Having the Wife's support is outstanding! My wife got her Tech license when I did and is not interested in upgrading BUT she supports my radio activities and really likes the off grid power capabilities that I have developed here. Not up to your level but making progress.
I know what you mean. Just having her support makes it so much easier. I have those friends whose people actively work against what they're trying to do. I guess we are lucky. Married the right ones :-)
I found high value from the review of differing propagation properties between the delta loop and the vertical whip configuration of the antenna. Thank you for including that in the presentation. The ability to select one or the other, given the intended role of the communicator, is the reason I think it’s an outstanding portable system. I would make a purchase if it were available commercially. Yes I probably could cobble together something that approaches the design with gear I already have. But it wouldn’t be as straightforward a deployment nor a sure fire hit right away when put in the air. Like you, I’d rather spend less time fooling around with the antenna and more time working stations on the bands.
Thanks for this comment. Rarely do some understand this no messing around, once we're out in the field. I just need something which is robust, and works consistently after each deployment and take-down. Thanks for taking the time to leave the feedback. It's very much appreciated.
Couldn't find the link. I say the Delta Loop is a winner.. it saves space in set-up and travel, it's directional, it RX and TX better than a dipole, it doesn't use radials and it's a perfect NVIS and Mid Range Antenna. Perfect for emergency operations and communications with family and friends while out on a trip.
I use a MFJ 1979 whip antenna that looks almost exactly like what you have shown. I use it with my wolf river coil which will also tune to 80m. This works standalone as a 20 meter antenna or lower freqs with the coil. You can buy a second whip and make a delta loop with the buddipole mount in the Y configuration. 73s IU3JNT
I purchased two of the MFJ 1979 whip antennas and I was so excited to use them as dipoles on 20 meters on an 18' mast I also got from MFJ. They have both failed at the same point. The second section from the tip has failed and no longer stops when reaching the stop point. Not sure if this is a defect in mine or just not built as well as should be. I am curious if Cameleon makes their own whips or if they may be made by the same manufacturer as MFJ?
I had one of those whips fail on me but was stored for a years in some moisture. Replaced it and still holding up. Have only used it as vertical though. If you have a proper radial network you're in business
Outstanding. Both your video and the prototype. For what it’s worth, I’m a newbie with base and portable comms, but like you, I just need / want my gear to work in the field. I’m a seasoned outdoors woman who is interested in enjoying my time / activities while out. A ready-made product like the TDL would fit the bill. Thanks again, Julian!
Thanks for the "first look" 👍 I just wish you had placed a warning at the beginning of the video about those sausages, because I hadn't had breakfast yet (hah)
Glad to see your ankle is better. Concerning the telescoping whip, there's the MFJ-1979 Telescopic Whip. It is Stainless Steel, 10-section, Adjustable, 17 ft. Extended Length. Gigaparts sells it for $65. I own two of them--and they are very well made and extremely sturdy. Concerning a Balun transformer for making a tunerless antenna, I experimented and made two different types--one has an impedance ratio of 5:1 and the other 6:1. The balun is installed in a 2 inch diameter pipe reducer (making it waterproof) which I picked up at the local hardware store. A coax connector is at one end and the whip connector at the other. The balun design is by G8JNJ. One can make a balun core or else purchase one ready made. Wiring up the balun is very simple.
Thanks Rachmiel. This video was taken the week before my ankle was hurt, but it is getting better. If you still have the tent in them, maybe I'll share some pictures on Facebook page. It's always awesome to see other ideas and how they come together. Thanks for the comment and the kindness. It's very much appreciated.
@@OH8STN I should still have some pics of the balun, If you want, I can certainly collect the links with the info showing how to make your own tunerless antenna and send them to you--this way if you want to ever go that route, you be spared from having to collect them yourself. I will say that I did not see any signiificant difference in performance between the 6:1 balun and the 5:1. I should also tell you that I became fascinated (with lack of a better word) with short HF antennas when I read the late Jerry Sevicks book on the subject. He's had also written a couple of books on antenna baluns--extremely useful stuff for those interested. If you want, I'd be glad to prepare a list of books and articles which I have found very useful for making portable HF antennas and which I believe you might want to pass on to the group.
Nice compact unit that contains all that is needed. This is what is needed for a portable mobile unit ready in a moments notice as a go-kit. This tent and portable cooker is a great touch. I believe it to be a great kit that with a little effort can be a well tuned ready to go kit not requiring an analyzer or tuner. Definitely a thumbs up.
Great video, I can't wait till my MPAS 2.0 arrives and we can get back into the parks for POTA. Keep up the great video's I completely revamped my mobile POTA setup from batteries, charger, computer, and more importantly attitude by watching your videos.
Well if you've got the right attitude, you're most of the way there. These types of comments actually provide the motivation to keep making videos. Stay safe and stay motivated. Thanks for watching.
After a long wait I got my MPAS 2.0 around the 24th of May 2020, Amazing antenna, on 20 meters since May I've been making regular DX from Ireland to South America 100 watts using the FT-891 which is a really amazing radio, great quiet receiver and I prefer it much more to my G90 which I hardly use now, it is a noisier radio and the FT-891 is almost the same size and it's filters work better then there's the MIC eq, 2 eq settings on the mic + the amazing DNR when you need it, amazing radio paired with the MPAS 2.0 and it's a really fantastic portable setup, I use the MFJ-939 auto tuner but if operating on 20 m the MPAS has a very low swr, around 1.2:1 and I also have the CAP Hat. The fantastic analogue audio of the 891 not ruined by noisy SDR is a pleasure to listen to, I always listen with headphones. Anyway, the MPAS convinced me that Chameleon are as good as owners have been saying and sometime I may try one of their loops or even the delta loop. The MPAS works so well on 20m that I decided to leave it up permanently and take it down for portable use, it can be set up and taken down in under 10 mins. I use only the single counterpoise so far. In the Winter I will get to test it more on 40 m but I've been making such great DX to South America that I haven't moved off 20m. I have tried 40 and made contacts around Europe but never really tried DX on 40m yet or any other band, it works on 80m too, made a contact to the U.K last weekend, haven't used it much on 80m. I also noticed that the MPAS is a really quiet antenna, I live in the sticks which really allows me hear weak DX signals. I also have only used it with the spike in the ground, not elevated which I might try next. Did you get your MPAS yet ?
Hey, Julian! I'm revisiting this video tonight because Chameleon has offered a "partial" kit to build a full Delta Loop. Since I have the Micro, and one stainless steel whip, all I need is the partial kit and one more whip. This antenna looks like it might solve a few of my issues with hitting some of the stations I work with, with improved results. Thank you for testing this prototype! Stay warm and healthy! Kudos to the wife and crew for support. 73!
A ground-mounted Delta is going to put a lot of signal up in the air. But if you can raise it - and it looks light enough to do that quite easily - it will start to beat the vertical for DX and the directivity will sharpen. Something like that tuned for the higher bands when the solar flux is up will be outstanding.
Hey buddy I've been away from radio for a while I'm just getting back in it again great to see you're making more videos this is freaking awesome I love the Santana system you got going really awesome man you're the man you're the man 👍👍👍👍👍
I have recently discovered a love of full-wave loops. I'm curious about the performance of this versus other antenna configurations. If one is going to add a bunch of parts, and weight, then I would hope for superior performance over other designs.
I have never worked with a vertical loop only horizontal loops and I have had great success even with sub standard antenna layouts. It's interesting, but have to see the price first.
Le plus important dans cette vidéos, ce sont les saucisses !!!!!! 😂 blagues à part, encore une vidéo honnête et objective. Merci pour votre travail. 73
This is not low cost by any means. But your comment on expecting kit to work and not be fiddly in the field is what I too want. may be I should take another look at this - two antennas in one. Thank you for the expert demo, the family cooking and having fun with you also was excellent.
Another outstanding video as always! As to performance I expect Delta loop to be comparable to a magnetic loop in reference to NVIS and low angle radiation when both are close to the ground. Arguably the advantage of the Delta loop is that it is more broad banded so there is less fiddling with tuning, but digital operators usually use a narrow portion of the band. Therefore, SSB operators might prefer the Delta loop over a mag loop.
Your spouse does deserve some serious credit here. I will suggest that HAM spouses - operators themselves or not - do tend to be highly decent, supportive and generally wonderful people.
My Delta loop kit comes in today. I already have the MPAS-2 and bought the Delta loop to close the gap on short range POTA hunters when activating. Thanks again for your great testing, explanations and videos. 73 KO4KHB
I use theese MFJ 17feet telescoping whips with Chamelon micro for nearly two years now. The original whip and whip extension is very expensive for what you get. Had a lot of fun with them. The deltaloop looks very interesting. I wonder if Chameleon will sell the base alone. And btw. great video again Julian. 73, Stephan, DF6PA
Thanks Derek. I was actually quite surprised when I could hear with the ground-mounted vertical. It really was a surprise. The sausages were great by the way :-)
I am impressed with the vertical configuration, I have tried one myself, and gave it two thumbs down, it was poor at best, but then I compare all antennas to my 80m full wave loop, which outperforms my beam at times. I love your evaluations.
This delta loop for the non constructor / portable operator looks to be the antenna of choice, the price of this product will either make it popular or limited to those with deep pockets. This was suppose to be my first year of portable operation. To all stay safe, stay healthy. Yes this product gets my thumbs up on this first review.
Who the hell thumbs-downs this video? Seriously? Thank you for continuing to create and post some of the best technical content and best videos about amateur radio on TH-cam. I’m always happy to see a new post from you.
Thanks for this. Some people just don't get it, and that's OK. I made this video for Operators like yourself, who want to see the story as it moves along. Thanks for the support, thanks for the kindness I definitely thanks for watching. It's very much appreciated. 73 Julian oh8stn
OH8STN Ham Radio - I became a Patreon last night to spite the thumbs down. I’ve been meaning to do it anyway, as your content is well worth the support, however this just reminded me. Thanks thumbs down guy :-)
Yeeey ➿ loop-antennas 🙂. I just prepared today some copper litz wire 6mm thick, different lengths (1; 1.5; 2 and 3 ml) for my MLA-30 antenna. I hope I can make it better on the 17, 10, 12 m band with the shorter loops.
👍😀 sounds like we have the same kind of "weird thing" with Loop antennas. This was my first experience using a Delta Loop, I've also got all the components here to put up a sky loop, which should happen this summer. Thanks for watching.
I was waiting for you to show this nice antenna. Delta loops as a few advantages and the one I like is no radials to operate. It’s a nice effective antenna. I prefer shock cord elements for easy setup, I will have to wait and see on these elements. Thank you for sharing!
Totally agreed. Since the weather is getting better I'd like to spend more time in the field getting to know the nuances of this antenna. You are right though, not needing to mess with those counterpoise wires is huge.
My impression from this is that it's great product for what it is. How ever I wouldn't buy it, simply because I'm opposite of you and like to fiddle around, build the staff and try different things. Also I was little surprised the configuration is not using ground as an "element" some where I read (don't quite me, I don't have the source and aren't sure) that you get quite low radiation angle when using ground as one element. All the best and keep up the good work. 73 oh2fhj
Our club chaiirman swears by delta loops and we are all taught how to make them. I have scratch built a delta loop for 6m, and now have one of the chairman's own designed 6m delta beam. It has 4 elements on a fibreglass box section beam. It's a bit of a handful to set up and get installed on the mast but its a very good antenna and needs no additional matching. I use it in the mid week contests. Typically for a single loop antenna we use 2 fibreglass fishing poles as the arms of the loop, and a matching transformer coil made from 75ohm coax. Hope the ankle is feeling better 73 OM de G1AW
These verticals look like my Alpha Delta Telescopic antenna that I tried to use with my MP1DXMAX. Since I have the MPAS 2.0 it has been sitting. This might be a chance to resurrect it! Great job Julian as usual.
Impressed at the NVIS performance of the loop! I miss makara sausage - tried at the Finnish church shop in London before lockdown, but they only had mustard 73 de M0MFX
Thnaks for the review. 👍 The telescopic whip looks similar to the MFJ-1979. I usually associate a delta loop with directiviy, and that one looks to be pretty good for DX.
Great idea. The test of course is how efficient is the system (matching system). If Chameleon will allow you, please do a comparison with a resonant dipole.
I own an Emcomm II and I am looking for a portable verticale, I am actually considering the CHA MIL 2.0 + CHA MIL EXT. But I will definitely wait to see what is going on with this loop as it offers the loop + verticale configuration in one nice package! Thanks Julian for that video!
I have the MPAS and I've been making great DX from Ireland to South America on 20m and a FT-891 @100w. I was amazed, really amazed to it's performance, I use the single supplied counterpoise, spike in ground and CAP HAT. I also live in a noise free area in the sticks which allows me to hear great DX. Get the MPAS 2.0 you will be amazed.
Nice day out Julien, I have 2 of those Whips, they are about 70$ each, knowing Chamleon, they will come up with a bit more rugged version,..in the end,... looking forward to a contact with u on JS8Call, 73
Well the Info Icon never came up to vote, but I did like the concept. I have one of the Collapsible antennas that came when I purchased the MPAS-2 system. All I would need to try what you did would be the 2nd whip and the tee connector that you used. So I wouldn't mind trying the same test setup that you did as this sounds like a nice experiment for sure. Thanks for the Video... Vic KE8JWE
It has potential my question is what is the length of the telescopic whip in its collapsed position? The mfj that looks very similar works great however I think that the design would be much better if the collapsed length was closer to 15 inches or so so it would fit in a feild pack this is the main gripe with the mfj at any rate
Another great video Julian- here I thought I was the only one using inverted delta loops for NVIS. That's one of my winter (i.e. in door) antenna setups. Like you said though, the radiation pattern is not necessarily obvious. Your azimuth suggestion is something to keep in mind.
Fishermen crazy. Amateur radio op in the snow covered field who dragged wife and sister-in-law with him, completely sane! (The dog would have been happy to join you no matter what!)
I’d be interested in purchasing it if it were also made available in parts for those who already have the MPAS 1.0 or 2.0. How does one tune the antenna and where in the band is it resonant. Im guessing it’s very narrow being a loop. Also, it would be great to compare it in performance to the F Loop or P Loop.
I am also curious if you can purchase add-on components to complement the MPAS 2.0. It looks like you need a 2nd vertical whip and extension, the v-junction to attach to the spike, an wire to connect the two ends (18ft long?).
ZS6-AQ South Africa. Thank you for that great insight, firstly I do agree with you, they should put this into production. 2. I only have one Q? What hight can one go with this antenna. Would one have better results with hight or not. Thank you once again Julian great video.
Looks like it might be a good companion to my MPAS 2.0. First time for me too seeing how a delta loop worked in a field trial. I do need to get some dinner now after seeing the sausages :) 73 Don KM6TRZ
Due to it's marginal RF performance I'm generally not a fan of using stainless steel in antennas. It's fine as a support structure but I'll bet the performance would improve by adding a wire in parallel with the tubing. Neat idea, and a great video!
Very nice video Julian. I have seen some DXcommander 7M poles turned into Delta Loops and I believe John did quite well with it. But it is really nice to see ultra long telescopic whips prefabbed. I am doing well with a SuperAntenna MP1 inside on JS8 using a Lithium Iron 10AH cell and a G90 Cross between your stuff and Mike's stuff. I am in Texas and more concerned with Mosquito's than Heating though I used to live North of Toronto and Know exactly what's up. 73 KF5AFJ
I was very interested in the NVIS abilities of this antenna including the beaming aspects of it. I would like to see more videos of you demonstrating NVIS antennas and the pros and cons of different kinds of antennas and how some perform much better than others. I also enjoyed seeing you use the G90 in the field. I hope to one day to see you test the qrpver minion sdr transceiver (as soon as they make refinements to the firmware.) Great Video!
Another fine video. I'm trying to figure out, other than maybe NVIS what is the use case for the TDL over the rest of the MPAS system? I have MPAS 2 and the 17 foot whip, looking into adding another whip and the TDL conversion kit. Performance wise, what am I missing? Specifically, what mission would theTDL perform better than the MPAS vertical? Thx and keep up the great work! 73 de WM1K
Too new to comment on the product, but I greatly appreciate your presentations. When I first found your channel here on the tubes, I thought it looked like an interesting and expensive hobby. Around December, I got a suggestion for one of your vids while researching the raspberry pi for an unrelated project with my teenagers and I just liked the way you explain things. Next thing I knew, I hit subscribe and then I was off researching Marconi and the history of radio in general. I liked the idea of the hobby, but like I said, it seemed a little too expensive, ... until I found out about what people are doing with QRP/CW home brews. That sold it: I bought a study guide and found a good tutorial series that follows the book and I am on track to know the material well enough to sit comfortably for my Tech test in July this year, 🤞(Beervirus not withstanding.) I'm not going to build my first humble radio until I have my ticket in hand/ more time to really identify what's a need vs. a want in a first rig/ but you'll be the one I blame, (thank,) for motivating my interest, so thank you. Now back to Koch and Farnsworth practice. 73, de Juano. Callsign forthcoming.
Definitely interesting and seemed to perform well. CHA has been really killing it lately in the antenna game. As far as the rest my wifey a Dutch van Houten thought the aspect of woodstove and sausages made it that much better lol. Love your approach to videos btw. Was there any sort of idea on pricing or yet to be determined . and if you could choose only 2 antennas from chameleon both man portable perhaps qrp lightweight and more inclusive what would you go with I wonder? thanks again for all the content been binge watching it .
Thanks for the kindness. If I could choose only two man portable antennas from chameleon, they would be the MPAS 2.0 and emcomm 3 portable. And yes, everything goes better with sausages :-)
Hi There Julian. That delta loop looks like an interesting portable antenna esp given the vertical config. just been on the CHA website then realising it was a prototype - explains why it wasn't there. I was wondering about the cost of the system, knowing that 17ft stainless steel telescopic whips are available from MFJ at £80 ea in the UK.and there seems to be whole lot more in this package from CHA. the appeal for this commercial system is I can make a lot of antenna products, but I cant make a Telescopic whip to that standard,and it does look very well engineered. and the results of your tests gave some very good results on each config. 73 Barnie, M7PBX PS, Those sausages are look great,
I guess I'd like to see the results of longer-term deployment to see if parts hold up under stresses of weather, setup and takedown. NVIS and directionality are good qualities to have in your kit. - W2DLC
Another fine video, thank you for your efforts. Any concern about strain on the expandable elements bending them to the point that would compromise their performance when used in vertical configuration?
It would be of interest to me, if the NVIS is superior to a plain jane wire nvis dipole/inverted V antenna? If not - then I think I would choose the wire for its ruggedness over the telescoping whips.
The telescopic whip was chosen simply because it was extremely easy to deploy. I didn't want to mess around trying to put wires in a tree in those temperatures and wind. If I were in a mild climate, I would use än ef random wire 70-120ft long for sure.
Another great video! It seems as though it performs very well as more of an NVIS, but with lower reception and seemingly shorter range I think I would prefer the quicker setup that the MPAS 2.0 vertical provides, and MPAS 2.0 performance is amazing! And now I must go grill some of my jalapeno sausages!! :) 73
Yes I have the MPAS 2.0 and been making great DX to South America from Ireland since I got it in May. Using the FT-891 and 100 watts. Forget the G90, the FT-891 is a way better radio much better receiver and great sound through headphones, mic eq settings and 2 eq settings on the mic and the eq can be adjusted in the menu. Great radio.
Yes Paul, the 891 is a fantastic radio with really superb receive Audio when listening via headphones which I do 99% of the time. The receiver is so quiet compared to my G90 or 7300. Perhaps Yaesu radios are better in general but I wish my 7300 sounded so good but like so many I got seduced by the screen which is tiny anyway. ****From Yaesu **** "High end 32-Bit floating point DSP enhances the operating experience providing a cleaner, clearer signal and reducing overall operator fatigue creating a more enjoyable environment for any Amateur operator." And that's certainly true the Audio is clean with reduced operator fatigue!
Julian, I noticed you are using the MiniProSC and not the full Raspberry PI sound card that you did a while back. Is there a reason? My next radio is going to be the X90 to go along with my X5101 which I purchased after your review and I can tell you it is a fun rig.
OH8STN Ham Radio I was going to ask about the setup for digital modes with the g90 but just read this post so will wait for the video. Radio should be here this week so hopefully the extra stuff for digital modes will not be hard to source in a timely manor.
Great video. I just purchased one of these. I have a question: How does the telescopic whip compare to the CHA MIL + CHA MIL EXT combination when using the vertical setup. It looks like they are about the same height. One comes in the MAN PAS 2.0 and the other comes in the MAN PAS light. Thanks!
I like it, but I think an improvement would be a wide range autotuner at the feed point. It would be a winner that would tune 6-80 meters with minimal feed line loss.
@@OH8STN A field friendly tuner would be an Elecraft T1 (25 Watts or less) with a modified wireless tuner initiation switch. It is a project that I have been working on. Search web using "wireless switch with fob" for options. Not plug and play.......but might make an interesting video for your channel. Love your channel. Stay well.
Elecraft T1 has a 1/8 inch port on side that can initiate tuning.....you just need a remote way to connect two wires to initiate it. Some have used small diameter coax and a remote switch to do it, but a wireless switch would be better. You would lift the tuner and wireless switch relay high up in the air since it would have minimal weight and be self-contained.
I had that same question. The answer are power and efficiency. This can handle a lot more power than a magnetic glue. As a much larger loop, it should be more efficient than a small transmitting loop as well. Awesome question by the way.
I never got a good view of how the wire is making the electrical connection at the top of the whip. Can you describe this connection? Did you home brew the wire and connector? Thanks again for all the work you do! Randy, N4NOM 73
A very thourogh test and Your results should also excellent. Loop Antenns do a lot better than horisontal dipoles since the QRM AND QRN levels are a l l leveled due to a s c DCshorted Antenna. Simpel loopamtenna 80M 83,0 m or 40M 42,25m I used Electrical 1,5 sqmm cable connected to 23,0 m windowline kabel into a tuner on the balanced input. [SWR 2:1] Start with Antenna load and finish with TX load and adjust with coiladjustments. I usually use MFJ969 or MFJ962D and works fine! (LDG PRO200II) Even these MFJ969 all use 4:1 Balun and works fine! 73s de Gunnar sm6oer
It sets up a lot like the buddipole antenna in a delta loop configuration. I like it as a portable option. I would also hope they sell it as a vertical also.
Watching this video makes me wonder if you couldn't take the MFJ big ear and just run a wire between the two points. That antenna is similar to this one but it doesn't have 80 m nor a wire running between the two ends. it has been a great antenna for me though and I've actually just used it this weekend doing QRP and made some contacts into Florida from my QTH in Michigan.
No onions with the sausages, but then they might have froze anyway! I don't know if it is a gimmick or not. You never know until you try it. I can see how the telescopic antenna can have some appeal, but will it become loose when it is used for a while as most do of this type. It is a very long antenna to be telescopic and it would need to be very tough to stand the battering it would get here!
Agreed. You must be from the Midwest of USA. The sausage with onions with something I only found back in Chicago. My mouth is already watering :-) Yeah time will tell. I'm really hoping chameleons will read these comments and take them seriously. They're pretty good with absorbing user feedback into their design and Manufacturing. Let's see how it goes.
Hi Paul. Yes, the equipment working is really important. Too many times have gotten frostbite trying to fix something which shouldn't have been so fiddly in the first place. I'm sitting here working on the next g90 video as we speak. Yes I'm still enjoying it I just gave the videos break, to cover a few other topics. I hope I'll publish another g90 video this week.
Morning Julian, I think its a good idea in principle. However, given Chameleons usual price point, I'd like to see the development away from the use of telescopic whips. My primary concern would be the longevity of them ultimately resulting in rust. Perhaps something could be achieved using the existing style whips employed in the MPAS system? Something for them to look in to. In the meantime, I shall continue with my JS8 quest to make contact with you using a loop antenna indoors. 73's James
Thank you. Hopefully we can get more people to understand the value of js8 to the community. Thanks for watching, thanks for the comment. It's very much appreciated.
Hello Julian, kickass video and fascinating adventure. I love what you doing there. Tell me, is this the 355.-$ CHA-TDL Tactical Loop you got there? Happy Easter buddy & try to stay warm. 73's de Uncle Günter
I voted. I think it might needs a bit more research. This company produces fine products, but they are very expensive. I would want to know that this is the best, researched product that can be produced. Again, they make expensive items. I hope that you realize how much that you have added to our knowledge and understanding of portable operation. You have the first videos that I ever saw on portable operation a while back. Thank you for all that you have done for us. N4KBM
I absolutely love the idea of an NVIS antenna that doesn't need any infrastructure outside itself, messing around with trees is always such a bug bear and time sucker.
Julian, I already have the Chameleon Hybrid Mini, the two 17' whips, and the ground spike. Today I received the TDL hub and the loop wire from Chameleon. I plan on trying the TDL tomorrow at a POTA activation about 5 linear miles from Disney World. I have a question about a counterpoise. Is one needed? If not needed, will a counterpoise be beneficial? I can experiment and figure it out, but I'm wondering if you gave a counterpoise a try. Thanks. de K4NYM
Congratulations. You're going to love the TDL. I didn't use a counterpoise or even try one because it's essentially a balanced antenna. Doesn't hurt to experiment however. I would also experiment with having it higher and lower to the ground.
Hi Julian, Out of curiosity have you tried using the 17" telecscopic whip on top of the MIL EXT yet? You should have a almost a 26' tall vertical antenna with that combo. 73 Adam W9DWP
I have and it's pretty freaking magnificent :-) naturally it require some counterpoise wires oh, but that's not a problem. The only issue is it to keep in mind, was it required some guying. 73 Julian oh8stn
@@OH8STN Excellent! Do you still have the skip zone issue? As for the guying that's an easy fix with some bank line, stakes and a little cardboard aided design. Adam W9DWP
No skip Zone issues with a purely vertical configuration not at all. I suppose deploying the right antenna configurations for the days goal, is the best option.
I think this product goes a long way (bad pun) to show that having a single polarity antenna is a bad idea if your looking for emergency coms. I love the idea that it favors a single direction or is it two lobes, like a mag loop. Id love to play and see how narrow i could get the beam. Directional. Portable, and QRP = smaller batteries?
I voted outstanding and I was hoping to buy this immediately but did not see on the chameleon site. I have a few of their other antennas and would really like to use this one. I have posted a few of their product reviews as well on my W3GTR Take 5 TH-cam Channel Thanks for the great review. 73
Can't find the poll, but I think it's perfect (for what it is). The performance is as expected, although you'd like to see better results in the "near" surroundings. My opinion: everybody has different things they want in their performance. I have a car that brings me from a to b very comfortable, but doesn't go off-road. If that is what I want, I'd have to buy an other car.
Hello Julian! Nice review on a prototype =) I noticed something about this antenna, and with the CHA-Micro I have. Have you ever noticed that you are unable to fully seat the antenna elements into the balun? There always seems to be at least a 1-2mm gap after threading the parts together. I thought this was just an anomaly with the CHA-Micro, but I see it here in this video as well. It would seem to me that over time, having all of this stress from wind loading on a 3/8 threaded section would eventually lead to failure. I would think that Chameleon would be better off if they made their antenna elements fully seat into the coupler to have more surface area contact, and perhaps a high mechanical durability. Thoughts? 73!
I disagree with the MIL Whip 1.0 or 2.0 not seating, but agree 100% with this telescopic Mast not seating perfectly in the hybrid micro. I investigated this when I put it together the first time. The threads on the telescopic whip how much longer than they are on either version of the mil whip. Anyway I'm glad you brought it up, because I had forgotten to mention it to chameleon. Excellent catch and excellent point.👍🙏
OH8STN Ham Radio Hello Julian! I had a second look at the Chameleon Mil Whip, and you are correct! The Mil Whip has a stubby brass threaded section that will fully seat into the CHA-Micro balun. However, at least from what I have, the Mil Whip Extension has a slightly longer threaded part. I wonder if this is intentional on Chameleon’s part something that came about due to an engineering change?
This not-seating problem could be solved with a washer or even a lock washer. That may have even been in Chameleon's original plans and got lost in the execution.
Nice report, many thanks. Both configurations seem to function as per expectations, so it boils down to construction quality, no new physics. They look good but a few Q's. Given the very long whips that the little V must hold at severe angles, did you feel it was strong or on the verge of bending or breaking? Also, did the whips have any tendency to collapse, or is friction fit enough to be reliable? 73 PS: I don't see a poll....
To vote on the poll, click the "I" (info) icon in the top right of the video.
thanks forwatching
73
Julian oh8stn
I could not find the link to the poll.
Having the Wife's support is outstanding! My wife got her Tech license when I did and is not interested in upgrading BUT she supports my radio activities and really likes the off grid power capabilities that I have developed here. Not up to your level but making progress.
I know what you mean. Just having her support makes it so much easier. I have those friends whose people actively work against what they're trying to do. I guess we are lucky. Married the right ones :-)
I found high value from the review of differing propagation properties between the delta loop and the vertical whip configuration of the antenna. Thank you for including that in the presentation.
The ability to select one or the other, given the intended role of the communicator, is the reason I think it’s an outstanding portable system. I would make a purchase if it were available commercially.
Yes I probably could cobble together something that approaches the design with gear I already have. But it wouldn’t be as straightforward a deployment nor a sure fire hit right away when put in the air.
Like you, I’d rather spend less time fooling around with the antenna and more time working stations on the bands.
Thanks for this comment. Rarely do some understand this no messing around, once we're out in the field. I just need something which is robust, and works consistently after each deployment and take-down. Thanks for taking the time to leave the feedback. It's very much appreciated.
he was a luxky man,that have wife like that
Couldn't find the link. I say the Delta Loop is a winner.. it saves space in set-up and travel, it's directional, it RX and TX better than a dipole, it doesn't use radials and it's a perfect NVIS and Mid Range Antenna. Perfect for emergency operations and communications with family and friends while out on a trip.
I use a MFJ 1979 whip antenna that looks almost exactly like what you have shown. I use it with my wolf river coil which will also tune to 80m. This works standalone as a 20 meter antenna or lower freqs with the coil. You can buy a second whip and make a delta loop with the buddipole mount in the Y configuration. 73s IU3JNT
I purchased two of the MFJ 1979 whip antennas and I was so excited to use them as dipoles on 20 meters on an 18' mast I also got from MFJ. They have both failed at the same point. The second section from the tip has failed and no longer stops when reaching the stop point. Not sure if this is a defect in mine or just not built as well as should be. I am curious if Cameleon makes their own whips or if they may be made by the same manufacturer as MFJ?
I had one of those whips fail on me but was stored for a years in some moisture. Replaced it and still holding up. Have only used it as vertical though. If you have a proper radial network you're in business
I'm not sure if chameleon makes them themselves. I couldn't imagine chameleon using whip from some other manufacturer. I hope not anyway.
@@OH8STN Thank you for introducing me to AmRRON!
@@daveryan2148 I make sure I put a very light coat of sewing machine oil to keep the sections free of rust and moving freely.
Outstanding. Both your video and the prototype. For what it’s worth, I’m a newbie with base and portable comms, but like you, I just need / want my gear to work in the field.
I’m a seasoned outdoors woman who is interested in enjoying my time / activities while out. A ready-made product like the TDL would fit the bill.
Thanks again, Julian!
Thanks for the "first look" 👍 I just wish you had placed a warning at the beginning of the video about those sausages, because I hadn't had breakfast yet (hah)
Glad to see your ankle is better. Concerning the telescoping whip, there's the MFJ-1979 Telescopic Whip. It is Stainless Steel, 10-section, Adjustable, 17 ft. Extended Length. Gigaparts sells it for $65. I own two of them--and they are very well made and extremely sturdy. Concerning a Balun transformer for making a tunerless antenna, I experimented and made two different types--one has an impedance ratio of 5:1 and the other 6:1. The balun is installed in a 2 inch diameter pipe reducer (making it waterproof) which I picked up at the local hardware store. A coax connector is at one end and the whip connector at the other. The balun design is by G8JNJ. One can make a balun core or else purchase one ready made. Wiring up the balun is very simple.
Thanks Rachmiel. This video was taken the week before my ankle was hurt, but it is getting better. If you still have the tent in them, maybe I'll share some pictures on Facebook page. It's always awesome to see other ideas and how they come together. Thanks for the comment and the kindness. It's very much appreciated.
@@OH8STN I should still have some pics of the balun, If you want, I can certainly collect the links with the info showing how to make your own tunerless antenna and send them to you--this way if you want to ever go that route, you be spared from having to collect them yourself. I will say that I did not see any signiificant difference in performance between the 6:1 balun and the 5:1. I should also tell you that I became fascinated (with lack of a better word) with short HF antennas when I read the late Jerry Sevicks book on the subject. He's had also written a couple of books on antenna baluns--extremely useful stuff for those interested. If you want, I'd be glad to prepare a list of books and articles which I have found very useful for making portable HF antennas and which I believe you might want to pass on to the group.
Nice compact unit that contains all that is needed. This is what is needed for a portable mobile unit ready in a moments notice as a go-kit. This tent and portable cooker is a great touch. I believe it to be a great kit that with a little effort can be a well tuned ready to go kit not requiring an analyzer or tuner. Definitely a thumbs up.
Great video, I can't wait till my MPAS 2.0 arrives and we can get back into the parks for POTA. Keep up the great video's I completely revamped my mobile POTA setup from batteries, charger, computer, and more importantly attitude by watching your videos.
Well if you've got the right attitude, you're most of the way there. These types of comments actually provide the motivation to keep making videos. Stay safe and stay motivated. Thanks for watching.
After a long wait I got my MPAS 2.0 around the 24th of May 2020, Amazing antenna, on 20 meters since May I've been making regular DX from Ireland to South America 100 watts using the FT-891 which is a really amazing radio, great quiet receiver and I prefer it much more to my G90 which I hardly use now, it is a noisier radio and the FT-891 is almost the same size and it's filters work better then there's the MIC eq, 2 eq settings on the mic + the amazing DNR when you need it, amazing radio paired with the MPAS 2.0 and it's a really fantastic portable setup, I use the MFJ-939 auto tuner but if operating on 20 m the MPAS has a very low swr, around 1.2:1 and I also have the CAP Hat.
The fantastic analogue audio of the 891 not ruined by noisy SDR is a pleasure to listen to, I always listen with headphones.
Anyway, the MPAS convinced me that Chameleon are as good as owners have been saying and sometime I may try one of their loops or even the delta loop.
The MPAS works so well on 20m that I decided to leave it up permanently and take it down for portable use, it can be set up and taken down in under 10 mins. I use only the single counterpoise so far.
In the Winter I will get to test it more on 40 m but I've been making such great DX to South America that I haven't moved off 20m. I have tried 40 and made contacts around Europe but never really tried DX on 40m yet or any other band, it works on 80m too, made a contact to the U.K last weekend, haven't used it much on 80m.
I also noticed that the MPAS is a really quiet antenna, I live in the sticks which really allows me hear weak DX signals. I also have only used it with the spike in the ground, not elevated which I might try next.
Did you get your MPAS yet ?
Hey, Julian! I'm revisiting this video tonight because Chameleon has offered a "partial" kit to build a full Delta Loop. Since I have the Micro, and one stainless steel whip, all I need is the partial kit and one more whip. This antenna looks like it might solve a few of my issues with hitting some of the stations I work with, with improved results. Thank you for testing this prototype! Stay warm and healthy! Kudos to the wife and crew for support. 73!
A ground-mounted Delta is going to put a lot of signal up in the air. But if you can raise it - and it looks light enough to do that quite easily - it will start to beat the vertical for DX and the directivity will sharpen. Something like that tuned for the higher bands when the solar flux is up will be outstanding.
Enjoy watching your winter radio and antenna testing and the tents you use videos. I have CHA TDL and use it with my ID-705. Enjoy all your videos.
Hey buddy I've been away from radio for a while I'm just getting back in it again great to see you're making more videos this is freaking awesome I love the Santana system you got going really awesome man you're the man you're the man 👍👍👍👍👍
I have recently discovered a love of full-wave loops. I'm curious about the performance of this versus other antenna configurations. If one is going to add a bunch of parts, and weight, then I would hope for superior performance over other designs.
Well said.
Make a vertical delta loop, and never look back...
I have never worked with a vertical loop only horizontal loops and I have had great success even with sub standard antenna layouts. It's interesting, but have to see the price first.
Le plus important dans cette vidéos, ce sont les saucisses !!!!!! 😂 blagues à part, encore une vidéo honnête et objective. Merci pour votre travail. 73
This is not low cost by any means. But your comment on expecting kit to work and not be fiddly in the field is what I too want. may be I should take another look at this - two antennas in one. Thank you for the expert demo, the family cooking and having fun with you also was excellent.
Great video! Thanks to the family, too. It's so nice to have spouses who support these worthy endeavors.
Thank you yl for letting julian make so many great vids!
🙏👍
Another outstanding video as always! As to performance I expect Delta loop to be comparable to a magnetic loop in reference to NVIS and low angle radiation when both are close to the ground. Arguably the advantage of the Delta loop is that it is more broad banded so there is less fiddling with tuning, but digital operators usually use a narrow portion of the band. Therefore, SSB operators might prefer the Delta loop over a mag loop.
Excellent analysis and I totally agree.
@@OH8STN Did you check the DL SWR? Would like to know what to expect.
Your spouse does deserve some serious credit here. I will suggest that HAM spouses - operators themselves or not - do tend to be highly decent, supportive and generally wonderful people.
My Delta loop kit comes in today. I already have the MPAS-2 and bought the Delta loop to close the gap on short range POTA hunters when activating. Thanks again for your great testing, explanations and videos. 73 KO4KHB
I use theese MFJ 17feet telescoping whips with Chamelon micro for nearly two years now. The original whip and whip extension is very expensive for what you get. Had a lot of fun with them. The deltaloop looks very interesting. I wonder if Chameleon will sell the base alone. And btw. great video again Julian. 73, Stephan, DF6PA
thanks. yeah not speaking for chameleon but they did say something about addons or accessories for the MPAS. So perhaps its possible.
But honestly, if you can make something which works well for you in the field, when I do it?
Hi Julian, I do like the vertical configuration. The sausages looked great, I can taste them now :)
Thanks Derek. I was actually quite surprised when I could hear with the ground-mounted vertical. It really was a surprise. The sausages were great by the way :-)
I am impressed with the vertical configuration, I have tried one myself, and gave it two thumbs down, it was poor at best, but then I compare all antennas to my 80m full wave loop, which outperforms my beam at times. I love your evaluations.
Same issue with my 80 meter in full wave skyloop. it's difficult not giving a thumbs down to every other antenna deployed.
This delta loop for the non constructor / portable operator looks to be the antenna of choice, the price of this product will either make it popular or limited to those with deep pockets. This was suppose to be my first year of portable operation. To all stay safe, stay healthy. Yes this product gets my thumbs up on this first review.
Who the hell thumbs-downs this video? Seriously? Thank you for continuing to create and post some of the best technical content and best videos about amateur radio on TH-cam. I’m always happy to see a new post from you.
Thanks for this. Some people just don't get it, and that's OK. I made this video for Operators like yourself, who want to see the story as it moves along. Thanks for the support, thanks for the kindness I definitely thanks for watching. It's very much appreciated.
73
Julian oh8stn
OH8STN Ham Radio - I became a Patreon last night to spite the thumbs down. I’ve been meaning to do it anyway, as your content is well worth the support, however this just reminded me. Thanks thumbs down guy :-)
Yeeey ➿ loop-antennas 🙂. I just prepared today some copper litz wire 6mm thick, different lengths (1; 1.5; 2 and 3 ml) for my MLA-30 antenna. I hope I can make it better on the 17, 10, 12 m band with the shorter loops.
👍😀 sounds like we have the same kind of "weird thing" with Loop antennas. This was my first experience using a Delta Loop, I've also got all the components here to put up a sky loop, which should happen this summer.
Thanks for watching.
Excellent stuff Julian. Great experiment. There is just something about radio.
I was waiting for you to show this nice antenna. Delta loops as a few advantages and the one I like is no radials to operate. It’s a nice effective antenna. I prefer shock cord elements for easy setup, I will have to wait and see on these elements. Thank you for sharing!
Totally agreed. Since the weather is getting better I'd like to spend more time in the field getting to know the nuances of this antenna. You are right though, not needing to mess with those counterpoise wires is huge.
Thanks for doing all the videos.
Thank you wife for supporting
73-KD2ETN
My impression from this is that it's great product for what it is. How ever I wouldn't buy it, simply because I'm opposite of you and like to fiddle around, build the staff and try different things. Also I was little surprised the configuration is not using ground as an "element" some where I read (don't quite me, I don't have the source and aren't sure) that you get quite low radiation angle when using ground as one element. All the best and keep up the good work. 73 oh2fhj
Our club chaiirman swears by delta loops and we are all taught how to make them. I have scratch built a delta loop for 6m, and now have one of the chairman's own designed 6m delta beam. It has 4 elements on a fibreglass box section beam. It's a bit of a handful to set up and get installed on the mast but its a very good antenna and needs no additional matching. I use it in the mid week contests. Typically for a single loop antenna we use 2 fibreglass fishing poles as the arms of the loop, and a matching transformer coil made from 75ohm coax. Hope the ankle is feeling better 73 OM de G1AW
These verticals look like my Alpha Delta Telescopic antenna that I tried to use with my MP1DXMAX. Since I have the MPAS 2.0 it has been sitting. This might be a chance to resurrect it! Great job Julian as usual.
Thank you to your wife and for the excellent review 73, Roger N4GF
Impressed at the NVIS performance of the loop! I miss makara sausage - tried at the Finnish church shop in London before lockdown, but they only had mustard 73 de M0MFX
Thnaks for the review. 👍 The telescopic whip looks similar to the MFJ-1979. I usually associate a delta loop with directiviy, and that one looks to be pretty good for DX.
Great idea. The test of course is how efficient is the system (matching system). If Chameleon will allow you, please do a comparison with a resonant dipole.
I own an Emcomm II and I am looking for a portable verticale, I am actually considering the CHA MIL 2.0 + CHA MIL EXT. But I will definitely wait to see what is going on with this loop as it offers the loop + verticale configuration in one nice package! Thanks Julian for that video!
I have the MPAS and I've been making great DX from Ireland to South America on 20m and a FT-891 @100w. I was amazed, really amazed to it's performance, I use the single supplied counterpoise, spike in ground and CAP HAT.
I also live in a noise free area in the sticks which allows me to hear great DX.
Get the MPAS 2.0 you will be amazed.
Two thumbs up for the sausages!
Got to love those sausages:-)
2:14 7:26
Just found your channel via a Chameleon email to me. Look forward to following you. 73, de WY4O.
Nice day out Julien, I have 2 of those Whips, they are about 70$ each, knowing Chamleon, they will come up with a bit more rugged version,..in the end,... looking forward to a contact with u on JS8Call, 73
As usual, crackin video Julian.... nice delta loop and a good idea for /P work... looking forward to the next one... cheers... 73's L
😊 I enjoyed your comments about antenna, but would have liked more specific info on band contacts and band performance.
Well the Info Icon never came up to vote, but I did like the concept. I have one of the Collapsible antennas that came when I purchased the MPAS-2 system. All I would need to try what you did would be the 2nd whip and the tee connector that you used. So I wouldn't mind trying the same test setup that you did as this sounds like a nice experiment for sure. Thanks for the Video... Vic KE8JWE
It has potential my question is what is the length of the telescopic whip in its collapsed position?
The mfj that looks very similar works great however I think that the design would be much better if the collapsed length was closer to 15 inches or so so it would fit in a feild pack this is the main gripe with the mfj at any rate
Another great video Julian- here I thought I was the only one using inverted delta loops for NVIS. That's one of my winter (i.e. in door) antenna setups. Like you said though, the radiation pattern is not necessarily obvious. Your azimuth suggestion is something to keep in mind.
Fishermen crazy. Amateur radio op in the snow covered field who dragged wife and sister-in-law with him, completely sane! (The dog would have been happy to join you no matter what!)
😂
I’d be interested in purchasing it if it were also made available in parts for those who already have the MPAS 1.0 or 2.0. How does one tune the antenna and where in the band is it resonant. Im guessing it’s very narrow being a loop. Also, it would be great to compare it in performance to the F Loop or P Loop.
I am also curious if you can purchase add-on components to complement the MPAS 2.0. It looks like you need a 2nd vertical whip and extension, the v-junction to attach to the spike, an wire to connect the two ends (18ft long?).
Outstanding !! I have had great performance with DELTA LOOPS - Thanks for what you do
ZS6-AQ South Africa. Thank you for that great insight, firstly I do agree with you, they should put this into production. 2. I only have one Q? What hight can one go with this antenna. Would one have better results with hight or not. Thank you once again Julian great video.
Looks like it might be a good companion to my MPAS 2.0. First time for me too seeing how a delta loop worked in a field trial. I do need to get some dinner now after seeing the sausages :) 73 Don KM6TRZ
Due to it's marginal RF performance I'm generally not a fan of using stainless steel in antennas. It's fine as a support structure but I'll bet the performance would improve by adding a wire in parallel with the tubing. Neat idea, and a great video!
Very nice video Julian. I have seen some DXcommander 7M poles turned into Delta Loops and I believe John did quite well with it. But it is really nice to see ultra long telescopic whips prefabbed. I am doing well with a SuperAntenna MP1 inside on JS8 using a Lithium Iron 10AH cell and a G90 Cross between your stuff and Mike's stuff. I am in Texas and more concerned with Mosquito's than Heating though I used to live North of Toronto and Know exactly what's up. 73 KF5AFJ
I was very interested in the NVIS abilities of this antenna including the beaming aspects of it. I would like to see more videos of you demonstrating NVIS antennas and the pros and cons of different kinds of antennas and how some perform much better than others. I also enjoyed seeing you use the G90 in the field. I hope to one day to see you test the qrpver minion sdr transceiver (as soon as they make refinements to the firmware.) Great Video!
Another fine video. I'm trying to figure out, other than maybe NVIS what is the use case for the TDL over the rest of the MPAS system? I have MPAS 2 and the 17 foot whip, looking into adding another whip and the TDL conversion kit. Performance wise, what am I missing? Specifically, what mission would theTDL perform better than the MPAS vertical? Thx and keep up the great work! 73 de WM1K
Quick answer. Low noise floor, regional communications, relatively easy to deploy.
Too new to comment on the product, but I greatly appreciate your presentations. When I first found your channel here on the tubes, I thought it looked like an interesting and expensive hobby. Around December, I got a suggestion for one of your vids while researching the raspberry pi for an unrelated project with my teenagers and I just liked the way you explain things. Next thing I knew, I hit subscribe and then I was off researching Marconi and the history of radio in general. I liked the idea of the hobby, but like I said, it seemed a little too expensive, ... until I found out about what people are doing with QRP/CW home brews. That sold it: I bought a study guide and found a good tutorial series that follows the book and I am on track to know the material well enough to sit comfortably for my Tech test in July this year, 🤞(Beervirus not withstanding.) I'm not going to build my first humble radio until I have my ticket in hand/ more time to really identify what's a need vs. a want in a first rig/ but you'll be the one I blame, (thank,) for motivating my interest, so thank you. Now back to Koch and Farnsworth practice. 73, de Juano. Callsign forthcoming.
this camelion antenna looks promising.
Thank you, 73
No problem. It's done very well for me since making this video. Thanks for watching and commenting, much appreciated.
73
Julian oh8stn
Definitely interesting and seemed to perform well. CHA has been really killing it lately in the antenna game. As far as the rest my wifey a Dutch van Houten thought the aspect of woodstove and sausages made it that much better lol. Love your approach to videos btw. Was there any sort of idea on pricing or yet to be determined . and if you could choose only 2 antennas from chameleon both man portable perhaps qrp lightweight and more inclusive what would you go with I wonder? thanks again for all the content been binge watching it .
Thanks for the kindness. If I could choose only two man portable antennas from chameleon, they would be the MPAS 2.0 and emcomm 3 portable. And yes, everything goes better with sausages :-)
Hi There Julian. That delta loop looks like an interesting portable antenna esp given the vertical config. just been on the CHA website then realising it was a prototype - explains why it wasn't there.
I was wondering about the cost of the system, knowing that 17ft stainless steel telescopic whips are available from MFJ at £80 ea in the UK.and there seems to be whole lot more in this package from CHA.
the appeal for this commercial system is I can make a lot of antenna products, but I cant make a Telescopic whip to that standard,and it does look very well engineered. and the results of your tests gave some very good results on each config.
73
Barnie, M7PBX
PS, Those sausages are look great,
Wow what a great setup!
It looks like a great time was had, and wow what an antenna too!
I guess I'd like to see the results of longer-term deployment to see if parts hold up under stresses of weather, setup and takedown. NVIS and directionality are good qualities to have in your kit. - W2DLC
Great video J, you’re videos are very informative for me
Another fine video, thank you for your efforts. Any concern about strain on the expandable elements bending them to the point that would compromise their performance when used in vertical configuration?
It would be of interest to me, if the NVIS is superior to a plain jane wire nvis dipole/inverted V antenna? If not - then I think I would choose the wire for its ruggedness over the telescoping whips.
The telescopic whip was chosen simply because it was extremely easy to deploy. I didn't want to mess around trying to put wires in a tree in those temperatures and wind. If I were in a mild climate, I would use än ef random wire 70-120ft long for sure.
Another great video! It seems as though it performs very well as more of an NVIS, but with lower reception and seemingly shorter range I think I would prefer the quicker setup that the MPAS 2.0 vertical provides, and MPAS 2.0 performance is amazing! And now I must go grill some of my jalapeno sausages!! :) 73
Yes I have the MPAS 2.0 and been making great DX to South America from Ireland since I got it in May. Using the FT-891 and 100 watts. Forget the G90, the FT-891 is a way better radio much better receiver and great sound through headphones, mic eq settings and 2 eq settings on the mic and the eq can be adjusted in the menu. Great radio.
@@o00scorpion00o Yes love my 891. Probably going to get a 2nd one!
Yes Paul, the 891 is a fantastic radio with really superb receive Audio when listening via headphones which I do 99% of the time. The receiver is so quiet compared to my G90 or 7300. Perhaps Yaesu radios are better in general but I wish my 7300 sounded so good but like so many I got seduced by the screen which is tiny anyway.
****From Yaesu ****
"High end 32-Bit floating point DSP enhances the operating experience providing a cleaner, clearer signal and reducing overall operator fatigue creating a more enjoyable environment for any Amateur operator."
And that's certainly true the Audio is clean with reduced operator fatigue!
Hi I've made this around 3 or 4 months ago the two whips are the MFJ 1979 17ft whips with 16.5ft of wire and the hibrid micro
Did you get the same results?
Have had great results , I’ve only been using it with a kx3 and only voice but happy
Julian, I noticed you are using the MiniProSC and not the full Raspberry PI sound card that you did a while back. Is there a reason? My next radio is going to be the X90 to go along with my X5101 which I purchased after your review and I can tell you it is a fun rig.
Next video up on the g90 will explore both options for data modes. The answer a bit complicated, so please wait a few days for that video.
OH8STN Ham Radio I was going to ask about the setup for digital modes with the g90 but just read this post so will wait for the video. Radio should be here this week so hopefully the extra stuff for digital modes will not be hard to source in a timely manor.
Great video. I just purchased one of these. I have a question: How does the telescopic whip compare to the CHA MIL + CHA MIL EXT combination when using the vertical setup. It looks like they are about the same height. One comes in the MAN PAS 2.0 and the other comes in the MAN PAS light. Thanks!
I like it, but I think an improvement would be a wide range autotuner at the feed point. It would be a winner that would tune 6-80 meters with minimal feed line loss.
100% agreed. Does anyone make a fully automatic feed Point tuner anymore, which doesn't have any control box? SGC perhaps?
@@OH8STN A field friendly tuner would be an Elecraft T1 (25 Watts or less) with a modified wireless tuner initiation switch. It is a project that I have been working on. Search web using "wireless switch with fob" for options. Not plug and play.......but might make an interesting video for your channel. Love your channel. Stay well.
Elecraft T1 has a 1/8 inch port on side that can initiate tuning.....you just need a remote way to connect two wires to initiate it. Some have used small diameter coax and a remote switch to do it, but a wireless switch would be better. You would lift the tuner and wireless switch relay high up in the air since it would have minimal weight and be self-contained.
Advantages to using this over a portable magnetic loop? BK I also would like to see Chameleon sell these telescopic antennas.
We'll start selling them in about a month or so!!
I had that same question. The answer are power and efficiency. This can handle a lot more power than a magnetic glue. As a much larger loop, it should be more efficient than a small transmitting loop as well. Awesome question by the way.
Gentlemen, thank you both for the quick replies. 73
I never got a good view of how the wire is making the electrical connection at the top of the whip. Can you describe this connection? Did you home brew the wire and connector?
Thanks again for all the work you do!
Randy, N4NOM
73
A very thourogh test and Your results should also excellent.
Loop Antenns do a lot better than horisontal dipoles since the QRM AND QRN levels are a l l leveled due to a s c
DCshorted Antenna. Simpel loopamtenna
80M 83,0 m or 40M 42,25m
I used Electrical 1,5 sqmm cable connected to 23,0 m windowline kabel
into a tuner on the balanced input.
[SWR 2:1] Start with Antenna load and finish with TX load and adjust with coiladjustments. I usually use MFJ969 or MFJ962D and works fine! (LDG PRO200II)
Even these MFJ969 all use 4:1 Balun and works fine!
73s de Gunnar sm6oer
It sets up a lot like the buddipole antenna in a delta loop configuration. I like it as a portable option. I would also hope they sell it as a vertical also.
Thanks you you and your company. You earned those sausages.
Fantastic bit of kit
Watching this video makes me wonder if you couldn't take the MFJ big ear and just run a wire between the two points. That antenna is similar to this one but it doesn't have 80 m nor a wire running between the two ends. it has been a great antenna for me though and I've actually just used it this weekend doing QRP and made some contacts into Florida from my QTH in Michigan.
No onions with the sausages, but then they might have froze anyway! I don't know if it is a gimmick or not. You never know until you try it. I can see how the telescopic antenna can have some appeal, but will it become loose when it is used for a while as most do of this type. It is a very long antenna to be telescopic and it would need to be very tough to stand the battering it would get here!
Agreed. You must be from the Midwest of USA. The sausage with onions with something I only found back in Chicago. My mouth is already watering :-)
Yeah time will tell. I'm really hoping chameleons will read these comments and take them seriously. They're pretty good with absorbing user feedback into their design and Manufacturing. Let's see how it goes.
@@OH8STN No I am not American, in Scotland they do that as well, but everyone is different, some like them others don't, what ever blows your kilt up!
Another great video. Like you, when I get out I want my equipment to just work. Just curious, are you still enjoying the Xiegu G90?
Hi Paul. Yes, the equipment working is really important. Too many times have gotten frostbite trying to fix something which shouldn't have been so fiddly in the first place.
I'm sitting here working on the next g90 video as we speak. Yes I'm still enjoying it I just gave the videos break, to cover a few other topics. I hope I'll publish another g90 video this week.
Morning Julian, I think its a good idea in principle. However, given Chameleons usual price point, I'd like to see the development away from the use of telescopic whips. My primary concern would be the longevity of them ultimately resulting in rust. Perhaps something could be achieved using the existing style whips employed in the MPAS system? Something for them to look in to.
In the meantime, I shall continue with my JS8 quest to make contact with you using a loop antenna indoors.
73's
James
Thx 4 js8 info about publishing :)
Thank you. Hopefully we can get more people to understand the value of js8 to the community. Thanks for watching, thanks for the comment. It's very much appreciated.
Hello Julian, kickass video and fascinating adventure. I love what you doing there. Tell me, is this the 355.-$ CHA-TDL Tactical Loop you got there? Happy Easter buddy & try to stay warm. 73's de Uncle Günter
I voted. I think it might needs a bit more research. This company produces fine products, but they are very expensive. I would want to know that this is the best, researched product that can be produced. Again, they make expensive items. I hope that you realize how much that you have added to our knowledge and understanding of portable operation. You have the first videos that I ever saw on portable operation a while back. Thank you for all that you have done for us. N4KBM
Have you had any more experience with the delta loop? Looking for ideas on how to reduce SWR.
I absolutely love the idea of an NVIS antenna that doesn't need any infrastructure outside itself, messing around with trees is always such a bug bear and time sucker.
Totally agree. 👍
@@OH8STN One question, how much does the delta loop "kit" weigh?
Julian, I already have the Chameleon Hybrid Mini, the two 17' whips, and the ground spike. Today I received the TDL hub and the loop wire from Chameleon. I plan on trying the TDL tomorrow at a POTA activation about 5 linear miles from Disney World. I have a question about a counterpoise. Is one needed? If not needed, will a counterpoise be beneficial? I can experiment and figure it out, but I'm wondering if you gave a counterpoise a try. Thanks. de K4NYM
Congratulations. You're going to love the TDL. I didn't use a counterpoise or even try one because it's essentially a balanced antenna. Doesn't hurt to experiment however. I would also experiment with having it higher and lower to the ground.
I must have missed something. Where is the link to the poll?
In the cards. Just click the little info icon at the top right of the video
Hi Julian,
Out of curiosity have you tried using the 17" telecscopic whip on top of the MIL EXT yet? You should have a almost a 26' tall vertical antenna with that combo.
73
Adam W9DWP
I have and it's pretty freaking magnificent :-) naturally it require some counterpoise wires oh, but that's not a problem. The only issue is it to keep in mind, was it required some guying.
73
Julian oh8stn
@@OH8STN
Excellent! Do you still have the skip zone issue? As for the guying that's an easy fix with some bank line, stakes and a little cardboard aided design.
Adam W9DWP
No skip Zone issues with a purely vertical configuration not at all. I suppose deploying the right antenna configurations for the days goal, is the best option.
It looks to me like that Chamelion Base coil (?) are pretty flimsy. Your thoughts ?
Thanks for another interesting video...
You're welcome Ian, thank you for watching.
I think this product goes a long way (bad pun) to show that having a single polarity antenna is a bad idea if your looking for emergency coms. I love the idea that it favors a single direction or is it two lobes, like a mag loop. Id love to play and see how narrow i could get the beam. Directional. Portable, and QRP = smaller batteries?
Sausages look amazing!
They absolutely were :-)
It does what it says on the box Mobil e easy to put up and back away antenna 👍
I voted outstanding and I was hoping to buy this immediately but did not see on the chameleon site. I have a few of their other antennas and would really like to use this one. I have posted a few of their product reviews as well on my W3GTR Take 5 TH-cam Channel Thanks for the great review. 73
Can't find the poll, but I think it's perfect (for what it is). The performance is as expected, although you'd like to see better results in the "near" surroundings. My opinion: everybody has different things they want in their performance. I have a car that brings me from a to b very comfortable, but doesn't go off-road. If that is what I want, I'd have to buy an other car.
Well said
Fantastic. Thanks for the great video. 73 de F1VNO
Thank you Andrey 👍👍👍
Would like to see a spreadsheet with pwr, mode,band and distance to compare specs👍
Nice idea, but also a huge amount of work.
Hello Julian! Nice review on a prototype =) I noticed something about this antenna, and with the CHA-Micro I have. Have you ever noticed that you are unable to fully seat the antenna elements into the balun? There always seems to be at least a 1-2mm gap after threading the parts together. I thought this was just an anomaly with the CHA-Micro, but I see it here in this video as well. It would seem to me that over time, having all of this stress from wind loading on a 3/8 threaded section would eventually lead to failure. I would think that Chameleon would be better off if they made their antenna elements fully seat into the coupler to have more surface area contact, and perhaps a high mechanical durability. Thoughts? 73!
I disagree with the MIL Whip 1.0 or 2.0 not seating, but agree 100% with this telescopic Mast not seating perfectly in the hybrid micro. I investigated this when I put it together the first time. The threads on the telescopic whip how much longer than they are on either version of the mil whip. Anyway I'm glad you brought it up, because I had forgotten to mention it to chameleon. Excellent catch and excellent point.👍🙏
OH8STN Ham Radio Hello Julian! I had a second look at the Chameleon Mil Whip, and you are correct! The Mil Whip has a stubby brass threaded section that will fully seat into the CHA-Micro balun. However, at least from what I have, the Mil Whip Extension has a slightly longer threaded part. I wonder if this is intentional on Chameleon’s part something that came about due to an engineering change?
This not-seating problem could be solved with a washer or even a lock washer. That may have even been in Chameleon's original plans and got lost in the execution.
Julian, great video I wonder how it would compare to a wire delta loop ?
Nice report, many thanks. Both configurations seem to function as per expectations, so it boils down to construction quality, no new physics. They look good but a few Q's. Given the very long whips that the little V must hold at severe angles, did you feel it was strong or on the verge of bending or breaking? Also, did the whips have any tendency to collapse, or is friction fit enough to be reliable? 73 PS: I don't see a poll....
Touch the “I” in the top right of the video and it will appear on the side.
Would love to see a lot more on this antenna system.