If the amp is 30 years old, you need to change the electrolytic - they will fail in due course. You're also implying that the amp sounded 30 years old when it was originally purchased. Otherwise, great advice and presentation!
I am not a tech. I only work on vintage amps, 99% of them are my own. I learned by buying trashed amps and getting them back to stock. Removing many mods over the years gave me a good Idea of what mod guys were up to. Combine this with a restorers knowledge of why a 66 version of an amp sounds better than a modern reissue... and I feel I have some stuff to share... I still dont undertand VH1 tone but I am 99.999% on Hendrix Clapton and SRV ...IMHO all those were vintage amps with mods
Listen to what this guy is talking about, he knows his business! The value of slightly undersized filtering caps can’t be stressed enough. Pat is working with vintage tube gear, but you should listen to what these principles do to a cheaply made transistor amp like the Vox Pathfinder, almost makes you wonder if tubes are all that important to tone
Pat, love your videos. I have a problem with my 1965 Fender Bandmaster amp. There's a treble high end sound that happens in this amp. I have all of the electrolytic caps changed, even tried jupiter and sozo coupling caps . even tried silver mica bright caps for the treble cap . tried changing the tone stack caps to 0.02. Still I get the shrill extremely high treble sound when playing chords around the 1st 2nd and 3rd frets I could really use your help on this one. Is it the wall voltage causing this, I don't know thanks Michael from Niagara Falls, Ontario
At 1:50 you say that those electrolytic caps "set the bias for the preamp stages". But the bias for a preamp triode is determined by Vgk (the grid-cathode voltage), which is set using the cathode resistor. I believe those electrolytic caps you're tapping on are the cathode bypass caps....which determine the frequency response of the gain stage.
Hi Pat, many thanks for the video! This is really hard to find information and has really helped me a lot. Could you tell me if the caps you used to replace the 25-25uf 25v ones were just a pair of 25uf 25v for each one? And did you also change cap next to the bias adjuster? Many thanks in advance!
Yeah, more instructional videos would be really helpful. I've got a Fender Super 60 that is dead, and I'm stumped. Could you post a video on what you do to diagnose new amps that you get in? And how often do you work on amps that aren't point to point?
I'm about to replace the caps in my '66 Deluxe Reverb. I can hear a clicking type of noise that has recently developed. I'll check for microphonics in other caps now thanks to your video. I always check for microphonics in my tubes but forget caps can get that way too. Also, I just obtained a '58 Silvertone 1391. I put a 4 ohm speaker in it as my '66 Champ is 4 ohms and I couldn't find a scematic. I bought the speaker from Ted Weber and the new filter caps too. Now, it sounds a bit dark for a 5 watt amp with an 8" speaker.Could that be impedance, caps, or both?
Hey, just started the built of a Deluxe Reverb clone by a local amp builder here in Argentina (totally hand made). The tech offered me to put Jupiter Red Astron caps in the place of the Blue Molded so I bought them, do you think this might me be a good idea or would you change them for the Jupiter Yellow ones or Sozo's Blue Moldeds?
Pat, thanks for this great video! I'm wondering if you can tell me if ALL tube amps will exhibit some ghost notes / subhamonics when really cranked? And if so, is some of that unavoidable intermodulation? I've got both a 70's silverface twin, and new Hiwatt clone that don't really shine until i've got them more or less dimed, but then single notes in the middle/upper register of the guitar produce VERY pronounced ghost / sub-octave notes... Do people just usually live with it?
Thanks for the awesome videos. I have an old Fender 75 and have had it for about 12 years now. If the life on the caps is about 10 years, should I be looking to change them regardless or only if needed?
Hey Pat. Great video's. You may have covered this in another video but I have a few Questions. I see Recap Kits being sold and they seem pricey. Can I just buy the caps from an electronic supplier and if so, what values are the caps on the top side ? Also do you have a good source for power transformers ? I have a 64 Deluxe Reverb that is all origin except Speaker , Grill Cloth and tubes. Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thank you
Hi Pat! I haven't heard you talk about suspected ”leaky capacitors”, what are your thoughts on that? I'm referring to the signal chain, you tend to prefer not replacing old mustards or what have you. I've recently seen some videos from Mr. Carlsons lab and another channel talking about old tube radios where they replace all caps because "they will be leaky", even recommends not buying nos caps because they will leak as well. Thinking about getting myself one of those old capacitor leakage test if I ever find one locally. You for sure has some of the nicest tones I've heard and I write this out of curiosity if you have any opinions on the subject :) Take care! :)
+Eric Öhman a leaky cap has a very ugly and obvious sound. If your replace all of the signal caps, and so on you might as well buy a reissue amp. Conversely if you replace all of the parts on your vintage amp with new parts it will sound just like a modern re-issue... for guitars and guitar amps OLD signal caps are THE SOUND ...
Hi Pat.. Love you repair videos... I have a question I hoped you might be able to answer. With a cathode biased amp (Vox ac15, Fender 5e3) what affect does the size of the cathode bypass have. I know the value if chosen to be low can limit bass, but a 25µf with a 250 ohm resistor (5E3) and a 50µf with a 130 ohm resistor (vox ac15) is enough for full guitar freq. (above 50 hz). Modern amps such a modern voc ac15c1 has a 220µf with a 120 ohm resistor. People claim it stabilizes the bias voltage.
Hi I have a 63 fender vibroverb ri. it has the Chinese 22uf caps in the rear.... can i check their value still installed.... could these be changed to 16uf and sound better..... this amp sounds bad in the bass tightness, Dead flubb not clear... bad pick attack.
Hi Pat, Great Video!...I live in the UK and have just bought a 65 Fender Deluxe Reverb Re-issue from USA, is it possible to put a 240v power supply in it or would there be other things to change on it if I did?
I had the similar issues with a DRRI I wore out (apparently). I got it back from shop and it still cuts out. What do I do now, sell it? I wonder if its cost effective to attempt fixing.
I kind of disagree, a 50 year old + amp is bound to fail and I will only leave the original caps in if it's going to be for display only. Disc and Mica caps are usually ok
Duuuude. Never apologise for being multi-orgasmic. I mean, err, never rage at n00bs for being sub 120IQ. The world is your oyster. Or as PANAM would say, the world is.. yours. Revel in your time!
+patfurlan Yes, true. I am not a fully trained tech but I've been able to keep my Fender amps going for over 40 years now. When I do need something over my ability, I have a friend or two who will help me. I sure wish you lived close enough to take a look at a couple of my amps. I'm in West Texas.
thanks Pat. I replaced the power supply caps with the correct value, hit power on, then after about 3min I hit standby and the main 3A fuse blew...any ideas? Maybe I didn't let the new big caps "form" properly? I don't have a variac and wasn't sure. Thanks again for your posts!
s2khawk current inrush trying to form the caps can blow the fuse ... you can make a current limiter with a dollar store extension cord by cutting one side of the cord and putting another ac plug in series with... then plugging in an incandescent lamp (100 watt bulb) the bulb will light up as the amp draws current giving a slow start ... google this project ... replace the fuse and do a slow start up ... also check your work for shorts
Hi Pat, I have a DR '81 and in a gig blow one of the filter cap, I put a new one with new tube set and in couple of days blow ir again, today I notice that the power cord is bad (no ground) thats could be the problem?
Pat i have a hand built BF Deluxe Reverb two channel it's around 12 years old. I've changed all the tubes but i get this midrange howl. You can hear it building up as your playing then it slowly go's into an Air raid siren howl.. Turn the amp off then back on all is good then after about 30 minutes of playing it will start again. Some times it wont do it for a couple weeks then out of the blue it go's into a fit. I thought the tubes were going Micro phonic as #1 was giving up the ghost that's why i replaced them. But this howl still persist.. Could this be filter caps or the preamp caps going bad.. Also the vibrato section is completely dead.. The friend that built this was a seasoned builder and repairman that sadly passed away a few years back so I'm in a pickle.
@@patfurlan ::: One thing I did yesterday was pull the Reverb tank and it seems to have a different sound than with it in.. I have another tank may swap them and see what happens..
Also started giving a fit in tube #3 with the tank unpluged.. Found it while wiggling tubes when it started howling, it wouldn't do that before with the tank plugged in during howling.. Yes my tank is in its bag at the bottom of the cab. I'll plug in the tank and see what happens as I replaced #3 pre tube.
Hello i have a early 70's late 60's Fender Deluxe Reverb, lately its been having a volume problem, i cracked a 6v6 tube socket and just replaced it but the volume is still low, i could put it all the way at 10 and its still too damn low, have you heard of any problems like this? If so any info you could provide would help alot, thanks
I have a deluxe reverb 65 klone with bigger transformers. My filter caps are 2 x 30u and 3 x 20 u. Is it possible to use normal values like originals in your video?? Tnx.. - Ulf
Bro im in México Puebla si here un my city its really hard to find someone who can help to fix this amps si PLEASE help me o have a jca hdm jet city 100 watt and its a problem the fx loop lowest the volume in the overdrive channel so i cant use it; and if o use active pickups the amp make noises in the clean channel so they are some little problems o think but they are a pain in the ass when im playin Sorry for my spanish thank you bro !!!!!!
Hi Pat I'm recapping a 1964 Fender Vibrolux Reverb and I have a question on the two 16UF caps to the far left (in your video). The other three are wired parallel and from what I see on a lot of videos is that the two on the left are wired series. Only problem for me is I cannot find a schematic for the amp I'm working on and cannot tell whether the two on the left are wired series or parallel. Can you help me with a definitive answer? Feel free to email me at squires@telus.net or simply reply here as it may help others :)
Pat, love your videos. I have a problem with my 1965 Fender Bandmaster amp. There's a treble high end sound that happens in this amp. I have all of the electrolytic caps changed, even tried jupiter and sozo coupling caps . even tried silver mica bright caps for the treble cap . tried changing the tone stack caps to 0.02. Still I get the shrill extremely high treble sound when playing chords around the 1st 2nd and 3rd frets I could really use your help on this one. Is it the wall voltage causing this, I don't know thanks Michael from Niagara Falls, Ontario
it's just high end shrill sound. no distortion at all . I have tried changing most of the capacitors and electrolytic. just don't know what to do at this point. I don't know of any techs in Niagara. my number is 905-351-0398 if you could give me a call thanks Michael
+patfurlan the output transformer has not been changed and neither the power transformer. I suspect that it's got to be one or the other. Everything has been checked. That was my thought possibly the transformers. It doesn't make any difference in switching the treble caps to 500pf or 250pf. This amp at one time sounded great. but I agree with you, you don't want to start changing too many components as you will never achieve the original tone. maybe I should get a mercury magnetics output transformer. Does the power transformer have anything to possibly do with this ringing treble sound. I don't know
slow down ! everyone always assumes the most expensive part is the problem. I mention the output transformer because if In stalled backwards ie the blue and brown wires swapped you would get a ringing chirping treble noise. if it is factory original your problem is elsewhere
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You should do more of these videos. The world needs these type of help.
If the amp is 30 years old, you need to change the electrolytic - they will fail in due course. You're also implying that the amp sounded 30 years old when it was originally purchased. Otherwise, great advice and presentation!
I am not a tech. I only work on vintage amps, 99% of them are my own. I learned by buying trashed amps and getting them back to stock. Removing many mods over the years gave me a good Idea of what mod guys were up to. Combine this with a restorers knowledge of why a 66 version of an amp sounds better than a modern reissue... and I feel I have some stuff to share... I still dont undertand VH1 tone but I am 99.999% on Hendrix Clapton and SRV ...IMHO all those were vintage amps with mods
Listen to what this guy is talking about, he knows his business! The value of slightly undersized filtering caps can’t be stressed enough. Pat is working with vintage tube gear, but you should listen to what these principles do to a cheaply made transistor amp like the Vox Pathfinder, almost makes you wonder if tubes are all that important to tone
Just bougt an all original 65 deluxe. It has never been touched. Can't wait to get new caps and so forth in it. It does work though.
When you went in to the Cap Can, I was waiting for the G Weber Moment, you know the one...careful here...zzzzzap..... As always an awesome video-Peter
gotta 1965 I'll be diving into tonight....thankx for the info
"I'm not knocking these guys" lol...
Yes. Yes you are. And rightfully so.
Pat, love your videos. I have a problem with my 1965 Fender Bandmaster amp. There's a treble high end sound that happens in this amp. I have all of the electrolytic caps changed, even tried jupiter and sozo coupling caps . even tried silver mica bright caps for the treble cap . tried changing the tone stack caps to 0.02. Still I get the shrill extremely high treble sound when playing chords around the 1st 2nd and 3rd frets I could really use your help on this one. Is it the wall voltage causing this, I don't know thanks Michael from Niagara Falls, Ontario
At 1:50 you say that those electrolytic caps "set the bias for the preamp stages". But the bias for a preamp triode is determined by Vgk (the grid-cathode voltage), which is set using the cathode resistor. I believe those electrolytic caps you're tapping on are the cathode bypass caps....which determine the frequency response of the gain stage.
yes
Thank you for this video youre a really good teacher
my favourite amp.
Hi Pat, many thanks for the video! This is really hard to find information and has really helped me a lot. Could you tell me if the caps you used to replace the 25-25uf 25v ones were just a pair of 25uf 25v for each one? And did you also change cap next to the bias adjuster? Many thanks in advance!
70uf ,70uf ,20uf ,20uf, 20uf is original spec for power supply filter caps.
Yeah, more instructional videos would be really helpful. I've got a Fender Super 60 that is dead, and I'm stumped. Could you post a video on what you do to diagnose new amps that you get in? And how often do you work on amps that aren't point to point?
I'm about to replace the caps in my '66 Deluxe Reverb. I can hear a clicking type of noise that has recently developed. I'll check for microphonics in other caps now thanks to your video. I always check for microphonics in my tubes but forget caps can get that way too. Also, I just obtained a '58 Silvertone 1391. I put a 4 ohm speaker in it as my '66 Champ is 4 ohms and I couldn't find a scematic. I bought the speaker from Ted Weber and the new filter caps too. Now, it sounds a bit dark for a 5 watt amp with an 8" speaker.Could that be impedance, caps, or both?
Hey, just started the built of a Deluxe Reverb clone by a local amp builder here in Argentina (totally hand made). The tech offered me to put Jupiter Red Astron caps in the place of the Blue Molded so I bought them, do you think this might me be a good idea or would you change them for the Jupiter Yellow ones or Sozo's Blue Moldeds?
So you don’t want to put a higher rated filter that are in?
Great video!
Pat, thanks for this great video! I'm wondering if you can tell me if ALL tube amps will exhibit some ghost notes / subhamonics when really cranked? And if so, is some of that unavoidable intermodulation? I've got both a 70's silverface twin, and new Hiwatt clone that don't really shine until i've got them more or less dimed, but then single notes in the middle/upper register of the guitar produce VERY pronounced ghost / sub-octave notes... Do people just usually live with it?
+Charles Scott yes.... which is why its important to get your tone before your amp is cranked
Thanks for the awesome videos. I have an old Fender 75 and have had it for about 12 years now. If the life on the caps is about 10 years, should I be looking to change them regardless or only if needed?
+maggit13 it depends on how the amp sounds
Hey Pat. Great video's. You may have covered this in another video but I have a few Questions. I see Recap Kits being sold and they seem pricey. Can I just buy the caps from an electronic supplier and if so, what values are the caps on the top side ? Also do you have a good source for power transformers ? I have a 64 Deluxe Reverb that is all origin except Speaker , Grill Cloth and tubes. Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thank you
Hi Pat! I haven't heard you talk about suspected ”leaky capacitors”, what are your thoughts on that? I'm referring to the signal chain, you tend to prefer not replacing old mustards or what have you. I've recently seen some videos from Mr. Carlsons lab and another channel talking about old tube radios where they replace all caps because "they will be leaky", even recommends not buying nos caps because they will leak as well.
Thinking about getting myself one of those old capacitor leakage test if I ever find one locally. You for sure has some of the nicest tones I've heard and I write this out of curiosity if you have any opinions on the subject :)
Take care! :)
+Eric Öhman a leaky cap has a very ugly and obvious sound. If your replace all of the signal caps, and so on you might as well buy a reissue amp. Conversely if you replace all of the parts on your vintage amp with new parts it will sound just like a modern re-issue... for guitars and guitar amps OLD signal caps are THE SOUND ...
Hi Pat.. Love you repair videos... I have a question I hoped you might be able to answer. With a cathode biased amp (Vox ac15, Fender 5e3) what affect does the size of the cathode bypass have. I know the value if chosen to be low can limit bass, but a 25µf with a 250 ohm resistor (5E3) and a 50µf with a 130 ohm resistor (vox ac15) is enough for full guitar freq. (above 50 hz). Modern amps such a modern voc ac15c1 has a 220µf with a 120 ohm resistor. People claim it stabilizes the bias voltage.
Hi I have a 63 fender vibroverb ri. it has the Chinese 22uf caps in the rear.... can i check their value still installed.... could these be changed to 16uf and sound better..... this amp sounds bad in the bass tightness, Dead flubb not clear... bad pick attack.
Hi Pat,
Great Video!...I live in the UK and have just bought a 65 Fender Deluxe Reverb Re-issue from USA, is it possible to put a 240v power supply in it or would there be other things to change on it if I did?
I had the similar issues with a DRRI I wore out (apparently). I got it back from shop and it still cuts out. What do I do now, sell it? I wonder if its cost effective to attempt fixing.
Hey Pat. Where do you get your 16uf 450V caps for the filters
I kind of disagree, a 50 year old + amp is bound to fail and I will only leave the original caps in if it's going to be for display only. Disc and Mica caps are usually ok
Duuuude. Never apologise for being multi-orgasmic. I mean, err, never rage at n00bs for being sub 120IQ. The world is your oyster. Or as PANAM would say, the world is.. yours. Revel in your time!
Puzzling that 3 or 4 musicians owned this amp but didn't change out some of the caps on the board.
+Bbendfender I see it all the time ...fear of a repair bill is a powerful force ... its worse with some vehicle owners !
+patfurlan Yes, true. I am not a fully trained tech but I've been able to keep my Fender amps going for over 40 years now. When I do need something over my ability, I have a friend or two who will help me. I sure wish you lived close enough to take a look at a couple of my amps. I'm in West Texas.
thanks Pat. I replaced the power supply caps with the correct value, hit power on, then after about 3min I hit standby and the main 3A fuse blew...any ideas? Maybe I didn't let the new big caps "form" properly? I don't have a variac and wasn't sure. Thanks again for your posts!
s2khawk current inrush trying to form the caps can blow the fuse ... you can make a current limiter with a dollar store extension cord by cutting one side of the cord and putting another ac plug in series with... then plugging in an incandescent lamp (100 watt bulb) the bulb will light up as the amp draws current giving a slow start ... google this project ... replace the fuse and do a slow start up ... also check your work for shorts
s2khawk th-cam.com/video/-rHmuPS--P8/w-d-xo.html
Hi Pat, I have a DR '81 and in a gig blow one of the filter cap, I put a new one with new tube set and in couple of days blow ir again, today I notice that the power cord is bad (no ground) thats could be the problem?
sounds strange take it to a tech
the bad ground is not the problem filter caps fail because of age or voltage over their rating
Pat i have a hand built BF Deluxe Reverb two channel it's around 12 years old.
I've changed all the tubes but i get this midrange howl.
You can hear it building up as your playing then it slowly go's into an Air raid siren howl.. Turn the amp off then back on all is good then after about 30 minutes of playing it will start again.
Some times it wont do it for a couple weeks then out of the blue it go's into a fit.
I thought the tubes were going Micro phonic as #1 was giving up the ghost that's why i replaced them.
But this howl still persist..
Could this be filter caps or the preamp caps going bad..
Also the vibrato section is completely dead..
The friend that built this was a seasoned builder and repairman that sadly passed away a few years back so I'm in a pickle.
It’s self by oscillating somehow there is a feedback loop between the output and input ….
@@patfurlan ::: One thing I did yesterday was pull the Reverb tank and it seems to have a different sound than with it in.. I have another tank may swap them and see what happens..
@@bigstick5278 if the tank it not isolated it can pic up vibration from the cab
Also started giving a fit in tube #3 with the tank unpluged.. Found it while wiggling tubes when it started howling, it wouldn't do that before with the tank plugged in during howling.. Yes my tank is in its bag at the bottom of the cab. I'll plug in the tank and see what happens as I replaced #3 pre tube.
Hello i have a early 70's late 60's Fender Deluxe Reverb, lately its been having a volume problem, i cracked a 6v6 tube socket and just replaced it but the volume is still low, i could put it all the way at 10 and its still too damn low, have you heard of any problems like this? If so any info you could provide would help alot, thanks
do you use factory values for bias caps or increase the value? thnx for the vids.
factory value
I have a deluxe reverb 65 klone with bigger transformers. My filter caps are 2 x 30u and 3 x 20 u. Is it possible to use normal values like originals in your video??
Tnx.. - Ulf
yes you can lower the filtering
Bro im in México Puebla si here un my city its really hard to find someone who can help to fix this amps si PLEASE help me o have a jca hdm jet city 100 watt and its a problem the fx loop lowest the volume in the overdrive channel so i cant use it; and if o use active pickups the amp make noises in the clean channel so they are some little problems o think but they are a pain in the ass when im playin Sorry for my spanish thank you bro !!!!!!
Hogwash!! If the caps are 30 yrs old you CHANGE them!!
Hi Pat I'm recapping a 1964 Fender Vibrolux Reverb and I have a question on the two 16UF caps to the far left (in your video).
The other three are wired parallel and from what I see on a lot of videos is that the two on the left are wired series. Only problem for me is I cannot find a schematic for the amp I'm working on and cannot tell whether the two on the left are wired series or parallel. Can you help me with a definitive answer? Feel free to email me at squires@telus.net or simply reply here as it may help others :)
Pat, love your videos. I have a problem with my 1965 Fender Bandmaster amp. There's a treble high end sound that happens in this amp. I have all of the electrolytic caps changed, even tried jupiter and sozo coupling caps . even tried silver mica bright caps for the treble cap . tried changing the tone stack caps to 0.02. Still I get the shrill extremely high treble sound when playing chords around the 1st 2nd and 3rd frets I could really use your help on this one. Is it the wall voltage causing this, I don't know thanks Michael from Niagara Falls, Ontario
+michael newell is it distortion or just crazy eq ?
it's just high end shrill sound. no distortion at all . I have tried changing most of the capacitors and electrolytic. just don't know what to do at this point. I don't know of any techs in Niagara. my number is 905-351-0398 if you could give me a call thanks Michael
has the output transformer been changed ? sounds like it might be positive feedback
+patfurlan the output transformer has not been changed and neither the power transformer. I suspect that it's got to be one or the other. Everything has been checked. That was my thought possibly the transformers. It doesn't make any difference in switching the treble caps to 500pf or 250pf. This amp at one time sounded great. but I agree with you, you don't want to start changing too many components as you will never achieve the original tone. maybe I should get a mercury magnetics output transformer. Does the power transformer have anything to possibly do with this ringing treble sound. I don't know
slow down ! everyone always assumes the most expensive part is the problem. I mention the output transformer because if In stalled backwards ie the blue and brown wires swapped you would get a ringing chirping treble noise. if it is factory original your problem is elsewhere