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Could you please do content on the Honda XR150L? I'm looking at buying one as my first bike once I'm done with CDL school. Thank you again, and I love your content! Can't wait to hit some BDR trails! From your Concord, North Carolina viewer here! 😅
As someone who lives in the Southern California desert the most important part about water is not only drinking it while you exert yourself but BEFORE you start exerting yourself. Pre-hydration will save your butt. I've seen plenty of people get dehydrated even though they brought water because they only stopped to drink it once they started feeling thirsty.
excellent point! usually, when most people realize theyre suffering from dehydration , its already to late!! you must drink even if you think youre not thirsty!! it also takes a long time to rehydrate yourself, its not a drink a bottle of water and head back out!!
Thanks for putting this one out Ben. Bonus group riding tip: Leave your ego at home and most of the previous tips won’t be an issue. Bonus Bonus group riding tip: Have a great sweep rider for your group rides. The sweep rider should be one of the better riders, with the most reliable and equipped motorcycle.
For those that have never heard the term "sweep rider" it means the tail rider/last person in the group. I fill this role a lot when out on group rides, I'm always on the edge of being over prepared (if that's even possible) The sweep riders responsibility is to ensure everyone in front of them gets to where they need to be and to assist in any mechanical or emergency situations that may arise.
I don't know if this has been brought up before, so here goes. I am 76 years old. I have been riding dirt bikes for 50+ years. I started riding quads in 1990, and did not even have a dirt bike for several years, but I am getting back into it with a TW 200. I am a competent rider, but, I have been known to make mistakes from time to time. 99.9% of my riding is done alone. I just like it that way for one thing, and I don't know anyone that likes to ride like I do, for another thing. I always tell my better half where I will be going. At least the general area, because sometimes when I am exploring a new area, I do not know where I can go, and where I can't go. I always have a hydration pack with me, and inside the hydration pack I carry a PLB. (Personal Locater Beacon) Mine goes straight to the rescue satellites, and it lasts for 5 years. Some of the newer ones will actually allow you to text a message. I may look into one like that when my PLB expires in one more year. I DO have to be able to activate it, so if I am unconscious, all bets are off. I understand the risks, and I am ok with that. I also do not do risky maneuvers in questionable terrain. I read a story about hydration that happened in Ansa-Borago desert in Southern California. 3 veteran riders were riding dirt bikes in the desert in the summer, and one of them started to show signs of heat stroke. The other 2 left him under a bush and each went in a different direction to look for help. They found a Ranger, and headed out to get the heat stroke guy. When they got to where they had left him, he was not there. They followed his tracks and found him. He was dead. From the time that they left him, until the time that they had found him, it was only 2 hours. Heat is deadly!!!! One time I was riding alone in the spring with my XT 600. I found a cool road and followed it for 10 miles. It had a washed out section, and I should have turned around and went back. This is one of those mistakes that I mentioned earlier. I made it across the washout and went another 1/2 mile, and found the road to be 100% washed out, so I turned around to go back. I might add that the road was carved out of the side of a mountain, and 70 feet down from the road was a 400 foot vertical cliff. When I made it back to the first washout, my bike slid off the goat trail that I was using. I could not lift up that heavy bike, so I took my water bottle that I always carried with me and headed off on foot back to where I was parked. There were others riding when I left. I went about 1/2 a mile, and by then I had drank all of my water. I stopped and thought to myself, "this is how people die in the desert. I walked back to my 600, and took my toolkit screwdriver and actually dug a trail under my machine. This took over an hour. I fired up the bike and pushed as hard as I could and slipped the clutch very bad until I made it back to the road. This was before I had a PLB. Would I have died? I don't know, but I certainly could have. It all started by me foolishly trying to go over a washout that was so very close to a 400 foot vertical cliff. I was simply stupid, and somehow lived to tell the tale. I do not go anywhere without my PLB!!!!! End of story. One of the stories on the PLB web site was of 2 older people near Flagstaff AZ. They were 30 miles from the highway, and got stuck. They thought that in order to use their PLB, they should have been injured. They tried to walk out, but soon gave up on that. In desperation they activated the PLB. When the rescuers got to them, they immediately started apologizing for using the PLB when they were not injured. The rescuers simply said, "we would MUCH rather rescue you folks than come out and do a body recovery!"
For water, figure out what you think you need, get double that. I live in Canada, winter air is cold, get water even when it’s cold. Self sufficiency is critical. One man one kit.
The one mistake I see all the time on TH-cam and in different "groups" on sosial medias is that people ride way to fast on gravel and rocky tracks... and most TH-camrs seems to think that it's important to ride as fast as possible and look cool! Install the "Go slower 2.0" upgrade into that thing that the helmets are made to protect... and things mostly goes well. BDR, TAT, TET, etc. etc. is not racetracks!
I've heard riders being discouraged of riding tougher trails because they can't "keep up" with easy trail goons. If only they knew the pace and comradery is soooo much nicer when the going gets tougher!
@@OAK_MTN comradery? when people push each other to make mistakes and get injured? Nope, that is not comradery... Comradery is when the most experienced riders hold the pace they see is what the less experienced rider can hold without high risiko. unnecessary risiko is for braindead idiots...
While I agree its not a racetrack if the gravel is good and smooth I'm not gonna be in 2nd gear doing 25mph. Speed is 100% related to rider experience, confidence and type of terrain. What you consider "way to fast" on gravel is going to be different to what I consider way to fast on gravel. Ride your ride and let others ride their ride.
Gotta admit that the "self sufficient" things scares me quite a bit. Got back into riding this summer and don't really know how to change a flat or anything like that. Bonus for me is that I always ride close to home and got roadside assistance. Hopeing to pick up some mechanics skills during the winter time.
On my first ride into the wilderness alone I misjudged the difficulty of the terrain and I ended up very low on gas, without battery on my phone and out of water in the summer... Not great but I made it out. Great advices for all riders!
I lead a lot of adventure rides, not because I'm a good or experienced rider, but because there are few in my groups that want to post and lead rides. I've always said "keep an eye on the rider behind you". I like "You are responsible for the rider behind you" much better. So I'm stealing that. Along with your explanation of how that keeps the group together. And, if there is someone in the group that has a problem with that, it's probably someone I don't want to ride with.
So glad you brought up that group riding means you're responsible for the people in that group. Even road riders suffer from folks who don't care about what's happening to those behind them. If you want to ride on your own, please don't join a group outing!
Great tips! Regarding keeping the group together and safe, I learned a way to do this at the Adventure Days in Sweden: The leader always drives first The apointed "Sweeper" always drives last. Because members of the group where unacquainted the leader and sweeper wore vests in different color to make it easy to spot them. When coming to an intersection the Leader signals to the guy behind who will stop and wait for the whole group to pass, pointing them in the right direction. When the Sweeper comes and signals that "I see you, Im the last guy, you can go" this guy sets of.
great to mention winter too, as riding in cold needs too to hydrate ! and pointing the autonomy of each rider, because 5 riders standing alone by themselves are not 1+ 1+ 1+ 1+ 1= 5 but 11111 synergy ;)
so many great points here!! I always fall back on the old military saying "Hydrate or Die". I carry 3 liters of water in my Camelbak plus a 40oz hydro flask stored in my bottle bag and that is not enough for me for an entire 8 hour riding day. Riding is exhausting and its very easy to get dehydrated.
I usually ride sweep and help others with sections they don’t feel comfortable with like loose rock hills with an offset. To ensure people ride their own ride I always add a comment to the riders meeting “When in doubt, chicken out”. I always bring extra water, food, tool kit, tube, patch kit and Garmin inreach and luckily all I’ve had to use is my extra water. Good video.
Sage advice. Didn't dual-sport ride with a group few years back didn't ride my ride tried to keep up basically did everything you said not to do ended up in a cast so I couldn't agree more from personal experience I will say absolutely everything you're saying is spot-on I learned the hard way
Good vid and tips. I'm a new rider and did my first group ride last month. I bought my first ever bike last May (a brand new klr 650s) because a friend got me interested in adv riding. We planned a trip one day last month and four other guys joined us. Well about ten minutes into the trip I got in over my head trying to keep up with them and went down. Minor injuries to my left knee and right soldier and some cosmetic damage to the bike. My friend told the other riders to go on and he would basically babysit me the rest of the day on easier trails. We rode another 6 hours or so but I have been paying for that fall ever since. Hopefully the upcoming mri's will show no major damage. Love your channel and keep posting great instructional videos.
The water issue astounds me. Water is my oxygen when riding. At any rate, I see nothing but downsides in riding with anyone else. The last thing I want to see while riding is another human.
Thanks for the good tips. I do disagree with one of the group riding "rules": Staggered riding off pavement. I totally agree with it on pavement but not off, especially for new riders. It does give a run off space between you and the rider in front of you but in off pavement riding give more space between riders rather than one rider being in the left track. As RideBDR promotes and gives stickers out: RIDE RIGHT! The reason: There could be road/trail changes and when it is time to get in the right track there could be a rut, deep gravel, or other hazard and the person in the right track may not be able to get over before the corner or worse an on coming fast moving vehicle. Also, if they are riding staggered to give more run out space they are riding too close and if something happens the person in the right track may need to avoid something and the rider in the left track doesn't have enough time to get stopped before they get to that same spot. I don't like to disagree with you since you do have excellent advice but over 30+ of off pavement riding I have experienced all these things with other riders. Keep reminding people about being responsible for the rider behind you during group/led off pavement rides. Rider become afraid they will get lost from the group if they don't keep the rider in front of them in sight and don't wait. Making sure the person behind you sees you at the turn, gives a thumbs up or whatever signal you agree on. I was on a single track trail ride, the person in front of me saw me coming through the trees and left the intersection. I didn't see her, when I got to the cross trail I didn't know which way she went. There was one person behind me. The lead rider was the only one ahead of us. The two of us went the way we thought, finished riding for the day and returned to camp. The "leader" was sure pissed when she discovered she was out there alone because she didn't wait at the intersection. That wasn't the first time she wanted to lead on a ride then didn't wait at an intersection assuming everyone knew the route. I guess she needed to learn a lesson. In June I was on a group off pavement ride and I was hanging back with the sweep rider. The person in front of me didn't wait at an intersection but I just waited for the sweep to confirm which way to go. At the next stop I found the person that didn't wait, since this is a pet peeve, and I found out why he didn't wait. It was a T intersection of sorts with one trail curving left and one curving right, he was so focused on the right trail and the person waiting for him that he didn't see the left curve. Keep the good stuff coming!
I occasionally ride in a group with a guy who is so focused on riding fast, he literally does not see intersections half the time. Personally, half my enjoyment on these rides is the wilderness around me. But some guys are only riding for speed and the challenge of the trail. They tend to suck at noticing anything other than what is directly in front of them
@@DorkintheRoad almost ready for moto GP 🤣. I never had a flat yet but that’s my nightmare. I carry the Baja no pinch kit with me and all the necessary tools in case of….when I work on my bike, I use only the tools I carry.
One of your best videos. Just finished the Dirtdaze rally in the NE and I wish some of the beginners there had watched this first even though the guides said most of this before leaving on the ride. Thanks!
Another excellent video Ben. I think you did/do a great job helping guys with your advice and stories. I have to say that I RESPECTFULLY disagree with staggered approach while off road. Experience has shown that a lot of bad things happen when a rider must switch from the left to the right side on short notice - especially in sandy or rocky sections where the center of the road/trail is piled up with soft stuff. How many times have we all almost ate it when crossing over. under the best of scenarios. Just as important is that if everybody is "riding right" the guy coming the other way will already be set to safely go by, thus avoiding the face to face "who's going where?" decision. Another group riding dynamic worth thinking about comes up is when the slowest and least experienced people are put in the back of the group. As you pointed out, being in back encourages newby's on the slowest bikes, worst gear, and lack of confidence to ride over their heads just trying to "keep up". Throw in a extra helping of dehydration and some dust and I think you have a recipe for disaster. On bigger group rides where slow and fast riders are mixed together, a "fast guys up front" approach results in big gaps between riders on the longer stretches. Eventually a slinky effect begins to develop and the fast guys end up with multiple 5-10 minute micro breaks waiting for the slow folks to catch up. And when the stragglers do come rolling up, you'll see impatient "fast guys" itching to get going. Sadly, the slow/inexperienced guys who could really use the same short breaks along the way are UNntentionally pressured to get going. When this happens I think it's better to break the crowd into smaller groups (no less than 3) based on pace and experience. I'm certainly no expert, but I hope my comments are seen as constructive.
I was the guy that didn't stop at the turn and wait on a group ride once, but it was also one of my first group rides and I totally forgot I needed to. Fortunately I remembered before I went to far and managed to chase everyone down. But an important thing is to go over some of these things before embarking. People should be stopping at intersections and waiting, but not everyone knows to do this.
Really good points friend. particularly when comes to dualsport rides, many machines are more capable than others and this needs to be respected by the group - one of the things we've done is marshaling to get the faster riders and machines up front so they are cutting trail for the heavier or less capable/skilled people in trail.
Also like others have mentioned always have a sweep rider - someone with extra of something. I've bailed plenty of folks with an extra squeezy of 2t oil even though I'm a 4t because they had to take on an extra liter or two fuel to make it out.
Tip # 6 if your just earning g how to ride off road don't do it on a big bike loaded to the hilt. Start small work your way up. Find a couple of friends ride some trails first on a dirt bike. Just did the ORBDR big bikes loaded like they packed the house on there. Seen way to many crashes from mud to sand to just rocky terrain. Skill set is the key Good luck out there be safe .
Something about passing, my group got passed a few times at ADV Fest in Black Hills. Usually we would get out of that way and wave them on. One time, a dude tried to get by us without us noticing. I almost rode off the road as I wasn't expecting someone to be right next to me when I was moving left to follow the line through some ruts. Dude didn't seem to care, the group found a spot to pull over to let the ass by before getting any of us in a wreck.
These skills carry over, to and from, those of us who ride ATV's, side bys, snowmobiles, and the Jeepers... Ben, thanks for taking the time to remind all of us who motor into the back country. I will be riding my adv bike off-road soon, and the basics are so important. You get a gold star
Staggered? I'll stay to the right as much as possible because people coming the other way on dirt roads don't always follow rules. Group rides? I went on a group ride a few months back and remembered why I don't do group rides. Someone trying to tell me where to go, where to turn, when to stop, what to see is not fun for me. I'll catch up later or you can catch up to me.
Great points! I'm a lone wolf who hasn't had the opportunity to ride with others and I hope that these will resonate when I have that opportunity! Great stuff! ❤❤
Thank you for this! I'm new to all of this, and have been out only a couple times in a somewhat heavy SWM super dual. I love it, but am kind of slow. Need to build more confidence.
All great information. I was surprised that you and Tim seemed to not be riding together on parts of the Oregon BDR. From the video it appeared you couldn't see one another at all times and even got separated. For that kind of riding, I'm definitely not comfortable riding a BDR alone, so having other riders nearby feels like a must, as incidents can happen. Stay safe, riding is inherently dangerous, but we all do it because we love it.
He was mostly behind me but I stopped all the time to make sure he was good. That just doesn't make it into the video. You also sort of relax on some of these things when you're riding with people you know well who ride around the same skill level. I don't check in as much, but I do still stop from time to time because the unexpected happens.
Excellent contents! Excellent presentation and explanations! (It's like you used to be a teacher or something. Wait a minute - you are still a teacher!) These principles apply to all group riding, on-pavement or off-pavement. Thank you for this!
Just because it was easy to miss Ben saying this I want to repeat it. If due to the terrain becomes too difficult or if for some other reason you decide to drop out of the group always let other members of the group know. Never separate from a group without first informing the group. If you separate without informing the group they may spend hours searching for you. This would be extremely rude. An additional thing that I always try to do when on unpaved roads is to slow down a lot when passing people's camp sites, hikers and bicyclist. It is rude to fly by covering someone camp site dust. Also hikers and bicyclist aren't expecting as much dust as cars and motorcycles. It just a nice and polite.
Good reminder even if you aren’t a novice! Question, does that tank bag damage the paint on your tank. I have a tusk tank bag from another bike with a plastic tank, but have not put it on my Tenere because the back of it is so rough. Thanks
Battery power banks are pretty cheap now with lots of capacity, I keep one plugged into my USB on my bike in my tank bag. Great for camping since you can charge your phone and Garmin InReach, etc overnight then charge the battery bank during your ride the next day. Great to have as a backup if your bike does break down and need the extra power if you are using your phone a bunch trying to find some help. Otherwise It's easy to start the next morning with a mostly dead phone, then if you have a break down you're left with no charge.
@@DorkintheRoad Yea that's a good idea too, I have the antigravity battery with the restart button I'm using for my backup, granted I don't know how many times it will actually turn it over. Do you know of any moto-specific jumper cables that are shorter and/or more lightweight? A normal automotive set are too much to carry around
thanks a lot for this fundamental and actually without saying behaviors. BUT it is sad to see that even experinced drivers do not know this behavior that is actually self-evident. From the experiences of different trips, I prefer to drive alone, tired to explaining this again ansd again.....
Hey Dork, I'm 6' 4", 240 lbs and getting into dual sport bikes. Will do lots of off road, atv trails, gravel, around town, not much highway. I'd like to buy a bike new. The DRZ 400 fits me well (I've sat on the KLX300 and CRF300, and they're less comfortable). I think I'd feel silly buying a 20+ year old design with the DRZ. I thought about getting a CRF450 but you make the case that it's very intense. Any other bikes/options you recommend?
The only part I disagree with you about is riding staggered off-road. Even trying to ride right like this will still push people to the centerline or across towards oncoming traffic and shouldn't be encouraged. I've had far too many close calls with oncoming riders to suggest any of them stagger vs just riding single file and spacing out.
My issue is that I don't have other folks who are going out where I'm going, when I'm going (I'm retired). I'd "like" to do more off road stuff but if I'm loaded, I can't pick up the bike if goes down ('22 GSA). I've been able to pick up the bike when it has no bags but that's still a struggle so I'm nervous about going out on my own. Now, I don't plan to go out and get over my head but that may still happen if I'm exploring. Just not sure how to proceed. I do carry tools, plug kit, pump etc.
Carrying an Eastbound Motohoist and Green Chili recovery kit partially solved this for me, now I've finally added a second lighter bike. Also many riders unload, at least partially, to upright their bikes.
have had similar problems with hvy bikes, cuple times had to take off the luggage to be able to stand the bike up, atleast the good thing is that you get a breather after pushing the bike up, while you you put the bags back on :þ, and yes this is not a good solution, so I went for a lighter bike, got a DRZ now and I am always solo, but now I throw myself into the muddy creak cos I know if I get stuck, the bike is not to heavy for me to get it out by-myself, but those darn babyhead hills still scare me :s and that is not good cos I live in Iceland and we have mostly just rocks everywhere we go :s
no stagger formation in the rockies when it's +50mph crosswind with guts up to 70mph...ride in the middle or right. It will shove you over the yellow. These bikes are wind sails. Keep distance.
Lots of iPhone apps Avenza, Gaia, maps etc for backup but I finally went high end and for a garmin Tread that is far superior to smaller gps and has great features, money well spent.
FYI, most people will not stop when you turn off a trail to another one, because they don’t want to be left by themselves, they’re afraid they’re going to lose the people they’re following, and they’re also afraid that the people behind them will just continue to go straight, and they will be by themselves, it’s a amental block that humans have, I’ve seen it many many times, and only rarely two people get separated
The self-preservation instinct to "stay with the group" often leads to issues, which is why I wanted to at least make this video to ask people to knock it off, lol.
@@DorkintheRoad oh, I fully understand why you bring it up, but most people will not do it, because of the reasons, I said, previously, it’s just a weird human trait
Pretty sure you have to pull the valve stem and then just stick the tube in...but I've only ever had one bike with tubless tires so I'm not sure. There's probably a video out there somewhere ;)
@@DorkintheRoad I've never had a bike with tubes, but it seems like an important trick to know, especially on a big bike like my GSA. Think I might try iut next time I'm changing tires. It worries me though.
Also remember not to leave your buddy behind to fend for himself on a heavier bike in the heat. Especially if he has helped you manage your heavy bike many times before and is carrying extra fuel so you can ride a smaller lighter bike.
Given all the horrific reviews on REI of the small satellite devices (like inReach) failing at the critical moment. I'm curious how many ADV riders you know that carry an actual sat phone. How many rely on the latest iPhone that supposedly has emergency sat capability.
@mntbighker all the complaints I'm seeing are people who don't seem to understand how to use it. One guy was complaining about it not working and then pointed out he hadn't updated it in 2 years. Sounds like an operator problem not the device. I've had my Inreach Mini for over 3 years now and it's always worked perfectly.
@@MeerkatADV With every major cell carrier planning to roll out satellite service built right into their existing cell phones, I'm wondering about the value in this product. I guess it depends how long it takes them. But I feel like the writing is on the wall. These devices are headed for the obsolete bin.
Big problem i have when group riding. Some people don't wear gear. So they are impatient and take off before us that wear gear have it on. So i find myself trying to hurry. Slow down people.
#6 stop loading your gear far back and high, it kills the handling of your bike (and the fun of riding a bike). Talk to people that have done it for years and learn the tricks to keep the heavy gear more to the middle of your bike.
Don’t buy a bike you can’t handle. I see alot people on brand new GS bikes and they can’t even got off it without almost having the bike come down on them.
Yeap, DO NOT EAT SNOW WHEN YOUR THIRSTY YOU'RE HELPING YOURSELF INTO HYPOTHERMIA FROM THE INSIDE . IF YOU MUST MELT IT 1ST UNDER A FIRE SOURCE ...... .
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Could you please do content on the Honda XR150L? I'm looking at buying one as my first bike once I'm done with CDL school. Thank you again, and I love your content! Can't wait to hit some BDR trails! From your Concord, North Carolina viewer here! 😅
As someone who lives in the Southern California desert the most important part about water is not only drinking it while you exert yourself but BEFORE you start exerting yourself. Pre-hydration will save your butt. I've seen plenty of people get dehydrated even though they brought water because they only stopped to drink it once they started feeling thirsty.
Right on, if you wait until your thirsty it's to late.
Spot on and pre-hydration should begin a week before not the night before.
excellent point! usually, when most people realize theyre suffering from dehydration , its already to late!! you must drink even if you think youre not thirsty!! it also takes a long time to rehydrate yourself, its not a drink a bottle of water and head back out!!
Thanks for putting this one out Ben.
Bonus group riding tip:
Leave your ego at home and most of the previous tips won’t be an issue.
Bonus Bonus group riding tip:
Have a great sweep rider for your group rides. The sweep rider should be one of the better riders, with the most reliable and equipped motorcycle.
100% agreed!
For those that have never heard the term "sweep rider" it means the tail rider/last person in the group.
I fill this role a lot when out on group rides, I'm always on the edge of being over prepared (if that's even possible) The sweep riders responsibility is to ensure everyone in front of them gets to where they need to be and to assist in any mechanical or emergency situations that may arise.
Well Stated Ben👌👍‼️
I don't know if this has been brought up before, so here goes. I am 76 years old. I have been riding dirt bikes for 50+ years. I started riding quads in 1990, and did not even have a dirt bike for several years, but I am getting back into it with a TW 200. I am a competent rider, but, I have been known to make mistakes from time to time. 99.9% of my riding is done alone. I just like it that way for one thing, and I don't know anyone that likes to ride like I do, for another thing.
I always tell my better half where I will be going. At least the general area, because sometimes when I am exploring a new area, I do not know where I can go, and where I can't go. I always have a hydration pack with me, and inside the hydration pack I carry a PLB. (Personal Locater Beacon) Mine goes straight to the rescue satellites, and it lasts for 5 years. Some of the newer ones will actually allow you to text a message. I may look into one like that when my PLB expires in one more year. I DO have to be able to activate it, so if I am unconscious, all bets are off. I understand the risks, and I am ok with that.
I also do not do risky maneuvers in questionable terrain. I read a story about hydration that happened in Ansa-Borago desert in Southern California. 3 veteran riders were riding dirt bikes in the desert in the summer, and one of them started to show signs of heat stroke. The other 2 left him under a bush and each went in a different direction to look for help. They found a Ranger, and headed out to get the heat stroke guy. When they got to where they had left him, he was not there. They followed his tracks and found him. He was dead. From the time that they left him, until the time that they had found him, it was only 2 hours. Heat is deadly!!!!
One time I was riding alone in the spring with my XT 600. I found a cool road and followed it for 10 miles. It had a washed out section, and I should have turned around and went back. This is one of those mistakes that I mentioned earlier. I made it across the washout and went another 1/2 mile, and found the road to be 100% washed out, so I turned around to go back. I might add that the road was carved out of the side of a mountain, and 70 feet down from the road was a 400 foot vertical cliff. When I made it back to the first washout, my bike slid off the goat trail that I was using. I could not lift up that heavy bike, so I took my water bottle that I always carried with me and headed off on foot back to where I was parked. There were others riding when I left.
I went about 1/2 a mile, and by then I had drank all of my water. I stopped and thought to myself, "this is how people die in the desert. I walked back to my 600, and took my toolkit screwdriver and actually dug a trail under my machine. This took over an hour. I fired up the bike and pushed as hard as I could and slipped the clutch very bad until I made it back to the road. This was before I had a PLB. Would I have died? I don't know, but I certainly could have.
It all started by me foolishly trying to go over a washout that was so very close to a 400 foot vertical cliff. I was simply stupid, and somehow lived to tell the tale. I do not go anywhere without my PLB!!!!! End of story.
One of the stories on the PLB web site was of 2 older people near Flagstaff AZ. They were 30 miles from the highway, and got stuck. They thought that in order to use their PLB, they should have been injured. They tried to walk out, but soon gave up on that. In desperation they activated the PLB. When the rescuers got to them, they immediately started apologizing for using the PLB when they were not injured. The rescuers simply said, "we would MUCH rather rescue you folks than come out and do a body recovery!"
For water, figure out what you think you need, get double that.
I live in Canada, winter air is cold, get water even when it’s cold.
Self sufficiency is critical. One man one kit.
The one mistake I see all the time on TH-cam and in different "groups" on sosial medias is that people ride way to fast on gravel and rocky tracks... and most TH-camrs seems to think that it's important to ride as fast as possible and look cool!
Install the "Go slower 2.0" upgrade into that thing that the helmets are made to protect... and things mostly goes well.
BDR, TAT, TET, etc. etc. is not racetracks!
I've heard riders being discouraged of riding tougher trails because they can't "keep up" with easy trail goons.
If only they knew the pace and comradery is soooo much nicer when the going gets tougher!
@@OAK_MTN comradery? when people push each other to make mistakes and get injured?
Nope, that is not comradery...
Comradery is when the most experienced riders hold the pace they see is what the less experienced rider can hold without high risiko.
unnecessary risiko is for braindead idiots...
While I agree its not a racetrack if the gravel is good and smooth I'm not gonna be in 2nd gear doing 25mph. Speed is 100% related to rider experience, confidence and type of terrain.
What you consider "way to fast" on gravel is going to be different to what I consider way to fast on gravel. Ride your ride and let others ride their ride.
Gotta admit that the "self sufficient" things scares me quite a bit. Got back into riding this summer and don't really know how to change a flat or anything like that. Bonus for me is that I always ride close to home and got roadside assistance. Hopeing to pick up some mechanics skills during the winter time.
I don't think people could hear this too often. Thanks!
I bring water, and beer. Nothing better than ice cold beer on the trail
On my first ride into the wilderness alone I misjudged the difficulty of the terrain and I ended up very low on gas, without battery on my phone and out of water in the summer... Not great but I made it out. Great advices for all riders!
I lead a lot of adventure rides, not because I'm a good or experienced rider, but because there are few in my groups that want to post and lead rides. I've always said "keep an eye on the rider behind you". I like "You are responsible for the rider behind you" much better. So I'm stealing that. Along with your explanation of how that keeps the group together. And, if there is someone in the group that has a problem with that, it's probably someone I don't want to ride with.
So glad you brought up that group riding means you're responsible for the people in that group. Even road riders suffer from folks who don't care about what's happening to those behind them. If you want to ride on your own, please don't join a group outing!
Great tips! Regarding keeping the group together and safe, I learned a way to do this at the Adventure Days in Sweden: The leader always drives first The apointed "Sweeper" always drives last. Because members of the group where unacquainted the leader and sweeper wore vests in different color to make it easy to spot them. When coming to an intersection the Leader signals to the guy behind who will stop and wait for the whole group to pass, pointing them in the right direction. When the Sweeper comes and signals that "I see you, Im the last guy, you can go" this guy sets of.
great to mention winter too, as riding in cold needs too to hydrate ! and pointing the autonomy of each rider, because 5 riders standing alone by themselves are not 1+ 1+ 1+ 1+ 1= 5 but 11111 synergy ;)
Amen. Bring water. Can't be emphasized enough.
so many great points here!! I always fall back on the old military saying "Hydrate or Die". I carry 3 liters of water in my Camelbak plus a 40oz hydro flask stored in my bottle bag and that is not enough for me for an entire 8 hour riding day. Riding is exhausting and its very easy to get dehydrated.
You guys are lucky to have others to ride with. I don't know a single guy that rides. Even my local FB group has produced no one. Solo is sketchy.
Yupp that's the most important thing, don't try to keep up, go your own pace.
I usually ride sweep and help others with sections they don’t feel comfortable with like loose rock hills with an offset. To ensure people ride their own ride I always add a comment to the riders meeting “When in doubt, chicken out”. I always bring extra water, food, tool kit, tube, patch kit and Garmin inreach and luckily all I’ve had to use is my extra water. Good video.
Really enjoy your content. I am an older guy and have not ridden in 20 years so it’s good hearing this stuff. Thanks
This is awesome info for any type of off road riding. Atv, sxs, jeep. Especially the trail etiquette and rules. Thanks Ben!
Sage advice. Didn't dual-sport ride with a group few years back didn't ride my ride tried to keep up basically did everything you said not to do ended up in a cast so I couldn't agree more from personal experience I will say absolutely everything you're saying is spot-on I learned the hard way
Good vid and tips. I'm a new rider and did my first group ride last month. I bought my first ever bike last May (a brand new klr 650s) because a friend got me interested in adv riding. We planned a trip one day last month and four other guys joined us. Well about ten minutes into the trip I got in over my head trying to keep up with them and went down. Minor injuries to my left knee and right soldier and some cosmetic damage to the bike. My friend told the other riders to go on and he would basically babysit me the rest of the day on easier trails. We rode another 6 hours or so but I have been paying for that fall ever since. Hopefully the upcoming mri's will show no major damage. Love your channel and keep posting great instructional videos.
The water issue astounds me. Water is my oxygen when riding.
At any rate, I see nothing but downsides in riding with anyone else. The last thing I want to see while riding is another human.
12:52....ahhh dead🤣
Great points. Not all riders have comms, so adding to #4 put the riders that can communicate at front and back and middle.
Thanks for the good tips. I do disagree with one of the group riding "rules": Staggered riding off pavement. I totally agree with it on pavement but not off, especially for new riders. It does give a run off space between you and the rider in front of you but in off pavement riding give more space between riders rather than one rider being in the left track. As RideBDR promotes and gives stickers out: RIDE RIGHT! The reason: There could be road/trail changes and when it is time to get in the right track there could be a rut, deep gravel, or other hazard and the person in the right track may not be able to get over before the corner or worse an on coming fast moving vehicle. Also, if they are riding staggered to give more run out space they are riding too close and if something happens the person in the right track may need to avoid something and the rider in the left track doesn't have enough time to get stopped before they get to that same spot. I don't like to disagree with you since you do have excellent advice but over 30+ of off pavement riding I have experienced all these things with other riders.
Keep reminding people about being responsible for the rider behind you during group/led off pavement rides. Rider become afraid they will get lost from the group if they don't keep the rider in front of them in sight and don't wait. Making sure the person behind you sees you at the turn, gives a thumbs up or whatever signal you agree on. I was on a single track trail ride, the person in front of me saw me coming through the trees and left the intersection. I didn't see her, when I got to the cross trail I didn't know which way she went. There was one person behind me. The lead rider was the only one ahead of us. The two of us went the way we thought, finished riding for the day and returned to camp. The "leader" was sure pissed when she discovered she was out there alone because she didn't wait at the intersection. That wasn't the first time she wanted to lead on a ride then didn't wait at an intersection assuming everyone knew the route. I guess she needed to learn a lesson.
In June I was on a group off pavement ride and I was hanging back with the sweep rider. The person in front of me didn't wait at an intersection but I just waited for the sweep to confirm which way to go. At the next stop I found the person that didn't wait, since this is a pet peeve, and I found out why he didn't wait. It was a T intersection of sorts with one trail curving left and one curving right, he was so focused on the right trail and the person waiting for him that he didn't see the left curve.
Keep the good stuff coming!
I occasionally ride in a group with a guy who is so focused on riding fast, he literally does not see intersections half the time.
Personally, half my enjoyment on these rides is the wilderness around me.
But some guys are only riding for speed and the challenge of the trail. They tend to suck at noticing anything other than what is directly in front of them
15 minutes tire change…you are à champ 😂
That was with 3 people helping and it was getting dark so we were very motivated to get it done.
@@DorkintheRoad almost ready for moto GP 🤣. I never had a flat yet but that’s my nightmare. I carry the Baja no pinch kit with me and all the necessary tools in case of….when I work on my bike, I use only the tools I carry.
Yeah, I have the tools, it’s the skill I lack. I need to pick up a spare wheel/tire and practice….
One of your best videos. Just finished the Dirtdaze rally in the NE and I wish some of the beginners there had watched this first even though the guides said most of this before leaving on the ride. Thanks!
Another excellent video Ben. I think you did/do a great job helping guys with your advice and stories.
I have to say that I RESPECTFULLY disagree with staggered approach while off road. Experience has shown that a lot of bad things happen when a rider must switch from the left to the right side on short notice - especially in sandy or rocky sections where the center of the road/trail is piled up with soft stuff. How many times have we all almost ate it when crossing over. under the best of scenarios. Just as important is that if everybody is "riding right" the guy coming the other way will already be set to safely go by, thus avoiding the face to face "who's going where?" decision.
Another group riding dynamic worth thinking about comes up is when the slowest and least experienced people are put in the back of the group. As you pointed out, being in back encourages newby's on the slowest bikes, worst gear, and lack of confidence to ride over their heads just trying to "keep up". Throw in a extra helping of dehydration and some dust and I think you have a recipe for disaster.
On bigger group rides where slow and fast riders are mixed together, a "fast guys up front" approach results in big gaps between riders on the longer stretches. Eventually a slinky effect begins to develop and the fast guys end up with multiple 5-10 minute micro breaks waiting for the slow folks to catch up. And when the stragglers do come rolling up, you'll see impatient "fast guys" itching to get going. Sadly, the slow/inexperienced guys who could really use the same short breaks along the way are UNntentionally pressured to get going. When this happens I think it's better to break the crowd into smaller groups (no less than 3) based on pace and experience.
I'm certainly no expert, but I hope my comments are seen as constructive.
I was the guy that didn't stop at the turn and wait on a group ride once, but it was also one of my first group rides and I totally forgot I needed to. Fortunately I remembered before I went to far and managed to chase everyone down. But an important thing is to go over some of these things before embarking. People should be stopping at intersections and waiting, but not everyone knows to do this.
exactly why I don't do group rides.
Really good points friend. particularly when comes to dualsport rides, many machines are more capable than others and this needs to be respected by the group - one of the things we've done is marshaling to get the faster riders and machines up front so they are cutting trail for the heavier or less capable/skilled people in trail.
Also like others have mentioned always have a sweep rider - someone with extra of something. I've bailed plenty of folks with an extra squeezy of 2t oil even though I'm a 4t because they had to take on an extra liter or two fuel to make it out.
Tip # 6 if your just earning g how to ride off road don't do it on a big bike loaded to the hilt. Start small work your way up. Find a couple of friends ride some trails first on a dirt bike. Just did the ORBDR big bikes loaded like they packed the house on there. Seen way to many crashes from mud to sand to just rocky terrain. Skill set is the key Good luck out there be safe .
Something about passing, my group got passed a few times at ADV Fest in Black Hills. Usually we would get out of that way and wave them on. One time, a dude tried to get by us without us noticing. I almost rode off the road as I wasn't expecting someone to be right next to me when I was moving left to follow the line through some ruts. Dude didn't seem to care, the group found a spot to pull over to let the ass by before getting any of us in a wreck.
These skills carry over, to and from, those of us who ride ATV's, side bys, snowmobiles, and the Jeepers... Ben, thanks for taking the time to remind all of us who motor into the back country. I will be riding my adv bike off-road soon, and the basics are so important. You get a gold star
Mesh type communication is invaluable on any type of ride. Thanks for sharing
So glad I’m not the only one who actually does all of this. 😂
Thanks man. Love your straightforward delivery and we can tell this stuff is from experience!
Awesome Awesome video Dork,if everyone will listen to this video and respect the group it ride with,it’ll make for a better safer ride
Staggered? I'll stay to the right as much as possible because people coming the other way on dirt roads don't always follow rules. Group rides? I went on a group ride a few months back and remembered why I don't do group rides. Someone trying to tell me where to go, where to turn, when to stop, what to see is not fun for me. I'll catch up later or you can catch up to me.
Great points! I'm a lone wolf who hasn't had the opportunity to ride with others and I hope that these will resonate when I have that opportunity! Great stuff! ❤❤
Very valid points Ben. Well articulated and a good reminder to all of us who enjoy this sport. Thank you for the reminders !
Thank you for this! I'm new to all of this, and have been out only a couple times in a somewhat heavy SWM super dual. I love it, but am kind of slow. Need to build more confidence.
Enjoyed the video! RIDE SAFE OUT THERE!
Good things to keep in mind and practice. Thx for throwing this out there Ben.
All great information. I was surprised that you and Tim seemed to not be riding together on parts of the Oregon BDR. From the video it appeared you couldn't see one another at all times and even got separated. For that kind of riding, I'm definitely not comfortable riding a BDR alone, so having other riders nearby feels like a must, as incidents can happen. Stay safe, riding is inherently dangerous, but we all do it because we love it.
He was mostly behind me but I stopped all the time to make sure he was good. That just doesn't make it into the video.
You also sort of relax on some of these things when you're riding with people you know well who ride around the same skill level. I don't check in as much, but I do still stop from time to time because the unexpected happens.
I dehydrated once, went into AFIB,
Excellent contents! Excellent presentation and explanations! (It's like you used to be a teacher or something. Wait a minute - you are still a teacher!) These principles apply to all group riding, on-pavement or off-pavement. Thank you for this!
Spot on bro, great informative video.
Great video. Thanks for the info.
As always, great advise. Thank you, sir!
Just because it was easy to miss Ben saying this I want to repeat it. If due to the terrain becomes too difficult or if for some other reason you decide to drop out of the group always let other members of the group know. Never separate from a group without first informing the group. If you separate without informing the group they may spend hours searching for you. This would be extremely rude.
An additional thing that I always try to do when on unpaved roads is to slow down a lot when passing people's camp sites, hikers and bicyclist. It is rude to fly by covering someone camp site dust. Also hikers and bicyclist aren't expecting as much dust as cars and motorcycles. It just a nice and polite.
Great advice Ben! Sharing this video with my riding groups right now. 👍
Hydration - start drinking water and introducing electrolytes into your system AT LEAST 24hrs prior to your ride or work out!
Thank you for taking the time to create these videos. Excellent video quality, and message.
Good reminder even if you aren’t a novice! Question, does that tank bag damage the paint on your tank. I have a tusk tank bag from another bike with a plastic tank, but have not put it on my Tenere because the back of it is so rough. Thanks
Well said Ben and all great advice.
This is a great series! Many thanks, friend.
Ok you change the tire but do you do with the old one? What if you are in the middle of no where?
Liquid IV now and then too, not just wasser. 😊
Battery power banks are pretty cheap now with lots of capacity, I keep one plugged into my USB on my bike in my tank bag. Great for camping since you can charge your phone and Garmin InReach, etc overnight then charge the battery bank during your ride the next day. Great to have as a backup if your bike does break down and need the extra power if you are using your phone a bunch trying to find some help. Otherwise It's easy to start the next morning with a mostly dead phone, then if you have a break down you're left with no charge.
Bonus if you get a jump pack that also works as a phone charger/battery backup.
@@DorkintheRoad Yea that's a good idea too, I have the antigravity battery with the restart button I'm using for my backup, granted I don't know how many times it will actually turn it over. Do you know of any moto-specific jumper cables that are shorter and/or more lightweight? A normal automotive set are too much to carry around
Preach! Great vid brother.
thanks a lot for this fundamental and actually without saying behaviors. BUT it is sad to see that even experinced drivers do not know this behavior that is actually self-evident. From the experiences of different trips, I prefer to drive alone, tired to explaining this again ansd again.....
As a dual-sport rider, I frequently lose ADV riders on the trail. It’s inconsiderate for folks to bring 600+lb bikes and expect others to “hold up”
Hey Dork, I'm 6' 4", 240 lbs and getting into dual sport bikes. Will do lots of off road, atv trails, gravel, around town, not much highway. I'd like to buy a bike new. The DRZ 400 fits me well (I've sat on the KLX300 and CRF300, and they're less comfortable). I think I'd feel silly buying a 20+ year old design with the DRZ. I thought about getting a CRF450 but you make the case that it's very intense. Any other bikes/options you recommend?
Lookin slim, keep it up
I'm down 20 already. Gotta love that keto action. Thanks for noticing.
Hey do you work at cycle gear in Oregon? Thought I saw you there.
rule #4. amen
The only part I disagree with you about is riding staggered off-road. Even trying to ride right like this will still push people to the centerline or across towards oncoming traffic and shouldn't be encouraged. I've had far too many close calls with oncoming riders to suggest any of them stagger vs just riding single file and spacing out.
My issue is that I don't have other folks who are going out where I'm going, when I'm going (I'm retired). I'd "like" to do more off road stuff but if I'm loaded, I can't pick up the bike if goes down ('22 GSA). I've been able to pick up the bike when it has no bags but that's still a struggle so I'm nervous about going out on my own. Now, I don't plan to go out and get over my head but that may still happen if I'm exploring. Just not sure how to proceed.
I do carry tools, plug kit, pump etc.
Carrying an Eastbound Motohoist and Green Chili recovery kit partially solved this for me, now I've finally added a second lighter bike. Also many riders unload, at least partially, to upright their bikes.
have had similar problems with hvy bikes, cuple times had to take off the luggage to be able to stand the bike up, atleast the good thing is that you get a breather after pushing the bike up, while you you put the bags back on :þ, and yes this is not a good solution, so I went for a lighter bike, got a DRZ now and I am always solo, but now I throw myself into the muddy creak cos I know if I get stuck, the bike is not to heavy for me to get it out by-myself, but those darn babyhead hills still scare me :s and that is not good cos I live in Iceland and we have mostly just rocks everywhere we go :s
no stagger formation in the rockies when it's +50mph crosswind with guts up to 70mph...ride in the middle or right. It will shove you over the yellow. These bikes are wind sails. Keep distance.
This question is for anybody who would like to answer, what have you found to be the best navigation system for off routing, what app, what maps, etc.
I like Gaia GPS a lot.
@@DorkintheRoadthe upgraded version?
Lots of iPhone apps Avenza, Gaia, maps etc for backup but I finally went high end and for a garmin Tread that is far superior to smaller gps and has great features, money well spent.
Thanks
@@mkjboyce1
I ride the opposite apparently. All by myself, no one else for miles. I don’t even know anyone that has a bike.
FYI, most people will not stop when you turn off a trail to another one, because they don’t want to be left by themselves, they’re afraid they’re going to lose the people they’re following, and they’re also afraid that the people behind them will just continue to go straight, and they will be by themselves, it’s a amental block that humans have, I’ve seen it many many times, and only rarely two people get separated
The self-preservation instinct to "stay with the group" often leads to issues, which is why I wanted to at least make this video to ask people to knock it off, lol.
@@DorkintheRoad oh, I fully understand why you bring it up, but most people will not do it, because of the reasons, I said, previously, it’s just a weird human trait
I've see riders bring a 6 pack of shit beer instead of bringing water.
They bailed out after 150km 🤷♂️
Amen
Is this video all about Travis??
LOL 😂
I can change a tubeless tire, but if it's not repairable, I have no idea how to use a tube to limp it home.
Pretty sure you have to pull the valve stem and then just stick the tube in...but I've only ever had one bike with tubless tires so I'm not sure. There's probably a video out there somewhere ;)
@@DorkintheRoad I've never had a bike with tubes, but it seems like an important trick to know, especially on a big bike like my GSA. Think I might try iut next time I'm changing tires. It worries me though.
Also remember not to leave your buddy behind to fend for himself on a heavier bike in the heat. Especially if he has helped you manage your heavy bike many times before and is carrying extra fuel so you can ride a smaller lighter bike.
I think you need to watch trav's video on that day instead of being judgemental about events you did not personally witness.
@@DorkintheRoadI apologize. Social media got the better off me, replied without context. Enjoy your adventures
Don’t forget to bring the means to quickly summon help…
With GPS location.
…and a fully charged 🔋 battery.
Yeah I meant to allude to that with the "communication" piece but don't think I actually articulated it clearly. Thanks for the tip.
@@DorkintheRoad thank “Ichy Boots”… I noticed her wearing a satellite communications & tracker on her harness.
🙂
Given all the horrific reviews on REI of the small satellite devices (like inReach) failing at the critical moment. I'm curious how many ADV riders you know that carry an actual sat phone. How many rely on the latest iPhone that supposedly has emergency sat capability.
Inreach failures? Haven't heard of a single one.
@@MeerkatADV The REI reviews are horrifying 🤷🏻♂️
@mntbighker all the complaints I'm seeing are people who don't seem to understand how to use it. One guy was complaining about it not working and then pointed out he hadn't updated it in 2 years. Sounds like an operator problem not the device. I've had my Inreach Mini for over 3 years now and it's always worked perfectly.
@@MeerkatADV Thanks, noted, hopefully it's discounted for the holiday somewhere. I have a long wish list waiting for the sales.
@@MeerkatADV With every major cell carrier planning to roll out satellite service built right into their existing cell phones, I'm wondering about the value in this product. I guess it depends how long it takes them. But I feel like the writing is on the wall. These devices are headed for the obsolete bin.
Valid points, but there’s a point where this group ride think doesn’t make sense.
Big problem i have when group riding. Some people don't wear gear. So they are impatient and take off before us that wear gear have it on. So i find myself trying to hurry. Slow down people.
Some messages are worth repeating.
People don't bring water? 🙄 I keep a filtration device, potable tablets, and some water flavoring in case it tastes bad after filtering it.
Yeah dude. It's crazy.
#6 stop loading your gear far back and high, it kills the handling of your bike (and the fun of riding a bike). Talk to people that have done it for years and learn the tricks to keep the heavy gear more to the middle of your bike.
Bad group technique. Corner Man System please.
Don’t buy a bike you can’t handle. I see alot people on brand new GS bikes and they can’t even got off it without almost having the bike come down on them.
I disagree! being prepared is for losers.
Blows my mind when people show up to ride without water. Just stupid
Yeap, DO NOT EAT SNOW WHEN YOUR THIRSTY YOU'RE HELPING YOURSELF INTO HYPOTHERMIA FROM THE INSIDE . IF YOU MUST MELT IT 1ST UNDER A FIRE SOURCE ...... .
Fu#*in’ JD
😂
Little opinionated
slowest rider at the front!!!
Knowing that you have learned all this through experience makes it that much more valuable ! Thanks Ben !