Is this the perfect cable for high-efficiency speakers?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 ก.ย. 2024
- If you have high-sensitivity speakers, and perhaps using a low wattage amplifier, these could be among the best speaker cables out there for your system. Discover all the details in this video!
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Another great video Guido. A thin solid core flat cable I've had good results with is DNM, they come in different diameters and are solid copper. Also, very reasonably priced-at least here in the UK. Well worth checking out as they have been at it since 1984.
I was experimenting with solid core copper cable over 35 year’s ago with a friend on his system. Working for a Telecom Company I had easy access to some smaller solid cables. This was initiated by a HI-Fi magazine back then recommending trying standard solid core 2.5mm mains, twin and earth,cable used in the UK. My friend and I both agreed it sounded better than the fashionable hyper multicore Monster Size cables of the day and that highly over-rated “49 Strand”. Perhaps they should have rounded the strands up to 50 🙂. After trying very thin solid cable the conclusion seemed to be that the 2.5mm solid was good for mid/bass (and treble) and the thin for “taming”higher frequencies but not so good for the lower ones(a bit light sounding). I ended up disassembling my crossover and bi-wiring my speakers with thin to the tweeter and some 7 strand? single mains cable to the mid/bass, twisted to make a pair. On my system, with a valve amplifier, it didn’t sound quite right and so the thin cable to the tweeter was replaced with the same as used for the mid/bass. It sounded pretty good to me and I still use the same modified speakers with that cable today. The bass sounds good for a valve amp(organic) and the treble is smooth and detailed-if the source material allows. Another friend said he went to a HI-FI shop back in the day and they said they didn’t recommend thinner cables for valve amps-I can’t argue-noting your comment about using efficient speakers. Being a solid(sort of) core convert I then made up a solid inter-connect, which was the best sounding I’ve ever tried. It was from a radio site. It was solid corrugated copper outer screen with quite a large gauge solid inner-an absolute pig to try and fit RCA plugs on the ends and of course had to be the correct length but it sounded magic. Unfortunately it’s gone missing. It was so transparent and great sounding to other coax cables I’ve tried. I now make do with Amazon basic interconnect which is very low capacitance and sounds pretty good.
Thanks for sharing your journey, seems like you tested them all! It’s good to see someone that stands for what they have achieved. Bravo!
Great video thanks. I use thin Duelund 12 AWG tinned copper cables with my Klipsch Fortes. I twist the single wires together to help reduce RFC pick up. They give a very open detailed live sound and seems to suit the horns very well. I might give these OCC copper ones a try though- silver version is a bit too pricey!!
I bought 16 AWG wire from GR Research for a refurb I’m doing to a pair of Klipsch Fortes. I bought more than I needed and also tried it as speaker cable, and it sounded great. It’s high purity copper, but sounds really nice.
Nice!
Cool, might try on my Heresy3s
Just in the last week I installed the 26 AWG version of that cable inside my amplifier, going from XLR inputs to the input board. Got the 26 AWG version because it was only €17 for 1 meter at Audiophonics, with thicker gauges being more like €36. The distance the wire needed to travel inside the amp was just 5cm-6cm, so 1 meter was plenty for my needs. It made a clear difference! It added about 0.5-1 meter extra width to the soundstage in all music, added more detail, and gave a nicer general character to the sound. I assume the effect of the wire will depend on how bad the cable is you're replacing.
Good job! Wait for the burn-in, things will get much better
@@anadialog Burn In of a cable wich "transports" AC current. LOL!!! You made my day!!!
You're are completely wrong in your theorie about cables.
Greetings from a electronic devloping engineer.
Great information Guido. I remember when I was in engineering school we had a course called Transmission Line Theory and it was basically meant for very long distances e.g. delivering electricity to people's homes and businesses but this course had other ramifications. I believe that all of this new cable technology stems from similar theory courses.
Thank YOU!
Hi, I use AWG 24 in a multiple configuration.
Gives air in the music.
If you prefer more body you can go with thicker cable.
I still have some Kimber Cable that was 4 black 18 gauge, and 4 brown 18 gauge that was braided together. I twisted the brown ends together, and the black ends together and soldered them. I think that was equivalent to 10 gauge single wires. Copper wires btw....
By the way, AWG is an archaic measurement really going back to the dawn of the industrial age. It stands for America Wire Gauge and the number of the wire represented how many times copper had to be drawn theough a sizing die to get to a speficid diameter. Thats why large diameter wires have low numbers and the smaller the wire gets the higher its designated number is. Is anyone still awake?
far out.wonder if we could sub industrial age to a i ?like its reveresed
Jantzen Audio do a very nice solid core PE dielectric cable. Sounds very good and cheap as chips.
With your speakers, good choice. I wouldn't use them on a lot of other speakers. OFC cable is the best for most setups.
For speaker cable you don't need solid silver. The best thing is in fact silver-plated copper. The copper core will give you very good lows and mid-range. The silver plating will ensure clean, detailed highs. The lower price also means that you can easily afford thicker gauges and quad configuration, both of which always improve sound.
As I said in the video, different metals are never a good idea because they have different electrical properties that conflict, for example copper and silver have different conductivity.
@@anadialog I promise you that you do not know enough physics to correctly predict how a cable sounds based on its materials and construction. In short, whatever you think will never be accurate. Whay you can do is test a lot of cables and then try to understand why they sound different based on physics. In practical tests, silver-plated solid core copper sounds better than anything else, including pure silver or gold.
@@anadialogI read somewhere about the problem with silver plated copper wires. Cheaper one use some kind of coating on copper base for the better plating process - that could cause the problems!
My personal experience with solid core cables is the bigger the diameter the top end rolls off. Too small and it is top end heavy, You need to hit the sweets-spot on diameter. Or combine a thick and thin wire.
Agree, the optimal diameter is around 0,8 mm according to proffessor Hawksford.
I used to be in the cable business and used solid core wire. My first interconnect used one 28 gauge wire combined with one 34 gauge wire. Worked well. Also I determined that my interconnects all functioned best with the aggregate wire gauge was about 24.@@karl-erikmoberg5668
That is more of a function of the dielectric. The high frequency signals travel along the outside of the conductor and the wrong dielectric will interfere with them. The best insulation is cotton because it has no dielectric effect.
OK, but the skin depth is 0,5 mm at 20 kHz, meaning that the signal travels nearly across the entire diameter in dia less than 0,8 mm. Have tried gauge 24 against gauge 22 with same insulation (clear teflon) with clear difference in sound.
Agree that the dielecricum maybe is of more importance. Have tried most of them. Natural (clear) PTFE is better than colored, my best choise is paper.
@@karl-erikmoberg5668 You need to consider the overlapping of frequencies due to the skin-effect. In a thin conductor the frequencies are pushed together but in a thick conductor they can spread out; the latter beingbthe better. The audio signal also travels as an electromagnetic wave on the outside of the conductor. So there are many factors that affect the final audible result.
I’ve used silver cables in fact I still have them but they made the horns on my La Scala’s or my Heritage horns to fatiguing.
Thank YOU!
Enjoy the videos and channel
I bought my silver core 16 gauge that came with an 8 gauge teflon tube.
Tempo Electric says the larger teflon casing offers more open sound. More air dielectric space.
Silver allows so much transparency.
Try oil-filled RCA cables. Now those are AMAZING!
Inspirational video and feedback. I have a query regarding shielding. Should I attempt to construct a cable in which each individual solid core cable is shielded with tinned copper braid, with the shielding connected to the negative terminal at the amplifier end? Would it be advantageous to place the individual cables into cotton sleeves before inserting them into the copper braid? Lastly, I'm interested in creating a bi-wire cable. Should I utilize solid core cables of different diameters or materials for the low-frequency and high-frequency components?
Try the silversmith fidelium cables.
I watched a video, that I'm sure was made by you where you archived music from a website that had highest quality masters using some audio amp to cassette. (Idk who this video was, but the audio wasn't PCM)
They played it though some kind of amp or dac player to their cassete recorder.
And mastered the noise floor to increase the amount of possible sound to the cassette or something.
If this was a video you have uploaded in the past, I cannot find it anywhere at all.
Maybe this one? th-cam.com/video/A1skO6rDgtA/w-d-xo.htmlsi=hNCx31qmo_854U6J
😊Hi can u buy 2 pair of same NeoTech cable & Skin off one of your Neotech cable head & change to Pure copper head! & compare them Original vs yr modified Neotech cable side by side. Video demo have !!😊
Hi Guido,
So you dont recommend Yarbo OCC-FV 110 cables not good for these speakers?
I got Focal Kanta2
I am sure they would be great, if you already have those I wouldn’t change. Silver is silver, and occ silver is the vertex of transmission
NEOTECH is one of the best ...
How are you?, can you tell me what a difference in an ultra low capacitance interconnect would do? I have type 45 tube mono blocks. Thanks
Not much when cables are so short. Inductance, resistance and capacitance are negligible when talking centimeters.
Check out Canare 4S8G speaker cable.
I want to try the neotech occ copper solid core cable. I have a single ended triode amplifier pushing 35 watts and my soeakers are 92db sensitivity into 4 ohms. Which gauge should I use?
The one in the video is 16 but if you can go a little lower (meaning larger) it is probably better but price increases dramatically
Ya good ...frum technics sl 1200MK7 stylus orthofon 2m black
Question-audioquest evergreen to preamp projectbox s2 psvane to audioquest evegreen dbs 72v to mac 1900 2.5 amps 55 watts out to biwhierd evequest coper knowing that mac is copered is verry resposive with kef 80wats and Bose 301 it feels boreales colurfull a mist in falls ...what you think about the combo ?
🙋♂️ GREAT ℹ️ 🧐,GUIDO,BUT I HONESTLY DON’T KNOW OF ANY HIGH EFFICIENCY SPEAKERS. 🤷♂️ KNOW THAT THEY ARE OUT THERE 💚💚💚
Between you and me, I think these work well on any kind of speaker if you are not using huge power-hungry amps!
@@anadialog THANKS FOR SHARING THIS WITH US 🤗👍😎💚💚💚
😃Where is the link to buy upocc silver?
Did you check the video description? ;-)
Have you every try Zavfino cables?
Yes, and I recommended them in several videos. They also use OCC. Not a big fan of their connectors.
So negative impact of physical measurement differences of cables can be ignored due to the short length we use in audio. The plot twist here is… we still have the positive impact that gives you an extra 10%. So science is just for the bad… the good is far beyond science. I must admit I did’t expect this LoL
That is what I am hearing, without any doubt a small jump in quality. In any case, no plot twist. As I have repeated in several occasions science measures quantity, not quality. Quality is inferred by numbers. I did a video on this: th-cam.com/video/rMfr8BG335w/w-d-xo.htmlsi=W2MZqJnx_HwEXC9x
What are the perfect terminations for the perfect speaker cables for high efficiency speakers? I may make a set of cables with this cable all kidding aside I am honestly wanting to know what you like and recommend
Well, actually I am using them bare because the Mc30 and the Altecs don't have connectors just clamps and screws. If you need connectors, try obviously to use a silver type!
@@anadialog thanks man I am going to try them out
Have you tried Neotech 16AWG but STRANDED OCC Copper? Simple lightly twisted pair for the + and - ..
No but I tried several stranded cables and several solid core and the latter almost always one me over
How does silver 1.5 mm or 2 mm. speakers cables sounds with big floorstanding high sensitivity speakers? does they really have the clean sparkle top end as every manufacturer of cables claim?
Nope, no trace. Otherwise I wouldn’t have recommended them like I do for several products that pass from here
ok, will buy QED silver 1.5mm cables. i think its a good replacement @@anadialog
How about Heresy 4?
Have you tried a silversmith fiedelium cable?
I haven’t!
You say that skineffect is for higher frequency.
But, skindeph is 0,5 mm at 20 kHz
In your clip you will have problems in the heights
A better solution is to use two in parallel with smaller diameter or four in parallell for even better result.
It definitely will make a change in the musical experience.
Karl-Erik 10:18
20khz is already high and things get much worse at much higher frequencies, that is were resistance may have a true impact, but in recorded audio, we are much lower
@@anadialog
Skin effect is caused by eddy currents that inhibits current in the center of the conductor.
It is not only affecting the resistance due to decreasing of the area, it also get reactive influence, not wanted, gives smearing of the signal. This effect affects lower frekvencies.
So, with good dielecricum, size matters.
I have tried at least 40 different interconnect cables over many decades. Haven't tried as many speaker cables, but plenty. MIT, Audioquest, Zu Audio, QED, Tributaries, Monster, Chord, Better Cables, Supra, etc. The only one that made a huge improvement (of the speaker cables) was MIT MH 770 Ultralinear II. I did think Better Cables was a pretty darn good cable also, and I did kind of like Chord Epic II, but realized after a while that it wasn't the last word in tone colors. The others I didn't like, except for Tributaries Seies 8 (older series), which I am still getting to know, but am sure I like it fairly well at this point. But a strange thing happened lately.
I changed the positioning of my equip. around in my room. Those wires wouldn't reach anymore and just for the time being, I just went out and bought a spool of some cheap copper coated aluminum cables. Better some sound than none. Right? They are just cheap $25 a spool speaker wires. Guess what? I don't hear them doing a thing wrong sonically! Surprise! No coloring the sound or anything deviating from neutrality, no harshness, hardness or loss of bass definition. I am wondering if I spent a lot of money for nothing over the years going from one fairly expensive speaker cable to another. The MIT cable (expensive), I never bought, just had a lengthy home audition. Amazing cable but too warm for my system back then. I won't be able to compare the Tributaries cable to the cheap cable because of length requirements. It makes me think that it must not cost a lot of money to make a speaker cable which does its job just fine. It simply steps out of the way and lets the music flow without altering it.
I have noticed over the years that a lot of gear, especially quality gear, is less influenced by cables, especially interconnects.
Does the wire come terminated?
No because they are wiring cables in reality, used inside components.
This is for a single cable. So a 10 ft pair would be 50x4= $2000...OUCH!
Value! 😂
The copper ones are MUCH cheaper and close to the silver ones. In any case, take a look at the price tag of a renowned cable manufacturer like nord-est or Cardas…with $2000 you don’t even get the connectors.
Watts yer point?
fantastico che parli inglese ma ragioni in italiano 🤣
Esatto!😅
Science vs listning.
Listen to the music, enjoy and rely on your ears.
If you listen to science, be careful to make statements!
Example 1: often typ Ohms Law is used to explain, this is a very simplified way to use.
If you care about timing effects (music is much about timing) yau shall use Maxwells equations to be able to discover the reactive effects (very important to get an non smeared reproduction)
Example 2: Measurements often are made with steady state signals (sinewaves) Harmonic distorsion is an example. You miss all the timing aspects!! Be careful.
Example 3: Statement, you need long wires to make a difference. Be careful! Often this is related to wave lengths of speed of light, but in cabels the speed of velocity is in the range m/s. With this in mind you can use science developed for ower 100 years. Short cables makes a difference.
The science shall not tell you what you hear, it shall describe what you hear.
So, listen to the music and thrust what you hear.
Karl-Erik
I covered the science here, no need to go over it again and again: th-cam.com/video/uVKFSquAhwc/w-d-xo.htmlsi=wEMwd6vG7oodAqeC
Instead here I explain how science in HIfi just produces numbers, that is quantity NOT quality. You can infer quality by quantity but you will never have the complete picture. As I always say, science will never tell you which is the best tasting chocolate bar. You can infer the quality of the ingredients but not its actual taste: here is the video completing this subject: th-cam.com/video/rMfr8BG335w/w-d-xo.htmlsi=fpfvHp0ibhMMnyaE
Hi,, I have watched ypur videos regarding "technichal aspects in cables". My point in earlier comments was and is "the use of simple theories i.e. Ohms Law can led to questionable statemants" This is what your videos does!
For more serious analysis of cable, see Professor Hawksfords paper "The Essex Echo 1995: Electrical Signal Propagation & Cable Theory," can be found on the web. It describes a cable with Maxwells eqations and are describing for example the effect of skin effect, eddy currents, velocity in cables and more.
Please read!
More can be read in "Heaviside condition" It describes a cable as "transmission line can be represented as a distributed-element model of its primary line constants"
It states that the inductance shall be increased to minimize the time distorsion (smearing).
Please read!
I have use these theories in my experiments and must say that they comply rather good with the listning experience.
If you don't belive in me, Hawksford and Heaviside I suggest two experiments.
Take your gauge 16 cable and compare it with two gauge 19 wires in parallell and next experiment with four wires gauge 22 in parallell.
I can assure you that you will get more dynamics and nuances in the upper end.
When you (and others) have done these experiments, we can take the dicsussions further.
Regards Karl-Erik
For 3m long cables, it doesn't really matter if it's silver or copper, as long as they are thick enough. It's a placebo effect. You can't measure any significant differences.
PS. Negative and positive need to be twisted around each other.
No china occ fake . Nice but a little late
What does this mean?
shielding might be helpful but that’s it. please keep snake oil and silver in the mountain - away from fraudulent companies for audio. awful
No, it increases capacitance. Unless you have a very bad problem of interference it is better not to use them. Once again, snake oil is all about selling and I am just sharing my experiences. Try or forget about it. Silver is the best conductor out there, another fact that you fail to acknowledge besides the fact that its oxidation is even more conductive in deep contrast with copper, which gets worse and worse each month. I have dealt with a fraudulent company and unveiled their scam together with the University of Waterloo brining the company to change the description of their cables and withdraw from the maket a few of their products: th-cam.com/video/XVLR9EuCkgo/w-d-xo.htmlsi=cJ0IuMB_hsyt9NRZ What is your contribution to this debate and issue? A few frustrated comments?
I am an actual metallurgist and I certify that the statements made in this video are bonkers. The concept of silver for speaker cables has been debunked some time ago. OCC will not help the characteristics of silver very much, but what it definitively does is prove that audio insanity is contagious. Most of the audio assessment statements made are better suited for wine tasting.
The prices quoted here are completed unrealistic for true (non-SKW brand!) OCC cable. You want 6N purity, you will pay a lot. Do we need to do a lab test to prove it? Like this one? th-cam.com/video/XVLR9EuCkgo/w-d-xo.html
Which quality cables have you tried? We want experience not handbook mumbo jumbo which is clearly incomplete. As I always say measurements and numbers are very important but they only tell you a sound quantity NOt quality. You can infer quality from quantity to a certain degree but after that the model is missing something, clearly there is more like a quality OCC cable compared to a normal one, especially for speaker and power cables.
@@anadialog You can legitimately measure all kinds of differences, but the bottom line is always "can I hear a difference?". That always throws us back into personal subjectivity, where you are insisting we take your subjective opinion (which is valid for you) as objective fact. "Wow baby wow" as a recommendation does not impress me!
My bigger problem is the careless or sometimes dishonest way that Amazon marketeers describe their cables. Everybody says 'pure copper', when in the practical world that does not exist -- a claim must be quantified or it is meaningless.
😅😅welcome Voodoo hifi. 48.50$ for one. 97$/m .best joke on monday morning.
Which quality cables have tried?
what the fudge dude. danm another snake oil guy. if you study electrical engineering even a little you’ll know that current doesn’t care about speaker sensitivity and gauge does nothing to enhance things sonically.
Though you keep watching and commenting videos on cables ;-) The concept of snake oil does not make any sense since it is applied to commercial activities and I am not selling absolutely anything. I do this to share my passion and experience. Actually, if your read as well some literature, gauge does have an impact on the resistance but only at very long distances as well as many other factors as dielectrics. I covered all the cable technical aspects here: th-cam.com/video/uVKFSquAhwc/w-d-xo.htmlsi=iRT-9OSQtguu7MoC BUT regardless of that, this thin cable sounds much much better that the low gauge cable I was using before. Tell me, which high quality cables have you experienced in your system?
The price is comical. Sorry. Maybe if you run your amps a foot from your speakers but for most normal setups you’d be spending thousands on wire to drive less than a watt of energy.
Comical are the prices proposed by Audioquest, Cardas, Nordost, Tara etc. plus I also recommend the the copper version which costs 1/4 of the silver. An objective bargain.