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Not sure if I missed it or it wasn't mentioned. Is there a reason you don't stitch the edging down and just glue it? I'm coming up to this stage for my own shield (not AS nice as yours though haha) and your series has been awesome
Roland. Can you find any re-enactment shields out there what have this sort of taper/ hide/ split planks and so on? I get a blunt sword does havoc but surely there must be ways of simulating this? Thanks and have a nice day. :)
You would have to make such shields yourself. But they do work fine with blunts if you are employing blunts like they were sharp instead of flailing like a madman.
I'm thinking, they where traveling with boats a lot, and having a shield that can't deal with water very well, have you got any idea how they would deal with that? I mean the glue would probably loose grip and everything fall appart.
Good question. But to dissolve the glue, you would actually have to completely soak it in water for an extended period of time. The Romans used leather covers for their shields, probably oiled. Waxed linen would work, too. Fixing smaller areas on a shield would easily be done with heat treatment which is no big deal in an age when fires were lit constantly. Also keep in mind that exposure to salt water would have also quickly caused corrosion on steel weapons, too. So one could expect some routine of dealing with the issue on sea voyages.
I have been avidly following this and have been slowly assembling supplies.. Do you know of other facing materials? do you think deer hide would be suitable?
there is no indication of any textile covers prior to the High Middle Ages. Any hide you use should be fine if you thin it down to an even thickness. Keep in mind that hide thickness varies.
What the guy in the video says is that from a historical perspective, a sword or an axe would often get stuck and jammed in the thin shield wall, giving you the advantage of being able to take the opponent's weapon. But if you ask me, from a structural mechanics standpoint, that's just complete bullshit. Because if you put a proper edge on your shield, and maybe even make it out of metal, you don't want the opponent's weapon to penetrate your shield anyway. If you make a metal edge, you hope that the opponent strikes it with their weapon and ideally even destroys it. I definitely don't see myself making my shields as thin as the guy in the video suggests.
not sure if its been asked yet but what is the width and diameter of this shield? just by looking at it id have to guess a minimum of 3ft in width at least...
Hellow from Russian reenactment! Can you answer please, how glue medieval norman shield without middle handle? And make curvature? Is curvature spec. effect when skin dry? Thank you for videos and good luck! Sorry for my eng.)))
Curvature on shields may indeed be achieved by the clever use of liquid glue which would make a hide facing and the the wood surface expand and later shrink at different rates. However, many surviving medieval shields appear to be covered with the same materials on both front and back, which would likely neutralize the effect. Thus the curvature must have been produced by chamfering the edges of shield planks before glueing them to each other. Hope this helps. Greetings to Russia!
For heater and kite shields one may use plywood layers glued into a press. th-cam.com/video/xz-p_4V-EBs/w-d-xo.html My question for any and all and for Roland Warzecha is how did the ancients make domed round shields?
A common question. We will run according tests at a later point. But apparently, thin shields were considered good enough a protection. This contemporary picture shows Anglo-Saxons with domed round shields advancing. Note how the front guy lifts and extends his shield to ward off missiles. See some arrows already got stuck in his shield: warfare2.netai.net/6C-11C/Franks_Casket-lid-lg.jpg
Bret Alvarez Not sure these shields were ever meant to go against steel crossbows and ''heavy'' longbows. The weapons of that era marginally overlap the viking age. Dont get me wrong, they had powerful bows at the time of the vikings, crossbows too(non steel prods), but in fewer number and seriously less powerful than their later brethren. English longbows could be twice as powerful as some longbows of that time, for the crossbows even more so. All in all, if some care was put into the making of the shield, and it most certainly was, it would have no problems dealing with contemporary weapons. Most projectiles would be stuck, but some of them even bounced, given the taper and flex of the said shield... P.S. I dont know what kind of arrow heads were the vikings and their enemies using, but that is the most important part of determining penetrating power.
Dog chew is made from inferior parts of hide. Learn more on preparing hide to cover or edge a shield here: th-cam.com/video/9uSF231q1A0/w-d-xo.htmlm29s
This shield would offer zero protection against an axe blow. Even a decent sword would shatter it after a few hits. I doubt it would stop much more than a weakly shot arrow, too. That's fine if it's only for show, but using a thin and light shield to demonstrate medieval fighting techniques will lead to false conclusions.
There are exactly zero Iron Age or Viking Age shield fragments that indicate a more robust construction. If you as a modern person cannot make authentic arms work in whatever fight simulation you use to run your tests, then, apparently, your fighting technique is indeed based on false conclusions.
Thank you for taking the time to post the video link. I still think your shield may be a little too thin, but I agree that no shield, however thick, will stand against repeated blows. It depends a lot on what materials are used, too. Apparently in the sagas it says for shields to be made from flexible woods like linden. This had the effect of absorbing blows and even bouncing blows back. Not good for your opponent's wrists! This was interesting reading: spangenhelm.com/the-norse-shield/.
Thank you for the link. There are a number of assertions in that text that cannot be supported by any evidence that I am aware of. Some is outright wrong, I am afraid to say: The assertion that "The Viking shield was ahead of its time" may be driven by enthusiasm, but, in fact, the opposite is true. It is an old Germanic design that fits particular contexts of combat which became increasingly rare in the High Middle Ages. Which is why the flat center-gripped round shield was ultimately abandoned, and the truly innovative forms of the so-called Viking Age, namely domed Frankish shields, were further developed to form the standard in medieval Europe, that is curved shields of various shapes. (There neither is a single shield on this page that I would consider a valid replica, I have to say.) The Icelandic sagas are a debatable source. They originate from some two hundred years after the Viking Age. I prefer to go by examining surviving shield fragments and fittings. And this is exactly what informed the making of my shield. Thanks for your interest.
Keep in mind, that a lot of energy will be absorbet just by flexing the material and if you deflect blows instand of parriing them, the main energy will pass along the surface of the shield.
Hi sword people! Would you like to receive weekly up-dates on weapons research, sword-fighting, living history and more straight into your inbox? To read previous newsletters and to sign up, go here: exciting-pioneer-6049.ck.page/a8f72e8432
I like the carving you did on the handle. Very nice. Thank you for sharing.
You are most welcome.
That fastening technique was fascinating!
Glad you found it useful.
Your carvings look so nice!
Thank you.
Like all my videos, this presentation is ad-free, thanks to the generous support of my cool patrons at www.patreon.com/Dimicator . This is also where all my videos are presented first before being made available to everybody.
Find the next part here: www.patreon.com/posts/making-shield-14347161
You are welcome to leave a comment, but if you have any queries, please direct them here: dimicator.com/contact/
Thank you for your interest.
Not sure if I missed it or it wasn't mentioned. Is there a reason you don't stitch the edging down and just glue it?
I'm coming up to this stage for my own shield (not AS nice as yours though haha) and your series has been awesome
Nice work! :)
Thank you
Bravissimo.
Thank you.
Roland. Can you find any re-enactment shields out there what have this sort of taper/ hide/ split planks and so on? I get a blunt sword does havoc but surely there must be ways of simulating this? Thanks and have a nice day. :)
You would have to make such shields yourself. But they do work fine with blunts if you are employing blunts like they were sharp instead of flailing like a madman.
18:15 somehow that clamp looks like my mom's hairpin...wait a second...HAIRPINS!! I can use that!! XD
You might like to see Mighty boars TH-cam channel testing "three bows two men and a kind shield" penetration test
I'm thinking, they where traveling with boats a lot, and having a shield that can't deal with water very well, have you got any idea how they would deal with that? I mean the glue would probably loose grip and everything fall appart.
Good question. But to dissolve the glue, you would actually have to completely soak it in water for an extended period of time. The Romans used leather covers for their shields, probably oiled. Waxed linen would work, too. Fixing smaller areas on a shield would easily be done with heat treatment which is no big deal in an age when fires were lit constantly.
Also keep in mind that exposure to salt water would have also quickly caused corrosion on steel weapons, too. So one could expect some routine of dealing with the issue on sea voyages.
How can i find rings like this? I need a searchword.
I have been avidly following this and have been slowly assembling supplies.. Do you know of other facing materials?
do you think deer hide would be suitable?
I used a worn out linen shirt
there is no indication of any textile covers prior to the High Middle Ages. Any hide you use should be fine if you thin it down to an even thickness. Keep in mind that hide thickness varies.
did you split those boards or are they sawn... because shields were split?
@Living History School They are split, but he commissioned them, but I forget from who.
What the guy in the video says is that from a historical perspective, a sword or an axe would often get stuck and jammed in the thin shield wall, giving you the advantage of being able to take the opponent's weapon. But if you ask me, from a structural mechanics standpoint, that's just complete bullshit. Because if you put a proper edge on your shield, and maybe even make it out of metal, you don't want the opponent's weapon to penetrate your shield anyway. If you make a metal edge, you hope that the opponent strikes it with their weapon and ideally even destroys it.
I definitely don't see myself making my shields as thin as the guy in the video suggests.
not sure if its been asked yet but what is the width and diameter of this shield? just by looking at it id have to guess a minimum of 3ft in width at least...
88 cm in diameter which puts it between the Trelleborg shield (84 cm) and the Gokstad shields (94cm).
How much nutella do I need to make a shield?
:)
I thought that too
Hellow from Russian reenactment! Can you answer please, how glue medieval norman shield without middle handle? And make curvature? Is curvature spec. effect when skin dry? Thank you for videos and good luck! Sorry for my eng.)))
Curvature on shields may indeed be achieved by the clever use of liquid glue which would make a hide facing and the the wood surface expand and later shrink at different rates. However, many surviving medieval shields appear to be covered with the same materials on both front and back, which would likely neutralize the effect. Thus the curvature must have been produced by chamfering the edges of shield planks before glueing them to each other.
Hope this helps. Greetings to Russia!
Thank you.)
For heater and kite shields one may use plywood layers glued into a press.
th-cam.com/video/xz-p_4V-EBs/w-d-xo.html
My question for any and all and for Roland Warzecha is how did the ancients make domed round shields?
Surely I'm not the first to ask this but, with a shield so thin what about arrows?
Marshall Banana Or Javelins.
I think projectiles will probably get stuck, unless it's a heavy bow or a crossbow
It tapers around a little after half way? I think it should be ok as there is still an amount of wood with hide.
A common question. We will run according tests at a later point. But apparently, thin shields were considered good enough a protection. This contemporary picture shows Anglo-Saxons with domed round shields advancing. Note how the front guy lifts and extends his shield to ward off missiles. See some arrows already got stuck in his shield: warfare2.netai.net/6C-11C/Franks_Casket-lid-lg.jpg
Bret Alvarez
Not sure these shields were ever meant to go against steel crossbows and ''heavy'' longbows. The weapons of that era marginally overlap the viking age. Dont get me wrong, they had powerful bows at the time of the vikings, crossbows too(non steel prods), but in fewer number and seriously less powerful than their later brethren. English longbows could be twice as powerful as some longbows of that time, for the crossbows even more so. All in all, if some care was put into the making of the shield, and it most certainly was, it would have no problems dealing with contemporary weapons. Most projectiles would be stuck, but some of them even bounced, given the taper and flex of the said shield...
P.S. I dont know what kind of arrow heads were the vikings and their enemies using, but that is the most important part of determining penetrating power.
Some guys use dog chew bones for the edge.
Dog chew is made from inferior parts of hide. Learn more on preparing hide to cover or edge a shield here: th-cam.com/video/9uSF231q1A0/w-d-xo.htmlm29s
This shield would offer zero protection against an axe blow. Even a decent sword would shatter it after a few hits. I doubt it would stop much more than a weakly shot arrow, too. That's fine if it's only for show, but using a thin and light shield to demonstrate medieval fighting techniques will lead to false conclusions.
There are exactly zero Iron Age or Viking Age shield fragments that indicate a more robust construction. If you as a modern person cannot make authentic arms work in whatever fight simulation you use to run your tests, then, apparently, your fighting technique is indeed based on false conclusions.
Compare to what I say here: th-cam.com/video/9uSF231q1A0/w-d-xo.htmlm21s
Thank you for taking the time to post the video link. I still think your shield may be a little too thin, but I agree that no shield, however thick, will stand against repeated blows. It depends a lot on what materials are used, too. Apparently in the sagas it says for shields to be made from flexible woods like linden. This had the effect of absorbing blows and even bouncing blows back. Not good for your opponent's wrists! This was interesting reading: spangenhelm.com/the-norse-shield/.
Thank you for the link. There are a number of assertions in that text that cannot be supported by any evidence that I am aware of. Some is outright wrong, I am afraid to say: The assertion that "The Viking shield was ahead of its time" may be driven by enthusiasm, but, in fact, the opposite is true. It is an old Germanic design that fits particular contexts of combat which became increasingly rare in the High Middle Ages. Which is why the flat center-gripped round shield was ultimately abandoned, and the truly innovative forms of the so-called Viking Age, namely domed Frankish shields, were further developed to form the standard in medieval Europe, that is curved shields of various shapes. (There neither is a single shield on this page that I would consider a valid replica, I have to say.)
The Icelandic sagas are a debatable source. They originate from some two hundred years after the Viking Age. I prefer to go by examining surviving shield fragments and fittings. And this is exactly what informed the making of my shield. Thanks for your interest.
Keep in mind, that a lot of energy will be absorbet just by flexing the material and if you deflect blows instand of parriing them, the main energy will pass along the surface of the shield.