My SPOILER FILLED responses for this discussion: Why didn't they relay news of the Empror's death via the Kettrel to the temple? They have a scene where Adare asks Ron il Tornja why they can't send the Kettrel and Tornja shoots down her suggestion making the excuse that he needed to ensure the new emperor's safe passage and so sent over 100 Aedolian guard and a convoy instead of just the Kettrel. Later it's revealed the Tornja who commands the military and the wings of Kettrel murdered the emperor so of course he wanted to get to Kaden and wipe out the Shin monastery and all witnesses that weren't already loyal to him Why didn't they outright refuse any of the concessions that the Priest demanded during his trial? Because that character was essentially this world's version of the Pope with a standing army that rivaled the capital's army. And this "pope" character was a popular figure, more popular than... a bunch of bureaucracts and a princess who was not allowed to take the throne as decreed by law. So they could relent to the trial by fire or risk sparking a religious revolt where the revolting force has a huge army that has equipment and arms that rivaled their own army and would probably destroy the city and cost the lives of a lot of people. Turns out they were played, but they erred on the side of not wanting to start an insurrection within the city. Women can't sit on the Unhewn Throne???? Yes they are not allowed to, as most patriarchal fantasy settings, but also anyone that doesn't have the eyes. Valyn is older than Kaden and he also can't sit on the Unhewn Throne because he doesn't have the eyes. The Malkeenians use religious divine right as one of the justifications for their rule, and those religious rules include not only needing the eyes, but also to be male. Big surprise. Ancient fantasy religion has sexist views... like almost all current religions in today's world. No women priests in Catholicism, no women rabbi's in Orthodox Jewish religions, and no women in religious leadership roles in Islamic faith as well. Not agreeing that it's right, but it's just reflective of an archaic, patriarchal religion. Why is that so far-fetched and so triggering for everyone? Why are the fictional made up names not instantly easy for me to pronounce? Uhhh..... Val vs Vale or Vah-len vs Vay-len... does it really matter that much? Especially when one of you is praising the audible book and it's pronounced for you? Why would you mispronounce it if you've heard it in your audible? Why was there repetitive mentions of how many years they trained? I didn't find it that repetitive, and it was done to emphasize how long and how hard they had trained so that their abilities and skills weren't deemed "oh they're just talented." It didn't bother me, and if anyone's ever spent many years learning a skill or conditioning they know that stories about someone being just gifted at something is silly. But if you found it annoying then fine, but the way you yelled about it, I was surprised it was that big of a deal. "... in monk land learning about whatever...." Learning about a skill that becomes crucial to defeating the enemy in the end also is an extremely important skill that is needed for the rest of the series and also explains the mechanics of the gates. Evil mentors keeping them down.... Tan wasn't evil. He was harsh as hell, but then again what Kaden needed to learn wasn't going to be gained with hugs and heart stickers on his term papers. The Shin monastery isn't Hogwarts. Also there's an entire tradition of Kung Fu movies of Shaolin monks that endure torturous training to gain abilities ala 36th Chamber of Shaolin and so on. It's an entire sub-genre of martial arts movies. I liked that Staveley basically drew upon this for Kaden and the Shin. Valyn is a friggin' Navy Seal. Marine DI's and Navy Seal instructors aren't going to be kind, reassuring, affirming people. Not enough Adare in the book. Read the rest of the series, there's a ton of Adare. Not liking the first book because there isn't enough Adare is basically like disliking a horror film because there isn't enough romance in it. How about evaluating the book for what it is, versus what you wanted it to be? I love Kung Fu movies, but I don't put down Pride & Prejudice because there isn't any Kung Fu in it. Valyn as a SEAL isn't a useful skill.... Uh... Valyn can't sit on the throne. He was being trained as the muscle to back up and protect Kaden. So useful skills. Why did Yurl and Balenden have to be SO MURDEROUS AND EVIL? Because if you're in a military environment and everyone is aggressive and beat the snot out of each other, maybe being mean and just toilet papering your locker isn't going to cut it as a bad guy? Valyn has no skills? I disagree. Well for one he's the best hand to hand fighter, he's also been groomed for command, so instead of being a specialist in one thing he learns general skills and a bit about everyone else's jobs. As we note from Valyn's comments and observations and evaluations about all of people in his Wing. Anyways, sorry if this sounds like I am being negative, I actually enjoyed the format and it's always fun to listen to people talk about books. Keep up the good work alls!
Enjoyed the discussion as always. I'm glad it wasn't a complete dumping because the book was entertaining for me. I plan on reading The Providence of Fire after I finish Blood Rites here in a few days. Keep up the good work everyone!
Gave the book 2.5 stars but stayed up stupidly late (I'm in the UK) to watch the liveshow because you're all so delightful to hear discussing books, even this book
Didn’t read this book but loved this live chat. Happened to catch it last night and laughed though out. Almost sounds like the wrong draft went to press lol.
Okay so this was fantastic and catharic. You guys hit all the points I thought haha. Also yes Allen, the whole thing where authors have characters in training hate each others guts or immediately want to kill each other is so lazy and forced. There are so many better ways to make dynamics interesting.I'm pretty sure I'm skipping right to Empire's Ruin because Staveley said you said (Petrik always recommends publishing order haha) so hopefully I will end up liking it.
@@TheLibraryofAllenxandria it's some time ago that I read the trilogy and you get answers to that but I don't know how spoilery these are so I'll leave it at that
I got book 2 a month ago from a library and read maybe 20 pages but after watching the show I'm going to pick it up again to see how good or bad it is🙂
I’ll be curious to see what Allen and Sarah think on book 2. I was pretty meh to negative on book one and thought book 2 was better it’s more fine to good and I’ll still be checking out book 3
Wow, I just realised: the emperor’s blades is not the ember blade :D For a while I was so confused, because I put the ember blade on my tbr after I heard good reviews. Then I heard a lot of bad things about it and thought of taking it off my tbr, even though I was interested in the synopsis. But now I understand: I mistook both books to be the same 🤦♀️ thanks for the chat!
I know I'm late, but I finished the whole trilogy and the further books. I overall enjoyed it, excellent prose, but yeah there's lots of flaws, especially in Emperor's Blades. Still, Staveley improves in every book IMO.
It’s been a few years since I read this series and to give it credit I totally stole the idea of an elite fantasy spec ops that ride huge flying beasts and the ‘death gates’ but aside from that, it was an ok read. Can’t remember anything about the character’s journeys or arcs
It's been a while since I've read them but I remember thinking one was okay but pretty standard then reading two and three and thinking it's went it's some unexpected directions as if the author and editor had read the reviews and changed the trilogy becuase of it.
One of the frustrating downsides of this series is that there are so many interesting plot-lines that simply vanish and do not appear again in later installments. And the characters tend to behave completely out of character in the last book and especially during the conclusion. It just takes you out of the immersion.
My SPOILER FILLED responses for this discussion:
Why didn't they relay news of the Empror's death via the Kettrel to the temple?
They have a scene where Adare asks Ron il Tornja why they can't send the Kettrel and Tornja shoots down her suggestion making the excuse that he needed to ensure the new emperor's safe passage and so sent over 100 Aedolian guard and a convoy instead of just the Kettrel.
Later it's revealed the Tornja who commands the military and the wings of Kettrel murdered the emperor so of course he wanted to get to Kaden and wipe out the Shin monastery and all witnesses that weren't already loyal to him
Why didn't they outright refuse any of the concessions that the Priest demanded during his trial?
Because that character was essentially this world's version of the Pope with a standing army that rivaled the capital's army.
And this "pope" character was a popular figure, more popular than... a bunch of bureaucracts and a princess who was not allowed to take the throne as decreed by law.
So they could relent to the trial by fire or risk sparking a religious revolt where the revolting force has a huge army that has equipment and arms that rivaled their own army and would probably destroy the city and cost the lives of a lot of people. Turns out they were played, but they erred on the side of not wanting to start an insurrection within the city.
Women can't sit on the Unhewn Throne????
Yes they are not allowed to, as most patriarchal fantasy settings, but also anyone that doesn't have the eyes.
Valyn is older than Kaden and he also can't sit on the Unhewn Throne because he doesn't have the eyes.
The Malkeenians use religious divine right as one of the justifications for their rule, and those religious rules include not only needing the eyes, but also to be male. Big surprise. Ancient fantasy religion has sexist views... like almost all current religions in today's world.
No women priests in Catholicism, no women rabbi's in Orthodox Jewish religions, and no women in religious leadership roles in Islamic faith as well. Not agreeing that it's right, but it's just reflective of an archaic, patriarchal religion. Why is that so far-fetched and so triggering for everyone?
Why are the fictional made up names not instantly easy for me to pronounce?
Uhhh..... Val vs Vale or Vah-len vs Vay-len... does it really matter that much? Especially when one of you is praising the audible book and it's pronounced for you? Why would you mispronounce it if you've heard it in your audible?
Why was there repetitive mentions of how many years they trained?
I didn't find it that repetitive, and it was done to emphasize how long and how hard they had trained so that their abilities and skills weren't deemed "oh they're just talented." It didn't bother me, and if anyone's ever spent many years learning a skill or conditioning they know that stories about someone being just gifted at something is silly. But if you found it annoying then fine, but the way you yelled about it, I was surprised it was that big of a deal.
"... in monk land learning about whatever...."
Learning about a skill that becomes crucial to defeating the enemy in the end also is an extremely important skill that is needed for the rest of the series and also explains the mechanics of the gates.
Evil mentors keeping them down....
Tan wasn't evil. He was harsh as hell, but then again what Kaden needed to learn wasn't going to be gained with hugs and heart stickers on his term papers. The Shin monastery isn't Hogwarts.
Also there's an entire tradition of Kung Fu movies of Shaolin monks that endure torturous training to gain abilities ala 36th Chamber of Shaolin and so on. It's an entire sub-genre of martial arts movies. I liked that Staveley basically drew upon this for Kaden and the Shin.
Valyn is a friggin' Navy Seal. Marine DI's and Navy Seal instructors aren't going to be kind, reassuring, affirming people.
Not enough Adare in the book.
Read the rest of the series, there's a ton of Adare. Not liking the first book because there isn't enough Adare is basically like disliking a horror film because there isn't enough romance in it. How about evaluating the book for what it is, versus what you wanted it to be?
I love Kung Fu movies, but I don't put down Pride & Prejudice because there isn't any Kung Fu in it.
Valyn as a SEAL isn't a useful skill....
Uh... Valyn can't sit on the throne. He was being trained as the muscle to back up and protect Kaden. So useful skills.
Why did Yurl and Balenden have to be SO MURDEROUS AND EVIL?
Because if you're in a military environment and everyone is aggressive and beat the snot out of each other, maybe being mean and just toilet papering your locker isn't going to cut it as a bad guy?
Valyn has no skills? I disagree.
Well for one he's the best hand to hand fighter, he's also been groomed for command, so instead of being a specialist in one thing he learns general skills and a bit about everyone else's jobs. As we note from Valyn's comments and observations and evaluations about all of people in his Wing.
Anyways, sorry if this sounds like I am being negative, I actually enjoyed the format and it's always fun to listen to people talk about books.
Keep up the good work alls!
Enjoyed the discussion as always. I'm glad it wasn't a complete dumping because the book was entertaining for me. I plan on reading The Providence of Fire after I finish Blood Rites here in a few days. Keep up the good work everyone!
Very cool. I'm gonna continue with Providence sometime soon
Gave the book 2.5 stars
but stayed up stupidly late (I'm in the UK) to watch the liveshow because you're all so delightful to hear discussing books, even this book
Yay, thank you!
I gave the first and the second 5 stars and the third 4.5 stars, one-off my favorite series ever. You all have a bad taste 😜
Yesssssss someone who loves it!
Didn’t read this book but loved this live chat. Happened to catch it last night and laughed though out.
Almost sounds like the wrong draft went to press lol.
Many decisions I didn't understand, but came through at the end
Actually in the Murders of Rue Morgue by Edgar Allen Poe.. it was an orangutan and it was a mystery! :)
Okay so this was fantastic and catharic. You guys hit all the points I thought haha. Also yes Allen, the whole thing where authors have characters in training hate each others guts or immediately want to kill each other is so lazy and forced. There are so many better ways to make dynamics interesting.I'm pretty sure I'm skipping right to Empire's Ruin because Staveley said you said (Petrik always recommends publishing order haha) so hopefully I will end up liking it.
Please let all of us know if it's worth reading.
26:00 about the heir Kaden being with the monks. This is a tradition of the Empire. Every emperor has to go through that
I think we were wondering why this is a thing
@@TheLibraryofAllenxandria it's some time ago that I read the trilogy and you get answers to that but I don't know how spoilery these are so I'll leave it at that
I got book 2 a month ago from a library and read maybe 20 pages but after watching the show I'm going to pick it up again to see how good or bad it is🙂
Let us know!
I'll never read this book, but this was really fun. 😊❤
Hobb is really good, btw. 🥰
So I hear!
I’ll be curious to see what Allen and Sarah think on book 2. I was pretty meh to negative on book one and thought book 2 was better it’s more fine to good and I’ll still be checking out book 3
I'm reading Cage of Souls, really liking it so far.
😯
@@thefantasynuttwork not gonna lie though, your reception to it has made me a little nervous lol
@@thatsci-firogue 😂
Don't listen to Jimmy
@@TheLibraryofAllenxandria Team Allen!
I actually enjoyed this one a lot, but all the flaws you guys pointed out, I noticed as well.
Wow, I just realised: the emperor’s blades is not the ember blade :D For a while I was so confused, because I put the ember blade on my tbr after I heard good reviews. Then I heard a lot of bad things about it and thought of taking it off my tbr, even though I was interested in the synopsis. But now I understand: I mistook both books to be the same 🤦♀️ thanks for the chat!
lol I get that. Thanks for watching!
I know I'm late, but I finished the whole trilogy and the further books. I overall enjoyed it, excellent prose, but yeah there's lots of flaws, especially in Emperor's Blades. Still, Staveley improves in every book IMO.
It’s been a few years since I read this series and to give it credit I totally stole the idea of an elite fantasy spec ops that ride huge flying beasts and the ‘death gates’ but aside from that, it was an ok read. Can’t remember anything about the character’s journeys or arcs
As long as your flying beasts are actually on your story lol
I’ve finally found the time to watch this discussion. Hope there’s lots of justified hate here! 😂
It's been a while since I've read them but I remember thinking one was okay but pretty standard then reading two and three and thinking it's went it's some unexpected directions as if the author and editor had read the reviews and changed the trilogy becuase of it.
Oh interesting!
A lot of your assassin wishes are actually fulfilled by Age of Assassins (+ sequels) by RJ Barker!! Check it out!
😲
Well this was fun. Unless Brian Stavely is reading this comment in which case sorry, i'm sure you are a nice person.
I think we were fair though.
I think so
One of the frustrating downsides of this series is that there are so many interesting plot-lines that simply vanish and do not appear again in later installments. And the characters tend to behave completely out of character in the last book and especially during the conclusion. It just takes you out of the immersion.
Oh no!!
Yeah this book was okay 😕
My thoughts exactly