Melanie Martinez is getting cancelled (AGAIN!) full explanation…
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ก.ย. 2024
- This story focuses on the allegations from 2017 about Melanie Martinez sexually assaulting her former friend, Timothy Heller. Who went into hiding for 8 years after Melanie Martinez fans have created fake proof that Melanie is innocent. I’m not saying I believe Timothy, but we don’t know what’s true and what’s fake. Find out in todays video what recently has happened between Timothy Heller and Melanie Martinez. This is the full story.
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Taggies♡´･ᴗ･`♡: #melaniemartinez #timothyheller #fyp #artist #singer #viral #melanie #timothy #viralvideo #fyp #fypシ゚viral #fypppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp #viralshorts #videos #martinezmelanie #foryou #drama #celebrity #celebritynews
SOMEONE CALLED HER MELDIDDY MARTENIZ
@@mar_ate BYE
IMMA GO INTO MY GRAVE RQ
IM CRYINGGGG IJBOL
HELP LMAO
BRO WTFF 😨😭😭
Is no one gonna talk about the picture of Ariana on the side 😭
GIRL I WAS FINNA SAY- 😭😭
Ariana just chilling lol
ARIANA WHAT ARE U DOING HEREE
We see it! 😂
Hahahaha
Ima be honest if melanie is guilty i will explode and delete spotify i will actually float all the way past the galaxy
literally, she’s the only reason I got Spotify‼️😖😔
I listen to many other artist but I listen to her the most😔
If she is guilty, I’m moving on to pinkpantheress, Jazmin bean, and elita, those are my other fav artists. I also deleted ALL my vids and yeah. Clean slate I guess.
@@bunniesdiorIdk About Elita Bc She Got Cancelled Too Just Now For Being Into Weird Stuff On Tumblr,But I Hope/Think She’s Probably Changed Now Probably-
SAMMME😭😏
For the people who keep on thinking “Why doesn’t Timothy just go to court and deal with this instead of social media?” : court cases are extremely expensive, time consuming, and stress inducing. 🍇 cases aren’t taken seriously, especially female on female ones. mel is also a millionaire & has a wide fanbase of loyal fans who (did already) attack Timothy for speaking out, she has an extreme advantage
even if the cost wasnt a problem - it's not, because timothy is not lacking in money, including the fact that taking it to the court would be easier, mentally than going to the internet after being "run off" of it and reviving the situation after it had died down, including the same fans that had taken part in the burial of it, there would still be no way to prevail with a case like this because of the fact that there is no solid proof to take to the court as this entire thing is based off of a she said she said thing as well as her inconsistent statements, which dont prove that she was lying about everything, but would give the advantage to melanie, not to mention the statement of globelamp and the person that she had also accused of being a rapist would likely not be forgotten.
But going to court is the best solution.
@@dhsf5937going to court is difficult. i had security video footage of me being assaulted, license plate #, and i correctly ID’d my assaulter in a lineup. the police twiddled their thumbs until statute of limitations was up. you guys should really educate yourself on the amount of rape kits that just sit untouched because “it’s too much money and work” for the police to work on these cases.
she should take it to court if its such a big deal
@@bunfi2Some people think she’s not lying because another person said they had the same experience which it’s just she said this their was no proof and the proof that was given was off and Mel was on tour when she said it took place
I personally am not picking sides until Melanie responds or until it is fully proven that Timothy is lying, but hopefully Melanie is not what Timothy is claiming she is. If she is hopefully Timothy is able to get help and recover
Edit: Still not picking side bc we need an updated response, but I'm kind of believing Timothy a bit more (Please don't attack me Melanie stans-)
Edit again: I'm believing Timothy more than Melanie, but either way I'm not going to be supporting either of them
👍
Same.
@@MuddyNewts Same. I think it’s most responsible to wait until both sides of the story are out and then decide an an an educated opinion.
Melanie did respond when the accusations first came out just search up her response
@@Swaggylicous Those statements were made very long ago, however. I believe it’s best to wait until an up-to-date response so she can clear some things up.
@@Swaggylicous I did, but it’s hard for me to believe her at the moment.😅 Im hoping she’ll respond again now that Timothy resurfaced everything
“Believe all victims” until the accused is someone you like.
THIS! Thank you!
I dont know why people say "Believe all victims" there's also a handful of "victims" who have lied about it and I feel like that's something everyone always forgets. Like I have a lot of friends who have went through it, hell even my mom. Yes there is a lot of victims who tell the truth but there's also a lot who have lied about it to gain something out of it. This stuff shouldn't be handled like nothing it's serious and people need to deep dive of both sides before believing one person without hearing out the other 🤦🏽♀️
@@IntrusiveFaerie would u rather believe a liar. or a rapjist?
@@Hysteriette I don't know who to believe but i do believe that Timothy needs to stop talking about this on social media because all its doing is just going to get Melanie cancelled or she will go back to hiding, there's really nothing to gain from it. if she is telling the truth she should take it to court. ranting about it online is not going to get her anywhere.
@@MELS_LOOZER > about taking to court, get off of the internet and see how the world treats SA victims
remember, if YOU want to separate the art from the artist, that's okay. nobody else can tell you what to do, regardless is she is innocent or guilty. and honestly, most artists have skeletons in their closet or at least some controversy, so avoiding artists that have done bad things is very hard. by saying this, i am not discrediting timothee. like that clip said, we do not know melanie and we will never know what truly happened between them. but, the decision whether or not to listen to melanie martinez is yours and yours only to make. also, if you really have your heart set on not supporting her but still listening to her music, going onto youtube and searching for lyrics videos on random accounts that arent melanie is a great way to do that!
@@phoebesunbook1737 it’s always ok to listen to an artist. Like you said, allat of artist (like me) have done allat of bad things and that will never erase from them. But it’s hard to say I like melanie bc people ask me who I listen to and I usually say Melanie and other artist but then they say “isn’t melanie a 🍇ist?” and it’s kinda hard to say who you like these days. At one point I stopped listening to her for getting bullied for it but I just decided it’s kinda stupid to not listen to a artist just bc other ppl don’t like them. But yes definitely agree bc ppl need to do their research. And every person done something bad, even if it’s illegal. So I guess nothing is wrong if you listen to Melanie or any other artist
Thank you, this really made me feel better ❤.
Thats why im a fan of no one,fandoms need to learn that artists are still people and people do bad things.
I do however recommended listening to content of the artist from other people who uploaded it as of to not support them!!
Tbh saying “she didn’t say no” makes it sound like Melanie doesn’t know what consent is
Neither do you or anyone else on the receiving end.. obviously
@@chayo4537 I don’t totally know what u js said but did u js call me a bottom?
@@fifteendozenalleyroses LMAO😭😭
@@fifteendozenalleyroses HELPP
Absolutely. She is guilty.
if melanie actually did do that, i would quit editing for life
@@gearypeary I would quit music because my music is inspired by her and ai songs
Don’t worry I didn’t ❤
I mean we will probably never get to know the truth
I'll quit listening to music again
noo omg, if she did then switch to editing sabrina carpenter if you’re a fan of her, she’s amazingg
Im so tired of arbitrary judgments and jumping to conclusion without evidence
"Melanie does NOT know you" you dont have to say it twice queen😔😔😔😔
Sorry bbg
@@pandymartinez Its okay😔🙏
I don't support either of them but you can't cancel without evidence
mel said that "she didnt say no"
@@tvgirlislove melanie she said “she never said no to what we chose to do together” you guys never include the full sentence.
@@kimar000it means the same thing bruh
@@kimar000 You’re actually so slow. “She never said no to what we chose to do together” I don’t care how much you love Melanie or think she wouldn’t do such a thing as rape, you literally don’t know her. Just because she acts all sweet and innocent in front of a camera, doesn’t mean you know how she is off of it. That sentence literally made no sense. So she didn’t say no, but she never said yes either… I feel like y’all are reading, but aren’t comprehending.
@@MissKitty952 i never said all that. ☠️ i’m just saying u guys never include the whole statement.
i personally believe innocent until proven guilty because Melanie speaks out about SA and i just think its weird that when Melanie is doing well career wise, timothy speaks up again
❗️❗️
Information that could support Timothy:
guys I just want to put out there that most “proof” that Melanie is innocent was made up and created by fans!! and also the ones saying that Melanie was on crybaby tour, the event did happen because Melanie even SPOKE about it in a tweet. She said and I quote, “she never said no to what we chose to do together.” I’m sorry but that sentence sounds VERY manipulated. Saying “chose” instead of something like consented or that they both said yes can be taken multiple ways and the whole thing of “she didn’t say no” is SO off-putting. Also Melanie made a later tweet about thanking fans for “analyzing past posts and timelines” that disproves the accusations?? which is so confusing even tho she stated in the tweet before that something happened between them.
About taking the case to court:
Also it’s almost impossible for Timothy to take this to court since it’s really hard for any SA victim to take things into court and since it’s also so long ago and there isnt much evidence.
My standpoint:
I love Melanie and going to the trilogy tour was one of the best nights of my life, my whole room is full of her and her merch. I have to say that right now I’m supporting Timothy. After watching her tiktok video, if what she’s saying is true I can not IMAGINE the pain and trauma she went through (she was horribly backlashed and not even Melanie tried to stop it) and NO ONE deserves that. I would much rather stand with someone who could have very likely been a victim that went through horrible trauma and had to hide for years than the accuser. We don’t know what melanie is like outside of public view and EVERYONE makes mistakes some point in their life, no one is perfect. If it really is true all I would want is for Melanie to apologize and accept her actions but we never really know what actually happened except the two of them
also ty for this video and informing other people!!
finally someone who gets how court works
Heya! Neutral here, I agree with all of your points. If you look at my other comments it looks like I defend Timothy but I don’t. I just debunk/question people who support Melanie. Some things don’t line up on both sides and it’s confusing
@@Buddypiez_world you’re totally right! I think my strong morals just have me standing with Timothy but I think it can still be reasonable to also be neutral!
I'm personality neutral cause she changed some detail in the story many time plus I heard that after the drama she was annoying other celeb so I suspeted her to doing this for attention even if this is real BUT you are rigth the fan proof feel so fake and do not excuse anything who would innocent mel the way Melanie react on the allegations ... plus if it wasn't true why do Timothy don't give up ? The fan harrased her for so long they ruin her life forever more than melanie if I was her give them what they want would be last thing I will do
I really hope Melanie clears this up soon, the amount of years this has gone on is crazy!! And these so called Melanie fans are NOT helping!!
I actually think it’s so crazy how former Melanie fans are destroying merch because of this
And me wanting them but not able to afford them-💀
Like give them to me
@@R0TT3N.T0X1NZFr
Just like last time, they could at least get money by selling it
Seriously whats the point?? You already paid money for it why not sell it and get ya money back?
Some people have to understand that sometimes it's hard for the victim to get clear solid evidence of SA. That's why not a lot of real SA cases are taken to court.
3:26 if we believe all victims, then it would be so easy for folks to lie.
Yeah that's true
Statistically, false accusations are rare. and men falsely accuse more than women
Yes, they clearly never heard of "amber" heard 😭
@@waylensmithnevermore
Amber Heard?
The Tubbo situation basically
“Believe the victim” We don’t even know if she really is the victim. Imagine being accused of rape. If Timothy lied, imagine how the REAL victim must be feeling then. We DEFINITELY need more info in everything. The times in which Timothy called her out are also weird like exactly when Mel becomes big and famous like…?!?
Guilty until proven innocent, bae xo
@@angelpathicits innocent until proven guilty not guilty until proven innocent if that was the case then both of them are guilty of rape
RIGHT as the same thing happend to kwite kwite was accused of rape or SA and the flop that said it was lying sooo
@@angelpathicactually it’s the other way around bae xo
@Maxyypurr that's a single occasion. People also blamed Dream for that sort of thing and he turned out actually doing it.
Guilty until proven is a real thing.
Dude whatever happened was wrong, if someone is lying or grape happened its wrong but they should be able to handle this without fans butting in and take it to court like adults
always believe the victim first, Timothy also isn’t trying to get melanie in trouble she just wanted to speak up about her experience again because the last time she did it everyone put her into hiding, also sa cases are really difficult to get into court especially if it happened years ago.
I agree with everything except the last part, court doesnt take SA seriously, its expensive and Melanie is a millionaire so she can afford better lawyers
love how absolutely no one here knows how the legal system works!! you really think a lawyer hired by someone who barely made a name for themself is gonna want to take on a case against a literal celebrity? not to mention, this case is insanely difficult to prosecute because it's two women, and juries are notoriously unpredictable. timothy winning the court of public opinion is the best thing she can do
After reading everyone’s replies I’m gonna go back on my previous statement, I know see how the court would also be unfair because the judiciary system is kinda trash and I apologize, I was being bias when I’ve tried to take a neutral stance. My original stance was trying to be neutral but I have been incredibly bias so I am sorry
@@imabauhausbabyyy while I agree there is a crisis in which rapists tend to get off lightly in some cases you're also not considering the reputable consequences that come with being found guilty of this. Being labelled as a sex offender destroys chances of landing jobs, pursuing education or even being allowed near certain places without supervision. ( As should said consequences be ), so think about how detrimental a label that would be for Melanie who is an international pop celebrity, the consequences are very much there.
Also you're right Melanie has overall better resources but that's not my concern as Melanie is still a citizen of the law just like Timothy is. Anthony Starr smashed a glass cup into a younger guy's face because he drunkly got into a fight with him, while he did bail that shit is still going to stain his career badly.
What concerns me is Timothy's statement, is it even going to be taken seriously in the criminal court system? It's what she's said that's buried her chances under. Timothy claimed she took no physical precautions to stop Melanie despite the fact that she made it "perfectly" clear. Is that not a contradiction? You can't say you're not fine with being charged at with a weapon and yet stand there and let the situation unfold, why is it different for SA? Timothy was under no mortal danger, no threats, no blackmail, no physical restraint, had no history of mental or physical illness preventing her from physically doing something, so what exactly is she weaponizing against Melanie? Her refusal to physically communicate or defend her dignity?
She claims she told Melanie no multiple times and yet she did not follow up with these messages of her will, would this not be an indication of giving in? Is giving in not an act of will? It's important to remember these two had a best friend relationship at the time, it's entirely possible Melanie saw this as playing hard to get. Seriously though, if Timothy had done anything: scream, shout, yell, push her away, slap her hands away, pull away herself or shown any acts of clear physical intent do you genuinely think Melanie wouldn't have backed off? Yet she admitted to doing nothing, keep in mind Timothy was an adult three years older than Melanie, there was no power imbalance preventing Timothy from taking physical precautions.
And how exactly was she transported to a more private setting if she just 'froze up'? How were her clothes removed? Is she saying Melanie just ripped them off? If this legally can't be counted as rape by assault or coercion then how is she going to argue this point in court?
If anything she's just given Melanie something to weaponize against her, as she's using her ambiguous behavior and mixed messaging as a way to accuse her of SA/Rape. Melanie could potentially sue that as unfair slander and defamation. The way Timothy described her lack of action literally sounds like she's leading this other woman on.
Also worth noting Timothy claimed they were both drunk, if Timothy was not in her right state of mind then does this also not apply to Melanie?
This is just my opinion, but why do people think it’s so easy for Timothy to take this to court? I’m not trying to pick sides, but trying to win a case against a millionaire with an incident that happened years ago is near impossible.
I don’t think she even tried honestly it just doesn’t feel like it nor is there evidence that she did.
Yo imma say this and take it with a grain of salt. This is 100% a misunderstanding that could’ve been dealt with privately. Doesn’t matter if the allegations are serious or not you have to be neutral or shit gets spun out of control. What you don’t do whoever side you choose is harass the people in this situation until everything is out and clear. False accusations and allegations can ruin many lives including the people involved. It’s innocent until proven guilty. Y’all need to stop changing this, many men get accused of this shit too and by saying that it has ruined innocent ppls lives.
Since when was SA a misunderstanding
@@SwaggylicousSince both parties can be intoxicated and/or high. Consent is all about consiousness.
@@Swaggylicous they were both intoxicated and both decided to play an x game together. Use your brain.
I’m 14, and have been listening to her since I was 6. She really helped me get thru a lot of tough times, her music even saved me from killing myself, no kidding. So when I found out about the r@pe allegations, I was shocked. I at first believed Timothy, and after a lot of videos and reaserch, I decided to STAY NEUTRAL, because some stuff from Timothy didn’t line up, and as much as I wanted to believe Melanie, I couldn’t without any trustful source declaring that she was innocent. Now this resurfaced again (weird timing if you ask me, both during tours, JUST AN OBSERVATION.), and ppl are saying that she drew CP, too… I felt sick at my stomach. I can’t with this anymore. And also, for people saying “Why don’t they take it to court”, IF TIMOTHY IS TELLING THE TRUTH, they won’t believe her either way, because the court brushes off SA victims A LOT. And I mean A LOT. So, while everyone, probably even them, want to take it to court, the chances are low. (Also because if in court they ask for proof, the only proof would be the little they can find on the internet)
Melanie drawing CP was actually debunked so dw :)
@@kaylee84243 That’s a relief! But are u 100% sure??
But she should still be taking it to court
@@Melanie_fan4lifee well yeah
@@Melanie_fan4lifee It’s not that easy, you know. Court cases are expensive and very burocratic (
Coming from a victim I think we should all stay neutral until further evidence
Why is Ariana in the corner and not Melanie or sum
Ariana what are you doing here
@@cryingportals it’s because I’m an Ariana fan too. And I don’t have to put Melanie if I don’t want to. I’m also a multifandom, I post about many artist and not just Melanie. If it bothers you so much then why watch the video
@@pandymartinez is wasn’t on the thumbnail
I was just wondering why put Ariana in a video that doesn’t concern her at all
It’s weird how ages back Timothy Heller was accusing Melanie of stuff aswell, now she is coming back up with it? This is my opinion so don’t come at me, I think Timothy heller is jealous that’s why she is doing this and she just wants to get Melanie Martinez gone for good.
Probably because she’s getting more famous, she knows that more people will pay attention and hopefully get the full story out. Also didn’t fans literally leak all her information? It’s no wonder she went into hiding
@@solong_abigail ikr
I rlly don't wanna believe Timothy there is so much proof against her so Mel is innocent?.but people are like getting mad cuz of Mel believers I'm not trying to get hated on but I'm here for Melanie all the way
yeah and the timing it was always weird, like the first time it was some weeks after timothy released a song and just before k-12, now before the trilogy tour... its weird
I dont know who to believe she needs to take this to court
Believe melanie I know she's innocent cuz on the day Timothy said this happened, Melanie was on her crybaby tour
court? there is rarely justice for SA victims in a court of law, let alone against a celebrity.
Timmothy used an ai voice of Melanie…
@@Toast10-f7y ye, but nevertheless she could have something where at the time Timothy didn’t say she was uncomfortable and then Timothy took it as abuse
Right
I’m actually scared. What if Melanie is proven to be guilty? I have some merch from her so idk what would I do, I wouldn’t like to burn it since it would cause damage to the planet and my mom already bought tickets for the trillogy tour for my birthday, I wouldn’t like all that money to go to waste but if she is proven guilty by the date of the concert I really dont know what am I gonna do, my heart is beating fast asf I really hope that Melanie isn’t a bad person, she has helped me so much…
Yeah, I have Mel posters. If Melanie is accused of being guilty, I won't do anything to the posters until one of them ACTUALLY gets exposed.
@goose3475 I upcycle the merch if you can or sell it but I think it's too early to pick sides
Im just gonna keep my vinyl, it did cost a shit ton
Her actions dosent prove your a fan, her music does i do this with the neighborhood, i seperate the people from the music, meaning ill still listen to that band but i wont support the people or artist because of what they did, i only listen to them for their music, i hope that makes
IF SHE DOES GET GUILTY GIVE THE MERCH TO ME INSTEAD OF WASTING IT😉
I can see both sides of the story, but isn't it "funny" how Timothy has only talked about this when Melanie's career is doing good?? For example, during the Cry Baby tour, PORTALS tour etc. If this story was true, i feel like the timing of speaking up about it wouldn't align with how popular Melanie is at the moment. I'm not saying that Timothy is a liar, but the timing is very odd. (also i'm not really a fan of either people so i'm not biased i'm just going by the couple videos i've watched 😭)
NO FR I NOTICED THAT TOO?
@@vxkyy_ysame but some people are saying it's for Timothy to get more attention like grow TF up do u not realize Timothy is almost 100% lying?
@@Mel_fanforlife NO EXACTLY LIKE TIMOTHY NEED TO NOTICE THAT SHES GONNA GET ATTACKED AND EXPOSED SOON BY MEL,AND ALL HER FANS😭✊
She's been talking about it for ages but people ignored her. It makes sense to bring it up again when she's doing well as many people will see the allegations made.
@@Mel_fanforlife how do you know she's lying?
The way Melanie worded her little note/twitter post was so bad.
I can’t believe you I’m putting you on my video
Timothy is so freaking jealous of Melanie, but if Melanie is not lying, separate the art from the artist and why did the allegations come back after the concerts???
bc mel is at her peak so timothy reminded everyone what kind of person she is
@@xxRioWe don’t know if she’s a bad person just yet, so you can’t really say that
@@ThikkiNikkiOfficial We do though, Melanie said it herself
@@xxRio when?
"jealousy"? not an real argument
I don't understand one thing. If Melanie abused her...why is she dressing up like her and posed photos like her? Sounded more like an obsessive stalker to me. Her words and her actions are not aligned at all. I know about SA. I had almost been a victim. And I do not even wait to blow the whistle because blowing the whistle is the only way to keep me safe. Not to mention, it have been 10 years since I last saw the guy that tried to SA me. I didn't even want to look at him let alone hear anything about him. What I'm saying is as a victim, I won't want to be related to my abuser in any way or form. Especially in pictures.
She did say that she was very attached to Melanie and codependent. She could've still felt attachment even after all that happened. It's possible. Not everyone reacts the same way to trauma.
I feel bad for you. At the same time are all humans the same those pictures are from a long time ago and she is a different person so her reactions won't be similar to yours do not compare SA to your own experiences
They were friends when she posted the photos in Melanie's wigs/when she dressed up like Melanie. Melanie did her makeup in one of those photos also. Lots of SA victims that are friends with/dating their abuser don't instantly drop them after it happens. The man that did it to me was my boyfriend, I stayed with him for about 2 months afterwards and tried convincing myself he was a good person. Timothy was doing the same exact thing. And for the record I'm on no ones side, but that's an easy thing to debunk.
@@kewuofthedownsidei can confirm this, denial can seriously affect people and it’s to protect us but can lead to us being friends with our abusers to justify it. admitting what happened is painful but necessary for healing.
Heres the thing, there isn't any real proof that i can find against melanie or to prove her innocent. As a victim i also dont personally understand why timothy would go into hiding rather than keep fighting, but everyoneworks through stuff differentlyand perhapsthis is her attempt to keepfighting. Also most r@pists and sa-ers are repeat offenders so it also doesn't help Timothy's case that there is only her allegations against melanie. I also find it a little convenient that this is only being brought up again why melanie is honesty the most popular, successful and talked about ive seen her in her career. I'm waiting for more information before taking sides
Edit: Also the fact that Melanie admitted to doing stuff with timothy doesn't really mean anything to me. They could've done stuff consentually at first and then something nonconsenual happened or it could have been one or the other, however I find that if melanie or anyone were to lie and say they didn't sa someone it would be best to deny anything sexual happened at all so to me it doesn't make sense that she would lie about the sa but still admit to other sexual acts with timothy
Edit: Just found out about the other allegations of sa against melanie. It isn't looking good for her. Still waiting for a response though.
She went into hiding because the Melanie fans LEAKED her address, phone number, family phone number, etc.
@pandymartinez It's too early for me to pick sides but leaking an address isn't ok. That is the only thing that is proven that I will pity for Timothy. I don't think that we should act like all Melanie fans leaked her address. There are many ppl who didn't do that. Yes, I agree this is bad but picking sides with no proof won't help. Either way if she gets canceled there is a good chance ppl will listen to her just bc the music. It's hsppend before (with Kanye drama, and Ariana cheating). 2024 is just getting worse....
@pandymartinez the Internet is a terrible place to talk about something serious like that, especially if it's someone famous, it's more than obvious nowadays for anyone to know that every fan base has fans who are obsessed and sick with someone, it only makes the situation worse, he knows? it would be better to make a statement after starting a legal process together with the possible other victims of the alleged rapes that mel committed
@@pandymartinez ah thank you for telling me
@pandymartinez also thank you for starting this conversation. I know it's really tough for some folks but I appreciate you taking your time to do so
It’s such a shame because I love Melanie Martinez’s music so much but I’m not sure if I want to listen to it anymore because I don’t want to support someone who’s been doing such terrible things.
The name of the song is piggyback while this song highlights Melanie's life experiences and then she mentioned that the friend that she mentioned was timothy heller
I don't know if anyone mentioned this but the diss track (although unconfirmed) was most likely piggyback which is only available on sound cloud because Melanie didn't want to profit off of it. The lyrics pretty much talk about friends and family that have tried to ride off her fame. Hope this helps!
My only question is.. if you get proven guilty but your actually innocent. Like is it possible your innocent but you get proven guilty? Because I don’t want Melanie my only comfort to be canceled
The only way I think to be innocent and be proven guilty is that the liar (not saying Timothy unless she is proven a liar) in the case brings out some fake proof that the innocent couldn't defend themselves over.
Sorry if it doesn't make sense!
And yeah. I loved Melanie for such a long period of time, so seeing her being proven guilty would be an absolute nightmare.
I’m not picking sides here, but why is Timothy specifically posting this whole thing on social media? Like, if I had a situation like this, I’m reporting it to court immediately. This is such a drastic and horrible situation.
because court is complicated and unreliable. juries are unreliable. its pretty much impossible to prosecute this case because a. the two have been close friends, b. they're both women, and c. melanie has the resources to receive MUCH better legal representation
@@imabauhausbabyyy oh! I didn’t know that. But anyways..what’s even Timothy’s whole point of these accusations??☹️
@@polariceberg it’s hard for Timothy to go to court because there will be an unfair advantage. So many celebrities have gotten away with shit that any normal person would get sued or sentenced to. Melanie is a celebrity in her prime right now so there will be an advantage. Like any sexual assault victim, if you’re unable to go to court you have to resort to the only other option, social media. While I do agree that this is convenient timing, no sexual assault victim should have to be silenced because their abuser is famous. She wants to speak out about what happened to her. It would be very upsetting if she lies but it’s guilty until proven innocent.
@@polariceberg did u want her to shut up about her own experiences? are u serious?
this kinda stuff is personal if this happend to me I wouldnt say shit i would not go to the internet but thats what people do i would take this to court not social media
None of us will ever really know what happened. Only Timothy and Melanie know. Untortunately the rest is impossible to prove or disprove.
And another reason why Mel is probably innocent, (this looks bad from me cause I'm a Mel fan acc-) The first time Timothy accused Melanie it was when she was becoming a star and going on her first tour? And what's odd to me is that now when Timothy is starting to blame her again it's when she won female artist of the year and she's going on a huge tour, regaining fame. It's weird that she only does it when Mel is getting more popular.
Both Mel and Timothy were doing different things on the days Timothy accused her and they weren't together. I believe Mel was on tour in LA/NYC and Timothy was at a pool with two of her other friends so it makes no sense. If you can read body language you can also see that in her video where she makes this claim, she is showing signs of nervous lying. And she claimed it happened in 2015 and they stopped being friends In 2016 but she posted in 2017 that her and Melanie where still friends. It would also make sense that she wouldn't want to take it to court because she could be arrested for false allegations. She also dressed up as Melanie for Halloween once which is weird to me because if you have so much trauma from it, why would you dress as your abuser? I'm pretty sure based of all of this evidence Melanie is innocent but we can't know until she is proven innocent or guilty.
Omg finally someone else viewing the body language too i thought i was the only one doing that-
It’s suspicious timing but I do think sa victims should not have to be silenced just because their perpetrator is famous or on a tour
Im not going to ignore the fact that Timothy said she is a “victim” but I am 100% sure, she is lying. The body language and her having to write down what she was gonna say? Also the fact she dressed as Melanie. The timing she decides to bring this up again. It baffles me how someone can try and ruin another's life, because of jealousy.
Neither do I but this sa victim has so many signs and holes in her story that makes me believe she is lying.
@@MadisonMcLeod-b8r yeah but you’re guilty only until proven guilty innocent so my approach is to just ignore it bc I’d feel real fucking bad if Melanie was proven guilty and I didn’t believe it.
"I feel bad for sa victims" until the abuser is someone you like
I’m TERRIFIED Melanie is my comfort singer. I CANT believe Timothy until I hear from Melanie. I’m scared and anxious.
I think its way to early for anyone to be defending anyone. There isn't enough out yet, people should ask questions and not harass either.
The victim's only evidence is "trust me bro"
thats.. also melanie's only rebuttal.
@@woerm yh which is why the whole debate should be dropped
@@LiverSundae yh?
@@woerm idk what ur asking, do u not know what it means/genq, yh means yeah
It’s like a “she said they said” right???
2:38 The diss track was piggyback it’s on SoundCloud because Melanie didn’t want the money for it
4:42 Who? Crow? Because Crow isn’t a victim blamer. He, himself, was SA’d and is sickened by Timothy.
It's 'believe all victims' until it's someone you support. I would prefer supporting a victim and being wrong about it than supporting a potential and accused abuser. No matter who they are. The majority of the statements used against Timothy are so victim blaming her and damaging for every SA victim out there, and attacking her is wild, especially considering none of us know Melanie personally, not even their fans. The 'diss track' Timothy is talking about is the song Piggyback btw, check the lyrics and the time Melanie released it.
Melanie has been absolutely silent, and to be honest Timothy’s video was very raw and felt real. I believe her. I’ve been a fan since 2015, Melanie has meant a lot to me and was really the first artist I ever listened to on my own. But I don’t know her personally and neither do you. When someone comes forward with a sexual assault story, believe them.
And for those saying “we need more proof.” What the fuck more proof do you need? We can’t time travel back to that night and see what happened. We can only take Melanie and Timothy’s word for it. At the end of the day, they’re the only ones who truly know what happened, and Timothy had a very detailed story. She’s not trying to get fame or sympathy, she has gotten absolutely none of that from this. She has been horribly abused by all of you; just because you want to defend some woman you’ve never met.
It’s okay if you still like Melanie Martinez. I still like her too. I like her music, I like her aesthetics. But defending someone blindly when they’re being accused of something like this is just wrong. You can listen to her music and enjoy it without needing to excuse all of her behavior.
Sorry for ranting. It’s just my opinions.
Don't apologize. We need more people to stand with victims. It isn't just about Timothy at this point, it's about victims of abuse in general. They all deserve better than this.
“She never said no” also means she didn’t say yes. so technically that counts as a no. If someone doesn’t explicitly say yes, take it as a no. I’m a victim myself and I’ll always side with victims because it’s better to side with a liar than an abvser
you’re the only person here with common sense thank you 😭
REAL.
the full sentence is she didn't say no to what we CHOOSE to do together meaning anything they did together was consented
YUPPP, CLOCK IT!!
@@ramonajavier5938it was probably a forced yes use your brain a forced yes is still a no.
Edit: This whole comment is my own opinion.
I'm not just defending Melanie because I'm obsessed with her and bc shes famous, I'm saying this because she is not the kind of person to do this I've known her for 4 to 5 years and she would never be the kind of person to do this because she made a song about this entire situation and spread awareness and help people who have gone through it. Why are we bringing this up 8 years later after it happened? If Timothy is making such a big deal about it then Timothy should give the information to court and not tiktok for everybody to see. Melanie has been preaching love and kindness ever since her first song. And also, why is Timothy now bringing this up again while she's on a tour with millions of fans and when she's famous? I don't think she would be the kind of person to do this.
Wait do you personally know her? I’m not trying to be rude or anything, but if you’re a fan who has listened and watched her for the last 4 - 5 years, you still don’t know her personally. All you would know is what she presents, not what goes on after she posts or is done with a concert. Anyone can put on an act and actually be a completely different person in real life. There are a lot of examples of people who were thought to be amazing but turned out to be not so great.
Again, I’m just putting that out there, not trying to be rude. And I’m not saying I believe what Melanie is being accused of happened. (But I really hope it didn’t happen because a lot of people love her music, including me, and SA is a horrible thing) But I do agree that this would be completely against what Melanie has been promoting over the years. And she has been putting out nothing but positivity since the start.
@@perrydot2021 no, I don't. But yes, all of that makes sense but Melanie still has to make a response so this is what I think so far.
@@The_FairyRP oh yah, hopefully the response is well done, she explains what’s going to on, and what did or did not happen. But mostly hoping it ends this whole thing
Exactly she would never do this- she is my only comfort to my insecurities.
And another reason why Mel is probably innocent, (this looks bad from me cause I'm a Mel fan acc-) The first time Timothy accused Melanie it was when she was becoming a star and going on her first tour? And what's odd to me is that now when Timothy is starting to blame her again it's when she won female artist of the year and she's going on a huge tour, regaining fame. It's weird that she only does it when Mel is getting more popular.
Both Mel and Timothy were doing different things on the days Timothy accused her and they weren't together. I believe Mel was on tour in LA/NYC and Timothy was at a pool with two of her other friends so it makes no sense. If you can read body language you can also see that in her video where she makes this claim, she is showing signs of nervous lying. And she claimed it happened in 2015 and they stopped being friends In 2016 but she posted in 2017 that her and Melanie where still friends. It would also make sense that she wouldn't want to take it to court because she could be arrested for false allegations. She also dressed up as Melanie for Halloween once which is weird to me because if you have so much trauma from it, why would you dress as your abuser? I'm pretty sure based of all of this evidence Melanie is innocent but we can't know until she is proven innocent or guilty.
Now im not saying its impossible but someone like melanie who has made songs of sa before actualy SAing someone not longly after is kind of a really weird thought
She must not have a good understanding of consent. It's not just Timothy who spoke up against her, there are other girls too
Thank you for making this. There’s just so much information going around about the situation that it’s gotten out of control. Also it’s good that you brought up the bad things Melanie fans did to Timothy because no matter what happened the things they did are still awful.
Kinda glad I got out of the Melanie fandom.
Same
As a Melanie's fan who grew up with her music I truly hope this isn't true but what is true is the fact that there isn't enough evidence on both sides to decide whos lying and whos not and even if the girl whos accusing her is proven innocent I wouldn't support her nor wish her the worst since theres a lot of bad things she herself has done and theres evidence of that if you want to look it up. Also I dont want to hear she was young back then she was 20-23 years old when she did all that meaning she knew what she was doing some of the things she did include racism and more. Anyways I wish the best for both.
Timothy herself had said she wanted to destroy Melanie Martinez career in text messages that were leaked by one of Timothys former friends, she was also controlling over Melanie and said she did it for fun. Melanie tried calling her but she didn't pick up.
most of that information was fake and edited and it was so obvious it was fake as Timothy said in her video
@@defsnotmike Timothy is also a liar as they also accused an innocent person of SA in the past aswell 🙂 (Strawberry shortcake from what i hear)
@@carrie4144 Timothy never accused anyone else all of that was edited 7 years ago, melanie also has four other victims as well
@@defsnotmike the text messages that (i think) the person that wrote this comment was talking about the ones that were shown after the second allegation, not before, so it didn’t happen 7 years ago, and it wasn’t proven false so far.
It isn’t your problem .. it’s Melanie’s and Timothy’s
Tim herself already admitted she did all this bc she was jealous of Melanie's career years ago
2:47 its piggyback
4:26
@@pandymartinez Yea ik i wasnt at the part but also just letting u know its most def piggyback lol:3
The diss track is the song piggyback! It’s only released on SoundCloud. It’s like “now you try to kill my name for some fame” or something like that
its all "I believe the victim first" until its a multimillionaire popstar who advocates against genocide and has such a "kind soul". dont justify rapists just because they make good music.
The internet is a terrible place to talk about something so delicate, she could have made this statement together with a legal process, resolved it with Melanie, they are adults, make a video and wait for something to fall from the sky for her justice It's a bit complicated to resolve, there will be sick fans who will detonate her with the accusations and there will be upset and angry fans cursing Melanie, both will be at a loss, it doesn't make any sense for her to repeat the story ON THE INTERNET KNOWING HOW THE FIRST WAS I know it's scary to report something like this, but come on? she won't get what she wants on the Internet
Timothy literally has lied on Mel's name all the time. When she saw Melanie was getting more famous than her she made these serious allegations to put her down. Timothy has always been obsessed with fame she'd do anything to get to the top. She even used her famous friends to put Melanie down. Timothy is a literally user who makes it hard for real victims of rape or SA to get their stories out there.
@@Ziggy2005those are all opinions. Do you have any not faked proof?
@@moon_1110she's spreading awareness and also letting the internet know she wants to be left alone. Also the "Me too" movement could be a reason she posted it. Going to court against multi-millionaire for girl on girl SA with very little evidence actually sounds like a recipe for disaster. And even if Timonthy found a way to contact Melanie in private there is a very high chance Melanie would just ignore her.
@Nova.123 if she still comes back with the accusations, even if Melanie has money, it is her justice, if you are being wronged and hunted, she could fight for it herself with what she has, it is a stronger act than If you eventually report a rape and end up in this mess again, it results in nothing but stress.
naw if melanie is guilty i’m going to ascend and die
Melanie really needs to speak up. For now I am neutral
Help me why is Mel in so much drama 😭😭😭
The diss track being reffered to is the song "Piggy Back". not the two songs you put up. just to clarify. the lyrics are much more clearly directed at the situation and was released on Melanie's soundcloud during the last canceling episode.
FINALLY, MORE SMART MARTINEZ FANS, THANK YOU!!
Btw can we talk about how timothy defenders are sending grape threats to melanie supporters even though theyre supposed to be against it?
Bro what. That's fucked up.
@@MeePLUSMee update: meowbahh(if you know her) made an animation about Melanie and Timothy, you'll realize the rest
@@Younggirlskeepyouwarm Oh ok. I'll try to check that out.
@MeePLUSMee OK, incase you don't realize, I'll tell you, it's 18+
@MeePLUSMee BTW I forgot to actually mention it's 18+, and basically you shouldn't check it out, just said it so that more people will be aware yknow?
We already know that there was no r@p3. There's no DNA from it, which would be there. Timothy said it wouldn't, but that's not true. She also never even described the toy. Timothy changed the story so many times, with her first post having an entire story in detail, and making an excuse for the other minor things with "it was trauma, I wouldn't remember" and "I was high, I wouldn't remember", even though she wrote an entire story in full detail, even saying that she said 'No' multiple times, despite saying it was hard for her to say No to Melanie. She eventually went on to say the r@p3 was during the game, which is just wrong. Melanie was wearing handcuffs, not her. Melanie's role in that game (the one wearing handcuffs) is the victim. The dice would say what Timothy had to do to her. Also she kept going to Melanie's house like a year after the supposed date, and even after the supposed date that they no longer were friends.
….
Depending on the “activity”, it’s very possible for something to have happened without leaving traces of DNA though. Especially with two women, toys and the like can be used on one partner without any DNA being involved from whoever’s holding it.
You’re free to believe who you’d like but the DNA argument is flawed and it’s important to have everything clear in a situation like this.
Mel also said “she (Timothy) never said no to what we CHOSE to do together” people often leave out CHOSE, and that word heavily implies that Timothy consented to this.
@@Boingo1625 Exactly.
Also, Melanie is on one of her biggest tours right now. Timothy could have shared that story ANY other time that she wanted, and she decides to do it when Mel is going big right now? Is that even just a little bit suspicious to anyone else? And the "It was trauma, I don't remember!". If it's something traumatic that happened to you, your probably gonna remember it. Not every last detail of course, but your gonna remember it
Honestly if something did happen that right, i was likely consensual at first and when Timmothy started fo feel uncomfortable she didht stop melanie giving her an idea that everything was alright. I think it's a miscommunication, Timothy might be lying she might not be, if shes not i believe what I said before. Im not trying to defend Melanie or Timothy this is my opinion.
I dont think this should be or had been taken to the internet in the beginning, i believe it should have been discussed in PRIVATE together. Sadly i doupt it will be taken to court given the night it happened, it was only the two of them, theres sadly not enough physical evidence.
This is exactly what i think happened.
Timothy said she said no
THIS
I fully agree.
After reading what both girls said I believe it was a misunderstanding between both of them rather than a clear victim and abuser result. Did Melanie and Timothy do sexual things together? Yes. Did Melanie think those things were wanted and accepted by both her and Timothy? I believe so. Did Melanie know Timothy felt she was being raped rather than mutual intercourse? I don't think so. Sometimes we misread how someone is feeling and I think both girls are telling the truth and both deserve support. I'm sure if Melanie knew in that moment how Timothy felt she wouldn't have pursued anything with her. I also think if Timothy loved Melanie she would've expressed this privately with her due to the possibility of a misunderstanding instead of being petty and bringing down her whole career.
I think Timothy made it very clear how she felt and Melanie doesn't take no for an answer. She isn't the only girl to say this about her. Other people have spoken out against her bad behavior too. There's nothing petty about wanting the world to see your abuser for who they are. This isn't a catty high school drama.
" she didn't say no to what we chose to do together " textbook 🍇 apologist statement.
Why is Timothy allergic to the court 😭 but if Melanie is proven 100% guilty and admits and everything, I’m separating the art from the artist :)
Unfortunately the courts doesn’t take these matters serious, especially if a woman is the alleged abvser. And this is coming from an SA victim of both genders. The only time it went legal was with a family member who was a man and he was let free
kinda would be hard to once you know that you're listening to a sexual abuser. adding to the alleged thought of melanie being guilty
@@solong_abigail well, the thing is Timothy’s friends said that they tried to convince Timothy to not post on social media, and talk to Mel or go to police, but for some reason police never got involved at all
@@Rosepetals436 shes too scared to be caught lying
Cause you can go to jail for a long time for 1 lying to the police and 2 accussing someone for sa. Which is technically lying but wtv
Please mel beat the allegations 😭
If she gets cancelled, I'm moving on to 3 new main artists - Chappell Roan, Sabrina Carpenter, and, of course, joining the very popular cult: Swifties. 🤭
I stopped supporting Melanie a few months ago because of this, now I am trying to show my sister, that she should not support that person.
You should remain neutral. Besides you can also separate art from the artist(meaning you can like her music but not Melanie herself)
There are so many fights going on this comment section… ok, guys, listen up. Melanie is innocent until proven guilty. I’m not saying I’m on Melanie’s side. I don’t know her. But there is no evidence. There is no DNA, and Melanie was on the other side of the world at the time. The dates don’t match up. Also, due to the lack of evidence, it would be almost impossible to take it up in court. SA victims almost never get into court in the first place, and as I said above, there is no evidence to back up Timothy’s case. She has been terribly vague about this. She said, and I quote, “I was drunk, I don’t remember. I was tired, I don’t remember.” And I get that trama can make you forget, or make the memories hard or painful to recall. But it’s odd. I don’t know, guys, honestly. I’m getting a weird feeling from Timothy’s videos, and also, her body language is like she’s lying. It’s really weird. Also, if she has such bad memories, she should probably be a bit more emotional talking about it??? Like she’s nervous in the video but it’s not like she’s on the verge of tears or anything??? I dunno it’s very weird but if she did consent to it and then had second thoughts Melanie probs didn’t pick up on it if they were tired? Also we haven’t seen this toy or anything that she said she used so??? Also wasn’t Melanie the one that was handcuffed???? If that’s true then there is no way that Melanie was the abuser because she was literally restrained! Also did I mention that Mel was on tour at the time and Timothy was at the pool lmao. There is no way. But I’m gonna wait for more evidence and for Melanie to say something bout it. Also if Mel was a abuser she would have repeat crimes and neither Oliver tree (yes I know they had problems but he never said anything and they broke up on good terms) or Verde have said anything so it’s unlikely. And this has only come up again once Melanie has a spike in her fame and career? Maybe Timothy is just jealous if she is lying, but if she isn’t then Mel will be in trouble. But if Mel is innocent then Timothy will be in trouble. There is no good ending. It’s a lose-lose situation they have here, and honestly I think they should have resolved things privately before telling the internet abt it. Also about the former fans harassing her, it’s not ok no matter what please don’t do it to anyone because there is still a chance Mel is innocent and you’re rumour spreading will just make things worse. Let Mel and Timothy sort things out between themselves. Thank you for reading all this, and have a amazing day. I’m sorry to trouble you all. 💕💕💕💕
"If you don't have evidence, you don't have anything."
And this applies to both sides.
she’s been on tiktok since 2021, she didn’t ACTUALLY just come back.
oh and btw, the song she’s talking about is piggyback, it was only released on soundcloud because mel didn’t want to make profit off of the song!
The diss track is called “piggy back” she only released it on her SoundCloud because she didn’t wanna profit off of it.
Many people have uploaded it on Spotify
If the accusations are false, why. Just why would someone accuse someone of that. I get some people just want attention, but seriously why?
Exactly, also why would she accuse her again of it if she was lying knowing she got doxxed and attacked by the fanbase 7 years ago? She didnt even gain any fame out of this, she got tons of hate and other messed up shit from melanie fans. I get people want attention at times, but i doubt she’d take it this far knowing what happened before.
It's a really stupid thing to do tbh. If she is lying about the r@p3 accusations then that's what she's going to be remembered for.
None of us were there and either could be lying. Some people get so passionate, even when they don’t even know the facts.
The diss track Timothy is talking about is "piggyback". I heard Melanie didn't realesed it on Spotify or other apps, just on SoundCloud (I think) so that she didn't earn money from the song. Correct me if I'm wrong please.
I smell some jealousy coming from Timothy. Eyes are the window to the soul..I don’t see fear, pain and betrayal. I see ENVY.
Even if Timothy is lying docking her, leaking and hacking her personal stuff like number and social media accounts is not okay and I do feel bad for her for that.
And also we don’t know what happened “Mel wouldn’t do that” the Melanie in front of the camera wouldn’t do this. But who knows if the Melanie outside of the camera would? We’re strangers to her.
I don’t have an opinion on the situation but if Melanie does not respond it’s going to get worse judging by the majority of her fan base.
If what timothy says is true, I wholeheartedly commend her bravery to expose her experience with melanie into the public; knowing how some melanie fans are, they can be very drastic and overly protective of her, a golden example being when rumors were spread about oliver tree being abusive to her in their past relationship when in reality that wasn't the case at all.
Its so horrid that this happend imagine being a female on female sa survivor ( female on female sa barely even talked about or believed to begin with) and have it done by a famous person who becomes even more famous and her fans harrass you into hiding poor girl boycott melanie
THIS.
The fact you thought it was copycat and not piggyback ,the one and only song addressing Timothy 😭 had me mad confused
Honestly I think Timothy might just be a very good liar, besides why is she doin this when Melanie is getting famous again?
Idk who to believe, all i know is that it is not ok to dox, threaten, etc to any involved (a lot of fans of both sides did that).
Elita is being called out for things. If you didn’t know, Elita was crybaby’s best friend in k-12, Angelita. Elita has been called out for many bad things such as being a pedo and other bad things that I won’t say due to YT. Two of my favorite artists are going down.
Yess exactly it's so suspicious that she is related to her
I’m not a Melanie Martinez fan, I do like her music tho, and seeing her being accused of R@PE is so shocking to me, like r@pe is such a disgusting and absolute horrible thing! And I’m sorry for all the ppl that have Melanie as their comfort artist but I’m glad that they’re still choosing to support the victim even tho it’s rlly hard hate your fav artist
False accusations exist. This is bit too much of an icky loophole
your so right tho im a melanie fan but i dont act like this i feel sorry for both timothy and melanie i hope this can be fixed soon
I'm supporting Melanie and I'm A HUGE CRYBABY AND A HUGE MELANIE FAN❤
i find it VERY hard to believe melanie is as r/pist. it doesn’t make sense at all
It does make sense??? Why because she has a cute fairy aesthetic and isn't a man??
im pretty sure they mean with the songs she makes that talk about those type of problems as awareness
@@ShyVelociraptor yes this is what i meant
@@kuchenkatt she writes songs talking about real world problems like r/pe so thats why its surprising
@@laylazaben just because she writes songs about a topic doesn't mean that she cannot be a r!pist how she defends things doesn't mean she is a good person
Let's see if Mel clears this? Ten years later i really think it have been cleared and not by some fake nonsense..
Believe victims or you dont . It doesn't matter if the person the allegations are made against are famous.
there was something off about tims whole video, it gives me the ick
Nah shes gonna get away with this bs again and just act like its not happening.
i love how some mel fans r like " mel would NEVER !" but do u know her personally ? Lmao😭
i completely agree with the person who said "you don't know her! you dont know what happened" so im sticking to that and the best i can do is ignore the drama
The full defense from what i can remember is “She never said no to any of the things we did together i would never have an intimate relationship with someone without there all out consent”
Also from what i saw she says she was SAed in 2 different ways?
The first one she said she was SAed during her sleep but then she says she was SAed while playing a sex game
The most people can do is apply pressure for Melanie to talk. You guys owe it to Timothy to at least hear her out after everything people have done to her. Even if she was a liar what happended was still fucked. Just because its Melanie and she helped you through your teenage years doesnt make her a good person unfortunately.
I dont know who to believe anymore at this point im a melanie fans but this is disgusting for fans to do and if melanie is proven gulity im moving to bambie thug
i will never stop listening to Melanie no matter what. im used to listen to problematic artists and her songs are just too good. her music helped me through tough times. im not a bad person for listening to problematic artists. everyone is free to do whatever they want with their spare time. and the world is going to criticize you no matter what so do whatever you want.