I learned as a crew chief on Blackhawk helicopters to touch every flight critical nut and bolt, it has served me well on my challenger as well as other aircraft I fly.
Great discussion! My first hours of flight training were in a FlightStar IISC, HKS-power. Very quiet, and decent performance, even on hot days w/ a 3200' field elevation, and about 2.5GPH. Not fast; maybe 65 MPH cruise at about 5800 RPM. Finished my Sport Pilot training (and have most of my hours) in a CTLS; seemed like a hot rod after the FS! Both planes require lots of rudder-work, esp. w/ X-wind landings, and like tailwheels (so I've heard), are "flown all the way to the hangar". The one brief stint (1/2 hour tops, 2 landings) I had in a 172, the landings (which I worked VERY hard at in the CT) were a non-event...If I ever got the funds, and the energy, I'd like to build/purchase one of the Zeniths (CH-701 or 750), or a KitFox...
Soloed in a Champ. Flew cubs, T-crafts, vagabond, 150, 172, owned 175, piper arrow, twins, and was Corp pilot of c421. They all fly different, and each has their traits.
I'm one of those purchasers you're talking about. Bought my tri-gear Challenger I right before Covid hit. Trailered it down to an airport about an hour away from me and there it's sat ever since. Not being a pilot, I had started to take some Challenger II dual instruction from a guy about 2-1/2 hrs. away, but now locally, can't find anyone who's affordable enough to resume the training and I'm NOT going to just take off and 'self-learn' with only 3 hours of training. I'd love to find someone nearby who does Challenger II dual instruction (even if not a CFI, but with many hours in-type). My plane is hangered at Clyde Valley Airport 3NC0 in NC, if there's anyone who see's this, is reasonably close and wants to reach out to me. I'd love to get flying again and hate the thought of giving up on the dream. If there's anyone retired who would want to do an intensive 1-week/2-week course with me, please do reach out! I'd be more than happy to travel for that!!!
Very good info. However I do disagree with a few cons and agree with most 1. A 2 stroke is very reliable. Perform the required maintenance and she will take care of you. 2. Flying the challenger is all I know except a few hours in the Cherokee 140 and I agree it’s completely different flying. 3. Night flying is allowed if your rated appropriately and you have the proper lighting per the FARs 4. Several challengers out there with the HKS 4 stroke engine and still be a 2 seater easily. 5. 503 cost about $2700 to rebuild if you can even find a crankshaft. Also I noticed your drag cables look a little to snug while in the resting position.
I figured you would lol.. I definitely got a guy here 2k for everything! But am I gonna use him is another thing! The night time flight wasn't as much legality as it was would someone want to use this for night flying! That's for each person to decide on their own!
My first flight in the Challenger II amphibian was very humbling!🫣 The airplane has huge adverse yaw from the ailerons and is yaw unstable. I have many hours behind most certified small general aviation aircraft and large commercial transport aircraft. Wheels, skis, floats and amphibious floats and lots of tail wheel time. Unlike most other aircraft, the rudder pedals rock over a pivot point, rather than being pushed. You work the rudder pedals by pivoting your ankles. Knowing this and flying accordingly it is a good little airplane. I highly recommend the Challenger for fun flying!
Great content! My father and I built a Challenger many many years ago. What a fun plane! Something about flying with the doors off and sticking your arms in the wind… just a lot of fun! After I sold mine is when I started hearing about cracks in the wing attach brackets. Before that, I hadn’t heard of any structural issues. Sounds like you are taking the appropriate precautions. Nice to see the the Challenger community coming up with solutions for these issues. But like you said, I think most of those issues came from over tightening the brackets. I have watched several of your videos, and I like the way you think with regards to safety. Whenever I find myself rushing a pre-flight, I intentionally stop, and start all over again without rushing. Experimental aviation is as safe as you make it. I am currently in phase 1 flight testing my latest build, a Zenith Cruzer. Before that, I owned a Cherokee 180. What a boring airplane! Experimental is the way to go! God Bless!
I am also considering a single place challenger but would like a CH1 CWS. Do you own the yellow single place also? I like the yellow pages n both planes! Keep up the great work!!
I owned a Challenger 1 first before the Challenger 2 after I sold my Piper Comanche 250 back in 1997 after owning it for 10 years and logging more than a 1000 hours on it. The transition from the Comanche to the Challenger 1 was huge. There was no Challenger 2 in my area to get feel for it and my first flight in the Challenger 1 nearly got me killed. The Challenger 2 is docile compared to the Challenger 1.
Awesome info, thank you. I really struggle with the fear factor and haven’t flown my clipped wing yet. I have flown all light sports, mostly ctls, some aeronca champ tailwheel training/endorsement, sonex, zenith. Lots of fast taxi, nose off the ground fast taxi (Finally got the cg much better with a lighter battery).
I think you might state that flying a Challenger is not hard, just different, thats all. It has peculiarities that make it fly different, but its not a hard plane to fly. It is a rudder heavy plane as opposed to a Cessna where rudders are almost an afterthought.
The main reason I prefer the challenger is its slow and hands on,I still have my 150 straight tail and my cuz Flys and takes care of it,,I haven't been out in the 150 in two and a half years, personally I have more fun in the challenger
We are at sea level but we are also surrounded by mountains. Biggest thing is the cold. I’m not trying to freeze to death either…lol. How good are those heaters?
😆 I'm in Texas with no doors so I can't answer that. But I think Jason over at the cottonpatch youtube knows alot more about them then I do! Glad you're giving challenger a chance! Buy one and actually fly it.. don't be worried about it just treat it good and preflight the crap out of it and she will keep you happy!
I’m working on my PPL and I live in Alaska. I really don’t want to go broke buying a Cessna and paying for insurance, fuel, hanger etc. I’m learning to fly just for fun. As a hobby. I’m thinking of buying a Challenger 2 or a Kolb Mark III Extra. What are your thoughts on this? Is cabin heat a thing on these aircraft?
Yea you can get cabin heat kit from u fly it but I'm not sure if I would want a challenger in Alaska but that's not from experience that's just my thoughts. I might be completely wrong but it's a difficult bird to keep warm in cooler temps and is definitely affected more by density altitude then others so also depends on the elevation where you live.
For me the fat ultralight is about all I can afford now. Just don't have the money to buy a Cessna that is okay with these new LSA rules coming in the future it will allow me to rent a 172. My plan is to buy a challenger or something like it maybe an Excalibur. There is someone in my area who does training in a challenger I could get my sport pilot in the Challenger that would be great.
Somewhere where you were talking nuts and bolts what are the round pipe clamps used for? That seems sketchy. They couldn’t manufacture a bracket or something for that?
@Just_ride_it ok so that is a piece challenger came up with to reinforce the nose gear because what was happening is people would slam the nose down and it would break so now that's not an issue. The pipe clamps are attaching it and distributing the force!
Excellent job.. I own a QS gt500, and agree with your ‘pro’ and ‘con’ comments 100%. These things are joy to fly, but ya have to respect that they aren’t Cessna/Jabiru/ etc, you have to learn how to fly them.
They really are all over the place in regards to cost but a decent chll like 13k to 16k if you want a super nice one then more! A crappy one for 10 or more!
I saw a ultralight that looks like a j3 cub for about 7500 online in VA. In your I Opinion are these good trainers? I’m trying to get my glider license.
Well in my personal opinion probably not I would use that money to get a sport license and go from there! But I'm definitely not an all knowing guy but that's just my opinion I'm sure others would debate it!
Well, the cons outweighed the pros, so I think the Challenger is out for me. Mainly because I'm a mediocre pilot at best. The stick-and-rudder aspect would be too much for me because I'm older than I was when flying helicopters. Taxiing and landing in quartering crosswinds required a lot of movement in the Robinson to keep it stable. I don't want to deal with that any more. On another note, when buying a plane, how does one know a seller is legitimate? Going across the country to trailer a plane home only to find out it was a scam can be a great concern. Thoughts?
I hope the video helped you and in regards to buying luckily with faa website it's easy to verify ownership nowadays but honestly I would use social media to verify the person. For example if you are buying a challenger you can easily go on the Facebook group and ask hey does anyone know this person and or this airplane! All models have a following online so definitely use it to your advantage! Hope this helps
Interesting that Challengers are bought and sold so frequently. Do you think experienced GA pilots are less likely to be scared away by their "twitchiness" than someone who had a vision of what it would be like to fly, and then realized it was a lot harder/less stable than their expectations?
I personally think it's because they are not factory built. So any little weirdness while flying they say you know what forget this lol.. I personally think it's just different mentality and everyone is different! It doesn't bother me but mostly because I built a tolerance to it!
I learned as a crew chief on Blackhawk helicopters to touch every flight critical nut and bolt, it has served me well on my challenger as well as other aircraft I fly.
Great discussion! My first hours of flight training were in a FlightStar IISC, HKS-power. Very quiet, and decent performance, even on hot days w/ a 3200' field elevation, and about 2.5GPH. Not fast; maybe 65 MPH cruise at about 5800 RPM. Finished my Sport Pilot training (and have most of my hours) in a CTLS; seemed like a hot rod after the FS! Both planes require lots of rudder-work, esp. w/ X-wind landings, and like tailwheels (so I've heard), are "flown all the way to the hangar". The one brief stint (1/2 hour tops, 2 landings) I had in a 172, the landings (which I worked VERY hard at in the CT) were a non-event...If I ever got the funds, and the energy, I'd like to build/purchase one of the Zeniths (CH-701 or 750), or a KitFox...
Soloed in a Champ. Flew cubs, T-crafts, vagabond, 150, 172, owned 175, piper arrow, twins, and was Corp pilot of c421.
They all fly different, and each has their traits.
I'm one of those purchasers you're talking about. Bought my tri-gear Challenger I right before Covid hit. Trailered it down to an airport about an hour away from me and there it's sat ever since. Not being a pilot, I had started to take some Challenger II dual instruction from a guy about 2-1/2 hrs. away, but now locally, can't find anyone who's affordable enough to resume the training and I'm NOT going to just take off and 'self-learn' with only 3 hours of training. I'd love to find someone nearby who does Challenger II dual instruction (even if not a CFI, but with many hours in-type). My plane is hangered at Clyde Valley Airport 3NC0 in NC, if there's anyone who see's this, is reasonably close and wants to reach out to me. I'd love to get flying again and hate the thought of giving up on the dream. If there's anyone retired who would want to do an intensive 1-week/2-week course with me, please do reach out! I'd be more than happy to travel for that!!!
Great video - thanks - keep it up!!!
Thank you so much! More to come
Thanks for the info. Love the channel.
Thank you! More to come!
Thanks for great video
Thank you! Appreciate you watching!
Great video! Im now a subscriber! Thanks!
Very good info. However I do disagree with a few cons and agree with most
1. A 2 stroke is very reliable. Perform the required maintenance and she will take care of you.
2. Flying the challenger is all I know except a few hours in the Cherokee 140 and I agree it’s completely different flying.
3. Night flying is allowed if your rated appropriately and you have the proper lighting per the FARs
4. Several challengers out there with the HKS 4 stroke engine and still be a 2 seater easily.
5. 503 cost about $2700 to rebuild if you can even find a crankshaft.
Also I noticed your drag cables look a little to snug while in the resting position.
I figured you would lol.. I definitely got a guy here 2k for everything! But am I gonna use him is another thing! The night time flight wasn't as much legality as it was would someone want to use this for night flying! That's for each person to decide on their own!
My first flight in the Challenger II amphibian was very humbling!🫣 The airplane has huge adverse yaw from the ailerons and is yaw unstable.
I have many hours behind most certified small general aviation aircraft and large commercial transport aircraft. Wheels, skis, floats and amphibious floats and lots of tail wheel time.
Unlike most other aircraft, the rudder pedals rock over a pivot point, rather than being pushed. You work the rudder pedals by pivoting your ankles.
Knowing this and flying accordingly it is a good little airplane.
I highly recommend the Challenger for fun flying!
I agree 100% thanks for watching
great video
Thank you
Great content! My father and I built a Challenger many many years ago. What a fun plane! Something about flying with the doors off and sticking your arms in the wind… just a lot of fun! After I sold mine is when I started hearing about cracks in the wing attach brackets. Before that, I hadn’t heard of any structural issues. Sounds like you are taking the appropriate precautions. Nice to see the the Challenger community coming up with solutions for these issues. But like you said, I think most of those issues came from over tightening the brackets. I have watched several of your videos, and I like the way you think with regards to safety. Whenever I find myself rushing a pre-flight, I intentionally stop, and start all over again without rushing. Experimental aviation is as safe as you make it. I am currently in phase 1 flight testing my latest build, a Zenith Cruzer. Before that, I owned a Cherokee 180. What a boring airplane! Experimental is the way to go! God Bless!
im 73 and want to fly again, ur helping nudge me off the fence. thx
Well good let's push off the fence! Where do you live?
Great video! I am on my third challenger. They are great easy flyers. Long may you fly! From ND.
I'm originally from ND too! What part?
Cool. We are just west of grand forks.
I am also considering a single place challenger but would like a CH1 CWS. Do you own the yellow single place also? I like the yellow pages n both planes! Keep up the great work!!
Yellow planes, not pages.
@timklawon2973 no it's my buddies plane but I'm the only one flying it currently!
I owned a Challenger 1 first before the Challenger 2 after I sold my Piper Comanche 250 back in 1997 after owning it for 10 years and logging more than a 1000 hours on it.
The transition from the Comanche to the Challenger 1 was huge. There was no Challenger 2 in my area to get feel for it and my first flight in the Challenger 1 nearly got me killed. The Challenger 2 is docile compared to the Challenger 1.
Awesome info, thank you. I really struggle with the fear factor and haven’t flown my clipped wing yet. I have flown all light sports, mostly ctls, some aeronca champ tailwheel training/endorsement, sonex, zenith. Lots of fast taxi, nose off the ground fast taxi (Finally got the cg much better with a lighter battery).
You're welcome! Thanks for watching!
Where do you live?
@@TheJonjonj Northeast Ohio
@@TheJonjonj 7g8
@techlifetime4098 I'm very familiar my mom lives in mentor Painesville area. I lived in Jefferson for a year!
I think you might state that flying a Challenger is not hard, just different, thats all. It has peculiarities that make it fly different, but its not a hard plane to fly. It is a rudder heavy plane as opposed to a Cessna where rudders are almost an afterthought.
I think at the end of the video I made that pretty clear your 100% right.
Good info John.
Thank you!
Just found your channel. My plane is up the road at Mineola.
Nice! What do you have?
A Viking Dragonfly
@justinwerth3138 oh man I love those such a unique bird! Would love to see it in person sometime!
@@TheJonjonj absolutely! I'm hoping to complete the restoration within the next year but we could connect on one of my next trips to the hangar.
@@jdubs-dragonfly definitely! Let me know
The main reason I prefer the challenger is its slow and hands on,I still have my 150 straight tail and my cuz Flys and takes care of it,,I haven't been out in the 150 in two and a half years, personally I have more fun in the challenger
Absolutely I agree!
We are at sea level but we are also surrounded by mountains. Biggest thing is the cold. I’m not trying to freeze to death either…lol. How good are those heaters?
😆 I'm in Texas with no doors so I can't answer that. But I think Jason over at the cottonpatch youtube knows alot more about them then I do! Glad you're giving challenger a chance! Buy one and actually fly it.. don't be worried about it just treat it good and preflight the crap out of it and she will keep you happy!
I’m working on my PPL and I live in Alaska. I really don’t want to go broke buying a Cessna and paying for insurance, fuel, hanger etc. I’m learning to fly just for fun. As a hobby. I’m thinking of buying a Challenger 2 or a Kolb Mark III Extra. What are your thoughts on this? Is cabin heat a thing on these aircraft?
Yea you can get cabin heat kit from u fly it but I'm not sure if I would want a challenger in Alaska but that's not from experience that's just my thoughts. I might be completely wrong but it's a difficult bird to keep warm in cooler temps and is definitely affected more by density altitude then others so also depends on the elevation where you live.
For me the fat ultralight is about all I can afford now. Just don't have the money to buy a Cessna that is okay with these new LSA rules coming in the future it will allow me to rent a 172. My plan is to buy a challenger or something like it maybe an Excalibur. There is someone in my area who does training in a challenger I could get my sport pilot in the Challenger that would be great.
Nice! Definitely would need cross training because flying a cessna is easy but Definitely different characteristics!
Good learning 😶
Thanks for watching
Somewhere where you were talking nuts and bolts what are the round pipe clamps used for? That seems sketchy. They couldn’t manufacture a bracket or something for that?
Can you give me the time in minutes and seconds and I will look! Not 100% sure what brackets you mean?
@@TheJonjonj I apologize. I guess that was an older video titled.Want To Own A Challenger I?? Let's Talk About it! At 21:20 and 21,42
@Just_ride_it ok so that is a piece challenger came up with to reinforce the nose gear because what was happening is people would slam the nose down and it would break so now that's not an issue. The pipe clamps are attaching it and distributing the force!
Excellent job..
I own a QS gt500, and agree with your ‘pro’ and ‘con’ comments 100%.
These things are joy to fly, but ya have to respect that they aren’t Cessna/Jabiru/ etc, you have to learn how to fly them.
I love the gt 500 I hope to fly one at some point! Thank you for watching
Hi, how much does it cost
They really are all over the place in regards to cost but a decent chll like 13k to 16k if you want a super nice one then more! A crappy one for 10 or more!
good video, nice hat
Jonah hates that I took that one but it's gotten to dirty for tournament play lol
I saw a ultralight that looks like a j3 cub for about 7500 online in VA. In your I
Opinion are these good trainers? I’m trying to get my glider license.
Well in my personal opinion probably not I would use that money to get a sport license and go from there! But I'm definitely not an all knowing guy but that's just my opinion I'm sure others would debate it!
@@TheJonjonj I’m starting to fly glider so I’m looking for something eventual. Glad I found your channel.
@@excellenceinanimation960 thank you! More to come soon
How much are you asking for your Challenger 1?
It's not mine and I don't believe my buddy wants to sell it either!
The I need a pilot license If I purchased a challenger 1 being registered with the FAA already
Yes indeed!
Thanks
sport pilot license you think it works
Well, the cons outweighed the pros, so I think the Challenger is out for me. Mainly because I'm a mediocre pilot at best. The stick-and-rudder aspect would be too much for me because I'm older than I was when flying helicopters. Taxiing and landing in quartering crosswinds required a lot of movement in the Robinson to keep it stable. I don't want to deal with that any more.
On another note, when buying a plane, how does one know a seller is legitimate? Going across the country to trailer a plane home only to find out it was a scam can be a great concern. Thoughts?
I hope the video helped you and in regards to buying luckily with faa website it's easy to verify ownership nowadays but honestly I would use social media to verify the person. For example if you are buying a challenger you can easily go on the Facebook group and ask hey does anyone know this person and or this airplane! All models have a following online so definitely use it to your advantage! Hope this helps
Interesting that Challengers are bought and sold so frequently. Do you think experienced GA pilots are less likely to be scared away by their "twitchiness" than someone who had a vision of what it would be like to fly, and then realized it was a lot harder/less stable than their expectations?
I personally think it's because they are not factory built. So any little weirdness while flying they say you know what forget this lol.. I personally think it's just different mentality and everyone is different! It doesn't bother me but mostly because I built a tolerance to it!
Sorry Ray!😂
Lol right!
Definitely Not a plane to fly in 25mph + gusting winds lol what a ride!
@rayhensley3750 haha 😄 facts! Thanks buddy!
talking, talking, too much talking. not enough airplanes.
Are doors worth it
I've never flown one with doors so I can't answer that but I'm in Texas I don't want doors!