300 watts power recommendation is based on most openness in sound quality with Class D amplification I have in hand. Good quality 100 watts @8 ohm Class AB Amplification will be more than sufficient for up to 90-95db range.
I finally got these speakers. Paired with Lyngdorf TDAI-1120 (got it instead of Marantz as I was convinced by Lyngdorf's RoomPerfect correction). This amplifier is 120W per channel into @4 ohm. To my ear it keeps Kefs more open than a pub on Saturday night. Amazing sound.
Don't get upset with negative comments. Don't bother them as they don't worth your attention, time, energy and emotion. Everyone has their own views. Just carry on to share your own views as that's what you fans need. Your reviews are much appreciated 👏👏👏👍.
Great review. Most important point: You let the viewers hear the sound of the speakers, unlike ton of other nonsence youtubers "reviewers" keep talking, blathering the whole clip w/o let the viewers here the sound! that's sucked!. Again, Great clip. You know what the youtube viewers really want to , thanks for share.
I purchased the same Indigo blue 3R meta two months ago. I used two different subwoofers with these KEFs. They replaced a $6k full range floor standing speaker. Not quite as detailed as the ones they replaced, but the r3 meta have a great soundstage and airy imaging. I'm quite pleased.
After listening from KLH Model 3 and Model 5, I found this speaker sounds more analytical than having a live perfomance like on the Model 3, I really wish the Model 5 has the same music track as this and Model 3 to know the bass performance of it. Honestly this is one of the best or the best of the best yt channel to sound demo speaker, I can really hear the soundstage.
I have the same pair. After toeing out and bringing them into the room plus adding a Rel 7x, I couldn’t be happier. At this reasonable price you’re getting your moneys worth.
I'll chime in my review of the KEF R3 Meta. So a while back my buddy had these speakers and he loaned them to me to test against my "speaker setup". My "setup" was a pair of Logan Martin 35XT and a pair of smaller Klipsch reference satellites (yes, that's 4 speakers total stacked together in 2 pairs of 2). I used one amp to drive the pair 35XT's, and another separate amp to drive the pair of Klipsch satellites. The Klipsch satellites had a 3/4" titanium dome tweeter and a 3" mid driver. My amps were just average Onkyo stuff, nothing fancy. I was also using a Martin Logan 10" powered sub when test all speakers. When testing these KEF's against my setup, the KEF's sounded a little subpar. The Kef sounded a bit muted and needed more power than the Martin Logan to deliver the same perceived decibel. The Martin is superior in the high octave range, some listeners may even consider it too harsh, but for opera music, this is a must requirement from the speakers. What the Martin lacks in the mid's is then completed by the Klipsch satellites 3" drivers. And when listening to the Kef's, it just doesn't have as strong a mid, and Kef sounded a bit muted and muddle in the high to mid frequencies. Yes, I realize this is NOT an apple to apple comparison, but I was curious what a pair of high-end bookshelf speakers would do against 2 pairs of lower-end speakers (that still cost much less). I was pleaseantly surprised at the outcomes of my test. The only "issue" is that having 2 pairs of speakers take up a little more room and doesn't look as aesthetic. I'm sure some will questioned if using a higher end amp would do the Kef more justice, and perhaps it may make the Kef sound better, but IMO the Kef would still not come close to my 4-speaker setup. So just to quench my curiousity further, a local Best Buys at the time were carrying the Martin 35XT and the KEF R3 (regular R3, not the Meta). So I asked the sales guy to demo these speakers for me in their music demo room. Now I'm not sure how Best Buys setup their demo equipment, so I can't say if they used the same amp or different amps for different speakers. At any rate, I got a chance to demo them, and again, the Martin 35XT sounded stronger, with better clarity, in the high to mid frequencies, and the Kef R3 sounded muted and subdued and had to be given more power for them to deliver the same perceived decibel to the ear. The Martins were better at listening at low decibel, I still can get clarity of highs and mids (and bass can be independently adjusted with powered sub). With the Kef, listening at low decibels makes it even more muted and muddle in the highs and mids. Again, not it was not an apple to apple comparison, but to me personally, it will take a lot to move me away from my 4-speaker setup.
I have had the martin logan 35 xti for a few years and while they’re great they can be fatiguing and I do think they’re harsh in the upper register. I’m replacing them with the Kef R3 Meta because the highs aren’t as piercing. It is true that the kef doesn’t have as much sparkle up high but after having the martin logan for several years I value versatility and being able to enjoy a wide variety of music without fatigue. The Kefs mid range is more full and the bass is loader.
Thank you for mentioning the break in. I was literally thinking about whether or not reviewers take that into consideration and at that moment you spoke about that. I am new to this but my Kef LS50 Meta definitely needed to run for several hours. I did notice a positive change. From very veiled and uninspiring to finally sounding much better. New Hegel H190 driving them, Tidal/Roon through laptop, H190 DAC. Transitioning my music from away from my beginner AVR setup / Marantz SR8015 with Klipsch RP280, RP center and surrounds, 5.2 / Dual SVS sealed subs. Keeping the 2 setups, 1 for movies the other for music. Klipsch are really good sounding but with all the typical Klipsch concerns - a little bright on some songs, a little fatiguing. The towers really fill the room and sound very good so the smaller soundstage of the KEF takes a little getting used to. Both systems sit together just like the view in this video so I can easily switch between systems to compare. KEF/Hegel is cleaner/tighter, warmer, sibilants not nearly as ear piercing. The Klipsch are very good, the Hegel/KEF are easier to listen to for hours on end. Not using the subs for music to keep the peace with neighbors - apartment living blues. They get fair warning on movies though as it is not as often as music. The dual sealed subs really dig deep and shake the walls just the right amount. Fun fact: best soundproofing in the world is being courteous to your great neighbors and kindly offer to shut it down at any time if it is too much. They always say blast it and they appreciate the offer. Love my neighbors.
Hey hey, can you please tell me more about he Hegel with the Meta? I got them with the Powernode since everyone was praising this "combo" for the price - but I do want to upgrade to get more power/sound - I m mostly listening to Funk Boogie House music - any feedback ?
Excellent review as always! Thank you for specifying how it is in low level listening. I’m in an apartment and that is paramount for me and many audiophiles!
I understand but On-Axis position is right on direction of a speaker is facing like when I measure a speaker but since we're not listening to one speaker toe-in would more correct term. Thanks
"Toe in, toe -out", one could understand 'toe -in' and 'toe-out' taken from the position where the axis of the drivers are faced front. 'On Axis' or 'Off axis' on the otherhand, means whether the axis of the drivers are pointed straight to your ears or not. And I have the impression you are referring with your 10 degrees toe-out to the remarks of Erin during his review of the R3 Meta on his channel Erin's audio Corner? If you do, than you might misunderstood Erin, or Erin was not clear enough; Erin talks about 10 degrees toe-out from the On Axis position as I understand him, while the manual of the R3 Meta advises to toe the R3 Meta in as of 'face front' to 15 degrees inward. Thanks for your review. You do have a way with words to describe sounds you hear! As a viewer I can hear the sounds of the speakers you recorded to judge for myself and you supply the in-room measurements as well, great!
It's clear enough, On-Axis position is right on direction of a speaker is facing like when I measure a speaker but since we're not listening to one speaker toe-in would more correct term. Thanks
@@Tharbamar Noted. So when listening to one speaker, one listens in a 3D environment and uses analogous terminology to describe the position of a speaker relative to the listener. But when listening to more than one speaker in a 3D environment, one confines oneself to a two dimensional environment using analogous terminology to describe how the position of the speakers relative to the listener opposes. Since you don’t listen to one speaker, there’s nothing to say about the behavior of speakers in the vertical plane. Noted. Yet describing the sound in the room produced by speakers,- as I said earlier, you do have a way with words-, 3D related sound properties do not lack, as if not to say there’s an abundance of such words. Instead of using your gift of having your way with words to try to comprehend someone’s attempt to convey a message and the message itself as well, you deliberately misinterpreted the message just to ridicule a TH-camr compcolleague. Well it is a way to show a disagreement. Apparently it is your way....
I was an *insufferable* KEF fanboy in the 1980s: My first audiophile purchase was a pair of KEF C80s. But the Uni-Q in the KEF 105/3 just shocked me for how dark and lifeless it sounded -- like listening to the highs and upper mids through a toilet tube. And ever since then it's been really hard for me to get excited again about the brand. I know this next part is going to sound silly, but it almost feels the way I imagine that a divorce would feel. The good news is that I also run an SMSL AO300 so the comp is one-to-one.
I run my KEF R3 Metas with Hegel H190 - Gustard R26 dac - KEF KC62 Sub and it sounds fantastic. I am pretty happy with this setup. The sound is pretty warm , transparent and holographic as well. The imaging is pretty good.
Another great review 👍. Happy surprise to hear you say that Musician Knight 1 is comparable to KEF Reference speaker as I've the Knight 1🤭. Thanks for sharing.
I suspect you're referring to Erin's Audio Corner re. 10° toe-out? He explains that when the tweeter is directly facing you, toe them out by 10° or your liking. 😉 It's prob. not the most bass heavy speaker, however, for a lot of rooms or closer to walls, that may be a blessing.
On-Axis position is right on direction of a speaker is facing like when I measure a speaker but since we're not listening to one speaker toe-in would more correct term. Thanks
Actually 0° is facing straight out into the room. Toe out is now angled towards the walls. Toe in, is toward the listener. Erin just doesn't know how to reference things properly. He also uses the back of the speaker to reference distance to the front wall. The distance from the acoustic center (front baffle) to the front wall is what actually matters with acoustics. I've tried to tell Erin this, but he's a stubborn old dog that's stuck in his ways that thinks he knows everything already. What I'm trying to say is, Erin is a bit of a moron. That's putting it as politely as I can.
Hello Tharbamar, Thanks for your recommendations in this audio world of so many.. because of you I am a pround owner of the Musician Knight 1.. love em!.. I am currently pushing them with Denon PMA 1600NE and SACD DCD 1600 speaker cables vibrog vs 901.. Heavenly sound.. My plan is to invest in another intergrated amp.. Musical fidelity or Naim. The Kef R3 Meta is my next speaker.. I currently have Kefs reference III in a 9.2 Home theater... I think Kef is very good speaker, it all depends on the many factors in your listening environment and components
ok, That's an interesting opinion.. My pairing components are not at a level where I can make a decerning decision.. sometimes I make a decision based on looks as well as performance, but thanks for your response@@Tharbamar
The bass on Kef R3 Meta is pretty strong. I sit on a couch, listening at arround 60-65db and on some songs I can feel like the couch cushons slighlty vibrate from the bass notes. I don't know why anyone would want even more bass than these speakers already deliver.
@@Tharbamar That is true my room is arround 20 sq meter with 3m high ceiling. If someone has a bigger room he might need bigger speakers with more bass.
Hello Tharbamar. I have a question for you because as a Japanese you will be a competent person. There is a Luxman L505uXII amplifier on ebay, which can be bought twice cheaper than in Poland. The problem is that the voltage is AC100V. Will using a voltage converter from 230V to 110V negatively affect the sound quality?
Hi, Sound quality will not effect with step down voltage converter but try to get at least 3 times the maximum power consumption of the amplifier, thanks
When you say pianos can sound a bit hard, do you mean bright and harsh, or something else? Does that hardness show up on other sounds too, e.g. Vocals or percussion?
Please show R7 meta vs R11 meta, people are aware of the R3 already. It's better than the previous but still aggressive when loud so it's out. Both R7 / R11 need subs so show us what we lose with the R7. It should be the sweet spot in the R line.
You are not supposed to listen to coaxials on axis, so a 10 degree toe out FROM ON AXIS is always recommended. And when you say imaging is not great on the R3 Meta, something must have terribly gone wrong somewhere. All the R Metas I heard recently have crazy good imaging, just like every other KEF. Imaging is the best thing about them.
Well you'll have to listen my other speakers for how real precise stereo image sound like R3m have not contest in pin point imaging. I've been using coaxial speakers for twenty years so I know how they have to set up how they're going to sound, probably no one have more than 10 pairs (6 of them were KEF) of Coaxial speakers like I did. EDIT: Good for you If you think R series have crazy good stereo image.
Read the manual. It’s 10 degrees from straight into the room going inward. Not from on axis going outward. Speaker works best straight into the room about 8 feet apart. I base this on my Ref 1 Meta which is pretty much the R3 with upgraded parts but essentially the same characteristics.
@@De132an it can be anywhere from 10 degrees (from no toe in) to 20 degrees (10 degrees from on axis) with 30 degrees being on axis. With zero toe in the R3 Metas will lose too much of the top end.
@@AbsoluteFidelityFrom KEF Speaker setup page… “5. Toe-in Uni-Q means that toe-in is not necessary like it can be with many other loudspeakers. We would always recommend starting with the speakers facing flat into the room. If your side walls aren’t symmetrical in their construction in a drastic way, then maybe some slight toe-in could help with the mismatch by focussing a slightly louder direct sound to the listening position, but you shouldn’t need to go further than 10 degrees. Having the Uni-Q flat into the room also maximises the sweet spot, giving maximal coverage into the room, so more people share the same experience.”
Hi - Thank you for your informative reviews. Could I ask for opinions please? Would I be better with the these speakers or the Knight Ones? Both are quite expensive for my limited budget (at UK prices) but I would be willing to spend the money to get very good ones. Or maybe KEF LS50 would be OK? I am playing mainly indie rock CDs from an Arcam CD5 using an Arcam SA-20 amp in a small/medium sized room. Thank you so much.
Thank you for the great review. Appreciate the honest review. I'm considering these speakers but am concerned about you mentioning that they "bottom out" or distort at high volumes. I vaguely recall you saying something similar about the LS50s. Do you think this is a common issue in general for these KEF standmount speakers? How likely is someone to encounter this issue. Is this distortion evident just at excessive listening levels?
No distortion in average listening levels, mostly they sound good but they don’t like it when you play them hard, you’ll have to use towers in KEF R series for that purpose, thanks
@@Tharbamar thank you for the reply. Just a last question. What volume level do you consider "hard"? Does that happen with all your amplifiers at that volume? Thanks.
I assume you are talking about the bass drivers bottoming out at high levels. Would a setup with a sub crossed at 80-100hz alleviate this? I believe you said you tried them with a sub as well.
How does it compare to Musician Knight 1? Which is better, and why? Thanks. Finished the video and you had said that low level listening goes to Knight 1. But overall, which do you pick overall?
Appreciate the honest review. How do the KEF R3 Meta compare to the Wharfedale Elysian 2 you have reviewed? Are the Elysians worth spending more €1.5K more? Also can you review the Wharfedale Aura 2 and the Arendal 1723 Monitor S THX? And compare these 4 speakers? Thank you.
Given the fact that R2R works better with the R3 Meta than the Loxjie, will those speakers work better with a D400 EX dac, than with an ESS ? (I like midrange, i don't like r2r 😅)
I auditioned these with Audiolab 7000A and I loved the sound. Compared to Linton 85s in a A/B test, Lintons sounded terrible and nothing special + tiring. I can listen to R3 Metas for hours.
Great review, thanks! Do you think the R3 Meta is a better speaker then the Bowers & Wilkins 603 S2 Anniversary Edition you reviewed earlier? I can get the B&W for 1000 EUR second hand or the metas for 1500 EUR new. Thanks!
Great review Thar. I was a little taken back about 300 watt in 4ohms needed to ideally drive these. Is that the same recommendation with your knight 1 and R11? Isn’t the e4000 and sx11 under 300 watts. Just trying to understand your logic. I do understand how more power can always be a benefit, but didn’t think it was needed on the speakers in your collection. Thanks again!
Hi Tharbamar thanks for yours reviews. I really enjoy your content. About Kef r3 Meta. In this Price Point, If is by your ears, do you prefer KLH Model 5 o Kef r3 Meta
Hi, Were your measurements done after the speakers burn in or out of the box? Do you see it in measurement since you said they sound "muddy" and "congested"?
Anyone planning on pushing the volume of a bookshelf beyond 90db very well knows they need a subwoofer with a 40-60hz HPF... if not shame on them lol. I just wish more Pre-amp's and integrated amps were equipped with bass management.
What’s your point? oh I see you just assume I don’t know, the truth is there are many stand mount speakers can push above 100db, Then why would they rated for 110db max output on white paper?
@Tharbamar I agree and liked your review, the comment was not aimed at you. I meant in general a 6 1/2 can only move so much air. Most people should have common sense crossover a 6 1/2" bookshelf if they plan on listening to 90db+ volume. IMO it's not the speakers fault, it has its limitation.
that is a huge difference is build and cost. What I can say, I have these and even in the blue. Very well made. I also have Dynaudio specials 40"s The Kef is on a higher level. But the Dali might take a leap as it should for the cost. I am using a Rega Aethos to power them. My Dac is Gold Note. Awesome sound. My next large speaker purchase will be Devore Super 9
Thanks for this demo. How about 70 watts @8 ohm moving to 100 watts @4 ohm for listening between 60-70db? Would that be enough amplification? I am about to pair these speakers with Marantz 40n.
Was waiting for this review, so I have a r7 non meta . Thinking to move to r3 meta . Is it going to be a good upgrade or no ? My room is small to medium only . So bookshelf is good size wise . Please advise
Hi, there is no such a thing as best speaker, all case by case and personal preference. Some of my favorites are Joseph Audio Pulser 2, Sonus Faber Extrema etc.,
@@Tharbamar Those two have a little bit of extra treble sparkle in frequency response? I'd love to try some of those interesting designs, but many cost $$$.
had kef r3(non meta) for 2months, as much as i wanted the gave them a chance because everybody was praise them, i couldn't. 1) harsh, my ears were bleeding after only 20 minutes of listening, because of their metallic tweeter 2) incoherent, for whatever reason they felt disconnected, not engaging 3) because of their narrow dispersion (coaxial) they have a deep soundstage, and because i was limited to pull them more than 40cm from the front wall, the sound gave me the impression it's coming from behind the wall, this was causing my brain going crazy
Hi,i need your advise. I want to buy an integrated amp Accuphase and i dont know wich one. I got 2 options for my budget. E 280 or E 350 !??? Thank you!
Hello Tharbamar. What you think is better speaker for me. Kef r3 meta or css criton 1 td-x with superior version. I have medium room. And my amp is Denon AVc 3700h. It has about 100w for channel.
Hello, Thabamar! Please advise me of good bookshelf acoustics to listen to in the evening at a low amplifier volume. jazz, vocals, classical. Budget from 1000 to 2000$
Tharbamar, what ever mic's you are using, their rolled off somewhere in your chain. Love your reviews. Can't believe you don't correct it. A-hole's save the "get the wax out of your ears" fan boy comments. This is now becoming comical.
Excellent detailed review, all your critiques are audible in the test track. This speaker is imo overblown by some other reviewers, but your critique explains well why it is not particularly engaging to my ears. 'Lack of separation in the upper mids' is a genius insight and one that one would not normally expect from KEF.
Hi I got r3 meta combo with atoll in200se with the AKM dac. Initially i was happy but at some poit i have realized that the amp is pushing the mids and especially the highs more than the bass. At low to normal volume 60db rhe highs are fine but the basa is very weak...if i push the volume to extract the bass the highs are getting slightly agressive for my liking. Changed the cables to mogami w3104 which helped but havent resolved the issue. Now i wonder if adding rel t5x to push the low end very slightly will level my sound and allow me to enjoy those low to normal 60-75db levels or maybe try EQ reducing the 2khz and up register with few db...is the bass idea just putting money at the wrong place?
Adding sub would be easier choice but I would look into something like Eversolo DMP-A6 streaming DAC to tune with PEQ, th-cam.com/video/pokEBmWlVIA/w-d-xo.html
Thanks for the reply. I have wiim pro so I will try with it first. Are you saying that wiim EQ wont be as good as A6 EQ quality. If i am going to buy new player or sub won't the sub be better investment overall?
@@Alextraz I’m talking about PEQ not regular EQ but regular EQ should work, see my full reviews of them here. WiiM Pro Music Streamer Could Be "The Product Of The Year" th-cam.com/video/UxKkOWiy1NY/w-d-xo.html EverSolo DMP-A6 Streaming DAC Review th-cam.com/video/pokEBmWlVIA/w-d-xo.html
You have strange prices in your home country apparently. In Germany the KEF R11 (non-meta) cost twice as much as the r3 meta. No idea why they would cost the same.
I would still prefer a KLH Model 5 over the KEF R3 Meta. If you still have the Model 5s, why not compare the KEF R3 to the Model 5s. The KEF doesn't envelope the listener and sounds a bit cold.. The Knights or the Burchardts as well are all warmer. I am looking forward to the DAC reviews you spoke about.
I don't like KEF sound. I had the Q300 then the R300 and sold them. Not my cup of tea. Now i listening to speakers with paper mid range driver. Sounds much better to my ears.
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300 watts power recommendation is based on most openness in sound quality with Class D amplification I have in hand.
Good quality 100 watts @8 ohm Class AB Amplification will be more than sufficient for up to 90-95db range.
Hello, nice review, how would they get along paired with Schiit Ragnarok 2 (100W@4 Ohms)? I am between this KEFs and SF Sonetto I/II.
Thanks
Could you try dali epicon 2? I really want to know what you would think of them😊
I finally got these speakers. Paired with Lyngdorf TDAI-1120 (got it instead of Marantz as I was convinced by Lyngdorf's RoomPerfect correction). This amplifier is 120W per channel into @4 ohm. To my ear it keeps Kefs more open than a pub on Saturday night. Amazing sound.
Why everybody talking about amps can’t you use this with a receiver ??
@@tracer073 yes you can use with any receiver, better amp is optional if they want to get the best out of it.
Don't get upset with negative comments. Don't bother them as they don't worth your attention, time, energy and emotion. Everyone has their own views. Just carry on to share your own views as that's what you fans need. Your reviews are much appreciated 👏👏👏👍.
Great review. Most important point: You let the viewers hear the sound of the speakers, unlike ton of other nonsence youtubers "reviewers" keep talking, blathering the whole clip w/o let the viewers here the sound! that's sucked!. Again, Great clip. You know what the youtube viewers really want to , thanks for share.
I purchased the same Indigo blue 3R meta two months ago. I used two different subwoofers with these KEFs. They replaced a $6k full range floor standing speaker. Not quite as detailed as the ones they replaced, but the r3 meta have a great soundstage and airy imaging. I'm quite pleased.
Yep they could be a great choice in right paring, I’m still enjoying them, thanks
What sub did you use? Also how did you like it?
Thanks for sharing your honest opinion. One of the best reviewer.
My pleasure
you are spot on about midrange leanness/thinnest on the R3, i found the same to be true as well
After listening from KLH Model 3 and Model 5, I found this speaker sounds more analytical than having a live perfomance like on the Model 3, I really wish the Model 5 has the same music track as this and Model 3 to know the bass performance of it. Honestly this is one of the best or the best of the best yt channel to sound demo speaker, I can really hear the soundstage.
I have the same pair. After toeing out and bringing them into the room plus adding a Rel 7x, I couldn’t be happier. At this reasonable price you’re getting your moneys worth.
About to buy the same speakers / sub.
I'll chime in my review of the KEF R3 Meta. So a while back my buddy had these speakers and he loaned them to me to test against my "speaker setup". My "setup" was a pair of Logan Martin 35XT and a pair of smaller Klipsch reference satellites (yes, that's 4 speakers total stacked together in 2 pairs of 2). I used one amp to drive the pair 35XT's, and another separate amp to drive the pair of Klipsch satellites. The Klipsch satellites had a 3/4" titanium dome tweeter and a 3" mid driver. My amps were just average Onkyo stuff, nothing fancy. I was also using a Martin Logan 10" powered sub when test all speakers. When testing these KEF's against my setup, the KEF's sounded a little subpar. The Kef sounded a bit muted and needed more power than the Martin Logan to deliver the same perceived decibel. The Martin is superior in the high octave range, some listeners may even consider it too harsh, but for opera music, this is a must requirement from the speakers. What the Martin lacks in the mid's is then completed by the Klipsch satellites 3" drivers. And when listening to the Kef's, it just doesn't have as strong a mid, and Kef sounded a bit muted and muddle in the high to mid frequencies. Yes, I realize this is NOT an apple to apple comparison, but I was curious what a pair of high-end bookshelf speakers would do against 2 pairs of lower-end speakers (that still cost much less). I was pleaseantly surprised at the outcomes of my test. The only "issue" is that having 2 pairs of speakers take up a little more room and doesn't look as aesthetic. I'm sure some will questioned if using a higher end amp would do the Kef more justice, and perhaps it may make the Kef sound better, but IMO the Kef would still not come close to my 4-speaker setup.
So just to quench my curiousity further, a local Best Buys at the time were carrying the Martin 35XT and the KEF R3 (regular R3, not the Meta). So I asked the sales guy to demo these speakers for me in their music demo room. Now I'm not sure how Best Buys setup their demo equipment, so I can't say if they used the same amp or different amps for different speakers. At any rate, I got a chance to demo them, and again, the Martin 35XT sounded stronger, with better clarity, in the high to mid frequencies, and the Kef R3 sounded muted and subdued and had to be given more power for them to deliver the same perceived decibel to the ear.
The Martins were better at listening at low decibel, I still can get clarity of highs and mids (and bass can be independently adjusted with powered sub). With the Kef, listening at low decibels makes it even more muted and muddle in the highs and mids. Again, not it was not an apple to apple comparison, but to me personally, it will take a lot to move me away from my 4-speaker setup.
Thanks for sharing.
I have had the martin logan 35 xti for a few years and while they’re great they can be fatiguing and I do think they’re harsh in the upper register. I’m replacing them with the Kef R3 Meta because the highs aren’t as piercing. It is true that the kef doesn’t have as much sparkle up high but after having the martin logan for several years I value versatility and being able to enjoy a wide variety of music without fatigue. The Kefs mid range is more full and the bass is loader.
Thank you for mentioning the break in. I was literally thinking about whether or not reviewers take that into consideration and at that moment you spoke about that. I am new to this but my Kef LS50 Meta definitely needed to run for several hours. I did notice a positive change. From very veiled and uninspiring to finally sounding much better. New Hegel H190 driving them, Tidal/Roon through laptop, H190 DAC.
Transitioning my music from away from my beginner AVR setup / Marantz SR8015 with Klipsch RP280, RP center and surrounds, 5.2 / Dual SVS sealed subs. Keeping the 2 setups, 1 for movies the other for music. Klipsch are really good sounding but with all the typical Klipsch concerns - a little bright on some songs, a little fatiguing. The towers really fill the room and sound very good so the smaller soundstage of the KEF takes a little getting used to. Both systems sit together just like the view in this video so I can easily switch between systems to compare. KEF/Hegel is cleaner/tighter, warmer, sibilants not nearly as ear piercing. The Klipsch are very good, the Hegel/KEF are easier to listen to for hours on end.
Not using the subs for music to keep the peace with neighbors - apartment living blues. They get fair warning on movies though as it is not as often as music. The dual sealed subs really dig deep and shake the walls just the right amount. Fun fact: best soundproofing in the world is being courteous to your great neighbors and kindly offer to shut it down at any time if it is too much. They always say blast it and they appreciate the offer. Love my neighbors.
Hey hey, can you please tell me more about he Hegel with the Meta? I got them with the Powernode since everyone was praising this "combo" for the price - but I do want to upgrade to get more power/sound - I m mostly listening to Funk Boogie House music - any feedback ?
The lighting on the speakers (the left speaker) give the impression that they have wooden side panels. And they look much better that way!
They would , maybe you should get on to kef
Excellent review as always! Thank you for specifying how it is in low level listening. I’m in an apartment and that is paramount for me and many audiophiles!
As I stated in the video Low level listening is ok, thanks
Thabamar, what other reviewers mean is to set the speaker 10 degrees toe in from straighr position, which pretty much how you have yours set.
I understand but On-Axis position is right on direction of a speaker is facing like when I measure a speaker but since we're not listening to one speaker toe-in would more correct term. Thanks
"Toe in, toe -out", one could understand 'toe -in' and 'toe-out' taken from the position where the axis of the drivers are faced front. 'On Axis' or 'Off axis' on the otherhand, means whether the axis of the drivers are pointed straight to your ears or not. And I have the impression you are referring with your 10 degrees toe-out to the remarks of Erin during his review of the R3 Meta on his channel Erin's audio Corner? If you do, than you might misunderstood Erin, or Erin was not clear enough; Erin talks about 10 degrees toe-out from the On Axis position as I understand him, while the manual of the R3 Meta advises to toe the R3 Meta in as of 'face front' to 15 degrees inward.
Thanks for your review. You do have a way with words to describe sounds you hear! As a viewer I can hear the sounds of the speakers you recorded to judge for myself and you supply the in-room measurements as well, great!
It's clear enough, On-Axis position is right on direction of a speaker is facing like when I measure a speaker but since we're not listening to one speaker toe-in would more correct term. Thanks
@@Tharbamar
Noted. So when listening to one speaker, one listens in a 3D environment and uses analogous terminology to describe the position of a speaker relative to the listener. But when listening to more than one speaker in a 3D environment, one confines oneself to a two dimensional environment using analogous terminology to describe how the position of the speakers relative to the listener opposes. Since you don’t listen to one speaker, there’s nothing to say about the behavior of speakers in the vertical plane. Noted. Yet describing the sound in the room produced by speakers,- as I said earlier, you do have a way with words-, 3D related sound properties do not lack, as if not to say there’s an abundance of such words. Instead of using your gift of having your way with words to try to comprehend someone’s attempt to convey a message and the message itself as well, you deliberately misinterpreted the message just to ridicule a TH-camr compcolleague. Well it is a way to show a disagreement. Apparently it is your way....
I have had the R3. Etas for over a month. They’re excellent
I was an *insufferable* KEF fanboy in the 1980s: My first audiophile purchase was a pair of KEF C80s. But the Uni-Q in the KEF 105/3 just shocked me for how dark and lifeless it sounded -- like listening to the highs and upper mids through a toilet tube. And ever since then it's been really hard for me to get excited again about the brand. I know this next part is going to sound silly, but it almost feels the way I imagine that a divorce would feel. The good news is that I also run an SMSL AO300 so the comp is one-to-one.
I run my KEF R3 Metas with Hegel H190 - Gustard R26 dac - KEF KC62 Sub and it sounds fantastic. I am pretty happy with this setup. The sound is pretty warm , transparent and holographic as well. The imaging is pretty good.
Great to hear!
Do you use R26 as streamer as well? Thanks
Yes I use it as Roon EndPoint
@mehmetcamat4458 - what type of music do you play on your Kef speakers?
Mostly jazz and vocals and some classical
Another great review 👍. Happy surprise to hear you say that Musician Knight 1 is comparable to KEF Reference speaker as I've the Knight 1🤭. Thanks for sharing.
I suspect you're referring to Erin's Audio Corner re. 10° toe-out? He explains that when the tweeter is directly facing you, toe them out by 10° or your liking. 😉
It's prob. not the most bass heavy speaker, however, for a lot of rooms or closer to walls, that may be a blessing.
On-Axis position is right on direction of a speaker is facing like when I measure a speaker but since we're not listening to one speaker toe-in would more correct term. Thanks
Actually 0° is facing straight out into the room. Toe out is now angled towards the walls. Toe in, is toward the listener. Erin just doesn't know how to reference things properly. He also uses the back of the speaker to reference distance to the front wall. The distance from the acoustic center (front baffle) to the front wall is what actually matters with acoustics. I've tried to tell Erin this, but he's a stubborn old dog that's stuck in his ways that thinks he knows everything already. What I'm trying to say is, Erin is a bit of a moron. That's putting it as politely as I can.
Nice that you give honest explanation,, and give sound sample in your review.
Hello Tharbamar, Thanks for your recommendations in this audio world of so many.. because of you I am a pround owner of the Musician Knight 1.. love em!.. I am currently pushing them with Denon PMA 1600NE and SACD DCD 1600 speaker cables vibrog vs 901.. Heavenly sound.. My plan is to invest in another intergrated amp.. Musical fidelity or Naim. The Kef R3 Meta is my next speaker.. I currently have Kefs reference III in a 9.2 Home theater... I think Kef is very good speaker, it all depends on the many factors in your listening environment and components
R3 Meta is not as good as Knight 1 in sound quality but if you like KEF sound it’s a very good choice, thanks
ok, That's an interesting opinion.. My pairing components are not at a level where I can make a decerning decision.. sometimes I make a decision based on looks as well as performance, but thanks for your response@@Tharbamar
The bass on Kef R3 Meta is pretty strong. I sit on a couch, listening at arround 60-65db and on some songs I can feel like the couch cushons slighlty vibrate from the bass notes. I don't know why anyone would want even more bass than these speakers already deliver.
Speaker bass response is depends on size of the room.
@@Tharbamar That is true my room is arround 20 sq meter with 3m high ceiling. If someone has a bigger room he might need bigger speakers with more bass.
Hello Tharbamar.
I have a question for you because as a Japanese you will be a competent person. There is a Luxman L505uXII amplifier on ebay, which can be bought twice cheaper than in Poland. The problem is that the voltage is AC100V. Will using a voltage converter from 230V to 110V negatively affect the sound quality?
Hi, Sound quality will not effect with step down voltage converter but try to get at least 3 times the maximum power consumption of the amplifier, thanks
When you say pianos can sound a bit hard, do you mean bright and harsh, or something else? Does that hardness show up on other sounds too, e.g. Vocals or percussion?
Please show R7 meta vs R11 meta, people are aware of the R3 already. It's better than the previous but still aggressive when loud so it's out. Both R7 / R11 need subs so show us what we lose with the R7. It should be the sweet spot in the R line.
You are not supposed to listen to coaxials on axis, so a 10 degree toe out FROM ON AXIS is always recommended. And when you say imaging is not great on the R3 Meta, something must have terribly gone wrong somewhere. All the R Metas I heard recently have crazy good imaging, just like every other KEF. Imaging is the best thing about them.
Well you'll have to listen my other speakers for how real precise stereo image sound like R3m have not contest in pin point imaging. I've been using coaxial speakers for twenty years so I know how they have to set up how they're going to sound, probably no one have more than 10 pairs (6 of them were KEF) of Coaxial speakers like I did.
EDIT: Good for you If you think R series have crazy good stereo image.
@@Tharbamar its clear your definition of imaging is not like the rest of us.
Read the manual. It’s 10 degrees from straight into the room going inward. Not from on axis going outward. Speaker works best straight into the room about 8 feet apart. I base this on my Ref 1 Meta which is pretty much the R3 with upgraded parts but essentially the same characteristics.
@@De132an it can be anywhere from 10 degrees (from no toe in) to 20 degrees (10 degrees from on axis) with 30 degrees being on axis. With zero toe in the R3 Metas will lose too much of the top end.
@@AbsoluteFidelityFrom KEF Speaker setup page…
“5. Toe-in
Uni-Q means that toe-in is not necessary like it can be with many other loudspeakers. We would always recommend starting with the speakers facing flat into the room. If your side walls aren’t symmetrical in their construction in a drastic way, then maybe some slight toe-in could help with the mismatch by focussing a slightly louder direct sound to the listening position, but you shouldn’t need to go further than 10 degrees.
Having the Uni-Q flat into the room also maximises the sweet spot, giving maximal coverage into the room, so more people share the same experience.”
Hi - Thank you for your informative reviews. Could I ask for opinions please? Would I be better with the these speakers or the Knight Ones? Both are quite expensive for my limited budget (at UK prices) but I would be willing to spend the money to get very good ones. Or maybe KEF LS50 would be OK? I am playing mainly indie rock CDs from an Arcam CD5 using an Arcam SA-20 amp in a small/medium sized room. Thank you so much.
For your music selection I would suggest you to try Dynaudio Emit 10 or 20.
@@Tharbamar Many thanks for your suggestion.
Thank you for the great review. Appreciate the honest review. I'm considering these speakers but am concerned about you mentioning that they "bottom out" or distort at high volumes. I vaguely recall you saying something similar about the LS50s. Do you think this is a common issue in general for these KEF standmount speakers? How likely is someone to encounter this issue. Is this distortion evident just at excessive listening levels?
No distortion in average listening levels, mostly they sound good but they don’t like it when you play them hard, you’ll have to use towers in KEF R series for that purpose, thanks
@@Tharbamar thank you for the reply. Just a last question. What volume level do you consider "hard"? Does that happen with all your amplifiers at that volume? Thanks.
I assume you are talking about the bass drivers bottoming out at high levels. Would a setup with a sub crossed at 80-100hz alleviate this? I believe you said you tried them with a sub as well.
I was wondering if the KEF Q11 might be on your list ? I really think it should be be and would make a great review based on the quality and price 👍
Great suggestion! Thanks
How do they compare to those beautiful red Night 1’s? They catch your eye.
I enjoy K1 more, thanks
Interesting that in room measurements show a broad emphasis on around 300Hz
How does it compare to Musician Knight 1? Which is better, and why? Thanks.
Finished the video and you had said that low level listening goes to Knight 1. But overall, which do you pick overall?
I will give R3 Meta to my brother as a birthday gift next year and keep the Knight 1 for now.
Appreciate the honest review.
How do the KEF R3 Meta compare to the Wharfedale Elysian 2 you have reviewed? Are the Elysians worth spending more €1.5K more?
Also can you review the Wharfedale Aura 2 and the Arendal 1723 Monitor S THX? And compare these 4 speakers?
Thank you.
I would if they send me samples, thanks
Given the fact that R2R works better with the R3 Meta than the Loxjie, will those speakers work better with a D400 EX dac, than with an ESS ? (I like midrange, i don't like r2r 😅)
These vs musician knight? What are your thoughts please? Thank you sir.
I auditioned these with Audiolab 7000A and I loved the sound. Compared to Linton 85s in a A/B test, Lintons sounded terrible and nothing special + tiring. I can listen to R3 Metas for hours.
Please compare to YAMAHA NS lineup..
Really good review (as always). The white entertainment stand is exactly what I'm looking for. Who makes it? thanks
Hi Thanks, built-in stand is custom made.
Thanks for the reply - it looks great.
Great review, thanks! Do you think the R3 Meta is a better speaker then the Bowers & Wilkins 603 S2 Anniversary Edition you reviewed earlier? I can get the B&W for 1000 EUR second hand or the metas for 1500 EUR new. Thanks!
Great review Thar. I was a little taken back about 300 watt in 4ohms needed to ideally drive these. Is that the same recommendation with your knight 1 and R11? Isn’t the e4000 and sx11 under 300 watts. Just trying to understand your logic. I do understand how more power can always be a benefit, but didn’t think it was needed on the speakers in your collection. Thanks again!
Hi Tharbamar thanks for yours reviews. I really enjoy your content. About Kef r3 Meta. In this Price Point, If is by your ears, do you prefer KLH Model 5 o Kef r3 Meta
Hi, R3 Meta is great but I would go for Model 5 if I have to choose one, thanks
Hello is Kef good? Have the Q750 and enjoy them, but I’m no audiophile at all
Can you make please a review with the Monitor Audio Platinum 100 3G?
In your opinion, what would be the ideal room size for the Kef R 3 Meta model?
Hi,
Were your measurements done after the speakers burn in or out of the box?
Do you see it in measurement since you said they sound "muddy" and "congested"?
Anyone planning on pushing the volume of a bookshelf beyond 90db very well knows they need a subwoofer with a 40-60hz HPF... if not shame on them lol. I just wish more Pre-amp's and integrated amps were equipped with bass management.
What’s your point? oh I see you just assume I don’t know, the truth is there are many stand mount speakers can push above 100db,
Then why would they rated for 110db max output on white paper?
@Tharbamar I agree and liked your review, the comment was not aimed at you. I meant in general a 6 1/2 can only move so much air. Most people should have common sense crossover a 6 1/2" bookshelf if they plan on listening to 90db+ volume. IMO it's not the speakers fault, it has its limitation.
Most people have no idea, all they see is the numbers that’s why real world data and honest reporting is the key for the reviews.
Jesus dude you need to take that chip off your shoulder. @@Tharbamar
Thank you!
You bet!
How dos compare to your red speakers?
Thank you for your review. Can I ask where did you get your white speaker stands from please? They look great with the blue Kefs 👍
Stable and Stylish Q Acoustics Concept Speaker Stand
th-cam.com/video/Co23KVm9nBY/w-d-xo.html
Would you take this over the Dali epicon bookshelf? Thanks for the review
that is a huge difference is build and cost. What I can say, I have these and even in the blue. Very well made. I also have Dynaudio specials 40"s
The Kef is on a higher level. But the Dali might take a leap as it should for the cost.
I am using a Rega Aethos to power them. My Dac is Gold Note. Awesome sound. My next large speaker purchase will be Devore Super 9
Thank you sir for feedback
@@jasonme3557hi! So kef sounds better than dynaudio special 40?
Thanks for this demo. How about 70 watts @8 ohm moving to 100 watts @4 ohm for listening between 60-70db? Would that be enough amplification? I am about to pair these speakers with Marantz 40n.
Can you do a comparison between Model 3 and R3 meta?
No plans at this moment.
What are the gold isolation feet you have under your amps? They look awesome
Was waiting for this review, so I have a r7 non meta . Thinking to move to r3 meta . Is it going to be a good upgrade or no ?
My room is small to medium only . So bookshelf is good size wise . Please advise
I had before R700 and change to R 300 about 6y. ago .
Very happy with the R 300 , R700 where just too big to my room .
Can you make a review for Dali epicon 2 ?
No plans at this time.
Hi sir
What are the best bookshelf speakers you've ever heard?
Hi, there is no such a thing as best speaker, all case by case and personal preference.
Some of my favorites are Joseph Audio Pulser 2, Sonus Faber Extrema etc.,
@@Tharbamar Those two have a little bit of extra treble sparkle in frequency response? I'd love to try some of those interesting designs, but many cost $$$.
Trying to decide between these meta R3 or Martin Logan xt b100 motion. Primarily for movies. Can you offer any insight or thoughts on this?
What did you pick?
Do you think the nad m10 v2 would be a good option for this r3? Thanks
Hiya. How o they compare to the r7 meta? I can't make up mind witch one to buy.
had kef r3(non meta) for 2months, as much as i wanted the gave them a chance because everybody was praise them, i couldn't. 1) harsh, my ears were bleeding after only 20 minutes of listening, because of their metallic tweeter 2) incoherent, for whatever reason they felt disconnected, not engaging 3) because of their narrow dispersion (coaxial) they have a deep soundstage, and because i was limited to pull them more than 40cm from the front wall, the sound gave me the impression it's coming from behind the wall, this was causing my brain going crazy
Maybe not due to the metal tweeter but frequency response in the tweeter's range. There are many metal tweeters that don't sound "metallic"
Hi,i need your advise.
I want to buy an integrated amp Accuphase and i dont know wich one.
I got 2 options for my budget.
E 280 or E 350 !???
Thank you!
I would choose E350, thanks
@@Tharbamar
I got Accuphase E 370.
I like what you do and thank you for helping us to choose the right stuff
I want one but prices is so high
Hello Tharbamar. What you think is better speaker for me. Kef r3 meta or css criton 1 td-x with superior version. I have medium room. And my amp is Denon AVc 3700h. It has about 100w for channel.
Please go with R3 Meta, another great choice would be KLH Model 3, thanks
Hello, Thabamar!
Please advise me of good bookshelf acoustics to listen to in the evening at a low amplifier volume. jazz, vocals, classical. Budget from 1000 to 2000$
Tharbamar, what ever mic's you are using, their rolled off somewhere in your chain. Love your reviews. Can't believe you don't correct it. A-hole's save the "get the wax out of your ears" fan boy comments. This is now becoming comical.
I listened to these in a shop demo, they sounded very good . I walked away with the Atc scm 11s .
can you review hivi swans speaker like d200 and m300 mkii please ?
Burn-in takes only 50 hrs? Really short time compared to B&W 706 S2 (about 300hrs).
Excellent detailed review, all your critiques are audible in the test track. This speaker is imo overblown by some other reviewers, but your critique explains well why it is not particularly engaging to my ears. 'Lack of separation in the upper mids' is a genius insight and one that one would not normally expect from KEF.
Kef r3 meta, 706 s2, Martin logan motion 35 xti. What is better?
Hi I got r3 meta combo with atoll in200se with the AKM dac. Initially i was happy but at some poit i have realized that the amp is pushing the mids and especially the highs more than the bass. At low to normal volume 60db rhe highs are fine but the basa is very weak...if i push the volume to extract the bass the highs are getting slightly agressive for my liking. Changed the cables to mogami w3104 which helped but havent resolved the issue. Now i wonder if adding rel t5x to push the low end very slightly will level my sound and allow me to enjoy those low to normal 60-75db levels or maybe try EQ reducing the 2khz and up register with few db...is the bass idea just putting money at the wrong place?
Adding sub would be easier choice but I would look into something like Eversolo DMP-A6 streaming DAC to tune with PEQ, th-cam.com/video/pokEBmWlVIA/w-d-xo.html
Thanks for the reply. I have wiim pro so I will try with it first. Are you saying that wiim EQ wont be as good as A6 EQ quality. If i am going to buy new player or sub won't the sub be better investment overall?
@@Alextraz I’m talking about PEQ not regular EQ but regular EQ should work, see my full reviews of them here.
WiiM Pro Music Streamer Could Be "The Product Of The Year"
th-cam.com/video/UxKkOWiy1NY/w-d-xo.html
EverSolo DMP-A6 Streaming DAC Review
th-cam.com/video/pokEBmWlVIA/w-d-xo.html
Much appreciated sir!
You have strange prices in your home country apparently. In Germany the KEF R11 (non-meta) cost twice as much as the r3 meta. No idea why they would cost the same.
No strange at all it’s call dumping excess inventory, Yes none Meta R11 can be had same price or less than R3 meta in the USA 🇺🇸
@@Tharbamar We do have that too in Europe of course but kef r11 are still nowhere near 1000€. Now I'm envious :)
I would still prefer a KLH Model 5 over the KEF R3 Meta. If you still have the Model 5s, why not compare the KEF R3 to the Model 5s. The KEF doesn't envelope the listener and sounds a bit cold.. The Knights or the Burchardts as well are all warmer.
I am looking forward to the DAC reviews you spoke about.
Pretty sure he doesn’t have that anymore.
Kef sounds stuffed to me
Como se llama la cancion del min 17.
The treble of these Kefs sounds like a old Classe D amplifier.
It sounds dry, harsh and mechanical.
It's not my cup of tea.😊
Many audiophiles love their muddy sounds speakers .
THEY NEED A THOUSAND HOURS BREAK IN !!
That's right .
The longer I listen to KEF's the more and more I love their 3D holographic sound .
Doesn't matter to me with the thin bass.
I have a Sunfire sub!
Bass is depends on size of your room, it may work better in your room.
id buy it if it less than 1000
2200, sounds great nonetheless
Great song not sade who is this??
I don't like KEF sound. I had the Q300 then the R300 and sold them. Not my cup of tea. Now i listening to speakers with paper mid range driver. Sounds much better to my ears.
Even in the shows they sound rubbish pretty compelling here 👌🏾✌🏾
Which speakers are you listening to?
@@higobatman buchardt s400 mkii a700 😃
@@andrefortune8278 I Recommend Revival Atalante 3 and ATC SCM19 V2.
What a bullshit is this😂