Russian Immigrants in Serbia: Integration or Isolation?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ต.ค. 2024
- Hi! I’ve come across a few TH-cam videos suggesting that Russians don’t integrate into Serbian society. This viewpoint intrigued me because I had similar feelings. To find out if this is really the case, I interviewed several Russian immigrants in Belgrade. We discussed their integration experiences and their thoughts on the matter. I hope you enjoy this video.
If you liked this video, please share it and subscribe to my channel. On my channel, I share my journey as a Russian emigrant who left Russia in 2022.
It is too early for integration my friend. I am Serb and I know that because of experience of many former Russian generations. 1871 -1878 ; 1917 - 1924 ; 1945 - 1956 ; 2022 - ...........
Perhaps you are right, and this is a very accurate remark.
@@StepansOdysseyRussia is big, you have difference between different regions. I worked in Moscow 97-98, 2012-2013 and experienced it, speaking language, usually end up with Ukrainans or Russians from the south. Peter and Moscow are way more metropolitan/urban than Belgrade. Belgrade doesn't have much to offer that is not repetitive like going out, drink, eat, ... rinse repeat. Very poor cultural offer for 2 million big city.
@@martstam2016You literally can't see everything in belgrade in less than 5 years. If you find yourself bored, its your problem.
@@draganraus1976 like what? Enlighten me? Opera hose, Ballet, recital? Metro?
@@martstam2016 we have an opera house, a ballet house. We dont have a metro, but I dont see how that relates to how much fun you can have in a city.
I know few Russians who try to learn Serbian language and I respect that a lot. I'd usually talk slow to them and help them out and motivate them to keep integrating. I know they came running from the war and I have a lots of sympathy.
Unpleasent truth is that the ones who don't integrate will be isolated and we'll eventually hate them for that. (we don't like having a country within a country). If willing to stay, use our welcoming nature and be our friends, step outside of telegram groups, there's more to see here.
Yea I find Serbia pretty easy to integrate in, as long as you're willing to learn the language. You'll automatically be elevated in the eyes of the Serbs compared to other foreigners and they'll introduce you to their friends. Even if your Serbian skills are somewhat basic, all of a sudden they'll start having deep personal conversations with you in English. And once they find out you listen to Djani and Sinan Sakic, your integration will be complete.
As a Serbian immigrant in another European country, with not so many Serbians, I find it very odd that an immigrant (no matter how long they're planning to stay) can say "There's no need to integrate" with a serious look on their face. That's what the third guy said, more or less. Don't people like him have enough self-awareness to understand that this makes them come across as arrogant and ungrateful?
As a fellow immigrant, I know that learning the local language, customs, and culture (to the best of your capacity) is essential, especially if you know you'll stay at least a year and most of these people will stay until they're welcome in the EU. It's not enough to simply pay taxes and bills. This new country gave you a place to live, safety, a job, a visa, and stability. None of us foreigners are entitled to any of these, regardless of the situation in our birth countries.
Also, it's rude to expect locals will accommodate you and speak in English when you go to a store or market.
But I guess I'd see people like the third interviewee in a more positive light if they didn't sound so entitled and like they're only milking their "adopted" country. I don't see why they would behave any differently when they move to their final destination, which is the EU in most cases.
Absolutely agree.
Spot on. I live in the UK and as a Serb who came to the UK at the height of the bombing campaign against Serbia, I managed to integrate.
I find it almost unbelievable that Russians, who are loved in Serbia, find it difficult to integrate.
They should try doing that in England, Russians here had horrific time when things around Ukraine started.
Most russians that have come to serbia that i see are families with children, they are extremely introverted, dont want to integrate, dont even want to talk to anyone unless its necessary. I have seen many times serbian people showing curiosity, and trying to start a conversation with russians, but the reaction is always like "whoaa, why are you trying to talk to me? Who are you, i dont know you,, why are you asking me things?" . I have no idea why is this the case.
Because Serbs and Russians are completely different ! Stories about similarity are state propaganda ! Russians are more similar to the Dutch than to the Serbs ! Cold, closed, distrustful, distant ! Everything the opposite of what Serbs are !
Significantly different mentality
Its typical northern vs southern mentality.Also integration is a process,needs time.What is generally always slowing down any integration anywhere in the world is when you have your own community so bassically there is no real need to fully integrate.
Xaxaxa I told to other Serbs that ruzzians is not my brothers and every looking me strange
@@brothabox6998 yeah, with that face nobody is
Answer is simple. If you young, extravert with desire for new contact, alone, with existential necessity to work with local people integration is simple. If you in middle-older age, married, economicaly independent of local society, widh introvert style of life it is problem. This is true for all nations. Serbs are ready to accept you.
Everybody should feel welcomed and relaxed in Serbia. Integration is a process, sometimes it's quick, sometimes not, but the most important thing is that I can guarantee that eventually all the Russians who decide to stay in Serbia will somehow integrate. They will find local frends, start speaking Serbian, and put some russian flavour to our culture which is great thing for both sides...
Thank you for your kind words!
I agree and you should definitely feel like you are home. Eventually, more and more Russians will realize, that they can be relaxed here!
@@msy7906I have been shouted too and I live hear from my childhood and am Serbian.
@@msy7906I am sorry to hear that you went through that. Of course it is not normal and it is an embarrassment for Serbia as a whole. Serbia has a long way to go/improve but hopefully it is going in the right direction. I think the point the other person was trying to make is that you aren't getting that treatment because you're Russian (on the contrary, they're treating you as a local!). Joking aside, overwhelmingly Serbs see Russians in a positive light and welcome their integration/positive influence on society/culture. This is not a new thing, it has happened before during the Bolshevik revolution (the white Russians did a lot for Serbia then) and probably even much earlier before that (as the cultural ties/similarities are evident).
@@msy7906 absolutely not. It is unacceptable. You should have called a police. There are jerks in every country. Unstable Political and economical situation did influence people here, these years, unfortunately. But you know what? Nevertheless most persons are friendly and civilized I have had similar experience in other EU countries. And in Russia too. But If you feel so bad about certain country you shouldn’t live in it. Moving would be the best option. Regards
sometimes for exalple when we (my girlfriend, or me) said “dobar dan” or “doviđenja” to our russian ex neighbours they look at us shocked, suspicious, offended even and I dont seem to grasp why that may be, but it is so confusing to us, and that probably contributes to people perceiving them as arrogant or cold, but when russians do open up and smile once in a while and even learn some phrases in serbian I believe they are wholeheartedly accepted by the serbs.
Everything said, our current russian neighbours are great and polite people and we met some russians who even put effort into learning some language which we really appreciate and they seem to do really well here…
I have immigrated to Serbia and am learning Serbian. It's not as easy as I thought because of the lack of learning materials. Additionally, for me and a number of other Russian immigrants, I don't know English well enough, which is why I have to learn both languages in parallel. It makes it difficult to integrate with the Serbian community. Anyway, i strive to get part of the community
Its normal to feel lonely in foreign country. Only time will resolve that feeling, you will build your life again, day by day don't worry about it. Just be patient and work. Also, Belgrade is big city, day is short, maybe in a smaller cities you guys would blend in quicker.. Good mannered people are welcome here. Good luck
Thank you 😊
GREETINGS FROM AUSTRALIA. We all experience the same things . Here in Australia Russians and Serbians have respect for each other.
@@alexanderaleksandar2030 Absolutely 💯 ❤️ 👌
Hello! Yes, we are very close in culture and mentality.
@@StepansOdysseyI don’t agree. We are quite differente. While you are closer to Nordic people, we are closer to Mediterian people. I don’t find any similarity except religion.
@@KARADJORDJIJEод грка???
@kdexter2690 I don't think that you understood what rbis is about. And it has nothing to with you.
My grandfather was Russian and I adore Russian culture, literature and people. I am sorry to say that Russians that I have encountered are very introverted and private.
Based on your view of Russians, it seems that in 2-3 generations you have "over-integrated" and become too Serbian ;)
Moramo malo i da se salimo
Thank you for this video… I am from Serbia and my sister is with wonderful young man from Russia. I see him struggling with status, papers and work with no real security, alone in a foreign country where people haven’t been so welcoming as they claim to be. I also heard those comments about prices going up and that Russians are guilty for everything, where the only blame is on Serbians who wanted to take advantage of these people having no place to go and being stuck here in search of refuge. It makes me sad that this is what our society is after being degrading for decades. On the other hand I know that there are still polite and normal people that like to see what someone from another culture can bring and feel excited for that. Me personally love the small places and restaurants that were opened by Russians always with style, high quality food and good service. Sloj bakery is one of my favorite places and their medovik cake. I also see that you guys are very committed and hard working which is amazing. I hope you will find a way to connect and feel like in a home away from home.
Interesting fact : This is not the first time for Russians to came to Serbia. "Belogardejci"(White Guard soliders) came to Serbia from Russia in years after WW1 . In Sremski Karlovci is a monument of Peter Vrangel (Black Baron) one of the members of White Guard. So you are White Guard 2.0 now 😊.
You have monument of Vrangel? Wow 😮
The "Russian Protective Corps" is an interesting historical sidenote from that wave of Russian immigration.
Ovi nemaju veze sa Vrangelom,došli su ovde jer ,ne mogu nigde drugo sem u neke,Azijske vukojebine.Imamo ih masu u našem kraju,za 2 godine ,ni dobar dan da kažu.90 pošto su budzovanska,deca pobegli od rata i ovde se bahate,pijani su kao klenovii svaki drugi dan.
@@StepansOdysseyVrangel is buried in serbia
@@StepansOdyssey th-cam.com/video/-nQOYttoZXE/w-d-xo.html
To me, that Russian need for isolation is very strange...
Cubans, Spaniards, Canadians, Americans, all integrate, at least to some extent, but Russians do not
It's not so strange when you realize what KIND of russians we got coming here and why they are here.
@@chickenlover657 Well, another KIND are destroying Ukraine and their own country for money. I would not recommend you to let that kind into your own country. But - it is up to you.
@@chickenlover657 So what kind are we?
@@dimitryrusu4022 The kind that ran away. And we all know what those are called.
@@chickenlover657 I don't care about your opinion, I live according to my ideas of what is right
Not a single russian in Novi Sad want to even try to speak serbian , they basically want me as a waiter to speak russian... They even get offended if i dont understand them...
And you spoke with all of them? I live in Belgrade and have 2 Russian friends in Novi Sad who started learning Serbian right from the start. When we are in restaurants they order in Serbian. So don't speak BS, please.
@@LayllasLocker its really a miserably low percentage of them wanting to speak ... They will live separately from us locals it seems
@@boris_just_ na zalost ali tako je
Ali naprimer ja sam u Novom Sadu i počeo sam da pričam Srpskim od prvog dana (3 mes pre). Dakle možemo da govorim da to nije sasvim istina...
Заиста желим да комуницирам са Србима, али видим да их мој ниво језика нервира, а они немају велику жељу да разговарају са мном. Зато се плашим да не будем наметљив... Иако су сви веома дружељубиви, тешко је наћи некога за разговор на дубљим темама (осим због новца којих немам много)
The Russians that have come to Serbia have not come as economic migrants who live on benefits, but are usually highly educated and with decent finances. You have contributed to Serbia's economy and added new knowledge that is often needed.
If you were refugees living on benefits, it would have been logical that people required you to learn Serbian in order to find a job and contribute to society. This is however not the case here. Many Russians work in IT and most Serbs in these industries know perfect English.
The only short-term problem has been that house prices and rents have gone up for many locals. However, this is positive for owners of real estate and it is the government's responsibility to build more and I have not met any Serb who personally blames the Russians.
If you hear some loser online commenting on your poor integration then keep in mind that this is not representative of the population as a whole (the internet is a magnet for assholes).
The positive thing about learning Serbian is that it is easier for you to socialize and feel a stronger community with the local people, but you only do that if you feel like it and nobody in Serbia has any moral right to demand anything from you.
▪️From a Serb living in Sweden surrounded by Serbs who refuse to integrate 😂
Thank you for sharing your point of view! I’m totally agree with you. It’s well noted that these people don’t live on state support and create something new.
“From a Serb living in Sweden surrounded by Serbs who refuse to integrate” - oh man, I’m sure that you understand what I’m talking about, like nobody 😄
I really don’t think that prices have gone up so much just because of Russians. Prices have gone up everywhere in Europe, in neighboring zagreb people are complaining about the prices increasing too. In Prague the government is being pressured to change things because prices in the center are now 6,000-8,000 per square meter.
Prices are going up in Serbia because it’s the only thing people invest in after they make a certain amount of money, it’s the same in lots of other countries in Europe. They would have gone up with or without the Russians that came.
@@nikolasirovica3250 Zagreb, not, zagreb. Totally by accident, I' m shure. .....
@@valmontv that was a typo. I’m half Croatian half Serbian and split my time between both cities, so I know what I’m talking about. In Zagreb prices have gone up just like in Belgrade, and there was no massive influx of Russians in Zagreb, so it’s obvious the factors that are driving up prices in Belgrade don’t have anything to do with Russians coming. It’s just a global trend right now, rising real estate prices. In Russia prices for real estate are going up, despite so many Russians leaving. People are just blaming rising prices on Russians because it’s an easy scapegoat. The reality is there’s an investor mafia in cahoots with the local government who are just investing all their capital into real estate because it’s the only investment where you can get somewhat of a return. Its like that in Russia right now, in Serbia and all over Europe.
I have to disagree with you as well. Russinas that came to Serbia came from all kinds of background. From IT sector to simple electrician. I guess that at least 50% of them are not making money working online, but look for job in Serbia.
Those who works in Serbia will integrate into the local society, but those who do not need to work in Serbia will not fit in. What is common to all Russians that came to Serbia, not only from 2022 but also earlier, is the thirst for democracy and the Western way of life. Russians were comming even before the war in Ukraine, but the war pushed a large number of those who were hesitated. They were not comming to Serbia because they love us, because mostly don't know anything about us, but because they don't need a visa and they’ve heard that it's quite easy to get citizenship and a passport. The vast majority of them who came from 2022 will move to one of the EU countries as soon as they get our passports and will try to integrate there, unlike in Serbia, where they never tought to integrate.
I honestly don't see it as a Russian or Serbian thing. I'm an American who came to Serbia 3 years ago and find that if I put effort into reaching out and spending time with Serbians they will respond in kind. Also both Serbs and Russians tend to be reserved at first and most people are busy so recreation actually has to be planned. I immigrated to new countries several times and I can tell you that it's not easy. Your average Serbian has no clue what it's like and the vast majority of Serbs that have immigrated only hang out with other Serbs. This happens with every culture, it's not unique to Russians, in Serbia or elsewhere.
True
learn our language and you wont feel like that, i have great Russian friends who came not so long ago here and im pretty sure they are doing fine, those who know Serbian are doing even better
Yes Russians are pretty much isolated and don't make easy friendships with locals. I am from Novi Sad. Russia's society used to be terrorized for the last 100 years and maybe during their entire history. I made friendship with only one Russian family and they are not typical Russians since they lived and worked all around the world, US, Germany, Cyprus and they are very opened to Serbs. They started to learn Serbian language and that makes difference.
Like we weren't 😆😆 Turks were really lovely towards us, there are different people with different interests and needs, I have friends all over the world but in a town I live currently I didn't make any new close friends because I didn't meet anyone I like, not my type of people and I'm fine with it. I you want to make friends you have to be open and communicate with people, introverts can struggle with that especially if they lived their whole lives in one place with family and friends they knew since they were little kids. Extroverts you can throw them out from an airplane anywhere on the planet and they will make friends fast. I met once a Russian guy in Germany it was instant friendship you Russian, you Serb = friendship.
That is normal. Serbs all over the world stick together as well. That is just how migrating groups survive in the new countries.
So true.I think most Russians still have fear from being "curious and open".
@@OneShadow7fully agree.Why should we push anything.Even in new country you need to established friendship with ppl with whom you share somular interests goals aspirations etc...
And they terrorized others. Like for example, Latvians. So many wealthy and educated Latvians were sent to Siberia.
In WW2 when Germans were pulling back to retrieve they were giving to locals all what they have left, food and kids sweets. When Russians were pulling back, they shit in houses in every corner on dishes.
Now days so many Russians living in Latvia or as we say Letonija, NOT Lithuania, don't speak Latvian language even though mostly of them are born in Latvia.
Other thing is: all Russians who l meet know for country as Serbia but nothing more!!! Once l invited one Russian guy for coffee, answer was: a što, ti pider! Vodku nadu pit. 🙄 l mean, really??!
It takes a while to integrate into a new country and population. Any migrating group stick together. I migrated to Australia from Serbia. If we didn't have a Sebian community to join, life would have been much harder in the beginning.
@@kdexter2690 Australia is pot of mix nationalities. English Australians are becoming more and more minority actually.
Agree but i think fully to integrate in society you need after while to minimize contacts with Serbian community and prioritized making connections with Australians...
@@dankadesign7462 true. Me and my husband joined the handball club when we arived to Australia and made long time friends with people from all over the world including Australians who played with us. Mijority of us were migrants, some were just studying in Australia, but we made our own hub of multicultural friends.
@@gbp4998 yes thats the way
I can imagine that a lot of newcomers are in Serbia only for a short period of time, before they will either return to Russia after the war ends or move on to some EU country. The ones that end up liking it here and stay for longer will surely integrate quite easily. I'm confident in saying this because I have been friends with several Russian people who came in before this last wave and you could hardly tell them apart from a Serb unless you got to know them :)
I know that children love to hang out so maybe parents can connect due to their children playing together. This is situation in Novi Sad. I had a Russian guy asking me to pronounce sentences in Serbian so he learns the pronunciation, and I was happy to help. I think people here are generally willing to help Russians.
Milica this is sooo sweet! Thank you for that!
It really doesn't matter, you're always welcome, regardless of the reason.
The way I figure - what's to integrate? You're home. It's different when you're Malasyan, Chinese, Sub-Saharan African etc - those guys actually need to try, make their way, learn the language etc. When you're Russian, even if you speak only Russian, at least 10% of Serbs speak it. Some will enjoy practicing Russian. More people speak English, but still, imagine if you were Chinese - it's not easy to be Chinese immigrant, anywhere. And it's Slavic language, so eventually you'll get there. On top of it all - all you needa say is "Russian" and every door's open to you.
You're welcome, you can stay all your life, everyone wants you to accept this country as your own, have kids, marry our daughters, there are litarally no barriers. Simply take your time - I hope all of you guys feel that way too.
I felt at home both in Kievo-Pecer lavra and in the Temple of st.Vasilije - how could I not - it's all the same like in every Serbian church. So it should be easy enough for you guys too.
What do you mean, home? They are nowhere near home lol. Both geographically and culturally. Religion is the only common thing in our 2 countries. We are nothing alike
@@Jotgut I can find common things with people who live in Amazonia forest let alone Russians that are slavic people with same religion and so many similarities. Only people who never really experienced the world think within those limitations.
The guy explained it very good - they are in a waiting position. They wait to go home. That means contestant stress which you are sometimes not aware of, where no much energy is left for socialising. Also mentality is different. It is more like Scandinavian, northern mentality than south European, very cautious folk . In addition if you have.a job where you do not depended on local connections or planning to move on…
all Russians and Ukranians are welcome to come and stay in Serbia and one day be citizens😊😊😊
with love from serbia❤❤❤
I am Serbian from Serbia, and with most of our people here I have no desire to be friends with 😂. And it is like that everywhere, you end up with very few friends wherever you live.
If you want to know how expats from Russia feel, read "The Night in Lisbon" by Remarque. Most Russians who have left cannot read this novel without tears. It describes us so accurately that it is even a little scary that humanity does not learn anything and goes in circles...
In November, I have been traveling Russia for a full month and went all the way to Siberia. I learned the Russian language and went there to see our brotherly country, and just how same or different we are.
And I think here lies the answer to why the majority of Russians are not integrating - our cultures are simply too different (the other answer would be, that some are waiting for the war to end, to go home).
On the one side, Serbs have had a drastically different picture of ''Who a Russian is''. We are still traditionally oriented towards the picture that Russians are Orthodox-minded oriented people, that they love tradition, Putin, in general, have religious-traditional approach to life.
In fact, Russians who came have a much different background and interests and when they learn how we imagine a Russian, topped with big differences in our North/South mentality, openness, culture, etc., I think that most Russians choose not to integrate because of that.
You nailed it. I totally agree with your explanation.
I'm not sure that the perception of Russians is the reason why some Russians do not integrate. Rather, there is no need as long as they have remote work.
If you compare Russians from Siberia and Serbs, the difference is enormous! But if you compare a Russian from St. Petersburg, for example, with a Resident of Belgrade or Novi Sad. What difference did you notice?
Your first sentence is what I explained, those who want to go home.
Let me list some the differences in more detail:
1. Closeness/Openess - Russians are much more closed, work oriented, success driven - typical northern mentality.
Serbs are much more open, we can talk for hours and hours on one topic, enjoy spontaneous things, and we smile more.
In Serbia, you will almost never hear 'ви', for young people, while in Russia, its customary in many situations. That speaks on the mentallity boundaries.
2.Women - Maybe the biggest difference of all. Russian women are super different than Russian men. Russian women work more, take care of the whole family, are very active in politics, run businesses, are Godmathers more than men, are more present than men in church. For me as a Serb, this was such a shock!
In Serbia, its completely different. Serbia is still a country run by men. Our women are more traditional then western, but they did not take on a primate of men, as in Russia.
3. Distance - Moscow from Belgrade is the same distance as London from Belgrade. Yes, its that far.
4. Tradition and religion - Serbs hold that Russians are religious and traditional people. To my 'women' shock, I found women way more traditional and interested in family, more present in church, than men. Men showed 100 years away from the women's energy. And I studied many times why this is the case, in the end i understood.
That of course does not mean that Russians are religious. Shockily, Russia is x13 more atheistic than Serbia, without Muslims, how much atheists would there be?
And many many more differences. I was in EKB, city is way more liberal than Moscow. For Russian tho liberalism means politic freedom, for serb, WOKE/LGBT values, etc. etc... 80% of Septemeber's gay parade attendes last year were from Russia, you can check the livestrewam on youtube.
This of course does not mean I have anything against these people, we welcome everyone to our country, anyone is welcome, gay or not. But I am saying on the trend of how vastly Serbian expectations are and that except faith, we are really too different, except Russian women that are more traditional, that's why there are a lot of Serbo-Russian marriages where almost always, women is Russian.
If you are interested to hear further my experiences, I could write until tomorrow... I can give you my TG and we can have a call, if you are interested to hear my perspective.
Russians and Serbs are brothers-period. Слава Богу! But we just need to manage our expectations and understand our differences.
Thank you for such a great comparison and explanation! This is very valuable for me and I am sure for many who watched this video!
In fact, I would do an interview with you, but unfortunately I won’t be able to in the near future. I have a friend who also has a channel on TH-cam and I think he might be interested in this :)
@halfrussian what do you think? That can be interesting interview!
@@askidar267 You find Russian women less traditional and conservative than Serbian women? That's interesting. Not really my experience. I find Russian women more feminine, more open about "the importance of the man providing things/having a good salary", etc. After all, there are many more women in the Serbian parliament and the research institutions than in the Russian ones (and many other across Europe). So this narrative of "Serbian women prefer to stay home" is a myth. As a Dutch friend of mine said about meeting some Russian girls after staying for a long time in Belgrade and Vojvodina: "Wow, they are quite different from Serbian women, somehow very feminine in a traditional way... Serbian girls are more similar even to Dutch girls...".
I agree with other things including atheism etc.
Well I know people (both) the ones with the kids and singles, and what is, let's say odd is that somehow I get the filling that they don`t want to integrate or to be part of this society. For instance, when I am "talking" with the one of my kids friend parents, conversation is usually "yes or no", and when I am communicating with those without the kids, usually the conversation is very limited though we can discuss more (in a lack of a better word). When I am communication with other nations like Italians, Germans, Brits or even with let`s say Norwegians or Swedes (people usually say that the are very quiet and introvert), that is not the case. I don`t understand why is that? All that I can notice is that they live in their community, and they are not trying to expand their group of friends, let`s be honest, most of them live here more than 2 years, and they still haven`t learn even few Serbian words or sentences, words for daily small talk like "hey, how are you" etc... Most of the time, we talk using English language, or waving with our hands like crazy trying to explain something. This is my experience, I can't say that this is the case with everybody.
I was born and raised in the center of Belgrade. Many Russians are here with their small businesses and locals, so as a good neighbor it was important for me to welcome the "brothers". But whenever I tried to start a conversation, the feedback was inappropriate and repulsive. It is so rude in our culture. When you first started coming here we were so excited, and now I hear daily complaints about your behavior. If I come to your house, I will have good manners and try to integrate. With this kind of behavior, you only create a little revulsion in the Serbian people. After several attempts to get close to you, I now bypass you and have the opinion that you are rude and ill-mannered, although I know I shouldn't generalize.
Tacno , ja imam u ulici jednu komšinicu koja je ruskinja , već nekih 20ak godina. Jednostavno ne želi da se "integriše" i to je totalno ok , svi smo različiti. Samo Rusi su generalno takvi , nije to samo jedan slučaj. Deluju kao dovoljni sami sebi , pre 20ak godina kada sam letovala u CG , bilo ih je bas dosta , kao i turista iz ostalih evropskih zemalja . Svi "stranci" osim Rusa delovali su otvoreno, oni su se družili unutar svojih krugova. Tako da nije mi bas jasna poenta videa. Ne integrišu se jer ne žele, po mom misljenju.
@@sanja1907 Upravo to. Ne mozes da sedis u sred centra glavnog grada jedne drzave u koju si pobegao i da se mrstis i odredjujes pravila. Ljudi jednostavno nece da se integrisu, zao mi je sto cu ovo reci, ali kao crnci u sred centra Pariza, hoce nesto svoje i da se sire i nemaju ni gram zelje da urade nesto drugacije. Drze se zajedno i grupisu se, kao migranti. 😃 Meni sada izmedju njih i migranata po Zelenjaku nema razlike. Gledam samo da ih izbegnem.
Pritom ne zaboravimo da ovi sto su dosli nisu ni ugrozeni niti sirotinja, nego su iskoristili priliku da odu kad se vec moze. Tako da tuznu pricu ne mogu da pricaju, jer imaju vise kesa od svih nas. Niti su napaceni, niti ih treba zaliti.
As a Serbian, I have an attitude similar to that guy at 8:25. As long as you have a peaceful life - meaning, no one bothers you and you don't bother others - that's all that matters. If social life is something you need, you will look for it and, I'm sure, find it.
I am a distant person, and I had some reservations toward Russians years ago (because some hooligans left a bad impression on me when they were here for a soccer game), yet now I have several good friends among Russians. If I was willing to get to know some Russians, anyone in Serbia would be. Trust me :D
It takes time. People with children will learn language with kids and their friends. And others with teachers and everyday life.
My boyfriend is Russian and he made a very big progress in Serbian and integration because he has me beside me. And we are everyday speaking Serbian.
First he had a teacher to teach him diffrence and basics.
Now people from exYugoslavia are asking is he Slovenian because of his accent. So for less than a year we are working on removing his accent. 😊
It helped him a lot also that he watched almost all exYugolav and Serbian movies and he was shocked that our movies are full of curses.
So he entered in that way of mentality first and our sence of humor. Thats very imortant for integration.
Now he is making joke first Russians who came after Russian revolution brought architeckture, culture, ballet teachers.
This wave of Russians brought Raf kafa. 🤣
Ako ćedu da se integrišedu nek se integrišedu, ako nećedu, ne moradu
nije koristan komentar. prosiri i reci direktno sta mislis.
They must integrate, because they live in this country, not Russia anymore, the rules are not the same. This applies to every person, wherever they have moved. if you want to live in another country with those people, you must learn their culture and adapt, not live like a wild dog.
@@procold89 Jaaoooo genijalno!
Very interesting! Good luck there! peace from Poland.
I’m glad to hear that! Thank you for watching and support! Dziękuję ☮️
@@StepansOdyssey I made some Russian friends last year in Thailand, great people!! Cold at first, but warm up after they trust you, understandable given Russia's history. peace be with you!
100,000 educated urban and young people came to Serbia...Serbia can only be satisfied with that fact...Добро Дошли браћо 😘
Хвала вам на гостопримству :)
As a Serb and a former immigrant to the West, I don't blame the Russians. People do not understand how difficult it is to integrate into a culture, especially into the one you didn't really want to go but rather had to go. I spent a decade living in Western Europe and I absolutely hated it, was just there for the money, did learn the language but ended up spending 90% of my free time with people of my own heritage.
That said, I am not the biggest fan of the arrived Russians myself, I see them as too intoxicated and seduced by the West, basically Russian-speaking Blue-state Americans, but I am fine as long as they do not commit any crime and do not take the streets to protest or advocate anything. I am absolutely not pro-Putin, but he is a factor in our foreign policy I cannot deny. We have a massive division in Serbia over West vs Russia and I do not want anyone but literally anyone stir further turmoil in an already divided society. So, Russians who are in Serbia or want to come to Serbia : speak whatever you want to whomever you want, do business, go out, have fun, live your life, take your children to schools etc but respect the law and understand the fragile societal situation and nothing bad will happen to you.
Just one fact we had many russians that came here after the revolution.
They integrated and made a real impact in serbian culture.
And today people are like wtf we dont have anything in common
i think that Russian people add a lot to Serbian society, well mannered educated people are always welcome
Ne lupetaj molim te
Nemamo nikakve dodirne tačke sa njima,kakvi crni prijatelji ,nadam se da će otići odavde,kada stane rat.
I agree but what I do not like when they do not try to learn language. If you do not try to learn language to me that is dissrespect to country that accepted you.
To je baš generalizacija. Upoznao sam na poslu(trgovini) nekoliko rusa. Dvojicu starijih , veoma kulturnih i pristojnih rusa i dvojicu mlađih ,bahatih od kojih mi je jedan krenuo da naređuje "da radim svoj posao" tj da idem u magacin da nadjem stvar za koju sam sigurno znao da nema. Kad sam mu po treći put rekao da nemamo to jer sam proverio na kompjuteru iako sam već znao da taj artikl nemamo ali rekoh ajd da ga uverim kad vidi stanje. Na to mi je mladi bahatijev odgovorio "Znam ja kako vi u Srbiji radite " na engleskom , porilično podrugljivim tonom. Iskreno , jedva sam se suzdržao da mu odbrusim da se slobodno vrati u Rusiju ako mu ovde ne valja. Tako da , ima ih svakakvih, kao uostalom i među svim narodima.
@@SimeoNjegovan Bahatijev, zapamticu taj izraz. Jednu stvar dobar deo Rusa i Amerikanaca izgleda imaju zajednicku: bahatost.
My nefew, who is Russian, came to live few months to Bosnia, even he has a family here, me as his aunt, could not manage to stay longer, he could not understand how we dont have 24 hours services, restaurants and so on. So as somebody who lives in a big city, I totally understand Russians. Still everybody loves their home.
Not being rude, but saying as it is. It's not acceptable for ANYONE who immigrated to an other country, not to learn the local language and it doesn't matter if you have money or not! Only ones who have an excuse are very old people who aren't able to learn anymore quite well, mentally disabled persons, traumatized from w*r and alike. Otherwise there's simply no excuse.
Since 🇷🇺 went in 🇺🇦 I been watching and listening to geopolitical TV shows where I regularly hear RUS and UKR language for over 2 years and I can ASSURE you, that I'm able to have a conversation in Russian now with people, which I do whenever I meet a Russian speaking person. Note, I've NEVER attended any classes, just from hearing the words that are being used often, looking up in the dictionary online and looked up the cases that differ from Serbian, some are the same. Also I made sure to learn the difference between the so called "false friends" words, and that's it.
So if someone who's NOT EVEN living in a country, but he can learn the language to the point of being able to have a conversation, WITHOUT attending some serious lessons or a school etc., then, in my opinion, someone who LIVES IN A FOREIGN COUNTRY and doesn't learn it, it's a NO GO, a clear RED FLAG.
Also, when you are in a different country, it's the most normal thing, a natural inclination, to communicate with local people IN THEIR language and it brings joy experiencing the process of progressing in being able to understand more and more. At the end, even if you relocate after 2-3 years, you gonna benefit from having learned an other language, and that alone is motivation enough to do it
I agree (Serb here). What especially rubs me the wrong way is the Russians in this video who say that they don't integrate because they don't "need to". Yes, you could go your entire life living in Serbia speaking only English and eating only in Russian restaurants, never really interacting with the locals, but in our eyes it shows disrespect and disinterest in your hosts who have welcomed you with open arms. Nobody is asking you to convert to being a Serbian or drop your habits but a little bit of engagement in local culture, and effort to meet the people of the country is all it takes. The same really goes for any country, even when you're just visiting, it's only polite to put in the bare minimum to learn the basics of the language and the culture. Some of the Russians that came to Serbia seem to completely want to separate their existance from the locals, and the first chance they get, they will leave for another country and not once think about the people and the land that welcomed them first. That's what irks us.
@@kdexter2690 yea we dont like you too
@@MeliceNix Most of them have no intention to stay and are more cold and closed in nature than ExYu people. They also see Serbia as small Russia bcs of politics and love for Putin they ran away from.
We in Croatia have expats from US, Canada, Australia etc. living here for years, still in their expats groups, saying they wish to learn our lang but it's too hard. I can somehow understand, but if those were expats from Slavic countries I would be offended too.
I understand your point of view. If you really emigrated and plan to stay for at least a year, then you need to learn at least some minimum of the language. It is important. Well done for learning Russian in two years! I also discovered this method for myself, I think it’s called “natural learning.” When you don’t learn the rules, but at first you listen a lot and try to speak. Many of those I talk to here are already studying Serbian and can speak it minimally. Not all, but many.
What are you people on? You get offended that they do not learn the language?
Who gives a f. If they obey the law, if they are not a burden to society, and especially if they contribute, if you ask me they do not need to do anything, learn anything or even look at me on the street. Most importantly, if they are here LEGALY.
It is like saying because i can do tripple integrals like a breeze, i should be offended you do not.
Idiotic take. No, people do not learn a language just listening to other people or watching tv after a year. If you are able you have a gift and use it.
If they chose not to learn the language and deside to live in the country, they just picked hard mode.
And grow some skin, offended because they do not want to learn a language, christ have mercy.
Integration as a concept is only important in case of people comming from a completely different culture, religion and education level. Prime examples are what is happening in England and Sweden especially.
And one last thing, if you told me that they should learn the culture, i would be on board. I was 20 days in Japan recently, and as everyone knows DO NOT TIP. Not a single time i needed to speak Japanese or English even. Pull out your supercomputer from your pocked, and write what you want and everyone in the world will understand you.
Prvo, ne razumem zasto Rus komunicira sa Rusima na engleskom jeziku. I sve to u Beogradu. Na zalost, potpuno sam razocarana vecinom Rusa koji sada zive u Beogradu. Mi smo bratsku narod, Sloveni, sa veoma slicnim jezikom. Rusi su ovde dobrodosli i oni umesto da se integrisu, prakticno zive kao u komunama.
Добро вече! Наравно, међу собом говоримо руски. Видео је на енглеском, јер је мој канал на овом језику и гледају га људи из различитих делова света. већина њих зна енглески.
@@StepansOdyssey Pa, postoji translate za one koji ne znaju ruski 😀 Salim se i ne salim se. Ja sam rusofil pa mi je zao kada sve ovo gledam i slusam. Postujmo svoje da bi nas i drugi postovali!
@@milicastanojevic5493I ja sam bio Rusofil dok nisu došli ovi.. "Rusi" tako da sam sad blizu Rusofoba.
@@miroslavmirkovic9665 Kao da ovi "nasi" Rusi imaju problem sa identitetom.
@@miroslavmirkovic9665 Ову Руси су дошли претежно из 3 разлога, -
зато што су се плашили позива за војску/рат,
зато што су политички противници Путина/ прозападно оријентисани, страх од реперкусија,
зато што не треба виза, а Србија је релативно јефтина.
Врв ће 95%+ напустити Србију одмах након стицања услове за то, и отићи или кући, или на Запад.
Додаћу и то да Београд са својим брзим животом не оставља пуно простора за дружење чак ни Србима, а пријатељства након 30-е се теже склапају.
Баш као и Срби гастарбајтери, ни они нису адекватни представници свог народа за генерализације о Русима.
Younger Serbs look for interesting people to have a good time with and share similar ideas with, regardless of whether you are a Spaniard or a Russian. Generally, the culture and communication are more open here, so maybe a little adjustment could be a good idea.
Regarding sensitive political issues, young educated "Beogradjani" and "Novosadjani" support the Russian so-called "operations" and ultra-Orthodocy as much as they support the long-ago destructive Milosevic's ideology and what came out of it. We lived our way through the country's isolation, and travel bans, hiding and saving ourselves in other countries. Young ones didn't live through that experience, but their parents did and they very well know all those stories. So, in a huge majority, they do not give an F. and/or they are against it.
It is quite unlikely that you will meet some ultra-nationalists if you buzz around the places where "your kind of people" gather. Hold on to the rule: "If it looks like a duck, and it quacks like a duck, it probably is a duck". We do the same. 🦆😎
People here understand that the Russians haven't come to overtake our apartments, but they come to find some security.
My advice: Learn 10 new words of Serbian each month, be open to small conversations with neighbors and look-a-likes, and throw a little smile here and there.
Thank you for that clarification and advice. That’s really important.
Seems on point. My first two neighbours are Russian. Only met the second like few weeks ago, because we menaged to be at the entry to our building, at the same time, both wanting to feed the same stray dog.. We got to talking and it was easy from there, but I work remote too, just like him, and I am not super social, almost never start conversations, but I do like talking to strangers..
If I went abroud, and there were 200-300k people who already speak my languange, and working remote, I doubt I would do any better.. So I get it. Still I hope all have a good time here, and maybe even some chose to stay long term. Cheers!
P. S. We have been practically next door neighbours for a whole year, and that was the first time we met.. Good thing his English was great, so it went easy..
Привет из маленькой деревни в центральной Сербии. Россиянам ВСЕГДА рады в Сербии. Будет ли он интегрироваться или нет? Неважно. Таково мнение 99% сербов. Они ВСЕГДА ДОБРО ПОЖАЛОВАТЬ в СЕРБИЮ. Я надеюсь, что в ближайшее время больше россиян из Турции, Грузии и Узбекистана переедут жить в Сербию.
Хвала на гостопримству :)
Apsolutno tacan komentar.Nije bitno.Kad god dosli dobro dosli.
I am Serbian and I honestly don't find Russians as a close nation and "brothers". I find other Balkan Slavs including Romanians and Greeks much closer to us. Despite that, Russians who came to Belgrade are good immigrants. We have much different mentality than people in Russia and it's normal that it is not easy to integrate in our society.
Thanks for sharing. Yes, they are closer geographically. It seems like you guys should certainly have more in common. Can you tell me where you see the difference in mentality with Russians? Thank you!
@@StepansOdyssey Much different mentality. Russians are usually more reserved and less open than Serbians. We speak slavic language and are mostly Orthodox Christians same like most people in Russian Federation, but the cultural differences are huge. Russians are more simillar to Scandinavians or Baltic people and our mentality is closer to mediterranean countries. What is your opinion about this?
Thanks for sharing. You know, I became interested and now I sent this question to the AI. Below is a comparison. In short,
Yes, it seems we have more differences than we have in common. We are similar in that we are both influenced by both the West and the East. For both of us, family values and cafes are very important. But Russians are more reserved and less sociable. I think your comparison with the Scandinavians is correct, to some extent.
We compare a Russian from St. Petersburg and a Serb from Belgrade.
Historical context and cultural heritage:
Russian from St. Petersburg. A city with a rich imperial history, it was for a long time the capital of the empire and is famous for its architecture. What affects residents in terms of cultural heritage.
Serbian from Belgrade. Belgrade is one of the oldest cities in Europe with a rich and turbulent history, including the periods of the Ottoman and Austro-Hungarian empires. This leaves an imprint on its multi-layered culture and mentality.
Belgrade is known for its cultural diversity, influences from both East and West. This is reflected in the city's architecture and multicultural atmosphere.
Both have rich historical backgrounds and both have been influenced by both the west and the east. Here we are similar.
Values and beliefs.
Russian from St. Petersburg:
They are proud of their intelligence and culture.
Family values and education.
Beliefs: Many residents of St. Petersburg value European culture and see their city as a “window to Europe.”
Serbian from Belgrade:
Values: Family connections and hospitality are of utmost importance.
Beliefs: Serbs often take pride in their national heritage and history, which is reflected in their patriotism and respect for tradition.
It's 50/50 here. Russians are really more closed, that's true. But for both, family values are important.
Customs and traditions:
Russian from St. Petersburg:
Customs: St. Petersburg residents actively participate in cultural events and like to gather in cafes and bars.
Serbian from Belgrade:
Customs: Serbs love to celebrate with friends and family, and Orthodox holidays are of particular importance. Evening walks and meetings in cafes and bars are also popular.
Again 50/50. Russians are colder and more formal. But we too love meetings in cafes and bars.
Social norms and communication:
Russian from St. Petersburg:
Social Norms: St. Petersburg residents may seem more reserved and polite, and value personal space and respectful communication.
Communication: Often more formal, especially in business and official situations.
Serbian from Belgrade:
Social norms: Serbs are more open and spontaneous in communication, often expressing emotions openly and freely.
Communication: Less formal, friendly and open.
Here we are different.
Worldview:
Russian from St. Petersburg:
Worldview: More inclined to the European style of thinking, open to innovation and cultural exchanges.
Serbian from Belgrade:
Worldview: The influence of Eastern and Western cultures creates a unique perception of the world, combining tradition with modernity.
@@StepansOdyssey The biggest difference is that you guys drink Vodka and we drink Rakija 😂
😅
I am Serbian, born and raised in Serbia and I couldn’t integrate after 30 years. Now I live in USA and I feel integrated.
I think one if the main reasons why you can not integrate there is because mentality is totally different. You guys like to keep it to yourselves and mind your own business while Serbians like to get involved in your business all the time.
Since I live in USA I realized that Americans might ask you something but if they feel that you don’t want to talk, they will leave you alone. With Serbians is different, they will ask you whole bunch of questions not realizing that they bother you, and even if they realize that they bother you, they will continue :)
😂😂😂😂😂😂
Russians and Serbs are two worlds. I feel that the Mediterranean peoples are much closer to me than they are. cold, unkind
Yes. But the Belgrade sun clearly makes us warmer :)
But seriously, what do you see as the big difference?
@@StepansOdyssey I lived in Israel, and there are many Russians, and then I saw that Serbians and Russians are not the same. Russians are cold people, like introverts, you dont associate like we do, you dont hug with your friends, you dont laugh as much, humor is not the Russian thing, you always act as individuals. Russian primary school system is shit, all the Russians that I have met in Israel had no broad education at all and ia have met hundreds of Russians. In general i always associated with friends from western countries there, or locals, because they are more warm and educated that the Russians. I think Russians have a systematic problem. But you are welcomed here, and i hope our sun will warm you harts.
@@StepansOdyssey As someone who loves Russia and Russians very much, I think that the main problem is that mostly younger Russians liberals came to Serbia, who as such do not feel much towards us and would like to live in NATO countries as well. We and the Russians are connected above all by faith, culture and values, which are disputed by those who come here, I would say.
My first neighbor rented a huge expensive apartment with his family and after a year they don't even know how to say good morning even to my old mother when she greets them?! That is deep disrespect and the last time,because they are very loud I explained to them a that we in Serbia have house orders and that he should stop making loud noises in the building.
In short, real Serbs and Russians understand each other well, but globalists, people without god and faith among us feel nothing or little for each other.
@@zorancvetkovic7204 Exactly! It's not about russians per se, it's about the specific KIND of russians that came here: the libs, the globalists, the pro westerners...We have nothing in common with that type or they with us. I hope they leave asap.
@@zorancvetkovic7204 Објаснио си.
1. If people are working remotely or in companies hiring just Russians it's quite tough to get to know some locals. You know when you work in mixed enviroment you get a chance that you colleagues become your friends and help you in integration. That's how we Serbians also wider our group of friends.
2. Also there is good majority of young people speaking English much better than for example people in this video so I would say that's one more obstacle for integration untill you learn some Serbian language. A lot of young people (especially high educated living in Belgrade, working in so many international firms,traveling a lot) make friends with people from other countries or cultures
3. In Serbia we always get to know our neighbours and our culture is such that we are very polite in these cases. Starting with the fact that those people might help you in so much situations, faster than your family
4. And most important, most of Russians which came here are not poor, or uneducated, waiting for others to help, so it's up to them to try socializing more, if they even plan to stay in Serbia or have a wish to integrate. Serbians are very well known as very hospitable and warm nation. But if someone apears as arogant and in a way rude (of whatever nation, even Serbian) that's in most cases - no, no for any socializing
The fact is that although we are all Slavs, Southern Slavs have much more in common with Mediterranean, especially Balkan countries, than we have with Russia.
Slavs are totally different from the rest of Balkan countries
These Russians don't want to live permanently in this country but in a better country for better people and better opportunities
Thank you for another great video!
It seems you have a old retired American couple following you.
We were in Batumi Georgia January through April. After your great Batumi videos. Thank you very much it helped us in Batumi.
We moved to Thailand in May and we fly to Istanbul next month then we are talking a bus to North Macedonia.
Maybe some day we run into you. My wife said you look like a nice kid.
Have a wonderful day and keep up the videos!
Hello! Yes, i remember you! I am glad that my video was helpfull :)
i wish you a great adventure, its sound like very interesting route!
Say hi to your wife for me! I'd be happy to meet you for coffee :)
Met a couple of great artists from russia in belgrade. A lot to be learned from this clash of cultures. And boy is it a clash hahahah
I'm working in the video game industry. And I really wanted to meet new Russian colleagues and fellow artists. But they usually just talk among themselves on breaks. And being an introvert myself i don't know how to approach them.
well Serbs sometimes complain about expats like that. meanwhile most gastarbeiting Serbs do not talk to natives while working and living abroad.
Interesting observation, thanks for sharing!
Difference is most of people in western countries are not welcoming of Serb workers or probably even other people, while Serb are extremely welcoming and hospitable especially towards Russians who we look as our brothers. From my experience Russians who came before war were really friendly and i made lot of friends, since start of war and influx of Russians i haven't had one good experience with them, they look at locals with some kind of arrogance, seem rude and refuse to respect our way of life, some unwritten rules and customs. I think a lot of it has to do with people now fleeing Russia being much more liberal, unpatriotic(therefore not sharing as much values with most of locals)than the ones who came before war, they make much more money so they dont feel the need to integrate since their own kin can be found everywhere in Belgrade or Novi Sad
I met a few Russians in my life, they were happy people, I don’t know much about them. I don’t think they should integrate - the language they speak is our old Slavic church language - we should learn more about them (and the language). The assimilation will be quick, but leave them alone until they come back to you. They just might be shy. Many people would love to have quiet neighbours.
Fortunately, they don't want to live in this country but in a better place for better life and better opportunities
@@kdexter2690 ty stvarno misliš da ima bolje od ex-Jugoslavije. Viruj mi da nema! Najbolja priroda, more, čista voda, hrana, ljudi!
the things are quite similar with Chinese immigrants, but Chinese imigrate to more countries, more skilled in surviving and living a peaceful business life. Russian immigrants are more demanding sometimes I think
sometimes when we (my girlfriend, my friends or me) say “dobar dan” or “doviđenja” to our russian neighbours they look at us shocked, offended even and i dont seem to grasp why that may be, but it is so confusing to us, and that probably contributes to people perceiving them as arrogant or cold, but when russians do open up and smile once in a while and even learn some phrases in serbian I believe they are wholeheartedly accepted by the serbs.
i dont mind russians not wanting to socialise with us,as long as they are peaceful and not bothering anyone its fine.Russians are pretty much scandinavians and we are completly different people its normal we dont get along
Thanks for sharing this, I understand your point. But I’m wondering, what difference do you see? Because I have a couple of local friends, and honestly I don’t see the difference between a person from Belgrade and a person from St. Petersburg. Well, maybe from St. Petersburg it will be more gloomy. But that's kind of all.
@@StepansOdyssey serbs are extroverts,russians are introverts.When i was in belgrade i saw quite few russians and they always avoided eye contact and never did small talk,thats main difference.But as i said im fine with it,they are not bothering me
@@StepansOdyssey ofc not every russian is like that,there is russian man in my village and he is very open to talk and integrated our community quickly,but majority is cold and closed
У моих родителей были близкие друзья, супружеская пара Тимофеев и Телешов, иммигрировавшие в 1920 году. В начале семидесятых годов их родственники приехали в Белград, и они впервые в жизни встретились у нас дома. 😊
Ого! Вот это история! :)
Before I watch I write this, as a reaction to the title. We understand that you Russians who came here in the last 2-3 years are still isolated because you didn't even plan to come, and you came in large numbers, so there are enough of you that you don't have to leave your Russian circle. We understand that among you (as well as among us in Serbia) there are many who have a pro-Western political opinion and you feel discomfort or contempt when you see that many Serbs support Russia and hate the West. I hope that over time you will see that the shortcomings of Russia as well as Serbia are to a significant extent the consequence of hostile actions from the West and that you will acquire at least a healthy dose of skepticism towards the West. The irony is that we communicate in the language of the common enemy, but it is a matter of practicality because English is much easier to learn than Serbian and Russian.
or maybe Russians who actually lived in Russia have better understanding of Russia than Serbians who "learn" about Russia from social media. The irony is that you think you understand Russia and their politics better than Russians. While the West is definitely meddling you can't blame our own corrupt government in Serbia on the West.
Interesting. I watch your first video in Belgrade some months, maybe a year ago and notice: this guy will be lonely for sure.
And here you are! :)
You are remember me, thats impressive :) Yes, during this year i absolutely didnt have time. just work-eat-sleep-repeat , thats crazy.
Thank you for watching :)
As a Serb and shop owner with many Russian customers, I can say biggest issue is language barrier. Most of us speak English at least decent, while some Russian folk struggle with it, wile some are decent with it. Thea also mingle only among themselves (as expected). As someone said, it is too early for integration, and maybe it wont happen in entire generation. Meanwhile, we are open people to anyone willing to mingle with us. I met especially fine Dutch people that are open to all, and ready for conversation and being friend with anyone, and some of them married our women, and they are integrating just fine, further emphasizing that it is Russian folk that has to open toward Serbs.
You'll be fine, Serbia is welcoming country! Greetings from Vienna
Fortunately, he is in France anymore
Before i watch the video ill just say my opinion on the topic (as a Serb): you dont have to integrate in any way beyond the most basic stuff like following the laws and paying taxes if you work here. Everything else is a matter of your choice. Nobody can and should make you learn the language. You can if you want to. You dont have to if you dont. I would just say that if you wanna stay here you should probably send the kids to the local school so they can interact with the natives. Other than that FREEDOM BABY.
The majority of russians who were in your country never wanted to live there permanently
They want to live in a better country
Well, my niece that is Serbian, needed to move from Belgrade when Russians came due to high cost of apartment rent. And she is not the only one. That is of course the blame of the Serbians that rise rents, but this is one of the reasons people do not like so much Russians. There are some people that do not like them becouse of the war they started, and that is legit. But my opinion is to be open and not make general opinion on both sides. We are all only humans and can be good or bad, depending on the situation.
Thank you for the video.
Russians are now a large community in Serbia and as such it's hard to integrate, since there are so many people here who gravitate towards each other. Difficulties that I can see are:
1. Language - most Russians don't speak English and our languages are not similar enought to effectively communicate.
2. Community - already covered it
3. Culturological differences - they are big, and very visible.
When people learn Serbian it is much easier. One thing that is very helpful is the pro-Russian sentiment of Serbian people in general.
Ahh whats that on 3:05? I was walking there the other day and somebody was chilling on that chair 😄 so cute. Im a Serbian girl and would be friend with Russians anytime ☺️
It is not the same when a family moves to another country and they are there alone and have to integrate with the people of the country they came to. The Russians in Serbia are a different case. They came here because they had to, secondly, they came in larger groups and they have each other and they don't feel alone in a foreign country, but they have their own online groups, communes where they additionally connect. Their migration case is totally different from a classic migration to another country. Therefore, don't expect them to integrate, they are here because they have to, not because they want to, as soon as the situation improves and the war ends, they will soon return home, or move to other countries. I know some Russians who have integrated, mostly through hobbies and sports with Serbs, and some have bought apartments here and want to stay because it's nice for them. But that's a minority. I don't mind that they don't integrate much, they certainly brought their own touch to the culture and subculture of Serbia as well as the IT industry. I wish them all the best, and of course I would do the same, and I couldn't wait to return home after everything, a completely normal thing, I don't consider our brothers any, but I met a lot of smart and normal Russians, talented, from music to sports, because I myself am in those waters.
We are a family-oriented people, but this doesn't mean only the nuclear family, but also extended relatives, godparents, friends, neighborhood, corso culture... personal development, business life, individual experiences are not values that can help you connect quickly with average Serb. But if you invite him to your house, or go to his house, eat and drink something, watch a game together, expect that he will very soon invite you to his child's birthday or some other family gathering.
Hello there, will you be returning to
Batumi?
Oh.. I miss Batumi so much, that city is in my heart. I have a lot of close friends there. When I will have opportunity, I will go there at least for a month.
And cuisine, I miss for Hinkali! :)
Oles, my friend, why didn't you tell me you will be on the TV!
Philosophy about what a Nation is is different here from the West. If I go to USA and get citizenship, then magically I'm American. But if you come to Serbia for example and get citizenship, you're still Russian who holds dual citizenship. Only if you marry Serbian man/woman and have kids, your kids can identify as being either of Serbian or Russian descent in this scenario. So there is no real expectation of expats integrating in such a way because you can't just become different nation (which is related to your genome - DNA, not the name of the country). As long as you respect local culture, you're as good as it can get
In most cases Russians in Serbia look down on us and they don't want to mix with locals and "common" people. I think they don't really respect us and this country and that they are only here because it is the only place that they can go, and that accepts them. Also, Serbia is good place to live if you have reasonable amount of cash, it has a good climate, people are friendly, social life is alive, and there are still some human freedoms.
I'm sorry you had such an experience. Most of my friends do not look down on the locals and respect them. They really appreciate the opportunities that Serbia now offers. Although there are probably people who are accustomed to a different standard of living in Moscow. You shouldn’t pay much attention to them; they exist in every society.
Da,ne može se generalizovati,ljudi ima svakakvih,pa.. Ali bih hteo reći da ne postoji bolja zemlja za ruse od Srbije,mislim na Evropu.. Kako mislite za na primer ruse koji su migrirali u Nemačku,da li se druže sa nemcima,da li ti nemci poštuju te ruse više nego ovde?! Mislim,malo je teže objasniti u kratkoj poruci na šta sve mislim😁
Sve u svemu i ovo što sam sad napisao je neki znak poštovanja ali zavisi sve od čoveka kako šta vidi..
Pozz i svako dobro..@@StepansOdyssey
I live in Novi Sad and in my work I meet a lot of Russians and people from Novi Sad where I can talk with them and I noticed that Russians very often close themselves to their community instead of integrating, for example Russians will prefer to go to a Russian dentist or a Russian hairdresser, it's the worst for me that he would rather go to a Russian car electrician than a Novi Sad one
I have to admit that there is a lot of blame in Novi Sad, in short, a lot of people came from the side to Novi, now what about the war in Croatia and Bosnia because of the consolidation of agricultural land in Vojvodina ... (Russians are the fifth wave of immigration to Novi Sad and the city has grown from 300,000 to almost half a million people in the last 35 years) and the old Novi Sad residents themselves are by nature a bit closed to newcomers (and if they themselves will say that it is not true) so at first the new settlers welcomed the Russians with a lot of skepticism and reluctance, although as time goes by they are increasingly opening up to the Russians and accepting them as part of novi sad , but I also think that this mistrust and antagonism is normal with any immigration, it's in human nature, I'm not like that, but people are people
I tried to talk to the Russians I meet about it, thinking that it will the separation spread over time but they don't see it as a problem even the worst hit me was the conversation with the mentioned dentist where he answered me Russians are used to one level of service (a bit racist)
I don't think it will turn into a big problem in the future, but it's hard for me to see it around me
Об изоляции говорить не приходится. У сербов нет неприязни к русским, к тому же в глубине души это близкие народы (если вы послушаете русские и сербские народные песни, вы это почувствуете - не слишком полагайтесь на популярную музыку, ведь в Сербии слушают" всё»: «от Сильваны к Нирване»). Требуется время, чтобы прорваться через эту внешнюю оболочку расстояния. Одно могу вам сказать точно: сербы ожидают от вас, что вы будете "сербами" (это касается и других народов, не являющихся русскими) 🤣, а это значит, что вы живете так, как живут они, а это, опять же, включает в себя "все" . Не забывайте: это «перекресток» Балкан. Удачи! И: «только сербский лад спасает!» 🤣🍀
Братья и сестры из России, добро пожаловать в Сербию, со временем вы привыкнете к новой обстановке. Желаю вам всего наилучшего.
Хвала вам много на свему :)
Im Serb,born n raised in Belgrade,we are isolated,if you dont sucsed in sport you quit at age of 16,17 if you chase your dream after that,all people aroud you see you as fool who dont want to work,if you got money,you got a lot of girls and friends,if you dont got money you got 1 friend...A lot of people here think that if thay live good,that all people live like them,if you are stranger people will be nice to you 10 times more then if you are random Serb.Dont got me wrong but i see to much fake people now here in Belgrade...
Interesting point of view. Thank you for sharing that!
There are two reasons why people who move to a different country will integrate with the local community - 1) necessity or 2) curiosity. And this applies to all immigrants. You’re either forced to integrate by necessity (need a job, need friends but nobody or not too many of your countrymen are in your vicinity…) or you’re simply interested in the local culture and will integrate to learn more about it. This second case is much more rare. So the best explanation why Russians don’t integrate into the Serbian society is because they don’t need to and are not interested in integrating. They don’t need to because there’s enough of them here to have their own bubble that they never or very rarely need to leave. And they are not interested because this is just a temporary solution to their current problem. And there’s no ill will towards the Russians who live here in my comment, these are just facts. The motion designer guy with the goaty said it himself. Can get by without learning Serbian and is waiting to move somewhere else. That’s going to be the legacy of this generation of Russian dissidents who came to Serbia. They will be as quickly forgotten here as quickly they fled Russia two years ago. Good riddance.
Greetings from Belgrade. My opinion is that most Russians who left Russia are anti-Putin, and Serbs are at least 90% pro-Putin. That's why Russians feel a little reserved and keep their distance. Russians must understand that Russia and Putin and its people are friendly to us, among the rest there is also politics because Russian politics and ours in the region coincide and have common interests. You are welcome and if you don't like Putin and his government, just don't tell us. We have our own concerns, and that concern is not from Putin but from the West. P.S. the Russians could take a little interest and read our past, at least in the last 100 years. 👍
Not the Great explanation, buddy.
First of all, I don't know where you found 90% pro-Putin people in Serbia. It goes to 40-50% max, but there are a lot of indifferent people who are either ambivalent about Putin or don't care, but not necessarily being "pro-Putin".
Second, much bigger reason is that Serbs and Russians are quite different in terms of mentality, social habits, expression of emotions and lifestyle... North-South division quite much. Most Russians that Serbs used to know are actually the Russians from 19th century novels.
@@withoutshadowww Correction. 99% support Putin. You have no idea about Serbia
An interesting point of view, I think there is some truth in this.
Thank you for adding to this point of view. Nevertheless, it seems to me that if you compare a resident of Moscow and a resident of Belgrade, there will not be much difference. At least I didn't notice. But if you compare from some small city in the far north, the difference will of course be very noticeable.
@withoutshadowww First, immigrants who arrive in large groups to another country tend to stick together for some time. This is also true with Russians in Serbia now. Even though Serbs think of Russians as close kin - the truth is they are not that close.
I find it interesting that you refer to a North-South culture divide … sounded a bit condescending but maybe you’re right. Serbs are definitely more Mediterranean culturally than they are northern!
But here’s a tip that’s useful to any immigrant group - keep your politics to yourselves in your host country. You can’t expect a different country with a unique historical experience to share your politics or views. For example, Middle Eastern immigrants in the US or Canada don’t talk about how they truly feel about the foreign policies of those countries that were directly involved in turning them into refugees. The historal experience of Serbia has created a very high level of distrust in western policies. Respect their experience and enjoy the vibe and hospitality of the people.
Missed opportunity to maybe try and speak in Serbian and /or Russian.
Propustena prilika da se prica na lokalnom jeziku.
yep, you are right. But many Russian, who work in service sector here, started learn Serbian. They just need some more time.
@@StepansOdyssey I mean, both are Slavic language, both use Cyrillic alphabet, I know from experience that I can understand some Russian if I talk with someone, so it should be easy.
Most Russians I have met have been extremely rude. 🤷🏻♂️
Nisu nam Rusi slicni mentalitetom koliko mislimo da jesu.I to samo zbog pravosljavlja i slavenskog porijekla.
Никакве сличности нема између Срба и Руса осим православља и комунистичке прошлости. Толико смо "слични" да када се сретнемо комуницирамо на енглеском
Yes you are right. I got interested and did a little comparison. Nevertheless, there is also something in common. You can find it in another comment thread under this video.
I met both sides of that specter, on one side I have young Russian family in my building and they are all about learning Serbian and really are into becoming part of society and on the other side posh IT ppl that are acting that they are above all yet still have to discover like use of deodorant or stop playing bloody Americans in the country that is so western bound and 90% of ppl actually do speak English, German and even Russian. still I consider them, both Ukrainians and Russians, my kin. welcome to Serbia!
You are wright, thank you for sharing that! Im glad to read that :)
Ćao! 😊
The issue is that Serbia has no policy for the integration of Russian immigrants. It is not only about Russians finding their way into the Serbian society. The institutions need to accommodate and facilitate the process.
Can you compare Serbia and Georgia, which one is better for living in your opinion?
Nice question! And quite hard to compare. Georgia is beautiful, and this country where I will go again and again. Georgians very freedom-loving people with powerful society. And In fact they don’t have corruption, at least in lower levels where people communicate with government.
But Serbia is more European country and I think more developed. Live in center of Belgrade are comfortable.
So I think that, if you have remote work and you don’t want shops, brands - Georgia will be better. But if you don’t have remote work and you want to have more developed country - you choose Serbia.
@@StepansOdyssey Well I am Serbian from Belgrade, I lived here my entire life. But I am interested to visit Georgia. Mostly for cuisine, mountings and monasteries. Thank you for your reply.
Why did you left Batumi, I know it is a city on the black sea?
Were the Georgians more hospitable than Serbians to you Russians after SMO?
And one more question, why is Georgia so poor? I watched their economic indicators, they are pretty bad. But they have everything to be more developed, sea access, gas/oil hub, unique cuisine, superior quality wine and dairy products, amazing Mountings, rich history. Literally everything they need. So what do you think is the problem than?
If you have any questions about Serbia I will gladly answer.
Georgian cuisine is delicious! If you will be in Batumi, visit the restaurant Pirosmani. It’s my favorite.
I left Georgia because I can’t do my documents there. Russians can live in Georgia 360 day per year without visa, and can do everything (open bank account, buy car, open business, etc). But, after 2022 so many people from Russia, Ukraine and Belarus go there, so Georgia stopped to do resident permits. Without that, this people can’t do visa to other countries and other things. And they can’t count on citizenship at future.
About hospitality.
I think we have different here.
I can be wrong, but it seems to me people in Serbia support Russia, like brother who have battle with Western.
In Georgia people don’t support Russian government, but they support people from Russia, Ukraine and Belarus. Georgia was a part of USSR, and this people knows what it was. They still remember a good and bad thing from that time. So they have different opinions about politics and about regular people. They know that regular people are just a victim at that situation.
Why so poor. That is also a good question. Really I don’t know. I know some Russian people, who have business there. And this people get normal money. But on the other hand, regular people who work like employers have very low salaries. Maybe the reason is the lack of trade unions and lower level of minimum salaries? I don’t know.
By my opinion Georgia have a great potential, and if they government will more think about people and economic, they will grow. And they can grow very fast.
I have one question.
What do you think about propaganda in general? Does it exist in Serbia?
@@StepansOdyssey Well if you crave Georgian cuisine there are 2 relatively new restaurants In Belgrade, "Đorđija" in Zemun and "Gost" near Obilićev venac. I cant judge the quality because I haven't been to Georgia yet. I made myself a lot of their dishes but I struggle with herbs and spices they use, impossible to find here.
It is interesting that Georgians are so welcoming to common Russians. I didn't expect that because of Russian intervention in 2008. and Aphasia an South Osetia. Every honor to them. I know that they have entire legions of volunteers fighting for Ukraine from the start of the SMO. Yes, you lived in USSR and they can relate. But you have to understand, Serbians had brotherly relations with Russians for more than 200 years, since the Ottoman wars. It is not from yesterday. Although Russian elites were often very calculative in relations to Serbia we view you as ultimate liberators and protectors. I will point out tsar Nicolas who started WW1 to protect Serbia, we will never forget that sacrifice.
About their economy, I heard it is because of the war in 2008. Corruption, lack of FDI because because of high country risk for previous reasons, and because they have one huge tycoon Bidzina Ivanishvili. His wealth is estimated at $6 billion which is astronomical for the size of their country. that is 21% of their entire GDP. I think all Serbian tycoons combined are not on his level. So there is great inequality in distribution of wealth. And I guess that grey economy is big there, a lot of unregistered vendors and sellers who don't pay taxes. But still, I am surprised how undeveloped Georgia is because they have everything they need to have at least 4x bigger economy.
Well my friend we can talk essays about propaganda, but I will assume you asked about propaganda in politics. Every government tries to influence and form public opinion as they see fit. Vast majority of people just believe what they heard on the TV. Some don't care, or simply don't have time to dig deeper to find what is really going on. As one guy told me "After 3h in traffic and 10h at work the last thing on my mind is to think about politics." Very true. What is interesting is that ironically in Serbia there is far greater freedom of speech than in the West and in the Russia. Here you can choose what you want to listen without censorship, BBS, CNN, RT, Sputnik, Serbian national TV, opposition TV (pro western), pro government TV. Here you can hear both sides and judge for yourself. But what you as a Russian must know is that Westerners sanctioned, demonized, lied and about Serbia the entire 1990s exactly the same as they are doing it now to Russia. I saw it all and I recognized it immediately. West is completely morally bankrupt. I hate their monstrous hypocrisy after all their wars of aggression and interventions, they are the last one to lecture anyone. What I saw with liberal Russians here in Belgrade is that they see Russian government propaganda and corruption, and they think this is BS, let me find an alternative, and they watch Western mainstream media and they think that that is the truth. But there is even greater black hole of lies and deception.
In Serbia I regard our president as a complete corrupt traitor who wants to rule until he lives. But on the other side there is pro western parties who are even worse than the government who are open foreign agents who have western media and NGOs on their side. And if you support neither one of these then you don't have the alternative. Unsystematic parties have no resources, no logistics no media behind them and they will never win in the elections. The level of manipulation I saw as a eyewitness both from the ruling party and from pro western opposition to destroy every alternative is to big for this comment.
Thanks for the restaurant recommendations, I'll check it out.
Yes, for me this understanding from the Georgians was also surprising. They know how to see ordinary people, without politics.
As for propaganda and freedom of speech. Thank you for such a complete and detailed answer. I didn’t know about such a wide broadcast network in Serbia. It's great that it's like that.
About Serbia in the 90s, I read about it and saw the buildings in the center. You really, like no one else, understand how ordinary Russian people feel now. Thank you for that.
Russians are great, polite, i would even say model immigrants. You don't cause any problems, you're usually educated and don't support authoritarianism. Some pro-russian and pro-putin Serbs are pretty negative about the newcomers, because they thought Russians would immediately befriend them or have the same worldview. Which is crazy, considering why these people had to fled Russia.
You can't imagine how important it was for me to read these lines ❤
The problem arises when newly arrived people from Rus realize that place they've come to consist from majority of people with patriotics affinity to Russia and Russians...
Especially considering our recent history with dealing how anglo media machinations, truth distortions, manipulations, and demonization is working...
And considering the reasons of why the recent wave of Rus people coming over is happening in the first place...
Making plenty of opportunities for some awkward interaction to occur, I believe 😁
Anyway, any Russians are and should be welcomed here, whatever the reason of their arrival (if acting in the boundaries of normalcy, of course), and I at least haven't heard of any badly expressed opinion on the newly arrived Russians...
I think you are very right about the potential for awkward interactions :) However, when the conversations are not about politics or the news, there is always a deep respect for each other. And this is very valuable.
Ja ne znam šta očekujete ,pa crnogorci u beogradu se ne razlikuju po obom pitanju od rusa niti bilo ko ko je došao u srbiju sa strane hercegovci makedonci goranci ,svi ljudi teže da budu u kontaktu sa svojima
Нисам очекивао ништа. Само ме је занимало да сазнам њихово мишљење и саслушам њихове приче.
Da odbranim malo bracu Ruse.
Ja sam 1989 god. dosao u Nemacku kod oca i tu ostao, imao sam tada 33 godine.
Pored rada na gradjevini, svakodnevno sam kao pomahnitao, samostalno ucio nemacki. ( Nemacki u 100 lekcija )
Za 3 meseca sam uspeo toliko da ga naucim da sam upisao Studije na Frankfurtskom Uni, zahvaljujuci cemu, sam dobio boravak.
U Nemackoj je otac do tada bio 20 god, Brat par meseci a uskoro zbog rata dosli su i dve sestre s muzevima, i upoznao sam desetine
zemljaka mladjih i starijih.
Sada posle 35 godina, rezime je, samo smo jedna moja sestra i ja naucili jezik.
Od drugih zemljaka koje sam ovde upoznao, na mom nivou pricaju samo oni koji su ovde odrasli.
Ucenje, uopste, a pogotovo stranog jezika nije za svakoga, a pogotovo ako je u zrelim godinama.
Ucenje je ubedljivo najteza aktivnost.
Ostavite odrasle Ruse na miru, ni vi nebi bili bolji da odete u inostranstvo.
Oni ce ako ostanu u Srbiji nauciti jednostavne fraze za komunikaciju, a deca ce im ceo zivot prevoditi vazne papire.
Sacekajte da njihova deca porastu, pa cete do mile volje moci da pricate s Rusima na Srpskom jeziku :)
Ja sam izuzetak, da nenormalno volim da ucim, sve me interesuje i svaki dan provodim nad knjigama 5-10 sati.
Sada, zaista, od nedavno, ucim Ruski, da mogu dobro da se ispricam s bracom Rusima, kad dodjem u Domovinu.
Very interesting
Glad you think so! :)
The first girl explained it well, it's all about incentives. At first there was such an influx of Russians and they were all providing services and support to each other so the need to interact with the locals was limited. But if you want to expand business or just need to make money to pay rent you bet your ass you're gonna start talking lol. In any case i don't think it's a big deal as long as they can speak english like people in this video. Also, let's be real, there are far worse options as far as migrants go.
That's right, it's all about incentives and necessity. But I know those who work in foreign companies, but they went to learn Serbian. There really aren't that many of them.
I'm a barman. I have lot of contact with foreners on my job. Language is the problem with Russians and Turks. Most of them don't speak English. Although in Serbia, some of us have learned russian in school, not many people speak it.
Russian kids that go to Serbian schools integrate great. My daughter is 10 and her best friend is Russian. ❤
They just arrived and have been living there for about 2 years and everyone expects them to be fully integrated? Lol. There are immigrants intot Britain and the EU who have been there for generations and have hardly integrated into their host's society. 😅
They don't want to live permanently in this country
They want to live in the western nations
Why are they now in Serbia first of all?
More integration means less isolation and vice versa, that's everywhere not only in Serbia. Cheers
Mentality of Serbs is closer to Italians and Spaniards than Russians. Serbs are open people, first meeting and we will tell you best and worst things about us, while Russians are so reserved and closed.
Beggars can't be choosers. I am referring to both sides of this relationship. The minority of emigrants from Russia, who came to Serbia without a job and are not from afluent families, will assimilate and are more than welcome.
You are quite alienated in Moscow, 100s of gated developments in suburbs, even there you don't want to mix much.