Modern West Frisian has “frommiske “ for woman, from “frou” + minske (the latter means person, Old Germanic was “*mannisko”, which also gave German Mensch and Dutch “mens”.
My headcanon is that "nnr" became "thr" because they all had a cold! It might seem that "n" and "th" are very different sounds, but here's a theory. English speakers typically pronounce "n" as an alveolar consonant - ie the tip of your tongue is placed on the alveolar ridge (the flesh above your top row of teeth). But it can also be pronounced as a dental consonant - try moving your tongue down to your teeth (where it would be for "th"), you can still pronounce "n" but it sounds a bit closer to "th". The difference in articulation between the two is actually the sides of the tongue, which "seals" the mouth for "n", fully obstructing the airflow whereas it leaves gaps at the sides for "th" allowing the air to escape (giving it the characteristic soft hissing sound). Anyway, if Old Norse speakers articulated "n" as dental rather than alveolar, it's not actually as big a change from "n" to "th" as you might think.
Interestingly, although Swedish has degenerated the genitive plural to “mäns”, from the nominative plural + s from the genitive singular, the Norse form “manna” is still preserved in phrases such as “i mannaminne” literally meaning “in the memory of men”, or more figuratively “in living history”. This would be from the old norse form “í manna minni”
With the increase in pod schooling (parents pooling resources to hire a teacher, much like the one-room school house days) and homeschool right now, I wonder if anyone is putting this into their independent learning programs?
I will definitely be incorporating info from this channel into our homeschool curriculum. I hope Dr. Crawford considers using the Outschool platform to do courses for middle and high school students.
One could say that Mann/Maðr equates (in some contexts) with the non-specific word one, could one not? That is after all how 'man' is used in Modern Norwegian (though 'en' also exists, but is not as common as 'man').
Mann is also the German word for man, however, if you want to say someone, its written man (e.g. Man kann sich denken, dass one can think, that) which is quite interesting in my eyes. / i very much enjoy watching your channel, do you speak any other germanic languages aside from english?
The same is true in Danish, but the Danish words "mand" (a man) and "man" (one/someone) are pronounced slightly differently, so perhaps they don't come from the same root.
Is there any relationship between the old norse name for the Kven tribes and the old norse for woman? “Kvenmaðr” If so, could this suggest that early proto Germanic men in Scandinavia took so many Kven women as wives that it became a word synonymous with woman? Or even the other way around?
No. "Kven-" is cognate with "queen". So "queen-man", not "Kven man". "kven-" and "kona" are from the same PIE source as the other IE words you're alluding to.
In early editions of the Bible in Old English, Adam was the ‘first man’ and Eve was the ‘second man’, because ‘man’ meant ‘person’, not necessarily ‘male’. There were two types of man in OE: weaponed-man (i.e. one who fights, a male) and weaver-man (i.e one who weaves, a female). Say ‘weaver-man’ quickly as though in the flow of conversation and you’ll find the ‘v’ sound being glossed over, with the result sounding not too dissimilar from the word ‘woman’. You can also hear how 'weaver' becomes 'wife'. Another modern occurrence of ‘man’ not meaning ‘male’ is ‘mankind’ - literally ‘person-kin’. Justin Trudeau showed he did not know the etymological history of the word ‘man’ when he interrupted a questioner who said ‘mankind’ to say he preferred ‘personkind’. Modern Germanic languages use ‘man’ where we would say ‘one’ or ‘you’, as in “one/you can take a bus to town”.
'Kvenmaðr' is paralleled pretty closely in the Old English word 'wifmann' - literally 'wife person' , which became modern English 'woman'
Modern West Frisian has “frommiske “ for woman, from “frou” + minske (the latter means person, Old Germanic was “*mannisko”, which also gave German Mensch and Dutch “mens”.
... Oh
Back in the day, I took a couple of coach trips right across the USA. The state that impressed me the most? Colorado-- stunning place.
My headcanon is that "nnr" became "thr" because they all had a cold!
It might seem that "n" and "th" are very different sounds, but here's a theory. English speakers typically pronounce "n" as an alveolar consonant - ie the tip of your tongue is placed on the alveolar ridge (the flesh above your top row of teeth). But it can also be pronounced as a dental consonant - try moving your tongue down to your teeth (where it would be for "th"), you can still pronounce "n" but it sounds a bit closer to "th". The difference in articulation between the two is actually the sides of the tongue, which "seals" the mouth for "n", fully obstructing the airflow whereas it leaves gaps at the sides for "th" allowing the air to escape (giving it the characteristic soft hissing sound).
Anyway, if Old Norse speakers articulated "n" as dental rather than alveolar, it's not actually as big a change from "n" to "th" as you might think.
Interestingly, although Swedish has degenerated the genitive plural to “mäns”, from the nominative plural + s from the genitive singular, the Norse form “manna” is still preserved in phrases such as “i mannaminne” literally meaning “in the memory of men”, or more figuratively “in living history”. This would be from the old norse form “í manna minni”
With the increase in pod schooling (parents pooling resources to hire a teacher, much like the one-room school house days) and homeschool right now, I wonder if anyone is putting this into their independent learning programs?
I will definitely be incorporating info from this channel into our homeschool curriculum. I hope Dr. Crawford considers using the Outschool platform to do courses for middle and high school students.
One could say that Mann/Maðr equates (in some contexts) with the non-specific word one, could one not? That is after all how 'man' is used in Modern Norwegian (though 'en' also exists, but is not as common as 'man').
Mann is also the German word for man, however, if you want to say someone, its written man (e.g. Man kann sich denken, dass one can think, that) which is quite interesting in my eyes. / i very much enjoy watching your channel, do you speak any other germanic languages aside from english?
Anna WHO i think he can speak german, norwegian and probably modern icelandic as well
The same is true in Danish, but the Danish words "mand" (a man) and "man" (one/someone) are pronounced slightly differently, so perhaps they don't come from the same root.
@@felipemontero9839 thanks
@@anotherelvis in german they are pronounced the same, but I will google or ask one of my Scandinavistik professors with the danish words
@@annawho2220 Cool. Please write the answer here, when you have it.
Is the "Ψ" symbol used only for "maðr" in nominative or for all forms?
Is there any relationship between the old norse name for the Kven tribes and the old norse for woman? “Kvenmaðr” If so, could this suggest that early proto Germanic men in Scandinavia took so many Kven women as wives that it became a word synonymous with woman? Or even the other way around?
And maybe Kona was decended from the original PIE word for woman since it looks more similar to other PIE counterparts?
No. "Kven-" is cognate with "queen". So "queen-man", not "Kven man". "kven-" and "kona" are from the same PIE source as the other IE words you're alluding to.
Mr. Wen \m/ Interesting that they’re both descended from the same word
Cognate to Greek gunè. (Both “kona” and queen). (Cf. gynaecology)
Why is it “snotrs manns hjarta” and not “snotri manni hjarta”? Thought that you used the dative for possession of body parts?
Genetive is possession not dative
@@skatesplayz3458 Well people say “hár honum” not “hár hans”, right?
If this is only a sound change in Old West Norse, why does the Old Swedish (descended from Old East Norse) Västgötalagen spell it as “maþr”?
to be fair he didn't say "only" Old West Norse
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👍🌷
In early editions of the Bible in Old English, Adam was the ‘first man’ and Eve was the ‘second man’, because ‘man’ meant ‘person’, not necessarily ‘male’. There were two types of man in OE: weaponed-man (i.e. one who fights, a male) and weaver-man (i.e one who weaves, a female). Say ‘weaver-man’ quickly as though in the flow of conversation and you’ll find the ‘v’ sound being glossed over, with the result sounding not too dissimilar from the word ‘woman’. You can also hear how 'weaver' becomes 'wife'. Another modern occurrence of ‘man’ not meaning ‘male’ is ‘mankind’ - literally ‘person-kin’. Justin Trudeau showed he did not know the etymological history of the word ‘man’ when he interrupted a questioner who said ‘mankind’ to say he preferred ‘personkind’. Modern Germanic languages use ‘man’ where we would say ‘one’ or ‘you’, as in “one/you can take a bus to town”.