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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 ส.ค. 2023
- Thinking about investing in a mid-drive eBike motor? Before you make your purchase, discover the 7 hidden drawbacks and problems that often go unnoticed. From maintenance issues to unexpected costs, this video uncovers the truth about mid-drive eBike motors that you need to know. Don't miss out; watch now to make an informed decision!
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I love how you make a video after you break a chain, this can’t be very unbiased
😅 sir you went into the mountains without an extra chain? That sounds like user eer to me
All of your other points where informative thank you
nope. bicycle designs are just not mature enough
@@snorttroll4379 No, you are next to braindead if you go moutainbiking without an extra chain and some tools. Regular top class mountain bikes worth 10k+ also lose their chains, it is something that happens with or without the motor that is more so related to the environment. Stupidity has no excuses.
1. Carry a multi tool with a chain breaker and a quick link.
2. Not really a reason.
3. It's a motor + controller. How is one more complex than the other?
4. Not all hub motors are compatible. Many complaints online about hub drive not fitting frame.
5. BBSHD is way quieter than hub drive of equal wattage.
6. Ground clearance is rarely an issue. CYC PHOTON sits higher up than chainring.
7. This is a very subjective reason. Pedal more?
Changing a flat is way more difficult on a hub than mid.
Hub drive rotational mass makes it feel like driving a school bus rather than a sports car.
Sincerely,
A mid-drive fanboy. 😉
No. 2 - Being more expensive is a huge problem.
@@difflocktwo I bought an Focus Ebike with Bosch mid-drive motor used with only 700km on it for 1400€. Years back I baught an convertion kit with hub motor for my old bike that cost 1300€ new. Mid motor drives much better, the bike is more nimble and the battery holds um much longer and you have more Power.
@@schlosserprofi8647 I do not know what the battery has to do with the motor. These are separate things.
Why do I care about nimble? What does it even mean?
You need to account that with a mid drive you have to spend a lot of money on brake maintenance but with hub drive you have regen braking so that you do not need to spend anything on brake maintenance.
A 100 USD hub motor and 100 USD controller is already more powerful than a 50cc scooter. So I think power is not an issue. This is a very cheap, very old, hub motor: th-cam.com/video/e03rMDmJzLE/w-d-xo.html
@@difflocktwo Batteylive ist importent. That ist why regen breaking is more expensive then normal brake maitenence, because it is reaking heavic on your BMS and batterycells. An more nimble, you know what I mean. It does feel more light and nimble when you drive it.
@@schlosserprofi8647 We are talking mid drive vs hub motor, battery has nothing to do with how we drive the wheels.
Regen is free to implement and the degradation to the battery is 1000000x less costly than brake maintenance. You can dump the electricity into a resistor if you do not want to charge your battery. But everyone wants to charge their battery, it's just better.
I would say first off you need a gearshift sensor. Secondly, always have a chain breaker and a master link. I agree that the ground clearance could be an issue on a mid drive that you have built yourself. It is not an issue on factory built ones though. efficiency, I would argue mid drives are much more efficient with the battery. I do have both. A more simple system, I will give you that one. But I honestly think the decision comes down to the person that it is for. If someone typically shift gears to be in the most efficient gear, that person is going to be better off with a mid drive. If someone wants to just stay in one gear and use the throttle when they need, that person would be better off with a hub Drive. I prefer a mid drive myself. But I would say, for every advantage that the mid drive has for me, I could name an advantage that hub drive would have for someone else. So it really comes down to the person, knowing how they intend to ride.
I got a mid drive. E, bike ,with the gear shift sensor missing. Will a midrive bike run without the sensor coz I can’t get this bike run from day one. Ty in advance for any advice. All my bikes are , this is my first mid drive bike.
I do have a gear shift sensor but it also use the left brake just slightly like a clutch when shifting. This combined with the gear shift sensor puts a lot less stress on the Chain when the motor is engaged
@@antrasix-beatsproductionho9813what mid drive is it, check the brake cut off sensors and speed sensor.
The ground clearance on bbshd only is an issue on low bb bikes or bikes with 26" wheels, i have a build on an ns bike evo slack bb hardtail and my bbshd has no issues on clearance on trails.
I have the bafang750w mid drive motor on both of my Trek bikes for about 3 years now and i haven't had not one problem with 32 mile range and top speed around 35 mph...
Happy with my setup...
Looks like you do not have a gear shift sensor. That will cause chain breakage as the motor is not shutdown during shifting. I see the plug not connected and I do not see a sensor. Mid drive will climb hills way better.
Exactly right! I need to get one installed and it will help with chain problems :)
Over time it becomes instinctive to stop pedaling or back off the throttle when, changing gears. But a sensor will help, if you think it will help.
I use the front brake as a clutch when shifting. Saves wear on the chain and cassette.
@@thebeaglebeat3615problem is you need to pedal to get the gear change done and then the motor starts up before the gear change is completed, then that terrible chain sound. Gear sensor helps but sometimes doesn't turn off long enough and the same problem happens. Best way imo is to use a brake lever to cut the motor or a horn button.
@Nismo-gy3wz mine has 1.5 second delay from pedaling to when the motor kicks back in & I activate the shift up or down before pedaling, pre activate the gear shift. Works OK, just need to keep the timing on point. Cheers
BBSHD's are super quiet compared to all the others. Quieter than the integrated ones that pre-built e-mtb's come with and way quieter than CYC ones.
The new Photon is as quiet. The ToSeven, TSDZ2, TSDZ8, Ananda, Truckrun and Yamaha as well as everything by Bafang are quieter than any geared hub motor...Bbso2 & BBSHD still being king of quiet....frankly, only The Shimano Steps motors really bother me.
Someone on aliexpress was complaining about nylon gear rattling requiring to loosen it's internal cover. Mine seems to have weird frame resonance/vibration as if the IPM rotor isn't balanced especially after having to hammer some hex bit in a worn rear wheel axle. The shock load might have damaged something inside the motor.
@@uvwuvw-ol3fgthe BBS02's magnets can actually come loose as they're not IPM rotors (only the HD actually has em inside of the rotor) so it is more susceptible to damage
Carry an extra chain, and use pedals on take off , chains break due to user error 99% of the time. Mid drive is the only way for off road as the weight is in a better place for balance
Never switch gears while powering on mid drive or kiss chain goodbye, I have both mid drive & hub I’ve learned to never shift under load just like a motorcycle don’t shift while rev’d up, my mid drive is old 7,500+- it’s a gng mid drive 500 watt with a literal ton of torque & loud like electric chainsaw but got me thru everything nature threw at me including deep snow on 26x2.5 tires
I have a mid Drive motor on my mountain bike and I absolutely love it. As far as if the chain breaks when I'm out riding I have a chain cutting tool and even carry a few extra links you can always shorten the chain up to get you back home. It just requires having some tools with you which I carry all the time on every ride no matter long or short. Mid Drive motors do require more maintenance than they do have more wear and tear on the chain and the cassette but chains and cassettes are very inexpensive, I was able to get a thousand miles out of my first cassette and chain and just changed it out the other day.
I want to know the best to get for battery like rear-drive, AWD or mid-drive
dont have a chain tool so you can make it a bit shorter?
Never broken a chain on my mid drive, bbshd, 160nm of torque, buy a good chain, not a cheap one, kmc chains are my go to, align the offset on chain ring to cassette which is easy af, don't use a crap derailleur, use a mid cage, one with a clutch on, either use a shift sensor or program the motors candence so it doesn't keep power when you stop rotating the cranks. I've had my bbshds for 5yrs now. Wait till you mess up a rear hub lol
i was about to buy a mid drive but this pretty much sway me to hub motor. thanks!
I have a Bafang 750w on a ti hard tail, the torque makes the bb creak for a second must be hard on chain. Is it the cadence sensor or torque sensor that increases power when shifting?
You don't have a torque sensor on bbs02 750w, cadence on bafang is very direct, when the speed poles read a rotation the power is direct and all the current and amps for the pas you have will be used, only torque sensor will apply it more or less based on a cadence sensor, they work together.
A couple of tips for that creak, check the lock ring is tightened to 80nm or very, very tight, you can stick a shock absorbing rubber between motor and downtube, also check for grit between motor and downtube, lube your chain and check derailleur is moving easily. I had creaking the other day, done the checks and its gone.
I always take a chaintool + link even on bicycle. On ebike its 100% must have!
But can a mid drive handle mountain bike trails? I ride a lot of the mountain bike trails in NJ and NH, the only other e bikes I've ever seen on the trail are the 250w Specialized and Trek type bikes, they only max around 550w and even those bikes go through drive trains pretty quickly.
Check out the Pinion Gear Box combined with a working mid drive motor with the pinion gears; something else you may like instead of the Bafang Mid Drive.
Stranded in the desert, and takes time to make a video…uh 🤔
I have a bafang bbshd / Rolof combo on one bike and a generic 1200 pancake hub-drive on the other. I prefer the direct drive for roadways and the mid drive is just better (more controllable) on hills. If you are commuting go direct drive. Cheaper less headache in the end. One other thing don't let those mid drive sales people sway you by saying mid drive has more torque. a 20lb dd motor has enough torque (at the wheel not crank) to rip itself out of the drop outs if not secured properly with the anti-rotation arms.
Lower? What about your foot at bottom of crank? So then you should not go through rough terrain becs you may injure your foot?
Do you have to be always peddaling with the mid drive motors to be working. If you stop pedalling can you get motor assist?
Yes. The pedals and don't need to turn for the motor to run. Throttling is a option. (at least on the bbs02)
I bought an Addmotor Wildtan M5600 mid-drive motor . ( I don't know how ) But this bike drivers with the throttle and the chain OFF. Watch youtube videos , you can see the chain is still when people ride the bike with the throttle only . ( when I bought my bike new , the chain fell off, and the bike would drive with throttle only .
Pretty darned informative!
Which one would you say is better for a long distance rider who wants the motor to help only in certain situations? Is that even possible?
Anything is possible. There are many aspects to consider.
Best e bike assuming that the laws allow it (re road) is a good mid drive and then add a hub motor to the front wheel or vice versa
I have ridden over 10k miles on my Bafang BBSHD mounted on a heavy recumbent trike with a Rohloff speed hub. This combination allows me to keep the motor spinning fast and avoid overheating. I tow a 200lb solar trailer and i use a 30T lekkie chain ring, Narrow/Wide... Keep the motor spinning fast, never lug down a motor (whether is a mid or hub motor is key). I use high quatlity ATB red chain lube because it is the best for my conditions. And i clean/relube the chain each week. My chains last 3 times longer than other riders for that reason alone...
If your chain is breaking, it is because you put too big a chainring on the mid drive. or you didn't maintain /clean relube your chain with the correct lube..
Or you start in high gear, high boost, which tears up hub drives too. Frankly, I find it hard to take advice from someone who just broke a chain. He either did not maintain it well, or he doesn't know how to shift.
Just one thing. Narrow wide chainrings are for derailuer gears. They are a disadvantage on a single speed chain
@@Alex-uh1mj Do you mean cassettes in combo with a narrow/wide chain ring..? My bike mechanics design and build ebikes/etrikes for big brands.. My chain use to come off the chainring when i went over bumps until they suggested the narrow/wide 30T Lekkie.. I have had great luck with my combo Lekkie to Rohloff speed hub.
I like front hub direct drive, easier to live with and you have all wheel drive. Feels a bit strange at first a bit weightier feel on the steering but I like it.
If I wanted a long distance ebike coupled with speed, would a mid motor be better? If yes, how much more distance would I get over a rear hub motor? 30% more?
@PepperLim
Great question!
I just got rid of the first bicycle I'd owned or ridden in approx 4 decades, and it was a class 3 factory mid-drive ebike. It was a great bike, leaned more towards a commuter bike but it just wasn't for me. I just got a new-to-me non-electric bike with a 12 speed Pinion transmission and Gates belt drive that I'll soon be transforming to an e-bike with a nice modern direct drive rear hub motor w/ built-in torque sensing.
I think their are builds where a mid-drive makes more sense and builds where a hub motor is a better choice. Sometimes both... I have an interest in building a mid-drive AWD bike in the future with an added front hub motor that gives the added advantage of riding home via throttle on front hub if a person breaks a belt or chain or has mid-drive motor problems.
@PepperLim
How much speed were you looking for?
Edit: And how much distance?
@@TNSonglines I am imagining 200-220 miles per day, cruising at 25 mph. I just set a Malaysian national record with an e-bike and now, I want to break it again and push the limits.
@PepperLim
Wow, I'd like to read about your record breaking ride! If you've written about this somewhere I'd appreciate if you'd share the link to where I could read about that ride. I'm hoping to be able to carry enough watt-hours of batteries to do approx 100 miles at the speeds you've estimated targeting, about 25 mph.
Was the 200 mile ride on a hub drive or mid-drive bike?
Dillinger rear hub drive is geared. So torque changes depending on stress.
You need a E-Bike chain. The metals in these chains are designed to take more torque.
good job
If cost and clearance are not a concern for anyone considering an e-bike, mid-drive is the way to go.
So only for the rich.
I am not rich but an $800 mid drive kit on an old bike frame has provided enriching experiences.@@difflocktwo
Someone needs to do a video of all the scams related to ebike related products there are these days...
Can you have a mid drive and also a hub motor?
if i did that i would maybe put the mid drive on a cadence sensor setting and then have a direct drive (non geared) hub motor on a thumb or twist throttle.
Maybe essentially 2 seperate systems with smaller seperate batteries
So they have one advantage if the chain snaps.. for everything else a mid drive is better. Just buy a kmc chain. Video is just click bait
One of the first things i do to any bike is buy two new chains and link them together, make the chain as long as possible, so if I break a chain it takes me couple minutes on the side of the trail with my multi-tool to fix.
Great idea.
It'll never work on planet earth!!!😂😅😊.
@venturescooters2439 Mine isn't stock, it is flashed (reprogramed) by venture scooters, the delay has been set not to immediately ramp up power, as soon as you start pedaling, it is delayed, i have plenty of time to change gears while pedling, so I don't have this problem, so there must be a setting that delays responce time from pedaling to when the motor kicks in, just saying that is my experience, with my setup. Not saying it isn't a problem for other setups.
Not sure what "exactly" is wrong with a bang or any other mid-drive motor but here is my top tips as I have 3 1kW bafang mid drive mountain bikes that are for 3 different uses. And between 2 of them they have done over 20,000kilometers.
1. NEVER use a standard bike chain. ALWAYS use an E-Bike rated chain and have a few spare quick links in your repair kit. Standard chains can not handle the torque of the motor.
2. Use ebike rated tyres, if you rides both on and off road a set of ebike rated tires will last a long time. Maxxis have them.as do other popular brands
3. If you run a low wattage motor, mechanical disc brakes are okay, otherwise use hydraulic and never v brakes. They are not powerful enough to handle the extra weight and speed especially in the wet
4. Use a bafang stainless steel motor brace. This will prevent the motor coming loose. The standard black one is okay for less powerful motors. Since I've installed mine I've never had a loose motor on the frame.
5. Brake or gear sensors are not necessarily needed but I would however recommend them to newbies. I have seen experienced riders struggle with the braking and pedal assist. The gears van be changed by changing gears when you are not pedaling or using the throttle.
6. On another note, to prevent punctures on tubed tyres, I recommend buying a puncture resistant liner. It goes in the tyre and lays flat against the tyre. I have had one puncture using these but the road tyres were almost bald and it was a piece of wire from a car or trucks steel radial tyre.
Hub motors be it front or rear have good and bad point. I bought one for the front of my hybrid trek bike and after I installed it I went to go for a ride and a hall sensor failure code came up on the screen. So a $600 kit is basically useless until I install the new sensors which are worth a few cents each. If you break a spoke, riding will get difficult. You can rid a mod drive when its flat etc but it will haveore resistance. Mine, I have had two controller failures and one was reflashed and is working as it should be. The other I think I should have had it checked bit I failed to do so. In the start I ran it with a standard chain and I was 20 kilometres from home and it broke .luckily I got a loft home. On other issue wasa cracked pas magnet inside the motor. Easy fix. I have just built a rock hopper Comp ebiks
good info i have got several hub drive bikes .just built a middrive bike for my daughter ,a bbs02 48v on a specialised pitch .its a nice little bike so i went straightout and bought myself a bbshd on a full suspension comencial ,it needs completing but should make the perfect off road bike for me .its like comparing apples to oranges i suppose when talking hub vs mid drive
the main disadvantage is that hub motors are better if you know how to use those those are superior.
Where I live if you're sticking to legal restrictions than the mid drives are not work it. unless you're really thinking about it or want to look it's not any better. They break easier too with more parts to break.
I love my mid drive with both cadence and torque sensors
some of these new geared hub motors have excellent hill climbing power, and are so fast on the mountain bike trails because they are so forgiving, don't think a mid drive would be as fast because it requires much more planning ahead and precise gear shifting.
But the unsprung mass is terrible for any full suspension mtb. Not a problem with casual riding ofcourse
@@mtbsieppo i would go mid drive for the full suspension, but anything with a fat tire I would go geared hub, the problem with the mid drive is, for some reason we're still using a regular aluminum drivetrain, I'm far from a beast and I've stripped a couple drive trains on my life without a motor. I feel like if I did the kind of riding with a mid try that I do with my hub motors, I would have to replace the entire drivetrain every 500 miles. And when I ride trails, the only other e-bikes I see are the Specialized and the Treks, nothing powerful like a Bafang. I've never seen a bbshd or 02 on a mountain bike trail.
@@bassw1758 yeah bicycle chains and cogs can't take that kind of beating, even factory mid drives are struggling with drivetrain wear! I think Shimano linkglide is the only drivetrain that can take the abuse relatively well
@@mtbsieppo eventually I'll get a 250w dual suspension, now that they're coming down in price
@@bassw1758 good move!
Hub or Mid motor or IGH / Cadence or Torque / Chain or belt
Most reviews and comparisons are made w/ bike's spec itself only under circumstance wide open area either on flat or hills. However, "in terms of which is better/efficient" could be totally different in certain situations including myself, those who live in heavy traffic city dealing w/ cars, signals and bunch of people each block that requires stopping and starting on a frequent basis.
As someone mentioned below, Mid-motor could be pain in the ass shifting gears constantly which possibly could also end up spending more $$ maintenances switching chains/drivetrain more often without getting full benefit of Mid-motor's advantage in heavy traffic area. (on the other hand, I heard Mid-motor has more range then Hub w/ same battery spec ?)
How about IGH+belt ? Is it considerably heavier then deraileur+chain ?
IGH's are the ideal e-bike combined with a mid-drive. No shift sensing, no brake cut-offs (with torque sensing) and cab shifted coasting to or ar a stop. Really the ultimate urban commuter. I have had a seven, an eight, a four and a three speed (running a shop, I get to play a lot). Most of my customer's bikes have deraileurs, but I'll take IGH's any day, even with minor internal friction losses and an extra half pound. With a torque sensing mid-drive, still far lighter and more efficient than any hub motor. Hub motors are 90's tech.
Always take an extra chain with you. But it is a good thing to remember; no chain, no drive.
My hub motor spun in the dropouts and I had to carry the bike and the wheel home😢
Hi, you must carry a pocketful of quick links!🙂
Uh, ever hear of missing links or a spare chain? If you use your gears properly you won't break chains & you'll get better range.
I'd take the broken chain possibility with a mid-drive over the broken spokes possibility with a hub drive (chain links are easier to carry than spokes). Given equivalent wattage a mid-drive vs a hub drive the mid-drive will climb better and attain higher top speeds (assuming you use your gears).
The only advantage to a hub drive is if you intend to ride your e-bike like a moped using throttle and not changing gears.
I haven't owned a mid drive, but I do have a twin motor hub fat tire. I feel a mid motor would be a closer transition to e-bikes from non powered. Especially since many use superior torque sensors. I am willing to make the sacrifices to own a mid drive soon. Hub drive without torque sensors just feels like an electric moped.
Use you chain link and connect it with your chain breaker ! Mid drive any time hub cheap my e bike dulay BBSHD 61 clicks with pedal assist ! 61 clicks up 45 degrees ! Cant do it with a hub ! wait till you have a flat m8 ! My e bike $12,000 ! Custom build ! Carbon fibre ! 10 foot drops no probs ! Throttle Tubeless 27.5 ! 20ahn 52 volt and runs on 48 ! 5 years 0 problems ! 8 speed !
Hub motor doesn’t ride like a regular bike at all. Nmid mount is the way to go. All the weight down low where you want it. Buy a quality chain man
All of the problems are hub bike manufacturers trying to sell their bikes at mid drive prices.
Nobody tells us about those "issues"? 😁
There are many videos presenting mid motors and all advantages and disadvantages.
Mids are compatible with all frames , with some adapters from lekke; and hub motors are compatible with low end and old frames only - explain how to install hub motors on frames with thru axles?
You can get dual hub motor E bikes now that make mid drives obsolete.
Heavy AF and not the least bit agile on true singletrack mountain biking trails.
Yea but just wait till the front fork dropouts snap frome the tork and and nearly get hurt I went thru this a couple weeks ago and start realizing the front hub motors are risky at least with the front forks that are available for sale now if you had a steel heavy duty fork with reinforced dropouts may be less risky
Rear hub and a mid drive is what I'm looking at now heavy rider lots of hills so need the tork
I added a BBSHD to a 500 watt hub bike climbs hills like nothing else and the motors compliment each other so neither one gets hot.@@user-tr4fe1ts4y
I use the front brake lever as a clutch to turn off the motor as i shift gears. Works great and saves chain wear.
I've read others saying the same. How sensitive is the sensor? Can you apply the brake slightly without it actually engaging the brake pads to stop the motor?
@@bockerwright4132 just a slight pull is enough to cut off the motor. You get the hang of it pretty quickly.
@@bockerwright4132 its all down to how you set up your sensor on the hydraulic brake lever. The idea is that you expoxy the sensor and magnet onto the lever itself. It is not the best of solutions as once its stuck on its permanent to some extent. How you place the sensor in relation to the magnet is important and you must get the clearance gap right on the pre biting point of the lever so that it shuts off the motor without actually applying the brake.
@@MrDegsy69 Yeah sticking it with epoxy is a sacrifice I've come to accept, but we might have some stuff at work to shift it if needed. I watched another vid here showing how to set up the magnet and sensor. Before watching it I thought that they both had to be touching, then I looked at my brakes and thought there won't be enough clearance for it to register on the controller when the brakes are pulled, there isn't a great deal of movement. I've realized now they don't need to be touching. I'll place the magnet right on the cusp where (!) *Doesn't* show on the controller when the brakes are not pulled. Does that sound about right?
@@bockerwright4132 spot on with that observation as that is what i was getting at. Setting the gap right on the cusp of the brake lever triggering the sensor is important so it is best to experiment with this before you epoxy the sensor into its final position. This an area on hydraulic brakes that needs some kind of ISO standardisation applied to it.
Before the EV bike craze came. Most mt bikers carries extra chain link and tools to be prepared for any mechanical issues. Tire pump, shock pump, multi tool, tire patch etc....
You don't carry a spare chain ,what's with that.?
That's why you bring parts with you .
Mid drive aren't that COMPLEX as you say so because I use them on all my bikes and have had NO issues what so every for over 10 years now especially using the Bafang/8fun or BBSHD version and replacing the internal parts are also very easy to do and readily available . Mid drives are actually MORE efficient than a hub motor read the specs of the bafang middrive verse the bafang hub motor
don't you lose some power through the chain, as opposed to direct drive?
@@lufknuht5960 Not on a mid drive because you have all the gears as if it were a manual transmission like a car or motorcycle has.
If you happen to view any of my videos I have on here I have built many bikes and NO ONE pays me for the videos I just like to post videos. of my bike and what I have done to them.
What I did was convert all my bikes to the IGH 3 speed hub and this way its even more efficient that a regular gear shifting with a derailleur .
I was thinking that a a hub motor should be able to convert to a generator, at the flip of a switch on the brake lever, let off on the brake and it's a motor again. No extra parts
There are hub motors like that.
@@wallywest2360 somebody beat me to everything always
Sounds good to me
Hub motors are for tourists,get a shift sensor educate yourself.
I've got a Befang bbso2 that is absolutely silent. My hub drive ebike is way louder.
After 4000 mi same chain on middrive. Midrive with torque sensor is more like riding a regular bike. $1,600. New
So you wouldn't be walking if the bike had a hub motor? Broken chain with no spares/tools = walking, whether the bike has mid, hub or NO motor! If you don't learn this lesson via first-hand experience you should learn it from the zillions of stories from those who did.
Bbshd vs dual 2kw hub motors
Converted my bike to a mid drive...BBSHD...reprogrammed it to be less brutal on drive train..literally never ride my rear hub drive fat bike anymore. Going up for sale..and going to build a mid drive fat bike. 160nm of torque vs 80nm is not even close....the performance is superior. Then again..I'm not just putzing around the city.
I havent broken a chain yet on an ebike. That being said, I carry a spare with me.
i think hub wheel is better. i got a wheel hub.
I Guess they don't sell spare chains.
First, chain repair tools. A chain breaker and some master links would fix the problem in 10 minutes.
I have a Tongshen and a Bafang BBSHD and the Tongshen was about $400 and doesn’t need a gear sensor. It’s definitely louder, but it’s also half the weight of the BBSHD. I’ve broken several cables with the Bafang so a gear sensor is a good idea. Also having spares with you.
I also have two hub motor bikes and they have a place, but I don’t think they are more efficient and they don’t seem to have the controller built in which could be good or bad depending on how much modifying you like to do and have space for on the bike
I would get a motorized gas bike with a front electric hub so I wouldn't worry if the chain breaks
just bring a master link next time
You broke a chain because your motor has no torque sensor! Motors with torque sensor like CYC operate much smoothly. I have CYC STEALTH and I have never broken my chain.
Chains can and do break. I've broken a chain on a Raleigh DL1 (and a few derailleur bikes) that had no motor, which is the end of the ride unless you have an extra link and chain tool in your kit.
If you have a hub motor you're not stranded.
i have worn out 20 chains to 1 break. the broken chain was a rusty used chain that came with the bike that i tried to save. Chains only break from foolishness
Chains break without a motor at all.
Bbshd on my build. 3200miles on it so far. No torque sensor, no broken chains.
Just don't use x z kmc and it won't break when shifting, i am not joking. shim, wiperman, sram 10s+
Did you forget to mention that the mid drives are difficult to ride if you run out of battery power…
Mid drive is the ONLY sensible choice, hub motors suck.
Especially if you encounter bad hills, or need to pull a trailer.
I’ve run both, and the mid drive is better for *my* needs. (It’s what I bought…)
Great video but very misconceiving thumbnail
Um, have you ridden a bike with a better-designed mid-drive like a Bosch, Yamaha, or Brose motor? I think not! You need to do that before you throw out these generalizations that are, I am aware, your personal opinion, but not necessarily accurate.
yikes 😳
IF YOUR CHAIN BREAKS ON ON ANY BIKE YOUR SCREWED
Ya.. so many issues here.. the fact that you don't carry a tool kit or even a chain breaker says a lot.. probably don't even have an ebike rated chain and not using your gears correctly either.. looks to me you don't even have any climbing gears ! Toss that cassette for one with close to 52t Your BBSHD can be turned up to 1,764w you should have no issues at all, you just dont know what your doing or playing dumb for this video. My BBS02 and 52v batt is turned up to 1470w and a beast, i can go up that hill in my climbing gears easily.. on the street i get 33mph throttle alone and with PAS + full throttle iv hit 42mph.. even 46mph drafting a box truck, with a proper build and some skill mid drive ebikes can be awesome
😂😂😂 you broke your chain. Have a spare one, your problems are gone.
I liked everything about mid drive but the noise...being able to drop to my lowest gear and use just motor to get up steep hills was great. But the noise, on my otherwise nearly silent commuter Trek 3700...it was too much. The hub motors I use now are super silent, just as fast, more smooth, and really simple...it is easy to just add more voltage and amps through batteries and controllers. Can run dual hub motors, one in front one in back. That allows for huge amounts of power. The hub motors are a little bit heavier and makes the bike feel a bit odd when actually mountain biking, but I dont use it on the trails much anymore...not anything major, anyway as I was run over by a car a few years back and am permanently disabled.
There is absolutely no reason to ever choose a hub motor over a mid drive motor. What are you doing in the mountains on an electric bike without an extra chain or at least minimum a chain breaker and a master link.
Lol a chain breaker and like 5 master links 😂
- get out of my left ear!!!
Go duel hub motors, and you’ll never buy a piece of shit mid drive again! Lol it’s like riding a dirt bike now!
If you don't want to pedal you can buy an e bike just for that . Why confused yourself of trying with pedals .
I love me some mid drive riders. They are inevitably my best drivetrain customers. It never occurs to them that a drivetrain engineered for human power is going to have more wear and be more failure-prone with human power plus e-power.
My bikes have have hub motors.
You work on these? Dude, you cannot add human power to mid-drive power. Once human power exceeds the motor, yhe motor isn't doing anything but spinning. NO motor has more torque than one human keg. You and I exert more than 100nm's of torque with a single ARM every day in our shops! The chains move faster, because of high speed, so tgey wear faster, but not over any less miles. It sounds like you aren't helping your customers to understand proper shifting and to maintain a proper cadence.
@@MHH3180 - So many misconceptions - customers like you, who don't understand the system, are exactly why mid-drives are profit centers for drive components, and education of any sort is an exercise in futility - like you, they already know it all.
"Dude, you cannot add human power to mid-drive power." - Wrong. That's precisely what happens. Especially with torque sensors, which are on a majority of mid-drives, you provide a little pedal power, and the controller adds a little power. Pedal harder, and the motor supplements with more power. If you're not providing pedal power, you get nothing, so yes, human power is added to mid-drive power.
"Once human power exceeds the motor, yhe motor isn't doing anything but spinning" - No. That motor is capable of far higher rpms than your legs can spin the crank, and it's adding whatever wattage the controller gives it throughout its rpm range.
"NO motor has more torque than one human keg." - Sounds like your mechanical engineering school may have specialized in kegs. Human legs, on the other hand, provide about 400 watts of power for a top-level cyclist - and I have zero top-level cyclist ebike customers - most would be struggling to provide much more than 100 watts of pedaling power for more than a minute or so.
"The chains move faster" - Huh? Same chainrings, same cogs - unless your cycling cadence magically goes up to 400 rpm, the chain speed is going to be just the same.
No amount of "educating the customer" is going to change the physics - whatever pedal power they have is supplemented by mid-drive power - and more total power means more total stress on drive components. More stress equals more wear.
Hub drives, on the other hand, provide power where it's needed, at the wheel, and reduce overall stress on the drive train.
There are only two advantages to mid-drives - it let's the motor (especially a low-wattage motor) benefit from the same gearing advantages your legs have by shifting gears, and you get to swap wheels at will. Mid-drive also has some handling benefits if you're doing competition-level mountain biking - but if you're riding at competition levels, you already know you're going to break things.
Sounds like you're just salty after breaking your chain going down a remote trail with no repair supplies in your cargo lol. Mid-drive motors are way better; once I got one to replace my hub motor kit I am definitely never going back. I bet you either weren't even equipped with an e-bike chain rated for heavier torque, or you were shifting under motor load (user error of mid-drive e-bike).
This is such a biased uninformed review. If have fitted 2 tsdz2 mid drives. First one 7500kms no problems still going second 2000kms no problems. Mid drive uses gears. In hilly country mid drive wins hands down.
Gave this vid a thumbs down. Just painful to watch - some guy snaps his chain in the desert and makes a babbling, rambling video out of it. Yeah, chains break - and it's almost always operator error (shifting under load, using too high a gear, DIY build with a crappy chainline, etc.). I blame the rider, not the mid-drive.
And so easy to fix. All you need is a chain tool to remove damaged link and master link to reconnect chain and you're back on the trail in 2 or 3 minutes. Oh, you didn't pack that? Operator error again, lol!
Throughout vid you mis-speak, repeatedly mixing up mid-drives and hubs - so annoying! You end with "I still love hub motors..." but I think you meant mid-drive. I gave up trying to decode what you were trying to say.
Here's the takeaway: mid-drives are great, but they demand more from the rider. Use your gears (especially low gears) and shift properly (never under load). Dial in your chainline. Use a quality chain and cassette. Ride your bike, don't punish it.
My mid-drive's closing in on 10K miles with zero problems and zero broken chains. Very much doable.
Mid drive on a mountain bike is hands down better, your problem is you are on a piece of crap bike and running some crap setup. If you had yourself a higher end setup, you wouldn't say this.
Pretty sure your full of it. I ride mid drive and ride it hard. You broke the chain, not the bike. Carry a spare chain. My mid drive has a shift sensor and cuts the motor when you shift. Learn to use the gears properly. You burned up two hub drive motors too? How did those ride home? Yeah I know, you pedaled. Not impressed. Ground clearance is hardly any different. Look at actual measurements. Carry a spare chain and learn how to shift. I am 67 and weigh 260 lbs and ride 7 miles up a local mtn that your hub drive would never make it up. Mid drive is a much more natural riding experience matching your power input instead of just accelerating up to top speed of each pas setting. To each his own but I love my mid drive. Good video but I disagree with most of it! By the way, mine is very quiet. As quiet as any other ebike I have heard.
yeah definitely always carry a $15 chain if you're in the mountains. the only real reason to buy a hub motor is cost, all the other reasons are kinda silly
I have ridden 10s of thousands of km without a chain. And you want this guy to carry an EXTRA chain? sounds like mid drive is terrible. hub drive all the way. no one wants to mess with chains.
@@difflocktwo yes you're right mid drives are terrible. don't carry spares
Get a belt drive.
Dude you have zero clue. Mid drives are much more efficient. I am guessing based on your bike you ran a crap chain. You run a shift sensor with a 1000 watt BBS HD that peaks at 1600 watts and 180nm of torque. Max on 99% of hubs is 80nm torque. Ah nevermind!!!
lol
Hubs suck..
One of the worst videos I've seen on the subject. I would guess you have never ridden a hub drive ebike and are ignorant of their flaws. Next time, please, write down your talking points and review them for quality before you release them into the world
Do Americans really talk like that?