We’ve seen some comments asking if this video was sponsored by Netflix or Stranger Things. It was not! We were inspired by the upcoming release to do a video about dead malls - and so we talked about the show in the video. WIRED will ALWAYS indicate when any of our videos have been sponsored - both in an onscreen title card as well as in our description box. Thanks for all your feedback!
If it wasn’t an ad for stranger things Netflix just got a bunch of free advertising. Just watched this with three other people who all simultaneously laughed about heavy handed the obvious Netflix sponsorship was.
S T R A N G E R T H I N G S. You have to know that when you repeat something over and over again, it sticks inside the head of people. If you want to share information, dont repete stuff even if you like it. You need to understand the weight of your words on people. I think it was so far related plus, it was taking us out of the real message of the video. It may not have been sponsored but you use the show to give exposure to your content so it is all the same. You can not say it is not sponsored because you really just are the sponser of netflix in this story. I'm angry because what you do is usually alright but not this.
The professor describes what could be done with these malls at 7:27. If the neighborhood is thriving with high employment, they build apartments on top of the malls and keep some shops turning them into a more modern downtown. If the neighborhood isn't thriving which it usually isn't, community uses such as schools, churches, community centers or just referencing them back to parklands and wetlands. I suspect we won't see a lot of changes till autonomous vehicles whether in private vehicles, ride hailing services or PRT removes the need for large parking lots as removing the parking lots recovers a lot of real estate. Ultimately, what path the mall will take would be the most profitable for their owners despite what we would like to see.
You'd probably have to turn mall grounds into mixed use, but it's completely possible. Though I'd use the whole mall land and build a superstructure, replace the parking lots with one or two multi-story parking buildings, and build a vertical city instead.
Yes! I've said a thousand times that old malls could be apartments or even schools depending on how the building is re-imagined. I hate to see these large buildings sit empty. It just seems so wasteful.
@@starzzzy22 It doesn't seem wasteful, it is wasteful. We dedicate way too much space for suburban development that could be used in different ways such as agricultural, nature reserves, parks, etc.
Yep, same here in Indonesia. It's super hot all day all year round, the only place people could hang around comfortably with friends/family is well, the malls. That's why some mall are even decorated to emulate the looks of an outside location (a hanging garden, some European highstreet, a row of fancy cafes, and so on) Malls in the western countries are super plain looking in comparison.
*Reasons:* Online shopping convenience People are busy working Middle class income shrinking Social media & social isolation Online gaming, Netflix, Uber Eats Minimalism Demographic changes Lower suburban investment
Yes. One more reason is that so many more people, particularly younger generations are rejecting capitalism and are also generally underpaid and have little to no expendable income
40% of Americans have no savings and live paycheck to paycheck. Wages have been flat for decades while the cost of living has risen. Could be a factor.
Yes this is the major factor. Wages for most Americans peaked in 70-80s the hey-dey of the mall. They even said malls were starting to falter in the 90s -before online shopping boomed to what it is now. Then folks saying their malls are doing fine are all located in thriving coastal cities not the economically depressed majority of the country. Then other comments are saying malls are taking off in Asia/china.... again places where their middle class buying power is clearly booming. Over saturation and online shopping are minor factors, but average americans losing buying power is clearly the major player.
Wages can't increase with the nonstop flow of immigrants into the country, legal or otherwise. "Jobs Americans won't do" more like jobs Americans aren't willing to do for slave wages, while on the other hand 3rd world migrants will do those jobs (not well) for a fraction of the cost.
@@BuffdaddyJamalWages keep being capped though. According to inflation, the minimum wage should be about $20 an hour now, in accordance to it's value when it began. Which means your average college educated person should be getting about $40 to $50 an hour. We've tried to hold back inflation with our own wages for so many decades that it's now hitting us all really hard. I know you can't just keep printing money and giving more and more in paychecks, but it's become much to low for your average American to just live day to day.
I was really disappointed they didn't address this in the video. Another factor I would point to is the decay of American suburbs. I don't have any statistics off the top of my head, but I remember reading that suburban homes are losing value, suburban poverty is increasing, and suburban infrastructure is falling apart. Since the prosperity of suburbia is what fueled malls in the first place, its decay is bringing about their end. I wish they would have brought that up in the video because I think it is important for Americans to know that the American Dream is not what it used to be and that the future of this country isn't suburbia and mall culture but cities and main-street economies.
I'm only 21 and I still remember how when I was a kid the malls in my area used to be jam-packed all the time and were places people went to hang out. Now it's practically a vacant ghost town. All of that chatter, footsteps, and laughter has been replaced with complete silence. It's quite sad, really.
Yeah same. Im 17 and i remember being 8 9 10 and spending 8 hours at the mall shopping and eating. It was always packed and always fun. Now they are a little creepy bc they are so silent
@stryfetc1 Amazon is basically small retailers under one big corp. P.s. what i meant is that Amazon is an online shopping mall. It has almost the same concept as a physical mall.
im blown away that they ignore the glaring fact that the demographic malls were designed for just cant freaking afford to spend the money to keep them open
Malls located in more up-scale places where people (still) have money are doing well. Malls located in economically depressed places are not doing well or are closing.
Last time I was in that Mall it looked like a great place to film a zombie apocalypse because it was so abandoned. It does have a great Korean Mega Mart, but that's about it now.
They repurposed an abandoned mall in Philadelphia and turned the 2nd and 3rd floors into micro appartments. The first floor is coffee shops,boutiques, and restaurants
What really wasn't covered was the fall of large retail chains like Sears, JCPenny, Macy's, etc. that bookended many of these malls and were their primary source of income before leaving. If you could get all inclusive box stores like Walmart and Target to take over the empty retail space these stores left behind, Malls would probably survive much easier, but these "buy everything you need here" retail giants are anti-mall by design, and want you only shopping in their stores for everything, so it wouldn't benefit them to give you an option of buying something there, and then walking down the corridor and getting something at another nearby retailer.
Target and Walmart even sell food now too. You can buy clothes, electronics, toys, toiletries, ect. Remember when Amazon used to just sell books? Lol, these companies have become monopolies.
Agreed. Also what wasn't discussed was why the former anchors failed. Online shopping had very little to do the failure of anchor stores. Crippling debt is the major factor in that. The death knell for malls happened in the crash of 2008, after 30 years of mergers and acquisitions, major department stores couldn't afford the debt they acquired making those mergers. Department stores began to close, and with their closure, malls were left with huge amounts of square footage and nothing to put in those stores place. Even if you could get someone in there, the costs to re open a dead anchor space is worth hundreds of thousands of dollars.
What strikes and shocks non-USA citizens probably is seeing those large, empty building and at the same time watching and reading about USA citizens living inside their cars, or at hotel rooms payed by the hour or even on street due to huge rent prices they cannot afford and seeing those well-preserved buldings which are no longer being used, empty, habitable, occupying huge part of public space and simple left there to rot and serve no purpose. To many people living outside of USA looking at something like this seems plain crazy. Not to mention that USA version of capitalism tends to lecture the rest of the globe on democracy and efficiency. How on earth is this democratic or efficient? It's just the most irrational waste of money, public space and raw materials anyone can ever imagine. Knowing that in some cities money has to spend to treat certain diseases simply becuase people live on the streets out of poverty and later on seeing a location like this that could actually house such people to at least lower social cost of certain diseases spread due to access to toilets and possibilty to wash hands more frequently really can leave many people worldwide speachless. Yes, there are dead malls in Europe for example. And guess what? They are being repurposed. They are not left empty, locked down to rot. People use them.
It scares me, this whole social media loneliness thing. At our Christmas gathering last year I went to see what the kids were doing...when I was young, me and my cousins would be outside or in the basement playing, or sitting around talking and laughing...I listened outside my niece’s bedroom door, nothing but dead silence...I opened the door and all 8 of them were piled on the bed - each one absorbed in their cell phones. Not talking, not interacting...just looking at their phones. It’s so odd.
Assuming you are in the United States, unless your area experienced explosive growth (downtown city, new exurb in a growing metropolitan, etc.) that mall probably canibalized one to three other malls that serviced the same area that were there 15-30 years ago (as alluded to in the video). Also the malls today are nothing like the malls of the 1980's and 1990's. Not only were they insanely crowded pre-cell-phone gathering places and town squares like in the movie "Mall Rats." Today's malls, even busy ones, are optimized for spending money. For instance, the mall in the show Stranger Things had carpet in the hallways! Modern malls use marble to reflect as much sound as possible which drives your subconcious self to enter an (often carpeted) store with softer music and signatures scents.
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i was understanding that the mall where you live, closed, lol.
She didn't forget. Everyone knows that capitalism and the destruction of the lower classes is to blame. They will never say it because their sponsors/owners won't like that.
Malls were the social media of there day before the internet. There is a sharp decline in the suburban middle class. Why couldn't these old malls be retro fitted as living space?
@Johnny Tramain I live in Toronto and up here all the major mall owners here are pouring in hundreds of millions of dollars to renovate and expand many malls in the city. Seems like malls at least in some parts of the world are still thriving and plenty of people aren't abandoning them which is good.
Living space? No. Suburban shopping malls are not aesthetically pleasing. They are almost always big boxes surrounded by a sea of parking lots next to highways. Nobody wants to live in such a soulless place.
I was really interested in the topic of the death of malls, but that lady just kept bringing up stranger things and it felt more like an advertisement than an intellectual conversation. Why was stranger things even involved in this video???
Albert Budi check out Landmark Mall redevelopment in Alexandria, VA. The city actually asked the community for input what to do with the space. Also, the mall served as a set last year for the upcoming Wonder Woman movie
Because that's job creation. They don't like job creation in this country. The democrats and republicans decided years ago that if we have the luxury of a constitution and human rights we therefore do not deserve stable jobs nor a substantial economy. Noam Chomsky breaks it down in Requiem For The American Dream. Free online!
Malls didn't sell anything I wanted as a mature adult. Many neighborhoods could no longer support them due to flattening incomes and thus the advent of Walmart, Dollar Tree, etc..
@@jamesedinger4956 Even during the heyday of the American mall (80s-90s), the stores were mostly for teenage girls, young women, and families. If I had to take a guess, you're a single male without children, right ? If so, it makes perfect sense why you wouldn't shop there. lol
And hospitals. I'm not American. But I'm married to one and spend part of the year in the states. The mall directly near our house in the states was torn down and rebuilt as an extension to the local hospital. I swear there's 12 different extensions to this one hospital in this one town that's not big enough to be called a city. It's borderline suburbs. More people are getting sick.
when did malls become huge? journalists are comparing and almost laughing how tiny 80s malls were... with size comes cost and risk. Even now every mall has to be the biggest in the country etc. Nobody is really thinking how to get shops. And same year they are building several malls in same city. Which already has many. So I cant anything good word for it, just MLM comes to mind.
Every county in every State in the USA needs Assisted Living Centers and all of these Malls could be refurbished to help with the huge shortage of beds issue for the elderly and upcoming baby boomers.
plus I could see that could bring back some of the culture. Living near each other if done right the could spear on culture in that community. Around me a lot of old schools are being turned into senior senior living facilities
The baby boomers. The generation that was born with the suburbia, grew up to make the malls and now would get into those repurposed malls as ALC. Kind of looks like some tale to be told.
@@007Julie Sure, it would cost money to relocate them in the first place, but, if they got the homeless back on their feet and contributing in the economy, the government could enjoy greater tax revenues and the "powers that be"... well they could enjoy a more robust economy. It seems like a win-win-win to me.
I'm actually finishing a year abroad in Japan, and one of the things that shocked me as an American is that... Malls are very much NOT dying here. Every mall I've been to has been packed, usually without any empty storefronts.
@@MajorGeneralVeers I think that's part of it- if I go to the mall and most of the stuff there is junk, I won't want to go back. Half the time it's super hard to find basics and half the shirts for women will have weird frills sewed on them
What everyone seems to miss, is what it feels like to be in mall, are you welcome, how aggressive are they trying to get your money etc... Even city officials dont like to talk about these stuff, then money is wasted a lot when mall is deemed failure. What I'm interested also, what happens to all the concrete in urban areas, when they demolish and build new huge constructions. I heard sand is not infinite supply (needed for concrete a lot).
Oh god yes. I remember last time I was in one, a man was forcing this expensive face cream at my mom, and would not take no for an answer until I literally dragged her away. I miss the days of malls just having art and phone stalls in the middle of them.
One thing no one mentions is that media was a significant portion of mall space. Books and magazines about your favorite stars, lots of movie and music stores, and of course a theater. These businesses were hurt or destroyed by the internet.
Yeah, they should have compensated by turning the vacant department stores into live theatres for musicals, plays, operas, concerts, etc, with smaller vacant retail spaces turned dance studios and rehearsal spaces and whatnot, and lots of places for audience members and performers to eat, hang out, etc.
Well you kind of forgot that the stores are becoming way too expensive for their competitors and the products are becoming less and less valuable and quality. Why spent $80 on a t shirt at a mall
Definitely. Overpriced merchandise which was probably a symptom caused by the consolidation of malls under 2-3 corporations who all started raising rent and squeezing store owners.
Also movie theaters in malls are expensive. I can go to a theater in a mall and spend $20 dollars on a ticket or go to an independent theater and spend $8 on a ticket
I lived through the death of downtown to the malls. I remember the ARCADES. Then the mall died and our downtown became a new mini-metropolis. Condos, restaurants, shops and etc.
No one: WIRED: Here's why malls are dying… Everyone: oh, cool, I wonder if it's online shopping! _click_ WIRED: btw, Stranger Things season 3 will have malls. Malls will be in Stranger Things season 3. Stranger Things feature malls in season 3! OMG won't season 3 of Stranger Things be so exciting? Everyone: 😒😒😒
I mean, I LOVE stranger things, but yea... it seems kinda... irrelevant to the topic at hand to force ST3 into this video, when the only connection is that "it has a mall in it"
I have always felt that the mall was a substitute for the village square, where people of all ages interacted. That some have been redeveloped as actual town centers for the surrounding suburbia is a healthy sign. Suburbs are dreary places that have no heart, which is a social gathering point. Suburbs have none of the advantages of a town and none of the advantages of being out in the country. If you don't have a car in the suburbs, you are as good as dead.
@@geoffreyharris5931 If they redeveloped the stores on the upper floors as apartments, they would, I believe, make a comeback. In Europe, lots of people live above the shops they own and operate.
It seems to me like they were using the show's popularity to create more interest in the topic. The vitality most malls enjoyed in the time the show portrays is also relevant and may help some younger folks understand the changes malls have undergone too. They symbolism drawn at the end of the vid was nice too. It takes me back to my high school AP English classes.
One more thing at play in the 80's: materialism, the more the better! Big box stores and the economy we're huge factors in the decline of malls. Also, the last 20 years have shown a gradual but definite shift in the younger generations thinking. Many have realized (thank God) stuff doesn't equal happiness. Now it's more about paring down and getting out there living life, traveling, living a quality life, living responsibly. Naturally, malls are getting left out of the equation. Those abandoned building structures could be repurposed in so many ways to help improve the communities they are located in, if only people with money and vision would invest in them.
I would disagree. People in the 80s definitely thought more is better but thats not to say this generation thinks any different. the shift is that it's no longer more is better, it's more expensive is better. that's the difference. no one wants to go to Macys and buy a shirt for $20 that has no logo attached to it. they want to go to more high end stores and blow money there. i would argue zoomers are even more materialistic than previous generations and this is exactly why luxury brands have just exploded in popularity. more isn't better, more expensive is better.
@@ceoofmemes1967 Yeah, point taken. I have to agree with you at least in part while still acknowledging the shift that has slowly taken place in the lives of many towards minimalistic living, off grid living and the nomadic lifestyle.
People need to come visit the malls in Asia, or Taiwan at least, and I'm sure malls in Mainland Chinese major cities are astounding too. Always lively and full of people.
Also Spencer, we can't overlook the fact that online shopping is what is really reducing that human traffic at these malls and I am afraid its never going back. If you can shop virtually for anything with a few clicks on your phone why do you have to drive anywhere. Its simply an evolution in commerce and the culture is adapting to it. Malls can be repurposed for other things to better the human condition.
The One World mall in Chengdu city Sichuan province is the largest enclosed space ever in the history of history. It's interior atrium is 13 stories high it has a water park and it's own metro station.
Yep. Another irony is seeing shopping carts, the emblem of consumerism, being used to transport the worldly goods and\or waste of underclass street people
between online shopping taking away the need to even go to places like malls, and the social media actually turning us into more antisocial groups, they are just unfortunately not "needed" in the same way they used to be.
My grandfather is a ceramics artist and sells at “booths” at various local craft fairs and farmers markets. One of them takes place in a once abandoned mall that has been repurposed to become an indoor craft fair where instead of paying for a spot to pitch a canopy (more often than not outdoors) you pay to have basically your own little air conditioned shop for a few weeks to display and sell your goods.
I dont think architecture has a damned thing to do with it period. Nobody cares wha the shops look like, its online shopping, point blank. In smaller towns with less access to shopping, malls will continue to be fine.
@@caligulalonghbottom2629 Thats gotta be the least intelligent post of this comment section. The architecture and design of a building plays a big part in its success.....
Architecture is not only the aesthetics of a building, but is more often a manifestation of the zeitgeist of a specific time period/culture. The commentary of an architectural professor is very appropriate because they study how/why a building typology came to be and why it is no longer appropriate for the culture today.
@@sukikwan3786 Plus the layout of a buliding heavily influences consumer behaviour, which is something that good mall architects carefully study and plan for, which wasn't always the case with those malls.
The historical part was really interesting. As a future architect myself, I love me some architecture/architectural content any time and if comes along with pop culture references, sign me up.
Could also be the quality of clothing and fast fashion. I’m so sick of my clothes lasting a year. People would rather pay for high quality stuff with longer life spans.
Most people that shop- a lot, only need their clothes to last a single season- as they'll be onto newer styles the next year. Those buying "exprensive" longer-lasting items... only shop once every couple years. They're not going to keep doors open.
When I went to malls in the Middle East I was amazed at how packed they were! I actually felt like I was going back in time to when I grew up when people loved malls.
Interesting, I looked at it the other way; them trying to tap into the Stranger Things hype to teach the fans something about the history and the future of malls.
100% agree! This woman is some sort of super fan of that show. She talked about it for a full minute before the real meat and potatoes of the topic started. Then closed the video with saying she hopes the professor tunes in for the new season. Ugh! So annoying!!
It's so weird watching that one year after and seeing them talking about gathering online and a loneliness epidemic when now we're actually in a pandemic and most of our interactions are online
In my city, there is a small mall that has a stage in the old food court area where there are local music acts, little kid dance recitals, etc. They also have public reservable meeting rooms on the ground level, a small library inside the mall, a regular drug store, grocery store and gym inside, and a large open seating and table area on the top level where social groups, clubs, support groups, and just friends of all ages meet up. It is a really cool community multi-purpose structure now. I wish more cities utilized them this way!
Except here in the Philippines. We Filipinos love shopping and because of the hot weather we always want to go to the mall. And everything’s there for paying bills, shopping, spa, groceries. A one stop shop.
So things people do with dead malls: 1) Downtownization: Putting street grids. Ground level retail. Appartments and offices up above. 2) Office space, Medical uses, Educational uses, churches. 3) Re-greeners. 4) Zombie paintball. I love the variety!
In Brazil malls are still thriving and becoming bigger and bigger. High security and air conditioning are two main reasons for that, I think. And here I also see the phenomenon of public services being absorbed into the shopping malls. Also the really big ones are usually already built with an adjacent office building.
@@mermaidcattt No. I'm telling a Canadian that people go to malls in Canada to get out of the cold. Maybe I just phrased my response wrong. In California, malls are not packed.
misstwinpeaks Nice. I go check his videos and it's just a loop of ads, some Jenny Jones story and some crazy woman laughing. Clickbaited by Wired - Rickrolled by Dan Bell. Great job.
My local mall is quickly fading and its really really sad. I love my mall and even though it has really good stores, its only busy around gift-giving holidays
Our downtown mall is two levels and the upper level has been turned into micro-apartments and the lower is a mix of unique retail, no chains. The mall is historic and has a European architectural ambiance. It has been a big hit. All of the micro-apartments (rent is less than $1,000/mo) has been filled and the retail and artists' studios are filling up. There's even a public market in the atrium.
See, it's the diversification of the mall you mention that works. Sort of how cities used to be. Our big cities didn't just get built overnight like suburban shopping malls and suburban residential planning. Cities were extremely mixed. Look at neighborhoods in cities with mixed zoning. It the community can get rid of crime s yuk ch mixed zoning areas are huge potential for economic growth. Suburban areas with strict zoning, strict hoa's, large distances between locations not so much, except cheap tax rates and open land for new construction.
It's worth mentioning that malls are thriving in places like Asia. In China and the Philippines you can go into 8 story malls with every type of business you can think of. Some people have pointed out that climate is a factor, but I also think it's because malls have an idea of luxury behind them. So many places are just trying to experience what the U.S. takes for granted.
People always like to copy us, I would've liked if it was different but most countries are influenced by American culture when you guys have your own culture.
i agree! a mall near me has stops for 3 buses, and a trolley stop. thats the only reason why my friends and i are even able to go, as we dont have cars. kids still love the mall, we just dont have access to them.
Public transit always has stops at major shopping locations, but not every city has a decent network of public transit. Cities/government in general would have to actually focus on policies to promote the middle class, but they only want to focus on thise who are already wealthy. It's a case of capitalist values being self-destructive.
@@beth8775 thats very true. our transit system is barely decent, but thats because i live in an area where it 100% needs to be. as in, theres no "rich people" to focus on. i cant imagine what its like in large cities, or upper class areas
@@chris4436 I live in an area that's pretty rural, so mass transit doesn't really exist. Our towns aren't big enough to need or support it. Our sporadic cities (small cities really) are largely full of people to whom the concept is kind of foreign, so what systems they do have are not functional enough for people to be content using them.
@@beth8775 America hates public transportation. America wants everyone to drive that's why public transit is deliberately underfunded. If America continues at the rate of underfunding public transit by the middle of the century public transit will be dead and relegated to NYC.
A dead mall in my area, Landmark Mall was used for the filming of Wonder Woman 2. There was also another mall in my area, Springfield Mall, that was revamped as Springfield Town Center and is doing so much better now.
There is something melancholic about viewing an ancient ruin that was once majestic, and a bustling, thriving place full of life, but is now a hollow shell with no movement and no life, except the rustling of the wind blowing through it. It doesn’t matter if it is the ruins of a temple complex in Luxor, Egypt, the empty streets of Pompeii, an abandoned mining town out west, the abandoned factories of Detroit, or the empty malls across America. Something about being reminded of the impermanence of all things in this life forces you to be reflective about your own life, and how you often spent your time chasing after things that seemed important at the time, but ultimately don’t last. Of course, as a child who came of age in the 80s, there is also something nostalgic about viewing the ruin of a place that once seemed so important and such a large part of your youth, but now it has been reduced to a ghost town. Makes you long for simpler times which you know are long gone, and will probably never come again. Middle class middle America has been gutted by hedge fund speculators who have bankrupted once viable companies to make a buck, and globalists who have shipped our factory jobs overseas. The abandoned malls are but the bleached bones of a once thriving middle America, a warning to future generations not to make the same mistakes we made with our economy, just like the ruins of Pompeii half buried in the ashes of Mount Vesuvius are a warning not to build too close to the volcano, or the ruins of Fukushima are a warning not to build anything important in a tsunami flood zone. “Look on my works, Ye mighty, and despair!” says the great Ozymandias.
I’m glad that the malls where I live are still very popular. I can’t imagine driving by the mall only to feel like it’s a ghost town. Maybe it’s because I live in packed New England, where no one really knows where else to go. 😂 The malls here are also relatively far apart, so people are almost obligated to drive to the nearest mall whenever they need something. They don’t need to pick and choose mall. Actually it’s so popular here I ALWAYS bump into people. I hope that our malls will still thrive and be open for many many more years to come. 😁
Gary Harper Its a combination of internet research allowing you to easily compare prices and then the shopping for an item to buy the cheapest used or new item gave people more options and better prices. When I went to a mall I did not even have a cell phone. A mall is a network of stores. Now the internet is the virtual network.
@@jamesmedina2062 Yeah, malls are ridiculously expensive. I've never bought anything at a mall for full price. Online and thrift is the exact same thing for a fraction of the cost.
@Enmity the Kindhearted amazon is just a logistics provider. You can open your own shop online at amazon, ebay, or other local clones of that or just open a normal web shop. Its easier than ever for small businesses to reach customers, while not havin to afford high rent in some mall or even city
I feel kinda sad, I remember going to the mall as a kid and just loved to walk around. Now the mall can barely keep stores and more then a few have made it so that you can't enter them through the main area, you have to go outside and go in their main doors, basically a round strip mall.
One of the malls in my area where I went when I was in high school died. It was already on it's way out in the early 2000s. It was revamped as an outdoor mall with smaller street level stores, apartments above and a theater complex. There is business offices and a library as well. A Whole Foods. Not all the stores do well there though and there has been turnover. Yet, people continue to frequent there.
They did the same thing with my childhood Mall Randhurst. Driving through the mall feels like something out of Back to the future. It's just not the same I miss the 80s
In my city 2 malls close because too many thugs just hung out and started trouble selling dope and stealing so they scared the consumers and they went other places
This woman has no idea what she's talking about, and it's not really her fault, it's yours for asking the wrong person. This is like talking to a cartographer about why the South lost the Civil War. It's just not their place to say. You should have interviewed a sociologist who actually knows what they're talking about. This is a very well studied field, it's just not the field a bloody architect has studied.
Willy Wong It really has nothing with millennials being losers or unsuccessful or failing to launch and more and more of them living with Mommy & Daddy. No, Millennials have actually made no changes in this world, good or bad. They are simple the victims of the decisions the big government and elite corporations make.
We don’t have this problem in the UK where there’s been huge recent & current investment in malls (at least in London). The problem with US/Canadian malls is the experience sucks - low ceilings, pokey stores, poor layouts, lack of variety.
Contract: "Mention at least 1 minute worth of Stranger Things" Wired: *Forcefully mentions Stranger Things at the beginning and end to make a video that is otherwise completely unrelated*
We’ve seen some comments asking if this video was sponsored by Netflix or Stranger Things. It was not! We were inspired by the upcoming release to do a video about dead malls - and so we talked about the show in the video. WIRED will ALWAYS indicate when any of our videos have been sponsored - both in an onscreen title card as well as in our description box. Thanks for all your feedback!
I don't want malls to close! :-(
If it wasn’t an ad for stranger things Netflix just got a bunch of free advertising. Just watched this with three other people who all simultaneously laughed about heavy handed the obvious Netflix sponsorship was.
2x speed
One mall where I live, Ballston Common, has been torn down and converted to a traditional business district called Ballston Quarter.
S T R A N G E R T H I N G S. You have to know that when you repeat something over and over again, it sticks inside the head of people. If you want to share information, dont repete stuff even if you like it. You need to understand the weight of your words on people. I think it was so far related plus, it was taking us out of the real message of the video. It may not have been sponsored but you use the show to give exposure to your content so it is all the same. You can not say it is not sponsored because you really just are the sponser of netflix in this story. I'm angry because what you do is usually alright but not this.
Malls could be community centers with gyms, libraries, studios and galleries like the SESCs in Brazil. So much potential.
Except for the people who want to turn them into churches. America has too many churches...
A closed mall in the midwest became. HS after a tornado took out the HS. Mini malls have been turned into ES schools.
@@CJ-im2uu what's HS and ES? (I'm not American)
The professor describes what could be done with these malls at 7:27. If the neighborhood is thriving with high employment, they build apartments on top of the malls and keep some shops turning them into a more modern downtown. If the neighborhood isn't thriving which it usually isn't, community uses such as schools, churches, community centers or just referencing them back to parklands and wetlands. I suspect we won't see a lot of changes till autonomous vehicles whether in private vehicles, ride hailing services or PRT removes the need for large parking lots as removing the parking lots recovers a lot of real estate. Ultimately, what path the mall will take would be the most profitable for their owners despite what we would like to see.
MrZaz3 high school.
Turn them into apartments. Keep most of the retro mall chic, add more plants and indoor pools. People would appreciate the aesthetic.
You'd probably have to turn mall grounds into mixed use, but it's completely possible. Though I'd use the whole mall land and build a superstructure, replace the parking lots with one or two multi-story parking buildings, and build a vertical city instead.
Yes! I've said a thousand times that old malls could be apartments or even schools depending on how the building is re-imagined. I hate to see these large buildings sit empty. It just seems so wasteful.
@@starzzzy22 It doesn't seem wasteful, it is wasteful. We dedicate way too much space for suburban development that could be used in different ways such as agricultural, nature reserves, parks, etc.
Have you seen Dredd (2012) ?
A huge multilevel neighborhood. Brilliant.
She said a quarter of US malls will close in 2022.. that was probably achieved in 2020
Hey she said *by* 2022 so she's still technically right!
no one knew corona will accelerate the faith back then... haha
I was going to say the same thing.
🤣🤣🤣🤣
Well actually it’s been like this since the mid 2000s
Meanwhile, malls in the Philippines are thriving and typically gigantic, for one simple reason: air con.
P.S. That means AC in Americanish. (－‸ლ)
lol true. palamig muna lmao
Yep, same here in Indonesia.
It's super hot all day all year round, the only place people could hang around comfortably with friends/family is well, the malls.
That's why some mall are even decorated to emulate the looks of an outside location (a hanging garden, some European highstreet, a row of fancy cafes, and so on)
Malls in the western countries are super plain looking in comparison.
Same in Mexico hahaha
yup. in places with less than ideal climates, malls are still a sort of town square place.
Well not 4 long
Legit thought I’d clicked on the wrong video with that intro about stranger things
S. V. Villano same! And I haven't even seen the show
Same!
ditto
Almost thought it was an ad.
Moepowerplant it is an ad
*Reasons:*
Online shopping convenience
People are busy working
Middle class income shrinking
Social media & social isolation
Online gaming, Netflix, Uber Eats
Minimalism
Demographic changes
Lower suburban investment
You got it! All of the above.
@@rachelc.5463 Wrong, malls in low income suburbs are thriving. Can't try clothes online. Social media sucks. Online gaming overrated.
Yes. One more reason is that so many more people, particularly younger generations are rejecting capitalism and are also generally underpaid and have little to no expendable income
@@beepboop3540 Also they can't borrow like they used to do.
Smoke screen yes you are wrong. Clothes can be returned online gaming is suceeding (That is just a fact) your likement of it is irrelvant
40% of Americans have no savings and live paycheck to paycheck. Wages have been flat for decades while the cost of living has risen. Could be a factor.
Yes this is the major factor. Wages for most Americans peaked in 70-80s the hey-dey of the mall. They even said malls were starting to falter in the 90s -before online shopping boomed to what it is now. Then folks saying their malls are doing fine are all located in thriving coastal cities not the economically depressed majority of the country. Then other comments are saying malls are taking off in Asia/china.... again places where their middle class buying power is clearly booming.
Over saturation and online shopping are minor factors, but average americans losing buying power is clearly the major player.
Wages can't increase with the nonstop flow of immigrants into the country, legal or otherwise. "Jobs Americans won't do" more like jobs Americans aren't willing to do for slave wages, while on the other hand 3rd world migrants will do those jobs (not well) for a fraction of the cost.
Buffdaddy Jamal ^^^ truth ^^^^
@@BuffdaddyJamalWages keep being capped though. According to inflation, the minimum wage should be about $20 an hour now, in accordance to it's value when it began. Which means your average college educated person should be getting about $40 to $50 an hour. We've tried to hold back inflation with our own wages for so many decades that it's now hitting us all really hard. I know you can't just keep printing money and giving more and more in paychecks, but it's become much to low for your average American to just live day to day.
I was really disappointed they didn't address this in the video. Another factor I would point to is the decay of American suburbs. I don't have any statistics off the top of my head, but I remember reading that suburban homes are losing value, suburban poverty is increasing, and suburban infrastructure is falling apart. Since the prosperity of suburbia is what fueled malls in the first place, its decay is bringing about their end. I wish they would have brought that up in the video because I think it is important for Americans to know that the American Dream is not what it used to be and that the future of this country isn't suburbia and mall culture but cities and main-street economies.
I'm only 21 and I still remember how when I was a kid the malls in my area used to be jam-packed all the time and were places people went to hang out. Now it's practically a vacant ghost town. All of that chatter, footsteps, and laughter has been replaced with complete silence. It's quite sad, really.
I'm 18 and I remember when malls were packed
Part of why I don't like the mall now is that it's so empty. If I'm there shopping alone without friends or family, it's almost disturbing.
50,000 people used to live here. Now it's a ghost town.
I'm 18 and they are still packed. It depends on the city and the mall itself really.
Yeah same. Im 17 and i remember being 8 9 10 and spending 8 hours at the mall shopping and eating. It was always packed and always fun. Now they are a little creepy bc they are so silent
Old malls never really die…
They just get de-mall-ished.
🤭🤭🤭
This is something my brother would say...
...if he was interested in dead malls.
Or s-mall-er
I'll groan a bit, but that was clever.
*_ba dum tss_*
It’s because the rents are too expensive for small retailers and consumers are sick of big Corp.
@stryfetc1 Amazon is basically small retailers under one big corp.
P.s. what i meant is that Amazon is an online shopping mall. It has almost the same concept as a physical mall.
Have you seen the S&P price? Big Corps have never had it so good
@@megaswenson Good Lord! Who hurt you? I have never had an aggressive experience in a mall with young undesireables.
@@megaswenson - That sure sounds racist to me...
Yes, no one likes Big Corp! No wonder Apple and Netflix and Facebook and Google are almost bankrupt.
im blown away that they ignore the glaring fact that the demographic malls were designed for just cant freaking afford to spend the money to keep them open
Ikr? Not to mention all the stuff sold in malls these days is disposable crap.
And most malls ( at least around here) are 95% clothing stores with nothing interesting in them at all.
Malls located in more up-scale places where people (still) have money are doing well. Malls located in economically depressed places are not doing well or are closing.
Everyone ignores that.
The same demographic that buys the newest iPhone every year and the Supreme brick that was literally an expensive brick with the name Supreme on it?
Host: “A quarter of malls will close by 2022”
COVID19 March 2020: “hold my drink”...
It's been held
Fun fact: The mall in the show is the Gwinnett Mall in Duluth GA. It is a dying mall in real life.
FACTSSSS
Huh...kinda like Duluth GA. Itself. Both are dying. So quaint.
Really. I remember that mall. That's sad.
Dang.
Last time I was in that Mall it looked like a great place to film a zombie apocalypse because it was so abandoned. It does have a great Korean Mega Mart, but that's about it now.
How about low cost apartments with parks and a grocery store? Perfect use for a dead mall.
Yes I agree even in New Zealand some are dying
Make them into small compact towns.
High security, able to walk around day or night
They repurposed an abandoned mall in Philadelphia and turned the 2nd and 3rd floors into micro appartments.
The first floor is coffee shops,boutiques, and restaurants
Kiwionwing morton A 21st century Catal Huyuk (however it's actually spelled in Turkish).
@@Moepowerplant lost me
Could you explain
Saliden was last Turkish global leader
And he was Kurdish
Moepowerplant oof I haven’t heard that name since my ninth grade western civ class
What really wasn't covered was the fall of large retail chains like Sears, JCPenny, Macy's, etc. that bookended many of these malls and were their primary source of income before leaving. If you could get all inclusive box stores like Walmart and Target to take over the empty retail space these stores left behind, Malls would probably survive much easier, but these "buy everything you need here" retail giants are anti-mall by design, and want you only shopping in their stores for everything, so it wouldn't benefit them to give you an option of buying something there, and then walking down the corridor and getting something at another nearby retailer.
Our Targets are all in malls.
Laura Smith Yes I have seen one Target connected to a mall but Walmarts are gigantic and simply too big to be attached to a mall
Top comment
Target and Walmart even sell food now too. You can buy clothes, electronics, toys, toiletries, ect. Remember when Amazon used to just sell books? Lol, these companies have become monopolies.
Agreed. Also what wasn't discussed was why the former anchors failed. Online shopping had very little to do the failure of anchor stores. Crippling debt is the major factor in that. The death knell for malls happened in the crash of 2008, after 30 years of mergers and acquisitions, major department stores couldn't afford the debt they acquired making those mergers. Department stores began to close, and with their closure, malls were left with huge amounts of square footage and nothing to put in those stores place. Even if you could get someone in there, the costs to re open a dead anchor space is worth hundreds of thousands of dollars.
I believe Amazon has turned a couple malls into distribution centers. Is that ironic?
No. Amazon is taking over.
Amazon stretches its tentacles far and wide consuming everything in its path. Distribution centers act as gestation pods to give birth to new plagues
@@minecraftminertime Governments really need to put a ceiling on these companies. It gets out of hands and absurd.
What strikes and shocks non-USA citizens probably is seeing those large, empty building and at the same time watching and reading about USA citizens living inside their cars, or at hotel rooms payed by the hour or even on street due to huge rent prices they cannot afford and seeing those well-preserved buldings which are no longer being used, empty, habitable, occupying huge part of public space and simple left there to rot and serve no purpose. To many people living outside of USA looking at something like this seems plain crazy. Not to mention that USA version of capitalism tends to lecture the rest of the globe on democracy and efficiency. How on earth is this democratic or efficient? It's just the most irrational waste of money, public space and raw materials anyone can ever imagine. Knowing that in some cities money has to spend to treat certain diseases simply becuase people live on the streets out of poverty and later on seeing a location like this that could actually house such people to at least lower social cost of certain diseases spread due to access to toilets and possibilty to wash hands more frequently really can leave many people worldwide speachless. Yes, there are dead malls in Europe for example. And guess what? They are being repurposed. They are not left empty, locked down to rot. People use them.
It don't matter.
Amazon is eyeing those malls for distribution centers.
you were right!!
I bet
Why can't amazon turn those malls to a premier amazon center so people can buy stuff and hang out, like a mall.
@@LazyPirate8 that would mean a corporation actually cares about the joy of its consumers, would never happen. That’s why malls are dead and gone
It scares me, this whole social media loneliness thing. At our Christmas gathering last year I went to see what the kids were doing...when I was young, me and my cousins would be outside or in the basement playing, or sitting around talking and laughing...I listened outside my niece’s bedroom door, nothing but dead silence...I opened the door and all 8 of them were piled on the bed - each one absorbed in their cell phones. Not talking, not interacting...just looking at their phones. It’s so odd.
The mall close to where I live is *thriving* so I can definitely see how it depends on location.
Same here the mall where Im at has a huge parking lot and is letting resturants build on the outskirts of it.
Aren't upscale or high end malls thriving? I know malls in tropical countries are thriving all because they have AC and outside is very hot.
Assuming you are in the United States, unless your area experienced explosive growth (downtown city, new exurb in a growing metropolitan, etc.) that mall probably canibalized one to three other malls that serviced the same area that were there 15-30 years ago (as alluded to in the video).
Also the malls today are nothing like the malls of the 1980's and 1990's. Not only were they insanely crowded pre-cell-phone gathering places and town squares like in the movie "Mall Rats." Today's malls, even busy ones, are optimized for spending money. For instance, the mall in the show Stranger Things had carpet in the hallways! Modern malls use marble to reflect as much sound as possible which drives your subconcious self to enter an (often carpeted) store with softer music and signatures scents.
i was understanding that the mall where you live, closed, lol.
Malls in huge cities seem to be thriving
Biggest reason malls are dying you completely forgot, c'mon Wired, you're smarter than that. *THE DEATH OF THE MIDDLE CLASS* is the biggest reason.
She didn't forget. Everyone knows that capitalism and the destruction of the lower classes is to blame. They will never say it because their sponsors/owners won't like that.
Sweet mother of Celestia, you're right
Its not true. The internet is killing retail, not just malls.
And to be more specific, the death of the suburban middle class whose prosperity fueled the growth of malls in the first place
Baby Boomers are dying off.
Malls were the social media of there day before the internet. There is a sharp decline in the suburban middle class. Why couldn't these old malls be retro fitted as living space?
@Johnny Tramain
I live in Toronto and up here all the major mall owners here are pouring in hundreds of millions of dollars to renovate and expand many malls in the city. Seems like malls at least in some parts of the world are still thriving and plenty of people aren't abandoning them which is good.
Living space? No. Suburban shopping malls are not aesthetically pleasing. They are almost always big boxes surrounded by a sea of parking lots next to highways. Nobody wants to live in such a soulless place.
I was really interested in the topic of the death of malls, but that lady just kept bringing up stranger things and it felt more like an advertisement than an intellectual conversation. Why was stranger things even involved in this video???
Angelic Boy Um, it takes place in the 80’s.
I know right?
why not convert them into offices, daycare, learning centers and food court rolled into one?
Albert Budi check out Landmark Mall redevelopment in Alexandria, VA. The city actually asked the community for input what to do with the space. Also, the mall served as a set last year for the upcoming Wonder Woman movie
Because that's job creation. They don't like job creation in this country. The democrats and republicans decided years ago that if we have the luxury of a constitution and human rights we therefore do not deserve stable jobs nor a substantial economy. Noam Chomsky breaks it down in Requiem For The American Dream. Free online!
Did you mean: Singapore malls
zenubi One of the malls shown in this video was turned into a school.
Have you heard about our lord and savior, Stranger Things?
Malls didn't sell anything I wanted as a mature adult. Many neighborhoods could no longer support them due to flattening incomes and thus the advent of Walmart, Dollar Tree, etc..
I agree...malls never offered me anything I wanted once I left my teen years
@@jamesedinger4956 Even during the heyday of the American mall (80s-90s), the stores were mostly for teenage girls, young women, and families. If I had to take a guess, you're a single male without children, right ? If so, it makes perfect sense why you wouldn't shop there. lol
80's: Malls killing small stores.
2010's: Online shopping is killing malls. Malls are being converted to warehouses.
Except online shopping isn't really what's killing malls. It's the lack of disposable income.
Online shopping keeps getting the blame. By the time you pay shipping you should have gone to the store.
And hospitals. I'm not American. But I'm married to one and spend part of the year in the states. The mall directly near our house in the states was torn down and rebuilt as an extension to the local hospital. I swear there's 12 different extensions to this one hospital in this one town that's not big enough to be called a city. It's borderline suburbs. More people are getting sick.
next: VR shopping kills physical shopping
when did malls become huge? journalists are comparing and almost laughing how tiny 80s malls were... with size comes cost and risk. Even now every mall has to be the biggest in the country etc. Nobody is really thinking how to get shops. And same year they are building several malls in same city. Which already has many. So I cant anything good word for it, just MLM comes to mind.
Is it called THE MALL because instead of going to one store you go to THEM ALL
lovely
No
@@TheStarBlack okay
Makes perfect sense
(Insert laugh track)
Every county in every State in the USA needs Assisted Living Centers and all of these Malls could be refurbished to help with the huge shortage of beds issue for the elderly and upcoming baby boomers.
plus I could see that could bring back some of the culture. Living near each other if done right the could spear on culture in that community. Around me a lot of old schools are being turned into senior senior living facilities
That would be ironic..the teenagers that used to hang out at the malls in the 1970's and 80's end up literally retiring in them..
The baby boomers. The generation that was born with the suburbia, grew up to make the malls and now would get into those repurposed malls as ALC. Kind of looks like some tale to be told.
Also: affordable housing for young families, such as they are.
This feels more like a Stranger Things advertisement. She keeps bringing it up when there really is no need to.
Maybe that's what inspired the video.
Wired gets more clicks/likes if it taps into the Stranger Things fans
If she wants to she can do it
@@patrickqin but they really missed chance to put stranger things in the thumbnail or the title.
Netflix money...
Other cultures and countries have old ruins, castles and temples. Abandoned buildings are the ruins of our young culture.
Hundreds of abandoned buildings in the suburbs, and thousands of abandoned people on the streets... If only there was a way of connecting the dots.
1234coolman I know right? Very insightful.
Dylan Nanayakkara if only. The government and powers that be, would never allow it.
@@007Julie Sure, it would cost money to relocate them in the first place, but, if they got the homeless back on their feet and contributing in the economy, the government could enjoy greater tax revenues and the "powers that be"... well they could enjoy a more robust economy. It seems like a win-win-win to me.
Your right.. But you need to mention Stranger Things to get more likes!
I literally buy everything online now. Malls to me are just a hangout spot for kids.
Most people don't play video games on their basement
......and thus malls need to have interactive places for the youth to be preoccupied with.
The mall in my town is the hangout for twenty and thirty year olds who live with their parents.
Kids don't even hang out at the malls anymore.
Kids don’t hang out at malls much either
US: Malls are dying
ASIA: Malls are everywhere
NJ: Our malls aren’t going anywhere.
Christopher Lee NYC just opened Hudson Yards
American Dream Mall is opening in a few months at the Meadowlands. That thing is supposed to be just slightly smaller than the Mall of America.
Thank you Bill Clinton.
@@WordsofHarmony Hudson Yards isn't a mall.
Correction: Why malls in the US are dying.
It would be more informative to compare American malls to Asian malls.
Americans have no idea that the rest of the world exist.
I'm actually finishing a year abroad in Japan, and one of the things that shocked me as an American is that... Malls are very much NOT dying here. Every mall I've been to has been packed, usually without any empty storefronts.
@@KaguyaHimex Also malls in Asia have higher quality stuff in general.
@@MajorGeneralVeers I think that's part of it- if I go to the mall and most of the stuff there is junk, I won't want to go back. Half the time it's super hard to find basics and half the shirts for women will have weird frills sewed on them
true, here in Asia, wherever mall you are, it's packed with people, even on a holiday
1970: Knock down the trees, build a mall.
2020: Knock down the mall, plant some trees.
2022: knock down the trees and build flying cars
This is what city planners and planning students like myself are dealing with as well! Such a fascinating subject
What everyone seems to miss, is what it feels like to be in mall, are you welcome, how aggressive are they trying to get your money etc... Even city officials dont like to talk about these stuff, then money is wasted a lot when mall is deemed failure. What I'm interested also, what happens to all the concrete in urban areas, when they demolish and build new huge constructions. I heard sand is not infinite supply (needed for concrete a lot).
I stopped going to the mall because the aggressive sales people at the kiosks made me too anxious
Jen absolutely!! I was going to say the same thing!
Me too. I stay clear and will never go back.
Oh god yes. I remember last time I was in one, a man was forcing this expensive face cream at my mom, and would not take no for an answer until I literally dragged her away. I miss the days of malls just having art and phone stalls in the middle of them.
Yes, those can be very annoying, some really believe they can sell you anything!!
Tell em "GTF outta my face."
The only reason I miss malls is because my life was better back then. It's a nostalgia thing.
One thing no one mentions is that media was a significant portion of mall space. Books and magazines about your favorite stars, lots of movie and music stores, and of course a theater. These businesses were hurt or destroyed by the internet.
Yeah, they should have compensated by turning the vacant department stores into live theatres for musicals, plays, operas, concerts, etc, with smaller vacant retail spaces turned dance studios and rehearsal spaces and whatnot, and lots of places for audience members and performers to eat, hang out, etc.
Malls do better In hot climates, free air con for poor & security
Our downtown mall was torn down, and after a while they put in a city commons. People love it. There's events and concerts there all the time.
Wouldn't happen to be city center would it?
what kind of downtown ? Chicago or some A B C city downtown
I wish I was a teenager in the eighties messing around with my friends and having fun. :/
That's what killed the malls.
*WIRED:* "Malls are dying"
*Philippines:* Laughs in Filipino
BUGZES ...but Visayans love malls too
1234coolman malls are thriving in the Philippines and are the de facto hangout for EVERYONE. It’s a tropical climate & AC is free at the mall
Malaysia also tag along😂
Relatable, have a nice day.
Just goes to show that our social and financial situation is about 30 years behind
Well you kind of forgot that the stores are becoming way too expensive for their competitors and the products are becoming less and less valuable and quality. Why spent $80 on a t shirt at a mall
Bingo. The price of jeans is always $50. Even on some of the clearance racks.
Definitely. Overpriced merchandise which was probably a symptom caused by the consolidation of malls under 2-3 corporations who all started raising rent and squeezing store owners.
Where I live a crappy pair of mall jeans that fall apart is $80 or more
Also movie theaters in malls are expensive. I can go to a theater in a mall and spend $20 dollars on a ticket or go to an independent theater and spend $8 on a ticket
Have any of you heard that stranger Things series 3 will have a mall?
I lived through the death of downtown to the malls. I remember the ARCADES. Then the mall died and our downtown became a new mini-metropolis. Condos, restaurants, shops and etc.
No one:
WIRED: Here's why malls are dying…
Everyone: oh, cool, I wonder if it's online shopping! _click_
WIRED: btw, Stranger Things season 3 will have malls. Malls will be in Stranger Things season 3. Stranger Things feature malls in season 3! OMG won't season 3 of Stranger Things be so exciting?
Everyone: 😒😒😒
Best comment
This is exactly what happened 😂
I mean, I LOVE stranger things, but yea... it seems kinda... irrelevant to the topic at hand to force ST3 into this video, when the only connection is that "it has a mall in it"
She is the only person I have ever seen that excited for a show with a mall.
Let's try to shift the conversation back to Stranger Things™, featuring David Harbour as the lovable Jim Hopper
Meanwhile shopping mall in Hong Kong still popular, I don't think you can find a vacant mall there
Raymond Chan it’s because AC
shopping malls are boring looking. they are not dying but they are very plain and dull.
It’s because they are convenient, but most things are overpriced and the stores are extremely repetitive. Personally I don’t really like malls in HK.
@@Tiriikran i agree with the repetitve
Working class in China have money. US working class do not have money. It is that simple.
I have always felt that the mall was a substitute for the village square, where people of all ages interacted. That some have been redeveloped as actual town centers for the surrounding suburbia is a healthy sign. Suburbs are dreary places that have no heart, which is a social gathering point. Suburbs have none of the advantages of a town and none of the advantages of being out in the country. If you don't have a car in the suburbs, you are as good as dead.
Eugene Pomeroy very well put
The guy who created them wanted them to be like downtowns.
@@geoffreyharris5931 If they redeveloped the stores on the upper floors as apartments, they would, I believe, make a comeback. In Europe, lots of people live above the shops they own and operate.
Iiunjuu oh my it’ll
I’m mom mom hm😊myhmcccfci tykmilitary m mo
Robin Sparkles says let's go to the mall today
This feels like a Commercial for Stranger Things. That could've been left out..... unless they were a secret sponsor?
Bosley did you even watch it? They hardly speak about stranger things after the first few minutes
It seems to me like they were using the show's popularity to create more interest in the topic. The vitality most malls enjoyed in the time the show portrays is also relevant and may help some younger folks understand the changes malls have undergone too. They symbolism drawn at the end of the vid was nice too. It takes me back to my high school AP English classes.
Bosley I think it was just a ploy for views
@Vulas Helefaren no... it's really not...
More so the opposite. Everybody is talking about stranger things so they use that hype for their video.
One more thing at play in the 80's: materialism, the more the better!
Big box stores and the economy we're huge factors in the decline of malls.
Also, the last 20 years have shown a gradual but definite shift in the younger generations thinking. Many have realized (thank God) stuff doesn't equal happiness. Now it's more about paring down and getting out there living life, traveling, living a quality life, living responsibly. Naturally, malls are getting left out of the equation.
Those abandoned building structures could be repurposed in so many ways to help improve the communities they are located in, if only people with money and vision would invest in them.
Totally true!
I would disagree. People in the 80s definitely thought more is better but thats not to say this generation thinks any different. the shift is that it's no longer more is better, it's more expensive is better. that's the difference. no one wants to go to Macys and buy a shirt for $20 that has no logo attached to it. they want to go to more high end stores and blow money there. i would argue zoomers are even more materialistic than previous generations and this is exactly why luxury brands have just exploded in popularity. more isn't better, more expensive is better.
@@ceoofmemes1967 Yeah, point taken. I have to agree with you at least in part while still acknowledging the shift that has slowly taken place in the lives of many towards minimalistic living, off grid living and the nomadic lifestyle.
Lame comment
People need to come visit the malls in Asia, or Taiwan at least, and I'm sure malls in Mainland Chinese major cities are astounding too. Always lively and full of people.
Also Spencer, we can't overlook the fact that online shopping is what is really reducing that human traffic at these malls and I am afraid its never going back. If you can shop virtually for anything with a few clicks on your phone why do you have to drive anywhere. Its simply an evolution in commerce and the culture is adapting to it. Malls can be repurposed for other things to better the human condition.
The One World mall in Chengdu city Sichuan province is the largest enclosed space ever in the history of history. It's interior atrium is 13 stories high it has a water park and it's own metro station.
The irony of dead malls emptiness is the energy they once held.
Yep. Another irony is seeing shopping carts, the emblem of consumerism, being used to transport the worldly goods and\or waste of underclass street people
Good point. It's the contrast of 'then vs now' which I find so fascinating... it's hard to put my finger on it
Turning these into apartments would be dope
between online shopping taking away the need to even go to places like malls, and the social media actually turning us into more antisocial groups, they are just unfortunately not "needed" in the same way they used to be.
My grandfather is a ceramics artist and sells at “booths” at various local craft fairs and farmers markets. One of them takes place in a once abandoned mall that has been repurposed to become an indoor craft fair where instead of paying for a spot to pitch a canopy (more often than not outdoors) you pay to have basically your own little air conditioned shop for a few weeks to display and sell your goods.
I love that this video is just a simple video of an expert explaing a thing, no BS, besides the Stranger Things plug...
Yes. But I find the laptop lid blocking the sight to the presenter unpleasant.
Too much merchandise in one place with too little money in ones pocket.
But it’s not just too much merchandise, it’s BAD merchandise that nobody wants.
Because of online shopping accessibility, privacy and the lack of clothing sizes. It’s not just architecture, not really the main/only issue
I dont think architecture has a damned thing to do with it period. Nobody cares wha the shops look like, its online shopping, point blank. In smaller towns with less access to shopping, malls will continue to be fine.
@@caligulalonghbottom2629 Thats gotta be the least intelligent post of this comment section. The architecture and design of a building plays a big part in its success.....
Architecture is not only the aesthetics of a building, but is more often a manifestation of the zeitgeist of a specific time period/culture. The commentary of an architectural professor is very appropriate because they study how/why a building typology came to be and why it is no longer appropriate for the culture today.
@@sukikwan3786 Plus the layout of a buliding heavily influences consumer behaviour, which is something that good mall architects carefully study and plan for, which wasn't always the case with those malls.
And this was before the pandemic. Crazy.
A smaller mall could be converted into a community college, or apartments.
The historical part was really interesting. As a future architect myself, I love me some architecture/architectural content any time and if comes along with pop culture references, sign me up.
i live for it, i'm in the same boat
Word! I love architecture, history, architectural history, and historic architecture. Totally my jam as well!
Godam high renting is the cause. Why bother to open a business when it is a clear sign of lost. The transition is inevitable
I'm confused. Is there a mall in stranger things
Chris Sanchez Gwinnett place mall in Georgia
In the upcoming 3rd season, part of the plot is a mall opening up in the small town that previously never had a mall
LMAO can’t you tell he’s joking!? Anyways, YES
HAAAA!
You're confused? I missed the Stranger Things stuff. MUST .... LEARN .... TO .... FO .... c .... u ....
Could also be the quality of clothing and fast fashion. I’m so sick of my clothes lasting a year.
People would rather pay for high quality stuff with longer life spans.
If you want better quality clothing at lower prices then the internet is the way to go
@@JAG214 that's hilarious!
@@wlonsdale1 How so ?
Most people that shop- a lot, only need their clothes to last a single season- as they'll be onto newer styles the next year. Those buying "exprensive" longer-lasting items... only shop once every couple years. They're not going to keep doors open.
The malls were huge in the early 60’s, through the 70’s and 80’s.
When I went to malls in the Middle East I was amazed at how packed they were! I actually felt like I was going back in time to when I grew up when people loved malls.
cause those malls are far more entertaining and glamorous than we have
This video did not need the Stranger Things plug
Kevin Vasquez yeah, you think they paid for it? That’s a weird product placement
Interesting, I looked at it the other way; them trying to tap into the Stranger Things hype to teach the fans something about the history and the future of malls.
100% agree! This woman is some sort of super fan of that show. She talked about it for a full minute before the real meat and potatoes of the topic started. Then closed the video with saying she hopes the professor tunes in for the new season. Ugh! So annoying!!
I've never seen the show and so I skipped past that part. Seemed like a plug to me.
I just started the season and so I thought it actually fit really well. I liked the connection
It's so weird watching that one year after and seeing them talking about gathering online and a loneliness epidemic when now we're actually in a pandemic and most of our interactions are online
In my city, there is a small mall that has a stage in the old food court area where there are local music acts, little kid dance recitals, etc. They also have public reservable meeting rooms on the ground level, a small library inside the mall, a regular drug store, grocery store and gym inside, and a large open seating and table area on the top level where social groups, clubs, support groups, and just friends of all ages meet up. It is a really cool community multi-purpose structure now. I wish more cities utilized them this way!
Covid-19. Malls were dying but I am the nail in the coffin.
When your local mall gets a baseball card trading store, that's like coughing up blood as a sign that you need to see a doctor.
One of the department stores being turned into a church is like stage 3.
Ours just LOST a base card trading store! So what does that say?
Common ideas for dead malls
-museums
-Homeless shelters
-warehouse
-grocery stores
-satellite stations for colleges
- multi purpose faculties
Except here in the Philippines. We Filipinos love shopping and because of the hot weather we always want to go to the mall. And everything’s there for paying bills, shopping, spa, groceries. A one stop shop.
So things people do with dead malls:
1) Downtownization: Putting street grids. Ground level retail. Appartments and offices up above.
2) Office space, Medical uses, Educational uses, churches.
3) Re-greeners.
4) Zombie paintball.
I love the variety!
In Brazil malls are still thriving and becoming bigger and bigger. High security and air conditioning are two main reasons for that, I think. And here I also see the phenomenon of public services being absorbed into the shopping malls. Also the really big ones are usually already built with an adjacent office building.
American politicians keep outsourcing our jobs and they wonder why stores are closing down. WE HAVE NO $$$$$
Why pay gas and drive to the mall, when you can just click a few buttons on Amazon?
I will be done ordering on Amazon before starting up my car.
"Why malls are dying"
dude, I live in Canada and the malls are packed.
Are you serious? Not in California where I live. Maybe people go to the malls to get out of the cold.
yea so0o true, we build malls in the middle of nowhere and they still get packed... even build a massive mall next to another massive mall
@@mermaidcattt No. I'm telling a Canadian that people go to malls in Canada to get out of the cold. Maybe I just phrased my response wrong. In California, malls are not packed.
They're talking about US malls fucktard
Mark Flierl Then the video should have said American malls. Malls in South America and Asia seem to be doing well too.
Or you could ask Dan Bell. Someone who produces some of the best dead mall content with great research.
Yes!!!👏👏👏
This video is trash, for many reasons. The biggest reason is not collabing with Dan.
misstwinpeaks Nice. I go check his videos and it's just a loop of ads, some Jenny Jones story and some crazy woman laughing.
Clickbaited by Wired - Rickrolled by Dan Bell. Great job.
rifter rifter I think you didn’t watch enough of his stuff lol Dan Bell is the king of dead malls.
Or you can ask Retail Archaeology, Ace's Adventures or even Bright Sun Films
My local mall is quickly fading and its really really sad. I love my mall and even though it has really good stores, its only busy around gift-giving holidays
Our downtown mall is two levels and the upper level has been turned into micro-apartments and the lower is a mix of unique retail, no chains. The mall is historic and has a European architectural ambiance. It has been a big hit. All of the micro-apartments (rent is less than $1,000/mo) has been filled and the retail and artists' studios are filling up. There's even a public market in the atrium.
See, it's the diversification of the mall you mention that works. Sort of how cities used to be. Our big cities didn't just get built overnight like suburban shopping malls and suburban residential planning. Cities were extremely mixed. Look at neighborhoods in cities with mixed zoning. It the community can get rid of crime s yuk ch mixed zoning areas are huge potential for economic growth. Suburban areas with strict zoning, strict hoa's, large distances between locations not so much, except cheap tax rates and open land for new construction.
It's worth mentioning that malls are thriving in places like Asia. In China and the Philippines you can go into 8 story malls with every type of business you can think of. Some people have pointed out that climate is a factor, but I also think it's because malls have an idea of luxury behind them. So many places are just trying to experience what the U.S. takes for granted.
Same here in greece
People always like to copy us, I would've liked if it was different but most countries are influenced by American culture when you guys have your own culture.
Mall In Philippines: So how many malls would you like?
SM MALL: YES
Amazon and streaming services are making malls and movie theatres obsolete.
When I went to the Midwest recently, I went to both a Dead mall and Mall of America. It was fascinating
Zach T mall of america is designed to attracted both locals and tourists so that’s why it’s always packed
The Blues Brothers movie was shot in a dead mall which had died by 1980 located in the South Side or Suburbs of Chicago.
pastorart1974 yes, but that suburban city was dead
That was Dixie Square. I remember going there when it was new, about 1970. It was beautiful. Too bad it only lasted about a dozen years!
New Oldsmobiles are in early this year.
I haven’t been to mall at all in my adult life because I’m too broke.
lol same.. i thrift shop.. i like saving by wearing used clothes. maybe ill treat myself to ross or tjmaxx
You can still walk around. Some people use them for exercise.
Need to connects malls with public facilities like bus / train stations. It'll survive for sure.
i agree! a mall near me has stops for 3 buses, and a trolley stop. thats the only reason why my friends and i are even able to go, as we dont have cars. kids still love the mall, we just dont have access to them.
Public transit always has stops at major shopping locations, but not every city has a decent network of public transit.
Cities/government in general would have to actually focus on policies to promote the middle class, but they only want to focus on thise who are already wealthy. It's a case of capitalist values being self-destructive.
@@beth8775 thats very true. our transit system is barely decent, but thats because i live in an area where it 100% needs to be. as in, theres no "rich people" to focus on. i cant imagine what its like in large cities, or upper class areas
@@chris4436 I live in an area that's pretty rural, so mass transit doesn't really exist. Our towns aren't big enough to need or support it. Our sporadic cities (small cities really) are largely full of people to whom the concept is kind of foreign, so what systems they do have are not functional enough for people to be content using them.
@@beth8775 America hates public transportation. America wants everyone to drive that's why public transit is deliberately underfunded. If America continues at the rate of underfunding public transit by the middle of the century public transit will be dead and relegated to NYC.
A dead mall in my area, Landmark Mall was used for the filming of Wonder Woman 2. There was also another mall in my area, Springfield Mall, that was revamped as Springfield Town Center and is doing so much better now.
There is something melancholic about viewing an ancient ruin that was once majestic, and a bustling, thriving place full of life, but is now a hollow shell with no movement and no life, except the rustling of the wind blowing through it. It doesn’t matter if it is the ruins of a temple complex in Luxor, Egypt, the empty streets of Pompeii, an abandoned mining town out west, the abandoned factories of Detroit, or the empty malls across America. Something about being reminded of the impermanence of all things in this life forces you to be reflective about your own life, and how you often spent your time chasing after things that seemed important at the time, but ultimately don’t last.
Of course, as a child who came of age in the 80s, there is also something nostalgic about viewing the ruin of a place that once seemed so important and such a large part of your youth, but now it has been reduced to a ghost town. Makes you long for simpler times which you know are long gone, and will probably never come again.
Middle class middle America has been gutted by hedge fund speculators who have bankrupted once viable companies to make a buck, and globalists who have shipped our factory jobs overseas. The abandoned malls are but the bleached bones of a once thriving middle America, a warning to future generations not to make the same mistakes we made with our economy, just like the ruins of Pompeii half buried in the ashes of Mount Vesuvius are a warning not to build too close to the volcano, or the ruins of Fukushima are a warning not to build anything important in a tsunami flood zone.
“Look on my works, Ye mighty, and despair!” says the great Ozymandias.
Internet & Netflix are bringing out the end of boredom - shopping (and so many other things) people used to do just to get out of the house...
I’m glad that the malls where I live are still very popular. I can’t imagine driving by the mall only to feel like it’s a ghost town. Maybe it’s because I live in packed New England, where no one really knows where else to go. 😂 The malls here are also relatively far apart, so people are almost obligated to drive to the nearest mall whenever they need something. They don’t need to pick and choose mall. Actually it’s so popular here I ALWAYS bump into people. I hope that our malls will still thrive and be open for many many more years to come. 😁
The destruction of the middle class.
No disposable income.
There’s your reason, Wired.
No. If that is true then explain how online shops are so successful.
@@garyh4458 Percentages.
Gary Harper Its a combination of internet research allowing you to easily compare prices and then the shopping for an item to buy the cheapest used or new item gave people more options and better prices. When I went to a mall I did not even have a cell phone. A mall is a network of stores. Now the internet is the virtual network.
@@jamesmedina2062 Yeah, malls are ridiculously expensive. I've never bought anything at a mall for full price. Online and thrift is the exact same thing for a fraction of the cost.
Rocky Comet Totally agree.
Turn Deadmalls into Vaporwave clubs
y e s
M A L L - C H I L L
It's not that hard to understand... Online shopping is taking over
Yeh, too many blablabla at the beginning before really getting into the architecture part
Clearly you didn't watch the video, they mentioned it
@@AQGOAT24 Could you book mark when they do? This video is pretty garbage and seems like the research is really weak.
@Enmity the Kindhearted amazon is just a logistics provider. You can open your own shop online at amazon, ebay, or other local clones of that or just open a normal web shop.
Its easier than ever for small businesses to reach customers, while not havin to afford high rent in some mall or even city
That would be true if online shopping was the majority of shopping. It's not.
The mall was the place to be on Saturdays
I feel kinda sad, I remember going to the mall as a kid and just loved to walk around. Now the mall can barely keep stores and more then a few have made it so that you can't enter them through the main area, you have to go outside and go in their main doors, basically a round strip mall.
One of the malls in my area where I went when I was in high school died. It was already on it's way out in the early 2000s. It was revamped as an outdoor mall with smaller street level stores, apartments above and a theater complex. There is business offices and a library as well. A Whole Foods. Not all the stores do well there though and there has been turnover. Yet, people continue to frequent there.
That's an awesome use of the space
They did the same thing with my childhood Mall Randhurst. Driving through the mall feels like something out of Back to the future. It's just not the same I miss the 80s
In my city 2 malls close because too many thugs just hung out and started trouble selling dope and stealing so they scared the consumers and they went other places
What city is that? That has been happening all over.
I feel like Northridge would be another. (...and all of the other failing Northridge malls. The "Northridge Curse".)
Johnny Tocino San Antonio Texas
This woman has no idea what she's talking about, and it's not really her fault, it's yours for asking the wrong person. This is like talking to a cartographer about why the South lost the Civil War. It's just not their place to say. You should have interviewed a sociologist who actually knows what they're talking about. This is a very well studied field, it's just not the field a bloody architect has studied.
Daniel Bazinga lol TH-cam comment section experts out in full force
@@MsZooper That's one thing that'll never die out.
Why malls are closing?
Old people will probably blame millennials. With their stagnant wages and sky high student student debts
Willy Wong It really has nothing with millennials being losers or unsuccessful or failing to launch and more and more of them living with Mommy & Daddy. No, Millennials have actually made no changes in this world, good or bad. They are simple the victims of the decisions the big government and elite corporations make.
Iv just read most of these reasons, and there "all valid!"
We don’t have this problem in the UK where there’s been huge recent & current investment in malls (at least in London). The problem with US/Canadian malls is the experience sucks - low ceilings, pokey stores, poor layouts, lack of variety.
Contract: "Mention at least 1 minute worth of Stranger Things"
Wired: *Forcefully mentions Stranger Things at the beginning and end to make a video that is otherwise completely unrelated*
C Barbs maybe it was just the inspiration for this girl to make the video
also this topic has really already been covered by tons of youtubers too. there’s a guy who also did a special on all the kmarts closing too