Surprisingly on point as far as the volume concept. You could tell right away when a person has experienced. Most of TH-cam channels I love to healthy troll these guys
Hi Daryl! Thanks a lot for the video, I learned a lot. We run an FMCG webshop, where most products fall in the same GPM - 40-60%, but we have a totally different product category which fall in the 10-15% range. We have about 1500 conversions a month. Based on your video my idea is to do a quite simple structure: - Campaign 1: the 10-15% GPM products - it has 1500 products, and it can probably get around 50 conversions a month - Campaign 2: All 40-60% GPM products - Campaign 3: Zombie products from campaign 2 My second idea was to mix the ROAS performance structure and the GPM structure the following way: - Campaign 1: the 10-15% GPM products - Campaign 2: High ROAS 40-60% GPM products - Campaign 3: Mid-Low ROAS 40-60% GPM products - Campaign 4: Zombie products from campaign 2 and 3. What do you think? Thanks a lot :)
Both of these could work. So you have 1500 conversions per month, and the low margin products get 50 per month, so I assume then that the higher margin products (40-60%) are getting lots of conversions like over 1000 per month? If that's the case then yep you could certainly afford to go for the second 4 campaign structure and I'd probably recommend that out of the two.
Question re: 3:57 - you state "I would group campaigns three and four into one campaign" (to hit threshold of 50 & expedite AI learning). Let's imagine Philip Kotler did your targeting strategy and the segmentation bases for 3 & 4 are meaningful. You merge campaigns. In a parallel universe, Kotler makes you keep 3 & 4 separated. It takes parallel guy 6 months to emerge from learning modeI, while you in this world does it in 3. Parallel you at 6 months has more strategically evolved campaigns than you at 3. Why? Because during the 3 month learning mode, the AI had to discover Kotler's brilliant segmentation bases and begin teasing them apart (so at 3 months, it's still drifting back to Kotler's segments). Kotler said something like, "if you get targeting and positioning right, everything else will follow". I think there might be a better way to emerge from learning mode without a strategic sacrifice. The rate limiting factor is conversions. Instead of relying on this one conversion definition (I presume it's a purchase), add two or more indicator conversions. For example, if your current conversion is a purchase success page, add depth of interaction conversions like add to cart, view cart, pages viewed, time on site, number of visits, etc. In this approach, you shift a small amount of uncertainty to the conversion end point in order to eliminate a lot of uncertainty for targeting and positioning variables - the factors that drive strategy.
Thanks for all info! PMX can take months to start generating conversions. I am confused why this approach, PMX first? Also, if you group all your products into one campaign, and then, only few products get clicks and conversions but you are at 20-30 conversions per month what do you do then? You can't keep them in one campaign in order to expose other products, but then again, if its less then 50 conversions you cant separate them into more campaigns. This seems to be catch 22... any ideas how to overcome this issue? Thanks 😀
The 50 products threshold is not set in stone. It’s a rule of thumb. At 20-30 products you could segment out a new campaign, just watch performance carefully and when reviewing performance use longer date ranges to smooth out any random statistical variability. For me though I probably wouldn’t segment them out yet. If the account is only getting 20-30 conversions per month, my primary concern is getting that number up. Getting some clicks and traffic and controlling the machine to spend on the lower volume products is a nice goal. But right now that goal would not be my priority. I would be working on getting overall conversion volume up and I wouldn’t be concerned as much about whether that volume came from only a handful or products. I would usually only segment out the lower traffic products later down the line when the campaign is mature and has plateaued. Regarding why pmax first. We usually get an ROI within a couple of weeks with the way we run it.
Hi, More of a question is a Performance max also good for an IT company? As an IT company you don't really sell a product but a service/services. Is it better to do keywords or performance max?
Hey sorry I can’t answer this question very well without knowing more about your business and situation. If you have less than 100 products and if your business is doing less than $500K per year then probably yes I’d just launch one campaign with all products in it. Probably.
But that’s just a starter campaign setup and it should be developed over time. I have a video coming out soon that shows beginner, intermediate and pro level campaign structures. Watch out for that one it might be helpful for you.
Thanks for your video Daryl, as always jam-packed with actionable value. Been a huge fan of your channel for a few months. Your thorough account audit videos, amongst others, are real gems, not easy at all to find on TH-cam (gotta rewatch them by the way). Please post more of those audits as well when you can 👍👍 Question : how do you go about segmenting products with the same or similar margin but a widely different price? For instance, products priced 200/250£ vs products priced 50£ or less ... despite them having a similar margin, how about segmenting them out into different campaigns while assigning a higher target ROAS to the more expensive ones? Talking about segmenting products according to actual contribution margin here, that is Product Margin + Price. P. S. If I remember correctly also from other videos I watched from your channel, in my opinion the volume of some of your videos is a bit too low even maximising the volume slider. Make sure to fix the volume issue and keep up the great work, mate. 👏👏👏
Hey mate, thanks for the suggestion will post more audits when I can! Regarding segmenting products with the same margin. If they have the same margin as a % then there’s no reason to segment them based on price. When I think about segmenting based on margins, I am thinking of margins in percentage terms. If the percentage margin is the same, then there’s no point in segmenting based on price. Re the volume, I think it should be fixed now on all videos within the past month or so and on all future videos. I upgraded my mic recently, i think the last one was a bit quiet, so I think/hope that means the volume issue is fixed as of about a month ago. Let me know if you encounter and recent or new videos with the issue?
Hi Daryl, thank you for the vid, was wondering if you could help me with some advice? We have just switched our website and after a month of running well our google ads/merchant account was turned upside down. We are now on week 3 of having only 25% visitors compared to before. My coworker says theres nothing we can do and just have to wait for google to trust our renewed merchant account again. We have upped our marketing budget but getting nowheee near the visitors/clicks and cpc has increased alot. Any tips?
Difficult to give tips without a lot more context. But one thing you could try is removing your Target ROAS or Target CPA if you are using one. Be sure to set a somewhat conservative daily budget when doing this because Google likely will spend all the budget once you remove the Target. Removing target can help a lot with getting the algo to increase CPC bids and thus traffic, allowing it to relearn faster, after an event has happened (such as a website change) that affects conversion rate.
For a new account, would you start directly with Pmax? And what would be the bidding strategy? And finally, what would this migration process be like, like you now have 500 sales per month, do you delete the initial campaign from all products and create new campaigns from scratch according to the video structure?
Yeah I’d normally start out with PMax and go from there. Start with maximise conversion value, no target ROAS. When progressing to next phase (eg adding a target ROAS then scaling budgets) do not start a new campaign. Do it in the existing campaign that already has conversion data.
But PMX can take months to start generating conversions. I am confused why this approach? Also, if you group all your products into one campaign, and then, only few products get clicks and conversions but you are at 20-30 conversions per month what do you do then? You can't keep them in one campaign in order to expose other products, but then again, if its less then 50 conversions you cant separate them into more campaigns. This seems to be catch 22... any ideas how to overcome this issue? Thanks 😀
Hi is it fine to run 1 p max campaign for different countries or should i run seperate ? For 50 cad budget and it is for apparel and I have too many products?
Different countries would usually be better run in different campaigns if it’s PMax with feed attached. For a 50 CAD budget with lots of items I’d probably just recommend running in one country and focusing on the best one.
@@anhadsingh7411 If they are your own products and you are the only company selling them, lack of GTIN is not too big of a deal. If you are reselling another brand of products, and if the brand is sold elsewhere as well, GTIN is much more important. This is because Google can use GTIN to connect your product to its global performance data, essentially giving google a lot more information about who buys/does not buy this product.
I have just google ads and it shows organic on shopify I can’t believe it’s just the organic because I just increased my budges and conversions firing it’s not recording will it affect my campaign ?
I don’t usually use Shopify to segment numbers by marketing channel. I don’t trust it for that. I do use it for seeing total revenue. But for seeing how much of that revenue was driven by each marketing channel then I either use in platform metrics (google / meta / etc) or I use a separate attribution software such as GA4 or Northbeam.
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Surprisingly on point as far as the volume concept. You could tell right away when a person has experienced. Most of TH-cam channels I love to healthy troll these guys
Hi Daryl!
Thanks a lot for the video, I learned a lot.
We run an FMCG webshop, where most products fall in the same GPM - 40-60%, but we have a totally different product category which fall in the 10-15% range.
We have about 1500 conversions a month.
Based on your video my idea is to do a quite simple structure:
- Campaign 1: the 10-15% GPM products - it has 1500 products, and it can probably get around 50 conversions a month
- Campaign 2: All 40-60% GPM products
- Campaign 3: Zombie products from campaign 2
My second idea was to mix the ROAS performance structure and the GPM structure the following way:
- Campaign 1: the 10-15% GPM products
- Campaign 2: High ROAS 40-60% GPM products
- Campaign 3: Mid-Low ROAS 40-60% GPM products
- Campaign 4: Zombie products from campaign 2 and 3.
What do you think? Thanks a lot :)
Both of these could work. So you have 1500 conversions per month, and the low margin products get 50 per month, so I assume then that the higher margin products (40-60%) are getting lots of conversions like over 1000 per month?
If that's the case then yep you could certainly afford to go for the second 4 campaign structure and I'd probably recommend that out of the two.
Question re: 3:57 - you state "I would group campaigns three and four into one campaign" (to hit threshold of 50 & expedite AI learning). Let's imagine Philip Kotler did your targeting strategy and the segmentation bases for 3 & 4 are meaningful. You merge campaigns. In a parallel universe, Kotler makes you keep 3 & 4 separated. It takes parallel guy 6 months to emerge from learning modeI, while you in this world does it in 3.
Parallel you at 6 months has more strategically evolved campaigns than you at 3. Why? Because during the 3 month learning mode, the AI had to discover Kotler's brilliant segmentation bases and begin teasing them apart (so at 3 months, it's still drifting back to Kotler's segments).
Kotler said something like, "if you get targeting and positioning right, everything else will follow". I think there might be a better way to emerge from learning mode without a strategic sacrifice. The rate limiting factor is conversions. Instead of relying on this one conversion definition (I presume it's a purchase), add two or more indicator conversions. For example, if your current conversion is a purchase success page, add depth of interaction conversions like add to cart, view cart, pages viewed, time on site, number of visits, etc. In this approach, you shift a small amount of uncertainty to the conversion end point in order to eliminate a lot of uncertainty for targeting and positioning variables - the factors that drive strategy.
This is a great value video! Amazing info!
Thanks for all info!
PMX can take months to start generating conversions. I am confused why this approach, PMX first? Also, if you group all your products into one campaign, and then, only few products get clicks and conversions but you are at 20-30 conversions per month what do you do then? You can't keep them in one campaign in order to expose other products, but then again, if its less then 50 conversions you cant separate them into more campaigns. This seems to be catch 22... any ideas how to overcome this issue?
Thanks 😀
The 50 products threshold is not set in stone. It’s a rule of thumb. At 20-30 products you could segment out a new campaign, just watch performance carefully and when reviewing performance use longer date ranges to smooth out any random statistical variability.
For me though I probably wouldn’t segment them out yet. If the account is only getting 20-30 conversions per month, my primary concern is getting that number up. Getting some clicks and traffic and controlling the machine to spend on the lower volume products is a nice goal. But right now that goal would not be my priority. I would be working on getting overall conversion volume up and I wouldn’t be concerned as much about whether that volume came from only a handful or products.
I would usually only segment out the lower traffic products later down the line when the campaign is mature and has plateaued.
Regarding why pmax first. We usually get an ROI within a couple of weeks with the way we run it.
Amazing approach with high and low ROAS Campaigns. Have to test this! Thanks :)
Hi,
More of a question is a Performance max also good for an IT company? As an IT company you don't really sell a product but a service/services. Is it better to do keywords or performance max?
When im just starting with P-Max do I market all the products in my store in one campaign?
Hey sorry I can’t answer this question very well without knowing more about your business and situation. If you have less than 100 products and if your business is doing less than $500K per year then probably yes I’d just launch one campaign with all products in it. Probably.
But that’s just a starter campaign setup and it should be developed over time. I have a video coming out soon that shows beginner, intermediate and pro level campaign structures. Watch out for that one it might be helpful for you.
Thanks for your video Daryl, as always jam-packed with actionable value. Been a huge fan of your channel for a few months. Your thorough account audit videos, amongst others, are real gems, not easy at all to find on TH-cam (gotta rewatch them by the way). Please post more of those audits as well when you can 👍👍
Question : how do you go about segmenting products with the same or similar margin but a widely different price? For instance, products priced 200/250£ vs products priced 50£ or less ... despite them having a similar margin, how about segmenting them out into different campaigns while assigning a higher target ROAS to the more expensive ones? Talking about segmenting products according to actual contribution margin here, that is Product Margin + Price.
P. S. If I remember correctly also from other videos I watched from your channel, in my opinion the volume of some of your videos is a bit too low even maximising the volume slider. Make sure to fix the volume issue and keep up the great work, mate. 👏👏👏
Hey mate, thanks for the suggestion will post more audits when I can!
Regarding segmenting products with the same margin. If they have the same margin as a % then there’s no reason to segment them based on price. When I think about segmenting based on margins, I am thinking of margins in percentage terms. If the percentage margin is the same, then there’s no point in segmenting based on price.
Re the volume, I think it should be fixed now on all videos within the past month or so and on all future videos. I upgraded my mic recently, i think the last one was a bit quiet, so I think/hope that means the volume issue is fixed as of about a month ago. Let me know if you encounter and recent or new videos with the issue?
@@DarylManderbigflare Perfect. Cheers mate!
Hi Daryl, thank you for the vid, was wondering if you could help me with some advice? We have just switched our website and after a month of running well our google ads/merchant account was turned upside down. We are now on week 3 of having only 25% visitors compared to before.
My coworker says theres nothing we can do and just have to wait for google to trust our renewed merchant account again. We have upped our marketing budget but getting nowheee near the visitors/clicks and cpc has increased alot. Any tips?
Difficult to give tips without a lot more context. But one thing you could try is removing your Target ROAS or Target CPA if you are using one. Be sure to set a somewhat conservative daily budget when doing this because Google likely will spend all the budget once you remove the Target. Removing target can help a lot with getting the algo to increase CPC bids and thus traffic, allowing it to relearn faster, after an event has happened (such as a website change) that affects conversion rate.
For a new account, would you start directly with Pmax? And what would be the bidding strategy? And finally, what would this migration process be like, like you now have 500 sales per month, do you delete the initial campaign from all products and create new campaigns from scratch according to the video structure?
Yeah I’d normally start out with PMax and go from there. Start with maximise conversion value, no target ROAS. When progressing to next phase (eg adding a target ROAS then scaling budgets) do not start a new campaign. Do it in the existing campaign that already has conversion data.
But PMX can take months to start generating conversions. I am confused why this approach? Also, if you group all your products into one campaign, and then, only few products get clicks and conversions but you are at 20-30 conversions per month what do you do then? You can't keep them in one campaign in order to expose other products, but then again, if its less then 50 conversions you cant separate them into more campaigns. This seems to be catch 22... any ideas how to overcome this issue?
Thanks 😀
Hi is it fine to run 1 p max campaign for different countries or should i run seperate ? For 50 cad budget and it is for apparel and I have too many products?
Different countries would usually be better run in different campaigns if it’s PMax with feed attached. For a 50 CAD budget with lots of items I’d probably just recommend running in one country and focusing on the best one.
Thank you so much for replying
And is it fine If Iam running ads without adding gtin number
@@anhadsingh7411 If they are your own products and you are the only company selling them, lack of GTIN is not too big of a deal.
If you are reselling another brand of products, and if the brand is sold elsewhere as well, GTIN is much more important. This is because Google can use GTIN to connect your product to its global performance data, essentially giving google a lot more information about who buys/does not buy this product.
I have just google ads and it shows organic on shopify I can’t believe it’s just the organic because I just increased my budges and conversions firing it’s not recording will it affect my campaign ?
I don’t usually use Shopify to segment numbers by marketing channel. I don’t trust it for that. I do use it for seeing total revenue. But for seeing how much of that revenue was driven by each marketing channel then I either use in platform metrics (google / meta / etc) or I use a separate attribution software such as GA4 or Northbeam.
Wow