Been watching your channel on and off for a while. TBH, I totally saw this coming. You're one of the most high-church Methodists I've ever seen. Given your emphasis on liturgy and tradition alongside the UMC's precipitous decline into theological liberalism and progressivism, this seems like a natural move for you. God bless you and your congregation.
As an Episcopalian under the Anglican umbrella, I concur with your favorable view of bishops in the apostolic succession. When our tiny parish encountered what seemed to be insurmountable problems, we turned to our bishop as a last resort, & have been pleasantly surprised at the vast resources he put at our disposal!
Congratulations on making a decision you are happy with. We are currently about to become Anglican, but most likely will join the continuing Anglican group.
16:36 "Anglicanism is the indigenous form of Christianity for the English speaking peoples." Exactly so, and why I identify not just as a Nazarene (though I am a Nazarene) but as a "prayer book Christian." As always, I appreciate your clear explanation as well as your generosity of spirit.
Love from a Lutheran, and long-time viewer. Due to the state of the ELCA, though I remain theologically Lutheran, I've been out of the Lutheran Church for a few years, going instead to my families' (Global) Methodist Church. Moving from Lutheranism, you helped me more than anyone to reconcile many of my misconceptions about the Wesleyan tradition. It is a shame that you need to move, but I have incredible respect for the ACNA, and I know that you will flourish, and God willing, the Anglicans will certainly benefit from having you in their theological collective. You have my prayers, and God bless you!
Hello from England, very inspiring listening to your journey to the Anglicanism. I have been an Anglican all my life my mothers side of the family were from the Methodist tradition all of whom subsequently converted to the Church of England, so I was taken to the Methodist church too as a child . I truly hope in the future we can reunite as one.
Also praying for Communion and unity between the Anglicans and Global Methodist Church, as well as brotherly love and fellowship for the whole Church Catholic.
Yeah, I honestly don’t see much of a reason for the two to be separate or not at least partner extensively except that there could be more issues with women’s ordination.
With most ACNA not recognizing women’s ordination-and this is becoming a hotter debate within Anglicanism-I cannot see most Anglicans adhering to inter-communion with a denomination that ordains women as elders and bishops.
Welcome, I pray your move will be fruitful and may you be able to serve faithfully and be at peace. Cs Lewis on the table behind you is a good start 😀. Sounds like the beginning of an exciting season for you.
God bless you in your discernment, wherever you end up. Of course, we'd love to have you in the ACNA, and I'd love to get a network - even informally - of Wesleyans connecting together.
I'm a fan brother! While I'd sure like to see your ranks with us in the Wesleyan Church, I'm happy that you are dedicated to the "Unity" of the body! I often find it a shame that we sometimes get so obsessed with the "little" divisions, that we cut off everyone else that is trying their best to serve the Lord. Thank you for this video, and ALL your videos. Wonderful, wonderful stuff!
Godspeed, brother. I watched your channel for a while. Not surprised with your decision. Just keep in step with the Spirit and not so much a form or structure.
Your reasoning is similar to mine when I left the UMC to become an Anglo-Catholic nearly 30 years ago. When I was growing up in the 1960s and 1970s, our quarterly communion service was still the one bequeathed to us by John Wesley, which was a slightly abridged version of the service of Holy Communion in the 1662 Book of Common Prayer. So, the Rite 1 service in the 1979 BCP felt very familiar, often identical word-for-word with the old Methodist communion service. But quarterly - or even monthly - communion seemed insufficient - especially in light of the fact that Wesley himself managed to receive communion twice a week, on average. So, my move to the Episcopal Church felt like I was being true to my Methodist/Wesleyan upbringing. During my dozen years as an Anglo-Catholic, I managed to receive communion twice weekly, like Wesley. But, when Anglicanism began to disintegrate in the early 2000s, my move to Orthodoxy drew on similar reasoning. John and Charles Wesley were Greek scholars at Oxford, and their theology was heavily influenced by the Greek Fathers. When an Orthodox friend would pose statements of the form, "Protestants believe X, Orthodox believe Y", in every case I as a Methodist had been taught Y, not X. The fact that you are being ordained as an Anglican while continuing to serve a church that is not Anglican seems odd to me. It would seem to imply that your ordination is a personal relationship between you and the bishop, rather than an ecclesial relationship with the Anglican Communion - or even with the bishop's diocese. I'm having trouble imagining an ecclesiology within which that makes sense.
I think the expiration date on denominations is passed. In my opinion its all about fidelity to scripture and resisting radical hermeneutics, critical theories and hegelian dialectics from influencing practise.
I stumbled across this video this morning. Although never officially Wesleyan (I have too many issues with Wesley's doctrines of sanctification/perfectionism and exaltation of experience to a concerning degree), I attended a Wesleyan church with my wife before we left to convert to confessional Lutheranism. One of the things, ironically, which was instrumental in our conversion to Lutheranism was reading Wesley's view of the sacraments and of confession and absolution: if you read Wesley himself, he sounds far more like Martin Luther concerning baptism and the Lord's Supper than he does the modern Wesleyan church. I suspect that a great number of people in United Methodist, Free Methodist, and Nazarene churches do not know that Wesley himself would not approve of their modernist takes on the sacraments and on confession and absolution.
Welcome to the ACNA! My husband was a UMC elder for about 20 years and 10 years ago left the UMC and went thru the same process as you are embarking on. We are home and loving the sacramental life of Anglicanism with the historic tradition, Daily Office, the fabulous hymnody, incense, icons, etc. He planted a parish 4 years ago in the Northwest and our congregation is growing so that we just brought on a new priest. The Lord bless the next step in your ministry.
You've inspired me for a long time, and I have some questions about ordination both in the Methodist and Anglican contexts. Is there another social media I should message you on? If you wouldn't mind taking a stab at my question.
God bless you on your journey, Daniel. Lots of comments on this one! I'm glad you're facilitating the conversation. I had sorta been hoping you would be a voice in the GMC advocating for liturgy and good order. We need a counterbalance to th extremes of those pushing for unchecked emotionalism. I do wish you had spent some time answering the concerns of those who have the understanding that you will now be part of a denomination that has iterations in America and Great Britain that are so vehemently liberal in their theology. Perhaps it is too difficult to suss out here, but in what sense are you tied to the Episcopal Church? Aren't you all tied to the Archbishop of Canterbury in some sense?
Great to hear from you. Hopefully I'll still contribute in some ways to discussions among GMC Methodists, since I know many do follow me (and I make comments on some GMC aligned FB groups too). As to the relationship with the Episcopal Church and the Archbishop of Canterbury the ACNA has no formal relationship at all. In the very early days the ACNA had indicated an interest in a relationship with the CofE and Canterbury, but since Welby has chosen to push for a revisionist agenda (to the surprise of many since he was thought to be an evangelical at the time he was elected), the ACNA is now working with Anglican provinces around the world (representing some 70 or 80% of all of the Anglican Communion) to "realign" the structures of the Communion in a way that basically ignores Canterbury and the revisionist provinces (until such time as they repent) but gathers Biblically faithful provinces, and perhaps even dioceses and parishes that remain in places like England, into a new world-wide covenant (called the Cairo Covenant that GAFCON and the Global South Anglicans have been putting together) that will really be the "mainstream" of Anglicanism going forward, especially as the liberal provinces continue to dwindle at an accelerated rate. This work is already well underway, and I believe there is a good understanding that there has to be mutual accountability on matters of faith and order and theological teaching in a way that has not happened in the past.
@@danielhixon8209 Thanks for taking the time to write that out. Part of me wants to argue that the ACNA, if it isn't connected to Canterbury, is as schismatic as the GMC. I wouldn't die on that hill, though. I reckon Calvin Robinson is part of these efforts to realign the Anglican Church. It is an exciting prospect. I would like to see the GMC similarly unite a lot of Methodist denominations under our umbrella and reclaim what was lost. Hey, if you know of anyone in the ACNA who is really strong in charismatic ministry, hook a brother up. I'm personally interested in platforming people who can represent high liturgy and the charisma of the Holy Ghost.
If I remember my history correctly the Methodist Church was in talks with the Episcopal Church in the late 19th or early 20th century regarding merging. The sticking point was not recognizing our apostolic ordination and the need to be re-ordained. That would keep me from joining the Anglican Church as an ordained Elder.
My husband was a UMC elder and went thru the Anglican ordination process. He said that he got another master’s degree with all of the reading he did in preparation. It was necessary as he studied very little of the English Reformation and theology in seminary (Princeton). I am concerned with folks coming in from other traditions as we want the Anglican tradition preserved.
I was reading lately about George Whitefield and the Welsh Methodists. Do you know any Calvinistic Methodist writers? Do you have any book to recommend? Are there Calvinists in Methodist Churches nowadays? I know in the past there were United Churches (Presbyterian-Methodists).
I've heard that there are still some Calvinist Methodists around - in the British Isles I think - but (sadly) don't know much of anything about them. I think Whitefield's own observation late in life was that the Wesley's organized their followers into groups in a way that he did not, so there was much more "staying power" for Wesleyan Methodism, so much so that the two terms are widely seen as synonymous these days.
Yes, Anglicanism has a variety of approaches to soteriology ranging from strict Calvinists, to "moderate Calvinists" that believe in "hypothetical universalism" (which is just a bit closer to the Wesleyan view), to folks who hold something closer to a Lutheran soteriology, to Wesleyans, to Anglo-Catholics. All of these folks have differences with one another, but the main thing (as I see it) is that we can in good conscience affirm the Articles of Religion and other formularies - including the Article on Predestination. The Articles were written with an eye toward also being acceptable (as far as possible) to both Calvinists and Lutherans, and so they do pass over certain debated points in silence. So Wesleyans can affirm the Article on Predestination since it does not actually affirm Double-Predestination or Limited Atonement (nor does it say whether election is conditional or unconditional which is a sticking point for some Wesleyans, though I'm OK with a bit more mystery around this point). In fact, as I see it, it would actually be harder to affirm some of the things the prayerbook says that seem clearly to affirm Universal Atonement if I actually was a strict 5-point Calvinist.
Very strong evidence that Shakespeare was Roman Catholic, just as Chaucer was. And the native religion of England, the British Isles and Ireland was Roman Catholicism-simple review of history. All that being said, praise God that He is leading you in the right direction.
The problem with the Bride of Christ is that it is full of only sinners. I still proclaim that" I believe in one Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church . "
This appears to be what's referred to as the ecumenical movement, a unification of all the denominations. It appears then, that many would regard the Eastern Orthodox or the Catholic to be the original church, because they are the oldest, and do claim to hold the Apostolic succession of the original Apostles. So why would one believe the Catholic or Eastern Orthodox is the true and original church? Because it goes back the farthest and is the oldest? None of these, whether a new denomination that started in this present generation or the one that's supposedly the oldest is nether here nor their. All the large mainline denominations claim they are the true church of God on the earth today. The leadership of the 7th day Adventist say they are because they obey God by keeping the Sabbath, not working on Saturday, while the others don't, of which are of the Beast, because the Catholic church changed the Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday centuries ago. Joseph Smith and the Mormons say they are the true and restored church, while many Mormons have left the church citing many reasons why Joseph Smith is a false prophet. Same with Jehovah's Witness and Catholic. The church of England started with Henry the 8th, separating from the Catholic church, claiming he is the leader of the church of God now, not the pope. None of them have any credibility. There is obviously true believers of the regular people who attend their religious services, because every person has a measure of faith, that's why they go to church, while any number of the leadership only live off their labor every week. One really has to know who the true pastors and Shepard's are, and the ones who are not. Anybody can quote the scripture.
First - welcome. Secondly, the view of the Holy Eucharist has differences between contemporary Methodism and Anglicanism. How are you reconciling that?
My view of the Eucharist is that of the Articles of Religion and the liturgy. Identical wording between Methodist and Anglican articles and nearly identical wording in the Eucharistic prayer as well.
@danielhixon8209 Great stuff. I, BTW, am ordained in the Old Catholic patrimony, which has devolved into as much flakiness as has the UMC, and I am also looking into joining ranks with the ACNA.
Hey, I am a Nazarene who has considered joining ACNA before. However, what holds me back is my position on ordaining women. How do you reconcile this as a Methodist?
The ordination of women is a "hot topic" in the ACNA: some dioceses ordain women presbyters/priests, and others do not. Same with deacons. I am perfectly OK with this current "mixed" practice, which is a reflection of the larger Anglican Communion as a whole. Certainly, a case can be made both for or against any of these practices from the Bible, but personally I think there is a stronger case for women deacons if you are simply working from Scripture and Tradition. But since you are asking how a Methodist can approach this, I note that Wesley never said he approved of the ordination of women, nor did he personally ordain women, nor did the Methodist Episcopal Church that he helped launch ordain women for well over a century. I believe there are to this day Wesleyan denominations that both do and do not ordain women (and God bless them all); so as far as I can see there is nothing about being Wesleyan that necessarily takes a side one way or the other on this issue. But for me this is not an issue that I am care to argue about, or leave (or join) a church over (and I've happily been a part of churches with different approaches on this question).
John Wesley and those of his time would not have endorsed ordaining women to the priesthood, as ACNA does. That is an innovation they would not have countenanced, and it does not nurture unity. Wish you had come to us Anglicans in the G3 first. Hoping to see you with us sometime in the future. Prayers for you and your family.
Wesley ordained women to preach. Sarah Crosby is the name of the first one. He couldn't ordain women to be priests/ministers because he was still in the church of England at that time, but we know from his writings that he was what we would now call a feminist
@@peterjermey7235 Wesley LICENSED a few women to preach. He did not ORDAIN women to the priesthood, because he could not. Wesley was dead when a few Methodist churches began ordaining women. Throughout his life and ministry, Wesley was an "innovator," often choosing his own interpretation of Scripture over everyone else's, which caused his brother Charles Wesley, also an Anglican minister, a great deal of stress. Wesley and other evangelical preachers set many American Christians on the road to today's "my beliefs are based on my personal relationship with Jesus and the Holy Spirit." That's how we've come to the point where people claim the Holy Spirit has told them gay marriage is good, while at the same time other people say the Holy Spirit told them the opposite. Bad things happen when we follow the innovations of our minds instead of the triple legged stool of Scripture, Reason and Tradition.
@@peterjermey7235, you are mistaken. Wesley never "ordained" any women. He did approve women preaching as an "extra-ordinary" calling, though. He did "ordain" others as elders for the Methodists in North America, and, eventually, for England. He remained a member of and a priest in the Church of England until his death. The approving to preach is a big step, but it is not the same thing as ordaining.
@@toddstepp5545 Wesley was very much a feminist. You are right in the sense that he didn't make any woman a priest in the church of England, but he had no power to do that. He absolutely supported women as the equal of men in both secular and religious roles
@@peterjermey7235, you are not understanding what I am saying. He absolutely did ordain presbyters among the Methodists, even though he remained in the Church of England. He absolutely did not ordain any women. That is the point. It is not that he didn't ordain any women, because he had no power to do so. He believed himself to have power to ordain for the Methodists, and he did so. He just did not ordain any women. - What he did do was allow women to preach. That was an extraordinary thing to do, at the time. In this way, he supported women in ministry. It is an outgrowth of this support that helped to move Wesleyans, after him, to ordain women. - So, absolutely, he supported gifted and called women preaching. But among all that he did ordain, he did not ordain any women.
The ACNA is derived from the Church of England, but not the same organization, nor currently in fellowship with it. We are in fellowship with the Free Church of England.
I'm praying for you! Once you help repair the rupture from early Methodism, then maybe you may see yourself walking all the way back to the Church Fathers towards Rome via the Ordinariate! Speaking as a cradle Catholic in the Ordinariate, our liturgy is very Anglican, and our hymnal is replete with the hymns of Wesley. The Ordinariate is staying clear of a lot of the recent foolishness coming from the Holy See and Canterbury at this time. Sound teaching looks bleak at this time from Rome and Canterbury, but, 'this too shall pass.' I believe one of the remnants Our Lord is raising up is the Ordinariate in Houston, which is providentially dedicated to 'the Chair of St. Peter.' Good luck in your spiritual travels!
I was hoping that you would have at least mentioned the authority of the Holy Scriptures. Hierarchal, corporate ecclesiastical order and clergy collars may make one feel and look religious ,but are poor substitutes for Jesus the Christ. That's why left the UMC in 1981. I needed to know if God did exist. He does, and I found Him after I left the UMC.
100 years ago it was hard on my grandfather family leaving Methodist ,john wesley was so influential its the elder son name proper. But Methodist and Anglican has only gotten worse on the factors why they left. American 1900s structuralism and the 80 year march into globalism specifically took away locals abilities to be patreons of church, our measure of faith & participation was in the sciences ,college's, Archeology, ,hosting community events like fairs. College's bowl games championships ,feeding the poor and finding ways to bring different classes together.
This is about to change obviously the Smith_Mundt act in 1940s that redefined what American seperation of church and state meant to self sacrifice out fear of marxist indoctrination which happened anyways and only hurt Christians removing prayer & God. Taking away the puritan classical American Christians way of life.
I always thought Anglicanism was inherently Calvinist, so going from Methodism to Anglicanism did you have to “switch”? I understand Wesley obviously was not a Calvinist, but it seems like most pop level Anglicanism is. Have you found this to be the case?
I think one other commenter asked this. There are actually several approaches to soteriology within Anglicanism today, and my impression (anecdotal, of course) is that what I call Calvinism is a minority position. The Anglican Church does have an article on Predestination (which John Wesley said he affirmed) and I guess for this reason people assume Anglicanism is Calvinist. Of course people do not always mean exactly the same thing when using the words "Calvinist" or "Reformed." I take "Calvinist" to mean "TULIP." But the Anglican Article does not affirm TULIP. Nor does it deny it. It affirms Predestination along Biblical lines, but does not nail down the actual controverted issues between Wesleyans and Calvinists: it does not address whether Atonement is Limited (as in TULIP) or Universal (as in Wesleyanism - though I note, the Prayerbook appears to affirm Universal atonement in numerous other places). The Article does not address whether Election is Conditional (as in Wesley's thought) or Unconditional (as in Calvinism). Nor does the Anglian Article actually teach Double Predestination (which Wesleyans reject). So, on all these points Wesleyans are quite at home (and have been for centuries) within Anglicanism.
An interesting choice, but one clearly influenced by location & familiarity, something you didn't reference. Not all leaving the UMC have active Anglican congregations around them, just as some don't have alternative Methodist/Wesleyan congregations to turn to. In some areas we are dominated by Southern Baptists and folks grow up without any knowledge of the Anglican church at all. Methodism came to our part of central Kentucky late in the 18th century but we've struggled over the generations to not be choked out by the Baptists (my own family established the first Methodist "class" in their new Kentucky home in 1783 from which Methodism extended into the interior of the state). We were saddened that our church lost its vote to disaffiliate, but thankful to find a nearby Methodist church who did leave and were determined to maintain their Methodist identity, eventually joining the GMC. Personally, that new denominational association means little. The UMC was never "Methodism" itself, and I'd have remained a traditional Methodist even without a local traditional Wesleyan congregation to feed & support me spiritually.
Yes, it is true that for some families leaving the UMC there will not be a good Anglican or GMC option close by for them to attend. In some cases, they may be able to find a solid Presbyterian or confessional Lutheran Church, but you are right that in many parts of "the Bible belt" the options are going to be Baptist or non-denominational-but-functionally-Baptist. This is a concern I have about former UMC churches that attempt to stay independent: that they will become Baptist by cultural osmosis. I already know of cases where churches, no longer being supplied a UMC pastor through the appointment process, hired a Baptist pastor and their church no longer practices a sacramental understanding of Baptism and Eucharist. I will say, one great thing about the Anglican tradition is that is fairly easy for a group of committed laity to start praying the Morning Prayer service or Evening Prayer service with some Bible discussion. All you need is a Bible and a Common Prayerbook, since those are the defining marks of the tradition. Of course it is a good idea to seek guidance from your nearest bishop. There may be church planting initiatives already underway that you don't know of.
From what I've heard regarding the UK Methodists Councils new 'guidelines' , over the God given terms Husband and Wife ..... there's no reason to explain 😮 I don't understand why Christians affiliate themselves with denominations . I'm a believer in Christ , and His finished work on the Cross . Christ plus nothing ❗ Have a Grace filled day 🇬🇧✝️♥️
Glad you're tired of being a schismatic and coming home... jk... kind of... all jokes aside, welcome to the ACNA. My Bishop is also Bishop Clark. He is a great fr in the faith.
I am a member of the Anglican Church in North America (ACNA), which is traditional. It is in fellowship with and recognized by various traditional Anglican Provinces (national churches) around the world, working together through a body called GAFCON. The GAFCON Provinces have a short faith statement called The Jerusalem Declaration that the ACNA affirms. You can read it online here (about halfway down the page): www.gafcon.org/resources/the-complete-jerusalem-statement-2008 We are not in fellowship with liberal Provinces, such as the Anglican Church of Canada, but stand as an alternative to them.
"i could launch a new denomination".... Just what Jesus wanted. 😢 Orthodox is your answer. Seek out Fr. Ed Meeks. Recently retired....went through the same process.
It saddens me when I hear people treat the church as it’s some kind of pick and mix, There are no denominations in Jesus Christ. Christ's true church has never been divided and never will be. It is made up of God's saints, His holy ones, sent and scattered around the world for the seed sowing of faith in Jesus Christ.
Obviously that is true in the modern sense; but I do think there is a sense in which the current broken state of the visible church is actually analogous to the situation in Ancient Israel after the death of Solomon when the Kingdom split into Northern and Southern kingdoms. Both were partial continuations of the original united kingdom, both continued to receive genuine prophets sent from God, but the outward and institutional division existed among God's covenant people for hundreds of years.
Yes. Methodists have always considered Anglican orders "valid" (insofar as Methodists worry about such things; sacramental "validity" has not played a major role in our theology - apart from requiring presbyters to consecrate the communion... as a general rule; but we have tended to focus more on the "fruits of the Spirit" as evidence that grace in indeed being shared with God's people). I am not aware that "valid orders" has played much role in the ecumenical discussions among various Methodist bodies, or between these and other groups, such as Presbyterians or Lutherans. In terms of the other ancient church bodies, some Eastern Orthodox jurisdictions have accepted Anglican orders in the past. The Church of Rome had mixed opinions till the pope rejected the validity of Anglican Orders in 'Apostolicae Curae.' Though officially infallible, there are numerous problems both of fact and argument with this document (you can devote a career to studying all the back and forth surrounding this), but even if it is accepted, due to ecumenical developments in the 20th century, virtually all Anglican bishops now have lines of succession that include the Old Catholic Church (some also include Eastern Orthodox lines) which Rome has always recognized, so that even Rome now says Anglican validity must be considered on a "case by case" basis.
What makes your Methodist ordination to the eldership invalid or illicit that you must be re-ordained? The ancient church would only count heretical clergy as unordained. If Methodists are a branch of the Catholic and apostolic church in the Anglican view, then why are Methodist elders not just received as clergy rather than being re-ordained? The ecclesial theology does not match the ministerial theology. One who is ordained is ordained. One doesn’t become unordained just because one is received into another branch of the church. Otherwise, ordination is merely an administrative, practical, human affair rather than holy order of being set apart for ministry by the Spirit, leaving an indelible mark on the person. In other words, just as baptism is one and unrepeatable, so is ordination. Unless Methodist orders are not real at all.
If I might reply: The ACNA does not dismiss Methodist orders as "invalid," as such. They would identify them as irregular in that they do not come via their understanding of episcopal apostolic succession. Therefore, while they would not sit in judgement of Methodist clergy serving in Methodist churches or other churches, if one is going to serve in an Anglican setting, they insist on ordination by apostolic succession (as they understand it). - Does that help? - For me, I would have a hard time with the idea of "re-ordination" unless they were willing to, at some point, use the language of "regularizing" my orders.
While I have some friends and colleagues in TEC that I really respect (including my own spiritual advisor and confessor, actually), I looked at TEC way back when I was in college, but saw that the direction of the church, the national leadership in particular, was heading in a direction that I (being fairly traditional in my beliefs) could not support.
Given what I know about Anglicanism, seems a lot like you jumped from the frying pan to the fire. Honestly? High Church Protestantism, as much as I do love it, is lost to the liberals because of who's family background is in these denominations. As much as I love the Smells and Bells, I think it's time to go back to basics.
The ACNA is a conservative Province formed by people who were dissatisfied with the revisionist direction of the Episcopal Church and the Anglican Church of Canada. You might think of it as analogous to the conservative confessional Lutheran (such as the LCMS or the AALC) and Presbyterian denominations (OPC, PCA). There is, in fact, a growing move to reclaim the classic Reformational traditions by returning them to their Bibles and historical doctrinal confessions & formularies. I believe this is a good thing.
@@danielhixon8209 As an Anglo-American myself, I'd actually be interested in something like that. I personally prefer the High Church liturgical tradition - I'm in Louisiana myself, as I believe in one of your other videos you said you were (I sorta went down a rabbit hole watching a lot of your stuff, having grown up Methodist and my family eventually leaving when I was small around the same time I decided to become Catholic I was just curious for your perspective) and would love to know where to look.
@@OGRamrod one of the reasons that the Anglican Church in North America was gathered (beginning with churches and even whole dioceses leaving the Episcopal Church) was to form a faithful, biblical, and historically orthodox Anglican province that could be in full fellowship with Anglicans around the world who are overwhelmingly Biblical and traditional. What part of the state are you in? We don't have many congregations in Louisiana as yet. There are a couple in Baton Rouge, one in Monroe, one or two in Shreveport, a couple in Lafayette, one in Covington, a couple in the NOLA area. I've also heard there is now one in the Lake Charles area. I know we also have a couple of churches discerning whether to join the ACNA and there are a couple of church plants in the works, I think. You could start with the "Church Finder" feature on the ACNA website (though it is not always fully up-to-date) anglicanchurch.net/find-a-congregation/ Some of these (Monroe, Metairie, maybe the one in Shreveport) are a bit more 'high church' than others. If you are close to Jena you could always come visit us at Nolley in Jena.
Secular history classes in the United States teach the Anglican church was founded by a English king that wanted to get a divorce but the holy Catholic church wouldn't let him.
Heart Broken- grew Up Methodist. Would only go to Internominational Church.. Or Strict Bible Based Church No Anglican or Methodist for Me… Unless they Free Churches.. God Bless you.. ✝️
“Go Orthodox” “go catholic” brother no. You obviously don’t understand what he believes or how Anglicans express our faith. We dont resonate with either of those other wise WE WOULD BE THEM!
I'm not big on making polemical videos about why other groups are wrong about this or that, but I definitely have non-superficial reasons why I would not go to Rome or to the East.
To be a Protestant is to be a cafeteria christian, picking and choosing what part of the faith you agree with. Essentially Creating a god that fits you. The fruit of splitting off the real church is constant splitting. This is why there continues to be so many new denominations. Come all the way home to the Church JESUS founded. The Catholic Church. The anglicans split off so a King could marry in adultery. A church founded on adultery. To read the Church fathers is to see Catholicism. Sins of man is no excuse to leave the whole of the faith. No other Church has Christ substantially present in the Eucharist. Come home. Build your faith on the Rock. Anything else is standing on shifting sand.
Anglicans *did not* split off so a King could marry in adultery... we finally removed the papacies control over our English Church and we Reformed our Catholic Orthodoxy. We were always Catholic, always Orthodox never Roman Catholic, never papist... our English faith was born pre-Constantinian, before Rome went Christian. Papal infallibility and Papal supremacy is not part of "the faith", the bishop of Rome had no universal jurisdiction in early Christianity, nor is there any reason way our national church, our English faith, ought to be under the papacies control. Be gone Papist!
Jesus said Peter I will build the church.give you the keys of gates of heaven, so Peter was the first pope ,and it has continued down the centuries, remember there no salvation outside.the true Roman Catholic faith .🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
Some of you in the Roman Church and the EO must copy each other’s rebuttals to Christians outside your tradition. You sound alike. It’s really tiresome, arrogant, and unchristian and nearly confirms why I’m not Roman or EO because Jesus said “you will know my disciples by their love for one another”. Please stop. Lord have mercy.
As of April 2023 there were 45,000 christian denominations. Jesus founded one church the Catholic church...you are Peter and upon this rock l will build my church.. singular. What a mess we are in !
I have always had respect for Anglicanism until The Arch Bishop of Canterbury started believing it s okay to ordain people living in sin. The Anglicand may go through the same things the United Methodist are going through.
Anglicanism is a split from the Catholic Church. If your logic is to attempt to mend a tear, in reality you are just going back to another tear that is 500 years old. The Church that Jesus founded is the Catholic Church-this is where the fullness of unity is found.
Anglicanism started with the Augustine mission to England. But since the reformation the church no longer recognises the Bishop of Rome as having authority in that church.
Wrong! Anglicanism is an ancient Christian faith, distinct from that of Rome, as far back as the Councils of the early church... we removed papal control that had been there since the synod of Whitby.
The Roman Catholic Church with all the accretions it embraced is NOT the same Church that Christ established. The schism between Rome and the Eastern Orthodox Church divided long before the emergence of the Protestant reformation in Europe.
@@FlatEarthTruth611 There is no "original church"... that's the nature of schism... the One Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church is the original church, Yet as we know, there is not physical One Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church anymore, it's been that way since before any of us were even born. The English Church is the One Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church *for the English race* , unlike the Orthodox church which is but a foreign church. Englishmen have always had a different Christian faith which is Reformed Catholic Orthodoxy... this is what Anglicanism is... English faith... some are more Reformed, some are more Catholic and others (like me) are more Orthodox, yet we are distinct from the Eastern Orthodox Church, the Roman Catholic Church (AKA Papists) and the other Reformed Churches. There is no "Coming home"... Englishmen do not belong in foreign churches
Reformed Catholic Orthodoxy, aye... that is what Anglicanism is, *English faith* , some are more Reformed, some are more Catholic and others (like me) are more Orthodox, yet we are distinct from the Eastern Orthodox Church, the Roman Catholic Church (AKA Papists) and the other Reformed Churches. There is no "Coming home"... Englishmen do not belong in foreign churches, least of all Eastern Orthodox, Englishmen have always had a different Christian faith which, as I said, is Reformed Catholic Orthodoxy, AKA English faith, AKA Anglicanism.
Don’t be ignorant … you went back to orthodoxy theologically … so name it respectfully instead of using the term indigenous which means nothing You remain ignorant not acknowledging orthodoxy What was Saint Patrick ?
Been watching your channel on and off for a while. TBH, I totally saw this coming. You're one of the most high-church Methodists I've ever seen. Given your emphasis on liturgy and tradition alongside the UMC's precipitous decline into theological liberalism and progressivism, this seems like a natural move for you. God bless you and your congregation.
Congratulations, and welcome to the ACNA!!!!! May the LORD be with you and your family!!!
As an Episcopalian under the Anglican umbrella, I concur with your favorable view of bishops in the apostolic succession. When our tiny parish encountered what seemed to be insurmountable problems, we turned to our bishop as a last resort, & have been pleasantly surprised at the vast resources he put at our disposal!
Congratulations on making a decision you are happy with. We are currently about to become Anglican, but most likely will join the continuing Anglican group.
16:36 "Anglicanism is the indigenous form of Christianity for the English speaking peoples." Exactly so, and why I identify not just as a Nazarene (though I am a Nazarene) but as a "prayer book Christian."
As always, I appreciate your clear explanation as well as your generosity of spirit.
Love from a Lutheran, and long-time viewer. Due to the state of the ELCA, though I remain theologically Lutheran, I've been out of the Lutheran Church for a few years, going instead to my families' (Global) Methodist Church. Moving from Lutheranism, you helped me more than anyone to reconcile many of my misconceptions about the Wesleyan tradition. It is a shame that you need to move, but I have incredible respect for the ACNA, and I know that you will flourish, and God willing, the Anglicans will certainly benefit from having you in their theological collective. You have my prayers, and God bless you!
Fantastic news! Bishop Lowenfield is such a wonderful bishop! Te Deum laudamus
Hello from England, very inspiring listening to your journey to the Anglicanism. I have been an Anglican all my life my mothers side of the family were from the Methodist tradition all of whom subsequently converted to the Church of England, so I was taken to the Methodist church too as a child . I truly hope in the future we can reunite as one.
I'm similar. My mother converted from Methodism to Anglicanism.
Also praying for Communion and unity between the Anglicans and Global Methodist Church, as well as brotherly love and fellowship for the whole Church Catholic.
Yeah, I honestly don’t see much of a reason for the two to be separate or not at least partner extensively except that there could be more issues with women’s ordination.
@@unit2394 it's an epidemic to be sure.
With most ACNA not recognizing women’s ordination-and this is becoming a hotter debate within Anglicanism-I cannot see most Anglicans adhering to inter-communion with a denomination that ordains women as elders and bishops.
@@robrog73
Yes. That’s a matter that needs to be settled soon!
Also, yes, please make a video on the importance of Episcopal oversight. I'll send it to all of my LCMS friends.
Welcome (back) to Anglicanism, Daniel. God bless you abundantly in your new ministry!
Welcome, I pray your move will be fruitful and may you be able to serve faithfully and be at peace. Cs Lewis on the table behind you is a good start 😀. Sounds like the beginning of an exciting season for you.
Intercommunion amongst the ACNA might be difficult, since most ACNA dioceses do not look favorably on ordaining women to the priesthood.
Welcome to the ACNA! Another Wesleyan already here. 🙏🏻👍
Welcome!
This is very encouraging. I am a 2nd career seminarian at Asbury and been trying to understand where God wants me to go.
God bless you in your discernment, wherever you end up. Of course, we'd love to have you in the ACNA, and I'd love to get a network - even informally - of Wesleyans connecting together.
I pray all Protestants unite under Anglicanism.
And then perhaps Anglicanism, Catholicism, and Orthodoxy could all work toward unification.
I'm a fan brother! While I'd sure like to see your ranks with us in the Wesleyan Church, I'm happy that you are dedicated to the "Unity" of the body! I often find it a shame that we sometimes get so obsessed with the "little" divisions, that we cut off everyone else that is trying their best to serve the Lord. Thank you for this video, and ALL your videos. Wonderful, wonderful stuff!
As a fellow Anglican, just wanna say it takes a lot of courage to even consider Anglicanism. We will pray for you, Rev!
Godspeed, brother. I watched your channel for a while. Not surprised with your decision. Just keep in step with the Spirit and not so much a form or structure.
Your reasoning is similar to mine when I left the UMC to become an Anglo-Catholic nearly 30 years ago. When I was growing up in the 1960s and 1970s, our quarterly communion service was still the one bequeathed to us by John Wesley, which was a slightly abridged version of the service of Holy Communion in the 1662 Book of Common Prayer. So, the Rite 1 service in the 1979 BCP felt very familiar, often identical word-for-word with the old Methodist communion service. But quarterly - or even monthly - communion seemed insufficient - especially in light of the fact that Wesley himself managed to receive communion twice a week, on average. So, my move to the Episcopal Church felt like I was being true to my Methodist/Wesleyan upbringing. During my dozen years as an Anglo-Catholic, I managed to receive communion twice weekly, like Wesley.
But, when Anglicanism began to disintegrate in the early 2000s, my move to Orthodoxy drew on similar reasoning. John and Charles Wesley were Greek scholars at Oxford, and their theology was heavily influenced by the Greek Fathers. When an Orthodox friend would pose statements of the form, "Protestants believe X, Orthodox believe Y", in every case I as a Methodist had been taught Y, not X.
The fact that you are being ordained as an Anglican while continuing to serve a church that is not Anglican seems odd to me. It would seem to imply that your ordination is a personal relationship between you and the bishop, rather than an ecclesial relationship with the Anglican Communion - or even with the bishop's diocese. I'm having trouble imagining an ecclesiology within which that makes sense.
I hope things turn out well for you.
Thanks be to God and welcome home!
"the truth will set you free"
I think the expiration date on denominations is passed. In my opinion its all about fidelity to scripture and resisting radical hermeneutics, critical theories and hegelian dialectics from influencing practise.
One could say, "variety is the spice of life."
I stumbled across this video this morning. Although never officially Wesleyan (I have too many issues with Wesley's doctrines of sanctification/perfectionism and exaltation of experience to a concerning degree), I attended a Wesleyan church with my wife before we left to convert to confessional Lutheranism. One of the things, ironically, which was instrumental in our conversion to Lutheranism was reading Wesley's view of the sacraments and of confession and absolution: if you read Wesley himself, he sounds far more like Martin Luther concerning baptism and the Lord's Supper than he does the modern Wesleyan church. I suspect that a great number of people in United Methodist, Free Methodist, and Nazarene churches do not know that Wesley himself would not approve of their modernist takes on the sacraments and on confession and absolution.
Just go all the way and become Catholic. Or, if you have a particular attachment to the Anglican tradition, check out the Ordinariate.
Please, please, please consider Holy Orthodoxy. Methodist to Anglican = frying pan into the fire (this from an ex-Anglican).
What is Holy Orthodoxy?
Welcome.
Welcome to the ACNA! My husband was a UMC elder for about 20 years and 10 years ago left the UMC and went thru the same process as you are embarking on. We are home and loving the sacramental life of Anglicanism with the historic tradition, Daily Office, the fabulous hymnody, incense, icons, etc. He planted a parish 4 years ago in the Northwest and our congregation is growing so that we just brought on a new priest. The Lord bless the next step in your ministry.
That is very exciting to hear. What parish do you guys serve?
@@danielhixon8209
St David’s Anglican, Post Falls, ID.
Left the C of E a while ago and now attend a Free Evangelical Church
You've inspired me for a long time, and I have some questions about ordination both in the Methodist and Anglican contexts. Is there another social media I should message you on? If you wouldn't mind taking a stab at my question.
Yes, I'm on Facebook (though I can be slow to respond to messages there), or you can email me revhixon(at)gmail
God bless you on your journey, Daniel. Lots of comments on this one! I'm glad you're facilitating the conversation. I had sorta been hoping you would be a voice in the GMC advocating for liturgy and good order. We need a counterbalance to th extremes of those pushing for unchecked emotionalism. I do wish you had spent some time answering the concerns of those who have the understanding that you will now be part of a denomination that has iterations in America and Great Britain that are so vehemently liberal in their theology. Perhaps it is too difficult to suss out here, but in what sense are you tied to the Episcopal Church? Aren't you all tied to the Archbishop of Canterbury in some sense?
Great to hear from you. Hopefully I'll still contribute in some ways to discussions among GMC Methodists, since I know many do follow me (and I make comments on some GMC aligned FB groups too). As to the relationship with the Episcopal Church and the Archbishop of Canterbury the ACNA has no formal relationship at all. In the very early days the ACNA had indicated an interest in a relationship with the CofE and Canterbury, but since Welby has chosen to push for a revisionist agenda (to the surprise of many since he was thought to be an evangelical at the time he was elected), the ACNA is now working with Anglican provinces around the world (representing some 70 or 80% of all of the Anglican Communion) to "realign" the structures of the Communion in a way that basically ignores Canterbury and the revisionist provinces (until such time as they repent) but gathers Biblically faithful provinces, and perhaps even dioceses and parishes that remain in places like England, into a new world-wide covenant (called the Cairo Covenant that GAFCON and the Global South Anglicans have been putting together) that will really be the "mainstream" of Anglicanism going forward, especially as the liberal provinces continue to dwindle at an accelerated rate. This work is already well underway, and I believe there is a good understanding that there has to be mutual accountability on matters of faith and order and theological teaching in a way that has not happened in the past.
@@danielhixon8209 Thanks for taking the time to write that out. Part of me wants to argue that the ACNA, if it isn't connected to Canterbury, is as schismatic as the GMC. I wouldn't die on that hill, though. I reckon Calvin Robinson is part of these efforts to realign the Anglican Church. It is an exciting prospect. I would like to see the GMC similarly unite a lot of Methodist denominations under our umbrella and reclaim what was lost. Hey, if you know of anyone in the ACNA who is really strong in charismatic ministry, hook a brother up. I'm personally interested in platforming people who can represent high liturgy and the charisma of the Holy Ghost.
If I remember my history correctly the Methodist Church was in talks with the Episcopal Church in the late 19th or early 20th century regarding merging. The sticking point was not recognizing our apostolic ordination and the need to be re-ordained. That would keep me from joining the Anglican Church as an ordained Elder.
My husband was a UMC elder and went thru the Anglican ordination process. He said that he got another master’s degree with all of the reading he did in preparation. It was necessary as he studied very little of the English Reformation and theology in seminary (Princeton). I am concerned with folks coming in from other traditions as we want the Anglican tradition preserved.
Welcome home! Methodists make good Anglicans.
I was reading lately about George Whitefield and the Welsh Methodists. Do you know any Calvinistic Methodist writers? Do you have any book to recommend? Are there Calvinists in Methodist Churches nowadays? I know in the past there were United Churches (Presbyterian-Methodists).
I've heard that there are still some Calvinist Methodists around - in the British Isles I think - but (sadly) don't know much of anything about them. I think Whitefield's own observation late in life was that the Wesley's organized their followers into groups in a way that he did not, so there was much more "staying power" for Wesleyan Methodism, so much so that the two terms are widely seen as synonymous these days.
Aren’t there quite a few people in the ACNA that will object to an Arminian Wesleyan soteriology?
Yes, Anglicanism has a variety of approaches to soteriology ranging from strict Calvinists, to "moderate Calvinists" that believe in "hypothetical universalism" (which is just a bit closer to the Wesleyan view), to folks who hold something closer to a Lutheran soteriology, to Wesleyans, to Anglo-Catholics. All of these folks have differences with one another, but the main thing (as I see it) is that we can in good conscience affirm the Articles of Religion and other formularies - including the Article on Predestination. The Articles were written with an eye toward also being acceptable (as far as possible) to both Calvinists and Lutherans, and so they do pass over certain debated points in silence. So Wesleyans can affirm the Article on Predestination since it does not actually affirm Double-Predestination or Limited Atonement (nor does it say whether election is conditional or unconditional which is a sticking point for some Wesleyans, though I'm OK with a bit more mystery around this point). In fact, as I see it, it would actually be harder to affirm some of the things the prayerbook says that seem clearly to affirm Universal Atonement if I actually was a strict 5-point Calvinist.
Very strong evidence that Shakespeare was Roman Catholic, just as Chaucer was. And the native religion of England, the British Isles and Ireland was Roman Catholicism-simple review of history. All that being said, praise God that He is leading you in the right direction.
Why bother leaving one for the other?
Getting warmer…
From the frying pan onto the electric burner is what it is!
What is your position on the ordination of women?
The problem with the Bride of Christ is that it is full of only sinners. I still proclaim that" I believe in one Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church . "
This appears to be what's referred to as the ecumenical movement, a unification of all the denominations. It appears then, that many would regard the Eastern Orthodox or the Catholic to be the original church, because they are the oldest, and do claim to hold the Apostolic succession of the original Apostles. So why would one believe the Catholic or Eastern Orthodox is the true and original church? Because it goes back the farthest and is the oldest? None of these, whether a new denomination that started in this present generation or the one that's supposedly the oldest is nether here nor their. All the large mainline denominations claim they are the true church of God on the earth today. The leadership of the 7th day Adventist say they are because they obey God by keeping the Sabbath, not working on Saturday, while the others don't, of which are of the Beast, because the Catholic church changed the Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday centuries ago. Joseph Smith and the Mormons say they are the true and restored church, while many Mormons have left the church citing many reasons why Joseph Smith is a false prophet. Same with Jehovah's Witness and Catholic. The church of England started with Henry the 8th, separating from the Catholic church, claiming he is the leader of the church of God now, not the pope. None of them have any credibility. There is obviously true believers of the regular people who attend their religious services, because every person has a measure of faith, that's why they go to church, while any number of the leadership only live off their labor every week. One really has to know who the true pastors and Shepard's are, and the ones who are not. Anybody can quote the scripture.
First - welcome. Secondly, the view of the Holy Eucharist has differences between contemporary Methodism and Anglicanism. How are you reconciling that?
My view of the Eucharist is that of the Articles of Religion and the liturgy. Identical wording between Methodist and Anglican articles and nearly identical wording in the Eucharistic prayer as well.
Shakespeare was prrobably a crypt-catholic. But then Anglicanism is reformed Catholicism. So. Do have you found the works of Martin Thornton?
I've got some of Thornton's stuff on my wishlist, but haven't read any of it yet.
@danielhixon8209 Great stuff. I, BTW, am ordained in the Old Catholic patrimony, which has devolved into as much flakiness as has the UMC, and I am also looking into joining ranks with the ACNA.
@@dalecaldwell
Waiting for you to join the ranks of the ACNA. 😊
Hey, I am a Nazarene who has considered joining ACNA before. However, what holds me back is my position on ordaining women. How do you reconcile this as a Methodist?
The ordination of women is a "hot topic" in the ACNA: some dioceses ordain women presbyters/priests, and others do not. Same with deacons. I am perfectly OK with this current "mixed" practice, which is a reflection of the larger Anglican Communion as a whole. Certainly, a case can be made both for or against any of these practices from the Bible, but personally I think there is a stronger case for women deacons if you are simply working from Scripture and Tradition.
But since you are asking how a Methodist can approach this, I note that Wesley never said he approved of the ordination of women, nor did he personally ordain women, nor did the Methodist Episcopal Church that he helped launch ordain women for well over a century. I believe there are to this day Wesleyan denominations that both do and do not ordain women (and God bless them all); so as far as I can see there is nothing about being Wesleyan that necessarily takes a side one way or the other on this issue.
But for me this is not an issue that I am care to argue about, or leave (or join) a church over (and I've happily been a part of churches with different approaches on this question).
@@danielhixon8209 interesting, okay. thank you!
John Wesley and those of his time would not have endorsed ordaining women to the priesthood, as ACNA does. That is an innovation they would not have countenanced, and it does not nurture unity. Wish you had come to us Anglicans in the G3 first. Hoping to see you with us sometime in the future. Prayers for you and your family.
Wesley ordained women to preach. Sarah Crosby is the name of the first one. He couldn't ordain women to be priests/ministers because he was still in the church of England at that time, but we know from his writings that he was what we would now call a feminist
@@peterjermey7235 Wesley LICENSED a few women to preach. He did not ORDAIN women to the priesthood, because he could not. Wesley was dead when a few Methodist churches began ordaining women.
Throughout his life and ministry, Wesley was an "innovator," often choosing his own interpretation of Scripture over everyone else's, which caused his brother Charles Wesley, also an Anglican minister, a great deal of stress.
Wesley and other evangelical preachers set many American Christians on the road to today's "my beliefs are based on my personal relationship with Jesus and the Holy Spirit." That's how we've come to the point where people claim the Holy Spirit has told them gay marriage is good, while at the same time other people say the Holy Spirit told them the opposite. Bad things happen when we follow the innovations of our minds instead of the triple legged stool of Scripture, Reason and Tradition.
@@peterjermey7235, you are mistaken. Wesley never "ordained" any women. He did approve women preaching as an "extra-ordinary" calling, though. He did "ordain" others as elders for the Methodists in North America, and, eventually, for England. He remained a member of and a priest in the Church of England until his death. The approving to preach is a big step, but it is not the same thing as ordaining.
@@toddstepp5545 Wesley was very much a feminist. You are right in the sense that he didn't make any woman a priest in the church of England, but he had no power to do that. He absolutely supported women as the equal of men in both secular and religious roles
@@peterjermey7235, you are not understanding what I am saying. He absolutely did ordain presbyters among the Methodists, even though he remained in the Church of England. He absolutely did not ordain any women. That is the point. It is not that he didn't ordain any women, because he had no power to do so. He believed himself to have power to ordain for the Methodists, and he did so. He just did not ordain any women. - What he did do was allow women to preach. That was an extraordinary thing to do, at the time. In this way, he supported women in ministry. It is an outgrowth of this support that helped to move Wesleyans, after him, to ordain women. - So, absolutely, he supported gifted and called women preaching. But among all that he did ordain, he did not ordain any women.
Nothing better in a spiritual journey than to end up, like Diane, in a wreck with King Charles as my Head 😂
The ACNA is derived from the Church of England, but not the same organization, nor currently in fellowship with it. We are in fellowship with the Free Church of England.
I'm praying for you! Once you help repair the rupture from early Methodism, then maybe you may see yourself walking all the way back to the Church Fathers towards Rome via the Ordinariate! Speaking as a cradle Catholic in the Ordinariate, our liturgy is very Anglican, and our hymnal is replete with the hymns of Wesley.
The Ordinariate is staying clear of a lot of the recent foolishness coming from the Holy See and Canterbury at this time. Sound teaching looks bleak at this time from Rome and Canterbury, but, 'this too shall pass.' I believe one of the remnants Our Lord is raising up is the Ordinariate in Houston, which is providentially dedicated to 'the Chair of St. Peter.'
Good luck in your spiritual travels!
I was hoping that you would have at least mentioned the authority of the Holy Scriptures. Hierarchal, corporate ecclesiastical order and clergy collars may make one feel and look religious ,but are poor substitutes for Jesus the Christ. That's why left the UMC in 1981. I needed to know if God did exist. He does, and I found Him after I left the UMC.
All Sunday churches are wondering after the beast of Rome.
Good sir, the Wesley’s did not start off in the ACNA.
Appropriating the name of Anglican does not an Anglican make.
It's not like a Muslim becoming a Buddhist, is it? I mean your still Christian, so not a big move.
100 years ago it was hard on my grandfather family leaving Methodist ,john wesley was so influential its the elder son name proper. But Methodist and Anglican has only gotten worse on the factors why they left.
American 1900s structuralism and the 80 year march into globalism specifically took away locals abilities to be patreons of church, our measure of faith & participation was in the sciences ,college's, Archeology, ,hosting community events like fairs. College's bowl games championships ,feeding the poor and finding ways to bring different classes together.
This is about to change obviously the Smith_Mundt act in 1940s that redefined what American seperation of church and state meant to self sacrifice out fear of marxist indoctrination which happened anyways and only hurt Christians removing prayer & God.
Taking away the puritan classical American Christians way of life.
I always thought Anglicanism was inherently Calvinist, so going from Methodism to Anglicanism did you have to “switch”? I understand Wesley obviously was not a Calvinist, but it seems like most pop level Anglicanism is. Have you found this to be the case?
I think one other commenter asked this. There are actually several approaches to soteriology within Anglicanism today, and my impression (anecdotal, of course) is that what I call Calvinism is a minority position. The Anglican Church does have an article on Predestination (which John Wesley said he affirmed) and I guess for this reason people assume Anglicanism is Calvinist. Of course people do not always mean exactly the same thing when using the words "Calvinist" or "Reformed." I take "Calvinist" to mean "TULIP." But the Anglican Article does not affirm TULIP. Nor does it deny it. It affirms Predestination along Biblical lines, but does not nail down the actual controverted issues between Wesleyans and Calvinists: it does not address whether Atonement is Limited (as in TULIP) or Universal (as in Wesleyanism - though I note, the Prayerbook appears to affirm Universal atonement in numerous other places). The Article does not address whether Election is Conditional (as in Wesley's thought) or Unconditional (as in Calvinism). Nor does the Anglian Article actually teach Double Predestination (which Wesleyans reject). So, on all these points Wesleyans are quite at home (and have been for centuries) within Anglicanism.
An interesting choice, but one clearly influenced by location & familiarity, something you didn't reference. Not all leaving the UMC have active Anglican congregations around them, just as some don't have alternative Methodist/Wesleyan congregations to turn to. In some areas we are dominated by Southern Baptists and folks grow up without any knowledge of the Anglican church at all. Methodism came to our part of central Kentucky late in the 18th century but we've struggled over the generations to not be choked out by the Baptists (my own family established the first Methodist "class" in their new Kentucky home in 1783 from which Methodism extended into the interior of the state). We were saddened that our church lost its vote to disaffiliate, but thankful to find a nearby Methodist church who did leave and were determined to maintain their Methodist identity, eventually joining the GMC. Personally, that new denominational association means little. The UMC was never "Methodism" itself, and I'd have remained a traditional Methodist even without a local traditional Wesleyan congregation to feed & support me spiritually.
Yes, it is true that for some families leaving the UMC there will not be a good Anglican or GMC option close by for them to attend. In some cases, they may be able to find a solid Presbyterian or confessional Lutheran Church, but you are right that in many parts of "the Bible belt" the options are going to be Baptist or non-denominational-but-functionally-Baptist. This is a concern I have about former UMC churches that attempt to stay independent: that they will become Baptist by cultural osmosis. I already know of cases where churches, no longer being supplied a UMC pastor through the appointment process, hired a Baptist pastor and their church no longer practices a sacramental understanding of Baptism and Eucharist.
I will say, one great thing about the Anglican tradition is that is fairly easy for a group of committed laity to start praying the Morning Prayer service or Evening Prayer service with some Bible discussion. All you need is a Bible and a Common Prayerbook, since those are the defining marks of the tradition. Of course it is a good idea to seek guidance from your nearest bishop. There may be church planting initiatives already underway that you don't know of.
From what I've heard regarding the UK Methodists Councils new 'guidelines' , over the God given terms Husband and Wife ..... there's no reason to explain 😮
I don't understand why Christians affiliate themselves with denominations .
I'm a believer in Christ , and His finished work on the Cross .
Christ plus nothing ❗
Have a Grace filled day 🇬🇧✝️♥️
Glad you're tired of being a schismatic and coming home... jk... kind of... all jokes aside, welcome to the ACNA. My Bishop is also Bishop Clark. He is a great fr in the faith.
I can’t help this but,syphilis or gonorrhea?😮
Ok what is Anglican. Some are progressive/ some are old time traditional .
I am a member of the Anglican Church in North America (ACNA), which is traditional. It is in fellowship with and recognized by various traditional Anglican Provinces (national churches) around the world, working together through a body called GAFCON. The GAFCON Provinces have a short faith statement called The Jerusalem Declaration that the ACNA affirms. You can read it online here (about halfway down the page): www.gafcon.org/resources/the-complete-jerusalem-statement-2008
We are not in fellowship with liberal Provinces, such as the Anglican Church of Canada, but stand as an alternative to them.
Why don't you come to Church Of God, hq at Cleveland TN. Come to the roots, the Pentecostal experience.
Your name is not reverend Daniel. Your name is Daniel. Reverend is your title.
"i could launch a new denomination"....
Just what Jesus wanted. 😢 Orthodox is your answer. Seek out Fr. Ed Meeks. Recently retired....went through the same process.
It saddens me when I hear people treat the church as it’s some kind of pick and mix, There are no denominations in Jesus Christ. Christ's true church has never been divided and never will be. It is made up of God's saints, His holy ones, sent and scattered around the world for the seed sowing of faith in Jesus Christ.
Joseph Smith would beg to differ.
FROM SUNDAY TO ANOTHER SUNDAY WORSHIPPER AND STILL IN THE SUNDAY MUD😅😅
I don't see any denominations in my Bible.
Obviously that is true in the modern sense; but I do think there is a sense in which the current broken state of the visible church is actually analogous to the situation in Ancient Israel after the death of Solomon when the Kingdom split into Northern and Southern kingdoms. Both were partial continuations of the original united kingdom, both continued to receive genuine prophets sent from God, but the outward and institutional division existed among God's covenant people for hundreds of years.
Anglican? Are there orders valid?
Yes. Methodists have always considered Anglican orders "valid" (insofar as Methodists worry about such things; sacramental "validity" has not played a major role in our theology - apart from requiring presbyters to consecrate the communion... as a general rule; but we have tended to focus more on the "fruits of the Spirit" as evidence that grace in indeed being shared with God's people). I am not aware that "valid orders" has played much role in the ecumenical discussions among various Methodist bodies, or between these and other groups, such as Presbyterians or Lutherans.
In terms of the other ancient church bodies, some Eastern Orthodox jurisdictions have accepted Anglican orders in the past. The Church of Rome had mixed opinions till the pope rejected the validity of Anglican Orders in 'Apostolicae Curae.' Though officially infallible, there are numerous problems both of fact and argument with this document (you can devote a career to studying all the back and forth surrounding this), but even if it is accepted, due to ecumenical developments in the 20th century, virtually all Anglican bishops now have lines of succession that include the Old Catholic Church (some also include Eastern Orthodox lines) which Rome has always recognized, so that even Rome now says Anglican validity must be considered on a "case by case" basis.
What makes your Methodist ordination to the eldership invalid or illicit that you must be re-ordained? The ancient church would only count heretical clergy as unordained. If Methodists are a branch of the Catholic and apostolic church in the Anglican view, then why are Methodist elders not just received as clergy rather than being re-ordained? The ecclesial theology does not match the ministerial theology. One who is ordained is ordained. One doesn’t become unordained just because one is received into another branch of the church. Otherwise, ordination is merely an administrative, practical, human affair rather than holy order of being set apart for ministry by the Spirit, leaving an indelible mark on the person. In other words, just as baptism is one and unrepeatable, so is ordination. Unless Methodist orders are not real at all.
If I might reply: The ACNA does not dismiss Methodist orders as "invalid," as such. They would identify them as irregular in that they do not come via their understanding of episcopal apostolic succession. Therefore, while they would not sit in judgement of Methodist clergy serving in Methodist churches or other churches, if one is going to serve in an Anglican setting, they insist on ordination by apostolic succession (as they understand it). - Does that help? - For me, I would have a hard time with the idea of "re-ordination" unless they were willing to, at some point, use the language of "regularizing" my orders.
Why not TEC?
While I have some friends and colleagues in TEC that I really respect (including my own spiritual advisor and confessor, actually), I looked at TEC way back when I was in college, but saw that the direction of the church, the national leadership in particular, was heading in a direction that I (being fairly traditional in my beliefs) could not support.
Given what I know about Anglicanism, seems a lot like you jumped from the frying pan to the fire.
Honestly? High Church Protestantism, as much as I do love it, is lost to the liberals because of who's family background is in these denominations.
As much as I love the Smells and Bells, I think it's time to go back to basics.
The ACNA is a conservative Province formed by people who were dissatisfied with the revisionist direction of the Episcopal Church and the Anglican Church of Canada. You might think of it as analogous to the conservative confessional Lutheran (such as the LCMS or the AALC) and Presbyterian denominations (OPC, PCA). There is, in fact, a growing move to reclaim the classic Reformational traditions by returning them to their Bibles and historical doctrinal confessions & formularies. I believe this is a good thing.
@@danielhixon8209 As an Anglo-American myself, I'd actually be interested in something like that. I personally prefer the High Church liturgical tradition - I'm in Louisiana myself, as I believe in one of your other videos you said you were (I sorta went down a rabbit hole watching a lot of your stuff, having grown up Methodist and my family eventually leaving when I was small around the same time I decided to become Catholic I was just curious for your perspective) and would love to know where to look.
@@OGRamrod one of the reasons that the Anglican Church in North America was gathered (beginning with churches and even whole dioceses leaving the Episcopal Church) was to form a faithful, biblical, and historically orthodox Anglican province that could be in full fellowship with Anglicans around the world who are overwhelmingly Biblical and traditional.
What part of the state are you in? We don't have many congregations in Louisiana as yet. There are a couple in Baton Rouge, one in Monroe, one or two in Shreveport, a couple in Lafayette, one in Covington, a couple in the NOLA area. I've also heard there is now one in the Lake Charles area. I know we also have a couple of churches discerning whether to join the ACNA and there are a couple of church plants in the works, I think. You could start with the "Church Finder" feature on the ACNA website (though it is not always fully up-to-date) anglicanchurch.net/find-a-congregation/
Some of these (Monroe, Metairie, maybe the one in Shreveport) are a bit more 'high church' than others. If you are close to Jena you could always come visit us at Nolley in Jena.
The Anglican church is not Protestant
THANK YOU! The Anglican church precedes Roman Catholicism, but people get in the weeds over Henry VIII & don't delve into the earlier history!
Secular history classes in the United States teach the Anglican church was founded by a English king that wanted to get a divorce but the holy Catholic church wouldn't let him.
Methodist IS Anglican
Heart Broken- grew Up
Methodist.
Would only go to Internominational Church..
Or Strict Bible Based Church
No Anglican or Methodist for Me…
Unless they Free Churches..
God Bless you.. ✝️
Your going out of the frying pan into the fire
“Go Orthodox” “go catholic” brother no. You obviously don’t understand what he believes or how Anglicans express our faith. We dont resonate with either of those other wise WE WOULD BE THEM!
I'm not big on making polemical videos about why other groups are wrong about this or that, but I definitely have non-superficial reasons why I would not go to Rome or to the East.
If god was real there would be no need for any churches.
Sorry, Dave, that makes no sense.
To be a Protestant is to be a cafeteria christian, picking and choosing what part of the faith you agree with.
Essentially Creating a god that fits you.
The fruit of splitting off the real church is constant splitting.
This is why there continues to be so many new denominations.
Come all the way home to the Church JESUS founded.
The Catholic Church.
The anglicans split off so a King could marry in adultery.
A church founded on adultery.
To read the Church fathers is to see Catholicism.
Sins of man is no excuse to leave the whole of the faith.
No other Church has Christ substantially present in the Eucharist.
Come home.
Build your faith on the Rock.
Anything else is standing on shifting sand.
Anglicans *did not* split off so a King could marry in adultery... we finally removed the papacies control over our English Church and we Reformed our Catholic Orthodoxy. We were always Catholic, always Orthodox never Roman Catholic, never papist... our English faith was born pre-Constantinian, before Rome went Christian.
Papal infallibility and Papal supremacy is not part of "the faith", the bishop of Rome had no universal jurisdiction in early Christianity, nor is there any reason way our national church, our English faith, ought to be under the papacies control. Be gone Papist!
Jesus said Peter I will build the church.give you the keys of gates of heaven, so Peter was the first pope ,and it has continued down the centuries, remember there no salvation outside.the true Roman Catholic faith .🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
Isn’t the Anglican Church lead by a bunch of lesbians now? Not sure how orthodox that is.
@@foundationofBritain
Thank you for your kind response to a tired and uninformed post.
Some of you in the Roman Church and the EO must copy each other’s rebuttals to Christians outside your tradition. You sound alike. It’s really tiresome, arrogant, and unchristian and nearly confirms why I’m not Roman or EO because Jesus said “you will know my disciples by their love for one another”. Please stop.
Lord have mercy.
Why not return to the Church Christ founded, the Catholic Church ? 🙏📿
😂😂😂
As of April 2023 there were 45,000 christian denominations. Jesus founded one church the Catholic church...you are Peter and upon this rock l will build my church.. singular. What a mess we are in !
Catholic as in universal. ✝️
Not the 'Roman Catholic church' .
I have always had respect for Anglicanism until The Arch Bishop of Canterbury started believing it s okay to ordain people living in sin. The Anglicand may go through the same things the United Methodist are going through.
They already did...that's partly why ACNA was formed
Same nonsense churches you wasting your time
Anglicanism is a split from the Catholic Church. If your logic is to attempt to mend a tear, in reality you are just going back to another tear that is 500 years old. The Church that Jesus founded is the Catholic Church-this is where the fullness of unity is found.
Anglicanism started with the Augustine mission to England. But since the reformation the church no longer recognises the Bishop of Rome as having authority in that church.
Wrong! Anglicanism is an ancient Christian faith, distinct from that of Rome, as far back as the Councils of the early church... we removed papal control that had been there since the synod of Whitby.
You literally did prove anything he said wrong lol. You just said it's the English offshoot of the Catholic church.
The Roman Catholic Church with all the accretions it embraced is NOT the same Church that Christ established. The schism between Rome and the Eastern Orthodox Church divided long before the emergence of the Protestant reformation in Europe.
Get out of both denominations, they are apostate .
Just return to Orthodoxy and the journey will be complete
Come home to Orthodoxy.
Yes, the Orthodox church is the original church that has preserved everything from Christ and the Apostles.
Amen!!!
@@FlatEarthTruth611 There is no "original church"... that's the nature of schism... the One Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church is the original church, Yet as we know, there is not physical One Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church anymore, it's been that way since before any of us were even born.
The English Church is the One Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church *for the English race* , unlike the Orthodox church which is but a foreign church. Englishmen have always had a different Christian faith which is Reformed Catholic Orthodoxy... this is what Anglicanism is... English faith... some are more Reformed, some are more Catholic and others (like me) are more Orthodox, yet we are distinct from the Eastern Orthodox Church, the Roman Catholic Church (AKA Papists) and the other Reformed Churches. There is no "Coming home"... Englishmen do not belong in foreign churches
Reformed Catholic Orthodoxy, aye... that is what Anglicanism is, *English faith* , some are more Reformed, some are more Catholic and others (like me) are more Orthodox, yet we are distinct from the Eastern Orthodox Church, the Roman Catholic Church (AKA Papists) and the other Reformed Churches. There is no "Coming home"... Englishmen do not belong in foreign churches, least of all Eastern Orthodox, Englishmen have always had a different Christian faith which, as I said, is Reformed Catholic Orthodoxy, AKA English faith, AKA Anglicanism.
Don’t be ignorant … you went back to orthodoxy theologically … so name it respectfully instead of using the term indigenous which means nothing
You remain ignorant not acknowledging orthodoxy
What was Saint Patrick ?
My family chapel in England is now a mosque, and I am now a Muslim, and everything is much more GODLY and serious and loving.
Omar used to be Anglican ? Lol