The Celts of King Arthur's Britain
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 ก.ย. 2018
- So the BBC aired their new show called "King Arthur's Britain" in which they look at Britain during the time of the mythical King Arthur i.e the Early Middle/Dark Ages. Some tweets which weren't happy with the "aversion" to calling and the "airbrushing out" of the Celts who were instead, and more accurately in my opinion, referred to as "Britons" and "British."
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Errigal - Kevin MacLeod
Celtic Impulse - Kevin MacLeod
Cattails - Kevin MacLeod
Achaidh Cheide Celtic - Kevin MacLeod
Feral Dub - Kevin MacLeod
"Feral Dub” - Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
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#KingArthursBritain #Celtic #History
Fun fact: in Greek, France is still called Gallia (Γαλλία).
You guys use the same 'g' as Russian haha
Lol I bet Vercingetorix puffs his chest out just a little bit at the fact that even after the massacre of his people (Gauls in France) the 100's of years of Romanization, and the absolute ethnic displacement of the Franks coming over the frozen Rhine to create Frankia (France) that his land is STILL GAUL!
@@mpforeverunlimited yeah since the Cyrillic alphabet was created by Byzantine Greeks, both our alphabets have many similarities
@@mpforeverunlimited More like the "g" in Ukrainian. The "g" in Russian is a hard G in the standard dialect.
That's kind of misleading, it's not *still* , France is called Gallia due to a kind of standardization called Katharevoussa which was an "artificially" puristic language, in contrast with Demotic Greek, which was the language spoken by the normal people.
For a century Katharevoussa was official in Greece until the monarchy and fascist regime were overthrown and Greece became a democracy, Demotic Greek was made official but still has some influences from Katharevoussa, the name "Gallia" being one of them.
Plot Twist, Hilbert Is Merlin.
Plot Twist: Hilbert is a bumble fuck.
I prefer the first answer
why
But why not both?
Because, AvE is THAT Uncle.....
......and keep your dick in a vice!
th-cam.com/channels/hWv6Pn_zP0rI6lgGt3MyfA.html
The word for foreigner in Irish is actually Gall, not Gael. Yes the words are similar and there may be a connection but still they are different.
Yes, he definitely got that wrong.
Galloway in Scotland is named for Norse-Irish or foreign Gaels - (Gall-Ghàidhealaibh). It's an example of both words side by side and how they are different. Plus Gael is a modern English version of Gaidel. Gall is probably related to the Germanic walh though though which welsh derives.
yeah the city in ireland, "Galway", basically means foreigners way
Yep Dun na nGall (county donegal) means fort of the foreigners.
Green Elf I don't think so, Galway in Irish is Gaillimh and is named that after the river. According to legend a chieftain's daughter drowned in it and her name was Gailleamh so they named the river after it. I've never heard anything about it being referred to as anything relating to foreign but then again I could be wrong too
“Keltoi” is what Greeks in the colony of Massalia (now Marseille) called the Gauls. This comes from what the Gauls called themselves. Julius Caesar wrote as he described Gaul, “All Gaul is divided into three parts, one of which the Belgae inhabit, the Aquitani another, those who in their own language are called Celts, in ours Galli, the third.”
Hey Hilbert. Big fan. You touched on it at the end there- the general consensus within the 'Welsh Twittersphere' (if there is such a thing) was that for a programme titled "King Arthur's Britain", they never once discussed anything outside of England. The 'airbrushing Celts out' remark was likely in regards to this (in this case, "Celtic" referring to the people of Wales, Ireland and Scotland, who barely got a mention). There's a famous quote by politician Gwynfor Evans that reads: "Britishness... is a synonym for Englishness which extends English culture over the Scots, Welsh and the Irish". The Anglo-centric 'English-washing' of the King Arthur story in this programme is what infuriated many. Happy to discuss more!
arddechog,par excellence,,,, french academics,have been speculating, was king artur: a breton legend from britian, or more likely a welsh king who visited brittany??
well done for even mentioning, this as even having a **historical discussion or debate** in the first place, is difficult, as anyone ,mentioning or having a objective,opinion, of king arthur,is seen as a joke,a fraud,a quack,conspiracy theorist or nut job on drugs..
about ancient british history, is seen by some as psuedo-quasi fake legends: or events that did not happen, and too other written -archeologicaly researched history.., the cornish,welsh,bretons and scottish,manx & irish had recorded history,before any anglo-saxon events, no joke, but mentioning even these, is seen as a nothing more than legends...
I think the term "Celt" is problematic, but King Arthur legends originally belonged to the culture of Brythonic "Celtic" speakers, primarily Welsh people. What happened to the stories of King Arthur is in modern parlance "Cultural appropropriation". Although that's moot really as it happened 800 years ago by Geoffrey of Monmouth.
geoffrey of monmouth per se, is seen by many university proffesors and academics to be a joke.... however lineages of early kings of glyswig-glamorgan , do refer to a king artur, or efwr of glamorgan**..,
as does the offical eclesiastical books of the early welsh church...
the books of llandaf(that is a welsh arch diocese**) yet another record of a simmilar depiction, refering to a king arthur....
also uncanily simmilar records in rennes(capital of bretagne-britanny *) also refering too a local ruler -originating from across the sea,,,possibly wales or cornwall....of the name efwr-artwr...
geoffrey of monmouth was writing some centuries later, much of cornish-breton & welsh -irish history is ecclasitical and oral histories...a right jumble**
the term celt, was first used, in a ethno-lingustic idea of edward lluyd the linguist, in the 18th century...only later,did it depict a ethno-cultural people....at best the term is *problematic**, a very mixed tribes...with common or shared languages....etc...
its possible, later monarchs...like king alfred of wessex-england, king rhodri mawr(the great of wales) king edward I & III, king henry IV tudor(after the battle of bosworth*)...(culturally appropriated this pseudo- history mixed with legend** to bolster, their own image...
English political saxwash
Proud to be half welsh half German decent. Yes I do argue with myself
No need for that. Nowhere is it recorded that any ruler of Germany declared war on Celtic Brits. The Germans who came here were just those opportunists who could not hack it in their own country, and who the Germans/Saxons were glad to be rid of, just like the Vikings.
Just being brutally honest no one actually cares .
@@brokennative114 that's what people who don't have European heritage say.
@@brokennative114 well it seems you cared enough when you took time to leave a stupid ignorant nonsensical comment
@@SP-mf9sh no doubt you're a celt, a name like owens is very common in Ireland
We Welsh( that means foreigner as well ) NEVER referred to ourselves as "Celtic" We were the "Brythoniad" the land was called' Prydain".
Why is that so difficult to understand.? The Welsh were British before "British "was invented by the English and Scott's.
The aincent irish kingdoms where really fractured and out of touch with each other .they all agreed they are from the same island and spoke its language but couldn't agree on a name for themselves .... causing a wide range of names to appear like .. gaelach , múnteoir na hÉireann , gael , fír bolg , gallaibh, duine gaeilge, Éireannach, gallaimhe, etc etc
Muintir na hÉireann, múinteoir means teacher
In Irish the word Gael didn't mean foreigner in the Viking Period. Gall meant foreigner, 'Cogadh na gael re gallaibh' meaning the war of the Irish and the foreigners is from the period where the Irish kingdom of Munster under Brian Boru fought the norse kingdom of Dublin. So, you're saying Finn Gael for norse and Dubh Gael for Danish, but it's actually Finn Gall and Dubh gall, which is where you get place names like Finglas in North Dublin and personal names like Doyle.
I don't speak Irish but I think that Gall and Gael are two distinct terms with distinct etymologies
Gall in Irish means 'foreigner'.
The mixed race (Viking X Gael) of the Hebridean Isles were called by the Irish 'Gall Oglaigh' (corrupted to Gallowglass) meaning 'Foreign Warriors' ie Mercenaries who were hired by the Irish Chiefs in their endless wars with each other.
The host here refers to Dubh gall and Fionn Gall ie the Black haired Vikings and the Blond haired Vikings. (Dubh Gall is corrupted to 'Dougal' and Fionn Gall to 'Fingal').
I really don't think Gall and Gaelic/Gallic are cognates but I'm not an expert.
Seconded, Francesco. Gael is short for Gaelic, or Goidlic if they wanna know, which arose from Goidl Glas formalising their language around 1300 BC. We are related through his mom Scotia's elongated skull; Meritaten, Akhenaten's daughter, is progenitor of the Gaels. Everybody knows that.
martin okelly I think Gallic and Gall are related, while Gaelic is not, now this would mean that the British and Irish Celts thought of themselves as ethnically and linguistically differents from the Continental Celts (Gauls) and I'm not sure of the implications
Francesco Fontana
The Gaels of Scotland migrated from Ireland into Scotland.
I think 'Gallic' is the distinct Scottish accent coming into play.
But I'm not an expert but I do accept that the Greeks called everyone north and N East of them 'Keltoi' meaning 'Outlandish' or even 'Barbarian'.
( Following on from this I think that 'Celts' were not a Race as such.)
'Argyll' in Scotland is a corruption of 'Oireathar Gael' meaning 'Eastern Gaels'.
Also, 'Scot' originally referred to the people of Ireland who made N. Western Britain and the Islands and extension of their domain, probably by simple migration rather than by conquest.
When St Columba/Colmcille banished himself from Derry to Iona he moved to an island already held by his Clan/Clann.
(This Saintly man secretly copied an illustrated book and was found guilty by the High King of Ireland who ordered him to give back the copy with the words:
"To every cow her calf.
To every book its copy")
Note that these holy books were made with vellum/calf skin.
Gael is the Gaelic version of Goidel which is what the Welsh who lived in Britain called Irish raiders who attacked the west coast, obviously they considered them foreigners so it's pretty obvious that it shares a root with Gall or other Celtic words for foreigners, the reason why the Irish began to call themselves Gaels is because when they met Welsh or Briton Catholic missionaries, like St. Patrick, the missionaries called them the Goidels, as more Irish converted they would have taken this on as their own name for themselves, eventually becoming the word Gael.
The word "keltoi" (pronounced kelti) was not meant to mean "foreigners of the north", because there were other foreigners of the north like the thracians and scythians that the greek recognized as different than the celts
Herodotus mentioned that the Keltoi lived "beyond the pillar of Heracles". Doesn't sound like a generic name for "foreigners" to me.
Exactly!
Rockabilly hick Came here to post this. Quote straight out of the Gallic Wars.
@@aurelius333 "beyond the pillars of Heracles" is a generic term for "Far-Far-Away-Land" in ancient Greek.
@@sualtam9509 the pillars of hercules is actually what the greeks called the straight of Gibraltar
I think you've mixed up two Irish words there, 'gael' usually exclusively refers to the Irish as a whole whereas 'gall' refers to foreign peoples, hence fingal in English is derived from 'fionngall' - because of norse presence (blonde foreigners) or donegal (Dún na ngall - keep of the foreigners). Common mistake for non Irish speakers or learners. Really good video, love when you focus on celtic groups within Britain
henogledd = hen gogledd = welsh for "old north"
Perhaps while trying to avoid the word Celt, as it is inaccurate, think upon the term British Isles, also inaccurate.
Finally got a chance to watch this. Great video as always.
Great vid Hilbert keep um coming!
Regarding Welsh, in Switzerland there's a derogatory term for non German speaking Swiss, it's "Welsche"
@@connorrivers798 German word for foreigner, not slave.
@@Shaniflewog Yeah my bad, I got mixed up because the name for Wales has the same origin and 'Walhaz' was used interchangably to mean both slave and foreigner to the Anglo Saxons.
The various slavs who lived on the Baltic Sea east of the Elbe were collectively called the Wends. Probably a related term.
Saxon word for foreigner.
So what you're saying is some random MP with a Twitter isn't magically an expert in history and linguistics? Colour me shocked.
I see your point, but I have to say, it isn't magic. None of this is expert level either. This kind of statement comes from a basic misunderstanding of the ethnolinguistic categorization schemes as regards to his own people.
It's nice having a channel which covers a lot of Early Medieval British history than isn't riddled with far-right toxic dogma.
@Leo Proctor Do you have any examples? I've never really noticed any socialist propaganda peppered into Medieval history...
@Leo Proctor I've seen plenty of BBC history docs, and I've never once seen anything resembling 'far left propaganda'. I fail to see how a supposedly socialist organisation would also be putting out David Starkey documentaries...
@Leo Proctor Well seeing as you've failed to provide even one single example of such a far left BBC documentary, I think I probably have been watching the same content as everyone else. But no problem, have a great day.
Hilbert stop apologizing (please). You do a great job researching and presenting your video posts. No matter what you say or do there will be people that find fault and rant online. Ignore them. A certain subset of humanity lashes out in anger at anything they don't understand or dis-agree with. So save your time (and breath) and continue to make videos.
15:02 Yes, in the Alps, Switzerland to be precise, there is indeed a half-french region known as Valais in French and Wallis in German. Another interesting example of the Wales/Wallonia phenomenon is Wallachia, a region in southern Romania which bordered Germanic peoples back in the day of the migration age
Was looking for this. My first thought watching that part was “I wonder if Wallachia is related.” Thanks
History With Hilbert, you are wrong about the name κέλτοι being a greek term that meant foreigner, according to hecataeus the milesian(first one to ever mention celts) and julius caesar, the galli of the area of modern france called themselves κέλτοι in their own language. Pliny the elder also wrote that the celtici of iberia called themselves celtici(we also have modern archeological epigraphic evidence for that). On the other hand no writer ever mentions britons as celts or them calling themselves celts, so you are correct on all the rest.
This is a splendidly informative video.
Just finished this programme, now this!!!
Excellent video as always Hilbert. I'd just like to clear up a few points as i sense that your knowledge of the West Country is not as hot as the North of England! Dumnonia was Cornwall AND Devon (plus a little slither of Somerset too) The West of Dumnonia was Cornu = the "horn of Britain" and the east (Devon) was Dyfnaint. Obviously Devon was consumed by the Saxons and just left the rump state of Cornubia which became Cornwall. Another 'Wealas' you missed was Cornwall which is a combination of British and Anglo-Saxon words. When you pointed out the gene-pool map of Britain you said there were several genetic groups in Cornwall to be seen but it appears you think the whole of the Western Peninsula is Cornwall! It's not! Cornwall is only the thin (and mostly pink) bit at the very end. The larger blob before the thin bit is Devon which was mostly blue in the DNA map which is fascinating because is shows Devon to be genetically distinct from both England and Cornwall whereas most might have assumed they would be similar to Cornwall. Sorry to rant on but being a Westcountryman it is a topic i am very passionate about! Lastly Tintagel is pronounced Tin Taj ul as opposed to your Tin Tay jel!! You don't want to rile the Cornish!! All the best and keep up the great work.
Brittany was given to Conan Meriadoc by Magnus Maximus when he usurped the Western Empire. The dream of Mascen Wledig tells how this future emperor married a Welsh Princess making Conan his brother in law.
Here with a suggestion for another video (well, I have to mention first that I love your video's) could you make one about the Frisian king Redbad or Koning Radboud? I've been interested in him since childhood when I saved a massive Dutch history book from the seventies my parents had from being trown away. It's hard to find information online and perhaps with your Frisian heritage, you might know more
I believe your statement in 2:00 is wrong , In the Gallic Wars Julius Caesar states "qui ipsorum lingua Celtae, nostra Galli appellantur" in English "who are called Celts in language, in ours Gauls"
There are many places across Europe called something that includes 'gal' in some way. These places are likely named after the people we now call the Celts.
So 'celt' is like the term 'byzantine'. Not historically accurate, but useful.
no
No not useful at all
@@fraser4982 @English Socialist when people use it about themselves, who are YOU to say they're wrong? And it IS useful. Just as useful as "germanic" or "turkic".
How is it not useful?
That's like saying the term Germanic isn't useful. It's a classification of a common culture.
Where it gets somewhat convoluted is when people start to try to use it for genetic or linguistic purposes.
Hilberttttt ❤❤ lol im starting my a levels and your channel is super helpful on the tudors too.
Very enlightening. Many thanks.
Holy crap I've never been this early love you hilbert
Love you too my man
Me too!
Genetic tests of the English shows they have more Celtic genetic markers than continental Germanic markers. Even along the so-called "Saxon shore" (the east cost of England) the test showed an average of 60 per cent directly descended from the original pre-Roman invasion population. Celtic genetic markers increase the further west you go; 83 per cent in the English West Country and 90+ per centin the northern England and Cornwall up to Scotland. The tests obviously didn't include people from modern ethnic minorities, just white English. They disprove the Victorian theory of an ethnic cleansing of the Britons by the Anglo-Saxons and suggest something more akin to a merger, but with the Saxons being the more dominant warrior caste.
Brilliant video! Well said.
In case anybody reads this,
There is a really interesting (not very probable) theory that Beiouaren (the old High German word for Bayern or English Baveria) is of Celtic origin since the population of this area was probably a very large percentage Celtic (we in Germany don’t even have a different common word for the Celts of the Southern German language region). The town I am from Bergtheim, a compound settlement name made from Bergt-&-Heim Bergt, so the home of Bergt or Bergtha. It may be of Celtic origin as in a Celtic Deities or Spirits place of worship. The south of Germany had also seen very rapid latinization and a common Bavarian greeting is „Servus“ as in „to be of service“ (zu deutsch: steht’s zu Diensten). The idea behind this theory is that even though Rome had neglected and plundered this region it was not as significantly depopulated as the more eastern Celtic regions which were almost empty, leaving significant Catholic and Galloroman populations behind into which the Germanic invaders integrated rapidly as seen with the franks whos royalty stopped speaking Frankish in about two generations of founding their Kingdom on the Rhine, they also „diplomatically“ integrated the Schwaben Lande, Allemanian Lands, and the rebellious Beiouaren, the people of South Tyrol, Bacaria, and Austria (meaning Eastern lands as Icelandic Austurland land being substituted for Latin ia and in German the Riki or English Rike or German Reich), who’s drive for independence was then dated with autonomy and privileges as well as royal marriage leading to the Kingdom of Bavaria falling with the Karloman dynasty. On another sidenote the Karlings spoke Galloroman Latin were as the Schaben and Beiouaren got their dose of latin straight from the Church, but with some Germanized Galloroman still mixed in like the all to popular and for most Germans very German sounding „Brei“ which upon closer examination is related to the French „Bri“ yes the cheese whose name refers to its consistency, being somewhat „Breiig“.
the gauls would still have been characteristically Celtic(albeit somewhat latinized) it would be quite distinct from British Celtic but they were still part of a broader Celtic cultural region.
Wrong way around. The celts are a continental people. The insular 'celts' copied the continental culture. Its why the Romans never called them celts but Brythonic because there were major differences between the Gauls and the Britons.
@@torinjones3221 the Romans never called them Celts because they didnt understand the ethnic relationships of the time. There were also plenty of obviously Germanic tribes that the Romans mistakenly misidentified as nongermanic. The insular Celts are as celtic as their Continental counterparts.
did you confuse "Gael" with "Gall" for "foreigner"...?
As I understand from the various books I have read, the word Keltoi wasn't used generically. Instead, it was used relatively specifically for people that likely were "Celtic" and indeed may have been a word they borrowed from the Celts. After, all one group of Celts seem to have meet with Alexander and there was the battle of Battle of Thermopylae in 279 BC as well as the Celtic tribes that settled in central Anatolia creating Galatia.
After all you had Thracians, Scythians, Sarmatians and others to the North.
I love your videos!! I did find a spelling error, however; you spelled arse wrong ;)
King Arthur was Welsh
Well, Brittonic, he could have come from anywhere between Cornwall to strathclyde, and there's also the possibility of him being of Italian, Iberian, or maybe even Irianian descent
@@edwinofnorthumbria2511 m.th-cam.com/video/Q3oWtH2ijJg/w-d-xo.html ✌
@Bear hn Everything adds up if you watch it
@Bear hn if thats the case the Egyptians didnt build the pyramids
@Bear hn did you watch the vid?wales has castles everywhere and burial mounds all over the place our history is being suppressed for some reason
An SNP MP with a persecution complex? Who would have thought it? :)
Excellent video as always Hilbert. Nice to see what can be discovered with a bit of research and not just assuming the worst.
And thank you for the tangent also. It was actually really important to the rest of the topic.
15:05 Welschtirol ("Welsh Tyrol" - present-day Trentino, Italy). Also walnut is another example.
and Wallachian
I get your point and it seems a good one but let me ask this question: setting aside the far flung branches of "Celts" that ranged as far as Italy and Turkey, in the popular collective consciousness of English speaking people I think the term "Celt" - however incorrect it may be - has come to represent those "Celts" of the Islands around England and Ireland due to perceived similarities in culture and language, music, mythology in recent times (though they may have had quite different origins as you point out). What do you propose that collective group be called? I think in the simple layperson's view the Irish/Welsh/Highland Scottish/Isle of Man/Brittany peoples are linked and thrown together as one mythological ethnicity and identity. That's what's popularly meant when they say "Celtic" and as you say it conjures images of Gaelic symbols, warriors, druids.
2:20 Wasn't "Barbarian" derived from Latin meaning "bearded people"? (Latin for beard is "barba".)
True. It's also why they call "Barbers", referring to the beard. I am surprised at Hilbert's idea that it had to do with the sound of their speech.
As a general rule at least in French a word that starts with a w in English starts with a g so for example ward becomes guard, Walter becomes Gaultier so it would not surprise me if Gaul is the same as Wall. Now that we can study genomes using DNA facts concerning migration history are coming to light. One of which is the further west you go in Britain the higher the percentage of the genome that goes back to the Mesolithic inhabitants with Ireland as a whole being around 85% from that gene pool. So the idea that Celtic is an ethnicity is probably kind silly, and should only be used to describe the culture and language of a people.
The trouble with that theory is that 'Gaul' is clearly not a Frankish word like 'guard'. Gaul represents Latin Gallia, and the country we now call France was called Gallia long before the Franks invaded it.
@@williamcooke5627 If one accepts that French is a Romance language derived from vulgar Latin just as Spanish and Portuguese are the conclusion is that whatever the Franks and Visigoths were speaking respectively didn't create as much of an impact as what the Romans were speaking.
There is they theory that Celts never invaded Britain and only they language was imported.
@@alo5301 Julius Caesar believed there to be significant links between the Britons and the Belgae going so far as to say that the training of the Druids amongst the Belgae occurred in Britain. I don't know of any other mixing of cultures to that extent without at least some colonization.
John Kilmartin Y haplogroup R1b L21 is the genome you’re referring to. More than 80% of Irishmen have it.
But R1b L21 was introduced to Ireland and Britain (where it has an average concentration around 35%) around 4,200 years ago. Along with autosomal DNA traceable to the Pontic Caspian Steppe and copper tools.
The Celts themselves arrived 2,700 years ago and brought Y haplogroup R1b S28 which averages at about 3-10% throughout the entire British archipelago.
In this video you very briefly mention Elmet. After reading Fiona Mozley's excellent book with the same name, I wanted to know a bit more about this kingdom/tribe, but couldn't really find anything about other than the fact that it existed. Is there much more to know about it?
Fun fact : Wales in French is called “Pays de Galles”
In german foreign languages or dialects and accents that are unintelligible are often refered as "Kauderwelsch", what "Kauder" means isn't quite sure, but "welsch" (which is similarly pronounced like the english term "welsh") refered and still refers, although not commonly used, to romans, romanic people (like the french or italians) but also to romaniced celtic people. Interesstingly it was first used to discribe the celtic neighbours of the early germanic people, the "Volcae" who settled in the donau-area. You still find words like "Wall", "Wahl", "Wal" and so on in many place and family names.
Ps: The term "welsch" also refers to foreign, although that is a later evolution.
BeasyBoi_B this iexplanation is also referenced in John Davies’ excellent book “A History of Wales”
Another good one Hilbert! I feel like the area that became England was inhabited by different people than the rest of the islands when the Romans arrived. The so called Belgae area. Those people would be more Gaulic than Briton and potentially even some of them were Germanic. it happens to cover pretty much the same area that became Roman Britain and the same area that became England.
interesting, never considered this
You’re ‘rambling’ is interesting and useful in the context of your video. 👍🏻
Lovely video. This goes to show that we can lose so much when slapping the same label on such a diverse group of people. I’ve been reading about Northumbrian history recently and to know about Gwynedd and Elmet interacting with Bernicia and Deira is just so fascinating (or should I say Britain and Britain with Britain an Britain according to a different comment ;)). I wish I was taught it in school.
History just doesn’t make sense if we don’t acknowledge the differences!
It's sad that u have to put such a disclaimer at the beginning, these days or is that me?
Disclaimers are at least a form of context for those who may view this with differing mindsets. It may make someone who is looking for something to get angry at take the video slightly more seriously. The issue I guess is that you don't know who on the planet is viewing this video or if they have ever heard of the old Celts or Saxons or whatever, or if others they have heard speak on this issue have mislead them or expressed overtly racist views.
“Dubh” (black) in Irish is pronounced as “dove”
Michael Depaor it varies by time period and dialect, hence the modern name Dougal from 'Dubh Gall' and not Dovgall; the 'bh' 'mh' sounding in Irish can be quite loose and in some cases depend on what feels better to sound
It is pronounced 'doo' aswell. Leinster gaelic and Ulster (older dialect) Gaelic have different pronunciations.
My friend pronounces it "dobh", aspiration on the last b, but not a v sound.
Yeah m8, Dubh , Black in Irish, is pronounced Duv. bd, bh and bhi all make varing V sounds. That's what we learned in school at least but I'm far from fluent.
It depends on dialect, varying between something similar to dove in Munster and something similar to "doo" in Ulster.
Will you at some point, also do a video on the Celtic influence/Origins on/of places like Brittany and Galicia?
Great explanation. I didn’t know most of these things. Entomology is one of the most useful lenses to view history through
A magnifying glass is particularly useful when looking at ants, I find! ;)
Well the BBC do themselves no favors. People are right to come at them they just need to actually be correct with their corrections. Like you said they come to some absurd conclusions and a lot of their material is hilariously terrible for a native country to ruin their own history so badly and get so much correct and jump to so many off base and ridiculous conclusions.
Fascinating that in so many languages, the word for these peoples means "foreigner". Other than the Cymry, are the names they called themselves known? Would they be the same as the 'tribal' names we know of? (that seems like an obvious one, but I've never seen it asked this way.) :)
Obvosleyly Iron-age farmers didn't have names for themselves the Romans made up some bullshit tribal names & Cymry is another bullshit name we adopted.
@@Kitsylove28 Thanks Hilbert.
Ella M.
Tribal groupings and names were there long before Romans arrived.
Obvosleyly.
My comment was just a playful tease lol I know our ancient fathers lived in tribes & their tribal names.
Very interesting! You said the Greeks' reference to anyone foreign was Keltoi. The only origin I can find for my own last name (Welch) is that it means "foreigner" in old English. Not someone from Wales, but any foreigner.
Walsh and Wall are cognate surnames found along the English side of the border with Wales, and of course the place-names Welsh Bicknor and Walford refer to Wales although they are in England (W. Bicknor was in the Diocese of Llandaff, although located in England, and Walford was the last fording place before a traveller entered Wales).
A particular beach of the River Wye in Herefordshire was known as Gumbrey's Wharf - presumably named after a Welsh inhabitant of the spot who used the name Cymru. Most farm names in South Herefordshire have a Brythonic origin, and many churches were dedicated to Celtic saints in the dark ages, as recorded in the remarkable "Liber Landavensis" (Book of Llandaff). The dialect of South Herefordshire still uses a few Brythonic words, such as coney (rabbit), tump (grave) and pitch (an incline).
Regarding the Alps: In Switzerland there is a mostly French speaking canton called Valais/Wallis, and there are quite a few words containing some form of "Welsh" in Alemannic German, e.g. "Welschkorn" for maize.
Also the tiny outpost , only six villages, of the walser culture in the upper Val sesia south of monte Rosa in Northern Italy
Gael (native) and Gall (pronounced Gowl is a foreigner)
Is that where gowl comes from? I would have pronounced it like "Gawl"
Will also add that the Celtic people of Britain tend to avoid the term British as it implies English these days. Using Celtic in reference to the Celtic speaking people of Britain at the time of the Germanic invasion shows an easy and clear distinction between the native peoples and the invading Germans without getting tripped up on modern terms.
That said there are a large number of people today who see Celt and immediately think of Celtic FC or the Boston Celtics.
Perhaps Britons over British is a better distinction but that is going to depend on the knowledge of your audience.
The word Celt was a loanword in Greek from the Celts of Gaul. Keltoi first appears in the Greek colony of Marsilia, modern Marseille in reference to the local Celtic tribes. That the Romans later use a similar word Galatae would seem that Keltoi is close to the word used by the Celts themselves. The Celtici and Celtiberi were tribes from the Celtic speaking regions of Spain for comparison.
They weren't "Germans". They were "germanic". Don't use words you do not understand. The Norwegians, Swedes and Danes were also germanic, but definitely NOT German. Neither were the Anglo-Saxons, they were semi-Danes.
Germans are ONLY the people from Germany. (The area occupied by the modern country). A rather young country by European standards.
So, Maybe a little late to receive a reply, But Hilbert, Mijn favoriete geschiedenis kanaal, I have two questions for you,
The first one is about a video you made about half a year ago about the dutch revolt. It was a great video but it ended at the 12 years truce and there hasn't been a video continuing on it since, is there still a plan for making such a video?
Second of all, a while back I do believe you answered a comment in which you said you were looking into making a discord, is that idea still around also or is that off the table as well?
Continue making these awesome videos, been watching them for a long time now and I definitely will continue watching!
Groetjes uit Nederland!
ŷStijn Wildeboer En hallo ook uit Schotland. :-)
I don't agree with the etymology of celt, Caesar wrote in the de bello gallico, I: "quarum unam incolunt Belgae, aliam Aquitani, tertiam qui ipsorum lingua Celtae, nostra
Galli appellantur." "[...] Of those the first is inhabited by belgi, the other by aquitani and the third by those who call themselves Celts, and we call them galli" so i think that celts was considered a specific term for describing the people who live between the garronne river and the marne.
King Arthur's hunting ground was in Swansea. Plasmal hafod Bryn hyfryd treforus all places he lived but you won't get the BBC to tell you this plas is Welsh for mansion hafod is Welsh for summer place bryn hyfryd means beautiful hill and treforus which is Morriston actually means lovely town in Welsh but no historian will ever disclose this information
What? Arthur didn't even exist. Fictional mate.
Bruts of England say he does look it up kung glamorgana
The German illuminati's white Dragon superimposed on Wales' Red Dragon flag in front of the Queen's administration buildings says it all. Give us our land back.
We have located King Arthur's grave and have compiled a fairly complete history of around 18 kings of Briton, all of which are yet to be accounted for by "ordinary" historians. You can probably join the King Arthur I and King Arthur II the Original FB group if you have a horse in the race for truth. Members only.
>Pronouncing Cymru as Kuhm-roo
An Anglo-Saxon is a German who has forgotten that his grandmother was Welsh.
The Julius ceasar Mediterranean conquerer analogy really helped me understand
This is so deep, most of the branches from my family tree come from all over these islands so i'm always interested to learn about the Celtic history.
gael = gaelic
gall = foreign
The first Celts is England came in from old Belgica in the early times. Belgian had 12 Belgian Celtic tribes. Belgian Celts came in Belgica from the Hallstatt culture area.
As always, a great vid.
I've got a series of questions that I hope maybe you or others here could answer for me, as I've been investigating and the answers I've found are not very satisfactory for me.
It's a about the Belgian tribes and whether they were 'Celtic'/Gallic, Germanic or a mix of both. I know that because it's the border between Germania and Gaul, it's rather difficult to tell, and in the De bello Gallico Caeser mentions some tribes as being Germanic. And as you said in this vid, the Frisians were there at some point (there was a comb found with runes in Belgium which is thought to be Frisian), although what would today be Wallonia would most certainly be Gallic/Celtic...but what about what would today be Flanders? As far as I'm aware, most tribes would have been Germanic, and today Flemish is being spoken there, which is a Germanic language and there is a Germanic culture, so this would make sense to me. And moreover, Germanic peoples expanded into Belgium at some point. I've also read that ethnically/genetically speaking, all peoples of Germanic countries are Germanic, and even places that are nowadays not Germanic, like Wallonia and Northern France, are genetically Germanic peoples.
So, what are your thoughts on this subject? I'd really like to hear your opinions.
See you around and take care!
To Welsh, and Wallonians/Walloons one can add Wallachians/Vlachs in Romania: same linguistic root.
If you avoid the word "Celtic" because the groups identified as such can be further subdivided by local genetic and cultural differences, then do you feel the same way about terms like "Scandinavian," "Ethiopian," or "Slavic," of which the same can be said? As you allude to yourself, "Anglo-Saxon" is obviously used to describe an amalgamation of diverse and ill-defined peoples. I would think that term would be far more objectional, based on your stated reasoning. Yes, Gaul and other places with a formerly Celtic identity have long been absorbed into or replaced by other cultures and languages. Does that mean that modern Greeks should not identify as "Greek" since Magna Graecia, Asia Minor, and many other formerly Greek areas have been absorbed or replaced by other cultures? I'm not following your reasoning.
Its political, always has been. I don't think Herbert actually realizes it consciously though, he's just parroting other scholars.
If the BBC redid this programme now, I bet there will be a group of mixed ethnic "brits".
You said “sea-arm” in lieu of peninsula when referring to Brittany, and I chuckled. Does that term exist in your native lexicon?
Joseph Krakowski was the best King of Brittain
"Brittain"?
Joseph Krakowski Jontron
King Arthur was Welsh and king of Glamorgan
Or he could've been Welsh and king of Rhos.
Pendragon Arthur, ruling by acclamation as the old culture did, of a large area, not only Glamorgan and Gwent.
Tintagel isn’t an island I’m afraid - it’s a settlement/headland in North Cornwall
14:30 can’t believe you didn’t get Cornwall given the celtic theme!
Mind the term British only came into usage in the late 19th century, and according to David Starkey it's impossible to teach Britishness because a 'British nation doesn't exist'. x
"Britishness...is a political synonym for Englishness which extends English culture over the Scots, the Welsh, & the Irish" Gwynfor Evans.
And the terms I referred are 'British' and 'Britishness', not the island of 'Britain' and the 'Britons'. x
@@GoldieDawn well I'm welsh and I think the idea of British identity needs to be strengthened so that people like you will stop thinking everything is England and maybe then the different cultures of britain will be treated equally.
After all England is the only part of britain that doesn't have a devolved government
@@jayasuryangoral-maanyan3901
www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/the-problem-with-the-english-england-doesn-t-want-to-be-just-another-member-of-a-team-1-4851882
x :)
Alt-Centrist NeoBuddhist-AnarchoBonapartist
Your name is a long way of spelling shit.
That's an English word btw.
Lombard Flag when? 35th attempt. (please daddy hilbert please!)
Great video, really enjoyed it. My only critism would be, a small ome at that. Was that you seemed to ramble alot in this video and repeat yourself a few time, other than that..wicked work, keep it up Hilbert.
I'm baffled as to why these people are whinging about the term Briton or Britannia.
As hilbert as pointed out the use of Celtic would be more confusing bc the presenter would have to spend 20 mins explaining what they meant by 'Celtic '
(which wd go straight over most people's heads anyway)
Wheras Britannia was used on coins nearly 2000 years ago , she 1st appeared on the reverse of Roman coins & continued to do so on British coins into the 21stC . (50p)
Celt /Celtic is a relatively modern term .
It's a silly thing to moan about imo.
Romans were foreigners and enemies of British (Scottish) people.
I think the complaint is more about referring to the Angles, Saxons, Jutes and Frisians as “New Britons.” Where they were never “Britons” - although later became BritISH... could also be cleared up by not referring to “England” prior to the existence of England - Easily done by saying “The former Brythonic and Belgic lands that would later become what we now know as England.”
First.... *Dammit*...
Always first to me ;)
Seriously though good work with this video. Hopefully will clear the whole Celt/Briton situation up for many people
my two fav history youtubers, i'm such a fan boy lol, Keep up the good work.
Sorry to take first from you, I'm definitely going to check out your channel though!
One of the best things you can do with your time Jacob he's got a ton of very interesting content!
Have you made any video about the people who lived in the British Isles before Celts? I know very little about them.
th-cam.com/video/d7y8oDYYnP0/w-d-xo.html
and
th-cam.com/video/pwG7Egfrqk0/w-d-xo.html
You missed the chance to use Celtic In your football team analogy, although admittedly that would have been extremely confusing.
I am Lithuanian and since ours is thought to be the closest language to Indo European still spoken we tend to take an interest in language history. The Celts tended to refer to themselves I think as Galla or Gallo which means something like Bold as in the nuance boldly going forward or impelling themselves forward. Perhaps this comes from the expansion invasion period. Galla with the suffix Tax/Tach you would get The Bold Ones. Gallatach would then be the root of the Greek word Keltoi. Since Britain is not the term used by these peoples, they would use something like Albion, Alban or as in Scotland Alba, they would likely use a different term. So only describing them as Briton seems inaccurate and possibly leading.
State broadcaster and the BBC in particular are known for material that supports the State's version of reality and they tend to employ people who agree with that " mission ". Since your country is it seems prone to the hysteria of " immigrants coming in and taking over ", I would be cautious of any of their production touching on a similar subject.
Mi'sen + I lived in England for a year before mu company transferred us to Edinburgh. That was a year of frequent abused and insults. While in Scotland for seven years about the only occasion was when I was being mistaken for being Russian. On trips to England on business always were marked with insults and rude service in shops when I wasn't being ignored. So personal experience is what I base my opinion.
Mi'sen Report from UK Home Office assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/652136/hate-crime-1617-hosb1717.pdf
Report by BBC www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41648865
Mi'sen You are calling the whole unedited report from your own Home Office " cherry picking ". Goodbye nationalist fanatic you are blocked.
Mi'sen
An ad-hominid attack.
Must have been attacking some Australopithecus bones in a museum or something.
Mi'sen
Bearing.
999th viewer? whew
Yeah I hate the constant salt towards the English by our Celtic neighbours that we're out to get them. Most aren't like this but there is a lot who will claim just about anything to downplay us.
Another thing that frustrates me heavily is how people seem to think British just means English. I've had people attacking me with insults, blocking me etc just because I said that English aren't the only Brits.
Maybe they don't want to be referred at as being british?
also in regards to losing your culture in the act of union (which is bollocks) most of the Brittonic culture you so desperately want to know was destroyed by the Romans, by the time the anglo saxons turned up you guy were completely different from the people before. you became (Hellenized). so if you want to moan about anyone moan at the Italians. or dont because the modern day Italians are not the same as the Romans. ALMOST LIKE THE ENGLISH!!!!
You probably shouldn't take it personally when Cymry bitch about England dood but just so you're aware, the shit inflicted upon my ancestors by yours has left a legacy that effects me and mine even to this day.
Specifically, shit like how, if my nan had a heart-attack in Wales, she's more likely to survive if I drag her into my car and cross the border before calling an ambulance. Shit like how my people are disproportionately murdered by the results of austerity, or how most of us can't even speak our own language.
Just think for a moment - when someone says something like 'without Churchill we'd all be speaking German', just consider how that wpuld make you feel if it were real? And please realise that that is literally what happened to us.
If someone calls you a saxon pig or whatever, i'm sorry but its just banter - and besides, you've likely said a lot worse about us. The real issues are life and death for most of us. Also, despite whatever your holiday-home-owning uncle says, there aren't enough Cymraeg-speakers to switch to Cymraeg when an anglo enters the pub. If enough of us in one room speak the language, we were speaking it before you showed up.
Also regarding your point about the Normans, its not the same thing. The anglo-saxons became the English but so did the normans. The whole melting pot ting. The native britons became the Welsh. You ARE your conquerors. Your are both victor and vanquished and, despite a handful of rebellions and reprisals, the anglos and the normans intermarried and basically came together as one people. We otoh have always been treated as aliens, as The Other, laws were designed to punish us, our own laws were abolished, our lamguage outlawed. Even the word 'Welsh' meana foreigner.
Thanks for reading, this is a looong train journey lol
also most of what you described is local governments problems. not Westminster fault. you sound like brexiteer blaming everything on the eu. also i know people that live in cardiff and newport, and apparently they have better facilities then them lots of places in the north of england. i come form Bristol and being so close to wales means that i know a lot of welsh.
what part of wales do you live in btw? south or the north? do you live in a major city or in a small town in the middle of no where? location is also key to many things.
@ On your first point, I get it, but that's still your history and your culture. Englishness, whatever that means, didn't skip the Normans. You are the anglos, you are the normans AND you are that mixture. You can trace back the language, just as you have, and see how it changes over time. You can read back through your history and know that it was written by your people. I cannot do that. I literally am unable to read a welsh telling of history. Literally.
Its not the same thing. It's like a white American saying to a Native American 'yeah I know we wiped out 99% of the indigenous population but look at what the british did to us! We're all victims here! And sure, youre demographically doomed to a life of addiction and violence, sure you'll watch most of your loved ones die at an early age, and sure your children will grow up in poverty but that's YOUR fault. That's just proof that WE should be in charge.'
On the local government side of things, no it's not down to policy decisions. It's down to the fact that despite us always voting Labour, England basically always goes Tory and guess what? The tories don't have to give a shit about us since they'll barely ever get fuck all votes here. They would starve every single welsh child to death if it meant they'd get the old english pensioner cunt votes for a single election.
Good video. I might add something? In Irish there were actually 2 separate words ('Gael' and 'Gall') as opposed to one. They're actually used as opposites. I think the name you meant is actually 'Gall' (Fionn-Gall / Dubh-Gall) which has been used by the Irish over time for a range of outsiders or foreigner, from Norsemen to the English. 'Gael' (or originally spelt as Gaedheal) as opposed to meaning foreigner was just the Gaelic word for the Irish. It comes from a word that the Welsh used for them meaning raiders, and it was taken on themselves as their own name. Both names were used to distinguish these two groups as apart,such as the old chronicle 'Cogadh Gaedeal re Gallaib' (Wars of the Gael against the Foreigners). Hope this helps
Love your videos bud. Just a small note on the pronunciation the word "Dubh" as you rightly mentioned means black or dark. The word is pronounced more like the English word "Dove" especially in the Dublin ascent
British,Briton it had brit in the name
It's not the same thing though.
r/woooosh
Gottem gud
once again: r/woooosh
King Arthur was mentioned in the bruts of England and this is part of what was said.( Kung Arthur crowned kung of glamorgana) this was written by an Anglo Saxon in old English about the coronation of king Arthur so what is the problem with him? Simple the German monarchy didn't want Welsh or Scottish independence so all history of king Arthur was eradicate but the problem was the Welsh and there language wasn't eradicate and we know out history. King Arthur was a real king but he wasn't anything special the Welsh people made him special for some reason. You can find king Arthur and his story in national museum of Wales were it's been hidden away for some time even the French know he's Welsh
Thanks for the video Hilbert. Never knew that Keltoi was applied to northern barbarians as a whole; was the term ever for Slavic peoples when they were migrating?
@@Zara-T_780 interesting, so Keltoi was used to refer specifically to the people inhabiting upper Germany and there decedents/off-shoot groups?
The Bretons, according to Nennius, were descendants Roman legionaries who rebelled and were punished to never return to their homes.
Great detail here. People like to associate themselves as being Celtic, or Saxon, or Viking etc. But I recall reading a book which claimed that based on genetic data of the modern English population, roughly 90% of the DNA of the modern native English population was from hunter-gatherers that inhabited the British Isles before any Celts, Romans, Saxons, Angles, Vikings etc came ashore. The overlords and dominant culture changed, but the people didn't.
in fact the oxford university report showed that the Welsh are the most native peoples of the British isles
Yes, there are many studies claiming different things. I do believe that the Welsh and other Gaelic/Celtic peoples of the British Isles originally inhabited all of England, and they only moved Westwards over to Wales and Cornwall etc when Angles and Saxons began to invade from the East circa AD 400-500. So the Welsh are arguably the real Britons.
@@SamuelHallEngland aye, but you realise the welsh go further back than that right? Welsh people not only possess the genes of the Insular Celtic peoples but also the first neolithic settlers, the 'hunter gatherers' you refer to, I think your little book confused the wrong people dude
I read that book years ago so it's probably me that got things confused. So the modern Welsh would possess more neolithic genes than the modern English? But both groups would still contain a large amount.
That reminded me that that book also claimed that Welsh people from the valleys had the most amount of neolithic DNA, and Welsh people on the coast, particularly the South coast had the most amount of Anglo-Saxon DNA, as well as other more recent groups. Which reflects that smaller populations living up in the valleys really have been up there for a long time, whilst larger populations living on the coast are more recent.
Celts and Germanics were 'cousins' to begin with, anyway, so there... ;)
Actually Freawulf as weird as it seems,the Celts were (first)cousins with the Italic indoeuropean people of the Italian peninsula(linguistically any way) with whom they share borders in the south of their Celtic homeland in central Europe(modern day Switzerland,Austria,Chezh republic,south Germany,north Italy and Slovenia)before they start immigrating all over they place.They did however share a lot of the same culture with the Germanic people in the North.Some German tribes had Celtishized and some Celtic tribes had Germanized(mostly the ones living north of the Rhine river,due to the Germanic expansion from the north to the south)by the time the Romans strarted invating Gaul and north west Europe(Belgium and north west Germany).
Spot on observations about the linguistic relationship with the Italic peoples (actually linguists once talked about the Italoceltic branch of IE languages) as well as the cultural (and, dare I say, racial) relationship with the Germanics in the north and east. Excellent observations for the region now spanning part of the NE France and Belgium: it was once a ethnoliguistic melting pot for Celtic and Germanic tribes. In fact, some Historians argued that the Belgae (who incidentally were the forefathers of the Celts who migrated to Britain) were not Celtic at all by the time Caesar invaded Belgica, but rather Germanic or Celto-Germanic. Ain't History and Ethnology fascinating? ;)
Συμπατριώτης; ;))
@@Freawulf χαχαχα,ναι πατριωτακι.Η ιστορια ειναι οντως απιστευτη.Και ειδικα οσο πιο πισω πας που η γνωσεις μας αρχιζουν και θολωνουν τοσο πιο ωραια ειναι.
Έτσι ακριβώς, φίλε μου!
A historical Celtic region often overlooked is Galicia (note the etymology) in northern Spain. Today they don't speak any Celtic languages but it is the only other place I've seen outside of the British isles were bagpipes are played.
Great video but as someone with ancestry from Devon I will say that the Dumnonii were from Cornwall and Devon.
You should bear in mind that Angus MacNeil is an SNP MP.
I'll just leave that hanging there...........
Would you please elaborate?
@@jackheggarty1929 Fair enough.
I'm a Scotsman, and proud of it, (whatever national pride means), but the SNP are a bunch of arseholes.
Small minded, petty, jingoistic arseholes.
I've no problem with their pursuit of an independent Scotland, although I'm a bit too pragmatic to get carried away with the idea, but as a party they're beneath contempt IMHO.
MacNeil isn't far off the mark in insinuating that the BBC seems to have an agenda, but he's making himself look like a tool with this tweet.
+Ian Macfarlane Hello, thanks for responding.
I, too, am a Scotsman. I'm a bit confused by your impression of the SNP. Why do you believe them to be small minded and petty? In terms of jingoism, the SNP are (to me at least) seemingly rather tame, especially if compared to UKIP or other such parties.What experience with them has given you this impression?
I would certainly concede that they are flawed - their Big Tent politics a great irritation to me as it potentially limits the amount of good they can do for Scotland - but i believe they have ultimately have done well for Scotland, blocking many of the worse Austerity cuts imposed by Westminster and maintaining a truly National Health Service. I'm just curious what your issues are with them.
@@jackheggarty1929 Alex Salmond would be a big factor in my impression, although with current events I'd prefer not to go for perceived cheap shots.
Until such times as he's proven guilty, he's innocent.
His personality was undeniably forceful & smug, which always grated with me, although there's no denying the man's political astuteness.
I'm also old enough to be aware of the part that the SNP played in ushering in Thatcher, and even though that was a generation ago, it's something that I'll always be aware of.
Nicola Sturgeon is also someone that I've very little time for - from her days as NUS rep at the old Langside college, right through to the present.
I've only mentioned personality issues, so I should probably elaborate on the petty mindedness.
The debating chamber at Holyrood seems to be used for nothing more than points scoring, although in this regard it's no different to Westminster.
However, it doesn't bode well for an independent country.
We've had over 15 years to prove that the country can be run in an adult fashion, and yet I've seen no evidence of that.
Of course the 'Unionist' parties aren't free from blame, but opposition parties often fall into a confrontational mindset as a matter of course.
The governing party should be above that - concentrating on health, education, job creation, building infrastructure, attracting inward investment etc, not banging on about Indyref 2.
I do have a degree of sympathy for the independence movement as the Brexit referendum was undeniably a massive spanner in the works.
I've no doubt that had the Brexit referendum happened before the independence vote things would have been very different.
I've no issues with the idea of independence, but the SNP have got to grow up if they wish to instill confidence in the electorate.
Maybe I've not been specific enough for you but it doesn't come down to specific actions - it's a general point about my perception of the SNP as a whole - it's time to move beyond the flag waving, and get down to real, meaningful action.