DeSu 2 was one of my first SMT games, and it's got a special place in my heart for that, regardless of how I feel about the story. I'd kill to see DeSu come back in some way this decade, whether we get a third game or remasters of Overclocked and Record Breaker.
I feel ya. I’d love to see the Devil Survivor series get another chance. It seems like a great game for the switch too. Hopefully Atlus will do something with a third installment or dual release of both remasters in some way. Thanks for checking out the video!
I personally love Desu 2, more than 1 because of the expansions they made to the gameplay and mechanics and I honestly love most if not all characters. It is definitely flawed, though and over the years those flaws make me less attracted to replay it over other megaten or persona games.
I totally get it gameplay wise. There are loads of improvements that make the game more enjoyable in a number of ways. As you mentioned, over the years , and even after it’s first play through, it definitely loses a lot of its value. It’s still enjoyable overall though. Thanks for checking out the video!
Im praying every day that we get Devil Survivor 3. And i hope that color is either Green Yellow or Purple. Green to complete the light chain(RGB Lights) Yellow to complete the Primary Colors Purple to connect the two colors Red and Blue
I like where you’re going with the themes of the colors. I’m sure if they would be able to somehow tie it together in the story too. Thanks for checking out the video!
@@Sopapiaaa yes it is! i'm a huge fan of the original desu and i feel pretty iffy about 2 so far! it bums me out a bit how far it strays from the original's vibe/themes which made it so special to me!
@ryojifan Totally feel ya on that one. That and some of the characters/character dialogue are what brought the game down for me. It just didn’t feel the same. On the plus side, practically everything else plays better than DeSu 1.
I love Devil Survivor 1, but I don't know if I want a 3. 2's writing was raw sewage, but the masses love it so high chance 3 has it's own Daichi Shijima. Ugh. I'm not a fan of Persona's bro characters, and Daichi is nearly every complaint one can have about Junpei, Yosuke, and Ryuji rolled into one. Also it's a neutral bias game, that can't even sell you on the neutral reps.
Fair enough. Agree with the hesitancy due to the writing and the likely outcome of a poor neutral rep. I’ll still take my chances of the game being pretty solid all around in an attempt to make up for the massive drop of the ball with SH2. Then again, would Atlus really want to risk officially killing of two series in such a short span? Haha Thanks for checking out the video!
I have a great idea for a game, a Persona devil survivor spin off game, just like the Q games are an easy way to get into the Etrian Odyssey series, a devil survivor Persona game would also be an easy way for that series, and If that game sells well then we can get a real devil survivor 3
I can see it a lot of it meshing really well together. A crossover with Persona will definitely get eyes on Devil Survivor. While I think it’s be nice to see Atlus step away from their reliance on Persona, if this were to be the reason for a DeSu 3, I’ll take it. Thanks for checking out the video!
I can’t entirely agree with your critique of the narrative. While there’s a lighter tone, it’s effectively counterbalanced by the overwhelming threat of the Septentriones, whose presence creates a palpable sense of dread. The claim that 'survival and its influence on the characters is completely absent' feels unfair when you're presented with the looming possibility of Lugh killing a party member. These events anchor the story in stakes and consequences, highlighting the characters’ struggles. Even if death can be prevented, on a first playthrough forcing to grapple with a potential death created a toooon of tension and dread. As for the stable base of operations, I don’t see it as a weakness. It shifts the tone from the first game in a deliberate way, introducing a fresh perspective. The tension doesn’t come from running or instability but from the mounting inevitability of facing the ever-stronger Septentriones. This structured approach enhances the narrative’s unique identity rather than diminishing it. I think the video is good for the most part, and you mostly support a lot of your arguments (such as the characters being more tropey). But a couple of points go unsupported which was a little frustrating. Ultimately I don't think the game took noticeable steps back in its narrative I'm also not sure why 2 ended up being a tier below 1 despite the ostensibly stronger gameplay but that's a minor quibble
No worries. That's why they're opinions. Personally, the Septentriones don't really feel like a counterpoint to the bright tone. Nor do they really bring any sense of dread to the narrative for me. If they bring that for you, that's great. I wish I could've gotten the same enjoyment. I will draw attention to the dread they instill in the player in terms of challenge during combat. Though, I don't find their presence to bring much in terms of enhancing the overall atmosphere or really being a homerun for the narrative. Besides, as I implied in the video, the cast being in the JPs in the manner presented essentially overshadows a lot of suspense in the game. I can see where you're going with grappling with a character's potential death. The example with Lugh, though, is how far along in the game? Day 6? I personally don't want to wait six in-game days to really get a sense of survival. Even if you wanted to include the death clips here, they're pretty insignificant in the grand scheme of things. The majority of these instances, if not all, are far less significant in terms of either plot development, character development, or the alignments, especially compared to similar moments in DeSu 1. In my opinion, they're a significant drop in quality and implementation when compared with DeSu 1's Death Clock and daily announcements. I'm not really sure I understand your final point. I believe this stable base of operations is about the JPs? Of course utilizing this would be a deliberate way to shift the tone. It's not the same situation as the first game... If I'm understanding you correctly, Devil Survivor 2's 'structured approach' of introducing stronger enemies as you progress in the game enhances the narrative's unique identity? Isn't that a crucial point of every JRPG? As to why I placed Devil Survivor 1 above 2? It's overall just the better game in my opinion. There's more to a game than just its gameplay. Like I said, if you place it higher, I won't argue. It's a good game. Thanks for checking out the video!
@@Sopapiaaa Yes, I forgot to highlight the gameplay/plot coherence of the Septentriones. Their demanding difficulty seamlessly integrates with the narrative’s escalating tension, creating a deep sense of satisfaction when overcoming them, especially with the knowledge that the challenges ahead will only grow more insurmountable. This dynamic threat feels far more compelling than bosses like Belial in DeSU1, where success is often reduced to exploiting a single gimmick, such as removing his invincibility and spamming Ice spells. While DeSU1 had moments like Baldr that demanded strategic engagement, DeSU2 sustains that intensity across the entire game. The idea that being housed in JPs outright eliminates suspense doesn’t hold up for me. The true tension lies in the apparent impossibility of defeating the Septentriones, whether it’s an alien multiplying endlessly, flying out of range, or being outright immune to all attacks. By contrast, DeSU1’s cast is rarely in real danger, even when they inexplicably decide to sleep in at the end of each day. There’s no need for shifts, and the supposed threats-like rogue humans-are rarely credible. Even someone like Kaido, despite killing Keisuke in specific scenarios (which I found frustrating), ultimately aligns with the group if you choose to recruit him. This undercuts any long-term consequences or interpersonal tensions, as most characters end up working together regardless of past actions. On character development, I think you might be overestimating DeSU1. While the core cast is solid, Midori is undeniably one-note. Keisuke’s arc is exceptional, but beyond that, the others-Kaido, Mari, SDF lady, etc-follow fairly predictable trajectories with little depth. Even for for character arcs more central to the narrative, such as Haru and Gin, suffer from their lack of presence throughout the game. I do think DeSU1's cast comes across more like real people, which is a part of why I find them more memorable at least. I also disagree with your assessment of alignments and endings in DeSU1. Several endings feel either unsatisfying or downright contradictory to the themes established earlier. For example, Atsuro’s route, despite him being my favorite character, hinges on entrusting demons to the Japanese government-a decision that feels absurd given their mishandling of the lockdown. It completely undermines the narrative’s prior critiques of authority. Meanwhile, Yuzu’s ending is essentially a bad ending in disguise, offering little resolution or satisfaction. >If I'm understanding you correctly, Devil Survivor 2's 'structured approach' of introducing stronger enemies as you progress in the game enhances the narrative's unique identity? Isn't that a crucial point of every JRPG? What DeSU2 does so well is center these elements-character arcs, thematic consistency, and escalating stakes-at the core of the narrative. It avoids arbitrariness, unlike DeSU1, where the focus zigzags from confronting an immortal early on (a fantastic moment) to battling more conventional enemies later. That’s not to criticize DeSU1 as a whole, but to emphasize that DeSU2 shouldn’t be faulted for diverging from its predecessor’s approach. Instead, it crafts its own identity, balancing narrative ambition with gameplay design in a way that feels deliberate and rewarding." >As to why I placed Devil Survivor 1 above 2? It's overall just the better game in my opinion. There's more to a game than just its gameplay. Like I said, if you place it higher, I won't argue. It's a good game. That's fair. Ultimately I would rank both games similar to each other, but I appreciate the clarification. Thanks for responding!
I don't think "anime" is an explanation. Anime is animation influenced by common tropes and archetypes that can be said to be overused, thus the problem is the writing gets worse or is dumbed down to appeal to broader audience.
DeSu 2 was one of my first SMT games, and it's got a special place in my heart for that, regardless of how I feel about the story. I'd kill to see DeSu come back in some way this decade, whether we get a third game or remasters of Overclocked and Record Breaker.
I feel ya. I’d love to see the Devil Survivor series get another chance. It seems like a great game for the switch too. Hopefully Atlus will do something with a third installment or dual release of both remasters in some way.
Thanks for checking out the video!
I personally love Desu 2, more than 1 because of the expansions they made to the gameplay and mechanics and I honestly love most if not all characters.
It is definitely flawed, though and over the years those flaws make me less attracted to replay it over other megaten or persona games.
I totally get it gameplay wise. There are loads of improvements that make the game more enjoyable in a number of ways. As you mentioned, over the years , and even after it’s first play through, it definitely loses a lot of its value. It’s still enjoyable overall though.
Thanks for checking out the video!
Im praying every day that we get Devil Survivor 3. And i hope that color is either Green Yellow or Purple.
Green to complete the light chain(RGB Lights)
Yellow to complete the Primary Colors
Purple to connect the two colors Red and Blue
I like where you’re going with the themes of the colors. I’m sure if they would be able to somehow tie it together in the story too.
Thanks for checking out the video!
this is a wonderful analysis ! i'm watching this while doing alcor's route in recordbreaker!!
Hey, I appreciate the comment!
Is this your first play through of Record Breaker?
@@Sopapiaaa yes it is! i'm a huge fan of the original desu and i feel pretty iffy about 2 so far! it bums me out a bit how far it strays from the original's vibe/themes which made it so special to me!
@ryojifan
Totally feel ya on that one. That and some of the characters/character dialogue are what brought the game down for me. It just didn’t feel the same.
On the plus side, practically everything else plays better than DeSu 1.
Really cool video!
@EphionWasTaken
Appreciate it! Thanks for checking out the video.
I love Devil Survivor 1, but I don't know if I want a 3. 2's writing was raw sewage, but the masses love it so high chance 3 has it's own Daichi Shijima. Ugh. I'm not a fan of Persona's bro characters, and Daichi is nearly every complaint one can have about Junpei, Yosuke, and Ryuji rolled into one. Also it's a neutral bias game, that can't even sell you on the neutral reps.
Fair enough. Agree with the hesitancy due to the writing and the likely outcome of a poor neutral rep. I’ll still take my chances of the game being pretty solid all around in an attempt to make up for the massive drop of the ball with SH2. Then again, would Atlus really want to risk officially killing of two series in such a short span? Haha
Thanks for checking out the video!
I have a great idea for a game, a Persona devil survivor spin off game, just like the Q games are an easy way to get into the Etrian Odyssey series, a devil survivor Persona game would also be an easy way for that series, and If that game sells well then we can get a real devil survivor 3
I can see it a lot of it meshing really well together. A crossover with Persona will definitely get eyes on Devil Survivor.
While I think it’s be nice to see Atlus step away from their reliance on Persona, if this were to be the reason for a DeSu 3, I’ll take it.
Thanks for checking out the video!
I can’t entirely agree with your critique of the narrative. While there’s a lighter tone, it’s effectively counterbalanced by the overwhelming threat of the Septentriones, whose presence creates a palpable sense of dread.
The claim that 'survival and its influence on the characters is completely absent' feels unfair when you're presented with the looming possibility of Lugh killing a party member. These events anchor the story in stakes and consequences, highlighting the characters’ struggles. Even if death can be prevented, on a first playthrough forcing to grapple with a potential death created a toooon of tension and dread.
As for the stable base of operations, I don’t see it as a weakness. It shifts the tone from the first game in a deliberate way, introducing a fresh perspective. The tension doesn’t come from running or instability but from the mounting inevitability of facing the ever-stronger Septentriones. This structured approach enhances the narrative’s unique identity rather than diminishing it.
I think the video is good for the most part, and you mostly support a lot of your arguments (such as the characters being more tropey). But a couple of points go unsupported which was a little frustrating. Ultimately I don't think the game took noticeable steps back in its narrative
I'm also not sure why 2 ended up being a tier below 1 despite the ostensibly stronger gameplay but that's a minor quibble
No worries. That's why they're opinions.
Personally, the Septentriones don't really feel like a counterpoint to the bright tone. Nor do they really bring any sense of dread to the narrative for me. If they bring that for you, that's great. I wish I could've gotten the same enjoyment.
I will draw attention to the dread they instill in the player in terms of challenge during combat. Though, I don't find their presence to bring much in terms of enhancing the overall atmosphere or really being a homerun for the narrative. Besides, as I implied in the video, the cast being in the JPs in the manner presented essentially overshadows a lot of suspense in the game.
I can see where you're going with grappling with a character's potential death. The example with Lugh, though, is how far along in the game? Day 6? I personally don't want to wait six in-game days to really get a sense of survival. Even if you wanted to include the death clips here, they're pretty insignificant in the grand scheme of things. The majority of these instances, if not all, are far less significant in terms of either plot development, character development, or the alignments, especially compared to similar moments in DeSu 1. In my opinion, they're a significant drop in quality and implementation when compared with DeSu 1's Death Clock and daily announcements.
I'm not really sure I understand your final point. I believe this stable base of operations is about the JPs? Of course utilizing this would be a deliberate way to shift the tone. It's not the same situation as the first game... If I'm understanding you correctly, Devil Survivor 2's 'structured approach' of introducing stronger enemies as you progress in the game enhances the narrative's unique identity? Isn't that a crucial point of every JRPG?
As to why I placed Devil Survivor 1 above 2? It's overall just the better game in my opinion. There's more to a game than just its gameplay. Like I said, if you place it higher, I won't argue. It's a good game.
Thanks for checking out the video!
@@Sopapiaaa Yes, I forgot to highlight the gameplay/plot coherence of the Septentriones. Their demanding difficulty seamlessly integrates with the narrative’s escalating tension, creating a deep sense of satisfaction when overcoming them, especially with the knowledge that the challenges ahead will only grow more insurmountable. This dynamic threat feels far more compelling than bosses like Belial in DeSU1, where success is often reduced to exploiting a single gimmick, such as removing his invincibility and spamming Ice spells. While DeSU1 had moments like Baldr that demanded strategic engagement, DeSU2 sustains that intensity across the entire game.
The idea that being housed in JPs outright eliminates suspense doesn’t hold up for me. The true tension lies in the apparent impossibility of defeating the Septentriones, whether it’s an alien multiplying endlessly, flying out of range, or being outright immune to all attacks. By contrast, DeSU1’s cast is rarely in real danger, even when they inexplicably decide to sleep in at the end of each day. There’s no need for shifts, and the supposed threats-like rogue humans-are rarely credible. Even someone like Kaido, despite killing Keisuke in specific scenarios (which I found frustrating), ultimately aligns with the group if you choose to recruit him. This undercuts any long-term consequences or interpersonal tensions, as most characters end up working together regardless of past actions.
On character development, I think you might be overestimating DeSU1. While the core cast is solid, Midori is undeniably one-note. Keisuke’s arc is exceptional, but beyond that, the others-Kaido, Mari, SDF lady, etc-follow fairly predictable trajectories with little depth. Even for for character arcs more central to the narrative, such as Haru and Gin, suffer from their lack of presence throughout the game. I do think DeSU1's cast comes across more like real people, which is a part of why I find them more memorable at least.
I also disagree with your assessment of alignments and endings in DeSU1. Several endings feel either unsatisfying or downright contradictory to the themes established earlier. For example, Atsuro’s route, despite him being my favorite character, hinges on entrusting demons to the Japanese government-a decision that feels absurd given their mishandling of the lockdown. It completely undermines the narrative’s prior critiques of authority. Meanwhile, Yuzu’s ending is essentially a bad ending in disguise, offering little resolution or satisfaction.
>If I'm understanding you correctly, Devil Survivor 2's 'structured approach' of introducing stronger enemies as you progress in the game enhances the narrative's unique identity? Isn't that a crucial point of every JRPG?
What DeSU2 does so well is center these elements-character arcs, thematic consistency, and escalating stakes-at the core of the narrative. It avoids arbitrariness, unlike DeSU1, where the focus zigzags from confronting an immortal early on (a fantastic moment) to battling more conventional enemies later. That’s not to criticize DeSU1 as a whole, but to emphasize that DeSU2 shouldn’t be faulted for diverging from its predecessor’s approach. Instead, it crafts its own identity, balancing narrative ambition with gameplay design in a way that feels deliberate and rewarding."
>As to why I placed Devil Survivor 1 above 2? It's overall just the better game in my opinion. There's more to a game than just its gameplay. Like I said, if you place it higher, I won't argue. It's a good game.
That's fair. Ultimately I would rank both games similar to each other, but I appreciate the clarification.
Thanks for responding!
I don't think "anime" is an explanation. Anime is animation influenced by common tropes and archetypes that can be said to be overused, thus the problem is the writing gets worse or is dumbed down to appeal to broader audience.
Neat!