Really liking the new setup and location. The combination of the lighter table, background and better looking lighting made the whole watching experience much, much better, especially for anyone with any issues with their vision.
Hi everyone! Slightly different set-up for this batch for logistical reasons... let us know what you think (our editor reads every comment... EVERY). In other news the electronic slider we used for our beauty shots is broken and no longer working (big sadness from the cameraman) but hopefully we'll get a replacement soon! Thanks for watching and your continued support...
@RoyalArmouries +RoyalArmouries Just to add my 0.5c Retrieve : (archaic) : Definition 3. Tto put right or improve (an unwelcome situation) Example: he made one last desperate attempt to retrieve the situation So that might be why its called 'Retriever' or 'Retrieval' (?) it is like Final Fantasy not being final perhaps it is them trying to fix something in a somewhat last ditch manner to get a contract?. (possibly?)
Ian (fw) noted in one of his early q&a videos that the dark colored tablecloth actually works better than light because the camera will focus more on the subtler contrasts instead of "washing out" 😮
@@beargillium2369 Yeah, the light table is definitely making it harder to make out details in the firearms. A darker cloth (like Ian always uses) would definitely help here.
Going to concur with Retriever - the character isn't high enough and there isn't enough of a cross stroke to be a t. Might be worth seeing if Silver or Webley were running contemporary adverts mentioning that as a sales name in...well, The Field?
I written before I saw that you'd posted that if it does end with a "t" that "Retrievet" is Dutch for "Retriever". So it means the same either way. Wonder if Kaufmann or the seller was Dutch or maybe for export?
I agree with the commenters saying the inscription reads "Retriever." Comparing the last letter to the earlier T, the T is taller and the cross sits above the other letters. Comparing it to the earlier R, it's the same height and the horizontal line is at the same level - roughly halfway up the loop of the neighboring E.
Congratulations on the subscriber count guys. Richly deserved. I have visited the Tower but will be going up to Leeds sometime this summer, and it's all down to this channel. See you soon!
as noted already in the comments, and I agree (fmr military linguist here) that it's a second "r" that's just in a "finishing slant" common in handwriting. In this case, it's almost certainly either referring to the dog, or to the act of hunting in the early-modern English way.
The last letter of the name, Retriever, certainly looks like another r similar to the first, at least looking at this video. And the Webley Bulldog predates this, so, maybe another, unofficial, doggo name. I want to see Chihuahua now, Deringer of some kind, I'd imagine. :D
great video as always, Sir Jonathan Ferguson, the keeper of firearms and artillery at the Royal Armouries museum in the UK, which houses a collection of thousands of iconic weapons throughout history.
Came here straight from watching a C&Rcenal video! I have to say, I do like your new setup. Also, the shirt is an appropriate C&Rcenal tribute. 5:52 Ironically enough, the swing-out cylinder in the modern sense was already patented by Albini in 1868 in the UK, and during the production of this model it was also patented again by the aforementioned Jean Warnant in the US (and, I presume, in most of Europe as well). 16:18 I believe a better explanation would be that the cylinder only moves when you want it to move, otherwise it's prevented from rotating by either of two stops. 24:51 I have to say that it doesn't look all that inspiring as a sight.
The Webley No.5 New model Army Express that my buddy once let me shoot had a similar backsight. At least for me, that particular gun would probably be the best combat revolver ever, because it naturally pointed where I wanted to shoot. The wide shallow V sight then made it easy to precisely and smoothly centre the front sight as the gun was brought up into the aim. It would have been interesting to try it on a UIT Duelling course of fire, but I never got the chance to do that.
@@JonathanFergusonRoyalArmouries I'm sorry if it came off as rude, I just thought a clarification for the viewers who might not get the point was in order.
@@derekp2674 I know that this style of sight is not too distinct from the so called express sight of a hunting piece, but the key difference in my opinion is that there's a vertical stripe on the express rear sight allowing the shooter to quicky & precisely find the center of the notch. A similar design among the older No. 4 Webleys and their Belgian relatives was the white metal triangle pointing towards the lowest point of the rear sight notch. So I find it very interesting that you managed to do just fine without it. Speaking of it, since you're a target shooter, how did you find this No. 5 in terms of accuracy?
@@F1ghteR41 I did not really fire enough rounds through the No.5 to form a view on how its accuracy compared to my then nearest equivalent revolver, an Uberti .44 Magnum Cattleman. The most accurate revolver I ever shot was an S&W Model 17 in .22lr. That said, I have sometimes seen almost the same level of accuracy from .38 calibre k-frame revolvers.
Identical marking on this Lot: 150: Webley & Scott Ltd No. 4 Revolver 455 Webley on Rock Island Auctions. Tried to link but they disappear. It seems to be more clearly 'Retriever'. Also Webley No 4 'Retriever' Pryse Pattern service revolver OBJECT NO. H5223 c. 1880. In the Powerhouse museum in Sydney, although they don't picture the marking here.
Regards: 'The Field' magazine. Around 1980 I bought a 2nd had copy of: 'Tales of a Rat Hunting Ma;, Brian Plummer' (still the best book about rat hunting I've read). Around 2000 I was in the British Queen pub (in Wyke) chatting to a man with a Jack Russell dog. I asked him if he ratted with his dog, he said he did. We talked of ratting. I talked about the book. He butted in and said: "That's Brian Plummer! He writes for The Field. His dogs are nowhere near as good as he says!" The world is small.
Hi new subscriber here.I only found you through Gamespot which is entertaining as i,m a big Ghost Recon player and a gun enthusiast.Your videos are great and fascinating.I have a big collection of deactivated and certificated WW2 guns (except my AK47) which i love even though they are basically paper weights but do have full moving parts but not my MP40 or AK. Keep up the great videos!
Retrievet isn’t Latin as I first thought but it IS a proper DUTCH word meaning ‘Retriever’. What a surprise. But, Retrieve is one of those slippery verbs which can appear to mean many things other than the obvious. Meanings like ‘Rescue’, ‘Recover’, ‘Protect’, ‘Restore’ amongst others in the case of Retrieve. We do know a bit about S.W. Silver & Co. In the 1880s, they were a well known ‘department store’ retailer and brand - rather like JC Penney or John Lewis today. Not a gunsmiths by any means but a general vendor; the London Cornhill site particularly sold items for travellers and (specifically) ‘Explorers’ - clothing, light and folding furniture, gadgets and gizmos. It wouldn’t be surprising if travellers and explorers might want to purchase a sturdy looking revolver, too. Why Dutch? Well, prior to WW2, the Dutch had a huge East Indies empire in the far-East. I bet plenty of Europeans went back and forth and one or more them might have ordered, or commissioned the production of revolver(s). Perhaps this weapon represents an overstock of production for say, Dutch overseas police, then sold as surplus to an outfit like SW Silver. Just guessing here. The 19th century (and later) retailers and merchants in the Cornhill-Bishopsgate-Fenchurch area had a reputation for selling on commission, locally produced, interesting, often hand crafted, high quality items at rock bottom prices. The winners here were the buyer and the retailer, with the maker/manufacture getting little or nothing or even being sold at a loss. These department stores were usually Jewish owned (as probably SW Silver was) and their ‘sharp’ business practices generated resentments which fed specifically into London anti-semitism over many years - this becomes quickly apparent if you start to research them. Older Londoners might remember ‘The Houndsditch Warehouse’ of the 1970s - as endlessly and rather catchily advertised on Capital Radio 194. That was the last of the SW Silver type London shopping experiences. I went once. No revolvers, sturdy or otherwise, were for sale. Unfortunately.
I suspect that the Dutch were more likely to order their own 1873 revolver or a cheap Belgian one (which would likely be superior), then go to expense with ordering from the UK.
@@F1ghteR41 OK. I am of course speculating wildly about what *only* might be a Dutch word on an unusual pistol from an unusual source. Where, I wonder, did a general department store like SW Silver acquire these revolvers and, with their deserved reputation as predatory middlemen, why?
@@alastairbarkley6572 I would expect that SW Silver ordered these revolvers just like any other retailer would. E.g. Wilkinson Sword had its own special line of products from Webley based on the preceding design to this, the so called Webley-Pryse. As for the name, many have said that it is just an unusual form of the final letter 'r' in the word 'Retriever', which has to be taken not as a name of a dog role or breed but as someone or something that rescues, rectifies or remedies something, especially some evil. Similar examples, as mentioned in the comments, exist elsewhere with more clear final letter of the inscription.
@@F1ghteR41 Sure. Maybe. But, whether it's English or Dutch, 'Retriever' (as people have discussed) would be an odd engraved marking for a general department store selling goods for travellers and/or explorers to specify for their order/s of firearms. I mean, why would Silvers want that? I'd be more convince if I could find evidence that Silvers sold a range of firearms or explorers supplies under the 'Retrievit' or 'Retriever' brand. A bit like the way Decathlon currently sells camping and outdoor goods under the 'Quechua' label - a French general retailer in the UK using an Aztec label for their goods. And why not?
Great video, as always! As a conservator, I particularly appreciated your mention of 'conservation' and their work preparing your collection for display, thank you on behalf of conservators everywhere. Regarding the stirrup and the 'couple of minor tweaks' you mentioned (around 23:30), on the later Webley service revolvers I have worked with the top of the hammer overlaps the top of the stirrup, which prevents the hammer falling when the stirrup is held open and forces the stirrup into engagement at the moment of firing (in the case of a broken stirrup spring, for example). This didn't appear to be the case in the example you demonstrated here, am I correct and would you consider this a shortcoming of the improved government revolver?
That wide v-notch is intended as a *fast* sight for snap shooting. Which makes sense if you consoder the envisioned probable use case - a sudden, close range encounter where speed beats precision. Which is what i have always heard was a major driver for the British preference for doubke action revolvers for "service" type use, even when the Colts were more accurate and chambered for more powerful cartridges and werent really much slower than pre-break top revolvers - better to have a fast shot that's "good enough" for "just outaide stabbing range" than cock the hammer and fire a more accurate shot at longer range.
It could read Retriever like the dog, eg like bulldog. Maybe it has something to do with the word trivet? That is three-legged item for cooking; something to do with the latches and hammer? Could earlier Kaufman Webley's have been retro fitted with the. Stirrup latch?
Definitely looks like Retriever to me. Which does kinda fit in the name - Retrievers and Bulldogs are both dog breeds. Retriever is certainly a friendlier sounding brand, as they tend to be pretty friendly pups, but any big dog can be dangerous.
With all the modern top break double actions being produced not just in Britain but also in mainland Europe (Belgium comes to mind) during this time, it certainly casts doubt on the statement that American gunmakers were "the leaders in the field" (revolver development) made by some people (NRApubs, cough cough). Europe was on par or even ahead of American firearms development in the 19th century. On another note, I would be interested in seeing some ballistic tests on the .476 Enfield. Also, is there any chance that Royal Armouries will ever make a video on the Kerr revolver?
Othias over at C&Rcenal makes a strong claim that the systems used by most modern revolvers, especially by the overwhelming majority of military revolvers at their peak around WW1, were essentially derived from Belgian inventions. One of those inventors, Jean Warnant, is mentioned in this video. He further points out that by the 1870s Americans were forced to imitate European developments, namely double action, to stay competitive on the export market, and, it has to be added, at home as well - Bulldog-style revolvers were priced very competitively, which costed the Yanks a President. 😉
@@MisterWonkaever heard of HK? FN? And before that, the Germans had the best small arms in WWII hands down. (Except for the Grand). Lots more examples
@@F1ghteR41with the clear prevalence of European designs, it's even more amusing hearing Phil Schreier (Check out NRApubs video on the Enfield revolver to hear him say it) state that the British were late to the game when it comes to metallic cartridge revolvers especially with the Colt SAA and the S&W top break and the British had to look up to the Americans. As if Webley hadn't made their early cartridge revolvers in the middle 1860s and Adams and Tranter conversion and purpose built metallic cartidge DA revolvers hadn't been around for around 3-5 years by the advent of the SAA and S&W top break.
@@thecount5558 I believe the Brits were indeed a bit late to the game when it came to military adoption of metallic cartridges - Lefaucheux pinfire revolvers were adopted by some European powers in the early 1860s already - but I don't know enough about various experimental or small-scale civilian metallic cartridge revolvers to judge whether a more general statement would be true. On the American side cartridge revolvers were a thing for quite some time - if I'm not mistaken, S&W Model 1 came out in 1857. Their proliferation perhaps wasn't as fast as it could be due to Rollin White patent and all the legal trouble and expense that resulted from it, and it was certainly seen that way by some officials at the time, hence Grant's veto on the Rollin White relief bill, but nevertheless, they certainly were around and made enough money for the S&W to develop their successful Model 3.
It could have been used as a signal gun to 'retrieve' the kids for dinner (it definitely says 'Retriever,' the last letter looks more like the r than the t)
Did they all have the "beak" shaped grips or did some have the colt style. I noticed that William Bonney "Billy the Kid" favoured the Colt lightning with the "beak" shaped grips. Why the "beak" shape?
Colt style grips were used on some of the Webley revolvers (the so called WG series) since the late 1880s. Of course, one could say that the bird's head grips were also Colt-like in the sense that they were popularized by Colt's 1877 & 1878 models.
Hey, quick question, does the RA Collection have a 'Webley-Bentley' revolver? I saw one on auction on Polish website Allegro, never heard of it, the title said it's a caplock gun in 12mm.
A quick search of the public facing collections database on the RA website suggests that they have three Webley / Bentley five shot percussion revolvers and about five more Bentley percussion revolvers.
@Getpojke As a Dutch guy I've never 'Retrievet'. The only reverence to that word I could find is from and article discussing how English words made it into the language because of the internet. Also Kaufmann is a German name not Dutch.
In Dutch we just use "retriever" as a loanword in the context of dog breeds. A literal translation would be "terugbrenger" or "haler" which are certainly not common vernacular. This was very definitely a "retriever" for private purchase by Victorian middle class in need of a service revolver that took a cartridge which was available in the full breadth of the British empire.
What I learned from movies and tv shows as a kid was that American revolvers are always shiny and silver and British revolvers are always dark and blued. The same source taught me the English used longbows and the French used crossbows. Exclusively. The derogatory national terms I learned from war comics. Later on I learned that if you are an American and your blued British revolver is unloaded you can shoot down a fighter with your umbrella. And a Walther P38 will put a single 9mm round through three bad guys if they are standing close enough. My sources of learning may not have been entirely accurate.
Those developments were made over a very short period of time. Were there circumstances pushing the rate of change? The social forces at the time weapons are sold are going to influence them.
Your American friend is still taking the pee out of the SA80 and i dont blame him not good for UK who does have a history of making guns ..Even India have made there first indigenous machine guns and some are saying there better than Sig
From Chat GPT regarding the word "Retrievet": The word "Retrievet" on top of a Webley revolver is a mystery, as this word is not commonly associated with Webley firearms. It's possible that it could be a custom engraving or a reference to something specific. A few possibilities for the engraving include: -Custom Personalization: The revolver might have been personalized by a previous owner or manufacturer with a specific word or name that holds personal significance. -Misinterpretation: The engraving might have been misinterpreted, and it could actually be a different word or phrase. -Historical or Cultural Reference: The word could be referencing something historical, cultural, or even from popular culture that is not immediately apparent.
![[Live สด] การออกรางวัลสลากกินแบ่งรัฐบาล งวดวันที่ 16 ธันวาคม 2567](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/dNTiBBthKgQ/mqdefault.jpg)
Really liking the new setup and location. The combination of the lighter table, background and better looking lighting made the whole watching experience much, much better, especially for anyone with any issues with their vision.
Hi everyone! Slightly different set-up for this batch for logistical reasons... let us know what you think (our editor reads every comment... EVERY).
In other news the electronic slider we used for our beauty shots is broken and no longer working (big sadness from the cameraman) but hopefully we'll get a replacement soon!
Thanks for watching and your continued support...
Very disappointed no SLRs are in the background. Also, you missed out ‘The’ on the job title, considering the internet has added it to the job title
This setup actually looks better than the previous two, which were a bit too grim for my liking.
@RoyalArmouries +RoyalArmouries
Just to add my 0.5c
Retrieve : (archaic) : Definition 3.
Tto put right or improve (an unwelcome situation)
Example: he made one last desperate attempt to retrieve the situation
So that might be why its called 'Retriever' or 'Retrieval' (?) it is like Final Fantasy not being final perhaps it is them trying to fix something in a somewhat last ditch manner to get a contract?. (possibly?)
Ian (fw) noted in one of his early q&a videos that the dark colored tablecloth actually works better than light because the camera will focus more on the subtler contrasts instead of "washing out" 😮
@@beargillium2369 Yeah, the light table is definitely making it harder to make out details in the firearms. A darker cloth (like Ian always uses) would definitely help here.
Any guesses for the inscription? Our editor hopes it's 'Retriever' like the dog, only because... dog.
Agreed, the final character must be an R because a second T would be the same height as the first
Owner's name.
just wondering, how many of your weapons are activated and how many deactivated
Going to concur with Retriever - the character isn't high enough and there isn't enough of a cross stroke to be a t. Might be worth seeing if Silver or Webley were running contemporary adverts mentioning that as a sales name in...well, The Field?
I would presume it is retriever to signify the revolvers reliability
Excellent video, the background is far better. Kudos for the C&Rsenal Martini-Henry shirt :)
I concur that the inscription is “Retriever.” The final letter is much more similar to the preceding “r” than the “t.”
I written before I saw that you'd posted that if it does end with a "t" that "Retrievet" is Dutch for "Retriever". So it means the same either way. Wonder if Kaufmann or the seller was Dutch or maybe for export?
@@Getpojke Kaufmann appears to have been Belgian from his residences.
@@Getpojke I'm Belgian(Dutch speaking) and i've never heard of the word "retrievet" being used for retriever(in Dutch).
Yes, the infection is spreading...
I agree with the commenters saying the inscription reads "Retriever."
Comparing the last letter to the earlier T, the T is taller and the cross sits above the other letters.
Comparing it to the earlier R, it's the same height and the horizontal line is at the same level - roughly halfway up the loop of the neighboring E.
Congratulations on the subscriber count guys. Richly deserved. I have visited the Tower but will be going up to Leeds sometime this summer, and it's all down to this channel. See you soon!
as noted already in the comments, and I agree (fmr military linguist here) that it's a second "r" that's just in a "finishing slant" common in handwriting.
In this case, it's almost certainly either referring to the dog, or to the act of hunting in the early-modern English way.
Exquisite! Thank you for this follow up to their work. Thanks!!!!
The last letter of the name, Retriever, certainly looks like another r similar to the first, at least looking at this video. And the Webley Bulldog predates this, so, maybe another, unofficial, doggo name. I want to see Chihuahua now, Deringer of some kind, I'd imagine. :D
The Webley Terrier, a small double barrel pistol in the very controllable .577 cal.
great video as always, Sir Jonathan Ferguson, the keeper of firearms and artillery at the Royal Armouries museum in the UK, which houses a collection of thousands of iconic weapons throughout history.
Polska mistrzem Polski ;)
possibly the best looking revolvers ever made
Thank you Sir. Genius coverage, again.
Thank you so much for going over the detailed markings and explaining them. It really scratches my brain 🧠 itch 😊
Came here straight from watching a C&Rcenal video! I have to say, I do like your new setup. Also, the shirt is an appropriate C&Rcenal tribute.
5:52 Ironically enough, the swing-out cylinder in the modern sense was already patented by Albini in 1868 in the UK, and during the production of this model it was also patented again by the aforementioned Jean Warnant in the US (and, I presume, in most of Europe as well).
16:18 I believe a better explanation would be that the cylinder only moves when you want it to move, otherwise it's prevented from rotating by either of two stops.
24:51 I have to say that it doesn't look all that inspiring as a sight.
The Webley No.5 New model Army Express that my buddy once let me shoot had a similar backsight.
At least for me, that particular gun would probably be the best combat revolver ever, because it naturally pointed where I wanted to shoot. The wide shallow V sight then made it easy to precisely and smoothly centre the front sight as the gun was brought up into the aim.
It would have been interesting to try it on a UIT Duelling course of fire, but I never got the chance to do that.
16:18 - more concise, certainly. Until they let me use a script, you get my ramblings :)
@@JonathanFergusonRoyalArmouries I'm sorry if it came off as rude, I just thought a clarification for the viewers who might not get the point was in order.
@@derekp2674 I know that this style of sight is not too distinct from the so called express sight of a hunting piece, but the key difference in my opinion is that there's a vertical stripe on the express rear sight allowing the shooter to quicky & precisely find the center of the notch. A similar design among the older No. 4 Webleys and their Belgian relatives was the white metal triangle pointing towards the lowest point of the rear sight notch. So I find it very interesting that you managed to do just fine without it.
Speaking of it, since you're a target shooter, how did you find this No. 5 in terms of accuracy?
@@F1ghteR41 I did not really fire enough rounds through the No.5 to form a view on how its accuracy compared to my then nearest equivalent revolver, an Uberti .44 Magnum Cattleman.
The most accurate revolver I ever shot was an S&W Model 17 in .22lr. That said, I have sometimes seen almost the same level of accuracy from .38 calibre k-frame revolvers.
Identical marking on this Lot: 150: Webley & Scott Ltd No. 4 Revolver 455 Webley on Rock Island Auctions. Tried to link but they disappear. It seems to be more clearly 'Retriever'.
Also Webley No 4 'Retriever' Pryse Pattern service revolver
OBJECT NO. H5223
c. 1880. In the Powerhouse museum in Sydney, although they don't picture the marking here.
Love the new filming set up ! Gives me a Neo in the Matrix vibe," we need guns. ! Lots of guns"
Regards: 'The Field' magazine.
Around 1980 I bought a 2nd had copy of: 'Tales of a Rat Hunting Ma;, Brian Plummer' (still the best book about rat hunting I've read).
Around 2000 I was in the British Queen pub (in Wyke) chatting to a man with a Jack Russell dog. I asked him if he ratted with his dog, he said he did. We talked of ratting. I talked about the book. He butted in and said:
"That's Brian Plummer! He writes for The Field. His dogs are nowhere near as good as he says!"
The world is small.
Excellent video as always Jonathan!
A wonderful video, Jonathan anything you do is welcome ...
The T-Shirt was hilarious ...
Fascinating, thank you.
That's one cool T shirt Jonathan!
Hi new subscriber here.I only found you through Gamespot which is entertaining as i,m a big Ghost Recon player and a gun enthusiast.Your videos are great and fascinating.I have a big collection of deactivated and certificated WW2 guns (except my AK47) which i love even though they are basically paper weights but do have full moving parts but not my MP40 or AK.
Keep up the great videos!
Welcome! Thank you for joining us :)
Excellent video thank you 👍
"Looked through the drawers and found this [incredibly rare antique]" is such a British curator thing.
Retrievet isn’t Latin as I first thought but it IS a proper DUTCH word meaning ‘Retriever’. What a surprise. But, Retrieve is one of those slippery verbs which can appear to mean many things other than the obvious. Meanings like ‘Rescue’, ‘Recover’, ‘Protect’, ‘Restore’ amongst others in the case of Retrieve.
We do know a bit about S.W. Silver & Co. In the 1880s, they were a well known ‘department store’ retailer and brand - rather like JC Penney or John Lewis today. Not a gunsmiths by any means but a general vendor; the London Cornhill site particularly sold items for travellers and (specifically) ‘Explorers’ - clothing, light and folding furniture, gadgets and gizmos. It wouldn’t be surprising if travellers and explorers might want to purchase a sturdy looking revolver, too.
Why Dutch? Well, prior to WW2, the Dutch had a huge East Indies empire in the far-East. I bet plenty of Europeans went back and forth and one or more them might have ordered, or commissioned the production of revolver(s). Perhaps this weapon represents an overstock of production for say, Dutch overseas police, then sold as surplus to an outfit like SW Silver. Just guessing here.
The 19th century (and later) retailers and merchants in the Cornhill-Bishopsgate-Fenchurch area had a reputation for selling on commission, locally produced, interesting, often hand crafted, high quality items at rock bottom prices. The winners here were the buyer and the retailer, with the maker/manufacture getting little or nothing or even being sold at a loss. These department stores were usually Jewish owned (as probably SW Silver was) and their ‘sharp’ business practices generated resentments which fed specifically into London anti-semitism over many years - this becomes quickly apparent if you start to research them.
Older Londoners might remember ‘The Houndsditch Warehouse’ of the 1970s - as endlessly and rather catchily advertised on Capital Radio 194. That was the last of the SW Silver type London shopping experiences. I went once. No revolvers, sturdy or otherwise, were for sale. Unfortunately.
I suspect that the Dutch were more likely to order their own 1873 revolver or a cheap Belgian one (which would likely be superior), then go to expense with ordering from the UK.
@@F1ghteR41 OK. I am of course speculating wildly about what *only* might be a Dutch word on an unusual pistol from an unusual source. Where, I wonder, did a general department store like SW Silver acquire these revolvers and, with their deserved reputation as predatory middlemen, why?
@@alastairbarkley6572 I would expect that SW Silver ordered these revolvers just like any other retailer would. E.g. Wilkinson Sword had its own special line of products from Webley based on the preceding design to this, the so called Webley-Pryse.
As for the name, many have said that it is just an unusual form of the final letter 'r' in the word 'Retriever', which has to be taken not as a name of a dog role or breed but as someone or something that rescues, rectifies or remedies something, especially some evil. Similar examples, as mentioned in the comments, exist elsewhere with more clear final letter of the inscription.
@@F1ghteR41 Sure. Maybe. But, whether it's English or Dutch, 'Retriever' (as people have discussed) would be an odd engraved marking for a general department store selling goods for travellers and/or explorers to specify for their order/s of firearms. I mean, why would Silvers want that? I'd be more convince if I could find evidence that Silvers sold a range of firearms or explorers supplies under the 'Retrievit' or 'Retriever' brand. A bit like the way Decathlon currently sells camping and outdoor goods under the 'Quechua' label - a French general retailer in the UK using an Aztec label for their goods. And why not?
I def think its "Retriever" that last letter looks like a squashed r more than a t personally
The important question is where the Martini Henry Cafe (Point 577 Boxer with a bayonet and some guts behind it) t shirt comes from?
It is from C&Rsenal :)
Great video, as always! As a conservator, I particularly appreciated your mention of 'conservation' and their work preparing your collection for display, thank you on behalf of conservators everywhere.
Regarding the stirrup and the 'couple of minor tweaks' you mentioned (around 23:30), on the later Webley service revolvers I have worked with the top of the hammer overlaps the top of the stirrup, which prevents the hammer falling when the stirrup is held open and forces the stirrup into engagement at the moment of firing (in the case of a broken stirrup spring, for example). This didn't appear to be the case in the example you demonstrated here, am I correct and would you consider this a shortcoming of the improved government revolver?
Finally, Jonathan found the light switch😉😁
Nice shirt!
excellent
Latin for recover or recuperate.Possibly a reference to the ease of reloading?
Webley produced several prototype revolvers in .38 special in the 1970s. They never went into production. Do the Royal Armouries have one?
That wide v-notch is intended as a *fast* sight for snap shooting.
Which makes sense if you consoder the envisioned probable use case - a sudden, close range encounter where speed beats precision. Which is what i have always heard was a major driver for the British preference for doubke action revolvers for "service" type use, even when the Colts were more accurate and chambered for more powerful cartridges and werent really much slower than pre-break top revolvers - better to have a fast shot that's "good enough" for "just outaide stabbing range" than cock the hammer and fire a more accurate shot at longer range.
Yeah there's Smith & Wesson, Colt, Magnum Research.. But Weobley are my all time favourite revolvers. Bias? Yeah, I know!
I think it says retriever. If you compare the 'r' after the 't' to the last letter the styling looks to be the same. It's just a high back fancy 'r'
It could read Retriever like the dog, eg like bulldog. Maybe it has something to do with the word trivet? That is three-legged item for cooking; something to do with the latches and hammer?
Could earlier Kaufman Webley's have been retro fitted with the. Stirrup latch?
Such handsome blasters.
Definitely looks like Retriever to me. Which does kinda fit in the name - Retrievers and Bulldogs are both dog breeds. Retriever is certainly a friendlier sounding brand, as they tend to be pretty friendly pups, but any big dog can be dangerous.
Did anyone else come for the shirts?
I came for the shirts.
I have the set his comes from. :)
Martini Henry does seem like a good name for a bar. I wonder if people ask him where it is and then he has to explain the rifle.
Nice shirt #C&Rsenalmafia
With all the modern top break double actions being produced not just in Britain but also in mainland Europe (Belgium comes to mind) during this time, it certainly casts doubt on the statement that American gunmakers were "the leaders in the field" (revolver development) made by some people (NRApubs, cough cough). Europe was on par or even ahead of American firearms development in the 19th century.
On another note, I would be interested in seeing some ballistic tests on the .476 Enfield.
Also, is there any chance that Royal Armouries will ever make a video on the Kerr revolver?
We might only speculate _how_ the Britons and Europeans lost the edge in firearms development
Othias over at C&Rcenal makes a strong claim that the systems used by most modern revolvers, especially by the overwhelming majority of military revolvers at their peak around WW1, were essentially derived from Belgian inventions. One of those inventors, Jean Warnant, is mentioned in this video. He further points out that by the 1870s Americans were forced to imitate European developments, namely double action, to stay competitive on the export market, and, it has to be added, at home as well - Bulldog-style revolvers were priced very competitively, which costed the Yanks a President. 😉
@@MisterWonkaever heard of HK? FN? And before that, the Germans had the best small arms in WWII hands down. (Except for the Grand). Lots more examples
@@F1ghteR41with the clear prevalence of European designs, it's even more amusing hearing Phil Schreier (Check out NRApubs video on the Enfield revolver to hear him say it) state that the British were late to the game when it comes to metallic cartridge revolvers especially with the Colt SAA and the S&W top break and the British had to look up to the Americans. As if Webley hadn't made their early cartridge revolvers in the middle 1860s and Adams and Tranter conversion and purpose built metallic cartidge DA revolvers hadn't been around for around 3-5 years by the advent of the SAA and S&W top break.
@@thecount5558 I believe the Brits were indeed a bit late to the game when it came to military adoption of metallic cartridges - Lefaucheux pinfire revolvers were adopted by some European powers in the early 1860s already - but I don't know enough about various experimental or small-scale civilian metallic cartridge revolvers to judge whether a more general statement would be true. On the American side cartridge revolvers were a thing for quite some time - if I'm not mistaken, S&W Model 1 came out in 1857. Their proliferation perhaps wasn't as fast as it could be due to Rollin White patent and all the legal trouble and expense that resulted from it, and it was certainly seen that way by some officials at the time, hence Grant's veto on the Rollin White relief bill, but nevertheless, they certainly were around and made enough money for the S&W to develop their successful Model 3.
does the RA have any of the Parker Hale bolt action rifles that they produced in the years before they went out of business?
I like this backdrop, it’s got a very early 20th century nautical feel
It could have been used as a signal gun to 'retrieve' the kids for dinner (it definitely says 'Retriever,' the last letter looks more like the r than the t)
Oh hey, Jonathan is filming today in the "guns, lots of guns" room from _The Matrix._ Neat.
Did they all have the "beak" shaped grips or did some have the colt style. I noticed that William Bonney "Billy the Kid" favoured the Colt lightning with the "beak" shaped grips.
Why the "beak" shape?
Colt style grips were used on some of the Webley revolvers (the so called WG series) since the late 1880s. Of course, one could say that the bird's head grips were also Colt-like in the sense that they were popularized by Colt's 1877 & 1878 models.
@@F1ghteR41 Thanks for that information, yes i take your point.
Hey, quick question, does the RA Collection have a 'Webley-Bentley' revolver? I saw one on auction on Polish website Allegro, never heard of it, the title said it's a caplock gun in 12mm.
A quick search of the public facing collections database on the RA website suggests that they have three Webley / Bentley five shot percussion revolvers and about five more Bentley percussion revolvers.
"Retrievet" is Dutch for "Retriever". So would it have been meant for export or was Kaufmann possibly of Dutch origin?
@Getpojke As a Dutch guy I've never 'Retrievet'. The only reverence to that word I could find is from and article discussing how English words made it into the language because of the internet. Also Kaufmann is a German name not Dutch.
In Dutch we just use "retriever" as a loanword in the context of dog breeds. A literal translation would be "terugbrenger" or "haler" which are certainly not common vernacular. This was very definitely a "retriever" for private purchase by Victorian middle class in need of a service revolver that took a cartridge which was available in the full breadth of the British empire.
@@DiggingForFacts Oh okay, I'm must be miss-remembering. Was a long time ago with an old Dutch friend I shot with. Sorry for my misinformation.
@@JorgenKesseler Oh okay, I'm must be miss-remembering. Was a long time ago with an old Dutch friend I shot with. Sorry for my misinformation.
What I learned from movies and tv shows as a kid was that American revolvers are always shiny and silver and British revolvers are always dark and blued. The same source taught me the English used longbows and the French used crossbows. Exclusively. The derogatory national terms I learned from war comics. Later on I learned that if you are an American and your blued British revolver is unloaded you can shoot down a fighter with your umbrella. And a Walther P38 will put a single 9mm round through three bad guys if they are standing close enough.
My sources of learning may not have been entirely accurate.
oohh.. 4K excellent (not from an uploading point of view if you don't have fast interwebs though) 🤣
From an era when your commission and your service weapon were purchased.
Those developments were made over a very short period of time.
Were there circumstances pushing the rate of change? The social forces at the time weapons are sold are going to influence them.
My guess is immediate customer feedback from revolver aficionados. The Webley archive may contain the answer.
Ooh, they got him out of the basement.
The service Webely had such a terrible trigger pull that we jokingly judge all other pistol triggers as a percentage of Webley power.
John, what do you think will happen with crossbow regs?
Okay, Jonathan. I know it's a favourite revolver of yours.
Come for the history lesson, and stay for the shirts 😁
First non bot comment 😂 😭
ARCHAIC
the possibility of recovery.
"he ruined himself beyond retrieve"
Your pronounciation of Kaufmann is almost correct. The Kauf is good but the mann is pronounced like you'd pronounce munn (if it was real word).
Your American friend is still taking the pee out of the SA80 and i dont blame him not good for UK who does have a history of making guns ..Even India have made there first indigenous machine guns and some are saying there better than Sig
Ww 🤯
From Chat GPT regarding the word "Retrievet":
The word "Retrievet" on top of a Webley revolver is a mystery, as this word is not commonly associated with Webley firearms. It's possible that it could be a custom engraving or a reference to something specific.
A few possibilities for the engraving include:
-Custom Personalization: The revolver might have been personalized by a previous owner or manufacturer with a specific word or name that holds personal significance.
-Misinterpretation: The engraving might have been misinterpreted, and it could actually be a different word or phrase.
-Historical or Cultural Reference: The word could be referencing something historical, cultural, or even from popular culture that is not immediately apparent.