Great videos Mr. Knight. I am currently using my way through a bottle of Kodak Polymax T Fixer that was originally purchased in the 1990's, and it is working excellently. Every batch I mix I perform a strip test before committing, and so far so good. I started with a quart and am done to about 1/3 of that, I've been using 150 ml daily, so will soon be finished, then onto the next old stock...
The solid form of fixer (powder) ought to be stable indefinitely if kept in a dry, sealed container. It is essentially sodium thiosulphate or ammonium thiosulphate plus some mildly acidic additives such as bisulphite salts. The ammonium salt is faster acting and smells slightly of ammonia.
I clip the B&W film leaders, and keep them for doing fixer clearing tests. My working solution kept in a plastic bottle does tend to smell of rotten eggs after some of the silver deposits onto the inside of the bottle. Also sediment tends to build up inside. I have filtered and re-bottled and continued to use it as long as the clearing time doesn't exceed 5 minutes. My rule is fix film for double the clearing time. Ilford Rapid Fixer seems to last for ever. I keep developers in dark glass bottles and remove the air with the Vacu-Vin system. Even working solutions last for ages using this method.
@@AzrielKnight My only test for a good dev is whether or not it has oxidized and started to go brown. If it's clear, I use it. I have a bottle of perceptol working solution that is about 6 months old, and is still fine. I don't know of a more technical test I'm afraid. Please send some of your cold weather to us poor folks in Queensland, Australiia.
@1:40 - just to clarify: did you just dip unexposed & undeveloped film into the fixer, and then it should clear all the (undeveloped) silver halides from the film and be clear acetate? @3:44 that’s you dipping the film into the fixer right? Would a densitometer test be best to test how much it cleared?
@1:40 I put exposed, as in exposed to the room light, & undeveloped strips in fixer, everything shoudl have cleared. @3:44 Yes, and yes, if the one I had was calibrated. Great idea though.
Kodak Fixer (the powder) is a basic thiosulfate fixer with nothing in the package to go bad so long as it stays dry, so your. results are not surprising. Rapid fixers in liquid form have components which can oxidize with age, so expiration date is meaningful, particularly if partly used.
I must say that Ilford Rapid fixer can turn weird when it gets old. I've had some that plated the inside of a plastic bottle with silver when it went bad. And there was no way of removing the stuff. It also had plenty of "fishies" swimming in it. When it starts going bad it develops that strong rotten egg smell, but it will still fix film really fast. When I do a fixer test, I use a piece of film leader, dip it partway for a few seconds and then fully dunk it in. When the line from the first dip disappears, I know the negative is fully cleared. It's usually recommended to fix for double the clearing time no matter the type of fixer. So far, I've pushed chemistry beyond what's recommended on multiple occasions and never really had any problems with it.
I have 5 bricks of Seattle Film Works film in the fridge and wonder if you have ever experimented with SFX development, it's suppose to work in standard C41 process.
It is/was a movie negative film in the same general class as the current Kodak Vision 3 films. probably a ECN-2 process. SFW captured the processing (I think sold it with the film) because of the need to remove the anti-halation coating during processing. Subject to remjet removal, processing in C-41 is quite possible, if not necessarily optimal. That's the basis for the Cinestill color films. SFW film would now be so old that normal refrigeration may not have been enough to save it, but a test roll or two.... (Went to college with the two guys who started SFW. One turned to drugs, then the Hari Krishnas, who muscled into the business, which then went to hell. It's one of those never-told stories which would make a great movie.)
Good job on this experiment. One test I've really been wanting to do is to develop color film a lower room temperature and also la higher temperature and the recommended 102 degrees. I'm very curious how temperature deviation will affect color film developing or if it's as critical as they say it is.
And apparently the temperature actually varies depending on what chemistry you use. The Fuji chemicals I recently tried actually called for ~100F (37.8C), and not the more commonly discussed 102-103F.
Careful with the fixer. A friend of mine had done a ton of darkroom work back in the day (for the newspaper lab), but there the speed was imperative. So she never (by my experience) left her prints in the fixer bath long enough. Yet now she called me, after 25 years, telling me that all her personal prints are almost gone, despite the fact that they where stored in the dark...
Great video! Since we're talking about fixers, I'd like to see what happens to a print (over time) when you use exhausted fixer. Thanks for all your work :)
@@AzrielKnight Once you are over the costs of acquiring an inventory of chemical stocks, the components of the various formulas, plus larger graduates, mixing beakers, and a lab grade scale and a magnetic stirrer like yours there, the only further cost is the time it takes to mix up whatever you need. Having your solutions fresh and not waiting for Amazon or Freestyle to ship an order is a faIr trade.
So was the result of expired fixer on film? It turns more purple? If you could explain a little more in detail that would be very helpful. Thanks in advance!
Hey, thanks for the question. The simplest way I can put it is if the negative isn't as clear, the scanner will have to compensate and detail will be lost. Fixing removes the unused parts of the negative.
Depends. Powder you are prob okay. Liquid tends to separate. I always add a clip to a separate jar and see how long it takes. Then a good rule is double that time for your film.
I have had good success re-fixing films, it is easy to do, though a bit awkward drying cut strips versus simply hanging a full strip. There is no need to re-process in the dark, and in fact you will want to keep an eye on the progress and stop when cleared sufficiently, if you leave it too long the effect will be reduced density in the negative. Try it, it works, and you've nothing to lose.
Re-Fix it with fresh fixer. Do it in the light and stop when sufficiently cleared. Over-fixing will reduce density in the negative, so keep an eye on the progress as only your eye can tell you how much time the repair fix requires. After re-fixing, wash, rinse, dry as usual. Happy printing.
Ilford Hypam works great with prints and film! I love it and used to use powders.
Great videos Mr. Knight.
I am currently using my way through a bottle of Kodak Polymax T Fixer that was originally purchased in the 1990's, and it is working excellently. Every batch I mix I perform a strip test before committing, and so far so good. I started with a quart and am done to about 1/3 of that, I've been using 150 ml daily, so will soon be finished, then onto the next old stock...
The solid form of fixer (powder) ought to be stable indefinitely if kept in a dry, sealed container. It is essentially sodium thiosulphate or ammonium thiosulphate plus some mildly acidic additives such as bisulphite salts. The ammonium salt is faster acting and smells slightly of ammonia.
This pack was neither dry nor sealed and it did fine, I guess it's even more stable than people expected.
@@AzrielKnight Good to know. The sodium salt is probably slightly more stable than the ammonium salt. Good video, BTW.
I clip the B&W film leaders, and keep them for doing fixer clearing tests. My working solution kept in a plastic bottle does tend to smell of rotten eggs after some of the silver deposits onto the inside of the bottle. Also sediment tends to build up inside. I have filtered and re-bottled and continued to use it as long as the clearing time doesn't exceed 5 minutes. My rule is fix film for double the clearing time. Ilford Rapid Fixer seems to last for ever. I keep developers in dark glass bottles and remove the air with the Vacu-Vin system. Even working solutions last for ages using this method.
Thanks for the tip about Vacu-Vin. How do you test your developers to make sure they are still good?
@@AzrielKnight My only test for a good dev is whether or not it has oxidized and started to go brown. If it's clear, I use it. I have a bottle of perceptol working solution that is about 6 months old, and is still fine. I don't know of a more technical test I'm afraid. Please send some of your cold weather to us poor folks in Queensland, Australiia.
@1:40 - just to clarify: did you just dip unexposed & undeveloped film into the fixer, and then it should clear all the (undeveloped) silver halides from the film and be clear acetate?
@3:44 that’s you dipping the film into the fixer right? Would a densitometer test be best to test how much it cleared?
@1:40 I put exposed, as in exposed to the room light, & undeveloped strips in fixer, everything shoudl have cleared.
@3:44 Yes, and yes, if the one I had was calibrated. Great idea though.
Kodak Fixer (the powder) is a basic thiosulfate fixer with nothing in the package to go bad so long as it stays dry, so your. results are not surprising. Rapid fixers in liquid form have components which can oxidize with age, so expiration date is meaningful, particularly if partly used.
I must say that Ilford Rapid fixer can turn weird when it gets old. I've had some that plated the inside of a plastic bottle with silver when it went bad. And there was no way of removing the stuff. It also had plenty of "fishies" swimming in it. When it starts going bad it develops that strong rotten egg smell, but it will still fix film really fast. When I do a fixer test, I use a piece of film leader, dip it partway for a few seconds and then fully dunk it in. When the line from the first dip disappears, I know the negative is fully cleared. It's usually recommended to fix for double the clearing time no matter the type of fixer. So far, I've pushed chemistry beyond what's recommended on multiple occasions and never really had any problems with it.
Thanks for the tips and good to know :)
I've got a couple packs of the Kodak powder fixer I've been hanging on to. Suppose now I best mix them up and try them! Thanks for the awesome test!
Glad I could help!
Powder is good as long it is kept dry
my pack got wet and it was still good! Got lucky I guess :)
@@AzrielKnight one of mine has similar stains on it, so let's hope I'm as lucky (fingers crossed)!
Great thing about testing fixer is you can use very little film and time to do it.
Good video. Good living through modern chemistry!
I have 5 bricks of Seattle Film Works film in the fridge and wonder if you have ever experimented with SFX development, it's suppose to work in standard C41 process.
It is/was a movie negative film in the same general class as the current Kodak Vision 3 films. probably a ECN-2 process. SFW captured the processing (I think sold it with the film) because of the need to remove the anti-halation coating during processing. Subject to remjet removal, processing in C-41 is quite possible, if not necessarily optimal. That's the basis for the Cinestill color films. SFW film would now be so old that normal refrigeration may not have been enough to save it, but a test roll or two.... (Went to college with the two guys who started SFW. One turned to drugs, then the Hari Krishnas, who muscled into the business, which then went to hell. It's one of those never-told stories which would make a great movie.)
Interesting results Azriel! Never found expired fixer. For fresh fixer I go with Ilford as well
Thanks Rob!
Good job on this experiment. One test I've really been wanting to do is to develop color film a lower room temperature and also la higher temperature and the recommended 102 degrees. I'm very curious how temperature deviation will affect color film developing or if it's as critical as they say it is.
I have wondered that too and deving at different temps is on my list.
And apparently the temperature actually varies depending on what chemistry you use. The Fuji chemicals I recently tried actually called for ~100F (37.8C), and not the more commonly discussed 102-103F.
@@derekkonigsberg2047 interesting, thanks for that detail
Powder is the only one I would ever trust. I dig the intro.
Thanks :)
Careful with the fixer. A friend of mine had done a ton of darkroom work back in the day (for the newspaper lab), but there the speed was imperative. So she never (by my experience) left her prints in the fixer bath long enough. Yet now she called me, after 25 years, telling me that all her personal prints are almost gone, despite the fact that they where stored in the dark...
Thanks for the tip. The fixer did exhaust pretty quick.
A few weeks ago, A friend gave me a 5l rapid fixer from ilford, and it's expired too, I'll try to do the same!
Hopefully yours works better :)
@@AzrielKnight I don't know haha, when I opened the carafe it had some rare stuff on the walls and didn't try it yet!
how about developing film in a print developer?
I did that on instagram the other day, Dektol.
You wouldn't be happy with the results, but first answer the question: WHY?
@@randallstewart175 That's why it's just n experiment
Great video! Since we're talking about fixers, I'd like to see what happens to a print (over time) when you use exhausted fixer. Thanks for all your work :)
Good idea. a video like that make take some time though :)
hy brother
i hope you can make a videos enlarging with expired paper, developer, and fixer vs all fresh
thanks
Could try reloading a 110 or 126 cartridge with fresh film?
Interesting idea. I wonder if its been tried before.
I hear talk of fixing with sea water, but perhaps that is an old wives tale. Maybe one day the Darkroom knight will shine a red light on this issue :)
I'm not very close to the sea :(
@@AzrielKnight haha that's ok :)
Interesting experiment. Nowadays, I mix all my own formulas from scratch to keep everything as fresh as possible.
I hear it's a money saver too!
@@AzrielKnight Once you are over the costs of acquiring an inventory of chemical stocks, the components of the various formulas, plus larger graduates, mixing beakers, and a lab grade scale and a magnetic stirrer like yours there, the only further cost is the time it takes to mix up whatever you need. Having your solutions fresh and not waiting for Amazon or Freestyle to ship an order is a faIr trade.
I did never care about the temperature of the fixer :D
In this case I cared more for mixing, than using.
Why do you prefer Ilford rapid fix for film? What about it makes it stand apart?
If I am doing a single roll of 35mm. I can completely clean my negatives, spot free with no hypo clear or photo flo, with less than 1 Litre of water.
@@AzrielKnight ok, very good to know, thank you!
Welcome back
Thanks, not sure if this is the first episode you saw but I have several episodes made.
So was the result of expired fixer on film? It turns more purple? If you could explain a little more in detail that would be very helpful. Thanks in advance!
Hey, thanks for the question. The simplest way I can put it is if the negative isn't as clear, the scanner will have to compensate and detail will be lost. Fixing removes the unused parts of the negative.
Redo the test...clearly the results were a fix! 😊😉😋
lol, fuck, you know when I got the notification it just showed "Redo the test...clearly..." and I was like, "oh, here we go"
what happen if i develop a film with a expired fixer???
Depends. Powder you are prob okay. Liquid tends to separate. I always add a clip to a separate jar and see how long it takes. Then a good rule is double that time for your film.
I have had good success re-fixing films, it is easy to do, though a bit awkward drying cut strips versus simply hanging a full strip. There is no need to re-process in the dark, and in fact you will want to keep an eye on the progress and stop when cleared sufficiently, if you leave it too long the effect will be reduced density in the negative. Try it, it works, and you've nothing to lose.
Re-Fix it with fresh fixer. Do it in the light and stop when sufficiently cleared. Over-fixing will reduce density in the negative, so keep an eye on the progress as only your eye can tell you how much time the repair fix requires. After re-fixing, wash, rinse, dry as usual. Happy printing.
You fixed it again.
I did?
Speaking of long intros!