Love your reviews and happy to hear more , as an ex secondhand hifishop holder in Brussels ,I understand very well your evaluations and estimate them musically accurate
I have owned a few pairs of the L-Series speakers from Quad. I had similar issues with the 12L2. Gorgeous looking things, sounded good but not great. They just never sat right with me and I ended up moving them on. However the 77-11l are much much better. Not sure if its the smaller driver or cabinet, but they are absolutely lovely to listen to.
I really appreciate your videos! Honest and with humor. These Quads were for me my first newly bought hifi-speakers (live in Holland). I guess about € 500 in 2006. Very solidly built. Nice sounding. I recognize your comment especially on lacking some ‘space’ and mid range. I sold them. Now i love my IMF Super Compacts as vintage ( 🇬🇧) and Dali Rubicon 2 monitor speakers as well, depending on my music and/or mood.
Given that I used a Quad amp in the past, I was curious when someone sold a pair for 175 euro. But listening to this review and reading these comments I am glad I didn't buy them. 175 for a quite old speaker that is probably a deep 3rd in order behind my Wharfedale Evo 4.2 and Diamond 11.2 isn't worth it. It is the brand that keeps the value but 60 euro's would be my max in what I feel it should be worth
Kevlar is good because it is only material where the wave of the deformation diagram before and after the load is the same, which has an impact on sound accuracy, only that it needs more pure power to move properly (B&W for example). It is generally laid back (woven material) compared to stiffer materials (which has been said). BTW heavy materials (like polypropylene cones) needs power too. Usually speakers with polypropylene cone have a lower sensitivity (db), precisely because they need more clean power to provide (their) maximum . Harbeth for example. Cheers!
It’s interesting what you say about the bass reproduction of an electric bass guitar sounding synthetic on the Quad, but the sound of an electric bass IS synthetic in it’s self as the instrument does not generate its sound naturally.
I still remember when the 11L and subsequently the 12L came out, they had amazing reviews. I auditioned them with the Roksan Caspian M Series-1 which was also very well reviewed at the time and they sounded fantastic. Well, I would say mainly on audiophile female jazz type vocals such as your standard issued Diana Krall and the likes. I thought the Quads sounded sweet and rosy with the Roksan. Although I didn't end up buying them as I opted for a pair floorstanders instead, that impression I had of the Quads always stayed with me as I really regretted not getting them at the time.
@@justinking5964 Not exactly, but I was kind of educated in the UK and was a PR at one point. So, you are looking for speakers? Bookshelf/standmount? Small? What budget are you looking at? What's your taste in sound? Warm vs bright, which end are you at?
I've been looking for a pair of MA R252 on ebay also, what kind of issues did you have? Also what is the sound quality of the MA R252,? I mainly listen to Bollywood music from the 60's, 70's and 80's. Thanks
@@girishkukadia9916 Hi , i have the MD version, but it was a little hard to give a true sound quality opinion of these as the driver speaker in one was farting from time to time , but i did find them to be very boomy to the extent that on 3 receivers / amps i tested them with i had to have the bass control nearly off completely. Apart from the bass issue i found the treble a little disappointing, not as clean and nice as i thought it would be. finding a cheap pair my be worth a try, but i would not pay over £100 for them
Hi Kelvin, thanks for doing these reviews, I'm a vintage enthusiast myself so always good to hear an opinion. I agree that different speaker cone materials have different characteristics, however, a strong characteristic of composite cones is their stiffness. In the case of the Kevlar it's down to the resin they impregnate it with and generally it's very stiff indeed. However, the important thing about speaker materials is their behaviour in the frequencies above their optimum operating range. Very stiff materials have breakup nodes which are highly pronounced, which in turn means they have to have high order crossovers to roll off the sound quickly above the crossover frequency. These crossovers are component heavy and have the effect of reducing efficiency and often cause a dip in the upper midrange. Sound familiar? In paper cone speakers, you may have a little more flex, which introduces some colouration, like all vintage Wharfedales, but the breakup nodes are softer so the crossovers are simpler. Result is more efficiency, easier to drive.
I have owned the Quad 12Ls since 2004. I am about to replace them, but I find it surprising that you say they have issues with space, separation and vocals, as I find that's their main strength! Were they bi-wired? They can deliver loads of low end for the size, but it's uncontrolled.
Hi Mark what are you thinking of going with I am at the point of looking around not sure if going with Kef R3 or Quad S1 or S2 as I would want centre speaker to match. At moment Quad stereo and M&K surround but need space so have to combine both.
Same, had 12L2s, 21Ls and while the "shriek" comment is spot-on, the seemingly "lack of space" is something I think that could come from someone expecting L series performing on Quad electrostats level. The sense of atmosphere in jazz recordings (Dolphy's "At the Five Spot" vol.I comes to mind) is something my AP Tempo2 just can't bring back.
I found myself nodding in agreement with your assessment of these speakers. When I heard them and their little brother, the 11L, I was very underwhelmed. I remember all the sales guys going on about how amazing the 'new quad speakers' are, but I was seriously unimpressed. They sound 'clammy' to me...'phlegmy', even. That's the Kevlar driver for you, for sure. Paper's my fave cone material for sure.
Yes for Kevlar woven thing never sounded good to me ever BAnd W seem to use it in the mid range units high end ones and it seems to work but mostly I agree it’s just not good sounding
I have a pair of the Quads for I guess close to 20 years. They were What hifi speaker of the year for I think two years. They are not rated even close to 200W from memory, more like 60w max. I also have a pair of the Kef’ LS50’s on a separate system. The Quads win hands down so maybe your Quads are time expired.
Kelvin is spot on about comparing and contrasting. You will soon hear faults. Cone materials have a signature - speed v breakup. Kevlar is only good for bass, not mids. Hence even B&W dropped it.
I have the quad 12L but i think they are way too muddy, a lot of bass which interferes with higher tones. Personally I love a punchy bass and not a slow bass. I solved the problem with putting rolled up socks in the backports to close them completely. The bass is now punchy and i like the sound much much better. I can hear the instruments a lot better now and it's more lively
I did this! Made a couple of "nunchucks" with insulating foam (for water/heating pipes) and rope so I could tune the bass by plugging one or both ports. It certainly tames the mud.
Is there a specific absorption co-efficient in Sabins for these "socks" or a particular product or are they just actually socks. I'm looking at buying a yard pair and the hass sounds like it needs some work.
Hi Kelvin, I am going thru the process of comparing my 12L's right now and they are exactly the same look as yours there. I confess that to look at they are the best i have ever owned and this may be affecting my critical judgement of them as i so like how they look! Which ofcourse is strictly speaking Not what it is about because we are talking 'sound'. But i am sure that i am in good company with others who have a certain pride in how their speakers look to friends dropping round and noticing - don't we! When i have satisfied myself of their sound i will report back...
Hey one thing Howard try carefully tightening up the base driver screws you can do the tweeter as well but it’s not so important but they can get loose and loose driver is a bad thing don’t strip the thread though
Woven Kevlar ( or carbon fibre ) cones make EXCELLENT mid drivers ! With the right surround and cms ( suspension compliance ) they can reproduce the harshest of transients . Light years ahead of that doped Bextrene that KEF used all through the 70's . For fast undistorted bass you can't go past highly rigid paper or sandwiched cones ( like the one used on the LEAK 600 and KEF B110 )....
I have the Quad 11L2s. I don't doubt you're right about the kevlar sound. I've nothing to compare them to though they are better sounding than the two pairs of Missions I had before. There's a hi-fi dealer a couple of miles away with LS3/5s in the window. Your videos are inspiring me to investigate them.
Hi Tom well LS35A is in a hi-fi dealer got a bit expensive I guess all I would say is there only worth it if you’ve got a properly good front end otherwise you may not appreciate the qualities K
@@stereoreviewx I repleced the 11L2s with a pair of Naim Arivas. I heard them with other Naim kit. With my NAD 320 they were lacking something so I bought a Naim Uniti. I'm loving listening to music again.
You know how music today is super compressed to emphasize loudness, bass, and shrieking highs? The same thing has happened to audio gear! Its all made to focus on the extremes and actual musicality has been left in the dirt.
I find this quite disturbing. It is ruining the original product, an intrusion not asked for. Why does this have to happen? And with gear generally? - because everything has to be Spiced up, is it?
@@howardleah8401 B&W and Focal sound good in the store after just a few months but once you take them home you discover what people mean when they say something is FATIGUING!
The quads need to be bi amped and want a lot of power thrown at them to sound their best. I have my 11L2 connected to a 200w luxman power amp using both the A+B speaker terminals.
Hey Kelvin. Some Quad 12L's came up for sale in my area. I listen to a lot of jazz, 70's fusion/Jazz curious if you think they would be ok. I love detail, presence and clarity (very Hi-Fi). Can you or anyone help me. The guy selling them can only audition playing Spotify!!!! I Can't audition speakers using that as the source audio.
hi Kevin, possibly review some TDl electronic speakers. transmission line models from 80-90's? studio 1 possibly. also the rtl budget range. great channel by the way
I think the Quads were a bit overrated when they were new, but they looked good and they sold bucket loads of them. With so many on the 2nd hand market they are good value, particularly if you like the looks. The rubber woofer surrounds are starting to perish on some examples.
I have a bit of a thing for vintage Acoustic Research. Do you have any? Just picked up a pair of AR-6s and really like the bass. Would be interested to hear your views on AR.
I just bought a new Denon receiver... it's going back. The comparison of musicality between that and my 1974 Sansui 101 is jaw dropping. Unless you're spending big dollars, todays stuff just doesn't compare. No definition, soundstage, imaging... none of it. Long live the old ! :)
@@stereoreviewx So I picked up a NAD C316 amp today and matching cd player. The amp is a worthy replacement to the Sansui 101; it's slightly warmer, valvy/tubey, VERY detailed which makes it easier to appreciate musical arrangements and how the various instruments intertwine. NOTHING gets lost in the mix. The tone of different snare drums, bass guitars etc is easy to discern. The opening guitar in DAY TRIPPER for example is more tonally funkier than I've heard before. The effect of the band being in the room is definitely more vivid than with the Sansui, again due to the details in the timbre of instruments and voices and it's punch. It was a $500 (can) purchase. Bare bones for features but where it's important (dynamics, timbre, warmth, power, musical details) it really shines. For anyone looking for a modern version of vintage sound, it's a great choice. Nice little remote that operates the amp AND cd player. Happy fathers day to ME. :)
Hi love your reviews, as you deal with vintage hifi, could you advice me on my Qaud 405-2 amp do i leave it on all the time or not, ive been getting some say yes some say no, i would love your opinion on this Thanks .
i got tosay thts a long raging question its a technical issue i dont exactly understand . if it was me i dont think i would care i would just think about the electricity bill.
My Old Man had Keff floor standing largish units, Codas?? ... Good quality. I had Heybrooks on stands fed by an Arcam 90 integrated amp and decent cables in a small self enclosed room over a wooden floor and all glass doors and hard surfaces within. Sources- an average Technics CD Player and a Rega Planar3. Still sounded quite warm to me. Then bought large Monitor Audios (I have their DAB tuner too) and got violently burgled. Speakers damaged. Insurance claim and I got these quads for £325. 2004 ish. My tastes are Hard Rock and Mahler Schubert and Dvorkak broadly and I've lost a lot of high end hearing. I rate the Quads. In a separate casual room I had Goldring Lenco GL 75 Idler wheel.. Last Pro serviced in 1885 around Norbury area when it wsnt bad(Dad gift who always bought the best he could afford) Nad 3020, Technics CD & Denon MINI Disc which was never used. Pure DAB and a nice Nakamichi never used into good old Mission 700s!. I'm listening here on B&O Blootoof Phones which are also a bit synthetic!
Hi Kelvin, I got a pair of L12L2 not sure what exactly changed except the tweeter looks a bit different. I got them for 10 years now paired to an Arcam Solo. I wonder if they would improve with a stronger amplifier or maybe time to upgrade the whole kit, I was looking at the KEF so your review was quite helpful.
Well I’ll see what I can think of that is useful firstly arcam which I refused recently actually arecam eight alpha I’m fairly impressed by them. As for the quads to me I just flat out don’t do anything good I will also mention I literally this evening put on the Kef sl 50 50s and took him off in five minutes they are really fun killing speakers the mid range is just not right. So I’m not offering you much here but what I’m certain of is there are loads better modern speakers than the quads and the kefs . Hope this helpsK
I like your channel, but the second hand cost you quote on some of the equipment you review is very low. The Quad 12L speakers sell for around £250+ on eBay amongst other places. Still enjoy the channel!
Do you check out the sold prices which you can find in the filter on eBay rather than the buy now prices I’ve got to say I think the prices are getting a bit crazy and kind of wrong nowadays CheersK
@@Sandraud I can’t remember exactly what I said in that video but I just found those speakers disappointing though I did check the sold prices in the UK and the average was around £220 which surprised me K
Hi Stereo X. Could you comment on 1970s Sony stereo receivers? Thinking of the Sony STR 70XX series. 15 wpc. How do they rate agains't the Sansui/ marantz offerings?
ive got a pair of dm602s2 from B&W which my late mum bought me ex demo when i was 13 in 2001 but recently found one of the voice coils on the woofer had perished slightly which i hadnt noticed and i had never cranked them , ive decided to let them go and replace them with a series 3 dm602 or dm110 im wondering what your opinion of this plan would be as im fond of large stand mount speakers
I have a love-hate relationship with my 12L, which I hook with a Sugden Audition. For near field, it is not so good, the speakers need to be driven and have front 2 m at least. Maybe it is another product from the marketing department: 1100 $ CDN tag price, nice piano black - I hate that - and bass not so bad when you crank it.
Ps - funnily enough i have always had a thing for gently tapping woofers like yourself. I feel it gives me some information about them before hearing ( also one can tell if the speaker is 'seized' as can happen on second hand ones that are being purchased) - though i know this behaviour is frowned upon badly within the critical hifi world...
Hi there. Thanks a lot for your videos, they are a very big help. But I was wondering if you could maybe have some advise for me please? I'm a professional musician (sound is my life) and I'm sort of stuck between my old studio setup and my new vintage Hi-fi setup. I need a nice amp and speakers to complement my Revox A77 & Thorens TD165 (both in mint condition). Now they're hooked up to a NAD C165BEE preamp and Genelec 1030A's and as nice as it sounds, it's coldish and clean and lacks (to my taste) the nice mids and low mids. No way of tweaking the sound, because the NAD only has bass an treble adjustment ( only meant to add super low or super high...). I was thinking to buy an older Sansui (AU999, AU777, AU7900, etc.), have it completely recapped and some nice speakers (Kef, B&W, AR, Altec, etc.)? Do I first buy the amp, have it recapped and then start looking for speakers? The amp seems the most expensive and my budget is that of a professional musician ;- ) I mostly listen to records from the end 50's beginning 60's...Kind regards, Mischa from Amsterdam.
Hard for me to give specific advice not sure what your power and peas or do you mean theNad is the amplifier Off the top of my head Sansui a U555 It will give you warmth and detail it’s luxurious
@@stereoreviewx Thank you so much for replying, very kind. Yes, I will sell the NAD and the Genelec speakers. And buy a Sansui AU555A. It looks absolutely stunning too, by the way :-) And any suggestion for speakers to complement it? Giving me enough mids (and some nice bas & high too of course...)? shouldn't be too huge though, gotta keep my woman happy....Thanks again.
You've probably figured out that you prefer soft dome tweeters like I have also discovered. I also prefer sealed box enclosures. While it limits the woofer to its natural frequency, the frequencies it covers are very true to life.
@@Supashoppa69 Buy yourself a pair of NHT Super One 2.1 and you tell me. I listened to Neil Young's recording of "Old Man" live from Royal Albert Hall from 1971 and it sounded like I was there. No fancy special wires or amplification either, just a vintage Pioneer SX3700 and run of the mill stranded copper 16 awg wires and an Oppo 83 universal player. All equipment combined cost under $500 usd -- probably under $400.
Hi Kelvin I have a pair of 12l2s which were the model which came after this I think. I always thought that they were ok but a but dull. No bottom end. One day I swapped the speaker cables on one speaker only and suddenly the improved a lot (I mean a lot). I now think that they were out of phase the whole time. Can it really be that the speakers were wired up internally from the factory incorrectly. Have you ever come across that before????
@@stereoreviewx Hi Kelvin thanks for answering..ps just watched your vid again and have to agree with everything. I checked the specs and it is indeed rated at 200 Watts. Just trying to imagine what would happen if I put 200 watts though them lol - maybe they were exaggerating a bit
Hi how you doing you well! I think you should make it clear when you say 30 to "200 Watts" I'll let you explain if you want if you know? No it's the butt plug I hate butt plugs that's, giving you that awful tone easy........ you got an old felt platter mat glue it all the way around the butt plug
Love your reviews and happy to hear more , as an ex secondhand hifishop holder in Brussels ,I understand very well your evaluations and estimate them musically accurate
It’s quite a refreshing style of delivery and presenting style. It’s like talking to a friend about the subject.
Hi Kelvin, just wanted to say how much I’m enjoying your channel. Keep up the good work.
I appreciate that!
I have owned a few pairs of the L-Series speakers from Quad. I had similar issues with the 12L2. Gorgeous looking things, sounded good but not great. They just never sat right with me and I ended up moving them on. However the 77-11l are much much better. Not sure if its the smaller driver or cabinet, but they are absolutely lovely to listen to.
I really appreciate your videos! Honest and with humor. These Quads were for me my first newly bought hifi-speakers (live in Holland). I guess about € 500 in 2006. Very solidly built. Nice sounding. I recognize your comment especially on lacking some ‘space’ and mid range. I sold them. Now i love my IMF Super Compacts as vintage ( 🇬🇧) and Dali Rubicon 2 monitor speakers as well, depending on my music and/or mood.
Given that I used a Quad amp in the past, I was curious when someone sold a pair for 175 euro. But listening to this review and reading these comments I am glad I didn't buy them. 175 for a quite old speaker that is probably a deep 3rd in order behind my Wharfedale Evo 4.2 and Diamond 11.2 isn't worth it. It is the brand that keeps the value but 60 euro's would be my max in what I feel it should be worth
Pity for those Quads. Their smaller model, the Quad 11l, sounded marvellous to me.
Same
11l has fantastic mids,vocal. I got the 22l which sounded a bit more laid back
Kevlar is good because it is only material where the wave of the deformation diagram before and after the load is the same, which has an impact on sound accuracy, only that it needs more pure power to move properly (B&W for example). It is generally laid back (woven material) compared to stiffer materials (which has been said). BTW heavy materials (like polypropylene cones) needs power too. Usually speakers with polypropylene cone have a lower sensitivity (db), precisely because they need more clean power to provide (their) maximum . Harbeth for example. Cheers!
It’s interesting what you say about the bass reproduction of an electric bass guitar sounding synthetic on the Quad, but the sound of an electric bass IS synthetic in it’s self as the instrument does not generate its sound naturally.
I had the 11L and 12L long time ago.
Love the 11L.
The 12L sounded slower, fuller.
Love your channel. Keep up the good work.
I used to have a pair of these. Great at the time. Superb veneers.
I still remember when the 11L and subsequently the 12L came out, they had amazing reviews. I auditioned them with the Roksan Caspian M Series-1 which was also very well reviewed at the time and they sounded fantastic. Well, I would say mainly on audiophile female jazz type vocals such as your standard issued Diana Krall and the likes. I thought the Quads sounded sweet and rosy with the Roksan. Although I didn't end up buying them as I opted for a pair floorstanders instead, that impression I had of the Quads always stayed with me as I really regretted not getting them at the time.
well-written. Native?
@@justinking5964 Thanks. Native as in am I British?
@@Rascallucci British or American.I am stuck with finding a suitable and affordable speaker ,which really pains me. thanks for your response.
@@justinking5964 Not exactly, but I was kind of educated in the UK and was a PR at one point. So, you are looking for speakers? Bookshelf/standmount? Small? What budget are you looking at? What's your taste in sound? Warm vs bright, which end are you at?
Nice video. I recently had a nightmare buying a pair of old Monitor Audio 252 speakers from eBay, i decided to to a buying tips video myself.
Monitor speakers are spezial. Sounded mostly extreme Flat.
I've been looking for a pair of MA R252 on ebay also, what kind of issues did you have? Also what is the sound quality of the MA R252,? I mainly listen to Bollywood music from the 60's, 70's and 80's. Thanks
Hi Michael. let me know when the video is up or where do i look .cheers K
@@girishkukadia9916 Hi , i have the MD version, but it was a little hard to give a true sound quality opinion of these as the driver speaker in one was farting from time to time , but i did find them to be very boomy to the extent that on 3 receivers / amps i tested them with i had to have the bass control nearly off completely.
Apart from the bass issue i found the treble a little disappointing, not as clean and nice as i thought it would be. finding a cheap pair my be worth a try, but i would not pay over £100 for them
Thanks
Hi Kelvin, thanks for doing these reviews, I'm a vintage enthusiast myself so always good to hear an opinion.
I agree that different speaker cone materials have different characteristics, however, a strong characteristic of composite cones is their stiffness. In the case of the Kevlar it's down to the resin they impregnate it with and generally it's very stiff indeed. However, the important thing about speaker materials is their behaviour in the frequencies above their optimum operating range.
Very stiff materials have breakup nodes which are highly pronounced, which in turn means they have to have high order crossovers to roll off the sound quickly above the crossover frequency. These crossovers are component heavy and have the effect of reducing efficiency and often cause a dip in the upper midrange. Sound familiar?
In paper cone speakers, you may have a little more flex, which introduces some colouration, like all vintage Wharfedales, but the breakup nodes are softer so the crossovers are simpler. Result is more efficiency, easier to drive.
Thanks for your info my friend
K
We always referred to fully closed box speakers as acoustic suspension types. The fully open back was called the infinite baffle.
I had the quad 11l with a Musical fidelity xa1 and Cyrus dad3 Q, that was a long time ago. A great system that I miss.
Hi Kelvin. Would love to see/hear you review your go to speakers. Really enjoying your reviews.
I have owned the Quad 12Ls since 2004. I am about to replace them, but I find it surprising that you say they have issues with space, separation and vocals, as I find that's their main strength! Were they bi-wired?
They can deliver loads of low end for the size, but it's uncontrolled.
Hi Mark what are you thinking of going with I am at the point of looking around not sure if going with Kef R3 or Quad S1 or S2 as I would want centre speaker to match. At moment Quad stereo and M&K surround but need space so have to combine both.
Same, had 12L2s, 21Ls and while the "shriek" comment is spot-on, the seemingly "lack of space" is something I think that could come from someone expecting L series performing on Quad electrostats level. The sense of atmosphere in jazz recordings (Dolphy's "At the Five Spot" vol.I comes to mind) is something my AP Tempo2 just can't bring back.
Agreed, I bought the 22l because of the 11l. I think they have great vocals.
I have to agree. Still have the 12Ls. They are "monitor" speakers and in my humble opinion deliver...
I found myself nodding in agreement with your assessment of these speakers. When I heard them and their little brother, the 11L, I was very underwhelmed. I remember all the sales guys going on about how amazing the 'new quad speakers' are, but I was seriously unimpressed. They sound 'clammy' to me...'phlegmy', even. That's the Kevlar driver for you, for sure. Paper's my fave cone material for sure.
Yes for Kevlar woven thing never sounded good to me ever BAnd W seem to use it in the mid range units high end ones and it seems to work but mostly I agree it’s just not good sounding
Describing sound with words is not easy, but you actually do a great job.
I have a pair of the Quads for I guess close to 20 years. They were What hifi speaker of the year for I think two years. They are not rated even close to 200W from memory, more like 60w max. I also have a pair of the Kef’ LS50’s on a separate system. The Quads win hands down so maybe your Quads are time expired.
Kelvin is spot on about comparing and contrasting.
You will soon hear faults.
Cone materials have a signature - speed v breakup. Kevlar is only good for bass, not mids.
Hence even B&W dropped it.
Agreed
Please can you look at some old and new Tannoys love them here in Southport!! Good video's thanks.
I have the quad 12L but i think they are way too muddy, a lot of bass which interferes with higher tones. Personally I love a punchy bass and not a slow bass. I solved the problem with putting rolled up socks in the backports to close them completely. The bass is now punchy and i like the sound much much better.
I can hear the instruments a lot better now and it's more lively
Yes I’ve done that many times for myself you losing base really but gaining in the mid range and that can be a plus
I did this! Made a couple of "nunchucks" with insulating foam (for water/heating pipes) and rope so I could tune the bass by plugging one or both ports. It certainly tames the mud.
Is there a specific absorption co-efficient in Sabins for these "socks" or a particular product or are they just actually socks. I'm looking at buying a yard pair and the hass sounds like it needs some work.
My Focals have paper cones and are super-efficient so they sound GREAT with vintage gear.
Good to know!
@@stereoreviewx The Focal 806s are fantastic. I recently bought some speakers that cost 5 times as much. They're a little better but not 5 times!
I like the practical pencil test. Re the Quad, perhaps it require proper placement. I had a B&W 600 series and it is very picky with the sweet spot
The what?!
Sounds like my ex-girlfriend.
Hi Kelvin, I am going thru the process of comparing my 12L's right now and they are exactly the same look as yours there. I confess that to look at they are the best i have ever owned and this may be affecting my critical judgement of them as i so like how they look! Which ofcourse is strictly speaking Not what it is about because we are talking 'sound'. But i am sure that i am in good company with others who have a certain pride in how their speakers look to friends dropping round and noticing - don't we! When i have satisfied myself of their sound i will report back...
Hey one thing Howard try carefully tightening up the base driver screws you can do the tweeter as well but it’s not so important but they can get loose and loose driver is a bad thing don’t strip the thread though
Woven Kevlar ( or carbon fibre ) cones make EXCELLENT mid drivers ! With the right surround and cms ( suspension compliance ) they can reproduce the harshest of transients . Light years ahead of that doped Bextrene that KEF used all through the 70's . For fast undistorted bass you can't go past highly rigid paper or sandwiched cones ( like the one used on the LEAK 600 and KEF B110 )....
I have the Quad 11L2s. I don't doubt you're right about the kevlar sound. I've nothing to compare them to though they are better sounding than the two pairs of Missions I had before. There's a hi-fi dealer a couple of miles away with LS3/5s in the window. Your videos are inspiring me to investigate them.
Hi Tom well LS35A is in a hi-fi dealer got a bit expensive I guess all I would say is there only worth it if you’ve got a properly good front end otherwise you may not appreciate the qualities K
@@stereoreviewx Yes, that's a point. I'll keep up the research (kicking back with a cuppa, watching your videos).
@@stereoreviewx I repleced the 11L2s with a pair of Naim Arivas. I heard them with other Naim kit. With my NAD 320 they were lacking something so I bought a Naim Uniti. I'm loving listening to music again.
You know how music today is super compressed to emphasize loudness, bass, and shrieking highs? The same thing has happened to audio gear! Its all made to focus on the extremes and actual musicality has been left in the dirt.
Hi Kevin I’ve only just seen your comment and I Gotta say it sounds right it’s kind of shocking that progress seems to not have been made.cheers K
I find this quite disturbing. It is ruining the original product, an intrusion not asked for. Why does this have to happen? And with gear generally? - because everything has to be Spiced up, is it?
@@howardleah8401 B&W and Focal sound good in the store after just a few months but once you take them home you discover what people mean when they say something is FATIGUING!
The quads need to be bi amped and want a lot of power thrown at them to sound their best. I have my 11L2 connected to a 200w luxman power amp using both the A+B speaker terminals.
Sounds fun
Just started watching your channel. People want way too much for used gear. The prices are just ridiculous.
I agree it’s got out of hand
Nice that we get vacuum in a ceiled/infinity box.
I thought that we got under and over pressure. Vacuum sound much cooler ;)
I like your style!
Hey Kelvin. Some Quad 12L's came up for sale in my area. I listen to a lot of jazz, 70's fusion/Jazz curious if you think they would be ok. I love detail, presence and clarity (very Hi-Fi). Can you or anyone help me.
The guy selling them can only audition playing Spotify!!!! I Can't audition speakers using that as the source audio.
hi Kevin, possibly review some TDl electronic speakers. transmission line models from 80-90's? studio 1 possibly. also the rtl budget range. great channel by the way
I think the Quads were a bit overrated when they were new, but they looked good and they sold bucket loads of them. With so many on the 2nd hand market they are good value, particularly if you like the looks. The rubber woofer surrounds are starting to perish on some examples.
I have a bit of a thing for vintage Acoustic Research. Do you have any? Just picked up a pair of AR-6s and really like the bass. Would be interested to hear your views on AR.
I just bought a new Denon receiver... it's going back. The comparison of musicality between that and my 1974 Sansui 101 is jaw dropping. Unless you're spending big dollars, todays stuff just doesn't compare. No definition, soundstage, imaging... none of it. Long live the old ! :)
Hi Scott would love to know what model that was or how much it cost the 101 is a great thing
@@stereoreviewx The Denon is an AVR-S540BT. $300 canadian.
I think I'll look into getting the 101 fixed. :)
@@stereoreviewx So I picked up a NAD C316 amp today and matching cd player. The amp is a worthy replacement to the Sansui 101; it's slightly warmer, valvy/tubey, VERY detailed which makes it easier to appreciate musical arrangements and how the various instruments intertwine. NOTHING gets lost in the mix. The tone of different snare drums, bass guitars etc is easy to discern. The opening guitar in DAY TRIPPER for example is more tonally funkier than I've heard before. The effect of the band being in the room is definitely more vivid than with the Sansui, again due to the details in the timbre of instruments and voices and it's punch. It was a $500 (can) purchase. Bare bones for features but where it's important (dynamics, timbre, warmth, power, musical details) it really shines. For anyone looking for a modern version of vintage sound, it's a great choice. Nice little remote that operates the amp AND cd player. Happy fathers day to ME. :)
Hi love your reviews, as you deal with vintage hifi, could you advice me on my Qaud 405-2 amp do i leave it on all the time or not, ive been getting some say yes some say no, i would love your opinion on this Thanks .
i got tosay thts a long raging question its a technical issue i dont exactly understand .
if it was me i dont think i would care i would just think about the electricity bill.
My Old Man had Keff floor standing largish units, Codas?? ... Good quality. I had Heybrooks on stands fed by an Arcam 90 integrated amp and decent cables in a small self enclosed room over a wooden floor and all glass doors and hard surfaces within. Sources- an average Technics CD Player and a Rega Planar3. Still sounded quite warm to me. Then bought large Monitor Audios (I have their DAB tuner too) and got violently burgled. Speakers damaged.
Insurance claim and I got these quads for £325. 2004 ish.
My tastes are Hard Rock and Mahler Schubert and Dvorkak broadly and I've lost a lot of high end hearing.
I rate the Quads.
In a separate casual room I had Goldring Lenco GL 75 Idler wheel.. Last Pro serviced in 1885 around Norbury area when it wsnt bad(Dad gift who always bought the best he could afford) Nad 3020, Technics CD & Denon MINI Disc which was never used. Pure DAB and a nice Nakamichi never used into good old Mission 700s!. I'm listening here on B&O Blootoof Phones which are also a bit synthetic!
Nice to hear the history thanks
Nice relief from race wars, Cummings and goings and oh... the virus. Thanks mate!
Kelvin, you say you are not mad about any of the above speakers, what are your go to speakers for everyday listening please? Thanks
well if can make noise spendor bc1 and if i cant rogers ls35a .having said that i am sure there are better speakers that i havent heard yet.K
Hi Kelvin, can I ask what would be your go-to speakers for under £500 new or old
Great vids 👍🏻
Hi Kelvin, I got a pair of L12L2 not sure what exactly changed except the tweeter looks a bit different. I got them for 10 years now paired to an Arcam Solo. I wonder if they would improve with a stronger amplifier or maybe time to upgrade the whole kit, I was looking at the KEF so your review was quite helpful.
Well I’ll see what I can think of that is useful firstly arcam which I refused recently actually arecam eight alpha I’m fairly impressed by them.
As for the quads to me I just flat out don’t do anything good I will also mention I literally this evening put on the Kef sl 50 50s and took him off in five minutes they are really fun killing speakers the mid range is just not right.
So I’m not offering you much here but what I’m certain of is there are loads better modern speakers than the quads and the kefs .
Hope this helpsK
I like your channel, but the second hand cost you quote on some of the equipment you review is very low. The Quad 12L speakers sell for around £250+ on eBay amongst other places. Still enjoy the channel!
Do you check out the sold prices which you can find in the filter on eBay rather than the buy now prices
I’ve got to say I think the prices are getting a bit crazy and kind of wrong nowadays
CheersK
@@stereoreviewx I can pick them up including stands for 300 euro but I am in doubt, however I think my old NAD 3020e would be happy...
@@Sandraud I can’t remember exactly what I said in that video but I just found those speakers disappointing though I did check the sold prices in the UK and the average was around £220 which surprised me K
Hi Stereo X. Could you comment on 1970s Sony stereo receivers? Thinking of the Sony STR 70XX series. 15 wpc. How do they rate agains't the Sansui/ marantz offerings?
pretty sure sansui and marantz just plain better K
ive got a pair of dm602s2 from B&W which my late mum bought me ex demo when i was 13 in 2001 but recently found one of the voice coils on the woofer had perished slightly which i hadnt noticed and i had never cranked them , ive decided to let them go and replace them with a series 3 dm602 or dm110 im wondering what your opinion of this plan would be as im fond of large stand mount speakers
Good stuff
Do you know what kind of integrated amplifier to drive good the minor QUAD 77-11L speakers?
But the b&w dm5 has Kevlar bassmid aswell but performs amazingly well IMHO and ears, it goes deeper and faster then the dm4
Yes that does look like a Kevlar driver this must be one of the very first.
I have a love-hate relationship with my 12L, which I hook with a Sugden Audition. For near field, it is not so good, the speakers need to be driven and have front 2 m at least. Maybe it is another product from the marketing department: 1100 $ CDN tag price, nice piano black - I hate that - and bass not so bad when you crank it.
Trying to pair this with rega Mira 3
Any speaker cable recommendations???
Ps - funnily enough i have always had a thing for gently tapping woofers like yourself. I feel it gives me some information about them before hearing ( also one can tell if the speaker is 'seized' as can happen on second hand ones that are being purchased) - though i know this behaviour is frowned upon badly within the critical hifi world...
You may be a market maker. Quad 12L are £350 upwards today on eBay.
Hi there. Thanks a lot for your videos, they are a very big help. But I was wondering if you could maybe have some advise for me please? I'm a professional musician (sound is my life) and I'm sort of stuck between my old studio setup and my new vintage Hi-fi setup. I need a nice amp and speakers to complement my Revox A77 & Thorens TD165 (both in mint condition). Now they're hooked up to a NAD C165BEE preamp and Genelec 1030A's and as nice as it sounds, it's coldish and clean and lacks (to my taste) the nice mids and low mids. No way of tweaking the sound, because the NAD only has bass an treble adjustment ( only meant to add super low or super high...). I was thinking to buy an older Sansui (AU999, AU777, AU7900, etc.), have it completely recapped and some nice speakers (Kef, B&W, AR, Altec, etc.)? Do I first buy the amp, have it recapped and then start looking for speakers? The amp seems the most expensive and my budget is that of a professional musician ;- ) I mostly listen to records from the end 50's beginning 60's...Kind regards, Mischa from Amsterdam.
Hard for me to give specific advice not sure what your power and peas or do you mean theNad is the amplifier
Off the top of my head Sansui a U555
It will give you warmth and detail it’s luxurious
@@stereoreviewx Thank you so much for replying, very kind. Yes, I will sell the NAD and the Genelec speakers. And buy a Sansui AU555A. It looks absolutely stunning too, by the way :-) And any suggestion for speakers to complement it? Giving me enough mids (and some nice bas & high too of course...)? shouldn't be too huge though, gotta keep my woman happy....Thanks again.
Totally over thought TMI too much information you just need an amp speakers & whatever delivery method
B&w used to have kevlar as drivers, and wharfedale still use kevlar.
I’ve got to say I always found those Kevlar drivers kind of squawking but I think BMW made them working very expensive speakers
Not only does it feel like 7 or 8 people singing, there are 7 or 8 people singing,?
Have you listened to the Quad S2's?
Not yet
You've probably figured out that you prefer soft dome tweeters like I have also discovered. I also prefer sealed box enclosures. While it limits the woofer to its natural frequency, the frequencies it covers are very true to life.
Does it prevent soft synthetic sounding bass?
Yes i like the bass punch of a sealed box generally ports are softer though this is something that has improved with time .K
@@Supashoppa69 Buy yourself a pair of NHT Super One 2.1 and you tell me. I listened to Neil Young's recording of "Old Man" live from Royal Albert Hall from 1971 and it sounded like I was there. No fancy special wires or amplification either, just a vintage Pioneer SX3700 and run of the mill stranded copper 16 awg wires and an Oppo 83 universal player. All equipment combined cost under $500 usd -- probably under $400.
Hi Kelvin I have a pair of 12l2s which were the model which came after this I think. I always thought that they were ok but a but dull. No bottom end. One day I swapped the speaker cables on one speaker only and suddenly the improved a lot (I mean a lot). I now think that they were out of phase the whole time. Can it really be that the speakers were wired up internally from the factory incorrectly. Have you ever come across that before????
I personally haven’t seen it but there’s Humira I guess so I’m sure it’s possible
@@stereoreviewx Hi Kelvin thanks for answering..ps just watched your vid again and have to agree with everything. I checked the specs and it is indeed rated at 200 Watts. Just trying to imagine what would happen if I put 200 watts though them lol - maybe they were exaggerating a bit
@TomTom Quad 12L2 Speakers - Out of Phase Mystery Solved: th-cam.com/video/PZ8LPt91614/w-d-xo.html
You should mention what equipment, stands and cables you use and room size and placement when testing? or even show the room and speakers being tested
Any thoughts on cartridges?
Did you have them single or Bi-wired?
to bi wire, or not to bi wire:)
Kevlar is so soft they make bullet proof vests out of it.
Yeah I know it’s a funny thing isn’t it they should stick to the bullet proof fest
I just bought a really expensive modern amp. If it doesn't blow me away I'm gonna sell it and stick with vintage gear!
You’ve got to tell us what it is and how it compares please.K
@@stereoreviewx Its the Willsenton R8 and I'm still waiting to get it from China!
@Matthew Taylor You're right. and I'm keeping it.
@@trekjudas Kevin did you get the R8,and what does it sound like? Thanks
@@richardjohnston4682 the R8 is warm but dynamic and it’s got some nice sexy bass.
Hi how you doing you well!
I think you should make it clear when you say 30 to "200 Watts" I'll let you explain if you want if you know?
No it's the butt plug I hate butt plugs that's, giving you that awful tone easy........ you got an old felt platter mat glue it all the way around the butt plug
Kevlar drivers need stupid amounts of power so they're probably worthless with vintage gear.
Once you've heard Quad Electrostatics, none of these little boxes sound any good.
Electrostatics are impressive but I don’t get the focus from them
I always love quad over two bull shit speaker.
Stop bashing your woofers 😮
I like it