You have not considered the fact that with more strength, your crit becomes more valuable. Firstly lets assume we have 50% crit chance from 1k crit rating, If you have 1k strength and you do 10k hit because of it, if you crit you hit 20k so crit gave 5k extra dmg. Now if you have 2k strength and you do 20k hit because of it, if you crit you hit 40k so crit gave 10k extra dmg as you can see adding 1k strength and 1k crit gave same amount of dmg. Now if you have 3k strength and do 30k hit and crit for 60k, crit gave you 15k dmg. Hence you got 15k dmg out of 1k crit but only got 10k dmg for 1k strength. As you can see you will reach a point where crit becomes more valuable than strength, because strength linearly scales and crit scales exponentially. Someone has yet to calculate the exact point where crit becomes more valuable then strength. It would be fairly easy to calculate this point if someone put in the time and researched all the coeffcients of spells, talents .etc. The highest dps ret palas swap out some pieces of strength gear with agi/haste alternatives in their bis giving more dmg. This also applies to Frost dk's using ARP near bis. It becomes more valuable then strength. Just my thoughts.
It's actualy easy even to see on the communit it self, on my server full str paladins *full str biz* reach at maximun 19k ish *end of the fight*, paladins *full biz agi * each 21-2k ish *end of the fight*, that's an exemple but the damage from agi builds tends to be towards 1k+ highier, but agi builds sometimes get left in the dust (really tho) by full str paladins on the burst fase because RNG of course, but after burst ends their dps plumet and agi ones not so quite. Easy math: str build 10 hits... 1 hit : 10k - 2 hit : 20k - 3 hit : 10k - 4 hit : 20k - 5 hit : 10k - 6 hit : 20k - 7 hit : 10k - 8 hit : 20k - 9 hit : 10k - 10 hit : 20k str build damage 150k. agi build 10 hits... 1 hit : 9k - 2 hit : 18k - 3 hit : 18k - 4 hit : 9k - 5 hit : 18k - 6 hit : 18k - 7 hit : 9k - 8 hit : 18k - 9 hit : 18k - 10 hit : 18k agi build damage 153k. That's is just and exemple to clarify the benefits of high crit chance ofc. People just get impressed by BIG crit numbers on the screen. More crit means you rely less in RNG and RNG is a souless bitch with no heart and if you run away from her you get more consistency. I often see str retry pallys crying over a bad burst because they had bad rng on crits... but in the end people play with what they grow to like anyways.
Just subscribed. Looking forward to wrath classic and was looking at potentially changing professions. Currently have JC/enchanting. What would be best for a ret pally?
JC/engi would be nice, JC gives more stats then enchanting. Engi is really good for the hyperspeed accelerators and nitro boosts, retri lacks mobility so it covers that well.
@@AwbeeX57 would love a profession vid explaining each and why. In TBC you can only use 1 JC enhanced gem. How could that be better than 2 ring enchants
in WoTLK you get 3 special gems, the best thing is that there are a LOT of recipes, you can choose if you want ARP / STR / AP / Haste etc, this makes JC very versatile second only to Blacksmiths' versatility in stat selection. A quick google will have to suffice for now, i'm currently working on other videos :p.
Your calculations are good, but the point of agility on ret pally is that agi items have 4 stats (agi, ap + 2 secondary) and strength only 2 (strength + 2 secondary). U use only strength gloves in bis equip because that mail ones doesn't have +6 str bonus and slightly less stats. I don't play WotLK like 3 yrs so i don't remember exact measurements but its like priority of 1 stat of your item: str = 1, crit = 0.6, agi = 0.59, ap,haste about 0.4 and arpen is... arpen. You can simply multiply this by stats on your items and compare. This video have no sense without considering this but at least it unanimously says that agi gem/ench (except meta) are total bullshit :D Summary: gem agi - bad gem for agi socket bonus - bad use agi items of same itemlevel as str depends on stats and socket bonuses use whatever have highter itemlevel and dont break hit/exp caps - good use str neck with hit to have 2 ap trinket to hightest possible burst dmg in low raids - god tier use DBW with bis agi retri - stupid - over crit cap on melee + judgement (+18% if i remember right from talents) - with dbw to proc rng cow +700 str and pure randomly top dps u can but for propper use of DBW (if u have no better choice like death choice) use all possible str gear that have +6 str socket bonus.
dude the only reason u want some agi on retris is to gain more crit, all your calculations etc are useless, if u go full str bis offsets u wont get enough crit to compare the dmg output as if u had bis agi offsets(not all but some)
Yes, but every agility item have AP on it. Strength item have no AP directly. Thats the difference. As I said - "4 stats (agi, ap + 2 secondary)" - Check it ingame.
@@eduardmrkvicka3109 wrong calculations still - DBW on retribution paladin is stealing from other classes that benefit from it more. Know what your talking about before talking
This man made a video based on misunderstanding the core problem. Why are you talking me about calculations. I used DBW on speedkills where you barely care about items in general. Guess what: DBW is overrated on all classes. But that trinket has its purpose.
i found mirror and loatheb shadow p1 running 205 hit and 7 expertise was better than bis bc you gain 168 crit rating vs 90 strnght 300 ap greatness and fof
Awsome video dude. I would like to know your thoughts about rogues on warmane because i have noticed some guilds dont even want them in raids are they just that bad or are the people playing them the wrong way? Cheers
Rogues are good for sure, they provide a unique 3% melee damage buff to the raid if they are Combat, and ofcourse Tricks of the Trade on a high DPS combined with wings or some crazy ignite ticks can push someone into the next orbit of DPS. The only specs people shouldn't want to invite for raiding are Sublety rogues, Arms warrior, Frost mages and ive personally never seen a good BM hunter, besides that everything should be considered viable.
Sir I guess if we put on all items with strength then this conflicts your video on How to DPS a Ret Pala uploaded 5 months ago when the required Agi is 800.
That's why you just use few offset parts with agi.
You have not considered the fact that with more strength, your crit becomes more valuable. Firstly lets assume we have 50% crit chance from 1k crit rating, If you have 1k strength and you do 10k hit because of it, if you crit you hit 20k so crit gave 5k extra dmg. Now if you have 2k strength and you do 20k hit because of it, if you crit you hit 40k so crit gave 10k extra dmg as you can see adding 1k strength and 1k crit gave same amount of dmg. Now if you have 3k strength and do 30k hit and crit for 60k, crit gave you 15k dmg. Hence you got 15k dmg out of 1k crit but only got 10k dmg for 1k strength.
As you can see you will reach a point where crit becomes more valuable than strength, because strength linearly scales and crit scales exponentially.
Someone has yet to calculate the exact point where crit becomes more valuable then strength. It would be fairly easy to calculate this point if someone put in the time and researched all the coeffcients of spells, talents .etc.
The highest dps ret palas swap out some pieces of strength gear with agi/haste alternatives in their bis giving more dmg.
This also applies to Frost dk's using ARP near bis. It becomes more valuable then strength.
Just my thoughts.
It's actualy easy even to see on the communit it self, on my server full str paladins *full str biz* reach at maximun 19k ish *end of the fight*, paladins *full biz agi * each 21-2k ish *end of the fight*, that's an exemple but the damage from agi builds tends to be towards 1k+ highier, but agi builds sometimes get left in the dust (really tho) by full str paladins on the burst fase because RNG of course, but after burst ends their dps plumet and agi ones not so quite.
Easy math:
str build 10 hits...
1 hit : 10k - 2 hit : 20k - 3 hit : 10k - 4 hit : 20k - 5 hit : 10k - 6 hit : 20k - 7 hit : 10k - 8 hit : 20k - 9 hit : 10k - 10 hit : 20k
str build damage 150k.
agi build 10 hits...
1 hit : 9k - 2 hit : 18k - 3 hit : 18k - 4 hit : 9k - 5 hit : 18k - 6 hit : 18k - 7 hit : 9k - 8 hit : 18k - 9 hit : 18k - 10 hit : 18k
agi build damage 153k.
That's is just and exemple to clarify the benefits of high crit chance ofc.
People just get impressed by BIG crit numbers on the screen.
More crit means you rely less in RNG and RNG is a souless bitch with no heart and if you run away from her you get more consistency.
I often see str retry pallys crying over a bad burst because they had bad rng on crits... but in the end people play with what they grow to like anyways.
Rewatching this video 100 times and still finding new things i missed before.
This is the video who need me !!! Support y
My personal opinion: if you're fully geared already make agi pala for PvP and surprise opponent with high crit chance and destroy them :)
hahahahah when you inserted that den den mushi sound i thought my phone began to ring...yeah my phone rings like a den den mushi...
Gotcha.
the conclusion 10:50 should became the new sub alert i think.
Just subscribed. Looking forward to wrath classic and was looking at potentially changing professions. Currently have JC/enchanting. What would be best for a ret pally?
JC/engi would be nice, JC gives more stats then enchanting.
Engi is really good for the hyperspeed accelerators and nitro boosts, retri lacks mobility so it covers that well.
@@AwbeeX57 would love a profession vid explaining each and why. In TBC you can only use 1 JC enhanced gem. How could that be better than 2 ring enchants
in WoTLK you get 3 special gems, the best thing is that there are a LOT of recipes, you can choose if you want ARP / STR / AP / Haste etc, this makes JC very versatile second only to Blacksmiths' versatility in stat selection.
A quick google will have to suffice for now, i'm currently working on other videos :p.
Dude need a combat rogue guide pleaseee !!
Pd: good video
Oh yeah we'll get to a combat rogue guide eventually :D.
Your calculations are good, but the point of agility on ret pally is that agi items have 4 stats (agi, ap + 2 secondary) and strength only 2 (strength + 2 secondary). U use only strength gloves in bis equip because that mail ones doesn't have +6 str bonus and slightly less stats. I don't play WotLK like 3 yrs so i don't remember exact measurements but its like priority of 1 stat of your item: str = 1, crit = 0.6, agi = 0.59, ap,haste about 0.4 and arpen is... arpen. You can simply multiply this by stats on your items and compare. This video have no sense without considering this but at least it unanimously says that agi gem/ench (except meta) are total bullshit :D Summary:
gem agi - bad
gem for agi socket bonus - bad
use agi items of same itemlevel as str depends on stats and socket bonuses
use whatever have highter itemlevel and dont break hit/exp caps - good
use str neck with hit to have 2 ap trinket to hightest possible burst dmg in low raids - god tier
use DBW with bis agi retri - stupid - over crit cap on melee + judgement (+18% if i remember right from talents) - with dbw to proc rng cow +700 str and pure randomly top dps u can but for propper use of DBW (if u have no better choice like death choice) use all possible str gear that have +6 str socket bonus.
dude the only reason u want some agi on retris is to gain more crit, all your calculations etc are useless, if u go full str bis offsets u wont get enough crit to compare the dmg output as if u had bis agi offsets(not all but some)
Agi gives ap only on rogues, hunters and ferals check your facts 1st man
Yes, but every agility item have AP on it. Strength item have no AP directly. Thats the difference. As I said - "4 stats (agi, ap + 2 secondary)" - Check it ingame.
@@eduardmrkvicka3109 wrong calculations still - DBW on retribution paladin is stealing from other classes that benefit from it more. Know what your talking about before talking
This man made a video based on misunderstanding the core problem. Why are you talking me about calculations. I used DBW on speedkills where you barely care about items in general. Guess what: DBW is overrated on all classes. But that trinket has its purpose.
Seal of comand on valkirs ?
Yeah if they are all stacked its 100% worth it, you need them to die asap to the raid can focus their DPS back on LK.
There are 4 types of paladins. Stamina paladins (tanks), Intellect paladins (healers), Strength paladins (DPS) and Agility paladins (idiots)
I was listen "Shitoflight”. LOL
One question agolity vs crit rating socket
Instead of buying Shadowmourne (if you have coins for it or planning), just buy Oathbinder and GG. You are now a useful paladin.
And you are not useful with gloren? 😂 This will mybe boost you for a couple %, that's the same shit 😜
Lol. Shadowmourne is imbalanced weapon. If you want to buy some shit for your character it should be shadowmourne.
@@Yonhondainove
SM is a waste of IRL money. You don’t need SM toons to clear any content easily.
@@brandonkruse6412 valynir will be 3-7k$ usd on retail servers but yea sm is useless bc u already cleared everything by then
0:52 it says 2507 str
1 str = 2 atp
Then why does it say it is 4994 atp???
It says 5888, dunno where u see 4994. this number isnt even displayed lol
4994/2507 = 1,992 its quite negligible so you can round it up to 2
i found mirror and loatheb shadow p1 running 205 hit and 7 expertise was better than bis bc you gain 168 crit rating vs 90 strnght 300 ap greatness and fof
nice, i think i'll stick to greatness and mirror
Get yourself wrath stone boy
i think i missed something... what is the crit cap? how much agility do I stack before I stop?
different for most abilities but as far as a "cap" 100% plus more to account for debuff losses so technically you can go to like 125%
Awsome video dude.
I would like to know your thoughts about rogues on warmane because i have noticed some guilds dont even want them in raids are they just that bad or are the people playing them the wrong way?
Cheers
Rogues are good for sure, they provide a unique 3% melee damage buff to the raid if they are Combat, and ofcourse Tricks of the Trade on a high DPS combined with wings or some crazy ignite ticks can push someone into the next orbit of DPS.
The only specs people shouldn't want to invite for raiding are Sublety rogues, Arms warrior, Frost mages and ive personally never seen a good BM hunter, besides that everything should be considered viable.
Sir I guess if we put on all items with strength then this conflicts your video on How to DPS a Ret Pala uploaded 5 months ago when the required Agi is 800.
Nope, check my character i got 800 agility.
Hi could you tell me names of your addons and where did you download them
I have a Top 5 essential PvE Raiding addons video, there I show the full list in-game.
Which is better agi or str?
hello awbee what is the best professions for retri ?
engi/JC
@@AwbeeX57 thanks mate 🖤
@@AmirHossein-wy6kv if u are pure pve it is better to take tailor instead of engi
@@beetle4118 haste + run boost far better than 400 AP
my agi pal doing well top dps ez
ez
agi ret = better consistent aoe dmg/ str=better single target... it`s not a rocket science
No, agility isn't consistent at all, it focuses on crit instead of.. damage :P its the exact opposite of consistent.