Anthony D Miller is a gem. Of course I am an Apostate. In order to be honest in my dealings with my fellow humans I came to realize that I couldn't raise a sustaining hand for leaders who bear false witness and lie and call it "faith promoting."
Dallin H. Oaks: "It’s wrong to criticize leaders of the Church, even if the criticism is true, because it diminishes their effectiveness as a servant of the Lord." There really is no need to take anything else seriously coming from a leader of the Church who preaches this. The focus is not on what is right and what is wrong. The focus is on ensuring that people will obey the leaders of the Church (i.e. ensuring that the leaders will be "effective")...regardless of whether the leaders are right or wrong.
It's clearly the Church of Simon Says. The current leaders are Simon. If Simon re-validates the teachings of any deceased prophet that's okay. But the commoners can't do that if what the deceased prophet said undermines the authority of Simon and Simon did not say it was okay.
1:46:15 i think there is a fine line between educated and arrogant. The truth matters. These things need discussed but in a climate of humility. There are serious historical and doctrinal questions that should be discussed if we're all serious about discovering truth, not taking sides.
The Book of Mormon essentially claims the Brass Plates had the entire OT *and more*, all the way to the end of Deutero Isaiah on them. The OT wasn't even compiled in one set of documents before 600 BC, let alone in the possession of someone who could have the entirety of it painstakingly etched onto metal plates *in Egyptian* prior to Lehi leaving Jerusalem.
I noticed that when people talk about Prophets, Seers and Revelator it focuses on Joseph Smith who wrote ancient scriptures and made future prophecies. None of the discussion revolves around the current First Presidency and Apostles other than the semi-annual arm waving. In other words, none of the current Apostles don't even fit the Prophet, Seers and Revelators don't even follow the model set by Joseph Smith on a superficial level. I pointed this out to my Bishop that this is the reason I can't sustain the current group as Prophets, Seers and Revelators. Despite this rejection and not accepting the church is restored, my Bishop allowed me to go to the temple because I do live like a Mormon. I guess I got lucky with the Bishop roulette. I do feel God's power at the temple which brings me great joy. I am against the current approach of forcing the mega temples down the small communities throats.
"Priesthood authority" is the thing that really matters most to Oaks. That's why it's in the first paragraph. The assumption (classic begging the question) that this "priesthood authority" is from God is needed to sell the idea that the term "priesthood authority" has any more significance than goobenslurp authority or any other kind of authority that is just made up...by people who want to have authority over others. Well in the LDS church who is right there at the pinnacle of priesthood authority...just one heartbeat away from being at the very tippy top of priesthood authority? Why, that would be none other than...drum roll...Dallin Oaks. So of course, of course, of course anyone who doesn't submit to "priesthood authority" is a freakin' apostate. It's not like Oaks is trying to serve his own interests or reinforce, emphasize, buttress and strengthen the power position that he holds...oh wait! It is sort of like that.
The concept of The Great Apostasy didn't originate with mormonism. It was an (at least) eighteenth-century Protestant idea. Mormonism just mashes together lots of Protestant ideas, adds a bit of weird new stuff, and calls it a restoration.
Your ignorance is the Reformation isn't correcting a total Apostasy: the Catholics that were kicked out, such as Martin Luther, were interested in reforming some of the erroneous practices. Most Protestants didn't view the Catholic church as an Apostate church like Mormons view authentic Christianity.
BY called for infanta2ide of mixed-faith, mixed-race babies?? I mean, there were a lot of awful, racist statements from the mid-1800's, but I listened to this part a few times here. Was/is that real?
I'm an active Mormon and I think this is almost Evil what ELder Oaks has instructed. Again he is basically forcing everyone to believe in what he says. This is so wrong in so many ways. I don't think God is happy with Oaks.
@@JaredSJones82 Yeah that scares me. It will be very interesting to see what happens when he RULES!!! I am team mercy &Grace Elder Uctdorf. But i feel like I get him in trouble everytime I use his name! lol!
Frankly I don't think Oaks is happy with Oaks. He strikes me as a man who knows truth is truth. Lie is lie. He knows who he is....man in the mirror ain't pleasant to face. Don't feel sorry for him. He chose not only lie for the lord. Lie to him. Um. Okay..
Very interesting dialogue. Some good ideas and thoughts and opinions being discussed. But there are some things being said that are just not Worth its salt.
I like to know in the near future,what well the church do,when the monetary system crashes, are they thinking ahead? And are they gonna be there for the poor, sick, and the needy.? If our right politicians don't get there way.?
It is so clear that the lds church leaders are not true apostles and prophets Because gods word never changes and he never changes , if we want to know God read the Bible the Old Testament is clear on who the God of Isreal is Have a blessed day 🙂
Sorry meant. Didnt know about yourson. Sorry. Got fat fingers 4 texting.Anthony dear. Been a fan of urs 4 years. Remember u yrs ago when u cried. Was that a Sunstone. Think you shed tears over your son. Not sure. Maybe faith crisis???? Just remember praying God would help u thru ur heartbreak. Didnt know about your sin. Just glad you and all family r doing better. ❤ yall and God does too. Ps. Raised Baptist. Xlds of 27 years. GOD AND JESUS STILL THRIVING. ❤ YALL. 🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
I cringe when I see these church affiliated studies showing pie charts with similar percentages and more than 3-4 values. In this data and insights world this is a major faux pas and highlights their amateurishness. Use a stacked bar people! Sorry a rant on the BYU study mostly but I appreciate the insights and analysis shared in the episode..
People's opinions on the various covid measures tend to divide along political lines, but that's not because the covid issues were political. The political division is simply due to the fact that the overwhelming majority of people don't know enough about biology, biochemistry, and the other relevant disciplines to really understand what was wrong with masking, distancing, and the mRNA injections, so they just fall back on whatever their favorite political team says about those issues. Although good information on those issues from honest scientists was heavily censored, it was not impossible to find. Now that certain pharmaceutical companies (which the left used to distrust deeply--go figure) are being sued for their slipshod safety testing and quality control, fraudulent claims of efficacy, etc., the truth may become more apparent to more people. Given the LDS corporation's lack of discernment, and no doubt also because of the hundreds of millions of dollars they had invested in companies that stood to profit from covid19, it's no surprise that they were 180-degrees wrong about the whole thing.
Those teachings of the prophets manuals were incredibly deceptive, Chery picked, and misleading. They did not represent the worldview or doctrinal beliefs of those men. So disappointing. Using dead guys to to advance their own agenda
35:35 I'm an exmo but believer in the Book of Mormon. Science does not debunk the Book of Mormon. There have been literally thousands of artifacts found in the Eastern US that have Hebrew influence. Horses in America.... Hagerman horse. People will debate these things from both sides but there are plausible, empirical evidence and explanations for the book of Mormon.
@@topbrent Yet here you are drawing a false contradiction. In the process of deconstructing I didn't create a TH-cam channel and obsess over it. It seems financial objectives are at play here.
I have to push back on the idea the church is pro-family. I personally experienced subtle undermining my relationship with my children when I left the church. I also have to share an example of a bishop undermining another family. A woman and her son were introduced by the bishop to give "talks" at sac. mtg. As the bishop introduced the young boy, he said since the father is not a member, the young boy had to be the spiritual leader in the home. I was appalled the bishop just undermined the mothers spirituality, he undermined the fathers spirituality, he undermined their marriage and he put all that on the 12 yr old boy.
![Merry Smithmas! [the Mormon Newscast 12.23.24]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/v49qrEQN8ec/mqdefault.jpg)
![Merry Smithmas! [the Mormon Newscast 12.23.24]](/img/tr.png)
Anthony D Miller is a gem.
Of course I am an Apostate. In order to be honest in my dealings with my fellow humans I came to realize that I couldn't raise a sustaining hand for leaders who bear false witness and lie and call it "faith promoting."
As xlds of 27 years I feel like YES Apostate and Thankful. I need T shirt😂😂😂😂😂
Fellow Apostate and I owe much of my healing in this journey to Anthony. I love his Mormon Stories episode so much! Thank you Anthony
Seventh-Day Adventists also teach about a "Great Apostacy" in the 1st century AD.
I love your show ❤
You bring sunshine into my life and thank you for speaking the truth .
It is so great to be out of it all .
Dallin H. Oaks: "It’s wrong to criticize leaders of the Church, even if the criticism is true, because it diminishes their effectiveness as a servant of the Lord." There really is no need to take anything else seriously coming from a leader of the Church who preaches this. The focus is not on what is right and what is wrong. The focus is on ensuring that people will obey the leaders of the Church (i.e. ensuring that the leaders will be "effective")...regardless of whether the leaders are right or wrong.
Yes! And "Not all truth is useful" ~BKPacker, along with, "Research is not the answer" ~D.Hoax
Oaks is the scare crow
Okay. Not gonna even reply. Oaks is demonic hoax.
This is garbage. You have nothing to offer just like tearing others faith down. Go away Satan.
Very interesting and enlightening - thank you! "Lazy learner" here! Rebecca and Landon, great job!
Love hearing from Anthony! You guys snag the best guests! Loved the discussion!
It's clearly the Church of Simon Says. The current leaders are Simon. If Simon re-validates the teachings of any deceased prophet that's okay. But the commoners can't do that if what the deceased prophet said undermines the authority of Simon and Simon did not say it was okay.
I loved classic cars and comic books
Anthony Miller is one of the nicest people I’ve ever interacted with. Legend
Thanks Anthony for pointing out where the Church was right. 50:00
Will this publish to podcasts? My fave car listening. I look forward to it! You guys rock!
Great episode. Love the factual data.
Another great topic expertly handled. Thank you!
Great episode!
We appreciate the love and support! Thank you!
1:46:15 i think there is a fine line between educated and arrogant. The truth matters. These things need discussed but in a climate of humility. There are serious historical and doctrinal questions that should be discussed if we're all serious about discovering truth, not taking sides.
The Book of Mormon essentially claims the Brass Plates had the entire OT *and more*, all the way to the end of Deutero Isaiah on them. The OT wasn't even compiled in one set of documents before 600 BC, let alone in the possession of someone who could have the entirety of it painstakingly etched onto metal plates *in Egyptian* prior to Lehi leaving Jerusalem.
I noticed that when people talk about Prophets, Seers and Revelator it focuses on Joseph Smith who wrote ancient scriptures and made future prophecies.
None of the discussion revolves around the current First Presidency and Apostles other than the semi-annual arm waving.
In other words, none of the current Apostles don't even fit the Prophet, Seers and Revelators don't even follow the model set by Joseph Smith on a superficial level.
I pointed this out to my Bishop that this is the reason I can't sustain the current group as Prophets, Seers and Revelators.
Despite this rejection and not accepting the church is restored, my Bishop allowed me to go to the temple because I do live like a Mormon.
I guess I got lucky with the Bishop roulette.
I do feel God's power at the temple which brings me great joy.
I am against the current approach of forcing the mega temples down the small communities throats.
"Priesthood authority" is the thing that really matters most to Oaks. That's why it's in the first paragraph. The assumption (classic begging the question) that this "priesthood authority" is from God is needed to sell the idea that the term "priesthood authority" has any more significance than goobenslurp authority or any other kind of authority that is just made up...by people who want to have authority over others. Well in the LDS church who is right there at the pinnacle of priesthood authority...just one heartbeat away from being at the very tippy top of priesthood authority? Why, that would be none other than...drum roll...Dallin Oaks. So of course, of course, of course anyone who doesn't submit to "priesthood authority" is a freakin' apostate. It's not like Oaks is trying to serve his own interests or reinforce, emphasize, buttress and strengthen the power position that he holds...oh wait! It is sort of like that.
I have found that the only argument the Mormon church makes anymore is the same one Eric cartmann claims: “Respect mah authoritah!”
My mind is blown. I need my TBM husband to listen to this!! When his Grandma, who was Packers personal assistant, dies- then maybe!!
Fabulous episode my friends! Now go start your WeEkeNd🎉
Thank you! You too!
It’s really hard to put the “genie” back in the bottle once released!
Second time through this timely video and learned even more. Thanks for your high quality content👏
You bet! Thank you for watching!!
Thanks!
Thank you for your support!
Excellent episode
Yes! Landon! Church is self serving!!
Insightful message!
Very well done!
Anthony is one of the kindest people around.
The concept of The Great Apostasy didn't originate with mormonism. It was an (at least) eighteenth-century Protestant idea. Mormonism just mashes together lots of Protestant ideas, adds a bit of weird new stuff, and calls it a restoration.
Your ignorance is the Reformation isn't correcting a total Apostasy: the Catholics that were kicked out, such as Martin Luther, were interested in reforming some of the erroneous practices.
Most Protestants didn't view the Catholic church as an Apostate church like Mormons view authentic Christianity.
Yup, I am ! Excellent podcast! Thank you!❤
Wow ! I’m a member of prosperity apostasy !
BY called for infanta2ide of mixed-faith, mixed-race babies?? I mean, there were a lot of awful, racist statements from the mid-1800's, but I listened to this part a few times here. Was/is that real?
Yep. Real. Just look up ol Bring 'em Young.
personally proud of my patterns of personal apostasy, my podcasting pals
I know my wearing of "Hawaiian" shirts at church made me suspect🙂🙃😇
😂
Apostate word history.... runaway slave. Great podcast episode!
I'm an apostate in every religion!\
Landon is on fire!
The integrity talk was delivered by Jack N. Gerard of the Seventy not Andersen.
As a missionary I was taught (in Preach My Gospel) to help investigator’s resolve their doubts by ADDRESSING them. But for tithe paying members: no 😢
I'm an active Mormon and I think this is almost Evil what ELder Oaks has instructed. Again he is basically forcing everyone to believe in what he says. This is so wrong in so many ways. I don't think God is happy with Oaks.
He is next in line….
@@JaredSJones82 Yeah that scares me. It will be very interesting to see what happens when he RULES!!! I am team mercy &Grace Elder Uctdorf. But i feel like I get him in trouble everytime I use his name! lol!
@@JaredSJones82only if he outlive president Nelson 😂
Oaks is the scare crow
Frankly I don't think Oaks is happy with Oaks. He strikes me as a man who knows truth is truth. Lie is lie. He knows who he is....man in the mirror ain't pleasant to face. Don't feel sorry for him. He chose not only lie for the lord. Lie to him. Um. Okay..
Proud of it..
I am a proud apostate 😊
Very interesting dialogue. Some good ideas and thoughts and opinions being discussed. But there are some things being said that are just not Worth its salt.
I like to know in the near future,what well the church do,when the monetary system crashes, are they thinking ahead? And are they gonna be there for the poor, sick, and the needy.? If our right politicians don't get there way.?
It doesn't accidently post from Instagram to FB. In your settings it's set up to do that. You can disable it.
I am a proud apostate.
I am proud to be a None!
Proud of my Apostate status!
Yes, I'm an apostate.
It is so clear that the lds church leaders are not true apostles and prophets
Because gods word never changes and he never changes , if we want to know God read the Bible the Old Testament is clear on who the God of Isreal is
Have a blessed day 🙂
This makes everyone an apostate. Good news is Oaks will become a "past prophet" so according to his training...he can soon be ignored.
Apostate here!
Sorry meant. Didnt know about yourson. Sorry. Got fat fingers 4 texting.Anthony dear. Been a fan of urs 4 years. Remember u yrs ago when u cried. Was that a Sunstone. Think you shed tears over your son. Not sure. Maybe faith crisis???? Just remember praying God would help u thru ur heartbreak. Didnt know about your sin. Just glad you and all family r doing better. ❤ yall and God does too. Ps. Raised Baptist. Xlds of 27 years. GOD AND JESUS STILL THRIVING. ❤ YALL. 🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
I’m a church going apostate as well.
How do they not know the will of the Lord? I thought they speak with Jesus. Can’t he give them the answer to these questions?
I cringe when I see these church affiliated studies showing pie charts with similar percentages and more than 3-4 values. In this data and insights world this is a major faux pas and highlights their amateurishness. Use a stacked bar people! Sorry a rant on the BYU study mostly but I appreciate the insights and analysis shared in the episode..
"Proud to be an apostate" bikini 👙
No Anthony. Garden of Eden is in Missourri. Oops wait Ensign Peak is selling it off.
apostate since 1988
Since when did lds church care about science or scholarpship? Oh Science 6000 year old earth. Um hickbilly lds....
Science also debunk science... We should keep open mind
$$$$$$ TELL THE MORMONS THE HIGHT OF THE STEAPLE CAN BE AS HIGH AS THEY WANT, BUT JUST INVERTED DOWN UNDERGROUND$$$$$$
Salt lake city above, salt town below. Go go team zion
The less we know about the landscape the better off we are
People's opinions on the various covid measures tend to divide along political lines, but that's not because the covid issues were political. The political division is simply due to the fact that the overwhelming majority of people don't know enough about biology, biochemistry, and the other relevant disciplines to really understand what was wrong with masking, distancing, and the mRNA injections, so they just fall back on whatever their favorite political team says about those issues. Although good information on those issues from honest scientists was heavily censored, it was not impossible to find. Now that certain pharmaceutical companies (which the left used to distrust deeply--go figure) are being sued for their slipshod safety testing and quality control, fraudulent claims of efficacy, etc., the truth may become more apparent to more people. Given the LDS corporation's lack of discernment, and no doubt also because of the hundreds of millions of dollars they had invested in companies that stood to profit from covid19, it's no surprise that they were 180-degrees wrong about the whole thing.
If the church can make money from any crisis, it will.
The prophet is the 4th member of the Godhead
😂😅😂
😂😂😂
😂😂
Yes the Prophet made it into Godhead membership, yet Heavenly Mother who creates everyone's spirit is without honor.
Yes, and Romney is the 13th apostle LOL
Those teachings of the prophets manuals were incredibly deceptive, Chery picked, and misleading. They did not represent the worldview or doctrinal beliefs of those men. So disappointing. Using dead guys to to advance their own agenda
Oaks is the scare crow
35:35 I'm an exmo but believer in the Book of Mormon. Science does not debunk the Book of Mormon. There have been literally thousands of artifacts found in the Eastern US that have Hebrew influence.
Horses in America....
Hagerman horse. People will debate these things from both sides but there are plausible, empirical evidence and explanations for the book of Mormon.
No there hasn't.. there is zero DNA, there are zero steel objects, there were no horses as a con man in the 1830s pulled out of his butt.
Political correctness is all about low self-esteem
Oaks is liar liar pants on fire.
I left the Church 24 years ago. I suggest you all move on, as I have. It's not healthy to be obsessing over this.
And yet here you are...24 years later...listening to a post Mormon podcast. Moving on is hard and deconstruction is a continuum.
This is actually hilarious!! Why are you here?? Trolling much?
@@topbrent Yet here you are drawing a false contradiction.
In the process of deconstructing I didn't create a TH-cam channel and obsess over it.
It seems financial objectives are at play here.
@@user-mn447I don't think I'm trolling. Just illustrating (kinda humorously) that deconstruction can be a long process.
@@user-mn447 So essentially what you're saying is that countervailing opinions are not allowed here. You're creating your own Church.
Interesting.
I have to push back on the idea the church is pro-family. I personally experienced subtle undermining my relationship with my children when I left the church. I also have to share an example of a bishop undermining another family. A woman and her son were introduced by the bishop to give "talks" at sac. mtg. As the bishop introduced the young boy, he said since the father is not a member, the young boy had to be the spiritual leader in the home. I was appalled the bishop just undermined the mothers spirituality, he undermined the fathers spirituality, he undermined their marriage and he put all that on the 12 yr old boy.
Agreed! They are pro-family as long as the family is pro-church otherwise they tear families apart!
Thanks!
Thanks for your support!