Being solved does not imply it is simple. From a purely computational perspective, being able to calculate all the possible positions says nothing about checker's complexity. It would be different if there was a simple algorithm that gives the optimal move given any position, without relying on previous computation (i.e. memorizing every position). So, for a human, it really doesn't matter if a computer can memorize every position. In fact, since the number of positions is so large, it doesn't make it any easier than chess in a practical sense.
Excellent content Boss and especially to the mathematical minds (like mine) who often look at mind games by its numbers. Draughts is a game of very simple rules which is their big advantage and disadvantage at once - advantage because everyone understand them and can START to play draughts without any training or preparation and disadvantage because to many people game of such simple rules must be a simple game and very likely you will have to fight with this myth by the end of the world cause 99% of the people have no interest to look closer into them and only way to change their opinion is to get across to them and educate by f.e. spreading videos like this one. I'm perfect example of person who got fascinated with draughts after realizing how this "simple game" is so complicated game in fact with number of possible outcomes impossible to get them all not only by any human but so far by computer too and the more people realize it, the more fans draughts (as a professional sport) will have. I was lucky to understand it rather quickly thanks to my math passion but how many people from the general public is passionate for math? Yeah exactly and that means you have to educate, educate and educate the people how this "simple game" is a complex game by making more content like this.
I fully agree with every sentence of this comment. As you write, my mission is to educate and try to change people's mentality. And of course I plan to make other such videos.
Excellent and concise video! As you rightly stated - checkers (draughts) has simple rules and yet is a complex strategy board game. And as alluded to by Mr. Vassily Ivanchuk, it is a difficult game to master especially because of the multiple capture computations and calculations. Overall, I prefer the 10x10 variant of draughts because it is far less reliant on a vast memorization of openings and patterns but focuses more on strategy and deep calculations, allowing you to develop your own style of play. Of course chess also requires deep calculations and strategy but as the great Bobby Fischer himself remarked - chess is more about pre-arrangement and memorization with creativity being lower down on the list - making chess less enjoyable as you advance. Either way, it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks as long as you are satisfied with which ever game you choose to invest your time.
Thank you for your very valuable comment! You're absolutely right. Personally, I mainly play 10x10 draughts, in the video I used American ones to reach a wider audience outside of checkers. Because these are the people I want to make aware of checkers.
I didnt understand the final of the world cup, how did she lose?, and also, why is the rival celebrating like that, it seems pretty disrespectful to me
That was a quite simple combination, she sacrificed 3 checkers to take 5 and it decided the game. Yes, that could seem disrespectful, but I understand her. It was 10 days of fighting and on this last final day it was a 10th game (tie breaks) and 12 hours of play.
@@checkers_tv Even being the 10th game in the tiebreaks this celebration before the game ends is definitely disrepectful, every player should hold the composture until the game is over. I'm a chess player, and this behaviour from my opponent would bother me for sure.
@@checkers_tvYeah, white is not forced to capture all 3 black pieces though. She can stop right after the first capture or before the last one. Also she could have tried to defend the attacked piece instead of starting jumps. Neither cases would allow black to capture 5 in her response. I don't really see how is that so simple as you say.
I prefer chess over checkers, and it's clear that chess is the more "intellectual" game. But I hate the snobbery that chess is somehow better than checkers, or even that there's no point to playing checkers, because checkers is solved. Well guess what, when there's one piece and 7 pawns on the board, chess is solved, and that doesn't stop the snobs from playing/liking chess.
WOW, thank you for educating me! I, like many others, have always thought of checkers as a child's game compared to chess! This video has changed my perspective completely and busted all of the myths and stereotypes I have held about the game for my entire life... Thank you gain. I will now go on giving checkers the respect it obviously deserves and maybe even try learning some theory! Thanks again!!
07:15 Always great to see sportmanschip in boardgames; for example when a winning player is keeping his/her composure out of respect and not rubbing in the opponent's blunder. Oh lord... 😅
Just started playing English Draughts, play chess but only a weak player, use to play draughts at school but didn’t realise how difficult draughts is. Any video on playing English Draughts would be great but also love playing Brazilian Draughts, so anything on getting started in this variation, openings, simple strategy etc great videos keep it up, lidraughts - Twoblackcheckers
I have prepared an entire game course for American/English checkers for beginners. If you want, send me an e-mail at checkerstelevision@gmail.com and I will send you a free code for the course ;)
checkers compared to chess is like the difference between Yugioh and an mtg format like modern. Checkers is just so Op,you can get demolished so early out of nowhere
A perfect game is where if 2 players were to play perfectly it should always end in a draw. Checkers ends in a draw, chess most likely ends in a draw, tux tax toe ends in a draw. Imperfect games like 3 d tic tac toe and connect 4 are flawed.
7:20 nigdy nie widziałem w szachach na arcymistrzowskim poziomie takiego okazywania radości w momencie gdy partia jeszcze trwała, nawet po partii raczej się nie zdarza coś takiego z szacunku dla rywala, szachy nie bez powodu nazywane są grą dżentelmenów, każdego szachistę takie zachowanie zbulwersuje
Rozumiem doskonale o czym mówisz, sam nie widziałem takiego zachowania w warcabach, poza tym przypadkiem. Próbuję jednak usprawiedliwiać je tym, że sam mecz był grany już 10 dni, a to była dwunasta godzina (dogrywki) decydującego, finałowego dnia. Godzina 23:00, tysiące kibiców. Emocje mogły wziąć górę.
0:06 Underrated? How, in what world is checkers an underrated game? Maybe tournament wise but you can ask anyone to play a game of checkers, even 6 year olds! If you don’t know how 2 play checkers at least in 2nd grade, then the school system has failed you.
True. Most schools have at least one box with a checkers game. Personally though, once I discovered chess, I have never played checkers again. I just love chess so much more.
@@checkers_tv But I don't think we can say a 2450 checkers player has the same skills as a 2450 chess player. I think 200-300 Elo points need to be added to the ratings of all checkers players to make the levels correspond better with chess. Unfortunately, in chess we have huge cheating problems right now. Hopefully checkers are not destroyed like that but I don't know much about what's going on in the world of checkers. I'm a chess player. I find checkers rules confusing. Too many rules for too many variants. The worst thing is that checkers don't receive enough funds and support. That's wrong. The game is very similar to chess. You can play a long game and you can play a bullet game.
@@billmorrigan386 Yes, you're absolutely right with Elo. And thank you for understanding our situation. I'll do my best to promote checkers and create better environment for it.
Im also a historian who has done alot of research into what youre talking about in this video. In addition , i have decoded alot of the masonic symbolism that the numbered board contains. Im not a feeemason but i solved the 33rd mystery. Its called solomans temple and is why cake starts out with the second double corner if you just let the computer play itself. The second dbl corner is symbolic of the mathematical solution to solomans temple 😉. I solved using gematria. The letters we all use come from numbers . A = 1 b = 2 etc, who knew ?!😮
If they threw out the idiotic forced to capture rule which has not always been (and basically turns checkers into mathematicians tic tac toe) their and brought back the secondary win condition of pinning your opponent's pieces so that if they moved they would be captured (exactly like how you checkmate a king in chess), it becomes more akin to a cross between chess and go and the goal is not to capture your opponent's pieces but to control the board and where your opponent can move pieces to.
removing forced capture??? In my opinion it's the one thing that makes checkers such a beautiful game, for example just play lidraughts puzzles you'd see that a lot of it is forcing your opponents to capture some of your pieces to open a way for you to do some crazy capture sequences (which is the trait that makes draughts interesting), especially in variants like Russian or Frisian Draughts
@HatterTobias Yes that may be true, but originally checkers was not that, it was a complex strategy game like chess, where you could choose not to make a move or let your opponent capture a piece on purpose. With forced capture it's basically a step up from tic-tac toe. As opposed to a strategy game that could rival Chess. (Like it originally was)
You're absolutely right, but if we're talking about international checkers, there's nothing to envy chess. But in the Anglo-Saxon world, we have to restore the image of checkers before trying to convert them to international checkers.
Lol, Ivanchuk is actually one of the most talented and creative GMs of pre-engine era still alive today and even in history. He is a fan of checkers as well, and he explains only one aspect of the game, which is actually true. And also yeah, for a top level GM like he is, chess is really mostly quite simple, but getting there is impossible to the most. Overall, chess is of course more complicated for both people and computers, but which is easier for you depends on your talent, training, and competition.
That's not what he's saying: he's simply pointing out that, due to multiple holds, a single move can result in a significant change in the game's configuration. This makes calculations over several moves ahead sometimes more difficult than in chess. Nobody disputes the great complexity of chess. The fact is, contrary to popular belief, checkers is not a simple little game, but a complex, high-level game that has nothing to envy chess in this respect.
@checkers_tv just explaining that there is no computer that has all the answers. Though modern computers can pretty much get you there if the software is there. Even 10x10 with its endgame the positions per second searched is insane.
@checkers_tv well at least they can count materials in chess, and see some direct threats Meanwhile in checkers, absolutely no idea man, the position is too deep, as ivanchuk said, much harder for ordinary people to understand the game :D
@@ductran.ngocminh2838 It's nice that you appreciate checkers so much! I have already broadcast checkers tournaments, which were watched by many people, so by explaining simply, I can interest the audience 🙂
Do you play checkers?🤔 Let me know⬇
Want to learn how to play and win at checkers? Check out my guide ➡ tinyurl.com/simple-checkers
Yes I play International Draughts.
😊a😊
Yes
🎉3😂😅@@smoothflying9618
Smooth, right...
Being solved does not imply it is simple. From a purely computational perspective, being able to calculate all the possible positions says nothing about checker's complexity. It would be different if there was a simple algorithm that gives the optimal move given any position, without relying on previous computation (i.e. memorizing every position). So, for a human, it really doesn't matter if a computer can memorize every position. In fact, since the number of positions is so large, it doesn't make it any easier than chess in a practical sense.
Valuable comment! I fully agree.
ल6@@checkers_tv
Chinook is a weak program..kingsrow beat chinnok
Excellent content Boss and especially to the mathematical minds (like mine) who often look at mind games by its numbers. Draughts is a game of very simple rules which is their big advantage and disadvantage at once - advantage because everyone understand them and can START to play draughts without any training or preparation and disadvantage because to many people game of such simple rules must be a simple game and very likely you will have to fight with this myth by the end of the world cause 99% of the people have no interest to look closer into them and only way to change their opinion is to get across to them and educate by f.e. spreading videos like this one. I'm perfect example of person who got fascinated with draughts after realizing how this "simple game" is so complicated game in fact with number of possible outcomes impossible to get them all not only by any human but so far by computer too and the more people realize it, the more fans draughts (as a professional sport) will have. I was lucky to understand it rather quickly thanks to my math passion but how many people from the general public is passionate for math? Yeah exactly and that means you have to educate, educate and educate the people how this "simple game" is a complex game by making more content like this.
I fully agree with every sentence of this comment. As you write, my mission is to educate and try to change people's mentality. And of course I plan to make other such videos.
Excellent and concise video! As you rightly stated - checkers (draughts) has simple rules and yet is a complex strategy board game. And as alluded to by Mr. Vassily Ivanchuk, it is a difficult game to master especially because of the multiple capture computations and calculations.
Overall, I prefer the 10x10 variant of draughts because it is far less reliant on a vast memorization of openings and patterns but focuses more on strategy and deep calculations, allowing you to develop your own style of play. Of course chess also requires deep calculations and strategy but as the great Bobby Fischer himself remarked - chess is more about pre-arrangement and memorization with creativity being lower down on the list - making chess less enjoyable as you advance.
Either way, it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks as long as you are satisfied with which ever game you choose to invest your time.
Thank you for your very valuable comment! You're absolutely right. Personally, I mainly play 10x10 draughts, in the video I used American ones to reach a wider audience outside of checkers. Because these are the people I want to make aware of checkers.
Las damas son un juego sencillo...
Absolutely brilliant content. Substantive, short and to the point! Way to go!❤👏💪
☺️☺️☺️
I didnt understand the final of the world cup, how did she lose?, and also, why is the rival celebrating like that, it seems pretty disrespectful to me
That was a quite simple combination, she sacrificed 3 checkers to take 5 and it decided the game. Yes, that could seem disrespectful, but I understand her. It was 10 days of fighting and on this last final day it was a 10th game (tie breaks) and 12 hours of play.
@@checkers_tv Even being the 10th game in the tiebreaks this celebration before the game ends is definitely disrepectful, every player should hold the composture until the game is over. I'm a chess player, and this behaviour from my opponent would bother me for sure.
@@checkers_tvYeah, white is not forced to capture all 3 black pieces though. She can stop right after the first capture or before the last one. Also she could have tried to defend the attacked piece instead of starting jumps. Neither cases would allow black to capture 5 in her response. I don't really see how is that so simple as you say.
White must capture 3 pieces due to international draughts rules. That makes it a simple 1-move combination.
@@checkers_tv i was suspecting that
case too, thank you for confirming it!
I prefer chess over checkers, and it's clear that chess is the more "intellectual" game. But I hate the snobbery that chess is somehow better than checkers, or even that there's no point to playing checkers, because checkers is solved. Well guess what, when there's one piece and 7 pawns on the board, chess is solved, and that doesn't stop the snobs from playing/liking chess.
Thank you for sharing your point of view! You're right about the solved positions.
It's not truly solved. Only solved as a known draw. There is no database yet with all the answers. Only to 10 or 12 pieces
Then there's me, learning checkers to beat my friend at both chess and checkers
Pool Checkers is nearly as complex as chess
You didnt disappoint when you said this was one of your best videos so far.
Thank you! I will focus on such videos more to attract more people ☺️
WOW, thank you for educating me!
I, like many others, have always thought of checkers as a child's game compared to chess!
This video has changed my perspective completely and busted all of the myths and stereotypes I have held about the game for my entire life... Thank you gain.
I will now go on giving checkers the respect it obviously deserves and maybe even try learning some theory!
Thanks again!!
Thank you for this comment! You're welcome!
Really good promo video for a great and underrated game. Thank you!
07:15 Always great to see sportmanschip in boardgames; for example when a winning player is keeping his/her composure out of respect and not rubbing in the opponent's blunder. Oh lord... 😅
Just started playing English Draughts, play chess but only a weak player, use to play draughts at school but didn’t realise how difficult draughts is. Any video on playing English Draughts would be great but also love playing Brazilian Draughts, so anything on getting started in this variation, openings, simple strategy etc great videos keep it up, lidraughts - Twoblackcheckers
I have prepared an entire game course for American/English checkers for beginners. If you want, send me an e-mail at checkerstelevision@gmail.com and I will send you a free code for the course ;)
I don't care about solvability: chess is just more fun to play.
And just enjoy it :)
Not really
EL CHUCKY! ivanchuk playing draughts is always fun
Yes, it is!
Seems like he Is fun overall, his chess games are chaotic and pretty enjoyable, tho I dont know how checkers works
@@gongoraequalstwo quite the same
checkers compared to chess is like the difference between Yugioh and an mtg format like modern.
Checkers is just so Op,you can get demolished so early out of nowhere
Bardzo fajny film. Warcaby są trudne!!! Natalia tak się starała 👏
Oj zostanie ten moment w naszej pamięci ☺️
Really good video, especially for those who are now starting in the game 👏
Thank you! ☺️
Checkers is a good game, but there are many more abstract games than chess and checkers.
Everyone can find sth suitable ;)
Like which one?
@@gongoraequalstwo For me Hive is the best one, Santorini is also so good and original, quoridor...
@@gongoraequalstwo go
@@OrdepCubik bro.
Are there solvers (softwares used in chess and poker to study the optimal strategy) ?
Yes, of course. Using such tools in a wise way is great to improve your play.
A perfect game is where if 2 players were to play perfectly it should always end in a draw. Checkers ends in a draw, chess most likely ends in a draw, tux tax toe ends in a draw. Imperfect games like 3 d tic tac toe and connect 4 are flawed.
Thank you for this ❤ Checker for life
😍
अशोक जी आप आदमियों का जीकर किया करो जानवरों की बात करने की कोई जरूरत नहीं है
7:20 very unethical
Yeah, it looks like that.
7:20 nigdy nie widziałem w szachach na arcymistrzowskim poziomie takiego okazywania radości w momencie gdy partia jeszcze trwała, nawet po partii raczej się nie zdarza coś takiego z szacunku dla rywala, szachy nie bez powodu nazywane są grą dżentelmenów, każdego szachistę takie zachowanie zbulwersuje
Rozumiem doskonale o czym mówisz, sam nie widziałem takiego zachowania w warcabach, poza tym przypadkiem. Próbuję jednak usprawiedliwiać je tym, że sam mecz był grany już 10 dni, a to była dwunasta godzina (dogrywki) decydującego, finałowego dnia. Godzina 23:00, tysiące kibiców. Emocje mogły wziąć górę.
Could someone please what happened @7:20?
Tamara (to the right) sacrificed 3 proces to take 5 and win the game. Pause the video and you should see it.
0:06 Underrated? How, in what world is checkers an underrated game? Maybe tournament wise but you can ask anyone to play a game of checkers, even 6 year olds! If you don’t know how 2 play checkers at least in 2nd grade, then the school system has failed you.
True. Most schools have at least one box with a checkers game. Personally though, once I discovered chess, I have never played checkers again. I just love chess so much more.
What happens if a piece goes to the end of the board
It turns into a king ;)
Polish people seem to like checkers a lot
How is the ratings calculated?
Exactly the same way as in chess. But having less players in our community, ratings are lower. World champion max ELO od around 2450-2460.
@@checkers_tv But I don't think we can say a 2450 checkers player has the same skills as a 2450 chess player. I think 200-300 Elo points need to be added to the ratings of all checkers players to make the levels correspond better with chess. Unfortunately, in chess we have huge cheating problems right now. Hopefully checkers are not destroyed like that but I don't know much about what's going on in the world of checkers. I'm a chess player. I find checkers rules confusing. Too many rules for too many variants. The worst thing is that checkers don't receive enough funds and support. That's wrong. The game is very similar to chess. You can play a long game and you can play a bullet game.
@@billmorrigan386 Yes, you're absolutely right with Elo. And thank you for understanding our situation. I'll do my best to promote checkers and create better environment for it.
@billmorrigan386 American checkers use to inflate ratings. Ended a few years ago.
Im also a historian who has done alot of research into what youre talking about in this video. In addition , i have decoded alot of the masonic symbolism that the numbered board contains. Im not a feeemason but i solved the 33rd mystery. Its called solomans temple and is why cake starts out with the second double corner if you just let the computer play itself. The second dbl corner is symbolic of the mathematical solution to solomans temple 😉. I solved using gematria. The letters we all use come from numbers . A = 1 b = 2 etc, who knew ?!😮
If they threw out the idiotic forced to capture rule which has not always been (and basically turns checkers into mathematicians tic tac toe) their and brought back the secondary win condition of pinning your opponent's pieces so that if they moved they would be captured (exactly like how you checkmate a king in chess), it becomes more akin to a cross between chess and go and the goal is not to capture your opponent's pieces but to control the board and where your opponent can move pieces to.
removing forced capture??? In my opinion it's the one thing that makes checkers such a beautiful game, for example just play lidraughts puzzles you'd see that a lot of it is forcing your opponents to capture some of your pieces to open a way for you to do some crazy capture sequences (which is the trait that makes draughts interesting), especially in variants like Russian or Frisian Draughts
@HatterTobias Yes that may be true, but originally checkers was not that, it was a complex strategy game like chess, where you could choose not to make a move or let your opponent capture a piece on purpose.
With forced capture it's basically a step up from tic-tac toe.
As opposed to a strategy game that could rival Chess. (Like it originally was)
Chess>checkers
Chess is more complex but that doesn't make checkers easy. Checkers is also very complex.
You're absolutely right, but if we're talking about international checkers, there's nothing to envy chess.
But in the Anglo-Saxon world, we have to restore the image of checkers before trying to convert them to international checkers.
😮 0:25❤😊😊😊😊
Brazilian or pool Checkers is definitely not solved. Billion more possibilities
Absolutely true.
@checkers_tv what is the complexity of Brazilian pool checkers? And I've seen chess Grandmasters lose in Brazilian checkers
By complexity you mean number of possibilities? Of course even Grandmasters lose in every type of checkers.
@checkers_tv yes how complex is Brazilian checkers? And how is it compared to chess
okay is he really a gm if he says checkers is hard and chess is easy
He really is 😅
That makes zero sense whatsoever
Lol, Ivanchuk is actually one of the most talented and creative GMs of pre-engine era still alive today and even in history. He is a fan of checkers as well, and he explains only one aspect of the game, which is actually true. And also yeah, for a top level GM like he is, chess is really mostly quite simple, but getting there is impossible to the most. Overall, chess is of course more complicated for both people and computers, but which is easier for you depends on your talent, training, and competition.
That's not what he's saying: he's simply pointing out that, due to multiple holds, a single move can result in a significant change in the game's configuration. This makes calculations over several moves ahead sometimes more difficult than in chess.
Nobody disputes the great complexity of chess. The fact is, contrary to popular belief, checkers is not a simple little game, but a complex, high-level game that has nothing to envy chess in this respect.
For a GM of that level, chess is indeed simple. Ivanchuck obviously finds checkers harder simply because he is still not as strong as he is in chess.
Wow is that Ivanchuk playing?
Yes, he is! In the middle of the video you have a part of interview with him that I will publish soon :)
great video
Thanks!
have you ever play thai checker?, the promote piece was so strong
No, never played this variant. But it sounds interesting
Solved but not 100% known. All positions are not known. Solved that it is a draw.
Like I explained in this video - only American checkers.
@checkers_tv just explaining that there is no computer that has all the answers. Though modern computers can pretty much get you there if the software is there. Even 10x10 with its endgame the positions per second searched is insane.
Checkers are way deeper than it looks 😂, but I'm afraid it could be hard to follow for the audience, i mean they dont know wthell is going on 😅
Yeah, that's challenging. Watching checkers or chess requires skill, not like in physical sports 😅
@checkers_tv well at least they can count materials in chess, and see some direct threats
Meanwhile in checkers, absolutely no idea man, the position is too deep, as ivanchuk said, much harder for ordinary people to understand the game :D
@@ductran.ngocminh2838 It's nice that you appreciate checkers so much! I have already broadcast checkers tournaments, which were watched by many people, so by explaining simply, I can interest the audience 🙂
@checkers_tv nah it's just facts, man, As Ivanchuk claimed.
Wish you best luck by the way
Try to follow a Go game. For outsiders (like me), it looks like two people decorating a table with black and white pebbles.
Bridge > Checkers > Chess
Yeah, and I regret I've never played bridge.
@@checkers_tv :) Very easy to learn, very heard to master. 500/Five Hundred is very similar, but much easier.
0:01 who is she?
Marta Bańkowska (to the right), Polish Female Grandmaster.
How do you know? Are you an expert? I thought it!
What do I know?
¿Por qué Natalia cometio ese error tan grave?
Todavía no puedo entenderlo...
@@checkers_tv de seguro le quedaba poco tiempo o algo asi
Como puedes ver en el reloj, tenía unos 30 segundos. Y era la duodécima hora de juego de la décima jornada de partido.
Chinook was a weak program
some points of view easier than chess and some points of view it is easier.
it's all about different points of view 😅
Bro think its chess 💀
I don't get it =\
Can I explain something to you? 🙂
Chess mess, checker better for sure
0 complejidad.
No brain activity detected
que comentario mas !mb3cil 🤣🤡
I challenge you to play 20 puzzles of any variant in Lidraughts, if you can solve half of them without hints or trial and error I'd eat my words
I won the nc majors in 2022. 👋 hi