I haven't watched the Discovery series, but I've heard mostly negativity. For a minute, I thought the video was saying they put StarGate replicators in there. I forgot that Star Trek had a technology called "replicators" (same word) that could materialise objects from a stream of atoms/molecules (like a superfast version of 3D printing). No, I thought it was the StarGate version of the Borg. Yeah, those replicators. The ones that stick hands in your brain and read your mind. I thought arrrrrgggghhhh those darn Discovery writers have introduced those stick-their-hands-in-your-head replicators and introduced them into the Star Trek universe. A StarGate-StarTrek crossover.
I wish they'd stop going back to the original time line and make a new Star Trek that takes place one hundred years or more after TNG. The new one could be intergalactic and take place in the Andromeda galaxy. I want to see something new in the original star trek formula.
The difference is the original series’s writers based life on a starship off life aboard a nautical ship, whereas for Discovery the writers based it off working at Google or Facebook.
Yeah, I hated how in Discovery, they talked to each other like they work in an office, and not a gigantic starship that requires military-style hierarchies.
It's like they are trying to write a show for the woke twitter crowd. Either that or they are intentionally trying to destroy the franchise. A la star wars
@@onewholovesvenison5335 we're very informal on submarines compared to the rest of the military, or so I hear...basically anyone below paypgrade E-7 is addressed with their last name only. unless E-5 or E-6 is mad at you, then you might want to say "yes petty officer" but I was technically a petty officer (3rd class, E-4) and no one ever said "yes petty officer" to me or addressed me as "petty officer [my last name]". Of course, I avoided leadership at all costs and got out after 4 years :)
Perfectly fitting every other ST series then ;-) From start to everything since, ST is full of internal logic and continuity errors, incredible plot conveniences and resolutions and even its fair share of character inconsistencies.
@@user-ww9yw4zi8m James Doohan (Scotty) was in the Canadian Army and landed at Normandy. DeForest Kelly (Bones) was in the USAAF Film Unit. Gene Rodenberry was also in the USAAF and flew B-17s in the Pacific
At a science fiction convention back in the early '70s, I got to ask Mr. Roddenberry how the food synthesizers worked on the Enterprise. He had apparently given it great thought long before I asked the question. He said that the ship's stores were loaded with all the basic molecules for food processing and were assembled by the computer into whatever dish you liked. He even said the waste system broke down the human waste to make new molecules for food and water. Then he laughed and said it didn't really matter what anyone ordered, because it all tasted like chicken anyway. Here is a bit of memory from a kid of those days. When Star Trek aired on TV. One of its main backers and supporters was Swanson and son's TV frozen dinners. They were fairly big sized tinfoil trays with a tin foil top. You slipped them into the oven for about 35 minutes and when it popped out you had a full course meal all ready to eat. They had 4 choices at the time. Steak(Salisbury steak), shrimp, fish and sliced roast and potatoes. Know what they had in common? They all tasted like chicken. Except for the shrimp. It had no flavor at all. People often referred to it as future food and space food. As for the veggies? A pea tasted like a carrot that tasted just like the potatoes. They had just the very slightest resemblance of the actual veggies. Most people smothered them in margarine to make them taste edible. Now that you get that little time portal here's a kicker. Most all of the food shown from the replicators on the original show were baked Swanson and son dinners. The company would deliver cases of the dinners every week to the studio for the show to have and use to feed the crews. It also saved production cost and the art department a lot of money.
This is why I appretiate Enterprise more and more. They understood that they were set in a time before Kirk so they used food synthesizers, a chefs gallery, hydroponics and MRE's.
Indeed. I always appreciate the internal look of the ship too. They managed to strike a balance between looking inferior to a 1960s version of the future while still being superior to today's technology.
@@RealShologar - They had transporters. Heck, they had them back in the ENT era. They were just a "new" thing during the ENT era, and most of the crew didn't trust them for anything more than cargo. They avoided using them on people for the most part.
@@danielyeshe yes! I especially love the inclusion of the Makos. It showed a period of transition from traditional military to a combination with space fleets to what became the Starfleet we already knew. Vessel built with practically and limited comfort that extended to everything from uniforms to quarters. Underrated.
@@saberiandream316 and stole the spore drive concepts as well. Not saying it was a good idea, I think the whole concept of the spore drive, is stupid. But and I quote: "Tardigrades is an unreleased point-and-click adventure game about a civilization that existed 20,000 years ago and discovered that, through the use of giant tardigrades, they could travel anywhere in the universe."
That was one of the great parts of watching that episode when it premiered and having a stupid memory for stuff like that. Give me a verbal list of 4 things.. I'll forget 3 of them... ask me a detail about a TV show made before I was born than I love.. sure, I can remember that... lol. We had a watch group in college of fellow nerds and we all geeked out when that line came up... I think one of us said "it's green" before data did.
When I first watched that during the original run of ST:TNG, I busted out laughing. Everyone else in the room looked at me funny - NO IDEA at all about the reference. Then I had to explain to this room full of people, most of whom had not seen the original show. I must have looked like the Nerd King.....
"We're taking from today's history to talk about US history!" uh... yeah. do you guys remember when Kahn Noonien Singh took over a quarter of the planet during the eugenics wars 25 years ago? Clearly, our trivial political differences are much more important than the world being taken over by genetically engineered superhumans.
@@croatoansounds That's because Star Trek Discovery isn't Star Trek. It's something they dredged out of a cesspool and then polished and covered in Star Trek sauce to make it appealing to fans of Star Trek, but in the basis? It has nothing to do with Star Trek. In the words of Tolkien: "The Shadow that bred them can only mock, it cannot make: not real new things of its own. I don't think it gave life to [the orcs], it only ruined them and twisted them;"
Enterprise also had access to an archive if technology from the future. The chief of security specifically had access to the roommate was locked in and later developed force fields far sooner than they should have appeared. I think it's reasonable to conclude that the temporal prime directive was violated repeatedly which led to a new timeline where replicators appeared earlier. Of course that also means that every series that came before that prequel would not have happened that way because Starfleet technology would have been further along.
Key point there, Alien replicator. There's nothing wrong with having an alien race equipped with technology earlier than Starfleet in the prequel series.
i suppose it's possible one guy may have seen one ep... they forgot it... and they have been mandated by Kurtzman from upon high, to not resemble old trek as much as possible
ya, they got high and drunk and binge watched a couple on a friday night in a screening room. dont u dare suggest they dont kno what they dont know what they dont know they are talking about that they dont know
But most of the things in ENT were explained, it was not like booom, we have transporters and phasers now, they explained it, which is completely different case than Discotrisco where they have TNG technology with no reason already in 1st season, also what makes Discovery weird is that there are no WARP jump! How can we have StarTrek show with no warp jumps? I really miss them.
@@jamesderiven1843 Discovery gets a little less worse each season, though not by much. That said, SO much stuff was coming out during the period that discovery was released, we kept back burning it to watch other things, until it got to be 6-7 months after the season had ended before we finished it. That's how back burnered it got.
I liked Enterprise when it wasn't all about time travel. Unfortunately, the writers had a real hard on for time travel, so they refused to let the show actually stand on it's own merits without all the references to other times.
Wow. I am not the biggest fan of Star Trek but seeing this..... I can see how dirty they have done the lore and the people who love it. It would have been so easy to just find some, anyone, to do this research they almost had to actively disregard the hundreds of references there must be. My condolences.
@@rorschachsjournal2084 Not with a metal whisk he doesn't. Gordan uses plastic spatulas, or rubber coated whisks or other non-metal cookware, you never use metal on metal especially on a non stick pan, which is what Kirk is doing here.
As a bit of an aside, I was always under the impression that even in the 24th century the Federation still needed agriculture and mining. Replication is a powerful technology, but the direct transformation of energy into matter is still a massive power sink. On a long-range starship where you happen to have a large military-grade warp core available, replicating food for a crew of 150 people might be a practical solution. But even Voyager (the most advanced starship with the smallest crew) still frequently needed to stop and forage or trade for foodstuffs. Replicator use was heavily rationed, and replicator rations were often spoken about as a sort of grey market currency on the ship. Similarly, DS9 made some references to "industrial replicators" for creating construction materials and consumer goods, but surely it's still more efficient to make girders and angle iron out of mined and refined ore.
Yeah it's kind of inconsistent since according to Geordi power conversion ratios of 95%+ are basically standard for the Federation, and the jack ass competing with a rival engineer to get it even higher to like 97% or something just for bragging rights. Power sink my ass. Most replicators are powered by their own internal fusion reactor and the federation handed them out like candy in TNG's era. DS9 was explained away by the fact the vast majority of the station's tech is incompatible with Federation tech, and Cardassian tech is not as efficient, and most Bajoran tech is reclaimed Cardassian tech. Voyager is honestly an absolute contrivance, the tech manuals have said that antimatter can last for YEARS of regular use and that was for the Galaxy class starships that had families and 1000+ crew members. The Intrepid class is a long range explorer, with a crew of 150, given the fact they make mention of bartering/trading for antimatter all the time. Plus they also make mention of building an antimatter converter out of some backup fusion reactor for the impulse drive, I think the rationing was just something cooked up by the writers to give the sense of "being far away from home" feeling to the show.
I've always wondered why, if they can create replicas of materials down to the atomic level, why wouldn't they just replicate starships? Re-arrange atoms in asteroids into starships, and make as many as you need to fight the Dominion. Just have lots of antimatter cores supplying the power. Build a starship the regular way, deep scan it down to the molecular level, and start making identical copies. There's a lot of things that don't make sense in Star Trek given their level of technology. Have a specialized transporter system that keeps all hardware components stored in memory, and if something breaks down or gets damaged it would beam in a replicated version of that component, precisely splicing it in to get the ship working again. Auto repair, done. That's just an example.
@@stevew8513 I can think of any number of limitations to replicators. Two off the top of my head: 1) Exotic materials. Trek tech uses a lot of it. There's stuff that replicators just can't make and any component that uses that stuff can't easily be replicated. The higher performance, more highly sophisticated the tech, the more likely this is to be the case. IRL, computer components already use rare earth elements; in Trek, certain techs may need materials with such exotic properties as a carbon lattice that exists in nine dimensions or something that a replicator can't build. 2) Resolution limits. Certain components may be required to be made with a greater precision than standard replicators are capable of doing. If replicators are limited to nanometer scale and you need picometer level precision for your part, then you're never getting a properly made part from the replicator. That being said, replicators can make FOOD, so any precision limits are beyond that required to make edible food. Atomic level precision could just be insufficient to make some of the more exotic Trek tech. That being said, replicator tech clearly improves with time. The list of stuff that can't be made shrinks... but also may get added too as even more advanced tech is invented. Resolution improves. The volume of space that can be used for replication improves. Stuff that required specialized synthesizers and processors (which in my headcanon uses similar tech) before can now be done with a general purpose replicator.
Crew in Voyager didn't have replicator rations because of limited power, they had rations because there was a limited supply of solid matter available for replication. Voyager was a small ship, so they probably couldn't fit a lot into the storage tanks anyway, and then they got stuck out in the middle of nowhere with no readily available resupply of solid matter. I don't remember any episodes where they explain how they could/would a obtain solid matter resupply, but there could be one.
@@dinkledankle well if replicators can rearrange components into food then logically it should work in reverse. so they get a couple tons of grain, feed it into a replicator (or the transporter seeing as the tech is related) and now you have carbs, fibre and assorted vitamins and proteins ready to be reassembled into whatever you want
As a non Star Trek fan, I have to thank RLM. To realize how this franchise can have writers from one era be inspired by stories of ships and the knowledge to run a ship ... versus writers who went on wikipedia.
I think they have to balance the need to stay orthodox to canon for every detail and to be true science fiction and imagine the future for the contemporary audience. With our present day knowledge of 3d printing and holograms, it doesn’t seem quite genuine to believe that the current technology wouldn’t advance that far in 200 years.
@@idaruthia If you want to do that with a new audience, you make a new scifi setting for the contemporary audience like they did 50 years ago. This is called plagiarism, and that gets you a 0 anywhere that matters. Look at something like Alien Isolation: they use the old, 70's style computers for the aesthetic design to keep it true to the original setting. That is an adaptation of old media done right. You still have to preserve the world building of the original authors as you are not and never will be the same as them. Either make a copy or make your own, but to disrespect them and yourself is to just make a shit. No amount of corporate PR can make a turd shine, it'll still be a turd.
Given how many times the show has used time travel to change its own history, EXPLICITLY; it’s really sad to see so many hateful people simply preclude the possibility of innumerable implicit changes to the timeline - and fail forgive a show they love for continuing to show them how to overcome the obstacles we create for ourselves. I watch Doctor Who fans hate DW similarly ironically. It’s really sad. Both shows continue to be amazing. You’ll forgive me not bothering to tell you what I don’t like about the show. There’s enough of that going on here already.
It could be argued that at least some of the technology shown in Discovery is more akin to 3D-printing rather than replication, but I'm not willing to give the writers of that dreck any benefit of the doubt.
I was disappointed that ENT went with the Xindi story arc instead of the Earth-Romulan War. The war with the Romulans have been mentioned throughout the various series before ENT. The showrunners claimed they went with the Xindi story arc to avoid a repeat of the Dominion War on DS9 but I suspect that they didn't go with the Earth-Romulan War because they didn't have the CGI budget for two massive fleets in battle.
It's not just the writers, ENT should have had one more season at least but management (who, mind you, wasn't experienced in making such decisions for Sci-FI based on prior shows) decided to axe it because the movies weren't helping at the time either. We got robbed of showing the Romulan War.
Well yea no shit. Nobody gets into writing or acting these days and aspires to work on fucking Star Trek lmao They'd much rather do other shows but are stuck working on trek
Okay. Well, with a name like that, one could assume that one, it involves space travel, and two, with 'trek' in it, that it's not just travel, but a journey or a trip fromone place to another. If it's a journey through space, it could be about exploration and study, or planting a new colony of people on another world, or perhaps the show's title is simply the uninspired name of a space-fairing vessel or travel company that handles space travel in similar fashion to an airport. If it's the last one, then it could be a sci-fi version of the show Friends or The Office. Not very interesting, but funny at least, and relatable to anyone in a similar industry. If it's any of the previous, that would demand research on what we know now about our solar system, and the galaxy in general, and current theories as well. Build the world, before you build the characters, as the world will affect who the characters are, WHAT the characters are, and allow you to flesh out their individual histories and personalities. What year is it right now in the show? Are we going to intro the main characters in their youth first, and then do a time-skip a few years or decades later? Okay. So they're on a ship. How much is CGI and how much is a set? What's practical for our budget? Sometimes less is more but we'll need to think about where and when. So it's the pilot episode. How about a simple test of the ship's systems first to make sure everything is working fine before going on a deep-space mission? We're showing a ship preparing to leave a dock on one of Mars' moons. World Lore states that before we landed on Mars a docking and re-supply station was built on one of Mars' moons first. This was later updated from sending and receiving orders from Earth for the Mars colony (the planet still isn't at a stage of inhabitable without a life support suit just yet but there are several domed colony-towns visible on the ground in the background through a window on the starship. They'll be made via model and slow-sliding camera angles instead of CGI and if we make that a 'standard design' for non-Earth colonies we can re-use the models in later shots on other planets and moons, thus saving money in the budget in the future, and if the show becomes popular enough replicas that can be opened to reveal rooms inside with little models of robots and characters can be sold in toy sections of stores). The different set pieces that are important sections of the ship will receive a few minutes of screen time each, letting the audience get a vague feel for the people working there and the atmosphere of the place, as well as a brief tour. Eventually we arrive at the bridge, which will vaguely resemble what looks like the control room of a modern submarine. An ACTUAL submarine though, not what a movie might display. Currently the place has a 'unused' in the new sense look to it, but as the show's story progresses a few niknaks will find their way there such as maybe a worn set of dice by the pilot's station (not fuzzy), perhaps a photo of a friend or loved one, a half-empty candy jar near the gunner with assorted candies in it that you'll see him/her/it indulge in from time to time throughout the show, a broken tooth from some big alien creature as a souvenir, and a plaque on the wall by the door that reads 'keep your stations neat and tidy or personal-decorations will be confiscated' added towards the end of the show due to someone spilling something in a previous episode on their console and causing problems. But that's an issue for later. --I was going to keep going but I took a step back and realized it was pointless since I'm not actually being given funds and rights to make a show.---
I wouldn't expect the writers to know every epsiode or at least not remember all details but does the Star Trek franchise not have some kind of continuity manager that has to check for these things?
That lore and history does not belong to them. Don't forget. The foundation of Trek was laid down by a much more talented group of creators. What we have now is a bunch of hacks trying to make bank on something they cannot understand.
This is what happens when you clearly wanted to do a sequel and make everything incredibly modern and technologically advanced, but you're forced to do a prequel. So you just do a sequel anyway but change some plot points so it's in the past, ruining the timeline as you go. Then, you get tired of that, so you time-jump so far into the future that you can ruin the entire franchise retroactively.
And it's already lessons learned with Voyager and Enterprise that these smug cronies have failed to learn. Thankfully, as Trek fans, we know where this is going. Prioritizing UPN over Star Trek led to the downfall of Classic Star Trek. Can't wait till it comes for NuTrek. There is no Michael Piller coming to restore the IP. It's over.
@@saberiandream316 I don't think it's over though, I really hope it isn't since this stuff is revolutionary, not only is it a pretty good science fiction, it also makes us think about our future as we develop space travel and reach the stars where we before couldn't have.
@@venezuelaanimations3732 I meant merely from studying history, franchise fatigue and market oversaturation will eventually set in, for whatever reason they drive away the casual new fans they have. And then, we shall see where Star Trek goes...
EVERY trek f-ed something up. The more you have, the easier it is across 50 years. That's a given. But historical facts like replicators you just can't change on a whim! I hate the cavernous turbolift shafts.....but lets not forget how many decks the Enterprise-A had too in the name of storytelling!
That moment when Lwoxana tells Stevie "that was your unpleasant surprise" and he just stares at her with dead eyes as apathy & hatred built in his soul was hilarious
Yeah, that blank baffled stare with the hate behind his eyes, the obsession to talk about everything white... Did we just watch Tucker Carlson's origin story there?
@@strategic_amber_reservoir That's how science fiction explains novel concepts and makes them commonplace and ubiquitous - H.G. Wells takes over 30 pages to explain what time travel / a time machine even is in his book _The Time Machine,_ whereas now it's a tired trope. We aren't especially genius and people of the past weren't especially dull, the concept simply hadn't become part of the canon yet.
Special detail note to the continued repetition of “food concentrates”; Trekkies familiar with the original series will know that despite the absence of replicators, they did have some limited food synthesize ation technology, specifically the ability to transport those food concentrates and re-organize them into edible compounds, this as explained is exactly how the “modern” replicators function in further iterations of Star Trek.
In fact even on Enterprise they recycled their food by dividing the atoms of their poop and reconstruct them. The replicator was just much more advanced.
I love how, of all the people, Uhura comes running in to check on who fired that phaser. Ahead of the security. "We have a known killer on board. And a phaser went off! I better go rush in unarmed and see who it is!" But that's just a funny small thing you can overlook. Discovery full on broke Star Trek.
Also in the movies, I think Chekov may have been in charge of security, so he should have been well aware of the fact you can't fire a phaser aboard without an alarm going off. Even if he wasn't security, he has been on a starship far longer than Valeris to have her teach him something basic about starship operations.
@@whos-the-stiff Well Maybe back in the 2260's when Chekov started you could, maybe its a new 2290's reg. I mean Chokov was an engine in 2267, and Undiscovered country is 2293, lots of time between for new rules and regulations
@@tphillips37 I kind of like the pot vapourising and leaving the stuff inside intact. A neat bit of world building as to what the phaser could be capable of. It was probably set to, "Strip Search".
The sad thing is, I actually could buy them having replicators... if they just produced food the crew complained about constantly. Not like how in TNG/DS9/VOY where it seemed like the issue was that everything was just kind of bland or a specific item always tasted the same as every other instance of that item you requested, but rather like a $1 frozen microwave burger from a gas station, food that just looks and tastes completely wrong or has weird textures for what it's supposed to be that makes the crew desire more than anything to obtain fresh food at every stop they make or have a staff of chefs to replicate basic food ingredients and cook them to at least make them not-quite-as-shit. The speed of what was shown in Discovery seemed era-appropriate for the most part, at least.
At least DS9 tried to show more people who preferred cooking to replicators to the point of that being the reason the station has restaurants. That, and the station's food replicators seemed to constantly malfunction. But outside of Scotty grumbling about synthohol, TNG was pretty bad about making it seem like home cooked meals were a thing of the past. And VOY has Neelix, so your options were take your chances with whatever he was cooking, or put up with bland replicator rations.
The scenes from the OG Star Trek series just reminds me how ahead of his time Gene was, a show like Star Trek was needed in the 60s, it gave such hope for the future!
The future isn't about optimism and humanity reaching it's potential anymore. Petty, vindictive, and unstable people are so much more dramatic. I'm just glad that as alternate timelines I can just ignore Enterprise, Discovery, and the JJverse.
@@frankb3347 Enterprise really isn't that bad. there is a lot of care and thought that went into it. Though I could have done without the Xindi arc to be honest, but while it's not the best Trek, it was still well done. Discovery on the other hand is the worse TV show with a budget I am aware of in the history of TV making.
@@jonathanberry1111 Scarier is the type of scrubs it will spawn, it encourages wrong qualities in people. Kurtzman's way of replicating himself only worse.
And this also goes into the Discovery era writers underestimating the miracle of food replicators. They are still thinking with our era's concept of organic foods and vegan shit being healthy when in the future, they can literally replicate ANY food to the way you want. It's not "artificial" like how we see it. It's food
The irony is "organic" food, as in actually cultivated and grown is seen as an anachronism in the future and very few people do it. Yet these writers think they would be relevant in such a future, hilarious.
I wanted Discovery to be post-TNG. I’m still waiting on an actual live action Starfleet Star Trek show that takes place some time in or after the 2380s. I do really like Picard but so far we haven’t seen nearly enough of Starfleet in it. I hope season 3 changes that. Give me Admiral Picard, Captain Riker, Captain La Forge, Ambassador Worf, Doctor Crusher and councillor Troi on the bridge of the Enterprise D/E/F (depending on what direction they want to take it) for one last adventure.
I was under the impression that there were simple industrial replicators in tos era ,used for spare parts and such things ( like todays 3D printers in some cases )
Exactly, there was a reason TNG took place 80 years after TOS era films: Technology at the time had advanced and imagination of future tech had advanced. They should just have gone for a sequal that took place in the 25th-26th century in the first place and just made Michel into Spocks granddaughter instead. Or like, since Picard was also being develpoed: Have a character appear in both shows. A vulcan perhaps, cast a 25-30 year old and let them play a cadet in Picard and a Captain/admiral in Discovery etc (so they're would be a connection between the shows).
They didn't forget that the original Enterprise had no replicators because they never knew, because they didn't ever watch the Original Series. And if someone had told them, they wouldn't have cared. All the classic Star Trek that has been loved and cherished down the generations is just an inconvenience to the people who offer us JunkTrek. They wish it would go away. They are trying to make it go away. When the dust finally settles on all this, of course, it is JunkTrek that will have been shelved and forgotten and classic Star Trek that the world will still be watching.
@@mastermonarch That is their ambition, but JunkTrek will be shelved and forgotten before that can happen. They are counting on the Far East to save them, but. Chinese and Japanese audiences have better taste than that.
@@ransom182 Deep Space Nine and Voyager are the pinnacle of Star Trek. People will be watching reruns of Deep Space Nine and Voyager long after you are dead.
Did they forget...or just not give a fuck? Lol. I'm not conservative at all, but I kinda am when it comes to fictional media. If the lore states they didn't have replicators back then, KEEP it that way.
That isn't conservative, that is a fundamental principle when writing a mythology. Not even time travel changes should be taken lightly, because if you do so, anything that was affected in the past should appear that way in the older series too. If there was a reference to Gabriel Bell in TOS or TNG, DS9 wouldn't have been allowed to make that episode about the 21st century
Well that is the definition of conservative. To maintain a tradition or set of ethics/code passed down from prior sources. So essentially, maintaining continuity is conservation of the source.
they didn't forget, they're called food synthesizers. A bit more advanced, given it's an experimental science vessel, but still food synthesizers. And replicators did exist in the federation, as well as starfleet, just not standard on every ship, most were crude and meant for only the most basic shit. Grin being the hate-clickbaiter they are, also included some scenes from Season 3 when they are WAAAAAY past the 23rd century.
@@DrowningMoon Which is something I never understood about Starfleet: how can you be made up of the "best and brightest" when you have people that can't or won't promote? Like that episode of TNG when Picard was the 20 year lieutenat, why would you even want this guy around much less on the flagship of the Federation.
@@erwin669 Well, one of the reasons why people want "promotions" in today's world is money, which they don't have in the Federation. Always seemed to me that you can't look at rank and promotions in that way. If you were a damn good engineer and you loved being an engineer why would you move up if it meant more delegation and less doing what you love if money was no factor. Hell even where I work engineers often become managers and get annoyed they don't get their hands dirty anymore. In Trek it always seemed to me that if you were one of the best engineers in the federation and a lieutenant or chief or whatever, the way to gain more of a challenge, prestige, renown, etc was to move from your ship that delivers supplies from Earth to unimportant outposts and onto a ship of more import such as the Enterprise, Excelsior, etc. Things make more sense from that standpoint. Characters on the Enterprise are often told they could leave the ship to gain a promotion, become a first officer or captain on another vessel and they turn it down cause they know they are on the Seal Team 6 of the Federation's crews. Riker could have been captain of his own ship for years and years. Most crewmembers seem to value being a part of important missions, having a challenging environment, being a part of something bigger than themselves, and being good at what they do. Characteristics most humans cherish when you remove money as a concern.
But there were food synthesizers… more primitive versions of food replicators. The synthesizers could provide essential nutrition in (colored) cube form… and ice cream apparently.
Like phasers are a "beam" weapon. Not the damn JJ phasers that shoot little bolts. Like Klingons are NOT this bizarre alien. They were augments then later restored to their original look. Food synthesizers are entirely different from replicators. They simply convert algae which ship's hydroponics grows into a "base" protein that can be resequenced. It doesn't involve a transporter. In fact, if anyone remembers TOS, the food had odd shapes and colors and did not resemble what we would call food.
I'm more annoyed of that computer voice whenever the "replicator" is used. They didn't have it in TOS or later when real replicators happened, so why have it in the first place? Honestly, it just makes the replicators feel like some cheap-ass corporate product, reminds me of the Working Joes from Alien Isolation, that kept asking various generic soulless corporate approved questions, like "Why not ask me about Sevastopol's safety protocols?". At least there one of the writers intended it as a satire of corporatism, after said writer saw a similar motto in a McDonalds. Whereas in NuTrek it's treated seriously.
bear in mind Discovery had an experimental propulsion system that nobody even heard of before in the entirety of Trek canon. Who's to say they didn't have an experimental matter resequencer as well?? Hell, with that drop-in of Spock suggesting that nobody talk about Discovery under penalty of treason(!), right at that moment, they could do what the hell they wanted. They took the easy, lazy way out by sending the ship nearly 1,000 years into the future and obliterating canon Trek in one fell swoop. By the way: the preceding paragraph may contain spoilers. Tough noogies, STD season 2 has been out what, 2 years and change? If you haven't seen it yet, sucks to be you.
TAS introduced voice activated food synths as upgrades on the enterprise A. And TNG had an episode where the replicator tells Troi that she can't have real chocolate sundae because it's not nutritionally balanced. And the replicator that told Janeway to make her own damn coffee.
They evolved into replicators. Synthesizers was the precursor. And they began to mention replicators specifically eventually. Replicators actually did exist in the 23rd century. They were just not perfected versions. Even in discovery, they referred to them as synths. Regardless, who give a fuck, really. Few star trek shows were that meticulous about continuity. They have all engaged in retcons and updates.
@@reynnar6585 Yea. probably. That and we're in a weird situation where we have modern technology and effects but we're dealing with a property whose timeline was created in the 60s. The limitations of the time informed what people saw, so people freak out when you update content for a modern audience.
I dont think we will ever see a Klingon on any Star Trek property again. If they show a TGN Klingon it will be them admitting that Discovery is not canon, But if they show the Klingorc's again; they will hit bees nest of Fandom again. Even in 'Picard 1 & 2' they will avoid showing Klingons aside from a 2 sec picture of Worf. It's ridiculous, Klingons are one of the biggest alien species in the galaxy, and not a single one was seen in Picard S1 or Discovery S3; it's like staying in Miami for 20 years and not seeing a single Cuban person.
Interestingly enough. It isn't even that hard to explain how both can exist. STO for example establishes they're a separate ethnic group. It doesn't explain why they're more advanced however. How I'd do it. The Klingorcs are Klingon Augments, which could explain them being more advanced.
The rights shifting of Star Trek property had alot to do with that, and I think we will probably still see them again in the Kelvin films. I would say you're right about the Prime timeline but last I heard was Worf is confirmed in Season 2 of Picard, so we shall see.
What about the chicken soup that the transporter chief gave the MP in Tomorrow is Yesterday? Or the ice cream Nurse Chapel gave the children in And the Children shall lead? I've always identified those as replicators, and they were basically explained as such during a discussion during a Q&A at a Star trek Convention in the late 70's at Kemper Arena.
I miss the true meaning of EXPLORATION. Didn’t matter which show STE or STG or even the original Star Trek were all well written and exciting! Every episode was guaranteed to have something new! Fighting BORG, accidentally killing a colony to find out you didn’t! Or getting DRUNK on a virus lol! You actually feel it while watching. The newest shows are just terribly written, I feel like if I watched the first episode, middle and last I got the story! Maybe it’s them using a single story arc?? I don’t know but this isn’t Star Trek feels like 90s era soap operas and I cringe every time there’s a heart to heart! I love you no no I love you like wtf am I watching!?? Even Picard is just weird!! Seems like every episode is a deeper hole of not knowing anything, now wait a week to find out nothing again!
Shocking that Disgracery didn't keep to cannon. They don't care about cannon. It was written by people, who hate Star Trek, for people who have never watched Star Trek, but bitch about everything.
I never noticed before that when the pot gets vaporized by the phaser in the galley in VI that one of the galley crew is almost in line and bails out - and a person in the background with a plate/platter does an immediate 180 without saying a word. "Nope - not dealing with this today"
I remember watching some behind the scenes specials or something from the TNG era, and it seems the writers in the 1980s and 1990s were told to treat canon from previous series with caution. Obviously that rule has been thrown in the trash.
Discovery lost me when they went back in time and had J. J. Evans from Good Times as the inventor of warp drive after he accidentally killed Zefram Cochrane with Dyn-O-Mite. Ugh. I was so done after that.
These snowflakes have _admitted_ how little they think of Gene Roddenberry. Heck, in Discovery's season 3, episode 2, the ships crew thoroughly denigrates a fellow crew member, who is (apparently) a "space janitor" as his job is cleaning up messes. He's made to use a completely normal shovel to scoop up the remains of someone who just exploded. The crew can't be bothered to remember his name, but he reminds them that his name is... "Gene"...
I always figured TOS did have replicators. You pushed a button and got food; and somehow magically they were carrying clothing for every culture, every time period for their landing parties. Starships around the time of "Assignment: Earth" were equipped with food synthesizers and other devices for producing clothing and machine parts on demand. While replicators weren't standard in Starfleet until the 24rd century, they even showed up on the 22nd century show Star Trek: Enterprise when the NX-01 visited a mysterious alien repair facility. Food for thought.
I think the difference is that we keep on getting closer and closer to replicators through 3-D printing whether your 3-D printing food metal or plastic or other composites and so it is necessary to update our expectations of what the future would look like.
It's funny how at first the Discovery scenes seemed fairly accurate to how the food dispensers are depicted in TOS, but then they just had to keep going... Also, what's the 3D animation at 06:56 ? I have no clue what it is
So now we finally know why Harry Kim is still an ensign! Sidenote: Dr. Julian Bashir didn't pack his dress uniform and couldn't replicate it with DS9's Cardassian replicators! It's like when I go to the Marine base with plenty of Navy corpsmen there and still can't find a Navy uniform item!
Plus there's probably also an aspect that dress uniforms might be prestigious items, like some other non-replicated items we see. You're not meant to replicate them, but to take care of your non-replicated uniform as a sign of dedication to Starfleet?
OMg I have seen pretty much every episode of both TOS and TNG hundreds of times and I NEVER caught TNG's "It's green" reference as a homage/nod to that TOS episode!
On DS9, the Feds were having problems with getting their tech, including replicators, to work with the Cardie power, so Julian couldn't have one made, and maybe Garak wasn't available to make one or right fabric not available.
It's unlikely you want a sensitive item like a military uniform being able to be made on a small ship attached to a base anyway. If it falls into enemy hands.
@@nyetloki yeah it could be that certain items have hardcoded blocks in the device software, to prevent sensitive items like uniforms being used in any false flag operations. It also probably helps with crew obedience, IRL soldiers have to take great care of their uniforms so not being able to make a new one at the snap of their fingers probably helps with discipline there.
In Pike's Era they did have rudimentary food replicators (due to that times limited tech on making special fx for tv). On kirk's enterprise's cafeteria they order their food at a terminal with a sliding panel (like those old Food-tomatics but without the glass windows), it was in a handful of episodes.
Discovery had so many inconsistencies...both with legacy trek and within its own framework...made many moments ruined as the errors broke my suspension of disbelief.
@@eschelar "I used to do drugs. I still do use drugs, but I used to, too." Moreover with Discovery the only way to truly enjoy it is to be just like Mitch and get high as hell prior to consumption of all the empty entertainment calories.
I doubt that "errors broke my suspension of belief." Because Star Trek has literally had continuity errors between episodes of the same season. Its Trek's trademark at this point. Spock forgetting for the first three episodes that his mom was human, how money does or does not work, Klingons, Trill, the Amanda Q, warp 10, literally everything. Nothing in Trek has really ever been consistent. So you're going to have to find a new excuse.
@@samholmes7030 dude, there’s a big difference between the writers making slight tweaks to the plot as the story progresses, and making massive alterations to the universes already established lore.
If I had to guess, I'm pretty sure the writing staff for Discovery never watched any of the other shows. They made a sci-fi soap opera. They could fix it in the 5th season by having some kind of temporal anomaly simply erase Discovery its crew, and its entire timeline from existence.
According to Michael Okuda the Star Trek Animated series was done to the same standards as the original series and used the same guidelines handbook. There is a TAS episode where the Enterprise has what many consider the first holodeck where the computer strands three crew members in the holodeck in a blizzard.
This is just a Trek version of 'TIE fighters can hyperjump', JJ and Kurtzman and their other buddies are fans, but don't know or care about lore like a Dave Filoni does.
There have always been backpeddeling and retconning in ST, Enterprise, had tons of them, but.. theres just too many of them in STD, its one of the problems of writing a series taking place before the previous ones, continuity can be tricky. Yet, altering the timeline to appease the fans that are used to see phasors, replicator etc. Can backfire pretty badly
Krutzman and gang don't give AF about ST continuity. And the little details inform the big ones. That shows how little they care in the grand scope of their production.
Brad Wright had said about making Stargate, at least the _intent_ for continuity is there, to follow the rules of the verse - such as that matter can only travel one way through an active wormhole. Imagine if Kurtzman had been overseeing Stargate? Oh wait, I think he was, that was Stargate Infinity. XD
That's what a 'reboot' IS - it's a 'let's start over because we can't possibly learn all there is to know about the original show, but we're expected to write for a show that's a blatant money-grab ripoff" tactic.
@@xaenon The irony is they call YOU a racist for hating this bullshit. When Sisko is inevitably brought back to fill in that PC check-box, he's gonna reappear 20 years later, and in effect, that shows he perpetuates the welfare queen stereotype, that he just walked out on his family. But Sisko was made to be a positive male role model as opposition to those stereotypes. And then they'll call YOU racist for thinking this (you have welfare queens on your mind, you're projecting!) as damage control (we're not the racists, _you're_ the racists!), so it just continues, on and on and on...
Thank you for this video. Discovery forgot all of Star Trek. The Federation does not use slave labor, warp drive does not look like Star Wars hyperspace, the uniforms are all wrong - even Pike's is very wrong (wrong colors, they did not have black collars etc.), those aren't Klingons, cursing or "colorful metaphors" beyond son of a bitch is unheard of, unless you are talking about proximity phasers - phasers are Beam weapons, tech is otherwise too advanced, bridges use monitors not windows (beyond the ceiling), that is not the Enterprise at all (too big, wrong shape, you can climb out of stuck turbo lifts, bridge too big, that is not engineering, way too much empty space, one support pylon per engine, longer neck, many fewer glowy bits, etc.), 23rd and 24th century ships are not that spacious, etc, etc.. I could go on. I stopped watching the show just before their version of Mudd showed up. I kept finding myself over and over asking out loud, "Have you ever seen Star Trek?" When I found the Enterprise made an appearance I watched that. I tried to give the show another chance. Then I saw it. If they can't get the Enterprise right, F them. This series, that uses Star Trek in its title, sadly owes more to Abrams' 1st remake of Star Wars IV (I even call it Star Trek XI the New Hope) than it does to any other Star Trek series or movie. I understand some choices were made based on legal or who they would have to pay. Fine, but if do not want to pay someone and that means you have to changes things this radically that don't use or better yet, do it.
As an added note, in the late 2260s, the Animated Series shows the Enterprise was fitted with a brand new Rec Deck, essentially a First Generation Holodeck. This is years after Discovery. Another example of where Discovery got it wrong.
Based on the few seconds I've seen of STD in this video, the writers think Star Trek is some kind of dystopian, cyberpunk cautionary tale, instead of a show that's full of optimism like old Trek.
my favorite bs scene involving food is a scene in TNG where Ryker is making eggs terribly and they all have to pretend hes a great cook with skill. he made a fried mess lol
This is pretty consistent with ST writers. They never watch a single show, or have maybe seen a couple of YT shorts from certain episodes, then write a show like Discovery, and make HUGE errors like these.
I had just assumed that, when selecting a stage name, Zachary watched an old episode of "Star Trek: The Animated Series" and was enchanted by the term "quinto-triticale."
They were called synthesizers and they worked in multiple ways, as food elevators, as plate combiners, and as 3d food printers. Not quite at the level of replicators yet.
We'll probably have a rudimentary version for real by the 2040's or 50's. Though I'd imagine appearance will be off, or it'll be flavoured soups, gelatin blocks or something.
my thoughts on how the Replicators and transporters actually work : th-cam.com/video/Yj9hSz0E94o/w-d-xo.html
An excellent break down on the theory. I too think the Nu writers should consider the same logic you are using.
I haven't watched the Discovery series, but I've heard mostly negativity.
For a minute, I thought the video was saying they put StarGate replicators in there. I forgot that Star Trek had a technology called "replicators" (same word) that could materialise objects from a stream of atoms/molecules (like a superfast version of 3D printing).
No, I thought it was the StarGate version of the Borg. Yeah, those replicators. The ones that stick hands in your brain and read your mind.
I thought arrrrrgggghhhh those darn Discovery writers have introduced those stick-their-hands-in-your-head replicators and introduced them into the Star Trek universe. A StarGate-StarTrek crossover.
What the fracking episode are they talking about meatloafs and turkeys? Lal.
Ah, 1x2 Charlie X
I wish they'd stop going back to the original time line and make a new Star Trek that takes place one hundred years or more after TNG. The new one could be intergalactic and take place in the Andromeda galaxy. I want to see something new in the original star trek formula.
STD forgot, they're not making Mass Expanse Effect....
The difference is the original series’s writers based life on a starship off life aboard a nautical ship, whereas for Discovery the writers based it off working at Google or Facebook.
Yeah, I hated how in Discovery, they talked to each other like they work in an office, and not a gigantic starship that requires military-style hierarchies.
It's like they are trying to write a show for the woke twitter crowd. Either that or they are intentionally trying to destroy the franchise. A la star wars
This should have a fuck ton more likes
they had food manufacturing machines in TOS and replicators in TNG and we had neither on USN submarines 1999-2003...lol
@@onewholovesvenison5335 we're very informal on submarines compared to the rest of the military, or so I hear...basically anyone below paypgrade E-7 is addressed with their last name only. unless E-5 or E-6 is mad at you, then you might want to say "yes petty officer" but I was technically a petty officer (3rd class, E-4) and no one ever said "yes petty officer" to me or addressed me as "petty officer [my last name]". Of course, I avoided leadership at all costs and got out after 4 years :)
This happens when writers know their subject only through memes.
Or have no passion for what the do. They are only collection a paycheck.
And wikis.
After the ST Memes, they youtubed there way through the StarWars Hologram memes too,
And they don't give a shit about that fact.
I saw some Star Wars meme, I put into STD now?
I think Discovery forgot a lot more than that , like Plot, internal logic , continuity, Previously established lore, quality writing etc etc
Perfectly fitting every other ST series then ;-) From start to everything since, ST is full of internal logic and continuity errors, incredible plot conveniences and resolutions and even its fair share of character inconsistencies.
You only need one etc.
@@LetBBB6345789like zephram cochran the clean cut guy from alpha centuri vs zephram cochran the crude post apopoliptic unshaven guy from earth
As a deck officer of twenty years I assure you, nobody in Discovery has the slightest clue how a ship runs.
Yeah some of the cast of the original were in the army and navy I think right ?
@@user-ww9yw4zi8m James Doohan (Scotty) was in the Canadian Army and landed at Normandy. DeForest Kelly (Bones) was in the USAAF Film Unit. Gene Rodenberry was also in the USAAF and flew B-17s in the Pacific
Joel thinks he worked on a space ship 😂
They also forgot that Star Fleet Academy used to have standards for admissions.
Soon to be that way in the real U.S. military.
Affirmative Action to let in foreigner.
@@knytrydr73 Soon? You mean already
@@ImperatorClass - well $h!t
@@knytrydr73 What are you talking about?
At a science fiction convention back in the early '70s, I got to ask Mr. Roddenberry how the food synthesizers worked on the Enterprise. He had apparently given it great thought long before I asked the question. He said that the ship's stores were loaded with all the basic molecules for food processing and were assembled by the computer into whatever dish you liked. He even said the waste system broke down the human waste to make new molecules for food and water. Then he laughed and said it didn't really matter what anyone ordered, because it all tasted like chicken anyway.
Here is a bit of memory from a kid of those days. When Star Trek aired on TV. One of its main backers and supporters was Swanson and son's TV frozen dinners. They were fairly big sized tinfoil trays with a tin foil top. You slipped them into the oven for about 35 minutes and when it popped out you had a full course meal all ready to eat. They had 4 choices at the time. Steak(Salisbury steak), shrimp, fish and sliced roast and potatoes. Know what they had in common? They all tasted like chicken. Except for the shrimp. It had no flavor at all. People often referred to it as future food and space food. As for the veggies? A pea tasted like a carrot that tasted just like the potatoes. They had just the very slightest resemblance of the actual veggies. Most people smothered them in margarine to make them taste edible. Now that you get that little time portal here's a kicker. Most all of the food shown from the replicators on the original show were baked Swanson and son dinners. The company would deliver cases of the dinners every week to the studio for the show to have and use to feed the crews. It also saved production cost and the art department a lot of money.
Huh, thanks for the insight. I didn't know that
"He had apparently given it great thought long before I asked the question"
Why DIscovery/Picard sux
The brownies did taste ok in the turkey dinners we had up here in Canada. Kind of like corn/peas with chocolate.😜
Tucker Carlson, the Swanson heir.
@@geraldford6409 Amen! You could say that again.
This is why I appretiate Enterprise more and more. They understood that they were set in a time before Kirk so they used food synthesizers, a chefs gallery, hydroponics and MRE's.
Indeed. I always appreciate the internal look of the ship too. They managed to strike a balance between looking inferior to a 1960s version of the future while still being superior to today's technology.
@@RealShologar - They had transporters. Heck, they had them back in the ENT era. They were just a "new" thing during the ENT era, and most of the crew didn't trust them for anything more than cargo. They avoided using them on people for the most part.
Chefs galley. 😉
@@RealShologar The ships transporter was used in the first episode of the series to save Captain Archer.
@@danielyeshe yes! I especially love the inclusion of the Makos. It showed a period of transition from traditional military to a combination with space fleets to what became the Starfleet we already knew. Vessel built with practically and limited comfort that extended to everything from uniforms to quarters. Underrated.
Seeing a commercial in the Star Trek universe, A COMMERCIAL, made me physically ill.
Come to Quarks, Quarks is fun, don't walk, run!
And eating balls of fur no less.
Shave the cereal.
@@gavcarl it’s the fact that it was a human commercial that made it so wrong.
I agree. Data remarked in an episode of TNG that television didn't last long into the 21st century.
Are you questioning the Star Trek knowledge of the Discovery writers?
No, of course not. I'm just denying it's existence.
I could destroy these fools in a debate. Just give me ten minutes.
I'm still a firm believer they stole a vast majority of their plot and story
@@richardhicks5031 Like how they ripped off Andromeda, lol.
@@saberiandream316 and stole the spore drive concepts as well. Not saying it was a good idea, I think the whole concept of the spore drive, is stupid. But and I quote:
"Tardigrades is an unreleased point-and-click adventure game about a civilization that existed 20,000 years ago and discovered that, through the use of giant tardigrades, they could travel anywhere in the universe."
What are denying exists?
I never realized “it’s green” was referencing the episode with the Kelvans. That’s an epic call back decades in the making.
Same, great catch.
Back when Trek writers actually knew the lore and cared.
That was one of the great parts of watching that episode when it premiered and having a stupid memory for stuff like that. Give me a verbal list of 4 things.. I'll forget 3 of them... ask me a detail about a TV show made before I was born than I love.. sure, I can remember that... lol. We had a watch group in college of fellow nerds and we all geeked out when that line came up... I think one of us said "it's green" before data did.
However, Data does not use contractions - hence he actually said, “It is green.” Sorry, my nerd mode has been activated…
When I first watched that during the original run of ST:TNG, I busted out laughing. Everyone else in the room looked at me funny - NO IDEA at all about the reference. Then I had to explain to this room full of people, most of whom had not seen the original show.
I must have looked like the Nerd King.....
It’s pretty insane how the discovery writers have literally never watched any Star Trek, clearly
I doubt they would understand it, no enough action and flashy ExPlOsIoNs, too much talking for their poor short attention span.
@@OneofInfinity. you’d think with their budgets they’d at least ask someone who has seen it… or at a minimum read Wikipedia or something
"We're taking from today's history to talk about US history!" uh... yeah. do you guys remember when Kahn Noonien Singh took over a quarter of the planet during the eugenics wars 25 years ago?
Clearly, our trivial political differences are much more important than the world being taken over by genetically engineered superhumans.
@@croatoansounds That's because Star Trek Discovery isn't Star Trek. It's something they dredged out of a cesspool and then polished and covered in Star Trek sauce to make it appealing to fans of Star Trek, but in the basis? It has nothing to do with Star Trek. In the words of Tolkien:
"The Shadow that bred them can only mock, it cannot make: not real new things of its own. I don't think it gave life to [the orcs], it only ruined them and twisted them;"
@@Locahaskatexu hahaha perfect quote
I never knew that Data's "It is green" line was also Scottie's in TOS. That's so cool!
You forgot Enterprise's scene where they encounter an alien replicator for the first time, even T'Pol was amused by it.
STAR TREK : ENTERPRISE
episode
DEAD STOP
about the automated
space station
or the Episode in Enterprise where they run into an alien Holodeck for the first time.
@@Kerberlos
TRIP got PREGNANT
Enterprise also had access to an archive if technology from the future. The chief of security specifically had access to the roommate was locked in and later developed force fields far sooner than they should have appeared. I think it's reasonable to conclude that the temporal prime directive was violated repeatedly which led to a new timeline where replicators appeared earlier. Of course that also means that every series that came before that prequel would not have happened that way because Starfleet technology would have been further along.
Key point there, Alien replicator. There's nothing wrong with having an alien race equipped with technology earlier than Starfleet in the prequel series.
How dare you suggest any of Disco's writers have ever seen a single episode of Real Trek
i suppose it's possible one guy may have seen one ep... they forgot it... and they have been mandated by Kurtzman from upon high, to not resemble old trek as much as possible
They don't even want to know how to better it they just care about money they can ribb off
They are at least very good at pretending to be hardcore fans and nerds to the gullible masses.
ya, they got high and drunk and binge watched a couple on a friday night in a screening room. dont u dare suggest they dont kno what they dont know what they dont know they are talking about that they dont know
Nutrek, it's like big bang theory but for "star trek".
I remember there being SO much hate for Enterprise when it was out.
And when it got canceled, people were like, 'oh well'.
And NOW we miss it.
But most of the things in ENT were explained, it was not like booom, we have transporters and phasers now, they explained it, which is completely different case than Discotrisco where they have TNG technology with no reason already in 1st season, also what makes Discovery weird is that there are no WARP jump! How can we have StarTrek show with no warp jumps? I really miss them.
I can not miss Enterprise and also not enjoy Discovery. I can dislike more than one thing.
@@jamesderiven1843 Discovery gets a little less worse each season, though not by much. That said, SO much stuff was coming out during the period that discovery was released, we kept back burning it to watch other things, until it got to be 6-7 months after the season had ended before we finished it.
That's how back burnered it got.
I liked Enterprise when it wasn't all about time travel. Unfortunately, the writers had a real hard on for time travel, so they refused to let the show actually stand on it's own merits without all the references to other times.
@@peytonmac1131 If I want a time war, I'll go watch Dr Who.
Wow. I am not the biggest fan of Star Trek but seeing this..... I can see how dirty they have done the lore and the people who love it. It would have been so easy to just find some, anyone, to do this research they almost had to actively disregard the hundreds of references there must be. My condolences.
At least it’s not as bad as the Halo show
Right?! Thank you!
I'm more outraged at Kirk whisking his eggs in the pan like a savage.
Its actually the correct way to cook scrambled eggs. That's how gordon Ramsey does it.
@@rorschachsjournal2084 Gordon "WHERE IS THE LAMB-SAUCE" Ramsay
To paraphrase Anon 7 he is a barbarian.
that is how I do it, ha ha!
@@rorschachsjournal2084 Not with a metal whisk he doesn't. Gordan uses plastic spatulas, or rubber coated whisks or other non-metal cookware, you never use metal on metal especially on a non stick pan, which is what Kirk is doing here.
As a bit of an aside, I was always under the impression that even in the 24th century the Federation still needed agriculture and mining. Replication is a powerful technology, but the direct transformation of energy into matter is still a massive power sink. On a long-range starship where you happen to have a large military-grade warp core available, replicating food for a crew of 150 people might be a practical solution. But even Voyager (the most advanced starship with the smallest crew) still frequently needed to stop and forage or trade for foodstuffs. Replicator use was heavily rationed, and replicator rations were often spoken about as a sort of grey market currency on the ship. Similarly, DS9 made some references to "industrial replicators" for creating construction materials and consumer goods, but surely it's still more efficient to make girders and angle iron out of mined and refined ore.
Yeah it's kind of inconsistent since according to Geordi power conversion ratios of 95%+ are basically standard for the Federation, and the jack ass competing with a rival engineer to get it even higher to like 97% or something just for bragging rights. Power sink my ass. Most replicators are powered by their own internal fusion reactor and the federation handed them out like candy in TNG's era. DS9 was explained away by the fact the vast majority of the station's tech is incompatible with Federation tech, and Cardassian tech is not as efficient, and most Bajoran tech is reclaimed Cardassian tech. Voyager is honestly an absolute contrivance, the tech manuals have said that antimatter can last for YEARS of regular use and that was for the Galaxy class starships that had families and 1000+ crew members. The Intrepid class is a long range explorer, with a crew of 150, given the fact they make mention of bartering/trading for antimatter all the time. Plus they also make mention of building an antimatter converter out of some backup fusion reactor for the impulse drive, I think the rationing was just something cooked up by the writers to give the sense of "being far away from home" feeling to the show.
I've always wondered why, if they can create replicas of materials down to the atomic level, why wouldn't they just replicate starships? Re-arrange atoms in asteroids into starships, and make as many as you need to fight the Dominion. Just have lots of antimatter cores supplying the power. Build a starship the regular way, deep scan it down to the molecular level, and start making identical copies.
There's a lot of things that don't make sense in Star Trek given their level of technology. Have a specialized transporter system that keeps all hardware components stored in memory, and if something breaks down or gets damaged it would beam in a replicated version of that component, precisely splicing it in to get the ship working again. Auto repair, done. That's just an example.
@@stevew8513 I can think of any number of limitations to replicators. Two off the top of my head:
1) Exotic materials. Trek tech uses a lot of it. There's stuff that replicators just can't make and any component that uses that stuff can't easily be replicated. The higher performance, more highly sophisticated the tech, the more likely this is to be the case. IRL, computer components already use rare earth elements; in Trek, certain techs may need materials with such exotic properties as a carbon lattice that exists in nine dimensions or something that a replicator can't build.
2) Resolution limits. Certain components may be required to be made with a greater precision than standard replicators are capable of doing. If replicators are limited to nanometer scale and you need picometer level precision for your part, then you're never getting a properly made part from the replicator. That being said, replicators can make FOOD, so any precision limits are beyond that required to make edible food. Atomic level precision could just be insufficient to make some of the more exotic Trek tech.
That being said, replicator tech clearly improves with time. The list of stuff that can't be made shrinks... but also may get added too as even more advanced tech is invented. Resolution improves. The volume of space that can be used for replication improves. Stuff that required specialized synthesizers and processors (which in my headcanon uses similar tech) before can now be done with a general purpose replicator.
Crew in Voyager didn't have replicator rations because of limited power, they had rations because there was a limited supply of solid matter available for replication. Voyager was a small ship, so they probably couldn't fit a lot into the storage tanks anyway, and then they got stuck out in the middle of nowhere with no readily available resupply of solid matter. I don't remember any episodes where they explain how they could/would a obtain solid matter resupply, but there could be one.
@@dinkledankle well if replicators can rearrange components into food then logically it should work in reverse. so they get a couple tons of grain, feed it into a replicator (or the transporter seeing as the tech is related) and now you have carbs, fibre and assorted vitamins and proteins ready to be reassembled into whatever you want
As a non Star Trek fan, I have to thank RLM. To realize how this franchise can have writers from one era be inspired by stories of ships and the knowledge to run a ship ... versus writers who went on wikipedia.
they didnt even do that, or they'd have known the details.
I think they have to balance the need to stay orthodox to canon for every detail and to be true science fiction and imagine the future for the contemporary audience. With our present day knowledge of 3d printing and holograms, it doesn’t seem quite genuine to believe that the current technology wouldn’t advance that far in 200 years.
@@idaruthia If you want to do that with a new audience, you make a new scifi setting for the contemporary audience like they did 50 years ago. This is called plagiarism, and that gets you a 0 anywhere that matters.
Look at something like Alien Isolation: they use the old, 70's style computers for the aesthetic design to keep it true to the original setting. That is an adaptation of old media done right. You still have to preserve the world building of the original authors as you are not and never will be the same as them. Either make a copy or make your own, but to disrespect them and yourself is to just make a shit. No amount of corporate PR can make a turd shine, it'll still be a turd.
These wokie wokeville jackasses just don't care about the history or the spirit of Star Trek at its foundation at all
Given how many times the show has used time travel to change its own history, EXPLICITLY; it’s really sad to see so many hateful people simply preclude the possibility of innumerable implicit changes to the timeline - and fail forgive a show they love for continuing to show them how to overcome the obstacles we create for ourselves. I watch Doctor Who fans hate DW similarly ironically. It’s really sad. Both shows continue to be amazing.
You’ll forgive me not bothering to tell you what I don’t like about the show. There’s enough of that going on here already.
It could be argued that at least some of the technology shown in Discovery is more akin to 3D-printing rather than replication, but I'm not willing to give the writers of that dreck any benefit of the doubt.
dirt was the word you where searching for. There is no dreck auf der englischen Sprache.
@@SteffenSchuchardt1978 Dude, it's English. We mug languages and steal their words all the time! Guten tag!
Agreed. I’d give Picard the benefit of the doubt on something like that, but not discovery.
Yeah the show jumped the tardigrade the second episode in.
@@SteffenSchuchardt1978 r/gatekeeping
This is why I hate prequels, they'll be inconsistent because the show runners either don't know the lore or if they do just don't care about it.
you don't have to care when you can retcon the entire thing into canon by having a character just go "Hey, we won't talk about this, k?"
Yep, Discovery is more advanced then Next Gen ships.
I was disappointed that ENT went with the Xindi story arc instead of the Earth-Romulan War. The war with the Romulans have been mentioned throughout the various series before ENT. The showrunners claimed they went with the Xindi story arc to avoid a repeat of the Dominion War on DS9 but I suspect that they didn't go with the Earth-Romulan War because they didn't have the CGI budget for two massive fleets in battle.
It can be done well but unfortunately it generally just isn't.
@@mechanomics2649 Better Call Saul for example, one of the best shows ever made, never mind the best prequal.
This is what happens when 'Star Trek' is just a gig for these writers until a show they really want to write for comes along.
It's not just the writers, ENT should have had one more season at least but management (who, mind you, wasn't experienced in making such decisions for Sci-FI based on prior shows) decided to axe it because the movies weren't helping at the time either. We got robbed of showing the Romulan War.
....until a universe they want to live in comes along.
It has writers?
@@jorgepeterbarton Only technically speaking.
Well yea no shit.
Nobody gets into writing or acting these days and aspires to work on fucking Star Trek lmao
They'd much rather do other shows but are stuck working on trek
Imagine making a Star Trek show and never having seen Star Trek before.
Okay.
Well, with a name like that, one could assume that one, it involves space travel, and two, with 'trek' in it, that it's not just travel, but a journey or a trip fromone place to another. If it's a journey through space, it could be about exploration and study, or planting a new colony of people on another world, or perhaps the show's title is simply the uninspired name of a space-fairing vessel or travel company that handles space travel in similar fashion to an airport. If it's the last one, then it could be a sci-fi version of the show Friends or The Office. Not very interesting, but funny at least, and relatable to anyone in a similar industry.
If it's any of the previous, that would demand research on what we know now about our solar system, and the galaxy in general, and current theories as well. Build the world, before you build the characters, as the world will affect who the characters are, WHAT the characters are, and allow you to flesh out their individual histories and personalities. What year is it right now in the show? Are we going to intro the main characters in their youth first, and then do a time-skip a few years or decades later? Okay. So they're on a ship. How much is CGI and how much is a set? What's practical for our budget? Sometimes less is more but we'll need to think about where and when.
So it's the pilot episode. How about a simple test of the ship's systems first to make sure everything is working fine before going on a deep-space mission? We're showing a ship preparing to leave a dock on one of Mars' moons. World Lore states that before we landed on Mars a docking and re-supply station was built on one of Mars' moons first. This was later updated from sending and receiving orders from Earth for the Mars colony (the planet still isn't at a stage of inhabitable without a life support suit just yet but there are several domed colony-towns visible on the ground in the background through a window on the starship. They'll be made via model and slow-sliding camera angles instead of CGI and if we make that a 'standard design' for non-Earth colonies we can re-use the models in later shots on other planets and moons, thus saving money in the budget in the future, and if the show becomes popular enough replicas that can be opened to reveal rooms inside with little models of robots and characters can be sold in toy sections of stores). The different set pieces that are important sections of the ship will receive a few minutes of screen time each, letting the audience get a vague feel for the people working there and the atmosphere of the place, as well as a brief tour. Eventually we arrive at the bridge, which will vaguely resemble what looks like the control room of a modern submarine. An ACTUAL submarine though, not what a movie might display. Currently the place has a 'unused' in the new sense look to it, but as the show's story progresses a few niknaks will find their way there such as maybe a worn set of dice by the pilot's station (not fuzzy), perhaps a photo of a friend or loved one, a half-empty candy jar near the gunner with assorted candies in it that you'll see him/her/it indulge in from time to time throughout the show, a broken tooth from some big alien creature as a souvenir, and a plaque on the wall by the door that reads 'keep your stations neat and tidy or personal-decorations will be confiscated' added towards the end of the show due to someone spilling something in a previous episode on their console and causing problems. But that's an issue for later.
--I was going to keep going but I took a step back and realized it was pointless since I'm not actually being given funds and rights to make a show.---
Worse....making as Star Trek show after watching Disney-fried Star Wars....
I wouldn't expect the writers to know every epsiode or at least not remember all details but does the Star Trek franchise not have some kind of continuity manager that has to check for these things?
Seems like if the show/movie is set in space it only requires you to read the Wikipedia page once.
I love how "kind of forgot" is just shorthand for writers shitting on their own lore and history.
That lore and history does not belong to them. Don't forget. The foundation of Trek was laid down by a much more talented group of creators. What we have now is a bunch of hacks trying to make bank on something they cannot understand.
This is what happens when you clearly wanted to do a sequel and make everything incredibly modern and technologically advanced, but you're forced to do a prequel.
So you just do a sequel anyway but change some plot points so it's in the past, ruining the timeline as you go. Then, you get tired of that, so you time-jump so far into the future that you can ruin the entire franchise retroactively.
And it's already lessons learned with Voyager and Enterprise that these smug cronies have failed to learn. Thankfully, as Trek fans, we know where this is going. Prioritizing UPN over Star Trek led to the downfall of Classic Star Trek. Can't wait till it comes for NuTrek. There is no Michael Piller coming to restore the IP. It's over.
I love how accurate this is XD
@@saberiandream316 I don't think it's over though, I really hope it isn't since this stuff is revolutionary, not only is it a pretty good science fiction, it also makes us think about our future as we develop space travel and reach the stars where we before couldn't have.
@@venezuelaanimations3732 I meant merely from studying history, franchise fatigue and market oversaturation will eventually set in, for whatever reason they drive away the casual new fans they have. And then, we shall see where Star Trek goes...
EVERY trek f-ed something up. The more you have, the easier it is across 50 years. That's a given. But historical facts like replicators you just can't change on a whim! I hate the cavernous turbolift shafts.....but lets not forget how many decks the Enterprise-A had too in the name of storytelling!
OMG! My Trek geek History is failing, I had no idea "Its Green" on TNG was a call back to scotty drinking that alien under the table.
That's another great thing about this channel. Connections are made!
Almost. Lol. He was under himself rather quickly
@@chrissmith7669 True. He didn't get the belt device to Kirk. However, he at least achieved the partial goal of disabling the alien. Good ol' Scotty.
ach, I was savin you for a special occasion ...
One of my favourite Scotty moments from TOS.
Raise your hand if you're not surprised a writer in 2022 couldnt bother doing basic research on an IP they're co-opting 🙋♂️
🙋♂️
🙋🙋🙋🙋🙋🙋🙋🙌🙋🙋🙋🙋🙋
That moment when Lwoxana tells Stevie "that was your unpleasant surprise" and he just stares at her with dead eyes as apathy & hatred built in his soul was hilarious
Little correction from a ST nerd: not Trois' mom, but Nurse Christine Chapel...
She wasn't Lwaxana. Same actress, different character.
Yeah, that blank baffled stare with the hate behind his eyes, the obsession to talk about everything white... Did we just watch Tucker Carlson's origin story there?
The voice on the intercom that says "real turkeys" is Gene Roddenberry.
His wife a female computer voices until she passed.
Yes, it was his only acting role in the franchise.
@@leejoelbeasley5005 Before she died Majel Barrett recorded a full phonetic library so future ST productions would have the same computer voice.
@@garrettrigoni6864
Did she also do the sexy computer voice in the episode with Captain Christopher?
@@garrettrigoni6864 And yet they chose not to use it, probably because they found someone cheaper than her estate
Those early episodes of TNG did make a whole lot of fuss about replicators, explaining exactly how they work over and over again.
So that way the old stodgy TOS fans would get it.
Well, that's precisely why we all know exactly what they are and how they work
Stupid boomers are just too old to understand and enjoy such a futuristic and progressive show like ST Discovery.
@@strategic_amber_reservoir That's how science fiction explains novel concepts and makes them commonplace and ubiquitous - H.G. Wells takes over 30 pages to explain what time travel / a time machine even is in his book _The Time Machine,_ whereas now it's a tired trope. We aren't especially genius and people of the past weren't especially dull, the concept simply hadn't become part of the canon yet.
I always took that as implying replicators were a relatively new technology, so it had to be explained to to most people, like the holodecks.
Just finished Discovery.
It's like a strobe light, parts of the writing are as bright and brilliant as the other parts are without any light.
Woof that is achingly spot-on.
Special detail note to the continued repetition of “food concentrates”; Trekkies familiar with the original series will know that despite the absence of replicators, they did have some limited food synthesize ation technology, specifically the ability to transport those food concentrates and re-organize them into edible compounds, this as explained is exactly how the “modern” replicators function in further iterations of Star Trek.
In fact even on Enterprise they recycled their food by dividing the atoms of their poop and reconstruct them. The replicator was just much more advanced.
There's only one explanation for all of this: Discovery isn't Star Trek
Star Trek Discovery is just as much Star Trek as you are George Takai. By name alone.
@@mreese8764 its just bad fan fiction
It's cause of the temporal cold war XD
@@mreese8764 lol absolutely
@@venezuelaanimations3732 That makes more sense than the entirety of Discovery thus far. XD
But you forget, this is the U.S.S. Micky D commanded by the intrepid Captain Grimace
Lt. Commander Hamburgler needs respect! 😁
@@shawn6860
you mean
HAMBERDER
"Anybody with any sense is afraid of Mickey D."
and their dreaded nemesis the King of Burgers and his ship the IKS Havot'yor'ay
I love how, of all the people, Uhura comes running in to check on who fired that phaser. Ahead of the security. "We have a known killer on board. And a phaser went off! I better go rush in unarmed and see who it is!"
But that's just a funny small thing you can overlook. Discovery full on broke Star Trek.
Also in the movies, I think Chekov may have been in charge of security, so he should have been well aware of the fact you can't fire a phaser aboard without an alarm going off. Even if he wasn't security, he has been on a starship far longer than Valeris to have her teach him something basic about starship operations.
@@whos-the-stiff Well Maybe back in the 2260's when Chekov started you could, maybe its a new 2290's reg. I mean Chokov was an engine in 2267, and Undiscovered country is 2293, lots of time between for new rules and regulations
gotta give the actress something to do on screen
The stuff inside the pot should have been vaporized, too.
@@tphillips37 I kind of like the pot vapourising and leaving the stuff inside intact. A neat bit of world building as to what the phaser could be capable of. It was probably set to, "Strip Search".
The sad thing is, I actually could buy them having replicators... if they just produced food the crew complained about constantly. Not like how in TNG/DS9/VOY where it seemed like the issue was that everything was just kind of bland or a specific item always tasted the same as every other instance of that item you requested, but rather like a $1 frozen microwave burger from a gas station, food that just looks and tastes completely wrong or has weird textures for what it's supposed to be that makes the crew desire more than anything to obtain fresh food at every stop they make or have a staff of chefs to replicate basic food ingredients and cook them to at least make them not-quite-as-shit. The speed of what was shown in Discovery seemed era-appropriate for the most part, at least.
At least DS9 tried to show more people who preferred cooking to replicators to the point of that being the reason the station has restaurants. That, and the station's food replicators seemed to constantly malfunction. But outside of Scotty grumbling about synthohol, TNG was pretty bad about making it seem like home cooked meals were a thing of the past. And VOY has Neelix, so your options were take your chances with whatever he was cooking, or put up with bland replicator rations.
@@NotMyRealName6 there’s also the fact that Cardassian replicators are inferior to Federation ones, so the food tastes even worse
The scenes from the OG Star Trek series just reminds me how ahead of his time Gene was, a show like Star Trek was needed in the 60s, it gave such hope for the future!
The future isn't about optimism and humanity reaching it's potential anymore. Petty, vindictive, and unstable people are so much more dramatic. I'm just glad that as alternate timelines I can just ignore Enterprise, Discovery, and the JJverse.
Discovery doesn't give me hope for the future! It gives me dread for the near future knowing what utter dolts are being given power!
@@frankb3347 Enterprise really isn't that bad. there is a lot of care and thought that went into it. Though I could have done without the Xindi arc to be honest, but while it's not the best Trek, it was still well done. Discovery on the other hand is the worse TV show with a budget I am aware of in the history of TV making.
@@jonathanberry1111 Scarier is the type of scrubs it will spawn, it encourages wrong qualities in people.
Kurtzman's way of replicating himself only worse.
The problem was that when gene died there was no one to take the reigns to continue his vision and we wound up with j j Abrams
And this also goes into the Discovery era writers underestimating the miracle of food replicators. They are still thinking with our era's concept of organic foods and vegan shit being healthy when in the future, they can literally replicate ANY food to the way you want. It's not "artificial" like how we see it. It's food
The irony is "organic" food, as in actually cultivated and grown is seen as an anachronism in the future and very few people do it. Yet these writers think they would be relevant in such a future, hilarious.
@@AgentExeider It's seen as a novelty like Sisko's restaurant hand making food as a hobby or Picard's vineyard
Replicated junk food is still junk food.
@@whatwedointheshadows3349 Unless you do some programming to make it TASTES like junk food without the junk in it
@@Excalibur01 but everyone complains it tastes off.
It seems to me that they wanted Discovery to be post-TNG. This is a detail that they could have easily written into it all.
I wanted Discovery to be post-TNG. I’m still waiting on an actual live action Starfleet Star Trek show that takes place some time in or after the 2380s. I do really like Picard but so far we haven’t seen nearly enough of Starfleet in it. I hope season 3 changes that.
Give me Admiral Picard, Captain Riker, Captain La Forge, Ambassador Worf, Doctor Crusher and councillor Troi on the bridge of the Enterprise D/E/F (depending on what direction they want to take it) for one last adventure.
I was under the impression that there were simple industrial replicators in tos era ,used for spare parts and such things ( like todays 3D printers in some cases )
This is why Season 3 exists. They literally sent Discovery a thousand years into the future to avoid having to watch TOS and pay attention.
Then they should have started with that. Not that it will help since they are making a Pike series.
Lol
Yes, but now they're failing with paying attention to their own writing.
yeah and then they forget about the doctors hologram tech in s3 lol
Exactly, there was a reason TNG took place 80 years after TOS era films: Technology at the time had advanced and imagination of future tech had advanced.
They should just have gone for a sequal that took place in the 25th-26th century in the first place and just made Michel into Spocks granddaughter instead.
Or like, since Picard was also being develpoed: Have a character appear in both shows. A vulcan perhaps, cast a 25-30 year old and let them play a cadet in Picard and a Captain/admiral in Discovery etc (so they're would be a connection between the shows).
They didn't forget that the original Enterprise had no replicators because they never knew, because they didn't ever watch the Original Series. And if someone had told them, they wouldn't have cared. All the classic Star Trek that has been loved and cherished down the generations is just an inconvenience to the people
who offer us JunkTrek. They wish it would go away. They are trying to make it go away.
When the dust finally settles on all this, of course, it is JunkTrek that will have been shelved and forgotten and classic Star Trek that the world will still be watching.
Yes. Rotten things (like New Trek) die and decompose. Healthy things (like classic Trek) live and grow and reproduce.
THROW BURMAN/BRAGA TREK INTO THAT CATEGORY AS WELL! THEY MADE A MOCKERY OF GENE'S VISION!
Just you wait CBS is gonna reeboot every episode of TOS with new actors they make the 60's series and the movies except generations non canon
@@mastermonarch That is their ambition, but JunkTrek will be shelved and forgotten before that can happen. They are counting on the Far East to save them, but. Chinese and Japanese audiences have better taste than that.
@@ransom182 Deep Space Nine and Voyager are the pinnacle of Star Trek. People will be watching reruns of Deep Space Nine and Voyager long after you are dead.
_Man those guys in the 23rd century love eating food from the 21st century._
As a historian, this makes me wonder what Star Trek series was Star Fleet propaganda, and which was based on actual crew logs.
I really really like this interpretation of lores
Did they forget...or just not give a fuck? Lol. I'm not conservative at all, but I kinda am when it comes to fictional media. If the lore states they didn't have replicators back then, KEEP it that way.
Yeah, they don't care. Keep just enough of the look to sell merch, dump everything else.
That isn't conservative, that is a fundamental principle when writing a mythology. Not even time travel changes should be taken lightly, because if you do so, anything that was affected in the past should appear that way in the older series too. If there was a reference to Gabriel Bell in TOS or TNG, DS9 wouldn't have been allowed to make that episode about the 21st century
Well that is the definition of conservative. To maintain a tradition or set of ethics/code passed down from prior sources. So essentially, maintaining continuity is conservation of the source.
they didn't forget, they're called food synthesizers. A bit more advanced, given it's an experimental science vessel, but still food synthesizers. And replicators did exist in the federation, as well as starfleet, just not standard on every ship, most were crude and meant for only the most basic shit.
Grin being the hate-clickbaiter they are, also included some scenes from Season 3 when they are WAAAAAY past the 23rd century.
Caring about consistency in lore isn't something exclusive to conservatism.
This is when Janey realized “I’ll never promote this idiot, he cheated in the academy history course!”
Ah, but if he cheated without getting caught, a smart leader would count that as a bonus.
Maybe thats why harry was never promoted past ensign despite seeing more combat and crisis situations than most captains/admirals ever do
@@DrowningMoon Which is something I never understood about Starfleet: how can you be made up of the "best and brightest" when you have people that can't or won't promote? Like that episode of TNG when Picard was the 20 year lieutenat, why would you even want this guy around much less on the flagship of the Federation.
@@erwin669 Well, one of the reasons why people want "promotions" in today's world is money, which they don't have in the Federation. Always seemed to me that you can't look at rank and promotions in that way. If you were a damn good engineer and you loved being an engineer why would you move up if it meant more delegation and less doing what you love if money was no factor. Hell even where I work engineers often become managers and get annoyed they don't get their hands dirty anymore.
In Trek it always seemed to me that if you were one of the best engineers in the federation and a lieutenant or chief or whatever, the way to gain more of a challenge, prestige, renown, etc was to move from your ship that delivers supplies from Earth to unimportant outposts and onto a ship of more import such as the Enterprise, Excelsior, etc.
Things make more sense from that standpoint. Characters on the Enterprise are often told they could leave the ship to gain a promotion, become a first officer or captain on another vessel and they turn it down cause they know they are on the Seal Team 6 of the Federation's crews. Riker could have been captain of his own ship for years and years. Most crewmembers seem to value being a part of important missions, having a challenging environment, being a part of something bigger than themselves, and being good at what they do. Characteristics most humans cherish when you remove money as a concern.
"No replicators, no holodecks"
Next scene: extremely detailed holographic security training simulation.
But there were food synthesizers… more primitive versions of food replicators. The synthesizers could provide essential nutrition in (colored) cube form… and ice cream apparently.
and chicken soup.
We had those?
Thank graces for dipping dots,ice cream of the future.
Put it on the pile with all the other things they "forgot"
Like phasers are a "beam" weapon. Not the damn JJ phasers that shoot little bolts.
Like Klingons are NOT this bizarre alien. They were augments then later restored to their original look.
Food synthesizers are entirely different from replicators. They simply convert algae which ship's hydroponics grows into a "base" protein that can be resequenced. It doesn't involve a transporter. In fact, if anyone remembers TOS, the food had odd shapes and colors and did not resemble what we would call food.
@@deathstrike Oh god, the "phasers" bug me soooo much.
@@deathstrike But the Wrath of Khan movie shows phasers being fires as separate "pulses", and the DS9 Defiant's main phasers fire as bolts.
I'm more annoyed of that computer voice whenever the "replicator" is used. They didn't have it in TOS or later when real replicators happened, so why have it in the first place?
Honestly, it just makes the replicators feel like some cheap-ass corporate product, reminds me of the Working Joes from Alien Isolation, that kept asking various generic soulless corporate approved questions, like "Why not ask me about Sevastopol's safety protocols?". At least there one of the writers intended it as a satire of corporatism, after said writer saw a similar motto in a McDonalds. Whereas in NuTrek it's treated seriously.
Because "HA HA r/IAmSoFunnyGoodestWriter"
"loOk teH RepLmUhCatOr sEz tEh heATlHy FInG 4 Tilly!"
I was thinking the exact same thing. It’s just so cheesy.
bear in mind Discovery had an experimental propulsion system that nobody even heard of before in the entirety of Trek canon. Who's to say they didn't have an experimental matter resequencer as well?? Hell, with that drop-in of Spock suggesting that nobody talk about Discovery under penalty of treason(!), right at that moment, they could do what the hell they wanted. They took the easy, lazy way out by sending the ship nearly 1,000 years into the future and obliterating canon Trek in one fell swoop.
By the way: the preceding paragraph may contain spoilers. Tough noogies, STD season 2 has been out what, 2 years and change? If you haven't seen it yet, sucks to be you.
To be fair, technology changes over time. It could have been something complained about and thus removed from further updated versions.
TAS introduced voice activated food synths as upgrades on the enterprise A. And TNG had an episode where the replicator tells Troi that she can't have real chocolate sundae because it's not nutritionally balanced. And the replicator that told Janeway to make her own damn coffee.
The more i see this, the more i like Red Dwarf. The way red dwarf would actively retcon themselves is even more funny now😂
"No holodecks..."
Let's not forget the "rec room" from TAS!
Surf Wisely.
They didn't even know that back in TOS era they were called synthesizers, not replicators.
Even 'Enterprise' got it right.
They evolved into replicators. Synthesizers was the precursor. And they began to mention replicators specifically eventually. Replicators actually did exist in the 23rd century. They were just not perfected versions. Even in discovery, they referred to them as synths.
Regardless, who give a fuck, really. Few star trek shows were that meticulous about continuity. They have all engaged in retcons and updates.
You didn't watch Discovery obviously
@@s0515033 Truth be told I feel it might just be the error of constantly having to write in the past instead of progressing the timeline.
@@reynnar6585 Yea. probably. That and we're in a weird situation where we have modern technology and effects but we're dealing with a property whose timeline was created in the 60s. The limitations of the time informed what people saw, so people freak out when you update content for a modern audience.
I dont think we will ever see a Klingon on any Star Trek property again.
If they show a TGN Klingon it will be them admitting that Discovery is not canon,
But if they show the Klingorc's again; they will hit bees nest of Fandom again.
Even in 'Picard 1 & 2' they will avoid showing Klingons aside from a 2 sec picture of Worf.
It's ridiculous, Klingons are one of the biggest alien species in the galaxy, and not a single one was seen in Picard S1 or Discovery S3; it's like staying in Miami for 20 years and not seeing a single Cuban person.
Interestingly enough. It isn't even that hard to explain how both can exist.
STO for example establishes they're a separate ethnic group. It doesn't explain why they're more advanced however.
How I'd do it. The Klingorcs are Klingon Augments, which could explain them being more advanced.
That's because by that time all Klingons are in fact attractions in Romulan zoos.
The rights shifting of Star Trek property had alot to do with that, and I think we will probably still see them again in the Kelvin films. I would say you're right about the Prime timeline but last I heard was Worf is confirmed in Season 2 of Picard, so we shall see.
@@tb7771 good DS9 reference there
@@antonioaguera4580 Thanks 😊
What about the chicken soup that the transporter chief gave the MP in Tomorrow is Yesterday? Or the ice cream Nurse Chapel gave the children in And the Children shall lead? I've always identified those as replicators, and they were basically explained as such during a discussion during a Q&A at a Star trek Convention in the late 70's at Kemper Arena.
I miss the true meaning of EXPLORATION. Didn’t matter which show STE or STG or even the original Star Trek were all well written and exciting! Every episode was guaranteed to have something new! Fighting BORG, accidentally killing a colony to find out you didn’t! Or getting DRUNK on a virus lol! You actually feel it while watching. The newest shows are just terribly written, I feel like if I watched the first episode, middle and last I got the story! Maybe it’s them using a single story arc?? I don’t know but this isn’t Star Trek feels like 90s era soap operas and I cringe every time there’s a heart to heart! I love you no no I love you like wtf am I watching!?? Even Picard is just weird!! Seems like every episode is a deeper hole of not knowing anything, now wait a week to find out nothing again!
When Guinan told Picard that people who look like him have it easier than people who look like her… that really warmed my heart. Classic Star Trek. 🙄
Kirk saying he'll raid a kitchen is more realistic than anything that came after
Shocking that Disgracery didn't keep to cannon. They don't care about cannon. It was written by people, who hate Star Trek, for people who have never watched Star Trek, but bitch about everything.
Not to mention the amount of crying in season 3
@@alternative915 If tears were replicator rations, they could feed the 4 known quadrants of the universe forever
Easy solution: if they don't keep to canon...they are not canon. See and now you are happy again. ^^
Based
@@MedalionDS9 Of the galaxy*
I never noticed before that when the pot gets vaporized by the phaser in the galley in VI that one of the galley crew is almost in line and bails out - and a person in the background with a plate/platter does an immediate 180 without saying a word.
"Nope - not dealing with this today"
It seems like the existence of replicators on Star Trek are like the plot device on Family Guy where adults can hear Stewie talk or not.
I remember watching some behind the scenes specials or something from the TNG era, and it seems the writers in the 1980s and 1990s were told to treat canon from previous series with caution. Obviously that rule has been thrown in the trash.
Thrown in the trash, urinated on, and set on fire.
Then pissed on and thrown into a ravine.
Just one of HUNDREDS of things they have intentionally or unintentionally "forgotten" from previous Treks...
The end of season 2 does explain why a lot of things were forgotten though starfeelt just regressed all thier technology.
@@thewewguy8t88 thats freaking stupid considering all the other races who kept there technology threw much worse from the shedai to the hurq
@@wilmagregg3131 i suppose. but i mean in discovery season 1 and 2 there were ships which looked straight out of tos.
@3:15 "extra... big ass .. TACO... now with more.. MOLECULEZZZ!!"
Discovery lost me when they went back in time and had J. J. Evans from Good Times as the inventor of warp drive after he accidentally killed Zefram Cochrane with Dyn-O-Mite. Ugh. I was so done after that.
Well, actually, IF someone wanted to destroy the Gene Roddenberry vision... then all of these shall i call them, "mistakes." Are indeed, "logical."
Gene's vision would amount to TOS and nothing else, as he hated Wrath of Khan. And the first two seasons of TNG, I suppose...
These snowflakes have _admitted_ how little they think of Gene Roddenberry. Heck, in Discovery's season 3, episode 2, the ships crew thoroughly denigrates a fellow crew member, who is (apparently) a "space janitor" as his job is cleaning up messes. He's made to use a completely normal shovel to scoop up the remains of someone who just exploded. The crew can't be bothered to remember his name, but he reminds them that his name is... "Gene"...
Exactly, this is the intentional destruction of a beloved franchise, which is achieved through cultural marxist writers/show runners etc
I always figured TOS did have replicators. You pushed a button and got food; and somehow magically they were carrying clothing for every culture, every time period for their landing parties. Starships around the time of "Assignment: Earth" were equipped with food synthesizers and other devices for producing clothing and machine parts on demand. While replicators weren't standard in Starfleet until the 24rd century, they even showed up on the 22nd century show Star Trek: Enterprise when the NX-01 visited a mysterious alien repair facility. Food for thought.
I think the difference is that we keep on getting closer and closer to replicators through 3-D printing whether your 3-D printing food metal or plastic or other composites and so it is necessary to update our expectations of what the future would look like.
It's funny how at first the Discovery scenes seemed fairly accurate to how the food dispensers are depicted in TOS, but then they just had to keep going...
Also, what's the 3D animation at 06:56 ? I have no clue what it is
I think it's from Star Trek Below Decks, the currently running Star Trek cartoon.
Its Star Trek Below Decks, a slightly more adult themed Star Trek cartoon which hilariously follows cannon better than Discovery as seen in the clip.
I can’t quite grasp how *two* people could get the name of the show wrong in the same thread. But it’s Star Trek Lower Decks
Not below decks
@@thebuddercweeper LOL
Lol. You just reminded me I still haven't watched season 3 std because I don't want to.
It was awful.
It was ok up till the last 2 episodes where everything flew apart faster than you could imagine, it was baffling.
I didn't watch season 2
It is good, the end was little rushed, but core star fleet values were there and it felt like star trek.
Yup, same here. Couldn't get past season 2. Never thought watching trek would feel like a chore. Really sad 😢
So now we finally know why Harry Kim is still an ensign!
Sidenote: Dr. Julian Bashir didn't pack his dress uniform and couldn't replicate it with DS9's Cardassian replicators! It's like when I go to the Marine base with plenty of Navy corpsmen there and still can't find a Navy uniform item!
but they had starfleet replicators in the Runabouts
Plus there's probably also an aspect that dress uniforms might be prestigious items, like some other non-replicated items we see. You're not meant to replicate them, but to take care of your non-replicated uniform as a sign of dedication to Starfleet?
@@MajorGrin Honestly, I wouldn't put it past Bashir to simply not think of that.
@@MajorGrin Came here to say this. Honestly there was a ton of problems in DS9 where people convenient forgot the runabouts.
I maintain that Enterprise was exactly how you do a prequel.
OMg I have seen pretty much every episode of both TOS and TNG hundreds of times and I NEVER caught TNG's "It's green" reference as a homage/nod to that TOS episode!
On DS9, the Feds were having problems with getting their tech, including replicators, to work with the Cardie power, so Julian couldn't have one made, and maybe Garak wasn't available to make one or right fabric not available.
As someone else pointed out, they had Starfleet replicators on the runabouts.
I imagine the replicators on runabouts would be somewhat limited in their capacity.
It's unlikely you want a sensitive item like a military uniform being able to be made on a small ship attached to a base anyway. If it falls into enemy hands.
@@nyetloki yeah it could be that certain items have hardcoded blocks in the device software, to prevent sensitive items like uniforms being used in any false flag operations.
It also probably helps with crew obedience, IRL soldiers have to take great care of their uniforms so not being able to make a new one at the snap of their fingers probably helps with discipline there.
@@nyetloki my guess is uniforms can probably only be replicated from an officer’s own quarters with their access code.
The 23rd century had food sythesizers introduced by the original series.
In Pike's Era they did have rudimentary food replicators (due to that times limited tech on making special fx for tv). On kirk's enterprise's cafeteria they order their food at a terminal with a sliding panel (like those old Food-tomatics but without the glass windows), it was in a handful of episodes.
Discoverys writing room :
"They were OK with us throwing out the baby. Fans won't care if we now toss out the bathwater."
Discovery had so many inconsistencies...both with legacy trek and within its own framework...made many moments ruined as the errors broke my suspension of disbelief.
STD used to have so many inconsistencies.
It still does.
But it used to, too.
Mitch Hedberg's angel on why STD sucks.
@@eschelar "I used to do drugs. I still do use drugs, but I used to, too." Moreover with Discovery the only way to truly enjoy it is to be just like Mitch and get high as hell prior to consumption of all the empty entertainment calories.
@@eschelar Much of star trek has internal inconsistencies. Like every series.
I doubt that "errors broke my suspension of belief." Because Star Trek has literally had continuity errors between episodes of the same season. Its Trek's trademark at this point. Spock forgetting for the first three episodes that his mom was human, how money does or does not work, Klingons, Trill, the Amanda Q, warp 10, literally everything. Nothing in Trek has really ever been consistent. So you're going to have to find a new excuse.
@@samholmes7030 dude, there’s a big difference between the writers making slight tweaks to the plot as the story progresses, and making massive alterations to the universes already established lore.
Can't forget something you don't know or care about
If I had to guess, I'm pretty sure the writing staff for Discovery never watched any of the other shows. They made a sci-fi soap opera. They could fix it in the 5th season by having some kind of temporal anomaly simply erase Discovery its crew, and its entire timeline from existence.
Oh how I wish
According to Michael Okuda the Star Trek Animated series was done to the same standards as the original series and used the same guidelines handbook. There is a TAS episode where the Enterprise has what many consider the first holodeck where the computer strands three crew members in the holodeck in a blizzard.
This is just a Trek version of 'TIE fighters can hyperjump', JJ and Kurtzman and their other buddies are fans, but don't know or care about lore like a Dave Filoni does.
did they not make that absolutely clear in ANH, that they couldn't?
@Rykiel Toh Because it was just a standard TIE fighter found on the Death Star wreck.
There have always been backpeddeling and retconning in ST, Enterprise, had tons of them, but.. theres just too many of them in STD, its one of the problems of writing a series taking place before the previous ones, continuity can be tricky. Yet, altering the timeline to appease the fans that are used to see phasors, replicator etc. Can backfire pretty badly
*Absolutely no one will be inspired to become a doctor, engineer or astronaut from watching modern STAR TREK.*
There is it.
Wow. I never watched the series, and now I know I never will. How can they destroy an entire universe of work so nonchalantly?
Krutzman and gang don't give AF about ST continuity. And the little details inform the big ones. That shows how little they care in the grand scope of their production.
They’ve only seen The Cage and ran with that.
Brad Wright had said about making Stargate, at least the _intent_ for continuity is there, to follow the rules of the verse - such as that matter can only travel one way through an active wormhole. Imagine if Kurtzman had been overseeing Stargate? Oh wait, I think he was, that was Stargate Infinity. XD
@@saberiandream316
One exception is Asgard transporters can beam people through an incoming wormhole but that is really just energy.
That's what a 'reboot' IS - it's a 'let's start over because we can't possibly learn all there is to know about the original show, but we're expected to write for a show that's a blatant money-grab ripoff" tactic.
@@xaenon The irony is they call YOU a racist for hating this bullshit. When Sisko is inevitably brought back to fill in that PC check-box, he's gonna reappear 20 years later, and in effect, that shows he perpetuates the welfare queen stereotype, that he just walked out on his family. But Sisko was made to be a positive male role model as opposition to those stereotypes. And then they'll call YOU racist for thinking this (you have welfare queens on your mind, you're projecting!) as damage control (we're not the racists, _you're_ the racists!), so it just continues, on and on and on...
Thank you for this video.
Discovery forgot all of Star Trek. The Federation does not use slave labor, warp drive does not look like Star Wars hyperspace, the uniforms are all wrong - even Pike's is very wrong (wrong colors, they did not have black collars etc.), those aren't Klingons, cursing or "colorful metaphors" beyond son of a bitch is unheard of, unless you are talking about proximity phasers - phasers are Beam weapons, tech is otherwise too advanced, bridges use monitors not windows (beyond the ceiling), that is not the Enterprise at all (too big, wrong shape, you can climb out of stuck turbo lifts, bridge too big, that is not engineering, way too much empty space, one support pylon per engine, longer neck, many fewer glowy bits, etc.), 23rd and 24th century ships are not that spacious, etc, etc.. I could go on.
I stopped watching the show just before their version of Mudd showed up. I kept finding myself over and over asking out loud, "Have you ever seen Star Trek?"
When I found the Enterprise made an appearance I watched that. I tried to give the show another chance. Then I saw it. If they can't get the Enterprise right, F them.
This series, that uses Star Trek in its title, sadly owes more to Abrams' 1st remake of Star Wars IV (I even call it Star Trek XI the New Hope) than it does to any other Star Trek series or movie.
I understand some choices were made based on legal or who they would have to pay. Fine, but if do not want to pay someone and that means you have to changes things this radically that don't use or better yet, do it.
As an added note, in the late 2260s, the Animated Series shows the Enterprise was fitted with a brand new Rec Deck, essentially a First Generation Holodeck. This is years after Discovery. Another example of where Discovery got it wrong.
I will vote political party which will delete Discovery and destroy all copies, like Lucas did with StarWars Christmas special :-D
You missed it. Part of the main plot of Charlie X was that Charlie had the ability to create things with his mind.
Based on the few seconds I've seen of STD in this video, the writers think Star Trek is some kind of dystopian, cyberpunk cautionary tale, instead of a show that's full of optimism like old Trek.
"It's coconut and vanilla and they are both White" he said disappointedly. And people say original Star Trek wasn't woke.
Aren't vanilla beans brown?
Obviously a future descendant of Humza Yusuf, or whatever his name is.
my favorite bs scene involving food is a scene in TNG where Ryker is making eggs terribly and they all have to pretend hes a great cook with skill. he made a fried mess lol
I guess he didn't improve since he was burning pizza many years later.
At least Worf lived ‘em!
Major Grin I really enjoy your videos, thanks!
This is pretty consistent with ST writers. They never watch a single show, or have maybe seen a couple of YT shorts from certain episodes, then write a show like Discovery, and make HUGE errors like these.
1:49 the seed grain is called QUINTO...... decades later Zachary Quinto was cast to play Spock... coincidence?
YES!
I had just assumed that, when selecting a stage name, Zachary watched an old episode of "Star Trek: The Animated Series" and was enchanted by the term "quinto-triticale."
What’s the point of pretending discovery is a Star Trek show.
Your videos are legendary. Good work!
Worf eating Commander Riker's scrambled Owon eggs -
Worf: Delicious.
So in TOS, those were "food processors" that took actual food stuffs and compiled them for you?
Yes
They were called synthesizers and they worked in multiple ways, as food elevators, as plate combiners, and as 3d food printers. Not quite at the level of replicators yet.
We'll probably have a rudimentary version for real by the 2040's or 50's. Though I'd imagine appearance will be off, or it'll be flavoured soups, gelatin blocks or something.
It's things like this that make me happy . . . because they make it even easier to completely dismiss "Discovery" as being actual "Star Trek" canon.
This has to be the best, if not the only video, that's an ode to replicators.