I saw Cream at Madison Square Garden in 2005. I had hoped it wouldn't be Clapton playing "slow hand" versions of 60's Cream songs and I was absolutely thrilled to hear Clapton playing guitar like he did back in the 1960's version of Cream. Eric Clapton, Ginger Baker and Jack Bruce killed it the night I saw them.
That's funny because I thought the same thing when I saw him in the 80's. I didn't want to hear his hits and he didn't play them. I think only one, After Midnight, which I preferred JJ Cale's original version, but it was Clapton, and he was amazing.
@@shobudski6776 I was disappointed at that too. But I read somewhere that during rehearsals for the reunion shows they tried it for a while with a set up of Marshalls with the Gibson guitars and EB3 bass etc but found it wasn't working for them. I don't think they elaborated on the reasons.
Saw Cream twice at a tiny club in Stockport, Manchester in 66, Manor Lounge. To me they were just a group, one week The Kinks, next The Small Faces. I didn't really appreciate how good they were but it was like that in the 60s. One night stands, saw Hendrix twice, once in another tiny club in Stockport, The Sinking Ship. Amazing times.
@@Baribrotzer Actually, drummers Watts and Mitchel were Jazz musicians. I recall that Jack Bruce had argued with his music teacher about his desire to go with the rock music direction that was new at the time and he went and switched to the rock scene. We know what happened after that
Pete Brown, who wrote the lyrics, died earlier this year, which means only Eric Clapton is left. Ginger Baker could, by all accounts, pick a fight with his own reflection. Watch "Beware of Mr. Baker", made when he was still alive.
That was a great documentary. No kidding "Beware". The man was one of the best drummers and an enigma. The thing about his life that made no sense to me was his connection to Polo! I can't imagine him fitting in with the Polo crowd. Hard to picture him out there with a cigarette in his mouth and that silly hat on
I once saw a show in Pennsylvania in the winter in the early 1990s that I recall was billed as "Jack Bruce and Friends, Including Ginger Baker" or something like that. The gig included many Cream songs. The venue was a small club and since we arrived early to get the best seats, we waited more than 2 hours in the freezing cold. Their set was split into two, with Ginger taking over the drums in the second half. Our seats exceeded our expectations, and I was seated only about 5 feet away from Ginger. In between songs, I saw Jack and Ginger interact and was so close I could hear what they were saying, even though not miked. You'd think from the stories told about those two that they wouldn't communicate much and would be curt with one another. But that's not what I saw and heard that night. They were exceptionally friendly with one another, complimented the performances of each other, and made each other laugh.
This was the band I followed, when I was 12. Born in 56, my sisters friend would tell me about the concerts they saw. Back when you could talk to the bands.
The Ginger Baker/Jack Bruce rhythm section is right up there with John Bonham/John Paul Jones, Keith Moon/John Entwistle and Neal Peart/Getty Lee. It's always about the rhythm section, always
And not to forget Squire and Bruford or White; but it does appear that the stop-shelf drummers and top-shelf bassists always manage to find each other.
No one could possibly forget Bonham and JPJ or Baker and Bruce. When I listen to Cream I hear, In this order, Bruce, Baker, Clapton. I'll have to plop Wheels on the turntable and see if it sounds like any form of jazz I have heard.
No matter Cream was one of the very best Rock & Roll outfits ever to grace this planet till this day their music hits me with their psychedelic arrangements, they were amazingly unique!
This is bullcrap. Baker was, indeed, a volatile personality. He did resort to the pugilistic arts frequently. But both Baker and Bruce tell the same story. Whilst playing in the Graham Bond Organisation they both decided they wanted to form a jazz trio. When they left the band they needed a quality guitarist. They decided Clapton was the pre-eminent guitarist du jour. They approached Clapton to join them. Knowing Clapton was only interested in playing blues they told him they were forming a blues band. All the time they knew they were a jazz trio. They tell the story that Clapton thought he was playing blues, while they both knew they were playing jazz. It's true that many of the songs they played were in a blues format, were actually blues songs, but this was just the foundation for long extended improvisations a la jazz. It was a joke that extended through Cream's short lifespan and Baker and Bruce often tipped the wink to each other over it. It is also true that Baker and Bruce grew to hate each other during this period. Clapton got fed up with their constant clashes and decided to leave. The band split up and they all went their merry ways. Baker and Bruce produced several great albums as solo artists. Clapton, though, was more famous for making more commercially viable product after the split. It's my contention that Clapton never again reached the musical heights he did when accompanied by, those other two maestros, Baker and Bruce. Clapton was a better artist as a jazz improviser than he ever was after leaving Cream. Cream were a pioneering band, following in the footsteps of The Beatles, as creative makers of fusion music, incorporating jazz into blues, Indian raga into pop and jazz. Clapton never reached the sophisticated song writing level of Bruce.
".....It is also true that Baker and Bruce grew to hate each other during this period....." I had the impression that they got along superbly when they had their instruments in their hands - and at no other time. Both had played jazz, but weren't quite conventional jazz musicians, and their musical eccentricities meshed very well. Apart from that, they had completely incompatible personalities, and Baker being a drug addict and Bruce a short-tempered drunk didn't help.
Blind Faith was different - because of Stevie Winwood. I am absolutely certain Clapton did not want to re-create Cream . i am certain he did not want Baker in that band, but to turn him down probably meant Baker causing massive problems.
I almost saw them at Stony Brook University 1967, we were all seated and someone came out and announced they were not going to show. They substituted Vanilla Fudge, but two thirds of the audience got up and left. Bruce, had a cold they said. Oh, well.
I was reading that when Bill Ward quit Black Sabbath, the band was considering Ginger Baker for their new drummer, but nixed that idea when they considered how volatile and difficult to get along with Ginger Baker was.
Part of Cream's problem was the insane touring schedule their manager, Robert Stigwood, forced onto them. He apparently recognized that the supergroup would be short-lived, so wanted to milk it for everything it was worthwhile he could. He was scheduling the group literally 7 days a week, not just in arenas, but at colleges and nightclubs, no matter how small. It was relentless, and all 3 of them said they stayed exhausted and the exhaustion led to increasing tensions within the group. And the truth is, Clapton was almost always dissatisfied with the group he was in. I believe the roughly 2 1/2 years of Cream's existence was the longest Clapton was ever with a group, as with most groups he was with he was out after the first studio lp release. So Cream was actually a rather long group project for Clapton. And Baker and Bruce would continue to collaborate with each other over the years, in jazz ensembles during the 70s-80s, At their r&r hall of fame induction, their BBM collaboration with Gary Moore in 1993-94, and then again in May and October 2005 with the reunion concerts at the RAH in London and MSG in NYC. Baker and Bruce had mad respect for each other's talents despite their competitive egos.
He's one of those musicians whose negative personal reputation simply cannot be dispelled because its' based entirely in fact. It's equally impossible to deny his skill on the kit, though.
I disagree. Baker’s drumming was not any better and often worse than most other drummers of the time. Bruce wasnt particularly good either, in my estimation Clapton was Clapton, of course, but overall, Cream was significantly overrated
I learn so much from these types of videos. I remember listening to Cream and liked their music, but didn’t know who was in the band. I was surprised to learn that Eric Clapton was in it. Back then if you didn’t go to concerts or deep dive into a group at the record store, you really didn’t know who the band players were or what they looked like. I wasn’t a deep diver. I liked music and knew the names of bands, but usually didn’t know who was in the band. I, pretty much, just listened to the radio.
How bad could the hate really have been? I attended a Jack Bruce Band concert. The band took a short break off stage, when they returned the new drummer was Ginger. Obviously pre planned. Of course we in the audience were pleasantly shocked suddenly having 2 thirds of Cream preforming unexpectedly !
Sadly, when in need (perhaps financially, since neither had truly made it "big" after Cream and had drink and drug issues) this was how they could help one another, a semi-reunion. OR they grew up. Money has a way of bringing enemies together. Hell, Simon and Garfunkel got onstage for 1 gig and went back to hating each other. Playing onstage together like that doesn't mean they have to be friendly, just civil and respect each other's talent (happens ALL the time, ask the KinKs, Oasis, the Everly Bros, the Righteous Bros, G&R, Pink Floyd, etc.)
It wasn’t that they hated each other. Jack Bruce and Ginger Baker had a buildup of tension over jealousy for lack of a better word and feeling the need to best each other. The tension came to a head at The Fillmore. When they got inducted in the hall they were asked about a reunion tour and said we don’t know we’re only just renewing our friendships and enjoying being together again.
When Jack was dying from liver failure, he called Ginger and the conversation went like this: JB: “Ginger? This is Jack. I have something I want to tell you.” GB: “Yes?” JB: “F*** YOU!” and he hung up on him,this is a true story. 😂
@@sheilafoster6213 I agree, but never underestimate the malignancy of ego 😂 From what I remember, Ginger was devoid of humor and patience, and Jack would try to antagonize him by turning up his bass amp, drowning out the drums as well as other digs. Ginger would be infuriated and the rest is history.
When it comes to Cream…you are basically (if subconsciously) in one of two groups. You either love what the three of them did as singer-songwriter-musicians, achieving a jazz-blues-rock synthesis uniquely their own (and the starting point in their own music careers, not to mention the inspiration for many UK and US bands following in their wake)… or you pretty much believe/think they are one of THE MOST overrated bands of theirs or any era of recorded sound, and you wish the three of them had never met in the first place. Count me in among the first group.
Cream has always been one of those important and mysterious watermarks in music. One man that I played music with as a teenager [implied] that Eric Clapton reached his peak while Cream was together. This friend wasn't so keen on a lot of Clapton's solo material.
He had to be at his peak to keep up with Jack and Ginger. They were the powerhouse than pushed Cream into immortality. Without them he became just another good guitarist. Jack and Pete Brown wrote all those classic songs as well, Clapton can thank his lucky stars for those two "waring partners".
@@tonicjack9823 I agree. Cream is one of the bands that, as an aspiring guitar player, made me really appreciate a killer rhythm section. I don't think Clapton ever played with another group that pushed him like that. I can say the same about Tony and Geezer and Bill, Jimmy and JPJ and Bonzo, even Jimi and Mitch and Noel. Those guitarists are all great in different ways, but they did their best work with those sections behind them.
Two other super groupings of that time: Electric Flag w/Mike Bloomfield, buddy Miles and Butterfield Blues people. Super Session an album w/Al Kooper, Mike Bloomfield, Stephen Stills.
thank God people are beginning to realize what happened in music from 64 -71. have you heard of the " Impressionists ?" the movement in painting - where the majority died in abject poverty - selling paintings for a few dollars. Now those paintings are worth 100's of millions.
If they could have been able to get out of their own way, great things could have happened. I was a young drummer back then and Baker was the first rock drummer who used double bass drums. I used to think so highly of him back then. But, I later found out what a terrible, horrible person he was in real life. Sad.
Ginger Baker seemed like England's rock version of Buddy Rich and thus the source of Cream's legendary internal turmoil. Neither Jack Bruce nor Eric Clapton seemed like particularly difficult personalities - not on camera anyway.
It's a safe bet that ALL of the internal strife with them had its origins with Baker. Aside from his heavy drug use, most other musicians seemed to have no real problems with Bruce, and Clapton is nearly universally regarded as one of the easiest to get along with.
@@BigBri550 Very true. Contrast him with the late great Neil Peart, a man not only every bit as skilled (and arguably more so) as Baker, but a very stable, highly intelligent man.
@@Gunners_Mate_Guns My 40+ years of experience as a blue collar musician taught me that drummers are generally a weird lot: a few were genuinely sweet people, but most were kinda difficult to get along with.
We also have to remember that Gary Moore did a great album and a tour with Ginger Baker and Jack Bruce. So it seems they weren't so enemies after all...
I had a chance to see Cream when I was in Oakland evading the Draft. Big regret that I didn't. Later I saw Blind Faith in Portland but Cream was hands down the best group of that era. Cream, to this day is still a favorite that I listen to anytime I hear them.
i am a percussionist and i truly believe that these guys drove their bands ...., however it is disastrous for amateur drummers thinking that they should bang a lot of drums very noisily .... I do consider John Bonham the greatest rock drummer for my tastes.
@@terrenceolivido741 and of course the greatest is Carl Palmer actually with Neil Peart and Bill bruford coming in 2nd and 3rd place respectively.. and of course 4 Jazz Rock Fusion the honor would go to Dave weckl.
Ginger Baker and Jack Bruce hated each other, may be, but they sure toured a lot without Eric too... I think they loved to hate each other, just to good together...
EC would try with tar heroin, they would roll it up and smoke it in a spleef along with some grass. No needles, but who knows what Baker tried. He had pain issues.
Really the first supergroup was Emerson Lake and Palmer. I understand that cream was a little before then however the term supergroup hadn't yet been used and was first used on Emerson Lake and Palmer who from a musicianship standpoint and especially each member coming from a successful in established band they fit the term to a T😊
Ginger was volatile but funny. I remember he once said "I saw the Rolling Stones and I thought Mick Jagger was a musical moron ....my opinion hasn't changed" 😂
Always wondered why Cream was determined a supergroup. Clapton was well known, and although Baker and Bruce had played with a few other bands, they weren't well known internationally until they played with Cream.
None of them were "well known" at the time outside of the music community, and by those of us that were listening to the cool music. None of them were commercial sucesses, but they were all equally regarded as the best at that time. That's why they're referred to as the first supergroup.
@@rondesantis8618 Other than Clapton, who was well known with the Yardbirds, John Mayall, I have two records from the 60's by both groups and I live in Can and they were quite well known in the 60's when I bought them. Whereas the other two played with Graham Bond Organization (anyone hear of them outside of the UK?) I consider Blind Faith, CSN&Y, Derek & the Dominos etc more of a supergroup than Cream, because all the players above were well known, well established. However, just what I think and I realize most people do consider Cream the first. C'est la vie!
Too bad about the negative vibes. Each is a brilliant muso. And I preferred Clapton's guitar work in Cream to some of the cliched blues sounds he played elsewhere.
Not true. It's just that these 3 were the epitome of ego. But there are many musicians who were very easygoing and congenial. Mostly the ones more interested in the music than in their egos.
@@piscesman54 You're probably right. Seeing the video gave me flashbacks of my days in a jazz band where so many of the members were convinced that the band would fall apart if it weren't for them and their "immeasurable talent".
@@graemeyetts3465 Well said. They are quite a rare example of three rock musicians with no egos, no drug or alcohol use, no groupies, just focusing all of their considerable energies together to write and perform incredible music.
I can think of a few more prominent bands whose members hated each other: 1. Sting and Stewart Copeland. 2. Eddie Van Halen and David Lee Roth. 3. James Hetfield and Dave Mustaine.
It was never about their musicianship skills..Some personalities just nitpick each other raw..Like Clapton stated they loved each other because how many times did they get back together at numerous occasions. They even did Letterman show in1991 together!!
I saw them a few times at the Marquee Club in Wardour Street in the middle sixties. The first time I went to the lavatory there was after a cry of "police---raid". I thought the the lavatory had a a terratzo floor but it was just multi-colored crushed pills. 😂
Cream was the BEST ever. Of the three groups that I consider to be my all time favorites, Cream would have been No#1 if they had stayed together. Rolling Stones is still the best band ever, having so many fantastic songs and absolutely NO duds, as far as I can recollect. Zepplin had some of the most outrageously fantastic songs of all time, but they threw in a few duds here and there as well. It's a shame Cream couldn't get along as well as they played.
I saw CREAM at MSG during their farewell tour in 1968 as a 9th grader. I remember falling asleep during Ginger's 20 minute drum solo and waking up at 10:10 PM with Ginger finishing up his solo. Fast forward to 2005 and I once again fell asleep during Ginger's 5 minute solo this time waking up roughly at 10 PM again. Sort of a Circle of Life. My only disappointment with the 2005 show was that Eric played through Fenders with a Strat and not through Marshalls cranked to 11.
Quite weird when Eric says “we’re going to do Sunshine… does that satisfy you?” It seems he’d become disillusioned with the guitar hero role, and was almost embarrassed by his extraordinary talent for playing the instrument & his legion of worshipping fans… hence the name of his next band!
Jack never got the credit he so deserved. Saw Jack & friends (with the ABB) at the Nassau Coliseum on December 27,1980 and they crushed it! Hard to believe it's been 44 years. ...there was a time.
huge clapton fan here. from the yardbirds' "i ain't got you" to mayall's blues breakers' "rambling on my mind" to cream's "crossroads" clapton just poured it on as he jumped from project to project. even improving the guitar solo on lennon's/the beatles "yer blues" as clapton played the song with lennon on the stones' "rock and roll circus" tv show and on lennons' solo endeavor "live peace in toronto." in the 60s graffitti across england declared clapton "god." and when it comes to guitar playing i can't argue with that sentiment! thanks for the video.
Yeah I don't know why they hated each other I don't know man based on what I see on this video they sound like psychedelic heavy metal to me back to the show boys
I was in my late teens when Cream arrived, and utterly amazed. Never got to see them live, but got the flavor from Wheels of Fire. Played Crossroads dozens of times. Arguably the first super group.
clapton played Sunshine at the beginning and it sounded nothing likr the album. Hows that happen? Sometimes i think studioguys played all the albums and its all a hustle.lol. What if also they brought in guys at like 2am that played all the stuff and then all the heroes think they played on the albums but it was really Tommy Tedesco lol
It was totally normal at that time to play songs live not like on the album, especially with bands like cream that did a lot of improvisation. No backingtracks, no metronomclick for the drummer, no autotune, no lipsyncing........ And by the way, Eric Clapton was one of the studioguys that played guitar for the recordings of other artists. The legendary solo of George Harrisons While my guitar gently weeps for example.
@@thedude-jb7wx Ok, that's a different thing. But iI think, in this case it is more related to the live recording equipment of that time than anything else.
@@Mullewarp Yes i suppose so but it sounds tonally much different and it doesnt matter cause i dont think people that dont play would ever notice. Im just picky and too picky most likely. Tones and the way thins are played is what gives it its own personal vibe. otherwise its just a 5th or a double stop and things all sound the same. On the album that tone and the way it sounds like hes using his fingers and theres this special thing thats happening. I suppose i have a producers ear lol i should do that insead of try to be a great player maybe
Always had the feeling Baker was unpleasant. Even looking at him, wouldn't want to be in the same room. As for a drumming god? You need to go to Buddy Rich for that.
I’m going to disagree with a lot of what’s been spilled over these comments pages. Jazz? Not hardly. Cream were a hard blues based band. I’m sure you could pluck out some long-form improvisation motifs - but aside from Ulysses I don’t hear the type of atonal, alternate chord progression that make this anywhere near jazz. They played a very Albert King, BB King, Buddy Miles style of rock, with JB certainly playing “leading bass lines” Clapton was nowhere near as nuanced and exceptional as he became during his post-heroin and drug fueled era. No way. He played loud and he played fast, and neither of those traits make you exceptional. Sorry.
I saw Cream at Madison Square Garden in 2005. I had hoped it wouldn't be Clapton playing "slow hand" versions of 60's Cream songs and I was absolutely thrilled to hear Clapton playing guitar like he did back in the 1960's version of Cream. Eric Clapton, Ginger Baker and Jack Bruce killed it the night I saw them.
He needed to play a Gibson and not a Fender Strat
That's funny because I thought the same thing when I saw him in the 80's. I didn't want to hear his hits and he didn't play them. I think only one, After Midnight, which I preferred JJ Cale's original version, but it was Clapton, and he was amazing.
@@shobudski6776 word.
I was at MSG in 2005, as well, and I was sorely disappointed in the quality of the show. I thought the shows at Royal Albert Hall were far superior.
@@shobudski6776 I was disappointed at that too. But I read somewhere that during rehearsals for the reunion shows they tried it for a while with a set up of Marshalls with the Gibson guitars and EB3 bass etc but found it wasn't working for them. I don't think they elaborated on the reasons.
Saw Cream twice at a tiny club in Stockport, Manchester in 66, Manor Lounge. To me they were just a group, one week The Kinks, next The Small Faces. I didn't really appreciate how good they were but it was like that in the 60s. One night stands, saw Hendrix twice, once in another tiny club in Stockport, The Sinking Ship. Amazing times.
Jack Bruce WAS Cream. He sang, he wrote the great hits, he played fabulous bass.
Agreed. The older I get, the more I realize Cream was his band. The musical skills were equal, but the songs, the voice, the delivery? Jack Bruce.
He could sing great and the lyrics are something else
In the studio, yes. But Clapton came first onstage - although Bruce and Baker, being jazz musicians, would change things up on him.
@@Baribrotzer Actually, drummers Watts and Mitchel were Jazz musicians. I recall that Jack Bruce had argued with his music teacher about his desire to go with the rock music direction that was new at the time and he went and switched to the rock scene. We know what happened after that
Genius
Pete Brown, who wrote the lyrics, died earlier this year, which means only Eric Clapton is left.
Ginger Baker could, by all accounts, pick a fight with his own reflection. Watch "Beware of Mr. Baker", made when he was still alive.
Yep, saw that movie.
He had cooled just a bit in his later years, but even so he was still incredibly irascible.
That was a great documentary. No kidding "Beware". The man was one of the best drummers and an enigma. The thing about his life that made no sense to me was his connection to Polo! I can't imagine him fitting in with the Polo crowd. Hard to picture him out there with a cigarette in his mouth and that silly hat on
what a great analogy ! i think of the videos of roosters fighting their mirror reflection ...
I’ve seen that, he punched the interviewer 😅
I once saw a show in Pennsylvania in the winter in the early 1990s that I recall was billed as "Jack Bruce and Friends, Including Ginger Baker" or something like that. The gig included many Cream songs. The venue was a small club and since we arrived early to get the best seats, we waited more than 2 hours in the freezing cold. Their set was split into two, with Ginger taking over the drums in the second half. Our seats exceeded our expectations, and I was seated only about 5 feet away from Ginger. In between songs, I saw Jack and Ginger interact and was so close I could hear what they were saying, even though not miked. You'd think from the stories told about those two that they wouldn't communicate much and would be curt with one another. But that's not what I saw and heard that night. They were exceptionally friendly with one another, complimented the performances of each other, and made each other laugh.
They grew up
@@christopherprim1973 Maybe Jack and Ginger were just in uncharacteristically good moods that night.
@@Gunners_Mate_Guns Yeah. Hey, do you ever get into stuff this weird? I love this band. th-cam.com/video/Xab_7DohIQ8/w-d-xo.html
25 or 30 years can make a difference as us old guys are aware.
This was the band I followed, when I was 12. Born in 56, my sisters friend would tell me about the concerts they saw. Back when you could talk to the bands.
Best cream album has all their best songs. Great to listen to.
The Ginger Baker/Jack Bruce rhythm section is right up there with John Bonham/John Paul Jones, Keith Moon/John Entwistle and Neal Peart/Getty Lee. It's always about the rhythm section, always
And not to forget Squire and Bruford or White; but it does appear that the stop-shelf drummers and top-shelf bassists always manage to find each other.
Exactly....white British guys have soooo much rhythm🤣😂🤣
Yes, we "rhythm sectionists" are the unsung Heroes !
@@disgruntledtoons That was the first pair that came to mind.
No one could possibly forget Bonham and JPJ or Baker and Bruce. When I listen to Cream I hear, In this order, Bruce, Baker, Clapton. I'll have to plop Wheels on the turntable and see if it sounds like any form of jazz I have heard.
No matter Cream was one of the very best Rock & Roll outfits ever to grace this planet till this day their music hits me with their psychedelic arrangements, they were amazingly unique!
This is bullcrap. Baker was, indeed, a volatile personality. He did resort to the pugilistic arts frequently. But both Baker and Bruce tell the same story. Whilst playing in the Graham Bond Organisation they both decided they wanted to form a jazz trio. When they left the band they needed a quality guitarist. They decided Clapton was the pre-eminent guitarist du jour. They approached Clapton to join them. Knowing Clapton was only interested in playing blues they told him they were forming a blues band. All the time they knew they were a jazz trio. They tell the story that Clapton thought he was playing blues, while they both knew they were playing jazz. It's true that many of the songs they played were in a blues format, were actually blues songs, but this was just the foundation for long extended improvisations a la jazz. It was a joke that extended through Cream's short lifespan and Baker and Bruce often tipped the wink to each other over it. It is also true that Baker and Bruce grew to hate each other during this period. Clapton got fed up with their constant clashes and decided to leave. The band split up and they all went their merry ways. Baker and Bruce produced several great albums as solo artists. Clapton, though, was more famous for making more commercially viable product after the split. It's my contention that Clapton never again reached the musical heights he did when accompanied by, those other two maestros, Baker and Bruce. Clapton was a better artist as a jazz improviser than he ever was after leaving Cream. Cream were a pioneering band, following in the footsteps of The Beatles, as creative makers of fusion music, incorporating jazz into blues, Indian raga into pop and jazz. Clapton never reached the sophisticated song writing level of Bruce.
Interesting analysis and viewpoint.
You've got way too much time on your hand.
Eric is proof drugs make you play better.
".....It is also true that Baker and Bruce grew to hate each other during this period....."
I had the impression that they got along superbly when they had their instruments in their hands - and at no other time. Both had played jazz, but weren't quite conventional jazz musicians, and their musical eccentricities meshed very well. Apart from that, they had completely incompatible personalities, and Baker being a drug addict and Bruce a short-tempered drunk didn't help.
I'd like a second opinion. Ginger and jack may have thought they were playing jazz but I'm pretty sure Miles Davis would snicker...
According to Clapton, ginger forced his way into Blind Faith and killed that too.
Blind Faith was different - because of Stevie Winwood. I am absolutely certain Clapton did not want to re-create Cream . i am certain he did not want Baker in that band, but to turn him down probably meant Baker causing massive problems.
He didn't
I almost saw them at Stony Brook University 1967, we were all seated and someone came out and announced they were not going to show. They substituted Vanilla Fudge, but two thirds of the audience got up and left. Bruce, had a cold they said. Oh, well.
Wasn't that Soft White Underbelly's (soon to be Blue Oyster Cult) stomping ground around that time?
Together just 3 years but Clapton sure had a lot of different looks
That's some lead rock guitar player shit.
I was reading that when Bill Ward quit Black Sabbath, the band was considering Ginger Baker for their new drummer, but nixed that idea when they considered how volatile and difficult to get along with Ginger Baker was.
That's really saying something with the band that had Ozzy Osborne!
Ginger Baker was a nasty person who actually didn’t really like anyone, even himself.
Drugs WILL do that to you!
he liked smack
Nevertheless, he lived a good long stretch. Croaked fairly recently.
@@snorthsnorth6480 Old Scratch was a little afraid of him
Didn't like his own reflection, no doubt.
I had an art teacher who saw cream in a Boston Club in 67. " I was 5 feet from Clapton." A life well lived
Part of Cream's problem was the insane touring schedule their manager, Robert Stigwood, forced onto them. He apparently recognized that the supergroup would be short-lived, so wanted to milk it for everything it was worthwhile he could. He was scheduling the group literally 7 days a week, not just in arenas, but at colleges and nightclubs, no matter how small. It was relentless, and all 3 of them said they stayed exhausted and the exhaustion led to increasing tensions within the group. And the truth is, Clapton was almost always dissatisfied with the group he was in. I believe the roughly 2 1/2 years of Cream's existence was the longest Clapton was ever with a group, as with most groups he was with he was out after the first studio lp release. So Cream was actually a rather long group project for Clapton. And Baker and Bruce would continue to collaborate with each other over the years, in jazz ensembles during the 70s-80s, At their r&r hall of fame induction, their BBM collaboration with Gary Moore in 1993-94, and then again in May and October 2005 with the reunion concerts at the RAH in London and MSG in NYC. Baker and Bruce had mad respect for each other's talents despite their competitive egos.
Ginger didn't really like anyone. Was a bitter guy and crazy. Great drummer of course
100% goofball
He's one of those musicians whose negative personal reputation simply cannot be dispelled because its' based entirely in fact.
It's equally impossible to deny his skill on the kit, though.
Typical drummer
I disagree. Baker’s drumming was not any better and often worse than most other drummers of the time.
Bruce wasnt particularly good either, in my estimation
Clapton was Clapton, of course, but overall, Cream was significantly overrated
@@jeffrobertson527 Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man.
I learn so much from these types of videos. I remember listening to Cream and liked their music, but didn’t know who was in the band. I was surprised to learn that Eric Clapton was in it. Back then if you didn’t go to concerts or deep dive into a group at the record store, you really didn’t know who the band players were or what they looked like. I wasn’t a deep diver. I liked music and knew the names of bands, but usually didn’t know who was in the band. I, pretty much, just listened to the radio.
I loved Cream. As I did John Mayall and the Blues Breakers.
How bad could the hate really have been? I attended a Jack Bruce Band concert. The band took a short break off stage, when they returned the new drummer was Ginger. Obviously pre planned. Of course we in the audience were pleasantly shocked suddenly having 2 thirds of Cream preforming unexpectedly !
Sadly, when in need (perhaps financially, since neither had truly made it "big" after Cream and had drink and drug issues) this was how they could help one another, a semi-reunion.
OR they grew up.
Money has a way of bringing enemies together.
Hell, Simon and Garfunkel got onstage for 1 gig and went back to hating each other.
Playing onstage together like that doesn't mean they have to be friendly, just civil and respect each other's talent (happens ALL the time, ask the KinKs, Oasis, the Everly Bros, the Righteous Bros, G&R, Pink Floyd, etc.)
It wasn’t that they hated each other. Jack Bruce and Ginger Baker had a buildup of tension over jealousy for lack of a better word and feeling the need to best each other. The tension came to a head at The Fillmore. When they got inducted in the hall they were asked about a reunion tour and said we don’t know we’re only just renewing our friendships and enjoying being together again.
When Jack was dying from liver failure, he called Ginger and the conversation went like this:
JB: “Ginger? This is Jack. I have something I want to tell you.”
GB: “Yes?”
JB: “F*** YOU!” and he hung up on him,this is a true story. 😂
How can you work together and not get on ,I should think the money helps 😢.
@@sheilafoster6213 I agree, but never underestimate the malignancy of ego 😂
From what I remember, Ginger was devoid of humor and patience, and Jack would try to antagonize him by turning up his bass amp, drowning out the drums as well as other digs. Ginger would be infuriated and the rest is history.
thanks for that, I was trying to remember the details of this little anecdote. Now THAT'S a rivalry, to the very bitter end!!! hahahaha
Clapton and Ginger deserve eachother.
When it comes to Cream…you are basically (if subconsciously) in one of two groups.
You either love what the three of them did as singer-songwriter-musicians, achieving a jazz-blues-rock synthesis uniquely their own (and the starting point in their own music careers, not to mention the inspiration for many UK and US bands following in their wake)…
or you pretty much believe/think they are one of THE MOST overrated bands of theirs or any era of recorded sound, and you wish the three of them had never met in the first place.
Count me in among the first group.
Cream has always been one of those important and mysterious watermarks in music. One man that I played music with as a teenager [implied] that Eric Clapton reached his peak while Cream was together. This friend wasn't so keen on a lot of Clapton's solo material.
He had to be at his peak to keep up with Jack and Ginger. They were the powerhouse than pushed Cream into immortality. Without them he became just another good guitarist. Jack and Pete Brown wrote all those classic songs as well, Clapton can thank his lucky stars for those two "waring partners".
@@tonicjack9823 I agree. Cream is one of the bands that, as an aspiring guitar player, made me really appreciate a killer rhythm section. I don't think Clapton ever played with another group that pushed him like that.
I can say the same about Tony and Geezer and Bill, Jimmy and JPJ and Bonzo, even Jimi and Mitch and Noel. Those guitarists are all great in different ways, but they did their best work with those sections behind them.
I tend to agree. Claptons best pkaying was with Cream, with maybe a few exceptions.
Two other super groupings of that time: Electric Flag w/Mike Bloomfield, buddy Miles and Butterfield Blues people. Super Session an album w/Al Kooper, Mike Bloomfield, Stephen Stills.
EF was a BAND. Super Session was a one-off studio project.
you got it ............................................................................
thank God people are beginning to realize what happened in music from 64 -71. have you heard of the " Impressionists ?" the movement in painting - where the majority died in abject poverty - selling paintings for a few dollars. Now those paintings are worth 100's of millions.
If they could have been able to get out of their own way, great things could have happened. I was a young drummer back then and Baker was the first rock drummer who used double bass drums. I used to think so highly of him back then. But, I later found out what a terrible, horrible person he was in real life. Sad.
Ginger Baker seemed like England's rock version of Buddy Rich and thus the source of Cream's legendary internal turmoil. Neither Jack Bruce nor Eric Clapton seemed like particularly difficult personalities - not on camera anyway.
jack bruce was a disruptive, spoiled, unpredictable lunatic.
It's a safe bet that ALL of the internal strife with them had its origins with Baker.
Aside from his heavy drug use, most other musicians seemed to have no real problems with Bruce, and Clapton is nearly universally regarded as one of the easiest to get along with.
@@Gunners_Mate_Guns Yep. Baker was good & all, but was he worth the pain in the ass?
@@BigBri550 Very true.
Contrast him with the late great Neil Peart, a man not only every bit as skilled (and arguably more so) as Baker, but a very stable, highly intelligent man.
@@Gunners_Mate_Guns My 40+ years of experience as a blue collar musician taught me that drummers are generally a weird lot: a few were genuinely sweet people, but most were kinda difficult to get along with.
We also have to remember that Gary Moore did a great album and a tour with Ginger Baker and Jack Bruce. So it seems they weren't so enemies after all...
$$. Ginger was ALWAYS broke.
Excellent!
I had a chance to see Cream when I was in Oakland evading the Draft. Big regret that I didn't. Later I saw Blind Faith in Portland but Cream was hands down the best group of that era. Cream, to this day is still a favorite that I listen to anytime I hear them.
pretty sure nobody cares,why would you think that is remotely interesting to anyone but yourself?
" I'm so Glad "
lyrical brilliance 🏆
Have you the original by Skip James? He recorded it in the 1930's and there still should be a recording of it on YT.
Ginger Baker, Keith Moon, and John Bonham should have formed a band. They could have called it Emotional Nut Jobs
Oh that's really funny....NOT
@@kevinobrien1259I don't know if it's funny but it's pretty damn accurate😅
i am a percussionist and i truly believe that these guys drove their bands ...., however it is disastrous for amateur drummers thinking that they should bang a lot of drums very noisily .... I do consider John Bonham the greatest rock drummer for my tastes.
@@terrenceolivido741 and of course the greatest is Carl Palmer actually with Neil Peart and Bill bruford coming in 2nd and 3rd place respectively.. and of course 4 Jazz Rock Fusion the honor would go to Dave weckl.
@@terrenceolivido741 I'm just joking. Bonham rocks.
Condition was and is such a major AH. That is the main reason. He built his career playing black music then promoted Enoch Powell.
I heard somewhere , that Jack Bruce's dying wish was to call Ginger Baker, to call him an Arsehole, one last time. Which I think is pretty rad!
Ginger Baker and Jack Bruce hated each other, may be, but they sure toured a lot without Eric too... I think they loved to hate each other, just to good together...
Ginger just could seem to accept success on an equal level with his bandmates.
A drummer so skilled that other drummers had to bow down to him? Who comes up with this bullshit?
I agree when we know that term applies to Carl Palmer😊
You never bring up their Heroin or Speed addictions
It's in the song lyrics, it's understood
who cares ? i like mr. average, " Mr. Jones " as Dylan would call him - looking down on these guys while they are on literally 5 prescription drugs.
EC would try with tar heroin, they
would roll it up and smoke it in a spleef along with some grass. No needles,
but who knows what Baker tried. He had pain issues.
The music was fantastic though.
Really the first supergroup was Emerson Lake and Palmer. I understand that cream was a little before then however the term supergroup hadn't yet been used and was first used on Emerson Lake and Palmer who from a musicianship standpoint and especially each member coming from a successful in established band they fit the term to a T😊
Ginger was volatile but funny. I remember he once said "I saw the Rolling Stones and I thought Mick Jagger was a musical moron ....my opinion hasn't changed" 😂
Beware of Mr. Baker!
Always wondered why Cream was determined a supergroup. Clapton was well known, and although Baker and Bruce had played with a few other bands, they weren't well known internationally until they played with Cream.
None of them were "well known" at the time outside of the music community, and by those of us that were listening to the cool music. None of them were commercial sucesses, but they were all equally regarded as the best at that time. That's why they're referred to as the first supergroup.
@@rondesantis8618 Other than Clapton, who was well known with the Yardbirds, John Mayall, I have two records from the 60's by both groups and I live in Can and they were quite well known in the 60's when I bought them. Whereas the other two played with Graham Bond Organization (anyone hear of them outside of the UK?) I consider Blind Faith, CSN&Y, Derek & the Dominos etc more of a supergroup than Cream, because all the players above were well known, well established. However, just what I think and I realize most people do consider Cream the first. C'est la vie!
Too bad about the negative vibes. Each is a brilliant muso. And I preferred Clapton's guitar work in Cream to some of the cliched blues sounds he played elsewhere.
OMG, finally revealed, they really hated each other. Surprising they made any music at all with all the hatred. 🤪
I'm convinced there's no such thing as an ego-less musician
Not true. It's just that these 3 were the epitome of ego. But there are many musicians who were very easygoing and congenial. Mostly the ones more interested in the music than in their egos.
@@piscesman54 You're probably right. Seeing the video gave me flashbacks of my days in a jazz band where so many of the members were convinced that the band would fall apart if it weren't for them and their "immeasurable talent".
I can name three such musicians, and exceptional musicians at that: Alex Lifeson, Geddy Lee, and Neil Peart
Good point... Rush took much of what Cream had done but without allowing that Cream to turn sour....@Gunners_Mate_Guns
@@graemeyetts3465 Well said.
They are quite a rare example of three rock musicians with no egos, no drug or alcohol use, no groupies, just focusing all of their considerable energies together to write and perform incredible music.
Kooper Bloomfield, and Stills… another super group.
Interesting.
I didn't know they started it. You hear it a lot in sports like basketball.
Baker was a kind of very grumpy a-hole.
That's an understatement.
As a youngster I listened to Cream. Now I can't listen to them because they sound like schitt
I can think of a few more prominent bands whose members hated each other:
1. Sting and Stewart Copeland.
2. Eddie Van Halen and David Lee Roth.
3. James Hetfield and Dave Mustaine.
Beware of Mr. Baker
It was never about their musicianship skills..Some personalities just nitpick each other raw..Like Clapton stated they loved each other because how many times did they get back together at numerous occasions. They even did Letterman show in1991 together!!
Ups and downs within years of drug use and recoveries, not always in synch.
First super group? Beatles? Stones?
Super Group implies its members were specifically poached from other bands
ELP were the first so-called supergroup to actually get that name which hadn't yet been used when those other groups came out😮
@@edljnehan2811 I haven't heard of ELP, who were they?
I saw them a few times at the Marquee Club in Wardour Street in the middle sixties. The first time I went to the lavatory there was after a cry of "police---raid". I thought the the lavatory had a a terratzo floor but it was just multi-colored crushed pills. 😂
There is a kind of unhealthy voyeurism in videos about who hated whom in the rock world.
None of them did anything of worth afterwards, this band really did break them.
Cream was the BEST ever. Of the three groups that I consider to be my all time favorites, Cream would have been No#1 if they had stayed together. Rolling Stones is still the best band ever, having so many fantastic songs and absolutely NO duds, as far as I can recollect. Zepplin had some of the most outrageously fantastic songs of all time, but they threw in a few duds here and there as well. It's a shame Cream couldn't get along as well as they played.
Of course talent wise it would be ELP they set the standard for musicianship excellence in the early 1970s😊
Ginger Baker was a tremendously talented drummer.
Good but overrated. Nobody loved Ginger Baker more than Ginger Baker😊 a true head case😅
Why would you mention a rapper in this?
I didn't care for Cream's live preformance but the albums were good. I agree with Baker about Jack's loud fuzz bass that didn't sound good at all.
This is not what I heard…Clapton was the third guy in. Anyone know for sure?
Jack was the third guy.
I saw CREAM at MSG during their farewell tour in 1968 as a 9th grader. I remember falling asleep during Ginger's 20 minute drum solo and waking up at 10:10 PM with Ginger finishing up his solo. Fast forward to 2005 and I once again fell asleep during Ginger's 5 minute solo this time waking up roughly at 10 PM again. Sort of a Circle of Life. My only disappointment with the 2005 show was that Eric played through Fenders with a Strat and not through Marshalls cranked to 11.
Quite weird when Eric says “we’re going to do Sunshine… does that satisfy you?” It seems he’d become disillusioned with the guitar hero role, and was almost embarrassed by his extraordinary talent for playing the instrument & his legion of worshipping fans… hence the name of his next band!
They should have called their last album, "Sour Cream"! 🤣
give up on your comedy dreams
My dogs are like that.
That's some fairly monotone narration you got going there. The topic is interesting enough. It's just hard to listen to.
IMHO...Claptons best work was with Cream.
This video makes it sound like Cream was the greatest thing since sliced bread.
They were good, but not THAT good.
Jack never got the credit he so deserved. Saw Jack & friends (with the ABB) at the Nassau Coliseum on December 27,1980 and they crushed it!
Hard to believe it's been 44 years. ...there was a time.
had a friend from England and he would rave about Bruce ....
Saw them June of 68 at the Oakdale theater in Wallingford CT..
nobody cares even a little bit
Ginger Baker is highly overrated. 👎👎
About the only thing these guys could agree on after they slip up is how much they hated Led Zeppelin.
Without Cream there would be no Led Zeppelin
Why do they get useless robots to read these? entercream.
Dysfunction Jumction
Something depressing about their music.
Cream was not a super group. Not even close. Blind Faith was because of Clapton, Winwood and Baker.
huge clapton fan here. from the yardbirds' "i ain't got you" to mayall's blues breakers' "rambling on my mind" to cream's "crossroads" clapton just poured it on as he jumped from project to project. even improving the guitar solo on lennon's/the beatles "yer blues" as clapton played the song with lennon on the stones' "rock and roll circus" tv show and on lennons' solo endeavor "live peace in toronto." in the 60s graffitti across england declared clapton "god." and when it comes to guitar playing i can't argue with that sentiment! thanks for the video.
Yeah I don't know why they hated each other I don't know man based on what I see on this video they sound like psychedelic heavy metal to me back to the show boys
I was in my late teens when Cream arrived, and utterly amazed. Never got to see them live, but got the flavor from Wheels of Fire. Played Crossroads dozens of times. Arguably the first super group.
Love Cream
The Supremes were no
different than other groups.
AI voice? Not appropriate!
Goodbye is my favorite Cream album.
and anyone should care why? This isn't all about your favorite album
Clapton was himself all of the time. A second hand opportunist who can play the guitar like no one else .....
The term “super group” is ridiculous
Well, before that it was "Clapton is God." And it can't possibly get any more ridiculous than that.
Why?
But useful.
Hype is a near constant in promotions.
clapton played Sunshine at the beginning and it sounded nothing likr the album. Hows that happen? Sometimes i think studioguys played all the albums and its all a hustle.lol. What if also they brought in guys at like 2am that played all the stuff and then all the heroes think they played on the albums but it was really Tommy Tedesco lol
It was totally normal at that time to play songs live not like on the album, especially with bands like cream that did a lot of improvisation. No backingtracks, no metronomclick for the drummer, no autotune, no lipsyncing........ And by the way, Eric Clapton was one of the studioguys that played guitar for the recordings of other artists. The legendary solo of George Harrisons While my guitar gently weeps for example.
@@Mullewarp the tone isnt close is what i meant not the structure
@@thedude-jb7wx Ok, that's a different thing. But iI think, in this case it is more related to the live recording equipment of that time than anything else.
@@thedude-jb7wx you’re drunk Grandpa, go to bed
@@Mullewarp Yes i suppose so but it sounds tonally much different and it doesnt matter cause i dont think people that dont play would ever notice. Im just picky and too picky most likely. Tones and the way thins are played is what gives it its own personal vibe. otherwise its just a 5th or a double stop and things all sound the same. On the album that tone and the way it sounds like hes using his fingers and theres this special thing thats happening. I suppose i have a producers ear lol i should do that insead of try to be a great player maybe
Always had the feeling Baker was unpleasant. Even looking at him, wouldn't want to be in the same room. As for a drumming god? You need to go to Buddy Rich for that.
he certainly took on Buddy's " personality. "
Over egged, over hyped and eternally awful
AI voice.
I’m going to disagree with a lot of what’s been spilled over these comments pages. Jazz? Not hardly. Cream were a hard blues based band. I’m sure you could pluck out some long-form improvisation motifs - but aside from Ulysses I don’t hear the type of atonal, alternate chord progression that make this anywhere near jazz. They played a very Albert King, BB King, Buddy Miles style of rock, with JB certainly playing “leading bass lines”
Clapton was nowhere near as nuanced and exceptional as he became during his post-heroin and drug fueled era. No way. He played loud and he played fast, and neither of those traits make you exceptional. Sorry.
Absolutely right. Baker was always convinced he was playing jazz. It was never the case.
Seams like too much working all the time is why most bands dont last very long no matter how good they are
Baker reminds me of Lennon great artists mostly rotten people. The way he treated Robbie Robertson was disgraceful.
Robbie treated Band members poorly at times
These a.i. narrations are so detestable.
Most overrated act in music history.
I am sick of these AI generated vignettes.