TOO HEAVY for ZWIFT? | New rider CRUSHES it for about 23 seconds!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 พ.ย. 2020
- I finally got round to my my first ZWIFT race. I knew my stats (6ft6, 225lbs) would not help but thought I had to try. It wasn't pretty!
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Hi mark, nice to see your trying Zwift ! It takes 5-6 races to get the hang of things.
I’m 6ft 5 and 94kg so similar issues but I have won several B cat races
A few tips below for you
- as you did come off the start hard (not to hard but 600w should get you into the front pack, the first 2-3 mins is always fast so be ready to hold 350 ish for a few mins, it will settle.
- try and make the front pack in your group (c) once your in the front sit in, rest and push hard on the climbs, it’s not about holding as much power as possible, it’s all about over and under.
- learn to stand ! It’s the only way to climb on Zwift being bigger and will massively improve your riding
-slow your cadence, spinning that fast is not good for Zwift and a bigger guy, slow the cadence up the pressure, this way you can stand and still have room to push on the lumps
- work in a 3 second delay, if a small hill is coming up the power on 3 seconds before you get there and you will fly over it.
Mark, I actually saw your followup video before this one so I know you found some ways to improve, but you are 100% correct in this video. I've got degrees in Math, Physics and Computer Science so I'm a numbers sort of guy and while I like Zwift for just getting some exercise it is way off the mark when it comes to simulating things for big guys on flat routes. I'm 6' and 220 so very close to you. I've got two kickr's and the other day my 19 year old son who tops the scales at 145lbs and only about an inch shorter than I went for a ride on Zwift. On hills Zwift created an environment that was pretty close to real for the two of us, but on flats he was putting out about 50-100W and I'm up at 180-220W and struggling to stay with him. I get it that my frontal area would be slightly higher so I should have a bit more wind resistance but on a flat where you aren't lifting the mass, W/kg should have less effect and yet I had to produce just about the same W/kg as he did just to keep up.
And I completely understand that at the start of the race I'd have to put out massive Watts to accelerate my larger mass at the same speed as a little guy, but to ride at a constant speed on a flat I shouldn't need more than double the wattage. I hope Zwift will improve their modeling algorithm soon or lots of folks are going to be left out of having a reasonably fair chance.
Fat lad blames his tool.
Lots to say on Zwift racing. First of all this is not a normal race being so short. Most are 30 minutes to 1 hour. Advices as follows:
1. Don't give up at all. These can be so fun it would be a shame to quit so quickly. Honestly the next couple months are only going to set you back $30.
2. Hard starts, but not 1000W hard. I would say 400-450W for 30s to 1 minute at your size should get you into the lead C group, maybe touching on 500W. No need nor any desire to be off the front like that at all.
3. Your size is not a disadvantage, rather it is a big advantage in Zwift Races that rank Cats by w/kg... follow me here on a few different cases using your power and weight @ 102kg, 316W, 3.1w/kg compared to a lighter rider say 70kg, 217W, and the same 3.1w/kg.
a. To be competitive you need to be at the top of your Cat for w/kg (duh.) so no advantage nor disadvantage here, you are near the top of the Cat @ 3.1w/kg, GOOD, so is your competition.
b. On the climbs w/kg is most important, the steeper it is the less that pure power (watts) matter and the more that w/kg matters. No advantage nor disadvantage here as you are near the top of the category @ 3.1 w/kg. So you should perform similarly to your competition climbing. This is the reason you are not an A or B Cat racer.
c. For riding the flats pure power matters the most and w/kg is irrelevant. Here you have an advantage, FTP is 316 compared to 217. Yes being tall and big means more drag but this is easily outweighed by the bigger raw power. Remember that riding at 90% of FTP for you is 285W... that is 131% of FTP for your lighter opponent. 90% of FTP is sustainable for well more than an hour and 131% would be very hard to hold for 4 minutes!
d. On downhill stretches you have another advantage with bigger raw power and you are heavier. You descend very very fast compared to your competition and can take in recovery here.
e. Sprinting. Most Zwift races end in a sprint. Advantage is for the big guys here as most of the time big guys have a bigger more powerful sprint. Again you create more wind resistance and have a higher CDA but the extra power more than makes up for it. Not different than IRL.
4. Take a look at the C Category overall rankings on Zwiftpower.com. As of today 11-12-2020 The weights of the top 15 are 26, 86, 105.6, 76.2, 84.8, 78, 91.6, 86, 93.4, 90, 88, 91, 58, 43, 48. You can see both very light (some kids) and very heavy riders (90kg+ and even #3 at 105.6kg). You have the whole range of weights being competitive at the top of the list.... If they can do it so can you.
5. Being big means that the smaller snappy riders can hit you on the hills, really it is their only chance. Find flat races. For the small hills you will encounter on even flat courses be ready. Learn the course profile. Sag climb if needed, start at the front of the group when you hit the bottom of the hill and slowly drift back maybe putting out 0.2w/kg less than everyone else. Make up the lost places on the flats where you should have the advantage.
6. Sit in and save energy as much as possible. Zwift does not reduce the resistance when you are in the draft rather is just slightly speeds up your avatar to "stick" to the guy in front of you. If you are putting down 225W try 200W and you may find that you still "stick" to his wheel while saving 25W.
7. You will quickly unlock new bikes and wheels in game that will make you faster. The bikes will be more aero and lighter than what you start with. This will help everywhere. Not huge but when those final sprints are contested to the second or less it can make the difference in the end.
Just remember that like outdoors raw power does not nearly dictate the winner. This is not a TT nor a Tri bike leg. There is a draft and you must learn the game, the physics behind it, etc to be successful. Best of luck to you, looking forward to your next race video... perhaps a bit longer next time and not a sprint race.
So interesting seeing your opinion on Zwift when you started and comparing it to how much fun you (seem to) have right now riding your "video game bike"
BTW: thank you for the videos, they have been a great source of inspiration when I hit the gym at 5:30 in the morning, or when I go running on sore thighs from squatting heavy the day before!
Great Mark Lewis on Zwift, gonna follow you!
Anyone frustrated by seeing people pass them pushing less watts need to stop thinking that watts specifically translate to speed, much more goes into cycling then power. First look at w/kg much more accurate depiction of fitness and speed, second know your strengths if your a big guy pushing big watts hills/climbs most likely will not be your time to shine. Your time to catch that light guy pushing less watts is over the top in the decent and flats, if you go after him on the climb you’ll burn too many matches to catch people where you are best suited to.
As a bigger racer if i am first or second over the top I love to put in that extra 10-15 second dig over and into the downhill. Most others shut it down too soon and then the lighter guys have a hard time catching back onto my wheel flying downhill and/or into a flat. Good point here.
Frank, if you look at Mark's example the race is a flat race. In the real world he should be leaving the little guy then as you pointed out, but can't in Zwift. That's the point.
Treat a Zwift race as a workout, I've recently gone from D to C and from coming in the top 10% of D I am firmly in the bottom 10% of C, but I do find it enjoyable, I guess it depends on what your expectations are, if you're used to winning things it can be hard to take, but if (like me) you're used to be being average at best. Also, think about whether you're an efficient rider, for example the cadence matching to power, if the cadence is too high the power can drop off, but by giving yourself a little more resistance and lower cadence you have something to push against. I'm no expert and people may disagree, but for me - my natural cadence is around 90rpm, in a pack I tend to slow it down to 85 and increase the resistance slightly, and thus increasing the power a bit which helps to stick in the group for a bit longer - if I am spinning higher than normal my power drops off and I get tired quite quickly, if I get near the front of the group i will knock off the resistance and up the cadence so not to push away from the group I am in. Zwift racing is fun, just don't take it too seriously... Also practise in group rides to get used to pack dynamics - thats super useful.
Do TTs or races on the tempus fugit course, your weight wont affect you as much.
My I refer you to Rule #5 of the Velominati. It gets easier when you learn to ride in the pack and respond to changes in speed and gradient. Stick with it!!!
Surely its just a question of training hard, learning from your experiences and trying to get better? Zwift is just one tool in a cycling arsenal (one I love btw) but you are no more disadvantaged in the game than you are in real life. We all have strengths and weaknesses; things like physical height we can't control but there are plenty of aspects which we can. Since we are not pros, the only real competition is with ourselves and figuring out how to make small gains as we go. You really can't expect to be a winner after just two races - it takes time on the platform, a good understanding of tactics and a small degree of luck. Zwift is also not only about racing. There are plenty of group rides for people of all abilities, built in training plans to follow, and regular challenges to take on if you want to. PS - you might also want to take a half decent warmup with some higher power efforts to prime the neuro system etc, even before a sprint race. You can't expect your body to perform optimally after just a few minutes on the bike. I think you did incredibly well considering your earlier run, lack of prep and inexperience in the game!
@@MarkLewisfitness a good perspective video would be the Cam Jeffers ones in his race with the vegan cyclist, from Cams point of view he's grinding hard and giving it his all after a hard start, from the vegans perspective he's literally screaming "kill yourself" to himself...
These guys are all over the world, I think we've all got to except our place in it and just aim to get better, you don't get better by quitting, you also don't get the upgrades that make you go faster.
Feel your pain. Have the kickr bike as well and am 109kg. Very depressing seeing people on alpe du zwift spreeding past me at 160w when I am over 250w for the whole way and about to fall over dead. Not done a race yet. But if I did it would all be one category race and on a very flat course. Keep up the good work!
I feel your pain! I'm also 6-6" and 198cm weighing in at 98kg! Using a wahoo kickr. I still enjoy the races, put everything through zwift power. Obviously the algorithm isn't 100% but I look at the races as more of a honking workout as I wouldn't push myself that hard on my own!! Good content 👍🏻 cheers.
103kg 6’3. Ftp 300ish. I tend to do the short crit races and flat course races and I can generally hang on for half hour. Best position is 3rd in cat C. But I agree. No way would I put that much effort round watopia on my own. Easy why to beast yourself
Counterstrike lol 😂 love it
I feel positively light now at 88kg lol. I used to race for real back in my 20's a long time ago. Now nearer 60 than 50 I take it pretty easy relatively but do still do the occasional zwift race. Like yourself, when I started, I got slightly disheartened at the disadvantage I appeared to have against the sub 60kg riders and made worse when I got moved to group C from D on zwift power.
However, once you get it in your mind that it is a game and quit worrying about getting a podium then it becomes a great way to push yourself. You invariably end up with a group of riders that may consist of B's, C's and D's which really doesn't matter but does encourage you to shut down attacks or make small attacks yourself to try and split a group :-).
I think the biggest lesson I learnt was to rest in the pack when you can but be very careful as you can drop off the back in the blink of an eye. Normally happens when I look at a phone message or some other distraction lol. Once off the back you may as well just slow and let the next pack catch you up as very difficult to catch again as a solo effort.
Happy Birthday Big Guy - go for 19,000 calories today. Keep up the good work ... very inspiring.
Hey Mark, great videos! What is that jacket? It looks great.
Do Zwift group rides! There are some at different paces and different lengths. Choose what suits you. They are a great way to distract your mind a bit and get good steady training in. The goal in group rides is to stay with the lead rider (with the yellow beacon above their head). I highly recommend it.
Enjoyed the video. We are same weight and FTP , you are 6” taller. Racing on zwift is largely tactical . That said like me you’re not going to win on hilly courses but that’s the same in real world . Choose flat courses to race and you will have decent success. Choose hilly courses for training when raining . Use the draft well in races and don’t burn matches . I love zwift for the fitness and fun . That said races are always very hard. Good I say . Hope you give it another crack 👍
6' 2" here - 268 lbs - loving Zwift - hills are a killer but that's to be expected. Have to say, those that don't understand watts hate the avg 250w output ;)
Brilliant. Love the humour. Give or take I’m same height and weight. M Massive on Zwift if you want to take a look. Crit city races are fun. There are a couple of other so called Flat races but we just have to face it. If it goes uphill we go backwards. Try the Crit city races. They are worthy. I had the same thoughts and humour about being beaten by 45 kg kids in races. . It is what it is. Maybe see ya on Zwift sometime. Cheers. Mart.
You should look to start on some of the flatter routes for races where your weight isn't too much of a penalty and its more about producing overall power, these could be done either as road races or TTs (where there's no draft enabled): Watopia routes - Tempus Fugit, Tick-Tock, Volcano flat and Watopia's waistband. France routes - RGV, Champs-Elysee (Paris world). Richmond flat. You'd probably be a watt-monster in these flat ones and be up towards the front in most of them. TTs too, if you can sit 300w+ you'd be well positioned.
I can see you’re signed up for newbury velo crit , this is an all category start , so you’ll be in with the As and Bs again , also on Zwift Power they have categorized you as a cat D based on your first race (not your 2nd one) , so you are entitled to enter D cat races if you wish , no doubt you’ll get upgraded the more races you do , but racing in D might give you a better understanding of the racing to start with
Mark, I am 6ft4, 108kgs, 383w FTP. When you are big, to be competitive you would have to have an FTP of over 500w, which is never gonna happen. Just accept, as I have the Zwift may not be for you!. Love your video's and honesty. Ride On!
People in the comments have pretty much all given valuable advice already.
However no one has mentioned the difficulty slider bar. It is effectively a rear cassette option, set on 50% as default. You still have to put in the same watts for your avitar to move the same distance, but it will help level out those hills, especially if you have it on 100% currently.
Try a Crit City race Mark. Approx 10 miles in distance. With your category only. And the course is virtually pan flat. There are a few small little ‘kickers’ but just dig deep and power over them, then hold the wheels of other riders. You’d be perfectly suited to it. If anything, just treat it like an interval session lol. As that is what they are usually like. Great video again as usual 👍🏻
@@MarkLewisfitness that’s right. There’s not much climbing at all. Categories set off at different intervals but you will never see any of the other groups. It’s just a small circuit loop. Just like a real life criterium to be honest. They are usually called ‘crit city race’ or ‘Beta Crit City’. You may have already tried one by the time I’ve got round to replying haha.
@@MarkLewisfitness excellent stuff. Try to stay within the top 10 if you can. At or near the front, but never actually on the front lol. Good luck and enjoy!
I feel you man. I tried my first race @ 120KG with a 290ftp, crushed my soul. I did take 3 in the Class D group though.. However, climbing race I will NOT try.
Just a few tips.... go hard at start but not full gas. You'll get it. Find a race that suits your riding style. Flat and sprint finish. Also, some races are staggered start with you racing only your category. I think that should help until you race more. When riders are coming up on you, you need to put power down to get in the draft or else they'll pass right by. Drafting in zwift is not the same as real world. You can get away with a few less w/kg, but yes like you said, need to pedal. Lastly, don't give up. Do you feel you trained hard? Than who cares about place. If you put in good work and feel you are making progress, that is important.
Love that all out sprint and the start of the race 😂 I believe zwift power disqualifies racers that have abnormal stats therefore less racers seen. Zwift group workouts and group rides is where its at 👍
ZP does DQ riders that are over power (wkg). The all out sprint was pretty cool to start. He knew for others that they were hatd starts. Maybe watching a couple Zwift races by others would have shown the starts are not THAT hard.
@@cyclingboss469 thanks for the clarification
Lol, I don't give a shit of cycling but loved it! "People leaving there dogs out are passing me" 😄
I prefer TET.
I have the same problem, 6’3” and 91kg. Being slightly more tactful and training harder are the only ways to get better. You have also got to take it with a pinch of salt as not everyone that races is honest about their weight and height. Suddenly everyone is 5’2” and 58kg...
You on Strava mate? Also keep the videos coming, loving it
@@MarkLewisfitness Thats a bit sad to hear.
Everyone has there advantages and disadvantages. As a heavier rider you will be stronger on flat courses and faster. I'm 104kg high ranked B cat rider. You need to just get your power up. Also you need to use the blob better. Blasting off the front and putting your nose in the wind is not the way to go. You need to ride to your strengths, flat course 20 min sprint races etc.
Zwift is extremly skewed towards watts per kilograms... you can improve that with some practice, looking at the time of the race and your power you "only" matched your FTP despite the effort just being 6 minutes, you should be able to pull well above your FTP for that time frame though. This requires a bit of practice to not get carried away for a 1000W sprint in the beginning, 300-400W are usually more than plenty, you dont want to be winning the first 30 secs, you just want to stay in the front group :) (and on a mixed start race like this, holding on to a group of A riders would be well above your threshold in a longer race, so not a wise idea).
Next step is understanding Zwift drafting... which is quite abysmally implemented, you do not feel the resistance going down which is a problem, the only indication is your rider going onto the hoods rather than being in the drops, at that stage you can let off the power slightly(!) and still keep the same speed as the folks in front, this requires a bit of experimentation, I would suggest to start with 0.2-0.3wkg easier than the people you are following and then take it from there, you will notice the draft isn't perfect, sometimes you still drop back and need to push a bit more, sometimes you will shoot of the front, never stop pedalling and never drop tremendously below the power others in front of you are pulling. There is pace bots in Watopia with which you can practice this.
On climbs you *will* have to match the people in front of you with your height and weight, as soon as it ramps up to more than 2%.
Zwift racing is a game and requires some "skill" apart from pure wattage to get right, the more you understand and get used to how it works the better, and ignore Zwift Power for lower categories, not many C and D racers in most races would be signed up there, so it really skews your view on how well you did for smaller races.
As a C with correct data and for the first time doing this, you did extremely well!
@@MarkLewisfitness one thing I forgot... if you see pack approaching from the back, you need to put the hammer down (not 1000W, again maybe 2-3 second 300-400W spike) to make up for the speed differential. While the draft is sticky, if there is a differential in speed you won't stick and it takes a couple of seconds to kick in so you need to get up to the groups speed on your own before you can let off again. Otherwise you will be spat out of the back on every single passing group.
You can improve a lot with your tactics. Go hard at the start, not an all out sprint but push to be in the front group. You have to hold the group, stay in the draft. You eased off too much when you were drafting. You need to get into and fight to stay in the front group as long as you can, if you can hang in to the end you will get them in the sprint.
Also, flat courses you will have an advantage because raw power is more important than power to weight. And Race within your category rather than a mixed category, so all C’s, will mean groups form better because riders are similar ability.
I am not sure if this is right. I am 6’2. 100 kg and my FTP is 302. I am much better and faster than others on the climbs and they always catch me on the flats!!! Any reason for this
He’s finally done one...woo hoo. My advice , try a flat course and also a race which doesnt mix the categories (A B C D all starting at the same time) , in the mixed races the lower cats can sometimes get the draft of the higher category riders and then sit in , if you just enter a pure Cat C race it’s a much fairer race
@@MarkLewisfitness did you adjust the settings at all? its default at 50% , some people like that some dont , i prefer 100% as it ramps up the resistance and i find it easier to put power down with a greater resistance especially on inclines , everyone is different , but worth playing around with
dylan jones yer have a bash at 100% setting mark for realism. I’m only 84kg so fair bit lighter than you, had the kicker bike for 2 weeks then did a race on course called vertoux I think it’s called, world of pain for 3 bloody hours, have a bash and let me know your thoughts. 🤮😜
It doesn’t make you faster... just makes a 10% incline feel like 10%... and allows you to put more power down. Look at Shane Millers post
th-cam.com/video/_mjAZyhOlt0/w-d-xo.html
@@simonrobinson2252 where does anyone say it makes you faster??, you simply just reiterated my point about possibly putting more power down as the resistance will be higher
I'm a hobby racer myself and do like ~270FTP ~ 3,1w/kg and yeah... ~14 y/o kids are pretty hard to race in REAL races... so the Zwift algo is not so far off.....
I heard if you train with the Adventure Spec jacket on it gives you extra leg power.
It's great gear, why wouldn't you use it. Maybe it's time to try it out on another offroad video? It's why I found this channel, and now I'm following cause I've signed up to a half marathon, full marathon and half ironman next year. Lol
If you want to think it was you that turned me to triathletes you are more then welcome. Alas it wasn't you, it was a combination of having kids, not being able to snowboard anymore and being fed up of doing nothing. So I'm now using everything the RAF can offer me to get a half respectable time in a half iron man before I attempt the full. And I also want to tick off an ultra marathon. Lol. But you are providing some good insight into the world of triathlon and training, albeit with a greater budget then I have right now.
It's definitely one on the list. I think Hindhead has a 50k at the devil's punchbowl. I definitely want to run the south downs way as well. A century run is far more prestigious then a century cycle
I would suggest more power. For a big lad like you, it's possible. Training that helped me is to go on a ride and ride at 375 watts until I get tired or traffic lights whichever comes first. It's a bit unstructured but you are simply spending time at that pace which important. So I never ride slowly for more than a few seconds. My Garmin is set to tell me the time spent riding above 350 watts. I am 85 Kg FTP 300 60YO Just throwing ideas. It certainly helped me. Possibly even better than a chain gang ride. It is literally time under tension. It provides the toxic load for your muscles to adapt to
Plenty of larger riders do well. It's about strategy. Sit on wheels, don't kill yourself on uphills. This is the exact same predicament large riders find themselves in in the real world.
I am 6’0” and 180 lbs (182.9 cm & 81.6 kg) and considered to be on the large size for cycling and you’re easily out sizing me. Cycling’s two major statistics are weight and FTP. You have a large mass and a relatively low FTP. That will make cycling, indoor our outdoor, a challenge. Your issue, being new to cycling, is a lack of FTP to match your size. That 10 year old’s race average was over 4 watts/kilo while yours was much lower. Zwift does an accurate job of translating these numbers to the virtual world. Your just new and heavy!
I'm with Kelly. It takes 6 months to a year of structured training on a bike to realize your true potential. Keep up the good work!
Zwift's penalties for height and weight are way out of whack with reality. At 6'4" and 220 pounds, my performance in Zwift is 25-50% of what I do with the same bike & gearing on the road. For example, in Zwift my height apparently gives me the wind resistance of a large barn. I'll see myself capped at 66 kph* on a long downhill stretch whether I crank 200 watts at 70 rpm, or 500 watts at 100 rpm in my tallest gear. Uphill, I'll just say that the game's pedestrians walk at 5 kph, because one has paced me! They need to fix this problem. I don't want to, but my frustration between IRL performance and Zwift performance has me very close to giving my avatar full-body shrinking surgery.
*Ride in metric for more XP, it's 7.3% faster XP gain than Imperial according to Zwift Insider.
Do you lower trainer difficulty to help with this?
🤣😂 Mark, what do you want Zwift for? Winning races? I already so your video where you state you have to give 3 chances, so I know how you feel after that video. Look, Im also up there at 100kg, but only 5'9. I fall behind in those hills like there is no tomorrow. But it has been so much fun learning my strengths, and learning when to attack, and where. It still a journey finding these things out. I cant hate on someone who is only doing 250w while I'm doing over 300w, and they still beat me, cuz unfortunately thats what my bigger body needs to do to keep up with someone 25kg lighter. But look at you at the end!! All tired, huffing and puffing! Your workout was a success and you competed!! That's why I'm in love with Zwift! With experience, and learning the routes, you'll get much better!
I’m about the same weight and height as you and started riding swift with a kicker today. I’m finding it way harder that real life and I’m almost running out of gears haha what do you have your trainer difficulty at? I’m thinking of lowering to 30ish?
@@maxbrady7306 I was on a Zwift Compatible Magnetic trainer, and therefore Zwift Power, and recently got a Wahoo Kickr, and I also felt it was harder than cycling outdoors!! I have been working a lot lately, so I went back to my ‘dumb’ trainer cuz I had lost fitness and endurance while giving the Kickr a chance. Hopefully Ill have a break here in September to troubleshoot the problem where I can at least get comfortable on it, and use it to go through the Zwift Academy workouts, hoping to get better on my smart trainer.
Zwift is a game. Have you ever been good at a game the first time you played a game of its style? You made a lot of first timer mistakes that you can learn from and get better... which will make it much more fun!
I'm 70kg with a 300 FTP so Cat A (barely) in Zwift.
First thing to know is the draft in Zwift is about 50% of that on the road.
Second, there is a time lag in power in zwift so if you are loosing the wheel it is already too late!
Third, W/Kg is king in Zwift, not Watts, unfairly to someone heavy since on the road you will be stronger than someone half your weight (but that kid did almost 150% of your W/Kg and still lost to you so not so unrealistic). Stay within 0.5 W/kg in the draft and you will be fine.
Four, you started way too hard. Just like any real race, if you go that deep you will blow up.
Get back in there for another go and try and remember some of the tips. It will get easier and more fun!
I think too many expect Zwift to be a perfect replication of the real world but it isn't. Zwift has intentionally made it have some game play.
Mark is tall and big. He will not get as much of a draft benefit when riding behind an average sized rider. The average sized rider will get a big benefit riding behind Mark.
IRL there is a noticeable difference when I draft someone who is 6'3" 225 and someone who is 5'6 and 145 and I am not small at 6'1" 200.
The truth is that he was very very inefficient in this race. Many mistakes as you noted it was a first try. Keep at it and you will get better. He has already learned several lessons.
Bro, your videos are low key funny. Cuz obviously you are fit but Zwift is screwing you over lmao
I’m almost 70 years old and I just use Zwift for fitness purposes. I’ve raced in the past and Zwift is definitely not like the real thing. I’ve got a couple of heart issues so I limit my efforts a bit and just make sure I stay in D grade. In fact, about 6 years ago I started getting angina as I was warming up on Zwift. (I thought I was indestructible). It might have saved me from pounding up the local hill and suffering a more serious fate.
What do you have your trainer difficulty at please mark?
Just above half. Prob 60%
@@MarkLewisfitness thanks mark! I had my first ride on my kickr this morning and finding even at minimal gradient I’m having to go onto my smaller ring at the front which I never have to use on the road! Do you think lowering trainer difficulty would help? I’m about 100 kg…
Hilarious video Mark, well done! Of course, you'll know by now that your body shape isn't the best for w/kg balance. Professionally it's very unusual to see riders of your height and weight so you are at a massive disadvantage, on the other hand, you could beat up the race winner at the end of the race and steal their cup, oh hang on its virtual racing so you can't even do that LOL!
Just knowing I could kick their ass will do 😆 🥊
@@MarkLewisfitness (chuckle) Careful ... that 'small guy' with the trophy could be another Bruce Lee - and then the 'kicker' becomes the 'kickee' 😃
Has anyone pointed out that Kimi Van Gaarderen could be Teehay van Gaarderen’s (professional cyclist) daughter?
You need to choose your races more carefully. Just do the flatter, longer races. 3.1 wkg is ok power and very similar to my power, you just need to use strategy. I’ve managed to get into the top 5 out of 40 plus cat C riders. In no time at all, you’ll learn where and when to push hard to maximise your power. Don’t take it too seriously and just enjoy it.
Watts per Kilo is what matters. Your 314 watts average is meaningless. It's W/Kg and yours was 3.1 w/kg. The 10 year old held 4.3 w/kg. ( That 4.3 is crazy impressive by the way. ) You simply need to get stronger and/or lighter. Just keep plugging away.
100% agree Mark ... zwift algorithm is WRONG too penal on weight ... drop em a line , c wot they say ...
Did anyone else spend 5 minutes working out how Mark's MacBook has a touch screen display at 10:10?
We race with a guy who is 6’4 220 and he whoops us. It’s all about watts per kilo. More watts. More fun.
The reality you're showing is that a 154watt rider should never come close to a 300+ watt rider on a flat short course except in Zwift they can... you're right Zwift is wrong. On a hilly mountain course yeah ok maybe we can accept it but nope not here. You're not wrong you're not missing anything its a flawed biased algo. (anyone saying anything else about watts per kilo and it being accurate to real world blah blah hasn't ridden a bike in the real world nearly enough! I can also hurt their feelings by telling them they can't hold a 25mph average in real life as they probably think they can!) If you do continue on Zwift your also a few rides away from finding out its riddled with intentional cheaters, weight doping etc and also accidental cheaters using inaccurate equipment. For me all this took me completely away from the platform, I don't want a social chat from my training nor do I want get battered and ultimately demoralised by cheats. TrainerRoad was my way forward. in terms of streaming it to us lot its a total loser, we'd rather see you get pipped by a pre-teen, but in terms of your training its a total winner.
Perhaps this is already well known or just plain wrong.
The way I see it;
Person A is 100kg and rides 100m in 10seconds
Person B is 50kg and rides 100m in 10seconds
Although the times and distances are identical... Person A had twice as much weight to move than Person B over the 100m in the same time... so his work done would also be twice as much (or he had to work twice as hard). In this scenario you are person A... the 10 year old boy is person B... the little so and so!
Second video I've watched of yours... keep 'em coming. Good to see another "bigger than average" person doing phys... although I'm about 9kg up on you and years behind in ability.
Keep it up
I could not agree more 😂😂😂
I would like to see some running events categorised by bodyweight. They're often already categorised by age! I can't see how its fair to compare a 20st and 10st person's marathon times as an example!
The zwift dynamics are close to real world and are improving all the time .... stick with it. Im 70 kgs with an ftp of 250+ for the hour ... no big deal since FTP average for cyclists in training peaks is 3.8w/kg. There will always be someone better than you in zwift and the real world on the bike. Elite riders are 6.0+. I ride in zwift with a 100kg guy, he can hold 4.0kgs for at least 15 mins., and is a B cat zwift power so ftp well over 3.2 for an hour. Zwift races, brutal starts, hard to work out who is actually in the legitimate cat, but you can quiclky tell as the A's and B's will be holding 1w/kg plus above the C cat limit after about 3 minutes.... best to drop back to the following bunch.... you just get better at calling it. Winners in zwift races are smart, people will sit in and draft in their weak areas and work hard where they are strong to punish others. For example,, you could push hard out of a group over the top of a hill and work hard down it, even if there was a group of 70kg guys behind you it is unlikely they would catch you. On a race with laps, recky the route, go ride it before you race it. Look at it on zwift insider and work out where you are gonna be strong, work out what is gonna hurt you . Work out how you can rest up going into a hard section to get through it. Hit the bottom of a hill at the front and ease back threw the pack a little ets.... there is a degree of race craft, not to mention the power ups.
@@MarkLewisfitness I got bumped into B cat in zwiftpower... when you go up cat... and yiu will... its even more brutal. So ZP is looking at your 20min efforts and once you have a few of them over 3.2kgs you will get bumped up. So in zwift, as you improve, keep your long interval effors to say 15 mins. IE do 2 or 3, 15 min ints at ftp or just above... not 1 at 20 mins as this will trigger getting bumped.... podiuming at cat C is short lived unless you undersell yourself, you will naturally get bumped up to B over time. Then it's quite a fitness journey to the top of that, as I am finding. There will always be cheats, its a game, but a really good game for self improvement on a bike. Your sprint power us brutal btw, work on your endurance! By riding ftp intervals.
If it helps Mark, Magnus Bäckstedt won the 2004 Edition of Paris Roubaix. He is (6 ft 4 in) and weighed 94KG. There's hope for us tall fat lads ;-)
Right?? I was looking at his stats and couldn't believe a 94kg dude could actually compete at that level.
The 154W vs 314W is an extreme example and does not align with in real life bike racing. What most people forget and/or do not understand though is that having the highest raw watts or highest w/kg does not mean that you will win a road, circuit, or criterium race (in Zwift or real life). The tactics that take place including teamwork are such a significant factor in determining who wins.
Often on flat courses the winner simply does not have the highest power in the race (raw watts or w/kg)... in fact flat courses really help the sprinters, who sit-in and cruise at a moderate pace while everyone else works hard and only in the end do they lay down a hard effort. In pro racing you see this all the time, how often is a teams protected sprinter on the front doing work on a flat stage, never. His team does the work and he only shows his face in the last 200m.
If you simply lay down your threshold power for 45 minutes, nose in the wind, the only thing that happens is:
a. You get very tired. 45 minutes of threshold sucks.
b. Your competition will let you drag them to the line. You may drop a few but many will be capable of hanging in the draft. Roughly speaking at 300W anyone else doing 250W will hang in there, possibly as low as 200W.
c. You will get passed by everyone in the final sprint 200-300m from the finish.
d. You will do much more work than everyone else and place horribly, possibly be frustrated by the fact that you are a much stronger rider however you keep losing.
e. This is also true in real life.
Fitness without tactics does not mean success.
In racing often times the guy putting down less power and/or less w/kg for the race wins... why? because he is playing it smart. He is only on the front doing work at very select times. He is only doing work at times in the race when a selection is being made and a group is breaking apart so that he can be a part of the winning selection. He is laying down that final big sprint that may be for a win, or for a podium instead of 15th place. He realizes that the break is going to go the distance and that he needs to bridge or else he will miss it and puts down the power.
As you level up pick up the most aero bike and wheelset available when you can purchase it for these flat races. I bet you could turn in the same time doing 15-20W less with a real aero setup.
If you are looking for a pure fitness race with long threshold and big watt efforts then do a TT on a TT bike in Zwift. There is no draft in Zwift when on a TT bike. If you want to see some semblance of real life road racing tactics in Zwift then keep up with these races and give it many many more tries to start to understand what is really happening.
That being said Zwift is not a perfect reflection of real life riding. There is a bit of game play and behind the scenes they are always tweaking the draft, CdA, etc. It is good fun and good for fitness but don't expect real life because it is not, it is its own thing, its Zwift.
Yep mate,know how you feel😀
194cm/110kg,
this game is not for us🤷♂️😀👍💪🦵🙋♂️, even my avatar, he laughs at me🤣🤣🤣
@@MarkLewisfitness 😀👍
Weight Vest? Be kind to your joints! Future Mark will thank you. Seriously.
story of my life; pull the billy-goats for 10s km on the flats, bursting through the air and sucking them along and then all of a sudden, 5% climb and I'm dropped like a used condom!
:)
Definitely a glass half empty kind of guy here! The extra size of a heavy body actually is predisposed to creating more power more easily than a smaller person. Your legs are longer with bigger muscles. They have more inertia and the body can press harder on the pedals! You have a bigger heart, lungs, more blood! It takes more power for a large person to simply walk so of course riding a bike is going to take that into account. It is so maddening to see people comparing their power numbers. It's simply not accurate. Blame the laws of physics if you want. B*tching won't make you faster, virtually or in reality.
Hyrox is a great sport for bigger people (as long as they can run at a decent pace) because the sleds, rope pull, rowing, wall-ball, kettlebells, and lunge packs are all one size, benefitting larger people.
I am not even a beginner at this, so happy to be schooled, but isn't the reason he shot ahead here is that he cheated by having a rolling start? Shouldn't everyone start from a stationary position?
I'm 6'5 circa 100kg and yes it's very annoying but that's physics for you..
Turns out, you were not done with Zwift
Zwift's algo is heavily dependent on w/kg. It's all a game of w/kg and FTP/kg. So, very far from real life. Sorry. Supposedly RGT is more real life aproximation.
Draft in zwift is so far off from reality. Again, in zwift draft you're still at you FTP just going faster than if you were not in that group. But you're really not drafting. Just going faster. In the road, when in the draft you can allow yourself to coast or pedal really easy. Not in zwift. Zwift is not trying to be outdoorzi realistic.
That being said with training you can see real benefits and with your weight in flatter courses you can really outperform on sprints.
I know the problem. My weight is 57kg and 174cm tall. I race beter in zwift than on the road.
Zwift is full of bullshitters Mark. Lots of riders putting out wkg's that the pro's would be proud of. I also think the algorythm disproportionately effects heavier riders compared to the real world.
Funny listening to big lads whining about not being good at a sport for once. As Jason Kenny said, being big is fine but you've gotta get it moving.
Hi Mark, How come that you are surprised that weight matters ?? I find it to be somewhat realistic, when I compare to my outdoor rides/performance. And yes there is cheating going on unfortunately, however If you look at the results 17:05 in the video, you actually won in category C - the riders in front of you all cheated and didn't belong in category C, their w/kg all were way above 3.1.
How very true, great spot!! @Mark Lewis - you don't suck as much as you think haha
The wkg / cats is of no relevance in such a short race , its only 3.5km and most people will go over their cat , cats are worked out over an average of 95% of your best 20 min efforts over the last 3 months , so in reality over 3.5km a true cat C could quite easily go over 3.1wkg
@@skaramanga007 you are right distance matter, however I personally have plenty experience from longer races that many riders sign up in categories too low for them. However I believe they are being disqualified in zwiftpower, not sure.
@@hrpzwift945 you’re right , zwiftpower will throw out the sandbaggers from the results , but on the shorter sprint races and the crit city races you’ll see people way over cat as the race is under 20 mins , and zwifpower will leave a cat c winner at say 3.5wkg in the results in these instances. Once you get over the 20 mins thats when people get dqed , you still have some leeway though as its 95% of your best 20 mins
@@hrpzwift945 They are in fact being DQ in ZP. ZP is the only place I look for "real" results.
Hmmmm ... if you think that Zwift is over-penalizing on height (which shouldn't increase your aero drag that much since your upper body is pretty much horizontal over the aero bars) just try setting your height to a lower value that is more in line with the tall end of the pro rider scale, say, 5' 10", but keep the same weight (for inertia and momentum calculations). I don't think that would be 'cheating' as you are trying to compensate for a 'faulty' algorithm.