Bought the same one about a year ago. Undid the chuck bolts with pliers (not very tight). Didn't realise the back plate was screw on until I had the chuck off. Undid it with a little bit of force as it was a bit snug. I did actually put it back on a bit tighter as I was worried it may loosen up during use. Worth getting apart and redoing the lube. Works fine enough for the money.
to try to get the chuck off, you can put a piece of hex bar or large nut in the chuck, then use an socket and impact gun on the nut while using a strap wrench on the manual index plate to hold it. This works a treat to get my lathe chuck off after I had it jammed it on for years that tight that I broke my back gear try to undo it.
Looks like a good deal. As for getting those odd divisions I've relied on compound indexing. It's described in the Machinery's Handbook, and includes a chart for all divisions up to 250. I don't know if the latest copies include it with all the modern ways of doing things, but the 16th and 21st do. Essentially, it involves having a second indexing pin attached to the body. With this setup the handle can be indexing in one hole circle, and the plate indexing in another. The mounting bolts in the plate will need to be out, and the center hole should be a reasonable fit on it's mounting. This isn't a new idea. My first dividing head patented in the late 1800's is set up for this. (I'm old, but I didn't buy it new.) A footnote below the MH chart reads: "The indexing movements are exact for the divisions marked with an asterisk (*); the errors of the other divisions are so slight as to be negligible for ordinary classes of work, such as gearcutting, etc." Years ago I calculated the accumulated error for 51 divisions. At the crank it amounted to about 1/50th of the center distance between two adjacent holes on the 47 hole circle. I'd say that is less than the accuracy one can expect from even a quality DH.
EDIT 2: Thankyou to all the suggestions, and I have finally gotten the backplate off the spindle. Ill make a quick update video, but to cut to the chase, I needed a fixture to stop the spindle from rotating, penetrating oil, an impact driver and a spanner for leverage. I really can not stress how tightly it was torqued on. No Damage to the threads, should be good to go. Cheers EDIT: Thankyou for all the suggestions guys, I am so grateful for all the feedback and suggestions. ill give the impact driver and jig a go and fingers crossed it should work. Cheers Any thoughts on getting the backplate off or the shaft out would be appreciated. Hope you enjoy the video, hope 2 in a week is not too much. Cheers.
Yup, small set of pliers, like Knipex Cobra or Alligator with the angled jaws, or similar. Grab the OD of those caps screws and crack them loose. When you get that off, try a little heat on the backing plate. That might get it to loosen off the spindle threads enough to get it to unscrew.
@@nigelcrockett4032 NO NO NO........you unscrew the back plate from the spindle.....it screws on like a lathe chuck......the chuck remains on the backplate at all times.
Ive worked on old motorcycles for decades. To remove an "impossible" bolt; use a dremel with a tiny cutoff wheel to cut a notch on the outside edge of the bolt head. Then a centre punch and a hammer, punch it on the notch at a tangent to the bolt head, ie to TURN the bolt head undone. It gives a combination of very high peak turning torque to the bolt head, plus added impacts of the punch to loosen it up, so it acts like an impact wrench. You'll get those bolts out in a few minutes.
Those "t-nuts of some sort" are intended to be keys to register the head against the t-slot in your mill table, so you can r&r it without spending a lot of time on getting it square to the table. I've got the same head, and it's pretty convenient- the spindle threads are the same as on my Atlas lathe, so I can take chucks and workpieces back and forth between the mill and lathe with no problem. (Especially convenient as I have 4-5 different types of chucks that I use on the Atlas.) Edit to add: I've never had any trouble removing the chuck from the spindle. Not sure what's going on there for you.
Do not press it out. You need to unthread the chuck backing plate. If you press it you will break the retaining screws holding that cover plate. The brass gear inside is held on with a threaded nut, it isn't going to be pressed off. Bolt it down, use the index pin and the spindle clamp to hold the spindle shaft from rotating, wedge a long piece of wood in the chuck jaws and unscrew it. It is just on tight, it isn't welded or pinned.
As a retired engineer I have used this type of dividing head many times and found it very useful because of the ability to tilt unlike conventional dividing heads, here in Australia they were generally brittish imports with the chinese being fast to make an inferior copy, in various sizes.
I do wish I could get my hands on one, I tried to snag one a while back on greys online but lost out. Must admit though, the tilt fiction has been very useful in the short time that I've had it. Cheers
I have this same model. The chuck is threaded on. Put the chuck key in and tap it counter clockwise to unscrew the chuck. If needed clamp the dividing head down and engage the spindle lock.
@@artisanmakes If you engage the index plate with the pin, you would have to break the pin or index plate before it slips... Honestly it isn't going to be tight enough to do that. It is made to come off.
@@Bakafish I am considering this too, I know I am being a little over cautious, I just don't want to damage the pin or the plate, trying to use other options before I do this. Cheers.
@@artisanmakes you can be cautious sure, but this is how you are meant to remove it. Its the same way older lathe spindles attached their chucks. You couldn’t cut with them in reverse. It will just spin off. I had the BS-2 with the 8” chuck.
When taking stuff apart, I often use a piece of delrin/nylon as a sort of punch and tap it with a hammer. This makes sure that you don't deform the metal parts. Assuming that it is able to come out in the first place, but that assumption is also true for the press.
I've had this kit for about 3 years. Absolutely delighted with it after a strip down and a bit of fettling and adjustment. I get great results milling splines and gear cutting. These are tremendous value for the money.
I would disassemble this and clean it sooner rather than later. Mine was also pretty well made (Got mine for $200 a year ago) and it is a BS-0. Don't know if they are all coming out of the same factory or what, but I imagine they are. Mine had some swarf and grinding dust included as extras inside. I am glad I went the route of cleaning it first.
I just bought from Vevor. The order says 1-6 business days shipping. My guess is it will be a bit longer. I do live in the states. Not sure where it ships from. I purchased to assist with building a simple cam. Once I get it I'm certain I will find other uses. Thanks for the review. Was happy to see someone else had good experience with Vevor. I bought the 8" rotary table as well. I'd definitely like to know how to get the chuck off as well.
Hello - I have the same type dividing heard. I wanted to put a face plate on it. I was able to remove the chuck with a strap wrench. It was difficult, but the chuck came off. Mike
The original B&S dividing heads have Timken type zero taper roller bearings, and the spindle nose and taper are ground true in place in those bearings. Disturbing the bearings for any reason is risky. The spindle will lose factory accuracy because of stacked errors reassembling. I found the imports a great buy, but the items need refitting of the parts. Good video showing the problems.
I use the same, the chuck will come off, just needs a few clouts with a heavy hammer and a wooden block, and yes you can tap the spindle through with the same method, no press required. I took mine apart and machined a myford spindle thread so that I could easily swap from the lathe to the indexer without loosing positions, the spindle is hardish, but still cuts ok with TCT. very useful and well made bit of kit for the money
Wow. I have the Vertex BS-0 and it is visually identical except for the shape of the locking handles and the sector arm. I have seen a page in a hobby machinist magazine from 1975 advertising the BS-0 so this design has been in production for a very long time.
Very surprised at how little the design has changed. If anything the sector arms are the weakest part of the build. They are die cast and not that nice to use. Thinking of making brass ones. Cheers
I have the same unit and the spindle lock, which is just cheap cast iron, broke after very little use at the threads. I disassemble it and made a new one out of cold rolled steel. I was able to remove the chuck and backing plate with a 3/8th extension in the chuck key hole and a dead blow hammer. No damage occurred to the gears because I had the spindle locked with the built in dividing pin. I find that this unit is not very ridged when milling vertically due to it's height so light cuts are a must. Overall it's fine for the money and ok for the home hobbyist just don't be surprised if the spindle lock brakes.
My Vevor BS-0 just arrived from EBay. Thanks for your unboxing and tips for pre-use. I’m just doing hobby grade work (RC wheels etc). So I’m sure this is going to be mint for that.
It looks like quite a few people are suggesting clamping a bar in the jaws and using it as a lever (once the base is bolted down). That's what I do on my lathe with a 10" chuck, and it works well. I've use a copper hammer on the jaws before (after gently smacking it several times on the face of the chuck), but the lever is better. In your case (because of the brass gear), I'd recommend using a propane or map torch to heat opposite sides of the threaded portion of the back plate for about about 30-60 seconds each and then try a good "calibrated push" on the lever. If it dosen't work the first time, let it cool over night and heat it incrementally longer; the goal is to expand the back plate without heating the spindle. I bought one of these dividing heads about a year ago, but haven't done anything with it except remove it from the packaging to inspect it the box it up again, so... I'll eventually face the same problem :)
Yeah I had to use a combination of a clamping jig, impact driver, leverage and penetrating oil to get it off. Good ideas all round, but it took several to eventually get it off. Cheers
Just for more info on removing the spindle.......when the spindle is going to be removed the worm must be removed first......undo the nut on the end of the spindle,then the spindle can be pushed out as it only has one taper roller or angular contact bearing at the front behind the chuck end and the other end is a plain bearing in the casting.....very basic but totally adequate. It will be much easier to remove the chuck by unscrewing it while it's still in the head. The worm wheel on the spindle is a straight cut gear (cast iron not bronze) with the teeth cut at an angle to match the helix of the worm. The worm presses against a steel ball in the bottom, (adjustable from outside around the back) not a thrust bearing....and I think it has a small thrust bearing at the top, but it might be a plain steel thrust washer...... not quite sure.
They likely no longer use plain bearings, most of the newer ones use real thrust and tapered roller bearings unlike the old ones. Also the the worm wheel is a worm wheel, it isn't straight cut with angles it is worm cut. And that worm wheel is most certainly held in place by a key and threaded nut, all of which cannot fit through the bearing retainer held by 3 screws in the front which can only be accessed once the chuck backing plate and the index plate are removed.
@@Bakafish Interesting.....mine is 20 years old, if that is the BS-0 type they must have changed the design for the better along the way, but I doubt that this model has 2 bearings on the spindle..........if it comes with a 3 jaw chuck already mounted you would also need a spare threaded back plate(s) if you wanted to fit either a 4 jaw chuck, ER40 collet chuck or a 5C collet chuck or even a face plate.
@@gangleweed Yes, bearings are cheap now, likely cheaper than bearing bronze 🙂 so the latest ones I've disassembled used a pin style thrust bearing in the rear, and a conical roller bearing in the front. Older models used plain bearings. The spindle has a Morse taper, so ER or 5C collet adaptors can use that, or you can drill your own holes in the chuck backing plate which is easily removable from the provided chuck once the plate has been unscrewed from the spindle nose.
The title of your video is misleading, do you feel it was a scam or not? Most of your feedback seems pretty positive and helped me make a decision for buying one.
Well I did almost loose $200 buying it and it’s apparently a somewhat common scam on some platforms. For a good amount of time I was up on the air about if I could get my money back. The DH itself is fine, just some sellers aren’t reputable.
If you want to devide by odd numbers you can make your own dividing plate easy from flat steel with your mill's DRO. Even print it on paper and punch it will work because your result is 40 times more accurate than the dividing plate.
Clickspring enlarged the circular pattern to multiply the accuracy many times. His work was all done by hand, as in ancient times. I'm sure you've seen it, but others may not have.
I see how you’re able to get it for about $200. I’m in the USA and that puts the price tag over $330. Guess I’ll just wait till it’s more convenient. Good video sir 👍🏻 Edit: Well, I waited and recently ordered one from AliExpress for…are you ready for this- $180! I’m super stoked 😆
hello you can unscrew the chuck by using the indexing pin to block the shaft, and use the chuck key with a small hammer to unscrew it. be sure to make the chuck in vertical position and give for some days proper lubricant to help removing the chuck. sadly the chuck plate is put in force, even by unscrewing screws i cannot unmount it...
i managed to open the chuck... don't know how to explain. i put the chuck on the shaft, put a nut inside the opening of the chuck so that it is in contact with the shaft and not the chuck, tigten a screw on the chuck with a nut. by screwing the screw, the nut is hold on the chuck, so the screw pushes on the nuts that is in contact with the shaft.. so the chuck plate gets out ! easly ! it really needed grease : there were burrs and no grease on the worm gear !
Chuck removal: can you get a strap wrench on the spindle or the index plate? 101 divisions: if the handle is sufficiently accurate radially, you could make a plate with multiple hole circles, either 34, 34, and 33 holes or 25, 25, 25, and 26 holes.
You need a mill with a universal table to spiral mill. I bought one from MSC back in the 1980's. They are nice. When I moved I sold it with the mill. I bought one again on Ebay for about $225.00 a few years ago. I switched out the original 5" chuck for a 5" chuck that had bolt on top jaws. I have no complaints. I sold my L&W index head with a 6" chuck, because this one is lighter and a 5" chuck allows you to get in closer to the chuck/center with the spindle.
You get what you pay for, but with careful setup you can do great work on it. Not heavy duty boss crashed ours and cracked frame but we were able to weld it up . But he tried to index a 8 inch dia backing pusher and got in a hurry and hogged the part and bang. I would buy one they are well made for the price. For home machinist they are fine. You could save money and build a Gingry index head yourself. His series of books are very interesting.
Do you nave a piece of hex stock, or a big (1/2") or more Allan key? With the hex stock I would bed it 90 degree with one leg long enough to go past the depth of the chuck jaws, tighten the jaws up really well, clamp the head down tight and try loosening the chuck with the new "handle". Still will not move? Use a piece of pipe as a cheater for more leverage, hit the end of the handle with a lead hammer, etc. A strange thought crossed my mind... could some fool at the factory have Loctited it in? A very weird idea, but not impossible.
In order to do a 101 divisions you would need a universal differential dividing head. the setup would need to be as follows index circle hole pattern 20 number of turns on the crank 8/20th graduations on the sector 78 gear on worm 72 first gear on stud 24 second gear on stud 40 gear on spindle 48 idle gear on no 2 hole 24 not sure if you actually wanted or needed to know this, but if you did I hope it helped.
I appreciate you writing it out, thankyou. I'm sure there are many methods, someone else suggested making custom dividing plates. I have seen CNC controlled dividing heads also work pretty well. Cheers
@@artisanmakes it is absolutely possible to make custom plates to improve and increase your division capabilities, however making a plate with correct number of holes for 101 divisions would be vey difficult if not impossible as there is no whole fraction of 101. (although peoples ingenuity always seems to surprise me to the solutions they find to problems, I have been proven wrong before.) CNC is definitely an option, I work a lot with CNC and and this would be easy.
Vevor are the best for hobby machining. I personally bought over 3k euros worth of stuff. Max 2 weeks every package arrives in good or perfect conditions. Never had issues. Hope you will trust them 😁
I bought the exact same one, but it came with a 41-tooth gear instead of the correct 40-tooth one. I discovered this 5 minutes after unpacking when I tried cranking it thru a single chuck rotation. The seller was understandably incredulous so I had to disassemble it and send them photos. It took a while but they eventually sent me a new 40-T gear which I swapped out myself. I suspect the factory cranked out a whole batch of these with the wrong gear on the spindle. It would be a terrific way for an ex-employee to exact revenge on his way out the door. Not a bad unit for the price, but don't expect the quality of a USA-made equivalent. It's perfect for a home shop.
The chuck backing plate is threaded on the shaft. Simply put your chuck key on on of the chuck drive holes and give it a smack with your hand to remove it off the right hand thread on the shaft. When you put the chuck back on there is a detent that you will feel click in and that will lock it in so there is no need to use a hammer to tighten it up. In addition, the hollow shaft is machined for a #2 Morse taper so if you have an adapter you can use collets in lieu of the chuck.
If a chuck I'd really tight on there is a risk of splitting/cracking the square chuck key drive sockets by outing sideways force on them with the key inserted. The recommended way is to clamp a piece of hex bar into the chuck jaws and use a spanner/wrench on the protruding end of the hex bar. No danger of damage that way.
Have the same. Getting the chuck off was childs play. It is just screwed on. In fact I sold the chuck already - without the back plate of cause. Have a 125 mm from my lathe what was a direct fit ... Quite convinient, can also use the 4 jaw from my lathe on it .No issues on my one also with the handle or its bracket. Works like a charm ... My one came also with a knurled nut for protecting the thread when the cuck is disconnected...
how about a cut short hex key? it is one of the quick and nasty solution i can think of. and if it fail, it is just one key, not that expensive to replace.
The faceplate is screwed onto the thread, it is enough to block the rotation of the spindle and unscrew the chuck together with the faceplate. Then the screws will be easily accessible for loosening.
This is correct, however the problem I really was having was that the backplate was so tightly torqued on that it was seized on to the threads. I eventually got it off, had to use a custom holding jig, impact driver and a wrench. Can not stress how tightly it was on. Cheers
Re the chuck. I'm wondering if you can cut a small length off an Allen key to insert into the screw. Use the correct sized spanner on that bit of Allen key. Swap out of studs and nuts when done. Keep up the good work 😃
Taking off the chuck gets him nowhere, the backing plate needs to be unthreaded in order to disassemble it and the chuck actually gives you something to gronk on.
I just unpacked one and the chuck did not want to unscrew. Gentle hammering on the chuck key did not impress it. I disengaged the worm , bolted it down to a machine table, put hex bar in the chuck, put a spanner on that and heaved. Then I put a spanner on the spindle lock, overtightened it and heaved again. That was when it gave in. It does unscrew but you must not take no for an answer.
The one thing I care about is accuracy. So a test would need to include measurements. When it comes to the bolts, rather than dismantling the entire thing, I'd undo the bolts with pliers and replace them with ordinary bolts so a wrench will do.
At the machine shop I work at our Tailstocks also have that two bolt adjustment and they are all REALLY wicked high dollar too! It seems really odd to me too that tail stocks for dividing heads and rotary tables generally have that clunky two-bolt on even the really expensive ones!
Replace the 2 individual nuts with a single rectangular piece of steel flat stock with the 2 thread holes tapped into it at correct centres. That makes the adjustment of tailstock height/angle much simple with only one spanner needed
To get the head off I believe you need to tighten the chuck down on a sizable bolt. At least 1". Then lock the head in place and turn the bolt counter-clockwise. Would use a large breaker bar. This video pretty much shows how to completely disassemble the unit. The link won't paste. Go to Bundy Bears Shed and find the video.
That did occur to me, id rather try and get it removed without needing to destroy the bolts, but if it comes to that, that might be a really good idea. Cheers.
i have used a 3/4" air impact to break loose these things do not lock the chuck the shock from the impact will break it loose use some type of hex in the chuck to be able to use the impact with a socket
I did eventually get is unscrewed, using some advice I got here. Combination of an impact driver, a clamping jig and a wrench. Just amazing how tightly this was torqued on. Thankfully no damage to the tool. cheers
my lathe is a vevor brand, its been pretty good for me so far only issue being the crap tail stock they come with, seems like an issue for everyone and the chuck plexi glass guard was broken when i open the crate, but i will give them credit cause when i contacted them about getting a replacement all they asked for was pictures of the broken guard an proof of purchase an they sent it, took about 2 weeks to come an it was alot better packaged than the lathe its self, it came with a bunch of stuff that was there own boxes but they was left loose in the crate an thats what got the plexiglass guard.
In fact, on Taobao in China, you can buy a 4-inch Dividing head for US$200, which is true. But if it is sold outside of China, That is impossible. the shipping cost will be higher than the price of the product. The fees charged by foreign trade sales websites and the cost of currency exchange rate losses are 20% of the total price + shipping.
To be honest, I have never used Taobao, I am more familiar with Aliexpress. It is true that shipping and such are expensive for heavy items from China, but I was lucky since the distributor has a local warehouse, so the shipping was free. Cheers
Stick it in freezer overnight. Take out, cover base of head with insulation(towels, foam, space blanket). Allow chuck to warm a bit. Insert long bar into chuck across the face. Use timing belt or oil filter belt wrench around spindle gear. Wack bar Counterclockwise until it breaks or you break.
I bought what looks like the exact same rig from eBay. That was in October 2020, and I paid $228US shipped (though my piratical state sticks me with sales tax on top of that). I just looked at the listing (Dec. 2021) on eBay, same vendor. It's now $999! Ouch. I was particularly interested since the chuck thread is the same as my old Logan lathe, and I needed a decent 5 or 6 inch chuck for that; price of a chuck+backplate is pretty damn close to the price for this whole unit, so I figured the risk was small even if the head turned out to be landfill. I've used the chuck on the lathe, and it's working well. I don't see any runout, and that's close enough for anything I'm making. But damn, that chuck was on there tight. Nothing in the minimalist instructions about locking pins or novelty threads, it's a conventional 1.5-8 thread but just too damn tight. I don't recall exactly how I got it off - it must have been such a horrific experience that my mind just blacked it out. Or maybe my age is showing. I'm pretty sure I put a piece of wood against one of the jaws and tapped the wood with one of my calibrated precision hammers. I locked the spindle by tightening the clamp screw to what must have been damn close to the yield strength of the metal; I don't think I used the direct index pin to lock it, as I didn't want to risk bending it, but I don't recall for sure. But in the end my hammers must have done the job.
I have the bs-1 version of this. I had to take it completely apart to deburr everything and completely remove the excessive amount of grit it contained. Then I relubed and adjusted everything. Made another index plate on my rotary table to expand the number of gears it can cut. Bundybears workshop channel shows a complete tear down.
And these cheap import heads are excellent once they have been given the clean out and refit with care treatment. I have a BS-0...very pleased with it.
Pinned comment - EDIT 2: Thankyou to all the suggestions, and I have finally gotten the backplate off the spindle. Ill make a quick update video, but to cut to the chase, I needed a fixture to stop the spindle from rotating, penetrating oil, an impact driver and a spanner for leverage. I really can not stress how tightly it was torqued on. No Damage to the threads, should be good to go. Cheers
Pinned comment - EDIT 2: Thankyou to all the suggestions, and I have finally gotten the backplate off the spindle. Ill make a quick update video, but to cut to the chase, I needed a fixture to stop the spindle from rotating, penetrating oil, an impact driver and a spanner for leverage. I really can not stress how tightly it was torqued on. No Damage to the threads, should be good to go. Cheers
I have that same dividing head, I never took the back plate off, but mine had hex bolts holding the chuck on luckily. If you can't get them out with vise grips or channel locks I'd cut the bolt heads off and replace them with some hex bolts cause the 5" chuck is great on the lathe too. But you can't put new bolts in the back plate with the dividing plate in the way either. Mine has the bolts sitting in it still. Which I guess is great cause I can't lose them. Not so great though if you actually want to change them.
And I put loctited studs in the chuck so I have to get those bolts out of there too. Am following to see what solutions yall come up with to get the back plate off there. I probably would have reefed on it a bit not knowing there was a bronze gear on the spindle. Thanks for the video
i'm thinking about getting one of these and this helps. funny thing, it was cheaper to spend 1,000 for a lathe than it was to have 7 parts made. i have the parts, and the lathe and saved about 1500 dollars. i think the set up for the company was about 50, and then 90 per hour, they gave me an estimate of 3100 dollars.
I have gotten the chuck off, required a fixture, impact driver and spanner. I can not stress how tightly it was on, though no damage thankfully. I will certainly do a follow up. Cheers.
Vevor does make decent vises. I have the knock off urt 6in single and two two-station vises. That said they cut corners where it really doesnt matter. My handles were all trash
@@artisanmakes Locking the index pin is the correct operation (along with the spindle lock.) You could make a long metal tool with two pins that engage the holes in the index plate to help give you leverage and avoid the possibility of damaging the indexing pin, but I'm pretty sure the plate is going to come off without breaking anything if you just lock it with the pin. Use a soft dead blow hammer if you need to. It isn't reversed threads or anything.
Artisan Makes, you quite rightly mention further down in the comments that the smaller heads BS-0 and BS-1 are only semi universal as they are not equipped to be rotary driven by a train of back gears and therefore cannot produce helical gears or splines. This can be overcome on the semi universal heads by the addition of an electronic stepper motor and rotary encoder drive. There are a few others who have done this very successfully. Also the annoying issue with trying to juggle 2 spanners to adjust the pair of tailstock nuts and bolts can be greatly improved by replacing the 2 individual nuts with a rectangular piece of steel flat stock with two threaded holes set at suitable centres. I have one of these cheap import dividing head kits the same as yours and they can be made very reliable with a bit of fettling and adjustment...very happy with mine and still can't believe how they manage to sell these for that price.
Heya! Did you actually post a link to the one you bought? I took a quick look, and it felt like there were many many ways for me to get it wrong!? :) Thanks for the vid - and followup. Great to see this sort of stuff torn down in advance of buying it!
The parts of the brass clamps that need to be machined are machined. The rest you machined didn’t need to be. It just makes it look a little bit nicer. Like everyone else said, it’s not bolted on. A parts list will show how this works. You were t being scammed. The extra cost for shipping was added into the Vevor price, which made it just as high as the other would have been, or even a bit higher. $225 for this is a ridiculously low price. Here, in the USA, from eBay, these BS-0 models go for around $500, and that usually doesn’t include shipping
I might have been so clear, I know its not bolted on to the spindle, the problem is is that the backplate has been over torqued on at the factory and has sized onto the threads, and my problems stem from being unable to unscrew the backplate. And I did leave out a few things with regards to the seller, they refused to refund me and grave me someone elses tracking number when I tried to dispute. And the seller was someone impersonating vevor, and the seller is no longer on aliexpress (banned maybe), if they were I would have linked to it so you could avoid it. And it didnt make sense either, it was being sent locally, but they said I was in the wrong country. Having being burned on stuff like this before with aliexpress, I was not going to take this risk. cheers
I discovered VeVor a few months ago, and i have bought many items and are good for the home hobbyist. The Dividing head i got was the HV4 for £109 Bargain as it is well made. as for those cap head screws, when ever i get a problem like you i get a 2 or 3mm drill bit and drill through the side of then and insert a round bar and turn. or as suggested, if they are loose enough then try a pair of grips first. when they are out i do replace such with a Hex head bolt so i can use a spanner,
Put it in the vertical position, put a piece of stock, take a cut and it will come loose, mine came unscrewed on a horizontal cut. It’s actually just screwed in.
get some mole/vice grips clamp them tightly on the cap heads then tap them with a hammer hopefully they will come loose. but i dont know if there is enough space for you to be able to pull them out fully but hopefully there is enough to get the chuck off. then if you do get it off id replace them with hex head bolts so it will be easier in the future.
yeah man if that is a friction fit. press, or a frog if you can. to prevent shit from getting scratched heat up wherever you end up securing it on the press, and keep the heat away from the part you decide to press on. so at work we use an oxy propylene torch, but even a small propane torch will help. put the work under pressure, then apply heat, be sure to apply it quickly and after maybe 30 seconds of evenly heating, start to press further. itll hopefully come out nice and smooth. I tear apart industrial machinery as the day job, and things tend to make very loud bang noises when they come free when they are rusty or dirty. something small and new should be easy, im imagining only a few thousandths shrink. When you put it back together put some never seize of your choice on the shaft, just a tiny layer. heat up what your going to get back one either hot enough to just slide it on with gravity and finese or heat up a tiny amount make sure its lined up very well and press it back on as soon as its hot enough. micrometers and snap gauges will be your friend.
Enjoy your videos and look forward to them. Im new to machining and you have sold me on a dividing head, i have a question though, you have purchased a BS-0 and the larger BS-1 is only $70 more, is there any reason you didn't go for the BS-1? or is the BS-0 the better unit? many thanks.
As i understand it they offer the same abilities, just bs1 is bigger. As it is, bs 0 is big enough for my machine and what I need so I bought that. Bs 2 and 3 however are slightly different as they are universal dividing heads and can do gear hobbing, whilst these can not.
Nice thank you, can you get a 4 jaw chuck for it? You might also consider making a round plate with T slots and a lock to stop it spinning off when in the vertical position?
Yes, many of the Chinese made or the Indian made 4 jaw chucks are available with the same threads in the backplate. I have a 4 jaw that fits mine which I purchased separately.
To everyone bitching about the price, would YOU set up a shop and build this dividing head to your high expectations for $200? Yeah, just what I thought...
I've owned one of these cheap import heads for about 3 years and had excellent service from it making spines and cutting gears. The usual to be expected strip down and re-fettle is essential to get the best from these cheap heads but once set up properly they work exceptionally well. I don't know how they manage to sell such a complete kit for the price. Very happy with mine👌
I bought one of these Chinese knockoffs of the brown and sharp - 0 Dividing head. I got mine off of ebay from a private seller for $120 dollars which included the shipping cost which was a pretty good deal. Mine had been dropped so the mechanism was frozen up because the internal clamp got bent when the tightening bolt struck something. The back plate on the chuck is bolted very tightly to the 5" 3 jaw chuck but it's threaded onto the shaft that goes through the dividing head and I was able to unscrew the chuck backplate from the shaft without much problem. It's a right hand thread so turning the chuck counter clockwise from the front will unscrew it. As you mentioned this needs to come off because in order to extract the shaft out of the front of the housing there are three cap head screw you need to get to. Regarding the backlash in the gears and precision gear cutting using the dividing plates, the most expensive dividing heads will always have some backlash so when rotating the locating pin one must ALWAYS come from the same direction when rotating and slipping into the hole. If you go past the hole you wish to land in you need to backup and try again thus eliminating the backlash and it doesn't matter whether you're using the cheap ones or the most expensive ones. The only real disappointment I've had with the head is that you cannot cut as many gear tooth variations as you can with some of the more elaborate bs models. For example I need a 57 tooth gear and this head won't do it.
If you are only cutting a keyway seldom, chuck the gear in your lathe - make a tool bit to make the keyway, and use the carriage back and forth to cut a slot in the gear. Otherwise you need some kind of a slotting tool/machine
hi . you showed a ring cover at the start. for the shaft.. ok so bolt the gear head to table. then put a ratchet strap around the chuck and pull .. ?? have fun till next time .. tone uk
I have been eyeballing these on Amazon. My mill is cheap, Ecno 30 and absolutely not production shop quality. I got it and about $1,500 worth of Japanese and Swiss cutters for $400. It was a basket case of work like new hand wheels, new quills and rework of the top cover and depth gauge ect. But it was what I could afford and does fulfill my needs. Locked down, it'll cut true enough for me, I'm not outsourced by Boeing or Lockheed, I'm not making aerospace quality parts. Sure I'd love a $5,000 used Bridgeport but that's later. This works for my garage. I need to cut a very specific set of rollers with 1/4" pyramidal teeth for a very specific and unique machine I'm making, specs don't have to be to the tenth of a thou. A knurling tool isn't going to do this. So this tool is what I'm after but I've held off for worry it might be a bit too cheap for what it's supposed to do. Now I know what to expect. I think I'll nab one. Thank you.
Looks like these have gone up a bit. The price is $462NZ. Plus another $460 to ship it here. Over $900 is far too high so now I'm looking for videos of people who have made them in the shop...
Bought the same one about a year ago. Undid the chuck bolts with pliers (not very tight). Didn't realise the back plate was screw on until I had the chuck off. Undid it with a little bit of force as it was a bit snug. I did actually put it back on a bit tighter as I was worried it may loosen up during use. Worth getting apart and redoing the lube. Works fine enough for the money.
to try to get the chuck off, you can put a piece of hex bar or large nut in the chuck, then use an socket and impact gun on the nut while using a strap wrench on the manual index plate to hold it. This works a treat to get my lathe chuck off after I had it jammed it on for years that tight that I broke my back gear try to undo it.
Looks like a good deal.
As for getting those odd divisions I've relied on compound indexing. It's described in the Machinery's Handbook, and includes a chart for all divisions up to 250. I don't know if the latest copies include it with all the modern ways of doing things, but the 16th and 21st do. Essentially, it involves having a second indexing pin attached to the body. With this setup the handle can be indexing in one hole circle, and the plate indexing in another. The mounting bolts in the plate will need to be out, and the center hole should be a reasonable fit on it's mounting.
This isn't a new idea. My first dividing head patented in the late 1800's is set up for this. (I'm old, but I didn't buy it new.)
A footnote below the MH chart reads:
"The indexing movements are exact for the divisions marked with an asterisk (*); the errors of the other divisions are so slight as to be negligible for ordinary classes of work, such as gearcutting, etc."
Years ago I calculated the accumulated error for 51 divisions. At the crank it amounted to about 1/50th of the center distance between two adjacent holes on the 47 hole circle. I'd say that is less than the accuracy one can expect from even a quality DH.
Compound indexing doesn't help with 101 divisions, since 101 is prime. It essentially multiplies the number of holes on the plate by 40.
EDIT 2: Thankyou to all the suggestions, and I have finally gotten the backplate off the spindle. Ill make a quick update video, but to cut to the chase, I needed a fixture to stop the spindle from rotating, penetrating oil, an impact driver and a spanner for leverage. I really can not stress how tightly it was torqued on. No Damage to the threads, should be good to go. Cheers
EDIT: Thankyou for all the suggestions guys, I am so grateful for all the feedback and suggestions. ill give the impact driver and jig a go and fingers crossed it should work. Cheers
Any thoughts on getting the backplate off or the shaft out would be appreciated. Hope you enjoy the video, hope 2 in a week is not too much. Cheers.
Yup, small set of pliers, like Knipex Cobra or Alligator with the angled jaws, or similar. Grab the OD of those caps screws and crack them loose.
When you get that off, try a little heat on the backing plate. That might get it to loosen off the spindle threads enough to get it to unscrew.
I put it vertical and tried and use it as a rotary table, well the whole chuck with backplate came unscrewed. To be clear, it’s not broken.
@@nigelcrockett4032 NO NO NO........you unscrew the back plate from the spindle.....it screws on like a lathe chuck......the chuck remains on the backplate at all times.
@@nigelcrockett4032 OK...........
Ive worked on old motorcycles for decades. To remove an "impossible" bolt; use a dremel with a tiny cutoff wheel to cut a notch on the outside edge of the bolt head.
Then a centre punch and a hammer, punch it on the notch at a tangent to the bolt head, ie to TURN the bolt head undone.
It gives a combination of very high peak turning torque to the bolt head, plus added impacts of the punch to loosen it up, so it acts like an impact wrench.
You'll get those bolts out in a few minutes.
Those "t-nuts of some sort" are intended to be keys to register the head against the t-slot in your mill table, so you can r&r it without spending a lot of time on getting it square to the table. I've got the same head, and it's pretty convenient- the spindle threads are the same as on my Atlas lathe, so I can take chucks and workpieces back and forth between the mill and lathe with no problem. (Especially convenient as I have 4-5 different types of chucks that I use on the Atlas.)
Edit to add: I've never had any trouble removing the chuck from the spindle. Not sure what's going on there for you.
Do not press it out. You need to unthread the chuck backing plate. If you press it you will break the retaining screws holding that cover plate. The brass gear inside is held on with a threaded nut, it isn't going to be pressed off. Bolt it down, use the index pin and the spindle clamp to hold the spindle shaft from rotating, wedge a long piece of wood in the chuck jaws and unscrew it. It is just on tight, it isn't welded or pinned.
As a retired engineer I have used this type of dividing head many times and found it very useful because of the ability to tilt unlike conventional dividing heads, here in Australia they were generally brittish imports with the chinese being fast to make an inferior copy, in various sizes.
I do wish I could get my hands on one, I tried to snag one a while back on greys online but lost out. Must admit though, the tilt fiction has been very useful in the short time that I've had it. Cheers
I have this same model. The chuck is threaded on. Put the chuck key in and tap it counter clockwise to unscrew the chuck. If needed clamp the dividing head down and engage the spindle lock.
I have done that, problem is the spindle lock doesnt have enough grip and eventually slips. Cheers
@@artisanmakes If you engage the index plate with the pin, you would have to break the pin or index plate before it slips... Honestly it isn't going to be tight enough to do that. It is made to come off.
@@Bakafish I am considering this too, I know I am being a little over cautious, I just don't want to damage the pin or the plate, trying to use other options before I do this. Cheers.
@@artisanmakes you can be cautious sure, but this is how you are meant to remove it. Its the same way older lathe spindles attached their chucks. You couldn’t cut with them in reverse. It will just spin off. I had the BS-2 with the 8” chuck.
When taking stuff apart, I often use a piece of delrin/nylon as a sort of punch and tap it with a hammer.
This makes sure that you don't deform the metal parts. Assuming that it is able to come out in the first place, but that assumption is also true for the press.
M2!
Bought one of these from vevor too recently. Was really surprised how nicely packed it was and relatively grit free given the price
I've had this kit for about 3 years. Absolutely delighted with it after a strip down and a bit of fettling and adjustment. I get great results milling splines and gear cutting.
These are tremendous value for the money.
Carefully that one advertised 69 dollars as a special... luckily I git a refund saw my bank statement saying was going to be a reoccurring charge
Really well done. I got the Vevor lathe and had a good experience with them as well.
I would disassemble this and clean it sooner rather than later. Mine was also pretty well made (Got mine for $200 a year ago) and it is a BS-0. Don't know if they are all coming out of the same factory or what, but I imagine they are. Mine had some swarf and grinding dust included as extras inside. I am glad I went the route of cleaning it first.
Got mine apart finally, and you are right, a good amount of grit and crud, plus I wanted to replace the factory grease. Cheers
@@artisanmakesCould you pls share how you could take is apart, finally.
I just bought from Vevor. The order says 1-6 business days shipping. My guess is it will be a bit longer. I do live in the states. Not sure where it ships from. I purchased to assist with building a simple cam. Once I get it I'm certain I will find other uses. Thanks for the review. Was happy to see someone else had good experience with Vevor. I bought the 8" rotary table as well. I'd definitely like to know how to get the chuck off as well.
Hello - I have the same type dividing heard. I wanted to put a face plate on it. I was able to remove the chuck with a strap wrench. It was difficult, but the chuck came off. Mike
The original B&S dividing heads have Timken type zero taper roller bearings, and the spindle nose and taper are ground true in place in those bearings. Disturbing the bearings for any reason is risky. The spindle will lose factory accuracy because of stacked errors reassembling. I found the imports a great buy, but the items need refitting of the parts. Good video showing the problems.
I use the same, the chuck will come off, just needs a few clouts with a heavy hammer and a wooden block, and yes you can tap the spindle through with the same method, no press required. I took mine apart and machined a myford spindle thread so that I could easily swap from the lathe to the indexer without loosing positions, the spindle is hardish, but still cuts ok with TCT. very useful and well made bit of kit for the money
I have tried that, that back plate is so tightly torqued onto the spindle threads that it aint budging. Cheers
@@artisanmakes Heat it up a bit and get the big-boy hammer out
Wow. I have the Vertex BS-0 and it is visually identical except for the shape of the locking handles and the sector arm. I have seen a page in a hobby machinist magazine from 1975 advertising the BS-0 so this design has been in production for a very long time.
Very surprised at how little the design has changed. If anything the sector arms are the weakest part of the build. They are die cast and not that nice to use. Thinking of making brass ones. Cheers
I have the same unit and the spindle lock, which is just cheap cast iron, broke after very little use at the threads. I disassemble it and made a new one out of cold rolled steel. I was able to remove the chuck and backing plate with a 3/8th extension in the chuck key hole and a dead blow hammer. No damage occurred to the gears because I had the spindle locked with the built in dividing pin. I find that this unit is not very ridged when milling vertically due to it's height so light cuts are a must. Overall it's fine for the money and ok for the home hobbyist just don't be surprised if the spindle lock brakes.
My Vevor BS-0 just arrived from EBay. Thanks for your unboxing and tips for pre-use. I’m just doing hobby grade work (RC wheels etc). So I’m sure this is going to be mint for that.
It looks like quite a few people are suggesting clamping a bar in the jaws and using it as a lever (once the base is bolted down). That's what I do on my lathe with a 10" chuck, and it works well. I've use a copper hammer on the jaws before (after gently smacking it several times on the face of the chuck), but the lever is better. In your case (because of the brass gear), I'd recommend using a propane or map torch to heat opposite sides of the threaded portion of the back plate for about about 30-60 seconds each and then try a good "calibrated push" on the lever. If it dosen't work the first time, let it cool over night and heat it incrementally longer; the goal is to expand the back plate without heating the spindle. I bought one of these dividing heads about a year ago, but haven't done anything with it except remove it from the packaging to inspect it the box it up again, so... I'll eventually face the same problem :)
Yeah I had to use a combination of a clamping jig, impact driver, leverage and penetrating oil to get it off. Good ideas all round, but it took several to eventually get it off. Cheers
Just for more info on removing the spindle.......when the spindle is going to be removed the worm must be removed first......undo the nut on the end of the spindle,then the spindle can be pushed out as it only has one taper roller or angular contact bearing at the front behind the chuck end and the other end is a plain bearing in the casting.....very basic but totally adequate.
It will be much easier to remove the chuck by unscrewing it while it's still in the head.
The worm wheel on the spindle is a straight cut gear (cast iron not bronze) with the teeth cut at an angle to match the helix of the worm.
The worm presses against a steel ball in the bottom, (adjustable from outside around the back) not a thrust bearing....and I think it has a small thrust bearing at the top, but it might be a plain steel thrust washer...... not quite sure.
They likely no longer use plain bearings, most of the newer ones use real thrust and tapered roller bearings unlike the old ones. Also the the worm wheel is a worm wheel, it isn't straight cut with angles it is worm cut. And that worm wheel is most certainly held in place by a key and threaded nut, all of which cannot fit through the bearing retainer held by 3 screws in the front which can only be accessed once the chuck backing plate and the index plate are removed.
@@Bakafish Interesting.....mine is 20 years old, if that is the BS-0 type they must have changed the design for the better along the way, but I doubt that this model has 2 bearings on the spindle..........if it comes with a 3 jaw chuck already mounted you would also need a spare threaded back plate(s) if you wanted to fit either a 4 jaw chuck, ER40 collet chuck or a 5C collet chuck or even a face plate.
@@gangleweed Yes, bearings are cheap now, likely cheaper than bearing bronze 🙂 so the latest ones I've disassembled used a pin style thrust bearing in the rear, and a conical roller bearing in the front. Older models used plain bearings. The spindle has a Morse taper, so ER or 5C collet adaptors can use that, or you can drill your own holes in the chuck backing plate which is easily removable from the provided chuck once the plate has been unscrewed from the spindle nose.
The title of your video is misleading, do you feel it was a scam or not? Most of your feedback seems pretty positive and helped me make a decision for buying one.
Well I did almost loose $200 buying it and it’s apparently a somewhat common scam on some platforms. For a good amount of time I was up on the air about if I could get my money back. The DH itself is fine, just some sellers aren’t reputable.
The thing at 1:35 that you’re not sure what is, it attaches to the dead center and is an attachment for a lathe dog when turning between centers.
If you want to devide by odd numbers you can make your own dividing plate easy from flat steel with your mill's DRO. Even print it on paper and punch it will work because your result is 40 times more accurate than the dividing plate.
Clickspring enlarged the circular pattern to multiply the accuracy many times. His work was all done by hand, as in ancient times. I'm sure you've seen it, but others may not have.
I've used the makeshift paper printed disc a couple of times and it worked out really well👍
I see how you’re able to get it for about $200. I’m in the USA and that puts the price tag over $330. Guess I’ll just wait till it’s more convenient. Good video sir 👍🏻
Edit: Well, I waited and recently ordered one from AliExpress for…are you ready for this- $180! I’m super stoked 😆
hello you can unscrew the chuck by using the indexing pin to block the shaft, and use the chuck key with a small hammer to unscrew it. be sure to make the chuck in vertical position and give for some days proper lubricant to help removing the chuck. sadly the chuck plate is put in force, even by unscrewing screws i cannot unmount it...
i managed to open the chuck... don't know how to explain. i put the chuck on the shaft, put a nut inside the opening of the chuck so that it is in contact with the shaft and not the chuck, tigten a screw on the chuck with a nut. by screwing the screw, the nut is hold on the chuck, so the screw pushes on the nuts that is in contact with the shaft.. so the chuck plate gets out ! easly !
it really needed grease : there were burrs and no grease on the worm gear !
Chuck removal: can you get a strap wrench on the spindle or the index plate?
101 divisions: if the handle is sufficiently accurate radially, you could make a plate with multiple hole circles, either 34, 34, and 33 holes or 25, 25, 25, and 26 holes.
You need a mill with a universal table to spiral mill. I bought one from MSC back in the 1980's. They are nice. When I moved I sold it with the mill. I bought one again on Ebay for about $225.00 a few years ago. I switched out the original 5" chuck for a 5" chuck that had bolt on top jaws. I have no complaints. I sold my L&W index head with a 6" chuck, because this one is lighter and a 5" chuck allows you to get in closer to the chuck/center with the spindle.
For sure. I have a set up that gears the table leadscrew to the mill but this diving head is a little small for heavy duty helical milling. Cheers
If you have enough room and you don't mind ruining the bolts that hold the chuck to the backplate a small pipe wrench could loosen the bolts.
You get what you pay for, but with careful setup you can do great work on it. Not heavy duty boss crashed ours and cracked frame but we were able to weld it up . But he tried to index a 8 inch dia backing pusher and got in a hurry and hogged the part and bang. I would buy one they are well made for the price. For home machinist they are fine. You could save money and build a Gingry index head yourself. His series of books are very interesting.
Do you nave a piece of hex stock, or a big (1/2") or more Allan key? With the hex stock I would bed it 90 degree with one leg long enough to go past the depth of the chuck jaws, tighten the jaws up really well, clamp the head down tight and try loosening the chuck with the new "handle". Still will not move? Use a piece of pipe as a cheater for more leverage, hit the end of the handle with a lead hammer, etc. A strange thought crossed my mind... could some fool at the factory have Loctited it in? A very weird idea, but not impossible.
The first piece you found looks like maybe it is for allowing you too use two stops for offset/different divisions.
In order to do a 101 divisions you would need a universal differential dividing head. the setup would need to be as follows
index circle hole pattern 20
number of turns on the crank 8/20th
graduations on the sector 78
gear on worm 72
first gear on stud 24
second gear on stud 40
gear on spindle 48
idle gear on no 2 hole 24
not sure if you actually wanted or needed to know this, but if you did I hope it helped.
I appreciate you writing it out, thankyou. I'm sure there are many methods, someone else suggested making custom dividing plates. I have seen CNC controlled dividing heads also work pretty well. Cheers
@@artisanmakes
it is absolutely possible to make custom plates to improve and increase your division capabilities, however making a plate with correct number of holes for 101 divisions would be vey difficult if not impossible as there is no whole fraction of 101. (although peoples ingenuity always seems to surprise me to the solutions they find to problems, I have been proven wrong before.)
CNC is definitely an option, I work a lot with CNC and and this would be easy.
Vevor are the best for hobby machining. I personally bought over 3k euros worth of stuff. Max 2 weeks every package arrives in good or perfect conditions.
Never had issues.
Hope you will trust them 😁
I bought the exact same one, but it came with a 41-tooth gear instead of the correct 40-tooth one. I discovered this 5 minutes after unpacking when I tried cranking it thru a single chuck rotation. The seller was understandably incredulous so I had to disassemble it and send them photos. It took a while but they eventually sent me a new 40-T gear which I swapped out myself. I suspect the factory cranked out a whole batch of these with the wrong gear on the spindle. It would be a terrific way for an ex-employee to exact revenge on his way out the door. Not a bad unit for the price, but don't expect the quality of a USA-made equivalent. It's perfect for a home shop.
That is a collector's museum piece😂
You did well to spot that error.
The chuck backing plate is threaded on the shaft. Simply put your chuck key on on of the chuck drive holes and give it a smack with your hand to remove it off the right hand thread on the shaft. When you put the chuck back on there is a detent that you will feel click in and that will lock it in so there is no need to use a hammer to tighten it up. In addition, the hollow shaft is machined for a #2 Morse taper so if you have an adapter you can use collets in lieu of the chuck.
If a chuck I'd really tight on there is a risk of splitting/cracking the square chuck key drive sockets by outing sideways force on them with the key inserted. The recommended way is to clamp a piece of hex bar into the chuck jaws and use a spanner/wrench on the protruding end of the hex bar. No danger of damage that way.
Have the same. Getting the chuck off was childs play. It is just screwed on. In fact I sold the chuck already - without the back plate of cause. Have a 125 mm from my lathe what was a direct fit ... Quite convinient, can also use the 4 jaw from my lathe on it .No issues on my one also with the handle or its bracket. Works like a charm ... My one came also with a knurled nut for protecting the thread when the cuck is disconnected...
how about a cut short hex key? it is one of the quick and nasty solution i can think of. and if it fail, it is just one key, not that expensive to replace.
The faceplate is screwed onto the thread, it is enough to block the rotation of the spindle and unscrew the chuck together with the faceplate. Then the screws will be easily accessible for loosening.
This is correct, however the problem I really was having was that the backplate was so tightly torqued on that it was seized on to the threads. I eventually got it off, had to use a custom holding jig, impact driver and a wrench. Can not stress how tightly it was on. Cheers
Loosen the socket head bolts with a vise grip and then thread them out- replace them with hex head bolts or studs and nuts.
I purchased the same one. I used the chuck key in the square hole and a few wacks with a dead blow hammer loosened the chuck.
Re the chuck. I'm wondering if you can cut a small length off an Allen key to insert into the screw. Use the correct sized spanner on that bit of Allen key. Swap out of studs and nuts when done.
Keep up the good work 😃
Taking off the chuck gets him nowhere, the backing plate needs to be unthreaded in order to disassemble it and the chuck actually gives you something to gronk on.
Thankyou, I did try this, but the gap just isn't big enough for any useful amount of the hex head to poke through. Cheers
I just unpacked one and the chuck did not want to unscrew. Gentle hammering on the chuck key did not impress it. I disengaged the worm , bolted it down to a machine table, put hex bar in the chuck, put a spanner on that and heaved. Then I put a spanner on the spindle lock, overtightened it and heaved again. That was when it gave in. It does unscrew but you must not take no for an answer.
What is the runout like on the chuck? Most 3j have several thou of runout which I would not expect to be good enough to cut a gear
The one thing I care about is accuracy. So a test would need to include measurements.
When it comes to the bolts, rather than dismantling the entire thing, I'd undo the bolts with pliers and replace them with ordinary bolts so a wrench will do.
At the machine shop I work at our Tailstocks also have that two bolt adjustment and they are all REALLY wicked high dollar too! It seems really odd to me too that tail stocks for dividing heads and rotary tables generally have that clunky two-bolt on even the really expensive ones!
Replace the 2 individual nuts with a single rectangular piece of steel flat stock with the 2 thread holes tapped into it at correct centres. That makes the adjustment of tailstock height/angle much simple with only one spanner needed
To get the head off I believe you need to tighten the chuck down on a sizable bolt. At least 1". Then lock the head in place and turn the bolt counter-clockwise. Would use a large breaker bar. This video pretty much shows how to completely disassemble the unit. The link won't paste. Go to Bundy Bears Shed and find the video.
A large-ish piece of hex bar held in the chuck jaws and a wrench applied to the protruding end is even better method.
Use a vise-grip to unbolt and replace screws with bolts (with outer hex)?
That did occur to me, id rather try and get it removed without needing to destroy the bolts, but if it comes to that, that might be a really good idea. Cheers.
Chuck needs to STAY bolted to the backplate, so that it can be unscrewed. Removing the chuck just makes it more difficult to unscrew.
i have used a 3/4" air impact to break loose these things do not lock the chuck the shock from the impact will break it loose use some type of hex in the chuck to be able to use the impact with a socket
I did eventually get is unscrewed, using some advice I got here. Combination of an impact driver, a clamping jig and a wrench. Just amazing how tightly this was torqued on. Thankfully no damage to the tool. cheers
I bought one. Took it apart, cleaned, oiled and adjusted for backlash.
Nice unit . I paid $220 with free shipping.
Good stuff, my one certainly needed a clean though. Cheers
What's the runout on the 3-jaw chuck?
Most times tapping the chuck wrench with a light bronze hammer will unscrew the chuck .
The run out was about 80 microns out of the box, I played around with the preload of the spindle bearings and got it down to about 30 microns. Cheers
1:00 "If the box is correct" 😂 He's already suspicious of how much trouble he's in😅
could a torque multiplier pull the main nut that was holding up your progress?
my lathe is a vevor brand, its been pretty good for me so far only issue being the crap tail stock they come with, seems like an issue for everyone and the chuck plexi glass guard was broken when i open the crate, but i will give them credit cause when i contacted them about getting a replacement all they asked for was pictures of the broken guard an proof of purchase an they sent it, took about 2 weeks to come an it was alot better packaged than the lathe its self, it came with a bunch of stuff that was there own boxes but they was left loose in the crate an thats what got the plexiglass guard.
In fact, on Taobao in China, you can buy a 4-inch Dividing head for US$200, which is true. But if it is sold outside of China, That is impossible. the shipping cost will be higher than the price of the product. The fees charged by foreign trade sales websites and the cost of currency exchange rate losses are 20% of the total price + shipping.
To be honest, I have never used Taobao, I am more familiar with Aliexpress. It is true that shipping and such are expensive for heavy items from China, but I was lucky since the distributor has a local warehouse, so the shipping was free. Cheers
Stick it in freezer overnight. Take out, cover base of head with insulation(towels, foam, space blanket). Allow chuck to warm a bit. Insert long bar into chuck across the face. Use timing belt or oil filter belt wrench around spindle gear. Wack bar Counterclockwise until it breaks or you break.
I bought what looks like the exact same rig from eBay. That was in October 2020, and I paid $228US shipped (though my piratical state sticks me with sales tax on top of that). I just looked at the listing (Dec. 2021) on eBay, same vendor. It's now $999! Ouch.
I was particularly interested since the chuck thread is the same as my old Logan lathe, and I needed a decent 5 or 6 inch chuck for that; price of a chuck+backplate is pretty damn close to the price for this whole unit, so I figured the risk was small even if the head turned out to be landfill. I've used the chuck on the lathe, and it's working well. I don't see any runout, and that's close enough for anything I'm making.
But damn, that chuck was on there tight. Nothing in the minimalist instructions about locking pins or novelty threads, it's a conventional 1.5-8 thread but just too damn tight. I don't recall exactly how I got it off - it must have been such a horrific experience that my mind just blacked it out. Or maybe my age is showing. I'm pretty sure I put a piece of wood against one of the jaws and tapped the wood with one of my calibrated precision hammers. I locked the spindle by tightening the clamp screw to what must have been damn close to the yield strength of the metal; I don't think I used the direct index pin to lock it, as I didn't want to risk bending it, but I don't recall for sure. But in the end my hammers must have done the job.
I have the bs-1 version of this. I had to take it completely apart to deburr everything and completely remove the excessive amount of grit it contained. Then I relubed and adjusted everything. Made another index plate on my rotary table to expand the number of gears it can cut. Bundybears workshop channel shows a complete tear down.
The channel is Bundy Bears Shed. th-cam.com/video/4pZxH3NuLHY/w-d-xo.html
Did the same, a lot more grit that I would have expected, glad I did it sooner than later. Cheers
And these cheap import heads are excellent once they have been given the clean out and refit with care treatment. I have a BS-0...very pleased with it.
If it’s like most others, the back plate unscrews from the shaft . which has a taper for a center
Pinned comment - EDIT 2: Thankyou to all the suggestions, and I have finally gotten the backplate off the spindle. Ill make a quick update video, but to cut to the chase, I needed a fixture to stop the spindle from rotating, penetrating oil, an impact driver and a spanner for leverage. I really can not stress how tightly it was torqued on. No Damage to the threads, should be good to go. Cheers
You can not press that out. You use the direct indexing pin to lock it, and dead blow hammer on the chuck key to unseat the threaded backplate.
I eventually had to make a jig to hold it to unscrew it, it was very much sized on
Pinned comment - EDIT 2: Thankyou to all the suggestions, and I have finally gotten the backplate off the spindle. Ill make a quick update video, but to cut to the chase, I needed a fixture to stop the spindle from rotating, penetrating oil, an impact driver and a spanner for leverage. I really can not stress how tightly it was torqued on. No Damage to the threads, should be good to go. Cheers
I have that same dividing head, I never took the back plate off, but mine had hex bolts holding the chuck on luckily. If you can't get them out with vise grips or channel locks I'd cut the bolt heads off and replace them with some hex bolts cause the 5" chuck is great on the lathe too. But you can't put new bolts in the back plate with the dividing plate in the way either. Mine has the bolts sitting in it still. Which I guess is great cause I can't lose them. Not so great though if you actually want to change them.
And I put loctited studs in the chuck so I have to get those bolts out of there too. Am following to see what solutions yall come up with to get the back plate off there. I probably would have reefed on it a bit not knowing there was a bronze gear on the spindle. Thanks for the video
Could you give us a quick tour of your workshop?
i'm thinking about getting one of these and this helps.
funny thing, it was cheaper to spend 1,000 for a lathe than it was to have 7 parts made. i have the parts, and the lathe and saved about 1500 dollars. i think the set up for the company was about 50, and then 90 per hour, they gave me an estimate of 3100 dollars.
Neat, best part is you have all the machinery left around afterwards for future parts.
could you please do a follow up if you get the chuck off
I have gotten the chuck off, required a fixture, impact driver and spanner. I can not stress how tightly it was on, though no damage thankfully. I will certainly do a follow up. Cheers.
Vevor does make decent vises. I have the knock off urt 6in single and two two-station vises.
That said they cut corners where it really doesnt matter. My handles were all trash
The chuck can be removed with dynamite. Works for me every time.
You could probably get those chuck hex bolts out with something like a knipex plier, and replacthem with a hex headed bolt
File the bolt heads down to get a spanner on them, and then replace bolts with hex head bolts 👌
Good score ! just a note they have a screw on back plate
What if you lock in the direct indexing pin and then put a large hex key in the chuck and give it a good tap.
I have thought about this, just concerned about damaging it or the plate. I might be over thinking it but I am not sure. Cheers
@@artisanmakes Locking the index pin is the correct operation (along with the spindle lock.) You could make a long metal tool with two pins that engage the holes in the index plate to help give you leverage and avoid the possibility of damaging the indexing pin, but I'm pretty sure the plate is going to come off without breaking anything if you just lock it with the pin. Use a soft dead blow hammer if you need to. It isn't reversed threads or anything.
Oh, what the heck... I will order the same one... I have been wanting one for a long time and the cost was holding me back...
Artisan Makes, you quite rightly mention further down in the comments that the smaller heads BS-0 and BS-1 are only semi universal as they are not equipped to be rotary driven by a train of back gears and therefore cannot produce helical gears or splines. This can be overcome on the semi universal heads by the addition of an electronic stepper motor and rotary encoder drive. There are a few others who have done this very successfully.
Also the annoying issue with trying to juggle 2 spanners to adjust the pair of tailstock nuts and bolts can be greatly improved by replacing the 2 individual nuts with a rectangular piece of steel flat stock with two threaded holes set at suitable centres.
I have one of these cheap import dividing head kits the same as yours and they can be made very reliable with a bit of fettling and adjustment...very happy with mine and still can't believe how they manage to sell these for that price.
Heya! Did you actually post a link to the one you bought? I took a quick look, and it felt like there were many many ways for me to get it wrong!? :)
Thanks for the vid - and followup. Great to see this sort of stuff torn down in advance of buying it!
The parts of the brass clamps that need to be machined are machined. The rest you machined didn’t need to be. It just makes it look a little bit nicer. Like everyone else said, it’s not bolted on. A parts list will show how this works.
You were t being scammed. The extra cost for shipping was added into the Vevor price, which made it just as high as the other would have been, or even a bit higher. $225 for this is a ridiculously low price. Here, in the USA, from eBay, these BS-0 models go for around $500, and that usually doesn’t include shipping
I might have been so clear, I know its not bolted on to the spindle, the problem is is that the backplate has been over torqued on at the factory and has sized onto the threads, and my problems stem from being unable to unscrew the backplate. And I did leave out a few things with regards to the seller, they refused to refund me and grave me someone elses tracking number when I tried to dispute. And the seller was someone impersonating vevor, and the seller is no longer on aliexpress (banned maybe), if they were I would have linked to it so you could avoid it. And it didnt make sense either, it was being sent locally, but they said I was in the wrong country. Having being burned on stuff like this before with aliexpress, I was not going to take this risk. cheers
And yeah, the brass didn't need that facing, but the rough surface really stuck out, looks a lot better now.
@@artisanmakes no problem. Without that info though, it was hard to make a judgement from here though. Glad you cleared it up.
I discovered VeVor a few months ago, and i have bought many items and are good for the home hobbyist.
The Dividing head i got was the HV4 for £109 Bargain as it is well made.
as for those cap head screws, when ever i get a problem like you i get a 2 or 3mm drill bit and drill through the side of then and insert a round bar and turn.
or as suggested, if they are loose enough then try a pair of grips first.
when they are out i do replace such with a Hex head bolt so i can use a spanner,
Put it in the vertical position, put a piece of stock, take a cut and it will come loose, mine came unscrewed on a horizontal cut. It’s actually just screwed in.
I know it's screwed on, point was it's just over torqued and it's sized in place. Cheers
I got one of these years ago.. still new in the box. Thought I'd use it and never did. (no problem with chuck though)
get some mole/vice grips clamp them tightly on the cap heads then tap them with a hammer hopefully they will come loose. but i dont know if there is enough space for you to be able to pull them out fully but hopefully there is enough to get the chuck off.
then if you do get it off id replace them with hex head bolts so it will be easier in the future.
NO NO NO - the check needs to stay bolted to the backplate so that you have some way to rotate the backplate and unscrew it.
Would this be useable 0n a Pm728vt?
Great tip, I’ll get me one of these. Always assumed they would be out of my budget …
yeah man if that is a friction fit. press, or a frog if you can. to prevent shit from getting scratched heat up wherever you end up securing it on the press, and keep the heat away from the part you decide to press on. so at work we use an oxy propylene torch, but even a small propane torch will help. put the work under pressure, then apply heat, be sure to apply it quickly and after maybe 30 seconds of evenly heating, start to press further. itll hopefully come out nice and smooth. I tear apart industrial machinery as the day job, and things tend to make very loud bang noises when they come free when they are rusty or dirty. something small and new should be easy, im imagining only a few thousandths shrink. When you put it back together put some never seize of your choice on the shaft, just a tiny layer. heat up what your going to get back one either hot enough to just slide it on with gravity and finese or heat up a tiny amount make sure its lined up very well and press it back on as soon as its hot enough. micrometers and snap gauges will be your friend.
NO NO NO - the chuck's backplate screws on. Read the comments, he already removed it.
Enjoy your videos and look forward to them. Im new to machining and you have sold me on a dividing head, i have a question though, you have purchased a BS-0 and the larger BS-1 is only $70 more, is there any reason you didn't go for the BS-1? or is the BS-0 the better unit? many thanks.
As i understand it they offer the same abilities, just bs1 is bigger. As it is, bs 0 is big enough for my machine and what I need so I bought that. Bs 2 and 3 however are slightly different as they are universal dividing heads and can do gear hobbing, whilst these can not.
Nice thank you, can you get a 4 jaw chuck for it? You might also consider making a round plate with T slots and a lock to stop it spinning off when in the vertical position?
Yes, many of the Chinese made or the Indian made 4 jaw chucks are available with the same threads in the backplate. I have a 4 jaw that fits mine which I purchased separately.
Can you post the site where you bought this dividing head?
Aliexpress and the vendor was vevor
To everyone bitching about the price, would YOU set up a shop and build this dividing head to your high expectations for $200?
Yeah, just what I thought...
I've owned one of these cheap import heads for about 3 years and had excellent service from it making spines and cutting gears. The usual to be expected strip down and re-fettle is essential to get the best from these cheap heads but once set up properly they work exceptionally well. I don't know how they manage to sell such a complete kit for the price. Very happy with mine👌
Question for you mate, would you be able to make some spur gear for a rc car ?
Depends what module. Not an area i know a lot about, but don't people 3d print them?
I bought one of these Chinese knockoffs of the brown and sharp - 0 Dividing head. I got mine off of ebay from a private seller for $120 dollars which included the shipping cost which was a pretty good deal. Mine had been dropped so the mechanism was frozen up because the internal clamp got bent when the tightening bolt struck something.
The back plate on the chuck is bolted very tightly to the 5" 3 jaw chuck but it's threaded onto the shaft that goes through the dividing head and I was able to unscrew the chuck backplate from the shaft without much problem. It's a right hand thread so turning the chuck counter clockwise from the front will unscrew it. As you mentioned this needs to come off because in order to extract the shaft out of the front of the housing there are three cap head screw you need to get to.
Regarding the backlash in the gears and precision gear cutting using the dividing plates, the most expensive dividing heads will always have some backlash so when rotating the locating pin one must ALWAYS come from the same direction when rotating and slipping into the hole. If you go past the hole you wish to land in you need to backup and try again thus eliminating the backlash and it doesn't matter whether you're using the cheap ones or the most expensive ones.
The only real disappointment I've had with the head is that you cannot cut as many gear tooth variations as you can with some of the more elaborate bs models. For example I need a 57 tooth gear and this head won't do it.
Just ordered this exact dividing head.
I am thinking of buying this one , looking at your video now , thx, what do you all think for the best way to make an keyway in a gear ?
If you are only cutting a keyway seldom, chuck the gear in your lathe - make a tool bit to make the keyway, and use the carriage back and forth to cut a slot in the gear. Otherwise you need some kind of a slotting tool/machine
For a one-off, use a vice, a hacksaw blade and a file.
Exactly how much did it cost shipped to your door?
Shipping was included in the price so with tax $210 USD
hi . you showed a ring cover at the start. for the shaft.. ok so bolt the gear head to table. then put a ratchet strap around the chuck and pull .. ?? have fun till next time .. tone uk
Only problem is the spindle lock is so weak that it slips easily. That's the biggest issue I'm running into. Cheers
not easy to get scammed on aliexpress , unlike for example ebay , aliexpress has a great refund policy
I need a dividing head. But how can i buy that.
Of course do your due diligence on the specific model, but I bought this one from vevor on aliexpress.
I have been eyeballing these on Amazon. My mill is cheap, Ecno 30 and absolutely not production shop quality. I got it and about $1,500 worth of Japanese and Swiss cutters for $400. It was a basket case of work like new hand wheels, new quills and rework of the top cover and depth gauge ect. But it was what I could afford and does fulfill my needs. Locked down, it'll cut true enough for me, I'm not outsourced by Boeing or Lockheed, I'm not making aerospace quality parts.
Sure I'd love a $5,000 used Bridgeport but that's later. This works for my garage.
I need to cut a very specific set of rollers with 1/4" pyramidal teeth for a very specific and unique machine I'm making, specs don't have to be to the tenth of a thou. A knurling tool isn't going to do this. So this tool is what I'm after but I've held off for worry it might be a bit too cheap for what it's supposed to do.
Now I know what to expect. I think I'll nab one. Thank you.
Where did you buy it, and what did you pay for freight?
I bought it from the Vevor store on AliExpress. Freight was included for "free" as it was shipped from a local warehouse
I live in NZ but Aliexpress will only let me buy from Chinese stores.
It confuses me why people won't watch the video... all the information was included there.
Were did you get it for that price? best I can find is Amazon for 307
I used AliExpress and the seller vevor
This mod e l is the "BS"-0
I haven't seen an inuendo like that since Robocop's 6000 SUX
BS stands for Brown & Sharpe, the people who invented this specific design, widely copied and old enough that patents no longer apply.
Looks like these have gone up a bit. The price is $462NZ. Plus another $460 to ship it here. Over $900 is far too high so now I'm looking for videos of people who have made them in the shop...
Buy it from a seller who has stock in New Zealand. DOH.
It had to be easily assembled during manufacturing or it couldn't be sold for such a low price. We are missing something here.
The chuck's backplate is screwed onto the spindle. Read other comments, he has already removed it.
Use plyers to attack the cap head bolts from the side