Lenses that swirl. Photos and lists. Add your own swirly, Petzval and twisted bokeh lenses!
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 พ.ค. 2024
- Do you like swirls? A look at old and new lenses and some unconventional lenses. There are a lot more options than Helios lenses!
Links to each section:
00:00 Introduction
01:31 How lenses swirl
04:54 My top old swirly lenses
11:46 Other suggestions
12:22 New/recent lenses
12:39 Unconventional lenses
13:28 Conclusions
All donations to help support my work on this channel will be most welcome. PayPal email: simons.utak1@gmail.com - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
It’s on the list already, but the TTArtisan 27mm f2.8 is a fascinating one. It doesn’t swirl as much as the most vintage swirly lenses, but it’s a cheap, compact autofocus lens for mirrorless cameras, and 27mm on APS-C is nearly wide-angle. That makes it a really different experience than an adapted 58mm film lens. On something like a Fuji X-E or Sony a5x00 camera, the setup could fit into a jacket or hoodie pocket. I think there’s something special about that combination of traits, even if it gives up some of what’s special about a Helios 44.
Lists of lenses.....
My old lenses discussed in the video:
Carl Zeiss Biotar 58mm f2
Carl Zeiss Jena Pancolar 50mm f2
Cosina 50mm f1.7 and f2
Cosina 55mm f1.4
Helios 40
Helios 44 series (44, 44-2, 44-3, 44M-4, [44M-5], 44M-6, 44M-7l)
Petri 50mm f2
Schneider-Kreuznach Rollei SL Xenon 50mm f1.8
Takumar 100mm f2 (borrowed)
Takumar Ultra-Achromatic 85mm f4.5 (borrowed)
Takumar 58mm f2.4
Auto-Takumar 35mm f2.3
Takumar 50mm f1.4 (various versions)
Other old lenses suggested in the video:
Carl Zeiss Jena Biotar 75mm f1.5
Carl Zeiss Ultron 50mm f1.8
Helios 81H
Leitz Wetzlar Xenon 50mm f1.5
Leotax Leonon 5cm f2
Schneider Retina Xenon 50mm f1.9
Takumar 55mm (various speeds/versions)
Tomioka 55mm f1.2 (various brands)
Voigtländer Nokton Prominent 50mm f1.5
Yashica Auto Yashinon 5cm f2
Yashica Yashinon DS 50mm f1.7
Zenitar MC M-2 50mm f2
Old lenses suggested in the comments below (to be expanded!):
Auto Sears/Rikenon 50mm f1.7
Canon FL 58mm f1.2
E Ludwig Meritar 50mm f2.9
Leica Noctilux 50mm f1.2
Leica Summarit 50mm f1.5
Meyer-Optik Gorlitz Trioplan 50mm f2.9 Red V
Voigtlander 75mm f1.8 Helios
New/recent lenses listed in the video:
Lensbaby Burnside 35
Lensbaby Twist 60
Lomography Petzval 80.5mm f1.9 MKII Bokeh Control Art Lens
Lomography Petzval 55mm f1.7 MKII Art Lens
Mitakon Zhongyi Speedmaster 50mm f0.95 Mark III
TTArtisan 27mm f2.8
Zenit MC Helios 40-2
Zenitar 50mm f1.2 S
Zenitar 75mm f1.4 Helios Edition
New/recent lenses suggested in the comments below:
Meyer-Optik Görlitz Biotar 58 F1.5 ii
Meyer-Optik Görlitz Biotar 75 F1.5 ii
Unconventional lenses listed in the video (antique, cine, projector, CCTV etc):
ŁZK LUCAR 50mm f1.6
Carl Zeiss Kipronar 105mm f1.9
Carl Zeiss Kipronar 120mm f1.9
Cinestar 75mm f1.9
Darlot Paris 2 1/2 inch f2
Dellmeyer Speed Anastigmat 1 inch f1.5 cine lens
Elgeet Cine Navitar 2 inch f1.5
Fujian 35mm f1.7 CCTV Lens
H Roussel Paris Kylux 65mm f1.6
Lerebours & Secretan Paris 240mm F5 Petzval Brass Lens
Ross 1 inch f1.9 cine
Taylor Hobson Cooke Kinic 1 inch f1.5
Wollensack Oscillo-Anastigmat 75mm f1.9
Zoomar Zoomatar 75mm f1.3
Unconventional lenses suggested in the comments below:
Carl Zeiss Kipronar 140mm f1.9
16KP 50mm f1.2 Soviet projector lens. Also sold as a Lomo PO-109-1A.
Tair 41-M 50mm f2 (for 16mm movie cameras)
More lenses suggested in the comments...to follow in due course...(when I have time!!!). Please excuse me if I've not got round to your suggestion yet!
In addition to new lenses I would suggest the Meyer Optik Görlitz Biotar 75 f1.5 II.
@@ministerstein Likely the second most expensive swirly lens next to the authentic Carl Zeiss Biotar 75.
Have witnessed swirls with the following:
Fotasy 35mm f/1.6 (MFT)
Fujian 25mm f/1.4 (MFT)
Canon FL 58mm f/1.2 (FF)
Canon FL 55MM F/1.2 (used with a Pixco 0.7x focal reducer on Fuji APS-C)
Canon FL 28mm f/3.5 (used with a Pixco 0.7x focal reducer on Fuji APS-C)
Steinheil-Auto-Cassarit 100mm f/3.5 (used with a Zhongyi 0.71x focal reducer on Fuji APS-C)
Old manual Nikkor Ai-s 85mm f1.4 with 0.7 speed booster - Kipon Baveyes N/G-NIK Z 0.7... keep it on full frame and it is swirl beast with 59.5mm f0.98 parameters, however it works best with 1:1 aspect ratio, or close to it...
It swirls so nicely, and set up is so much lighter and versatile than famous Helios 40, that I sold my Helios 40, as no longer using it...
Also, all projector lenses designed for 16mm film, swirl on the full frame....😊😊
Old manual Nikkor Ai-s 85mm f1.4 with 0.7 speed booster - Kipon Baveyes N/G-NIK Z 0.7... keep it on full frame and it is swirl beast with 59.5mm f0.98 parameters, however it works best with 1:1 aspect ratio, or close to it...
It swirls so nicely, and set up is so much lighter and versatile than famous Helios 40, that I sold my Helios 40, as no longer using it...
Also, all projector lenses designed for 16mm film, swirl on the full frame....😊
Many thanks. Yes, on cine lenses, I've recently acquired a Dallmeyer Speed 1 inch f1.5, c-mount. It fits into a APS-C frame and swirls like mad!
Thanks for making these videos, Simon. You're the bomb and these videos will help people for a good long time.
Other versions are already on your list, and I love the look I get from the Zeiss Kipronar 140mm f/1.9 projector lens. I also just picked up the Meyer Optik Görlitz Biotar 75mm f/1.5 II, and it has beautiful swirls, and is an amazing lens.
The Nikon 10.5mm apsc fisheye lens for Nikon DSLR's also has an extensive swirl at close focusing distances wide open. Combine that with the fisheye effect and you get some really unique looking images.
Don't forget the Lensbaby Twist60, modeled after the old Petzvals and Helios 44 lenses. You can buy it as an optic if you already have the optic swap system or as a lens.
A couple or three lenses that have the swirl effect to some degree; Meyer Optik Domiplan, Industar 50-2 and the modern ttartisan 35mm f1.4 and the 17mm f1.4 to a lesser extent.
Another wonderful resource. Thanks so much for all the effort you have put into creating this video and also for establishing a list of swirly lenses. There isn't anyone else like you on TH-cam.
I own several swirly lenses. Helios 40, Helios 44 and Helios 44-M with front element reversed. True, the Helios 40 is quite a beast. They will only swirl in the right conditions, though when they do it's always a thrill.
Also own some of the other lenses you mentioned, including the Auto Rikenon ‘Tomioka’ 55mm f1.4 and
Auto Rikenon 'Tomioka' 50mm f1.7. While I don't necessarily expect them to swirl, the Bokeh balls do elongate towards the edges. An excellent list and growing. Some might make there way onto a wish list.
Simon, can’t stop watching your videos, you got me hooked !!!
I am even giving up le Salon de la photo here in Paris this week end to go hunting for some new lenses.
Thank you for the outstanding videos, I told you I am hooked 😂❤
Thank you for another FANTASTIC video...I"m always inspired to go on a vintage lens hunt after watching your presentations!!
I now have some gems and they are SO much fun to work with...turning "blah" scenes into something interesting....
Have a GREAT day my friend!!
CC
I was not expecting such an exhaustive list, fantastic video!
I have several generic CCTV lenses (M 4/3 seems to be a good censor size for them). Swirls galore and a cheap way to decide if you like the effect.
The Rokkor-X 50mm f1.4 is kinda swirly wide open but it's subtle unless you're right up on something. A more character filled swirly lens though is the Agfa Solinette II 50mm f3.5. It's a triplet so it has soap bubble bokeh on top of the swirl. it's a bit fiddly to use however because you more or less have to remove the entire mechanical assembly, lock it in bulb mode and put it on a helicoid adaptor.
This has peaked my curiosity, I have some older lenses that I still use, such as the Pentax M 50mm f-1.4 that I have not used in a while. Great video.
what a great initiative, thank you so much!
Leitz Summitar 5cm f2 is a very swirly/painterly lens wide open. You should try it, it’s beautiful!
one of my favorite is the canon FL 58mm f1.2, swirls like a helios but faster
I have this lens, love it, makes a really distorted image if you use it with extension tubes though
thanks for the video, lately im thinking about add some of M42 swirly lenses on my collection and this video very helpful to me. by the way because most of your collections for SLR ill add few RF (specifically M39) lenses you could consider to collect in a future. Sankyo Kohki W-Komura 35mm F2.8, w-nikkor.c 3.5cm f2.5 ltm, Chiyoko SUPER ROKKOR 45mm F2.8, NOKTON Classic 35mm F1.4 II (just little bit of swirl), Leica Noctilux-M 50mm F1.2 (re-issue, yeah its bit pricy but can make swirly image very easily even much easier than legendary original one)
Many thanks for this interesting list of lenses to consider! It fuels my LBA....
The 7artisans 25mm T1.05 vision lens, originally designed for APS-C, delivers some of the most surreal and swirliest bokeh when used on a full-frame camera.
Additionally, here's a super cool trick to achieve swirly bokeh with ANY lens: cut a circle of black paper with a hole in the middle, slightly smaller than the lens's opening, and place it in front of the lens. I wouldn't have believed it myself, but it works like a charm!
One of my favorite lenses, which also swirls, is the Tair 41-M 50mm f2. It has the rare Kiev-16 mount which has to be adapted to M39 and then further to whatever camera mount you're using.
Works well on my MFT Olympus, i doubt it covers an APSC sensor but certainly not full frame.
I like it because of that, the swirl of for example a Helios-44 would get mostly cropped away by the small sensor of my Olympus.
Спасибо за ролик. Из всех Гелиосов мне нравятся 44-3 и 81Н. А недавно приобрел Зенитар 1.9 тоже очень понравился рисунок и потрясающая резкость, а вот до него был 1.7 не понравился своей рваной диафрагмой на ф2, 2.8. Жду ещё новых роликов. Вам огромное спасибо за ваши тесты и обзоры!!!!
Kudos for the hardwork!
The fixed lens on the Vivitar 35es gives a nice and subtle swirl under the right conditions
Hi Simon, the Ludwig meritar 50mm 2.9 swirls like a beast, I'd say it's probably more swirly than the 44-2, it differs from the helios because the swirly bokeh on the meritar stays an oval shape becoming thinner towards the outside of the frame and I'd say the helios goes more of an elliptical shape with sharp ends. I really like the photos I get from the lens but it's an absolute pain to use, it's different from any other lens I've used, I'm constantly catching the push pull preset ring turning the focus the wrong way or turning both the focus and aperture at the same time. I think with a lot of regular use muscle memory would kick in but at the moment for me it's a real juggling act of a lens, certainly not one that you can be just whipping out and taking a quick photo of a moving subject! I'd recommend you pick one up if you see one they're very cheap and they're a lovely very little compact lens, just a shame that they were seemingly designed by someone crazy!
you're legendary for this yo!
Let me start by thanking you for your exceptional series of videos, I have watched all of them and very often more than once. For swirly lenses, I have had some great results with the Canon FD 58mm f1.2 and the FD 55mm f1.2. The former is slightly more charactered with Thorium glass but it also has a very tricky mount that was improved upon for the 55mm which is not thoriated.
I have one of the Taylor Hobson Cooke Kinic 1 inch f1.5, and can verify that it's swirly. I also have the Taylor Hobson Cooke Anastigmat 1 inch f1.4, which has some amount of swirliness but nothing like the Kinic. Another c-mount lens that is swirly is the CZJ Tevidon 25 mm f1.4. The whole range of CZJ c-mount Tevidon lenses from the same era are apparently swirly, but I've only tried the 25mm.
I also have the Tomioka-made Mamiya-Sekor 55mm f1.4 and I also haven't found it to be particularly swirly.
First? Always great content Simon - many thanks 🙂
12.06 all of those have some swirl but it is mostly because of the shape of the bokeh due to the hardware vignette (lemons in the corners). If you want a helios/biotar type of swirl you have to find the Pancolar 50 1.8 MC, it is almost the same bokeh like the helios but the color and sharpness are much better. It is a later production in the Russian occupied Germany from the Zeiss Jena factory and it is a master piece. Swirly, good contrast, beautiful flares. Also very sharp, I have used mine to scan film because it turned out to be sharper than my macro lens at that time the Industar 61.
I use a Bell&Howell 2 inch 1,4 projectorlens, wich is marvelous regarding swirl and short depth of field. I love it:-D
The soligor 28mm f2.8 does wide open and at close focus.
Also Bell & Howell super f1.2 & 1.4, tricky to use but big swirls
The new Meyer Optik Goerlitz Biotar 58 1.5 and the 75 1.5 are the best swirl lenses I know.
7:34 the 103 (53 1.8 swirls a lot). The 81H I think is very similar to the 77 but it is made in Nikon mount for the Nikon copies named Kiev 19 and similar to it.
My m42 EBC Fujinon 50mm 1.4 (late version, without thorium) swirls under right conditions. I was surprised to see it do that :D
I had a projector with a Leica projection lens on it. Still kicking myself to this day for binning it.
I've found that the Soviet lenses that I have used often swirl. The T-22 75/4.5 on the GOMZ/LOMO Lubitel swirls, as well as the Kiev-80 mount Vega 12B 90/2.8. They swirl under similar conditions as the Helios 44M-4, but not quite as much.
My Yashica ML 50 f2 does indeed swirl to a great degree. took me by surprise
i own the older DS 50mm f1.9 and it does as well
Thank you very much
Olympus Pen F half frame lens 38mm 1.8 seems to have swirl when I use it on a crop sensor Fuji. It has a smaller image circle so you would need to use it in crop sensor mode on a full frame camera
Missing a lot of wider lenses in the list. Probably because there is a lot less bokeh. But there are some that will swirl on close objects. The Auto Makinon 24mm f2.8 is the widest I have that swirls. Definity not the sharpest but dirt cheap! Covers full frame too! And there are some zoom lenses missing. The sigma zoom beta II 60-200 comes to mind, also very cheap but will be harder to find in a usable mount. My favorite lens until I dropped it 🫣
What other wide angle lenses swirl?
Have persoanlly gotten swirls with
Pentacon 29mm
Mir 20mm
Mir 1 37mm
Mir 24m 35mm
Tair 11 133mm
Ive heard that the era 6m and tair 11a swirl too, but i havnt used them to confirm
Lovely stuff Simon, much appreciated, just wondering the star filter you used thank you.
Thank you. The star shape was printed on a clear UV filter. We used to own a printer that could print onto a lens filter. We don’t own it now. I’ve also drawn shapes by hand on clear filters using a black felt tipped pen and a ruler, and blocked the rest of the filter in black. Good luck! Simon
Hi. It's a "new" lens but check out the Meyer Optik Görlitz 58mm f1.5 Biotar. There's a good video here on Luca Bono's youtube. I have a Meyer Optik Orestegon 29mm f2.8 which has shown potential for swirls, however, I need to experiment some more with it to see if I able to coax it into some swirls. Love your videos! Thanks for sharing.
8:14 I think this lens is more similar to the Planar 50 1.8 for Rollei, they are even made in the same factories.
my CZJ Pancolar 50mm F/2 and Yashica Yashinon DS 50mm F/1.9 both swirl to a great degree for a 50mm lens
Great video . What 50-55 comes to your mind that has the most constant non swirly bokeh ?
Also would love a video on “flat field” type of lenses
I'll add the big guns of swirl, the Kodak Aero Ektar 178/2.5, the 16mm cine camera Zeiss Biotar 50/1.4, and 70mm cinema projection lenses like the ISCO Kiptar and Super Kiptar series of lenses (Kiptar was a petzval design, Super Kiptar looks like a planar design on the few samples available online), and two warp bokeh beauties - the Zeiss Pancolar 55/1.4 and OM Zuiko 55/1.2
My favorit swirly lens on apsc is cosmicar 75mm f1.9 (cctv lens)❤
13:10 I do not see the Meopta 70 1.4 :) it is the one that started it all that projector lens experiment. Meopta has some other models that are also very nice. And there are the Schneider Cine-Xenon ones that are made for IMAX projections and are superb and crazy expensive.
You must try Lomo KP16 50mm 1.2 (projector lens)
I have a Pentacon 135mm f2.8 (15 bladed version), and that seems to like swirling in the right conditions.
I have that lens too. First specifically bokeh test I did with that lens I didn't even recognize what was in that picture. I shot something on the table in my room, very tight, ofc, because the lack of space - when I look at the picture it was way, way over what I expected. Fantastic lens! I love it.
I need to re-check, however my very early Minolta Auto-Rokkor 55mm f/1.8 produced quite the amount of swirly images, and my Bronica 150mm f/3.5 S SQ mount lens swirled like hell in the right conditions
If you like really distorted images and you own a Micro Four Thirds camera, give the Fujian 1.4/25mm CCTV Lens a try. It is a C-Mount lens, so you need an adapter and it costs about 25 EUR. It is a little bit too small, even for MFT, so I don't think it is suitable for bigger sensors.
I own the Auto Sears 50mm f/1.7 which seems to be the same as the Auto Rikenon 50mm f/1.7. It is a swirly lens that rivals the helios. It is suggested to be a copy of the cosina but I am not 100% sure as I do not have a cosina variant. It could also be a copy of a Yashica lens. Another lens that performs similarly is the bigger brother the Auto Sears/Rikenon 55mm f/1.4. Though I like the 55mm I find the 50mm f/1.7 is sharper at wider apertures while retaining similar bokeh characteristics. The 55mm seems to perform better stopped down. The 50mm is one of my personal favorites.
I also have a copy of the Rollei 50mm f1.8 in QBM but under the Carl Zeiss name and made in West Germany. Unfortunately the lens rear element has some marks but the lens still performs extremely well.
ive also read that the original Nikkor 5.8cm F/1.4 is a swirl machine
The new Nikkor 105 MC S lens has some swirl to it that I like. I don't know if there are any swirly photos taken with it online though.
Please do a review on the Schneider-Kreuznach Rollei SL Xenon 50mm f1.8 😃
kp 140..kp 120..kp 100 lomo projector lens are fun also
My 3.7K USD Hasselblad XCD 55V does swirl a bit, which is quite intersting for a lens released in 2022 at such a price…
You're missing the Olympus F.Zuiko 38mm f/1.8 Auto-S for the Pen F system.
I use the 16KP 50/1.2 mark II adapted to Sony E-mount. It’s an optical block used in late-Soviet 16mm film projectors. Contrary to popular belief, it was NOT made by Lomo (although it shares its optical design with another lens that is - the RO-109) but in the Iziyum Optical Manufacturing Plant, which was sacked and mostly destroyed in the early days of the Russian invasion of Ukraine.
It’s most definitely a “character lens”, with a wild variety of intense distortions: field curvature so spherical it puts Petzvals to shame; extreme swirling at any distance or lighting conditions; flaring and CA that remind one of an LSD trip. The very center is quite sharp and distortion free but rapidly goes all over the place the further away you get, making it excellent for subject shots and unsuitable for general photography. Covers an APS-C circle but the best results I’ve seen come from MFT cameras as the extreme corners are too muddled for my taste.
Many thanks for this information - very useful. I have the Lomo RO-109-1A, but I've only just repaired it back to its original design.
Do try it, the lens has an unmistakable signature look unlike any other i’ve ever seen. Although as always sample variation plays an enormous part, and mine being a very late specimen from 1991 when Soviet control had waned significantly over Ukraine, i suspect the extreme distortions i mentioned may be partly due to inadequate quality control. I’ve learned to embrace the look rather than trying to correct around it. Color reproduction is a bit iffy, but in BW it reaks of early glass plate photography.
Would LOVE to see you do a video on it.
For new lenses what about Meyer Optik Gorlitz’s Biotar 58 F1.5 ii and Biotar 75 F1.5 ii
Jcpenney 135mm f2.8
Mine has a somewhat more subtle swirl than the Helios 40. I prefer the former.
My Tanaka Tanar 5cm f:2 does swirl but not a whole lot
I am wondering if you could one day do a "explosive" bokeh lens video? I am a big fan of them.
my schneider 50/0.95 looks like swirl but it is actually producing weird (in a good way) tunnel effect
1:03 you mentioned making swirls by soft. Was something specific or making it in Photoshop? If you have a special technique in Photoshop maybe you can make a tutorial, if you have enough time, it would be very interesting. Thank you!
Hi, that was the NIK Collection by DxO. Yes, I'll see if I can do a quick tutorial on this.
@@Simonsutak thank you! I have Nik collection, last free version, but I'm not very familiar with it. A tutorial would be helpful.
Voigtlander 75mm F1.8 Helios
Any chance there’s a vid on softer lens with a bit of a glow? Anyone? 😮
Takumar 55 f2, cctv 25mm1.4 and cctv 50mm1.4
The Brand New Sony 300mm f2.8 lens costing £5000 has swirly bokeh! See Gerald Undone review!
Just for future reference Simon, Xenon is pronounced Zenon. Like the noble gas.
Thank you, I won't make this mistake again. Ironically, Zenon was how I was pronouncing it in my head, but confronted with the X when speaking out loud I thought I should stress the X. As always in these cases, I should have searched on-line first for someone who knew how to pronounce it!
Leica Noctilux 50mm f1.2
Leica Summarit 50mm f1.5
Your title I think has a misspelling in it. Reads: “Add you own swirly”. I mention it because you put a lot of effort into these and the error seems off-brand for you. Just trying to help.
Thank you so much. Really appreciate this; I’ve changed it.
12:33 Lensbaby products are mostly very cheap looking and bad optics for unusable effects, but they are trying to sell them for more money. Zenitar 50 1.2 is a crop sensor lens - too big and heavy + expensive with nothing interesting in terms of image quality. Helios 40-2 is almost the same as the first one with some small changes and it depends what copy you will get. The new ones are build much worse than the old ones (40-2 has old M42 version and new which is not USSR and is sold in other mounts too). Speedmaster 50 0.95 is not swirly, it just has lemon shape bokeh towards the edges and I prefer the II version. The 3rd one has some optical changes but the aperture blades are straight which made it worse when you are closing down the aperture.
What's a utak?
0:47 Well, where is the promised list of lenses?
It’s in the first comment below :-). I’ll add to the lenses suggested in the comments when I have time.
RLHORROR
TTArtisan 90mm 1.25 swirls, not really sharp thought
The Russian night vision h3t-1 has often the same glass in its 85mm F/1.5 as the helios 40 and can swirl the same way. Additionally it's M42 and has the same flange focal distance.
Please learn to pronounce Kreuznach... Kreuznach. It's not crutsnatch, but more kroytcnahh
Thank you so much for the pronunciation advice. I rely on people telling me I'm not pronouncing names/brands properly, and how it should be, so this is very helpful.