Is no one gonna talk about how the Time War reversed the doctor and the master's roles. The Doctor becomes the warrior and the Master the timelord who runs away. they've always said they were opposite sides of the same coin but the Time war proved it
The Master started the warrior but then ran from the Time War in fear, hiding as a human. The Doctor ran from the Time War but became the warrior to end it. Both changed themselves as a result of the Time War and went back to their original roles after it.
I also like how on the face of it "Master" sounds much more dominant than "Doctor", but when taken in the academic sense a Doctor, i.e. someone with a Doctorate has a higher qualification than a Master, i.e. someone with a Master of Arts degree. To be a Doctor is actually the greater achievement.
@@LordTyph it was a great thing for their characters because it taught the other how the others outlook on life. Leading to a Doctor being far more vengeful when he gets angry and Missy eventually siding with the Doctor, at the end of her life.
It's all funny as during the Time War The Master actually was trying to be 'good' and help people. He just majorly fucked up and overreached what he thought was possible. He used a Time Lord weapon called the heavenly Paradigm which was capable of automatically rewriting timelines to make certain events always come to pass. The Time Lords planned on using it to just rewrite the history of Skaro to change the timeline so the Khaleds and Thal's never conflicted, which would would have meant they remained peaceful forever so no Daleks, The Master however instead tried to change the timeline of the entire universe under the instructions to 'make a better universe'. Which then ended up being such a massive and vague request the paradigm could not accurately work out what changes to make, and it ended up undoing key Time Lord victories in the war and turning them into Dalek wins, one of which being The Emperor capturing the Cruciform and The Master fleeing to hide realising what he'd done.
I love the way the timelords walk on superior ground. The master is toying with Martha, she’s not even worth his direct attention as he just has her on speaker, but then when the doctor takes the phone and announces his arrival the master instantly gets off his lazy speaker phone lounging, straightens up and has to address him directly in ear. Like this is the only person truly on his level. They may be rivals but there is some real respect here.
I cannot get enough of this phone call. The Doctor and the Master depict a true and long friendship; you know the type when your conversation doesn't skip a beat and you can hear their mutual love and respect.
The more amazing thing I find is how they own their superiority, as a character trait, they talk about the stars and planets like they are just walking around town for getting milk. The way the Master asks, "Where is it?" referring to Gallifrey. There's never a doubt like, oh how do I get out of Earth? or How do I find home? or Where will I find help? There was one time Missy mentioned how she made a gun out of a tree leaf. Unlike us humans who have a great deal of general knowledge but only specialize in one narrow field in our lives, TimeLords know most of their civilization's knowledge and skill individually. They don't need a team to build or do something, they each have the means to do it alone. Just the idea of that feels so amazing. I can't even build plastic cup on my own if I needed to. Like, compared to us, if you leave most people alone in the woods we won't be in control of anything but a Timelord can hold their own in the wild (Anywhere outside of Gallifrey).
I've always thought that overhearing this conversation was what convinced Leo to take the threat deadly seriously and to hide out and stay hidden so effectively that he was never tracked down, even with all the government surveillance at The Master's disposal.
@@gay4sswhovian”are they aliens? I mean, nobody calls themselves doctor and master unless they’re aliens or they’re horny. And I don’t even know what a tochlophane or a gallifrey is, so leaning towards the former.”
"So... Prime Minister then?" "I knoooooooow!" I can't help but love how gossipy/small-talky that little bit sounded. XD They veer back and forth between passionate and casual in a heartbeat, their chemistry is amazing (and I don't even buy into Foe Yay most of the time).
@@jamesmccann531 Not sure about it... At that time he was just elected and didn't start to rule the world. So it's unfair to say he was destroying it, And his purpose wasn't to destroy the Earth but to turn it into a new Gallifrey. Of course at first that would mean hundreds of millions of innocent human death ... but once New Gallifrey has conquered enough worlds so humans can have lesser races as disposable slaves, the life would have improved drastically ... At least for us, Time Lords. But thanks to 'public menace' guy we will never be in this golden age.
It's sad that before this conversation, The Master believed the Time War was over, that the Time Lords had defeated the Daleks. You can hear the disbelief, the shock, and the sadness in his voice when learning his home planet was gone and burnt.
@@mayotango1317 That was a fever dream of the doctor. That's what I will always believe it to be. I don't even care about the timeless child part, it's the fact that they built up a decade long arc to bring back Gallifrey, and 12 just finally got back to it, for only it to be destroyed. Such a stupid thing to do.
he was PERFECT as the Master. He got the master down perfectly and I also liked his look. It fit, for him to be younger looking as Ten was younger looking as well.
"How could Gallifrey be gone?" "Well, you remember when you were Eric Roberts and the Tardis swallowed you whole? Sometime after that, things got weird."
@@them1ghtyalex Aye. He talks about the Cruciform and how he ran from that when the Daleks took it. It's because he tried to use a Time Lord weapon to rewrite the universe in the favour of the Time Lords. It failed, and started changing things for the worse, such as the Time Lord victory over the Cruciform that was then negated and the Daleks won instead. it was his fault, among a lot of other things, so he ran to the end of the universe. P.S. Everyone should try and listen to the War Master audio stories.
@@PoliceAlarm and that's a little...sad. It's weird that I'm feeling sad for The Master who's a homicidal maniac in every sense of the word and the only time he ever "turned good" was when he regenerates into a woman in his next incarnation after John Simm.
I love it when the protagonist and the antagonist actually take the time to talk to each other, especially if said protagonist and antagonist have a long history.
Dude, he turned off the intercom and switched to a cell. So could have the Doctor's voice straight up in his ear all personal like. Just the two of them, up close like. Like too former.....friends.
This has to be the wrong Handsome Jack... The Handsome Jack I know isn't as good-looking as this one! In all seriousness, I loved that little reference! Not many people know that Handsome Jack was named after Jack Harkness! Not even a lot of die-hard Handsome Jack fans... Has to be my favorite part!
Such different actors yet you can still feel the presence of Pertwee and Delgado, Davison and Ainley within their performances. Great scripts, written by fans, performed by proper actors. Elite.
"Try, nano-brain, to rise above the reproductive frenzy of your noisy little food chain and contemplate friendship. A friendship older than your civilization, and infinitely more complex." They're basically lifelong friends/lovers that got so used to each other that they play this eternal game of cat and mouse because that's the only interesting form of interaction they have left. Which is why Missy's whole arc was so fantastic, it really developed their relationship in a genuine way without betraying why the Master has loved being a villain for so long
Agreed! I think the Doctor did-if even for a moment-felt like god when he ended the Time War. The Doctor admitted that they were inseparable when they were younger and he had a crush on Koschei during the Academy years.
With their talk of Gallifrey and being like gods, you get the feeling that if they teamed up they could take on the whole universe and win, time lords being treated like powerful gods is one of a number of reasons why I miss this era of the show, and watching the Doctor and the Master chat like this is just really cool on its own.
“We had no equals. We controlled the fundamental forces of the entire universe. Nothing could communicate with us on our level. Most races pray to lesser beings than the Time Lords." - _The Gallifrey Chronicles._
So, the Master's idea of a birthday present is a Cyberman army. I'm now convinced that the Doctor WAS asking the Master out on a date and that he considers fighting the Master across the constellations a date.
Sure there was a bit in a Third Doctor story where the Master had a device that created someone’s fears and turns it against them, and I can’t remember how exactly but I think it starts showing The Master’s fear, which turns out to be The Doctor himself.
The dialogue here is so good. The last remnants of the oldest, most powerful civilisation in the universe, two opposites. The man who rules others, and the man who serves others. Note how the Master seemed almost hesitant, at first, to make the Doctor his enemy again, to go through with his plan. He wavered for a moment once he realised that the Time Lords were really gone, that the Doctor was all that was left. And then all of that was ruined with the retcon that he never actually killed them anyway....
It was definitely ruined. They could've kept the emotional stakes intact by having just a few time lords survive and having them rebuild time lord society over a few seasons. By changing events so the Doctor never even wiped them out means all the weight behind the first seven series was lost.
@@cameronjosephvideos5942No none of the doctors up to 11 remember saving Gallifrey during The Time War, as 11 said the time stream is out of sync so The War and 10th Doctor can't remember it, so it wasn't ruined as they stated that War wouldn't remember it. "I won't remember this will I?" the war doctor asked. "No the time stream is out of sync" The 11th replied. "So I won't remember that I tried to save Gallifrey rather than burn it, I have to live with that." So the 50th anniversary thought about a solution to that problem
@@cameronjosephvideos5942 Since the Doctor doesn't remember the events of The Day of the Doctor he still did it to his memory. But it would also depend on how you look at it: is it a time loop and The Day of the Doctor always happened the way it did or did the War Doctor actually kill them all with the moment and they actually just changed time.
The Timelords misjudged *motivation* when they thought the Master was the better warrior for the war. The Master cared only for himself and ran once he felt his life was in danger. The Doctor only valued others and fought until the end to try and keep them safe.
Not only that but The Master is someone who likes to tell others what to do and by contrast, he doesn't like to be bossed around by others but I kind of get why the Time Lords got him to fight because for a war like the Time War, you'd need everyone you can get on your side.
The Doctor say in season 10 that the Master was his first love, they have a lot of romantic like discussion, in some comics they even are married, the Showrunners (Steven Moffat and Russel T Davies) sait that they shipped them and Sasha even said that if the Master wasn't angry he would have said "i love you Doctor" so I'm pretty sure it's a mix between ex, best friends, lover, ennemies and friends depending of their regeneration but definetly a romance
I love this version of the master cause it really was like lovers/besties reunited rather than a crazy friend from back in the day who wastes the Doctors time at every appearance like “Harold” and the Doctor had chemistry they bounced of each other
2:10 That face the Master makes when he talks about how scared he was, it reminds me of the feeling I always have when I remember the one time a WW2 veteran really remembered the war. A chilling experience, that still haunts me each time I remember it.
"Run for your lives ! Doctor ! What do we do ? We run !" *run to epic music* *10 minutes later* "Okay, we're not really going anywhere and I'm tired, let's walk for our lives."
The part where the master is yelling at the doctor to run is kind of scary in its own way, along with the music. the mood is like the master has the upper hand and this is where the show truly ends.
What always gets me about this scene is that the Doctor's response to the Master saying "you must have been like God" is "I've been alone ever since." It shows the Doctor's character so well in contrast to the Master's and is a quiet underscore of the loneliness the Doctor constantly suffers from. He doesn't feel like a God, he just feels alone.
I'd imagine it would be emotional to talk to someone who not only was your friend for CENTURIES, since childhood, before they went off to break bad, but is also the sole other surviving member of your entire species.
It’s sadder when you realize that Rassilon is the one who caused The Master to go insane by having the heartbeat of a time lord ringing in his head from the day he stared into the untempered schism.
anyone else still hear this fucking drumming beat after 13 years in their head or just me? literally every day since i first watched this i catch myself tapping my finger 4 times
So lovely when it happens organically. A wonderful group that just happened to be diverse, rather than painfully forced. The comradery was magnificent.
@@ObsidianNightFury i'm pretty sure Jack is known as a pansexual. Because he'll even fuck with an alien or robot if given the chance. Pansexual is basically everything.
This is such a great scene, showing the unique relationship between the Doctor and the Master. Despite being hated enemies, they now have to face the fact that they are all they have left of their race. The Master is such a perfect opposite to the Doctor and the actors play off each other perfectly.
The Master had a thing for The Doctor, it's pretty damn obvious. Listen to the sound of The Master's voice when he says "Doctor" The Master played for both teams
Am I the only one that wants to see that Torchwood episode where The Master sends them on a wild goose chase. For some reason I actually think it involved a real Wild Goose
Favorite. Scene. Ever. "I like it when you use my name." LOL! Poor Jack must be jealous... but I digress :) I love the dynamic between these two. Their past relationship is so believable even through the ambivalence and confusion that's there right now. Fantastic writing, fantastic acting.
This gave me CHILLS. I'm new to Dr. Who and I LOVE JOHN SIMM from previous works, when I started the series with the 10th doctor I LOVED David Tennant, so seeing to actors I adore and admire in this ACTING CLASS is EVERYTHING.
Fangirls? Please he has more than that. David can make the most hetero guy into gay under a minute. I would be gay for him and I have a perfectly happy life with my fiancee. He's THAT HANDSOME.
The Doctor may have been the one to end up in The Pandorica, but The Master..? was far, FAR more dangerous, methinks. Of all The Dr. Who villains, He was the greatest. "There's a drumming noise inside my head/ That starts when you're around/ I swear that you could hear it/ It makes such an almighty sound..."
_"I like it when you use my name."_ _"You chose it. Psychiatrist's field day."_ When I first saw this episode in 2007 (seven years old) I didn't know the word _psychiatrist._ I thought the Doctor was saying that the Master had decided on his name during some special Gallifreyan festival called "Saint Kyatrist's Field Day". I pictured children queueing in a tent to step forth and declare their name.
Wait a minute... When the Master asked if the Doctor was asking him out on a date, the Doctor didn't say no. In fact, his answer could be interpreted as a "yes".
well actually after the master asks that question, the doctor answers "we could leave this planet, we could fly across the constellations if that's what you want". I took that as a yes
hypnotizerLuna Actually, he says "fight" rather than "fly". Anyway, these two have such a messed-up relationship that fighting across the constellations might actually count as a date.
The first time I saw this, when I heard the Master say "Ooooh, I like it when you use my name" and saw the look on his face, I had to stop the TV, I was laughing so hard. Why didn't they just go ahead and make the pairing canon while they were at it? Cuz there's NO way they did that (made it sound like phone sex) on accident. XD
This is brilliant how they've written this, the first time I've watched this I didn't actually listen to what they were saying. But now I realise how detailed the conversation was! I so can't wait for christmas!
God this era of doctor who was amazing! Everything from the dialogue to the music. The atmosphere is much darker and grounded than that of today. What has moffat done to this programme and now we have a female doctor oh dear...
You should give 13 a chance. It has an old school feel but with updated effects. Jodi is brilliant. At least try The Women Who Fell to Earth, Kerblam, Demons and Resolution.
The Master didn't run from the Time War because it scared him, but because he made it worse. He used the Heavenly Paradigm to try and prevent it, to create a more placid universe that he could assume himself as its master, but ended up changing events and turning Time Lord victories into Dalek ones. He ran because if the Time Lords knew it was him, he would have been executed. His response to Gallifrey and the Time Lords being gone is not of shock, but relief. He had to be absolutely sure no one who could have known what he had done was coming for him, and, more importantly, keep the one person self righteous enough to actually enact punishment was incapacitated. Which makes the line "I forgive you" all the more striking in the next part. The Doctor wasn't referring to the Master's actions on Earth, but him using the Heavenly Paradigm during the Time War and escalating it. That meant that the Doctor knew what he did, and that he was playing the Master's game and beating him at it the entire time. And that is one thing the Master despises more than anything, not being in charge of the situation and being made a fool of.
@@talentlessartist7929 of course it wasn't, but, while watching this episode retrospectively, you could view it with this added context if you so choose, regardless of what the initial intent was, especially since said intent was left somewhat ambiguous anyway (a bit like when The Doctor says "Master, I'm sorry" in Utopia, it's open to interpretation exactly what he's sorry about)
I love how scared Simm's Master is of the Time War and the Daleks. Considering what this guy's capable of, it just make the Time War and the Daleks seem that much scarier if they can elicit such a reaction from such a horrible person.
Bruce Wayne Moffat wasn’t changing anything with the relationship. The doctor specifically said “Man Crush”. If you don’t know what a man crush is, it isn’t something taken as serious romantic love. It’s “I look up to this person, acknowledge them, and admire them”. Normally doesn’t even mean that and is meant in complete jest. Moffat really didn’t change their relationship. They were ALWAYS the best and oldest friends. Their relationship has ALWAYS been complicated. Moffat didn’t make anything up. He just explored an idea that without the drumming and having lived longer, the master is potentially redeemable or at the very least would WANT to become friends with the doctor again. Whether liked it or not is personal, but he didn’t pull shit out of his ass (well, not any more than any other doctor who writer). He didn’t work with anything not there.
Okay but notice how after the Master says "how sanctimonious is that" it gets really casual? Like, the Doctor is far away from where he started and the Master is spinning in his chair???? WHAT WAS IN BETWEEN THAT????
why does the lines about going and fighting across the stars literally sound the same as when Tennant says 'we could go off together! Alpha Centuri .......' in Good Omens. There is literally no difference. Complete opposite characters, talking to their complete opposite character. One to fight, one to escape the Apocolypse... but still... it literally is said in almost the same tone even so many years apart.
I was so glad to see that they kept up their relationship from the old series, I was afraid that because of all of the new additions and alterations to the show, they would turn them into purely enemies just to simplify things, as opposed to the lovers/enemies/friends deal that they have always had. Actually (and if anyone has seen the 3/Delgado era you will probably agree) I wouldn't be the littlest bit surprised if it turned out they were married (ex husbands maybe) XDDD I'm serious!
Is no one gonna talk about how the Time War reversed the doctor and the master's roles. The Doctor becomes the warrior and the Master the timelord who runs away. they've always said they were opposite sides of the same coin but the Time war proved it
The Master started the warrior but then ran from the Time War in fear, hiding as a human.
The Doctor ran from the Time War but became the warrior to end it.
Both changed themselves as a result of the Time War and went back to their original roles after it.
The Master was also forced to do what he hates most of all: Helping people.
I also like how on the face of it "Master" sounds much more dominant than "Doctor", but when taken in the academic sense a Doctor, i.e. someone with a Doctorate has a higher qualification than a Master, i.e. someone with a Master of Arts degree. To be a Doctor is actually the greater achievement.
@@LordTyph it was a great thing for their characters because it taught the other how the others outlook on life. Leading to a Doctor being far more vengeful when he gets angry and Missy eventually siding with the Doctor, at the end of her life.
It's all funny as during the Time War The Master actually was trying to be 'good' and help people. He just majorly fucked up and overreached what he thought was possible. He used a Time Lord weapon called the heavenly Paradigm which was capable of automatically rewriting timelines to make certain events always come to pass. The Time Lords planned on using it to just rewrite the history of Skaro to change the timeline so the Khaleds and Thal's never conflicted, which would would have meant they remained peaceful forever so no Daleks, The Master however instead tried to change the timeline of the entire universe under the instructions to 'make a better universe'. Which then ended up being such a massive and vague request the paradigm could not accurately work out what changes to make, and it ended up undoing key Time Lord victories in the war and turning them into Dalek wins, one of which being The Emperor capturing the Cruciform and The Master fleeing to hide realising what he'd done.
I love the way the timelords walk on superior ground. The master is toying with Martha, she’s not even worth his direct attention as he just has her on speaker, but then when the doctor takes the phone and announces his arrival the master instantly gets off his lazy speaker phone lounging, straightens up and has to address him directly in ear. Like this is the only person truly on his level. They may be rivals but there is some real respect here.
I cannot get enough of this phone call. The Doctor and the Master depict a true and long friendship; you know the type when your conversation doesn't skip a beat and you can hear their mutual love and respect.
The more amazing thing I find is how they own their superiority, as a character trait, they talk about the stars and planets like they are just walking around town for getting milk. The way the Master asks, "Where is it?" referring to Gallifrey. There's never a doubt like, oh how do I get out of Earth? or How do I find home? or Where will I find help? There was one time Missy mentioned how she made a gun out of a tree leaf. Unlike us humans who have a great deal of general knowledge but only specialize in one narrow field in our lives, TimeLords know most of their civilization's knowledge and skill individually. They don't need a team to build or do something, they each have the means to do it alone. Just the idea of that feels so amazing. I can't even build plastic cup on my own if I needed to. Like, compared to us, if you leave most people alone in the woods we won't be in control of anything but a Timelord can hold their own in the wild (Anywhere outside of Gallifrey).
Well the Master and Doctor are good friends.... they just have really weird ways of showing it.
Well, years before the master and the doctor were best friends. There is respect there because of that.
It really is like battle of the Titans, two mighty intergalactic heavyweights going head to head.
Imagine Leo still on the phone hearing this.
Leo would be thinking, "these guys have some issues to work out"
I've always thought that overhearing this conversation was what convinced Leo to take the threat deadly seriously and to hide out and stay hidden so effectively that he was never tracked down, even with all the government surveillance at The Master's disposal.
"Martha why am I hearing 2 gay alien phone sexing with your cellphone?"
@@amberguyer4667 oh time lord
@@gay4sswhovian”are they aliens? I mean, nobody calls themselves doctor and master unless they’re aliens or they’re horny. And I don’t even know what a tochlophane or a gallifrey is, so leaning towards the former.”
"So... Prime Minister then?" "I knoooooooow!" I can't help but love how gossipy/small-talky that little bit sounded. XD They veer back and forth between passionate and casual in a heartbeat, their chemistry is amazing (and I don't even buy into Foe Yay most of the time).
John Simm is PERFECT for this role, he got the same cheeky, flirty energy as David Tennant
“Oh you public menace!”
I love that line.
To be honest the Doctor was doing vandalism, it's illegal.
@@Awelbeckk yeah, but you have an evil pm spying on you and trying to kill the world. Is a bit of vandalism that bad?
@@jamesmccann531 Not sure about it... At that time he was just elected and didn't start to rule the world. So it's unfair to say he was destroying it,
And his purpose wasn't to destroy the Earth but to turn it into a new Gallifrey. Of course at first that would mean hundreds of millions of innocent human death ... but once New Gallifrey has conquered enough worlds so humans can have lesser races as disposable slaves, the life would have improved drastically ... At least for us, Time Lords. But thanks to 'public menace' guy we will never be in this golden age.
The Master's version of "Oh, you bad boy!"
@THE INHERITOR What do you mean?
"Are you asking me out on a date?"
"Have been for the past few centuries but thanks for noticing."
HAHAH
I think the Doctor started asking the Master out and never really stopped, lmfao
Thats what my Lil sis thought 😂😂😂😂
It's sad that before this conversation, The Master believed the Time War was over, that the Time Lords had defeated the Daleks. You can hear the disbelief, the shock, and the sadness in his voice when learning his home planet was gone and burnt.
Is ironic because later he destroy Gallifrey and kill the Time Lords.
Even psychopaths have a home
@@mayotango1317Yeah we don't talk about that story lmao
@@Aegon6I hope gallifrey just shows up at some point, what a stupid descision it was to have it be destroyed again.
@@mayotango1317 That was a fever dream of the doctor. That's what I will always believe it to be. I don't even care about the timeless child part, it's the fact that they built up a decade long arc to bring back Gallifrey, and 12 just finally got back to it, for only it to be destroyed.
Such a stupid thing to do.
'I like it when you use my name'
'You chose it'
' ok daddy.' Lol XD jk
You chose it. A psychologists field day
@@DarthHydra456 As you chose yours
Ryu the man who makes people better
he was PERFECT as the Master. He got the master down perfectly and I also liked his look. It fit, for him to be younger looking as Ten was younger looking as well.
If you remember, that's largely why he did it.
"How could Gallifrey be gone?"
"Well, you remember when you were Eric Roberts and the Tardis swallowed you whole? Sometime after that, things got weird."
I hate you so much right now!
🤣🤣🤣
Someone's not paying attention, the master was there for the time war as he explains above, just not all of it or the end.
@@them1ghtyalex Aye. He talks about the Cruciform and how he ran from that when the Daleks took it. It's because he tried to use a Time Lord weapon to rewrite the universe in the favour of the Time Lords. It failed, and started changing things for the worse, such as the Time Lord victory over the Cruciform that was then negated and the Daleks won instead.
it was his fault, among a lot of other things, so he ran to the end of the universe.
P.S. Everyone should try and listen to the War Master audio stories.
@@PoliceAlarm and that's a little...sad. It's weird that I'm feeling sad for The Master who's a homicidal maniac in every sense of the word and the only time he ever "turned good" was when he regenerates into a woman in his next incarnation after John Simm.
As if the Master being a literal Goo Snake wasn't weird enough
I love it when the protagonist and the antagonist actually take the time to talk to each other, especially if said protagonist and antagonist have a long history.
Doctor-"All we've got is each other.
Master-"Are you asking me out on a date?"
GUS BAMBRIDGE-SUTTON The Doctor is already spoken for he is Married to River Song
Brittany Rozenberg Hollander rivers dead, and only 11/12
The Doctor didn’t say no 😂🤔
Bethany Thorpe lol
why do I have the feeling they both have a picture of each other. Like that wolverine meme.
Dude, he turned off the intercom and switched to a cell. So could have the Doctor's voice straight up in his ear all personal like. Just the two of them, up close like. Like too former.....friends.
Henry Williamson No, it was to keep his true identity hidden.
Aidan Stead No bcs at this point doesn’t the Doctor already know
Henry Williamson two former friends, not too
Two bros, sitting in a hot tub 5 feet apart cuz they're not gay
@@danivarius thank you for pointing that out. That was bothering me to no end. Like a drum beat on repeat
''Are you asking me out on a date?'' 7 years later they kiss
Oh.. if That Happens Im... 0///0 (blushes)
🤮🤮🤮🤮🤮
@@danverit783 It did happen.
@@credendovides20 well... crap
Maybe from our point of view but from the Doctor’s more than 1100 years pass lol
Everyone talk about the "Are you asking me on a date" but nobody talk about the "handsome Jack" xD
Handsome Jack's been busy.
This has to be the wrong Handsome Jack... The Handsome Jack I know isn't as good-looking as this one!
In all seriousness, I loved that little reference! Not many people know that Handsome Jack was named after Jack Harkness! Not even a lot of die-hard Handsome Jack fans...
Has to be my favorite part!
Such different actors yet you can still feel the presence of Pertwee and Delgado, Davison and Ainley within their performances.
Great scripts, written by fans, performed by proper actors.
Elite.
These two are about one heartbeat away from being soulmates... I have to imagine that truth frightens the Doctor more than he cares to admit.
Seeing them come so close to becoming friends again in The Doctor Falls was genuinely really tragic.
"Try, nano-brain, to rise above the reproductive frenzy of your noisy little food chain and contemplate friendship. A friendship older than your civilization, and infinitely more complex."
They're basically lifelong friends/lovers that got so used to each other that they play this eternal game of cat and mouse because that's the only interesting form of interaction they have left. Which is why Missy's whole arc was so fantastic, it really developed their relationship in a genuine way without betraying why the Master has loved being a villain for so long
Agreed! I think the Doctor did-if even for a moment-felt like god when he ended the Time War. The Doctor admitted that they were inseparable when they were younger and he had a crush on Koschei during the Academy years.
Technically 2 heartbeats
Make that 2 heart beats.
Doctor: "We've got each other"
Master: "Are you asking me out on a date!?"
LOL
No the doctor has a date with aziraphale (get it he tennant he play as crowley)
STAR loves rimmer Studio that would be an ineffable crossover
@@damimates epic show
With their talk of Gallifrey and being like gods, you get the feeling that if they teamed up they could take on the whole universe and win, time lords being treated like powerful gods is one of a number of reasons why I miss this era of the show, and watching the Doctor and the Master chat like this is just really cool on its own.
“We had no equals. We controlled the fundamental forces of the entire universe. Nothing could communicate with us on our level. Most races pray to lesser beings than the Time Lords."
- _The Gallifrey Chronicles._
That build up of music at 0:34 is perfect. Wish we had more moments like that.
i mean russel is incharge of who again so we probably will XD
It gets used a fair bit in the impossible planet/satan pit story
So, the Master's idea of a birthday present is a Cyberman army. I'm now convinced that the Doctor WAS asking the Master out on a date and that he considers fighting the Master across the constellations a date.
Still better love story than twilight.
😂
They're just really bad at communication...
Eleven would consider that a date.
I'm pretty sure most of their fighting is their dating
I feel like the Doctor is the only thing in the Universe to whom the Master would admit being afraid of anything.
Sure there was a bit in a Third Doctor story where the Master had a device that created someone’s fears and turns it against them, and I can’t remember how exactly but I think it starts showing The Master’s fear, which turns out to be The Doctor himself.
The dialogue here is so good. The last remnants of the oldest, most powerful civilisation in the universe, two opposites. The man who rules others, and the man who serves others. Note how the Master seemed almost hesitant, at first, to make the Doctor his enemy again, to go through with his plan. He wavered for a moment once he realised that the Time Lords were really gone, that the Doctor was all that was left. And then all of that was ruined with the retcon that he never actually killed them anyway....
temmychan not a retcon, and certainly not ruined.
_It wasn't ruined in the slightest _
It was definitely ruined. They could've kept the emotional stakes intact by having just a few time lords survive and having them rebuild time lord society over a few seasons. By changing events so the Doctor never even wiped them out means all the weight behind the first seven series was lost.
@@cameronjosephvideos5942No none of the doctors up to 11 remember saving Gallifrey during The Time War, as 11 said the time stream is out of sync so The War and 10th Doctor can't remember it, so it wasn't ruined as they stated that War wouldn't remember it. "I won't remember this will I?" the war doctor asked. "No the time stream is out of sync" The 11th replied. "So I won't remember that I tried to save Gallifrey rather than burn it, I have to live with that." So the 50th anniversary thought about a solution to that problem
@@cameronjosephvideos5942 Since the Doctor doesn't remember the events of The Day of the Doctor he still did it to his memory.
But it would also depend on how you look at it: is it a time loop and The Day of the Doctor always happened the way it did or did the War Doctor actually kill them all with the moment and they actually just changed time.
The Timelords misjudged *motivation* when they thought the Master was the better warrior for the war.
The Master cared only for himself and ran once he felt his life was in danger. The Doctor only valued others and fought until the end to try and keep them safe.
Not only that but The Master is someone who likes to tell others what to do and by contrast, he doesn't like to be bossed around by others but I kind of get why the Time Lords got him to fight because for a war like the Time War, you'd need everyone you can get on your side.
"don't you understand, all we've got is each other.''
*''are you asking me out on a date?''*
Pft- that line always will crack me up
"Are you asking me out on a Date."
I'm pretty sure these two's relationship far surpasses friendships or romance.
The Doctor say in season 10 that the Master was his first love, they have a lot of romantic like discussion, in some comics they even are married, the Showrunners (Steven Moffat and Russel T Davies) sait that they shipped them and Sasha even said that if the Master wasn't angry he would have said "i love you Doctor" so I'm pretty sure it's a mix between ex, best friends, lover, ennemies and friends depending of their regeneration but definetly a romance
@@gay4sswhovian Kismesistude
Doctor-"Master"
Master-"I like it when you use my name"
"You Chose It"
@Clementine Craddockso. Prime minister then...
@Clementine Craddock what are those creatures? There’s no such thing as the toclofane that’s just a made up name like the bogeyman!
@Clementine Craddock gone...
I love this version of the master cause it really was like lovers/besties reunited rather than a crazy friend from back in the day who wastes the Doctors time at every appearance like “Harold” and the Doctor had chemistry they bounced of each other
2:10 That face the Master makes when he talks about how scared he was, it reminds me of the feeling I always have when I remember the one time a WW2 veteran really remembered the war. A chilling experience, that still haunts me each time I remember it.
"Run for your lives !
Doctor ! What do we do ?
We run !"
*run to epic music*
*10 minutes later*
"Okay, we're not really going anywhere and I'm tired, let's walk for our lives."
The part where the master is yelling at the doctor to run is kind of scary in its own way, along with the music. the mood is like the master has the upper hand and this is where the show truly ends.
Ditto0415 Well, he has the upper hand in that scene
Ditto0415 what do you mean the show “truly ends”
More like when the game really begins
It's reminiscent of the Doctor's words to the family of blood
What always gets me about this scene is that the Doctor's response to the Master saying "you must have been like God" is "I've been alone ever since." It shows the Doctor's character so well in contrast to the Master's and is a quiet underscore of the loneliness the Doctor constantly suffers from. He doesn't feel like a God, he just feels alone.
Also him spinning the globe while he says that forshadows his plans for earth
I think even Godhood could possibly be quite lonely, too.
I'd imagine it would be emotional to talk to someone who not only was your friend for CENTURIES, since childhood, before they went off to break bad, but is also the sole other surviving member of your entire species.
It’s sadder when you realize that Rassilon is the one who caused The Master to go insane by having the heartbeat of a time lord ringing in his head from the day he stared into the untempered schism.
anyone else still hear this fucking drumming beat after 13 years in their head or just me? literally every day since i first watched this i catch myself tapping my finger 4 times
I do this constantly lmao
Same! We’re all going mad! :D
Yo me too
Rogue Traders.
Lovely double Doctor meme (Moisturise me)
@@LunarCatWitch Leftover from when we all were "The Master Race"
He sounds disappointed when he says "Too late."
The score to "Utopia", this episode & "LOTTL" is so fantastic, and improves upon already perfectly written and acted episodes!
And the Master is back! I just knew he wasn't dead!
"You and your little band- which, by the way, is ticking every demographic box"...HEAR THAT CHIBNALL?!
*Chinball
So lovely when it happens organically. A wonderful group that just happened to be diverse, rather than painfully forced. The comradery was magnificent.
I find this so much more satisfying to watch with actual phones, the dramatic button push is everything!
The slash is strong with this one.
It was so interesting to see The Master in this position of power. I hope we get to see more of this in the future some day
3:51 - "...ticking every demographic box" loool one alien, one gay, and one black female HAHAHA
Jack’s not gay- he’ll do it with literally anyone.
Jack’s could totally pass off as Bisexual
Back when the BBC could laugh at itself.
@@ObsidianNightFury i'm pretty sure Jack is known as a pansexual. Because he'll even fuck with an alien or robot if given the chance. Pansexual is basically everything.
The True Upgrade that’s true. Probably should label him as Pan from now on because I’ve been labeling him bi for a while now
"Two civilisations burning. You must have felt like God." Man, after The Day of the Doctor, this hits differently.
I like how the doctor resorts be being like "look if you wanna go fuck shit up I'm down we just gotta do it someplace else"
This scene is perfect. :3
I love how this master is mad but smart and vulnerable and invulnerable all at the same time
Fun fact: David and John actually phoned each other for this scene to make it more realistic
This is such a great scene, showing the unique relationship between the Doctor and the Master. Despite being hated enemies, they now have to face the fact that they are all they have left of their race. The Master is such a perfect opposite to the Doctor and the actors play off each other perfectly.
"Are you asking me out on a date?" I wonder how the Master would react if Doctor said "Yes, yes i am." With a trollface look XD
Awesome that you have a picture of Satine Kryze.
Why thank you....if its a compliment (Or are you a SatineHater and that was sarcasm?)
SPOILER
You really DON'T know how that makes sense now... Really.
Well now they can since he's now a she.
StarwindAmada1 They always could...do you really think that the Time Lords are all heterosexual?
That one nostalgic moment takes everything back to the early 70s:
"Doctor?…"
"Master…"
The Master had a thing for The Doctor, it's pretty damn obvious. Listen to the sound of The Master's voice when he says "Doctor" The Master played for both teams
All timelords are pansexual
And I think Sacha Dhawan made it worse XD
They're regenerating aliens. "Both teams" isn't even a thing on Gallifrey.
"Are you asking me out on a date?"
After watching Dark Water in the weekend. Hearing that line is very disturbing now after seeing them kiss lol
Why do all the protagonists and antagonists on BBC show have so much sexual tension?
oh you public menace!
Am I the only one that wants to see that Torchwood episode where The Master sends them on a wild goose chase.
For some reason I actually think it involved a real Wild Goose
I was just thinking that
Favorite. Scene. Ever. "I like it when you use my name." LOL! Poor Jack must be jealous... but I digress :) I love the dynamic between these two. Their past relationship is so believable even through the ambivalence and confusion that's there right now. Fantastic writing, fantastic acting.
2:17 to 2:42 I love that part so much, is so '''Masterish''...
I'm seriously convinced that the drumming is his own heartbeat and he cant stop hearing it anymore
@Barbara Zhang it's possible I guess. Idk if it was confirmed I kinda fell out of the fandom
This gave me CHILLS. I'm new to Dr. Who and I LOVE JOHN SIMM from previous works, when I started the series with the 10th doctor I LOVED David Tennant, so seeing to actors I adore and admire in this ACTING CLASS is EVERYTHING.
4:06 I love how this scene is what caused Gearbox to name the villain of Borderlands 2 "Handsome Jack"
Honestly I love how that connection was made.
The way he says "Doctor". You can totally see a love/hate relationship there.
The conversation that launched a thousand slashfics.
"Oh you public menace!"
The Master being a good guy and being against vandalism.
*"oh! you public menace! better starting runniiiinnngg..."*
never gets old i swear 😭
Kills 3 Billion humans : "Lol, haha!"
Swearing: "Errm...OH you, public menace!"
Wow!
He didn't swear, he broke the CCTV camera, the cheeky bugger
The chances of this not being intended for gay subtext are about the same as David Tennant losing all his fangirls
Fangirls? Please he has more than that. David can make the most hetero guy into gay under a minute. I would be gay for him and I have a perfectly happy life with my fiancee.
He's THAT HANDSOME.
John Smith I dunno...if I was to ever go non hetero in the Dr Who world, I'd prefer "Handsome Jack". Just my opinion though.
But they're trying to kill each other.
John Smith I'm straight but Oh David xD
The Doctor may have been the one to end up in The Pandorica, but The Master..? was far, FAR more dangerous, methinks.
Of all The Dr. Who villains, He was the greatest.
"There's a drumming noise inside my head/ That starts when you're around/ I swear that you could hear it/ It makes such an almighty sound..."
"Louder than sirens/ Louder than bells/ Sweeter than heaven/ And hotter than hell"
The Master is still here, I swear for I can hear is call, for the drumings are so loud.
Pyramids of Mars and Satan pit already did that most feared being imprisoned thing much better than the Pandorica arc.
How he changed from speakerphone to his phone. How he wants it to be closer, more personal. He wants the call in his hands
The Master and The Doctor are the best couple I want to see.
That way he says "Doctor" in the begining... WHO CAN DENY IT, NOBODY CAN DENY IT. THIS IS NOT EVEN SHIP ANYMORE THIS IS CANON.
_"I like it when you use my name."_
_"You chose it. Psychiatrist's field day."_
When I first saw this episode in 2007 (seven years old) I didn't know the word _psychiatrist._ I thought the Doctor was saying that the Master had decided on his name during some special Gallifreyan festival called "Saint Kyatrist's Field Day". I pictured children queueing in a tent to step forth and declare their name.
The Master's face when the Doctor takes the phone :0
Wait a minute... When the Master asked if the Doctor was asking him out on a date, the Doctor didn't say no. In fact, his answer could be interpreted as a "yes".
well actually after the master asks that question, the doctor answers "we could leave this planet, we could fly across the constellations if that's what you want". I took that as a yes
hypnotizerLuna Actually, he says "fight" rather than "fly". Anyway, these two have such a messed-up relationship that fighting across the constellations might actually count as a date.
hypnotizerLuna The Doctor wasn't saying yes to going on a Date with the Master he was trying to stop a Time War on earth
Sanulay it wasn’t a yes. He didn’t answer the question cause it was the master being sarcastic. And the Doctor didn’t have time for that.
No.
The first time I saw this, when I heard the Master say "Ooooh, I like it when you use my name" and saw the look on his face, I had to stop the TV, I was laughing so hard.
Why didn't they just go ahead and make the pairing canon while they were at it? Cuz there's NO way they did that (made it sound like phone sex) on accident. XD
The best scene of the whole doctor who series!!!
2 great actors !!!
This is brilliant how they've written this, the first time I've watched this I didn't actually listen to what they were saying. But now I realise how detailed the conversation was! I so can't wait for christmas!
D: So, Prime Minister, eh?
M: I know!
Watching the last two Time Lords have a conversation like that is just... indescribably awesome.
When i saw these two talk, they became my favorite rivalry duo equal to or second to the Batman and Joker rivalry
God this era of doctor who was amazing! Everything from the dialogue to the music. The atmosphere is much darker and grounded than that of today. What has moffat done to this programme and now we have a female doctor oh dear...
Luke et
Jodie's gonna be good.
Luke et - I completely agree.
Meangrl19
I don't.
Jodie's got this.
It got much much worse
You should give 13 a chance. It has an old school feel but with updated effects. Jodi is brilliant. At least try The Women Who Fell to Earth, Kerblam, Demons and Resolution.
The drumming, the sound of a time lords heartbeat
Did anyone else notice that the area the doctor was in is the same place where they filmed a scene in the Zygon Inversion
Oml ikr I thought I'd recognised that place
I like the "scruffier" version of the Master.
It's a bit like Troughton with all the joking and running around.
0:36 that was THE MOST intense phone answer 😂
The Master didn't run from the Time War because it scared him, but because he made it worse. He used the Heavenly Paradigm to try and prevent it, to create a more placid universe that he could assume himself as its master, but ended up changing events and turning Time Lord victories into Dalek ones. He ran because if the Time Lords knew it was him, he would have been executed.
His response to Gallifrey and the Time Lords being gone is not of shock, but relief. He had to be absolutely sure no one who could have known what he had done was coming for him, and, more importantly, keep the one person self righteous enough to actually enact punishment was incapacitated.
Which makes the line "I forgive you" all the more striking in the next part. The Doctor wasn't referring to the Master's actions on Earth, but him using the Heavenly Paradigm during the Time War and escalating it. That meant that the Doctor knew what he did, and that he was playing the Master's game and beating him at it the entire time. And that is one thing the Master despises more than anything, not being in charge of the situation and being made a fool of.
I never thought of it like that. Very interesting
But this lore you mentionef was done before this episode was written tough. That clearly wants the I rent when it aired.
@@talentlessartist7929 of course it wasn't, but, while watching this episode retrospectively, you could view it with this added context if you so choose, regardless of what the initial intent was, especially since said intent was left somewhat ambiguous anyway (a bit like when The Doctor says "Master, I'm sorry" in Utopia, it's open to interpretation exactly what he's sorry about)
"You're Public Enemy #1." Oh, God. What hath Ye wrought?
the master was always my favourite character! he's bloody hilarious!
The master’s awe at the destruction of gallifrey becomes much more chilling after the events of season 12
I love how scared Simm's Master is of the Time War and the Daleks. Considering what this guy's capable of, it just make the Time War and the Daleks seem that much scarier if they can elicit such a reaction from such a horrible person.
I know I'm late but I think at one point the doctor said when he was a child he had a crush on the master lol
Missy also said she was the Doctor's first love
Yeah that was Moffat making the Doctor's relationship weird
Bruce Wayne Wait! That was a thing?
@@soygato2722 no
Bruce Wayne Moffat wasn’t changing anything with the relationship. The doctor specifically said “Man Crush”. If you don’t know what a man crush is, it isn’t something taken as serious romantic love. It’s “I look up to this person, acknowledge them, and admire them”. Normally doesn’t even mean that and is meant in complete jest. Moffat really didn’t change their relationship. They were ALWAYS the best and oldest friends. Their relationship has ALWAYS been complicated. Moffat didn’t make anything up. He just explored an idea that without the drumming and having lived longer, the master is potentially redeemable or at the very least would WANT to become friends with the doctor again. Whether liked it or not is personal, but he didn’t pull shit out of his ass (well, not any more than any other doctor who writer). He didn’t work with anything not there.
Okay but notice how after the Master says "how sanctimonious is that" it gets really casual? Like, the Doctor is far away from where he started and the Master is spinning in his chair???? WHAT WAS IN BETWEEN THAT????
why does the lines about going and fighting across the stars literally sound the same as when Tennant says 'we could go off together! Alpha Centuri .......' in Good Omens. There is literally no difference. Complete opposite characters, talking to their complete opposite character. One to fight, one to escape the Apocolypse... but still... it literally is said in almost the same tone even so many years apart.
"Are you asking me out on a date?"
And so the Master became Missy to make it more interesting
even when the master knows that the doctor cares about him and wants to help him he is way to stubborn
The moment the Master makes them run is one of my favorites. The realization of what they're up against makes the stakes palpable
With "this is gallifrey" playing as they start to run too.
So good
The Master was PERFECT
He had that hate attitude that made you hate him he was damn good at it
2007: Are you asking me out on a date?
2014: *threw the Doctor against a wall and kissed him"
I was so glad to see that they kept up their relationship from the old series, I was afraid that because of all of the new additions and alterations to the show, they would turn them into purely enemies just to simplify things, as opposed to the lovers/enemies/friends deal that they have always had. Actually (and if anyone has seen the 3/Delgado era you will probably agree) I wouldn't be the littlest bit surprised if it turned out they were married (ex husbands maybe) XDDD
I'm serious!
I swear that have some kind of love relationship
The Doctor said that the Master was his first love so yeah-
The way The Master yelled “I SAID… RUN!” Gave me chills, great line delivery