WTF is Tasmanian Oak?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ม.ค. 2018
- You've seen me use Tasmanian (Tassie) Oak before, but what is it? Surely its just an oak tree from Tasmania, right? Nope!
How does Victorian (Vic) Ash fit in? What about messmate, alpine ash, mountain ash, and blue gum?
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It's hard to find information about our (Australian) Woods on TH-cam, so I'm hoping you keep up the good work
Thanks for the aussie content. I consume a lot of TH-cam woodworking information, but so hard to translate to locally available wood. I'm in Vic. Thank you!
Honestly, there needs to be some naming consistency rules for timbers in Australia! I see Tassie Oak referred to as Messmate, Stringybark as Messmate, Messmate as Ash, Ironbark as Messmate, its crazy! I mostly use "Stringybark" that is from the Northern Slopes and Tablelands of NSW, which is most likely E. caliginosa, it is absolutely nothing like "Tassie Oak" that comes from bunnings, doesn't have even close to straight grain, and is much much harder - closer to Ironbark, which is a whole other rabbit hole of group-named eucalypt hardwoods! Thanks for the video though, it helps get information on our timbers out to the world!
I’ve sanded and polished more than 3 football fields of Tasmanian oak floorboards throughout Melbourne. At least 80 percent of floors would be tassie oak.. the old growth tas oak (up until the 70s) was denser. You definitely notice a lot more dints and scratch’s in the new tas oak. Even more so in new vic ash (the Messmate/stringybark is the densier species) when compared to the other popular flooring species these days (spotted gum, blackbutt, brush box, ironbark) they make tassie oak look soft in comparison.
Thank's Paul. Hard for a newbie trying to figure all of the timber variations out especially as a lot of us new wood workers are watching American content. I really liked this video as You seemed a lot more confident and relaxed in front of the camera even if some of the editing was slightly choppy. Your channel has been a huge influence and an ongoing resource for me - so thanks again for the content
Great video Paul - very informative and interesting (as are your other videos).
I have to say this video is super informative and it's helped me a lot. Thank you!
Paul, I thought this was really interesting. I'm from the US and have always been interested in Australia. From watching your videos, I picked up that your domestic lumber is a whole different animal from ours. Fascinating stuff. Thanks for doing a video on it. Would definitely enjoy seeing more!
Loved that Paul. Some years ago friends moved into new house and she was proudly showing off her Tas Oak kitchen. Was very deflated when I called it gum tree. However I still love the timber. Floors in our house are all Vic Ash (I am Victorian) and it is fine.
Great video Paul, it is good to easily learn something about our local timbers. Keep it up!
Love your style and the info. Thanks!
I grew up on a farm where native trees included Jarrah and karri. Karri sounds exactly like carry. We also had marri (redgum) and yarri (WA blackbutt). Maybe tuart, I'm not sure.
Interesting video and subject. Would love to lera
n more about Australian timbers, how they are used, how they look etc. Looking forward to more!
Great video, thanks Paul!
Thanks so much for this video! It's so hard to find information about Australian woods on the internet, so I definitely appreciated this video. I'd love to see a video on acacia, although I'd imagine it'd be even more complicated and confusing than this one, given that there are many species of acacia.
Awesome video Paul , hope you can make a bit more content on the Australian timbers, Spotted gum, blackwood,
..... and how good they are for furniture making
Learnt heaps. Thanks mate also love ya style, down to earth, honest damn funny. I will continue to follow you.
Thanks for the info Paul! 👍👊
Thanks so much for the local info! I was sent here by fix it fingers. I love the channel - a sub for sure! Im on a mission to solve the mystery of a piece of 'tasmanian hardwood' i got from bunnings in melbourne. this video explains the vuage nature of its lable. Would it likely be 'vic ash' if its from here or is this stuff grown and shipped all around australia? Thanks!
Excellent info thank you mate ✌🏼
Hi Paul - Really late to the party, but as a newbie woodworker who just build his first project (a wine rack) from 'Tassie Oak', this is invaluable. The wine rack is now sitting in my workshop, with my greatest fear being that I will ruin it with a poor finish. A video on staining / finishing Tasmanian Oak furniture would be a huge... Thanks!
I wouldn't bother with a stain (unless you're going to ebonise, which I have a video on) on tas oak - it looks gorgeous as is.
I'd recommend an oil based top coat - a hardwax oil (I have a video on that!) would be my first preference, but oil based polyurethanes work well too. Water-based finishes tend not to bring out enough colour in tas oak, leaving it looking pretty lifeless.
@@TheWoodKnight Thanks mate - will look at those videos. Thanks for the quick reply!
Awesome video I do find it funny about the name of wood species that aren’t even in the same species family. And learning more about Australia’s native wood always love to learn. Awesome video
Clear as mud mate, lol, you did a good job trying to explain this somewhat topsy turvey subject.. its kinda like explaining my where my half brothers' step-mum's sister fits in the family tree..
thank you, really great informative video
This was very fun to watch (or however you would name it in Australia) hahaha!
Love TH-cam's attempt at subtitles in Aussie accent.
Wolverine taking about Tasmanian oak. Love it.
Very interesting info. It's a shame that shipping is so expensive; I've always thought it'd be great to do 'lumber swaps' with woodworkers from other parts of the world.
That would be great! Wish it could be e-mailed!
Great video! ...and BTW it was 15 Wood Knight Videos today and that was better than staring at my sander.... just. 🤣
Maybe I should look around a bit more but in Perth our 'Exotic' suppliers are few. I quite like Tas Oak and use it quite a bit. It seems to have come down in price so much more affordable than say a year ago. I have just made a couple of side tables with Jarrah legs and Oak top. the combo goes together quite well.
Jarrah + Vic Ash is in my top three combos. It fluctuates between + vic ash, so jarrah or redgum, and blackwood + vic ash. The plainness of vic ash is great against how swirly and colourful blackwood is.
Yes please more!
Is tasmania Oak a heavy wood? Thanks a lot for this comprehensive video!
Tassie Oak, headed off to Bunnings because they out marketed our local timber stores. Checked the shelves and hey presto tassie oak 1200mm x 600mm perfect for doors on the vanity but I wanted 1800mm lengths ? Bummer they use rejects and jointed pieces 40mm wide. That's gonna look crap as a mirror surround timber 1800mm x 1200mm. I really liked the grain I didn't mind cutting and molding the timber but the joints stuck out like the preverbills once oiled. Learnt my lesson buy from a timber yard. That's for letting me know that it's actually a gum tree timber not an Oak.
Bit late on this video, but I was wondering if Tassie Oak/Vic Ash is suitable for a hand carved axe handle?
No . It splits too easily .
When I lived in Melbourne, they called E. Regnans Mountain Ash in Victoria, but Swamp Gum in Tasmania... And once cut, Tassie oak ? What a mess...
Thanks for those specifics. I keep asking my Australian friend what those woods are and she has no idea, but turns out to be right anyway when she says "Oh, I'm sure they're all eucalypts." I know the British took Monterey pines from here (California) to Australia (radiata to you guys), and as Tim notes below there are many eucalyptus varieties growing here, so isn't there anywhere on your largish island where oak and walnut and cherry and maple can be grown commercially?
I'm sure there is enough space, there might even be enough space in the right climate, but its a bit like why doesn't the US grow Bubinga, Ebony or Zebrawood? It likely isn't commercially viable when you consider the tiny population, and the 20+ year investment before rewards can be reaped.
Oak/Walnut/Cherry/Maple are imported from the US, but not all places sell it - it is more of a niche product too, as we have plenty of amazing woods in Australia. Why use walnut when you could use blackwood (looks like koa)? We've got dozens of timbers that match similar colours to Bubinga.
Furniture made in Australia by an Australian using Australian woods has much the same appeal as "Made in America" stamped stuff ;)
No, not really. The climate's not right except maybe in Tassie, and we have lots of nice local timbers to use. Although once you've had to wrestle with woods like Jarrah you begin to wish for a bit of nice soft White Oak.
David Eddy David you know Tassie is a part of Australia, even though they are left off many maps? LOL
Hi Paul I’ve just discovered your channel. I’m about to make all our furniture and I have a good Vic Ash supplier down the road (Qld). When using my Leigh jig for the dovetail drawers can I just put a sacrificial sheet behind the stock piece to stop tear out? Thanks.
Yes. Sharp bit will also help, but sacrificial sheet will get most if not all tearout :)
Paul Jenkins Ripper Rita, thanks.
A lot of railway sleepers in the UK were made of Jarrah, they were heavy, hard, but beautiful when polished up. My first experience of this timber was to bend a 6" nail in two different directions at once when driving it in and snapping the head off my hammer trying to pull it out. I then removed the spurs of a 1" auger bit drilling a 4" deep hole. Exactly how hard is Tasmanian Oak and does it destroy good quality tools too?
+Clive Bashford Tas oak is considered a soft hardwood by Australian standards, and jarrah a medium hardness wood. There are much harder woods around, but primarily what dulls edges with Jarrah is the higher than usual silicia content.
Maybe I need to do a "wtf is Jarrah?" episode!
Tuart might be tougher. It's the only wood I know of that, when dried, still sinks in water.
What a waste of a good timber. Trouble with sleepers, when you rescue them you can only get short pieces.
thanks Paul. appreciate the insight into our locally available timbers. kwila for example is the same species as merbau but kwila comes from new Zealand and merbau from Indonesia... or is that the other way round! 😁 but you never want to work those timbers.. just good for decking imho. the info on relative density and comparisons to real oak and maple is really helpful. thx.
Ah I didn't realise the location/source of "Insia Bijuga" changed its name. I just like calling it by the other names 'cause it throws most people off ;)
Kwila doesn't come from NZ and neither does Merbau. Insia Bijuga are tropical trees so I doubt there are plantations of either in NZ. Are you confusing Queensland with NZ perhaps?
Clear as mud!
Here in Oregon (wood heaven, USA), we pretty much just call each species what it is. Nice video.
The trees were named by British settlers after wood from the old world that they were similar to.
Just found you, explained alot about our native timbers.Australia has the hardest hardwood on earth
Interesting, we have a lot of blue gum eucalyptus (eucalyptus globulus) in California starting to come down. Can’t seem to get a piece longer than 12 inches that will stay straight, although it’s the hardest wood I’ve ever worked with. Any tips for drying it?
I don't, sorry. I've never dried my own wood, other than random turning blanks that I just leave under the house for a few years. My understanding is it is one of the more difficult trees to dry - lots of internal stresses (presumably because of how quickly it grows)
Paul Jenkins Dad planted a solitary Tasmanian Bluegum near the house about 50 years ago. You might be able to use small pieces for turning. It's probably best crosscut through the whole tree, or maybe ripped into slabs for furniture. Its trunk is quite short, and there are branches all over the place.
Grown in a plantation, maybe it could be used as regular timber.
With the flooring - a large part of it is our much harsher climate. The harder australian woods also tend to be much more rot resistant without treatment. Part and parcel of living in tropical climates is that wood needs to be able to stand up to a lot more punishment.
I'm in the UK & this was really interesting.
You mention about vic ash not being suitable for flooring yet its denser than maple. Wood needs two characteristics to be good for floors, hardness and stability (resists warping and splitting). Density is not the same as hardness. It can be dense but soft.
+Brandlin it's plenty good for flooring, furniture and structural applications, it's more that by comparison to other woods in Australia, it's "soft" (Jarrah, Redgum, Ironbark, spotted gum to name a few) that many Australians think it's too soft! Maybe us southerners just wear too many high heels and steel souled boots ;)
oh ok, i misunderstood your comments in the video. thanks for the clarification. I thought it might be rugby boots not high heels, but hey, whatever floats your boat :-) Love your vids!
Ive seen Tassie oak floors a few times here in Sydney. It's way to soft if you have big dogs though like our Rottweillers, as they would scratch the floor to pieces when they decide they need to run outside to check out a passing dog. We have spotted gum which has survived for nearly 20yrs. People like Tassie oak due to it's lighter colour. There are other light coloured hardwoods available like Grey Box which has a density of 1120 kg/m3 whereas tassie oak is only 675-770 kg/m3
More please
I installed solid 19mm flooring into two units late last year. The first was Tassie Oak/Vic Ash, and the other was Tassie Blackwood. The Tassie Oak was hard enough, but of course not hard by any of our real timbers standards. But the damn Tassie Blackwood is so damn soft, my boots was scarring the surface during installation. It didn't matter because it still requires sanding, but god help the poor lady waltzing around in stilletto's. The blackwood did look mighty fine, qtr sawn tassie oak looked like crap! so plain jane.
There aren't too many timbers in the world that look that vaguely remarkable next to a nice piece of blackwood. That poor Tassie Oak never stood a chance! :(
Been going around looking for wood I can machine in my new 3018. Not much choice in small qty. Bamboo, Acacia chopping boards and Tassie Oak from Bunnings. Now I know it is not Oak and why there is the colour and feel variations.
Where do you get your tassie oak from? Really surprised to hear it's as hard as maple
+Robin Lewis anywhere that sells hardwood in Melbourne stocks it. Bunnings sell it dressed, or as "F17 Construction timber" for bargain prices. I've also bought from WR Timbers and Mathews for better grade stuff.
The little Walnut and (maybe soft?) Maple I've turned felt like I was going to snap them by comparison to the regular Aus woods I use!
My boss has had 2 stair cases made of tassie oak at work.
Here's the pronunciation phonetically, it might help. It has four syllables. Della (like Ella with a "D") ga ten sis, with the emphasis on the Della. You could almost sound it like two words, Della-gatensis. Hope that helps. I enjoy watching wood working/Reno type vids (amongst others) . But there's very few Aussie channels. So, good luck to you. I wish you every success. We need more channels like this representing us.
Hey mate I'm an Aussie beginner and want to make a table to try sell what do you reccomend
Can you do one on mountain ash tree?
How do you think tassie oak would go for making a bow? Wondering how it would handle the tension and compression it will be put under when it flexes as its drawn
Not something I have any experience with, sorry. The usual "tool handle" for axes and the like is usually spotted gum rather than tas oak. I'd suspect it'd be fine, but may not get the last 1% out of the bow for top tier competition type thing.
@@TheWoodKnight cheers mate
Good vid, have you messed much with staining the various species?
+Pete G takes stains pretty well - no oils, noticeable resins or tanins, so goes on nice and evenly with no special prep. Seems half the Tas oak furniture in chain stores gets a "chocolate" type stain on it!
Pete G Redgum isn't necessarily Redgum. Here it's marri.
Awesome cheers
Hey Mate, I am just getting into woodworking. I am located on Sunshine Coast Australia. Any idea's or recommendations on where to get some Tasmanian Oak/Victorian Ash (I would like to buy online with delivery) Thanks :)
The WoodFather has (had?) a store locator for hardwood and plywood, but I'm in Victoria, no idea whats in Queensland, sorry. Pask might have a better idea as he's from the Sunshine coast too
Any good place to find hardwoods in Wollongong?
No idea, sorry
Hi Paul. Is stringbark the same as messmate/tas oak?
messmate stringy bark is a Tasmanian oak have a look at the wiki it will show the exact species that are under the Tasmanian Oak name
Paul, we got Eucalyptus gum trees here in The Philippines. Nobody seems to have a definite answer on what the exact name is. They say GumGum..
This wood is VERY yellow, not so hard, but pleasant looking (you would not dare stain it). there is video on my thingy v=3w3PkEE37Tw&t= showing me making a lathe stand from it.
I had a bit of a look - at first glance I thought you had stained it because thats such a vibrant yellow!
Unfortunately, I'm not able to identify it. There are only a handful of woods I've worked with, and while most of them are gums there are some 700+ eucalyptus varieties out there!
Thank you Paul. It actually looks so much like our famous Narra, but this is lighter (in weight) and way softer. In the video, the stand was just covered in 2 coats of sand'n'seal. Can send you a sample if you like?
Karri and Jarrah timber look pretty similar. To distinguish, you need to burn a sliver.
So _that's_ what that "F" stands for. Huh. Who knew?
Yowsa. I think I was happier assuming it just an oak tree from Tasmania!
Bunnings only advertises it as TAS oak so is there any way to tell which variant you are buying?
Anyone in Brisbane have a recommended place to get wood? Have mostly been using bunnings, and the occasional woodworking show to buy wood, but really need to find a good place to go!
Inaudable try Watt's Wood www.wattswood.com.au
If you feel like a drive, GT hardwood at Woodford are worth the trip
use Vercace timber in Virginia
Big Red Shed at Darra
VSH also in Virginia.
We also have a tree called mountain ash here in Europe that isn't an ash lol
Thanks Paul. I now know less about Australian wood than I thought I did, yet somehow I now also seem to know more. Keep up the good work, I think, I'm not really sure anymore 😁
I'm Ron Burgundy? ;)
How do you like Gidgee and Bowakka ?
lol
so damn hard to use :P looks amazing but sawing it by hand is a bastard
harder to find around NSW these days, Bunnings has shitcanned almost off of it.
Who decides these names? _"I'm gonna call this new fish for... green fox! Oh man I'm so hilarious"_ :P
Dv8_NO Probably the pommie invaders.
Couldn't make a bow out of it
More important question: Where the f is Tasmania?
I live in Arizona U.S.A. we have a lot of eucalyptus trees here as the climate is hot and dry like a lot of the out back. We know very little about the trees other than the genus. How do you identify a particular species (or subspecies) of Aussie trees? any pointers would be great.
Hi Tim Mills - there are about 900 species of Eucalypt trees, and many of them have very similar features - it can sometimes be difficult to distinguish species exactly. The Australian Govt research organisation CSIRO has an identification database here: www.csiro.au/en/Research/Collections/ANH/Our-research/Plant-taxonomy-and-evolution/Identifying-eucalypts-made-easy
Also some further information about this: www.anbg.gov.au/cpbr/cd-keys/euclid3/euclidsample/html/learn.htm
I am not an expert but have identified some species in my area - typically you need to consider the bark, the leaves, the seeds (gum nuts) and overall shape of the trees/branches to get close. Have fun!
You can tell by looking at leaf shape, bark colour and character, and general tree characteristics. Here is a link to an "easy" species identification app written by CSIRO (the Oz government scientific arm): keyserver.lucidcentral.org:8080/euclid/player.jsp?keyId=2&thumbnails=true . There is an enormous range of timbers that come under the heading "eucalyptus", with wide variations in colour, grain character, and so forth - but what they do have in common is that they are hard. Really hard. And some of them are really, really heavy. And they're bastards on tools because many of them are full of silica. A bit of web searching will give you an idea about what the various eucalyptus species look like as woods.
Personally I find Tassie Oak a pain to work with as it's very splintery and intolerant of bad technique - planing against the grain is a good way of generating huge divots in the wood, for example. But it's the cheapest hardwood by a mile and it's readily available so it gets used a lot in Victoria and NSW. In Western Australia they tend to use a variety of other local species such as Karri rather than importing Vic Ash 2,500 miles.
Tim, the Victorian Ash, or Mountain Ash, as a mature tree grows to approximately the same height as mature North American Redwood, and in a similar climate to Redwood, so we're not talking the outback by a long chalk. And the Eucalypt trees around San Francisco, etc: are Tas Bluegum but look very different around there to there appearance in Tasmania
@@djeity Also see it as common in Bunnings stores and one supplier I went to in Brisbane.
It's very hard to find timbers here in Australia. Tasmanian oak is the only one I can find locally that is good for production. The US has so much better timber choices.
Come on down to Fraggle Rock!
Can I stain Tasmania Oak? Will it look good. Wife doesn't like the colour, she wants it darker. But this is the best and cheapest hardwood I can find ATM.
You can stain/dye all woods, but whether or not it looks good depends on what colour you try and make it, what stain/dye you use, etc. Most finish companies will have small tint samples available, I'd recommend grabbing some to figure out what looks good to you and your wife
So where the Fraggle-rock do you buy your what-ever-you-call-it?
Every hardwood vendor (Victoria, Australia) that I've been to stocks it.
So no tips for where is cheap?
No. I don't know where you are, what you find reasonable, etc. Search for "hardwood +yourRegion", and ask the local places.
It’s steamed and can’t be bent easily
Where the fuck do you buy black walnut in Victoria
I don't use exotics, but you can try Mathews Timbers or American Hardwoods
Oak not oak, mahogany not mahogany and ash not ash. Well of course I now understand it all and appreciate you explaining it to us. Now on the subject of “who’s on third”, could you please ......... on second thought maybe not. Haha
You forgot blue is red but sometimes its brown ;)
Oh wow. Didn’t realize it was gum, just that it wasn’t oak.
Ash is gum
Oak is gum
Mahogany is gum
Red gum is gum
Blue gum is gum
What variety do we have??!?
(Also: nice insulation on the doors! Must have missed when you got that in!)
Edit: oh there’s the video 2days ago!
Only got the installation of them finished Sunday! Shame they dont' do anything against the awful humidity of late ;)
I came here specifically to have a quick rant because i've been using a few thin pieces of "Tas oak" to do little things with and i find the thin pieces to be awful, nasty, hateful vile pieces of wood. Absolutely awful to cut, my crappy saws bind up in every cut, even on thin pieces! And as you have confirmed, the wood splinters and splits very easily. By the looks of it, thicker pieces of it might be ok for workbench tops & other uses, but, i can't stand the thin pieces. Just terrible.
I don't think I'd classify it as a vile wood species - at 'medium hard' it will handsaw pretty well, but it will work best with sharp saws. How thin is thin though? Thinner it is, the higher the TPI you'll need otherwise it will tend to cause things to bounce around and have an even worse time.
Tas Oak is aweful, I don't know what it is, but every finish I put on it, it just looks awful in my opinion. It's kind of boring. It's very stringy, I dunno, however when buying walnut, American Oak, so forth it's SO FREAKING expensive to get to Brisbane, I think I get a 200x32x3000 for 200$ which to americans is an absolute joke. Bunnings sells TAS Oak to why I use it, and my lumbar yards are terrible here. It's just a shame, to build something in which I'm proud of costs a fortune because timbers I like all seem to be hard to find.
Try a timber native to your area? Tas Oak/Vic Ash have to travel a long way to make it up to Brisvegas. Try Silky Oak? Queensland Maple? I'm sure there are more
@@TheWoodKnight Silky oak is lovely but it's soft and very, very expensive.
I have been offered Australian oak (red wood ) sleepers untreated. Would they be suitable in the uk weather . Would it last longer than our typical soft tantalise sleepers.
"Australian oak" isn't red (straw to brown), so I'm not really sure what you've been offered, so I can't comment on its suitability.
Re: flooring - I know nothing about it either, but - density doesn't equal hardness. See: Lead vs Tool Steel - otherwise, fantastic information and I've already come back to this video once. Next time, I'll make the full venn diagram, print and laminate and memorise it. Cheers Paul. Craig
It's pronounced delegatensis - hope this helps!
:| I dont' know how to place more emphasis than that. *:|* maybe..
Answer: the only wood you can buy in Victoria other than pine for making stuff :-/
Unless you buy decking haha oh god we are so isolated and limited in our selections of affordable timber.
The only way thats true is if you only shop at Bunnings. On the way to one of the Bunnings stores, I pass by WR Timber, which has Blackwood, Blackbutt, Jarrah, Redgum, Rose Gum, Sydney Blue Gum, sometimes "real" Oak, sometimes Maple, sometimes Walnut. Thats just off the top of my head. There are several much much bigger timber vendors within 30mins drive of the CBD, including Mathews who stock other exotics like Purpleheart, Bubinga, Zebrano.
Don't even get it at an affordable price in W.A.
I'd reiterate "affordable" but acknowledge that's relative. Watching US wood makers pull out a piece of "scrap" walnut induces jealousies in me that I doubt will ever be satisfied here in Aus.
Thanks for the supplier suggestions, I'll definitely check them out.
+Aaron DC mediA While the US is cheaper for their natives, not all areas are equal. There are places in the US that charge more for cherry than we what I can get similar grade timbers over here, as it's not native to the area and they have to ship it from many states over.
Don't forget their prices are per board foot, a volume measurement rather than our linear meter, the take into account USDAUD. if you're paying Bunnings price for dressed Tas oak, you're paying a massive premium over other places.
Paul Jenkins Britton Timbers supplies a large amount of species, as does Australian Timber Wholesalers. Everyone states we don't have many species, when sitting at the one store, it's hard to see the quality from the crap. Cheers Sean
When my dad immigrated to Australia, some 70 years ago, they were using Tas Oak to make pallets, then the pallets were finished with the wood was used as fire wood. Imagine this in 2019 given the rip-off price of Tas Oak.
Part of the price is because your father and their generation burned so much and cut so much old growth down mate. Add onto that we practically give it to china for nothing. This is the world we live in.
What an honor to be the first... /s