Any chance we might see Servos and heli flight controllers start supporting the Dshot protocol to control the servos in the future? I get that updating your servo at 8kHz like you can with Dshot600 is waaay overkill. But if the protocol exists and is open source, and the hardware is cheap, why not use it? Especially with helicopters where there might actually be a percievable benefit. It certainly made a difference for quadcopters when they switched from using pwm to control the ESCs to using Dshot instead. PWM to the servo is the last digital to analog and back to digital again signal path in the control link these days and been thinking ever since dshot came out for quads and their ESCs that it would be cool to see this used for servos as well.
@@RotoRCol The betaflight and blheli devs came up with it back in 2016 to remove any errors from the flightcontroller-esc communication. They had gone all the way up to a 25us center pulse for pwm, multishot was what that was called, but noticed there tended to be error in the way the esc interpreted the signal and in the way the flight controller produced the signal. So they came up with dshot instead so even if there is a small error in producing the signal, as long as the esc can read the 1's and 0's the signal retains full precision. In the case of dshot i believe it's 11 bit precision. 2048 positions. The packet itself is 16 bit though with a reverse direction but, so for a servo where you would be going forward and backward, you'd get 12 bit precision. You can read all about it with a Google search, it's really cool stuff.
It's all quadcopter open source code stuff. They are always coming up with cool stuff. Been waiting for dshot compatible servos to trickle down someday, but it's been years and years and hasn't happened yet. Lol
What would be the difference with same hz, but different pulse width? Would the wider pulse width actually be smoother since it has more 'data points' for servo travel? Would this be better for the f3c flyers?
Not necessarily. Resolution is not less with vBar and Theta. Both can handle 0.04us, so nothing changes there. Some people have to lower gains simply because the higher response can have adverse effects with some helis and high frequency vibrations.
Bert can I ask are you going to come out with a control box for your BK 9000 servos? And are you going to come out with Mini servos? Sorry to ask but is it true Kyle left? Why? Lastly not everyone uses Vcontrol/Vbar.
We have no plans to release a programming box for the 9000 series, that will come with a new servo series in the future as the 9000 series is not programmable. Kyle doesn't with us full time any more, but he didn't leave! He is still very much involved with BK Hobbies and SAB and managing other aspects of the business. I am fully aware not everyone uses V control, but this video is intended for those who use it. Sorry, but I only fly V Control.
@@BertKammerer There's no need to say your sorry for using V control. Thank you. And thank you on letting me know Kyle is still around. Word was he left. I have like 25 sets of your older servos. And 4 sets of the 9000 series. So you are coming out with a new line of servos. Cannot wait to get my hands on them. Thank you Sir.
@@Airbrushkid Wow. Thank you for your great support! Yes, he had a good job opportunity outside the hobby, so can't blame him for that, but he still works with us doing team management, testing and representing BK and SAB :)
your video is very interesting, I have x1 razors, they don't return to the center after a shift. which parameter could I change to have a higher sensitivity?
@@BertKammerer hi thanks for the reply. I use a spektrum receiver system, not all servos do, it happened to me on two aerobatic models where there are a lot of vibrations, in both cases the affected channel was the ailerons. in the first case I had only one servo per aileron, I replaced the razors with new ones and the problem disappeared. in the second case the aileron has two servos on each side.
Best explanation of the EVO to date, felt no different from a SmackTalk episode lol.
Thank you 😀
Nice how you let crumble the hyped servo centering thing! Like it!
Very Good explanation and honest evaluation.
Totally appreciate the time taken to do this video as it's needed. All the content was necessary for us to know.
Very informative Bert! I just installed my first VBAR EVO and this is gonna help a lot. Looks like you are our new Finless Bob!
Thanks Bert! Appreciate the information! This helps a lot!
Very helpful, thanks Bert!
As always from Bert you get it as it is, No BS , great video great information from the Man. now send me some BK servos please :)
Awesome video! Thanks, Bert.
awesome video!!!!! thank you sir
Great info. I learned something today
Any chance we might see Servos and heli flight controllers start supporting the Dshot protocol to control the servos in the future? I get that updating your servo at 8kHz like you can with Dshot600 is waaay overkill. But if the protocol exists and is open source, and the hardware is cheap, why not use it? Especially with helicopters where there might actually be a percievable benefit. It certainly made a difference for quadcopters when they switched from using pwm to control the ESCs to using Dshot instead.
PWM to the servo is the last digital to analog and back to digital again signal path in the control link these days and been thinking ever since dshot came out for quads and their ESCs that it would be cool to see this used for servos as well.
never heart of that, what type of signal dshot protocol send?
@@RotoRCol The betaflight and blheli devs came up with it back in 2016 to remove any errors from the flightcontroller-esc communication. They had gone all the way up to a 25us center pulse for pwm, multishot was what that was called, but noticed there tended to be error in the way the esc interpreted the signal and in the way the flight controller produced the signal. So they came up with dshot instead so even if there is a small error in producing the signal, as long as the esc can read the 1's and 0's the signal retains full precision. In the case of dshot i believe it's 11 bit precision. 2048 positions. The packet itself is 16 bit though with a reverse direction but, so for a servo where you would be going forward and backward, you'd get 12 bit precision.
You can read all about it with a Google search, it's really cool stuff.
It's all quadcopter open source code stuff. They are always coming up with cool stuff.
Been waiting for dshot compatible servos to trickle down someday, but it's been years and years and hasn't happened yet. Lol
Bert thanks for the video! This was very informative. Another thing: do you use the hard C-dampening and 90/90 shore rings on the piuma?
Yes! But it is normal with that setup to have some wobbles at first at lower head speeds, over time once things "wear in", it goes away.
What would be the difference with same hz, but different pulse width? Would the wider pulse width actually be smoother since it has more 'data points' for servo travel? Would this be better for the f3c flyers?
That is my assumption based on the data, the wider the pulse width, the more resolution available, therefore the more precise it "should feel".
Do you have to lower your cyclic gain if you switch to narrow band on cyclic as there is less resolution?
Not necessarily. Resolution is not less with vBar and Theta. Both can handle 0.04us, so nothing changes there. Some people have to lower gains simply because the higher response can have adverse effects with some helis and high frequency vibrations.
How to do it without Theta Servos? I just got GDW Servos 760us + Vstabi Neo
You'll have to contact GDW, sorry, I don't know anything about those servos.
Quick question, what is the max HZ of the theta servos. Is it 400hz? So the max you can run is 333hz on the fbl?
1000Hz at 760us center pulse.
@@atcoflyer1756 Same, but no FBL can handle that, so doesn't really matter ;-)
The actual situation feels that 760us is good
Bert can I ask are you going to come out with a control box for your BK 9000 servos? And are you going to come out with Mini servos? Sorry to ask but is it true Kyle left? Why? Lastly not everyone uses Vcontrol/Vbar.
We have no plans to release a programming box for the 9000 series, that will come with a new servo series in the future as the 9000 series is not programmable. Kyle doesn't with us full time any more, but he didn't leave! He is still very much involved with BK Hobbies and SAB and managing other aspects of the business. I am fully aware not everyone uses V control, but this video is intended for those who use it. Sorry, but I only fly V Control.
@@BertKammerer There's no need to say your sorry for using V control. Thank you. And thank you on letting me know Kyle is still around. Word was he left. I have like 25 sets of your older servos. And 4 sets of the 9000 series. So you are coming out with a new line of servos. Cannot wait to get my hands on them. Thank you Sir.
@@Airbrushkid Wow. Thank you for your great support! Yes, he had a good job opportunity outside the hobby, so can't blame him for that, but he still works with us doing team management, testing and representing BK and SAB :)
@@BertKammerer No Thank you for very good servos. Cannot wait to see the new ones. Happy flying!
Thanks Bert, has the Therta program box been available now?
End of this month! 🙂
your video is very interesting, I have x1 razors, they don't return to the center after a shift. which parameter could I change to have a higher sensitivity?
What FBL system or receiver are you using? Are they all doing that? It seems like they're getting incorrect data and the issue is more at the source.
@@BertKammerer hi thanks for the reply. I use a spektrum receiver system, not all servos do, it happened to me on two aerobatic models where there are a lot of vibrations, in both cases the affected channel was the ailerons. in the first case I had only one servo per aileron, I replaced the razors with new ones and the problem disappeared. in the second case the aileron has two servos on each side.
Because vbar no has rescue automatic ?
What does this mean?
Does a higher refresh rate heat up the servo motor?
This will depend on the servo. It will not on Theta servos, but I can't speak for any other servo.
Will 500hz/760us affect the lifetime of the servos?
760 does not, the higher Hz could. As with anything, the harder you run them, the less you can expect in terms of longevity, but should be negligible.
@@BertKammerer what would u recommend for a intermediate pilot? Do u think 240hz will be more than enough ?
@@Twx97 Absolutely, anything over 144 up to 333 is perfect and you won't be able to tell much of a difference.