco in Pompei that retains its original colors and portrays an armored and helmeted guard in a court, and exactly like the Trajan's Column analysis and colorization, his tunic and cloak are red and his armor grey (likely to simulate iron or tinned or silvered bronze, which was popular in early Imperial times).
Its fascinating to imagine the plain white ruins of roman and greek temples and cities in striking and lush colours. Every boring old white statue would have been colourful.
Julii soldiers are red
Scipii soldiers are blue
Brutii soldiers are green
And senate soldiers are purple.
OHH. a man of culture i see. Good. ¿Did you bought the RTW remaster?
They copied that from star wars!
@@heinzguderian628 bro what
@@PiusAugustus Its a joke
Imperium
In the translation of Tacitus, "colours" refers to standards, not literal colours. So "eagles", "colours" and "standards" are just being used as synonyms.
I think you are putting a modern understanding of something upon something written about 2000 years ago.
Colour is used by modern armies to refer to standards. However this practice is neither universal (linguistically today) nor ancient (as it has become common only in the 18th).
It’s possible that the Romans used the same terminology. However it’s just as possible that it was used literally.
For example, militaries from Italy or Spain do not use the word colour to refer to standards.
@@leonardodavid2842 the word used in the Latin is vexilla, meaning standards or banners. The ambiguity only exists in the English translation, as another comment has said.
@@leonardodavid2842 If you'd just read what I wrote. It says "colours" in the translation, not in the source material....
could the "colours of 4 legions" not refer to "the standards" of the legions and not necessarily refer to the 4 legions actually having different colors?
Yeah. And colours might not even specifically mean a different color. Military uses colours to represent a standard. It's a bit of a leap to assume the Romans are using a modern definition, but so it assuming colours meaning different colours. Issue is context and writing styles is too vague at times.
You’re absolutely correct. The Latin word used is vexilla, which means flags or banners. The ambiguity only exists in the English translation.
Colours and standards can be synonymous in the English language at times too
@@ccbakes haha, I forgot the translation issue
@invicta you've prob seen this by now right?
"It's not pink, it's light-ish red!"
Don't think they'd care because up until modern times pink was seen as a boys color and red as a mans.
I see you are a man of culture ;)
You know, they have a word for that...
There is the British 'hunting pink'
@@mrookeward I learnt something today; I'm British and never knew they called those scarlet jackets that.
Then again not a toff so never been fox hunting. :/
Some timestamps to help you navigate my 20 minute answer to a yes or no question:
2:40 - Visual Evidence
4:40 - Written Evidence
7:50 - Colors of the Monarchy and Early Republic
11:40 - Colors of the Mid to Late Republic
15:00 - Colors of the Empire
Thanks for your videos. Havent watched yet but i know Romans didnt always dress in red. I also assumed they might've worn different colors based on region and leadership. Cant wait to find out. Thanks again
@Invicta, is the second Stormlight archive video coming out soon? It’s been half a year since the last one where you said it would be a series
I think including timestamps in the description gives the viewer the ability to skip along to these points in the video itself.
I sent you an email about the sassanid empire military I hope it helps you
I love your videos. You are so succinct, and don't speculate beyond what is generally known. It is so frustrating to not have definitive answers, but I guess the ancients didn't think we'd be interested in this information 2000 years in the future. If only they'd known. I can't help wondering what Julius Caesar would think of his portrayal 2000 years after his death. 🤔
"To be ignorant of what occurred before you were born is to remain always a child"
Marcus Tullius Cicero
Jokes on him, I know how Earth came to be and he didn't.
@@steelbear2063 he's a baby loooooooooooooool
It's simple. Commanders wore red so that soldiers morale doesn't suffer when a commander is wounded, as they wouldn't see the blood. For the same reason commanders wore brown pants when facing a vastly superior enemy.
True from De Blob 2 in final boss fight facing comrade black in brown.
I know this is probably a joke, but blood is still visible on red clothes. It has a black appearance, so wouldn't actually work for the "to hide the blood" myth.
@@Nutty31313 That's is true.
@@Nutty31313 Nutty.
The spartans wore red tunic for the same reason.
They probably did at some point(s). We know the Spartans unified their outfits for the intimidation factor, and surely the Romans found the same useful through practical experience.
Well they had the same Shield and Cloak etc but they still wore different tunics etc. However as they mostly probably all wore fairly similar tunics anyway, depending on rank or wealth it's a mute point I guess.
@@itarry4 obviously not everything would be uniform but probably if you were to glance at a unit from afar it would probably look like a solid red color or whatever
@@OneRichMofo yhea like I say. Although each Spartan would have just worn whatever tunic they owned its highly likely that especially in such a society they all owned pretty much the same type, style and colour of tunic with very minor differences. Thanks to the uniform nature of the cloak, armour, shield, helmet, grieves, etc as you say, from any sort of distance those slight changes wouldn't have been apparent and the "every man is the same" effect would have been effective.
The only people who may have stood out would be the king and the leaders of the separate phalanx. Although apparently the Spartans had elite units and again maybe these had different design on the shield or wore a different colour but I'm not sure.
@@itarry4 oh and due to the fact that they march toward enemies in silent, having a unified colour and uniform would give their enemies quite the nerve breaking before battle
Imagine a sea of reds in formation just slowly marching toward you in complete silent with only the sound of their step and gear, i would just poo my pant
@@MyHentaiGirlNeko and. I understand why they did it. We're talking about the tunics and other personal items they would have worn. It's nothing to do with why. I know why and I've said a couple of times that the armour, cloak, shield, helmet and grieves would have been a standard same but they'd have all worn slightly different tunics and arm bands etc.
Try reading what we were disgusting better mate.
A breeding "pen" for the snails used by Romans for purple die has been found demonstrating it was an industry as thousands of snails were needed for the die.
and die they did. RIP my gastro -nomic- pod friends.
Or in other words, red was the cheapest dye, plus it conceals blood the best.. And at a certain time they have mass produced their battle tunics. Finally, the one surviving roman shield - its indeed red. So yes, it all points out in favor of the assumption that they wore red - at least for battle. Perhaps they had formal white tunics and casual grey tunics as well, and perhaps the senior officers wore a purple tunic - but a Roman soldier wore red when going to battle.
Roman soldiers definitely wore tunics of different colors based on the circumstances, just as soldiers today wear different types of uniforms depending on the duty. For fatigue duties they would wear undyed, off white linen or woolen tunics like any common laborer of the period, and for dress occasions they would wear bleached white tunics usually deorated with Clavii stripes like any other Roman citizen, but for wartime campaigning under armor, the best evidence indicates they wore dyed tunics to help mask the inevitable grime and blood to maintain a neat, military appearance, and Madder red is the most likely candidate as the archaeology and pictorial evidence confirms.
Idk if they wore red, but I know they would have marched to Parthia with Caesar.
Great video as always.
And it would've been another pointless invasion that would've ended in stalemate or defeat...no different from the invasions of Parthia by Crassus, Marc Antony, and Trajan...or the several centuries of stalemate in the Roman-Sassanid wars.
Guys, he said he was going to make a Part 3 to what if Julius Caesar lives. I’m tired of random comments telling me how they think it would have gone. Me and hundreds of others aren’t asking you. We’re asking Invicta.
@@caesarshotdogchampion8738 Well said man. I too am tired of waiting. Caesar was not a mediocre general like Crassus or Antony, and he was superior to Trajan. Things could go differently. #CAESARLIVES
@@Armorius2199 Trajan was an excellent general, and Marc Antony was a good general - not a mediocre general. Even Crassus was more of an average general and isn't nearly as bad as pop culture portrays him out to be. People play up Caesar mainly because much of what we know about Caesar comes from Caesar's own writings (with a hefty dose of propaganda) that played up his own victories, downplayed his defeats, and tried to spin his defeats into victories (eg. his failed first invasion of Britain that he turned into a propaganda victory). It's a recurring theme in Caesar's battles to get himself stuck in bad situations where he is surrounded and stuck with low supplies...and he escapes to fight another day or edges out a victory thanks in part to a good dose of luck. Any Roman who wrote their own history would've made themselves look far better than they actually were in reality,
@@Intranetusa man stfu is not that serious 😂
Units in History: "Genoese Crossbowmen" when?
They're so op in Medieval 2 Total War
I want to hear about the proto crossbows that have links to syracuse apparently.
@@WelcomeToDERPLAND Do you mean the gastraphetes? Or something else?
Banana where?
@@WelcomeToDERPLAND There likely isn't enough information about the ancient Greek proto-crossbowmen to make a video about it. There are a few scant historical references to the Gastraphetes with some basic drawings, but not much more than that.
And in Asterix, they kinda deviated by making Romans Green.
they varied in some books, but often had green tunics, and red shields, in retrospect it might have been just the italian colors.
@@ernstschmidt4725 Just checked... Green tunics with white frames and red pants. The italian flag. The shields were blue. - ...since when did Romans wear pants?
Mainly for there face coler
@@Barbarossa125 They had pants for colder climates.
That's why I started playing the Brutii, green was a more natural colour for the Romans for me
"if you take anything away from this video, it should be the understanding that reality is far messier than we'd like it to be." Yup. This exactly.
Your channel is one of my favorites because you go over sources and their credibility when discussing historical events. It's a quality that is rare, thank you
This seems like way too dry and detailed a topic for a video, and I absolutely love that Invictus dived right into it. I’d never questioned my assumptions on the colours of roman uniform, and from now on, I’ll think about this differently. Well done!
The Blood Angels are one of the LEAST "Roman" Legions
they are the Best Legion >:)
Meanwhile the Ultramarines aka Space Romans are Blue Da Ba Dee Da Ba Di
wasn't the original picture of Imperial fist and not blood angels?
Yeah, the original image is of the Imperial Fists (you can still see their insignia on one of the banners) but somebody spent a lot of time recoloring the image and changing the insignias in the foreground
@@TheAngelofBaal of course *you* would say that, Hawk Boy
Thank you so much for this video! I've been waiting since your announcement and it was well worth the wait. Love your content, and I'm going to keep recommending you to others.
This was extremely informative! I was looking forward to this, thank you so much!
The Roman Army as a professional force was very practical. I would expect that leaning toward a light red or reddish brown tunic would be most practical for campaign because of constant dirt, grime and blood, although the romans were fastidious and not averse to extra duty. It just seems impractical to have an army marching and fighting in white, except possibly officers. Shields specific to unit has to be assumed as it helps in identity and unit pride. The shapes and size being necessarily uniform
Bleaching linen and wool white was most cost effective means of coloring clothes. Obtaining the dyes for reds, blues and yellows was much more time consuming and costly. Being practical concerning logistics it makes perfect sense for the Romans to have their soldiers in white.
@@larkturner7136 Wrong. Madder red dye was cheap, common, and there is plenty of archaeological evidence to prove it was used by the Roman Army. As experimental archaeology has proven, on campaign a bloodstained Madder red tunic can be quickly rinsed out and will look clean again, whereas a white tunic needs to undergo a time consuming and expensive bleaching process and even then it is very difficult to get the blood stains out. Yes, fatigue tunics were unbleached, light color cloth, and full dress tunics were bleached a brilliant white , but all of the extant evidence suggest that "war tunics" worn in combat under armor were usually red. See my detailed critique of this video above.
@@danpeterson114 Madder red dye was common in the area around the city of Rome. The problem is that most legions were organized and raised far from Rome itself. Why would the Romans spend the resources to ship large amounts of dye from Rome when they can source local dyes and save resources and time. Hence it makes sense that Roman soldiers would be depicted in various colors including white.
@@larkturner7136 Wrong again! Madder red wool cloth fragments have been found all over the Empire, from the Roman fort at Newstead in Scotland to red cloth fragments from the Roman garrison at Masada in Israel. Also found in Israel is a complete deep red wool tunic from the period of the Bar Kochba Revolt during the reign of Hadrian. It was probably captured Roman war booty like several other items found in the same cave. A deep red woolen tunic with purple trim was also found in the Thorsberg Moor in Germany which was a Germanic votive offering site which contained numerous items of captured Roman equipment, and in all probability the tunic was Roman as well. Of course the Romans soldiers used white tunics too, though, as unbleached, undyed, off white tunics were the cheapest of all, worn by laborers, and in garrison, doing manual labor, these would be worn instead of the more valuable red "military" tunic, worn while on campaign. This is no different than today where cheaper coveralls are worn in garrison doing manual labor, while the more expensive and sophisticated uniform is the combat uniform. For dress occasions a bleached white tunic with Clavi stripes, the mark of a Roman citizen, would be worn by Roman legionaries with their best military belt with dagger and sword, but never under armor. All of this is discussed in my Roman Army book.
@@danpeterson114 what's your book called bro
When is avenging varus episode coming i love that series
Same here
?
Hopefully soon
Yes we need to know the Vengeance of The Rum
Yah that episode left on a major cliff hanger I didn’t see that coming...I thought my computer was broke when the video stopped but then I realized the video was over ....☹️☹️
Really well-made and researched. I love the visualizations paired with the engagement of various primary sources and their limitations. Makes it so easy for anyone to follow and understand.
What a thorough, well researched presentation, this was more educational than many of my college history classes.
Thank you! Very well done!
Just as a quick note about the quote from "the Histories", A unit's Colours may not refer to the colour of their uniform but the Military Colours, Standards, and guidons. It's the reason why modern flag carriers are often called the Colour Guard. Not saying I am right just saying that your statement that you can tell the different units by their colours MAY BE because of the different standards (like seeing modern military patches) and not because of the colour of their uniform.
That's how I read that passage as well.
I thought this as well. I would want to see the translation notes there.
You are correct. But this is just the "tip of the iceberg" of all of the things inaccurate about this video. See my long reply above -- his main piece of supposed "evidence", the "Alexandria Mosaic" is not even depicting Roman soldiers, they are Macedonians of King Ptolemy I, and made centuries before the Roman Imperial period he claims it depicts!.
Excellent point.
6:27 Is that not a translation to 'colour' as in regimental flag rather than literally the colours of the uniforms? What does the original Latin say?
I just posted a comment talking about the same thing. When I was in the military the term colors referred to the flags, unit flags and the United States flag among others.
Not sure how far back that application of the word goes or if it's a translation matter but it's worth looking into.
The quote in question is from Tacitus' Histories: book 2, passage 89. I'll look for the original Latin and comment again
Correct, this was not referring to colors! The source says: "quattuor legionum aquilae per frontem totidemque circa e legionibus aliis vexilla" or "Four Legions' eagles were in front, and around it were many other Legions' VEXILLA". Vexilla does not mean colors, it means "standards". Invicta's translation was just using modern military jargon
@@jr8260 apparently ancient Egypt is the first place to use colours to separate units etc.
@@villefere6968 go to the library of alexandria and read about it
Fantastic! I've been looking forward to this since it was announced! Love your channel!
Awesome video man! I love how you go into detail explaining all the various data points you found!!
You forgot the New Testament. In it, the Gospels mention a red or purple (some scholars believe this refers to a faded red) military cloak.
Problem with that is that is a religious text with a bias towards a certain viewpoint so there can be cause for the text to be inaccurate for a certain purpose.
But why would you lie about the color of a piece of clothing? We use the Iliad as historical evidence and that is also a religious text. The New Testament has proven to be historically accurate.
@@ethanmaranto8063 The Iliad is Not used as a historical text but is used as a reference to the cultural values of the time. Historians debate whether or not Troy even existed. As for the institutions that say that the Bible is historically accurate most if not all are Christian institutions that have a clear bias is saying the Bible is historically accurate when there is conflicting evidence against otherwise. For example the Bible states that the earth and life was created in six days when geographic evidence points to it taking billions of years to do so. Now as for why they may lie about the color of the Romans there could be plenty of reasons. Red is often the color of violence and the Romans killed Jesus when they nailed him to a cross so red to paint them as savages or murders. Or it could be that they didn’t lie and were speaking true fully about the matter. The thing is we don’t know if they are speaking true fully of the matter becuase the Bible is not a book of science but a book of faith.
@@sanguisbumb6138 dude troy was literally found in the 1980's already... it existed lol
@@sanguisbumb6138 but didn’t Schliemann proved that Troy existed?
When it talks about distinguishing the troops from their “colors”, it's talking about the units standards/flags. Our military today calls it the same thing and it's from the Roman army. The person designated to carry the standards is called the color bearer.
Invicta, thank you for all the time and effort, no doubt you invest countless hours into your videos. The quality makes it clear you really put a lot of time and effort into these. Thanks so much for all your hard work
I love all the small parts of history you cover. Things we may not consider, or make assumptions of. You delve deep to bring us the truth.
Love the channel
"Imposing sight" is a very likely Roman characteristic, impressing the natives. An easily identifiable uniform in battle is also a meaningful theme. Color-coded units make sense, too. Vast amounts of fabric dye on a global scale would be a major expense, standardized or not, and availability in regions another consideration. A very useful video.
Archaeology and period literature proves that regular rank and file legionaries often had belt plates of solid silver, and gold and enamel inlaid sword and dagger scabbard and other very expensive personal equipment that they paid for themselves. They were highly paid professionals. That clearly being the case, and the fact that Madder Red was a very inexpensive dye makes it ridiculous to imagine they wouldn't have red tunics if they wanted them, not to mention the preponderance of evidence that proves they had them..
Thank you for another amazing and informative video llve how I depth you all always go through in each videos and I love the breakdown! Makes it easier to go back and watch my favorite parts again! Which is always the entire video 😆
I enjoy how impartial you're about the information that you have and only presenting the facts in which we have at this time.
If the earliest depiction of the Romans in red is from 1600, perhaps it was the scarlet clothes of the Roman Catholic cardinals that inspired the association of red with the Romans in art?
Or perhaps the cardinals adopted scarlet red because that was a favored color by the roman officers.
I think that the church using the colors of the roman politicians is more of a continuation of the same practice rather than an adoption (many rich families working for the republic/empire simply joined the curch once it became important)
But that is NOT the earliest depiction of Roman soldiers in red tunics, as my book and many other books confirm, there are numerous contemporary ancient Roman depictions of Roman soldiers wearing red tunics under their armor, but virtually no evidence of Roman soldiers wearing white tunics under their armor, though they did have unbleached natural white work tunics and bleached white dress tunics worn WITHOUT armor. The person who created that video were not even aware that their supposed main evidence for white tunics for Roman soldiers in armor, wasn't even a Roman source, but are Ptolemaic Greeks!
6:24 Colours doesn't necessarily mean the literal colour of the item in this context, Military colours often refers to a banner, flag, emblem or others used to identify. Colours could've been used to refer to the banners of the individual legions.
Always appreciate the thorough research and responsible way you present it.
I wasn't sure about this segment, but it was surprisingly informative. Kudos!!
At 6:30 when discussing the "colors" representative of each unit.
When I was in the military, the term "colors" referred generally to the flags, one being the United States flag, the others being various unit flags, later of which were all the same color scheme.
I'm not sure how far back the term "colors" being used for flags goes but maybe that's how it is meant. It could also be framed in that sense by whoever translated that document.
Basically the word "colors" in a military setting could potentially mean flags and not necessarily literally mean varying colors in this context.
I actually like the fact that soldiers back then could basically customize their own look( with a bit of regulation of course).
It kinda makes you think about what their lives where like or kinda tells their personality in a way. I just love looking at some of the old arts and seeing the variety of colors and armor sets together, it really makes the person stand out from the crowd.
Yes, there was probably never another army in history where "rank and file" soldiers spent more of their own money to make their military equipment as splendid as they could, though it was also way they could transport their wealth -- for they could sell their rich equipment to someone else when they eventually retired.
For a modern example, think of retail workers who are told "wear X colour tops, and X colour bottoms" and see how all the workers go with that.
Omg, great topic. You guys keep nailing it!
Loved the focus on questioning pre conceptions and tracing where they come from and detailing exactly what we know!!
I can't put into words why this was so incredibly fascinating to me.
It's like how Romans are always portrayed with British accents.
Asterix & Obelix portrayed Roman legionnaires with blue shields and green tunics.
why is that anyway? rather odd to go against a popular sterotype like that especially for a children's show.
Awesome work. Love this channel!
Well presented and informative as always!
In the translation of Tacitus "Colours" the translator may be talking about the unit standards. You'd have to see the original text to be able to tell.
I haven't watched the video yet, but I wanted to make a prediction:
Casual people: "They wore red to hide blood and intimidate their enemies"
Me, a former Logistician: "It was the cheapest color for an entire army to use."
Really enjoyed this style of video. Wonderful content
Well researched. Thank you for your passion for history and ability to share it with us.
Not actually all that well researched at all. Like most of his videos
What did Roman Soldiers wear in Winter? We always see them in that typical thin tunic but never in any cold weather clothes.
I believe they only had their cloaks to keep them warm in the mediterranean but would adopt local clothing such as trousers when campaigning in the north
Pants, cloaks, wool socks,etc
I once read about how they wear baggy, thick pants under their armour in Hadrian's wall
Not comfy, I know but it is what it is
6:40 as you point out we're not sure about the antiquity, however in middle ages proper and early modernity we see plenty of cases where "colour" is synonymous with the banner or crest
even today.
i love your videos man keep up the good work
Thank you for putting in the effort of research God bless you this channel is awesome for a military history lover like myself this channel is awesome
0:41 I see A Celestial Vorticanum, some Knights of the Empire and Thorgrim Grudgebearer in the central bookshelf. Also, Blood Angels reference a few seconds before that. Any Warhammer hobbyists here?
interesting topic, anyway!
Cringe
Excuse me?
There is a serious issue with economies of scale: they have limits. Basically after a point there are no savings made by keeping just 1 colour. In fact the price might go up because you will run out of raw materials. Basically mass production at that scale probably meant that there were several colours for tunics.
Also, purple shields were used for special units.
Very good video again! I'm glad I found this channel. Really cattures my imagination that there was more variety in the Roman military.
Very good video, being a amateur historian with roman era my favourite I found your video very informative well done really enjoyed it.
"Sword and Sandals" would be a GREAT title for a Rome-set piece of media. (show, game, movies...)
There’s an old flash game about gladiators by that name.
Or a mount and Blade Rome mod
That was a collective title for the fantasy adventure movies set in ancient Greece and Rome that were made in the 1950's and 60's.
The answer is simple, the Julii wore red, the Brutii wore green, and the Scipii wore blue.
Someone played a little too much Rome : Total War
@@whatamidoingwithmylife4108 There's no such thing as too much Rome: Total War
@@angeleyes2c Uhhh when you find yourself playing pontus, or numidia, i think that's the appropriate time to turn off the computer, and go outside to get some fresh air.
I had many questions about the colors, but man you are genius, you answered them all ♥
Who is drawing those amazing illustrations?
this reminds me of many misconceptions about spartans.
you learn something every day :D
Very interesting topic. Something I never really thought about before I saw your video.
It never really made sense that every Roman soldier’s tunic would be red considering the scale of the Roman army and how often they would need to be replaced. Despite how cheap red is in the long run that’s a lot of money the state would be spending to dye disposable clothing.
yeah but they're not gonna look good on tv. :-)
Could have been an expense levied on the troops, to get their uniform dyed just like modern soldiers were responsible for keeping their uniformed pressed and polished. Like showing up to formation in pink would get you in deep shit for not keeping up with your obligations because you let your uniform get sun-bleached.
Source: My own life experiences.
Eh, the romans also enforced their standard castrum design on every terrain, even if it meant additional work compared to just use natural defenses. The romans cared much for their impression, i really dont see why this shouldn't apply to their tunics and other gear. Especially since individual production gets easier and cheaper the more you mass produce.
@@LegioXXI In the ancient artistic depictions of Roman soldiers they often don't look uniform. A number of tunic colors are seen of which red is only one, and red is less common than white in their art.
0:15 Ironically, the faction in Warhammer 40k that is most modelled after Rome wears blue. ;)
The image used is also originally of the imperial fists, you can see some of the insignias where the remaker of the image hasn't bothered to change it to the BA one
actually, it makes sense, they(Ultras) are space Marines and marines in Rome wore blue tunics ;)
high quality content, thanks!
You are very careful in your assumptions! A great quality! Excellent video!
You could always ask Metatron for an opinion; I'm not saying he will always have the correct historical context, but he sure lives and breathes Roman history and strives to be as correct as possible...... could be a nice coop.
th-cam.com/video/9c-c39T1xeI/w-d-xo.html
He actually commented on this video already
This Production should be sponsored by the Guild of Millers. True Roman Bread for True Romans!
Holy Smokes! What a great upload! I could watch stuff like this all day!
Very well-researched video! Thank you.
A military unit's "Colours" can mean their standards, or banners. It has nothing to do with what color the uniforms are.
Are you talking about the histories quote? He did at least specify both separately so I suppose its possible that in this case it was separate
Anyone here ever seen Scorsese’s “Last temptation”? Great movie, but the costumes they chose for the Legions are atrocious. Literally made me laugh out loud 😭
Don't forget that one ridiculous scene in the temple where the Legion are shown jumping off rooftops like they were ninjas.
I'm more of a Bill and Ted fan myself
@@casper2694 lmao I wish I could forget that scene
I had to look it up. The scene where they were dragging Jesus across the dirt looked akin to bondage gear.
Thank you for your videos and providing information. It is provided in a clear and unbiased manner as I wish all history was taught.
Very cool subject. Thx for the video.
Can't remember where I saw it but this is a similar preconception to everyone in Antiquity wearing bracers. Also it's probably completely historically inaccurate but the Praetorian guard in the movie Gladiator had epic uniforms, purple tunics with black lorica segmentata.
I would think a red tunic, even light red tunic would be easier to "clean" after beeing soked/splattered in blood?
That's what I thought as well. Blood stains are very hard to get rid of, so having a redish tunic will cover it up.
Blood stains are brown, though, as the iron in red blood cells rusts. Cloth would be cleaned thoroughly and then bleached or blued to hide any remaining stain.
There is more ancient art of Roman soldiers wearing white than red, and white appears at least as much as red in the written sources.
The evidence seems to point towards white being more common than red, though both were used.
I love that Invicta has brought the details of the past alive! Not just an over wash of battles and political states, but the everyday life. Though I love the big battle ones too!
One of my favourite videos that you've made!
The Colours of other legions may refer to the "standard" or flag of a unit and not the clothes they wore. This is a common term that could have been interpreted from original Latin text depending on who translated it. Just a thought.
Interesting that you bring up Rome: Total War. Now, on the Roman side, you have three factions: Red In The North, Blue in the Center or Rome, and Green in the south. Was Green Used?
That was purely a gameplay convention.
It is probable than during the many Roman civil wars the opposing armies didn't look all that different from one another, and were mostly distinguished from one another by their standards and perhaps shield designs.
There is art from the period of a Roman soldier wearing a green tunic. He is the only one however and the other soldiers in the same artwork are mostly wearing white.
White tunics seem to be the most common in Roman art.
@@lycaonpictus9662 That sounds awful. Why wouldn't you distinguish yourself from your enemy?
Another great video. Thank you.
I'm frankly impressed that this 20 minute video with the ultimate answer of "nobody really knows for sure so maybe" was still super interesting and entertaining
In Denmark we have had some restoration done one some old buildings painted red. The main ingredient was ox blood... would that not have been a method used in roman times?
Doesn't blood rust to brown immediately, or did you conserve the colour somehow?
@@Barbarossa125 Dont know about clothing, but oak doors that are more than 200 years old painted with oxblood look very red...
I'm not a historian, but I would imagine that when thinking about mass produced stuff, oxblood would just be too expensive compared to using plant material. An ox does take way more material to raise than plants do to grow
the wood was soaked in the blood for preservation purposes, not to be painted. Just to withstand worms
There already was a plant based dye called Madder that we know was used to dye cloth red in Roman times, and traces of it has been found in cloth fragments found at Roman forts.
Really good video!! Thank you!
You just influenced s refusing for my graphic novel on the Punic Wars, I tried to vary colors a bit but I'm going to go back and double down. Thanks abd great video!