We had multiple articles from the usual 'news' sites hyping up Damrod the troll, who the creators were so proud of, talking about how awesome he'd be and dropping the usual meaningless Breaking Bad references because that's like the only show these people have watched His theme song gets more actual screen time than he does..... that's not even a joke. it's really hard to wrap your head around the incompetence of his show sometimes.
To be fair: It makes sense in the lore. Orcs are weakend by the sun and this time the orcs don't have the Nazghul or Sauron to block out the sun like in the battle of Minas Tirith.
@AlphariusCLH oh thats a load of pants in two towers and return of the king we get night fights, but we also get to see whats going on too. and thats the same setting this is *supposed* to be in so it doesnt make sense, its just lazy
@@lordlossize That's fair, but the blueish night fights don't really fit in 2024. Night fights are nasty to make, Peter Jacksons solution was the blue filter but again: It's not very fitting for the current time. They still should have shown the true scales of both sides, it's not like that more realistic lighting would make that impossible. I still think it was a bad scene, I'm just saying that it makes sense that it was a night battle.
Irony is that given the fact that Rings of Power is set in the 2nd Age in a part of the Cannon that is underdeveloped they literally could have summoned a wide variety of of monsters to break the wall. It could have been a fucking Wingless fire, Drake. Instead we got a single Troll, one of the most well used siege weapons in Lord of The Rings by Mordor. Can you imagine (in a world where they had competent writers so 90% of the story is different but the City is still being besieged by Orcs- they are still failing to break the wall. The orc General calls for his "special weapon" (i would come up with some other euphemism such as "our guest" or "our pet" or "our companion") and a dragon comes walking out (a wingless Dragon which are pretty common in Tolkien) The orc officers protests would make more sense as the dragon would roast and trample anything in its path paying zero respect for orc losses. Basically, using the Dragon is like using a tacticl Nuke.
@@BartimaeusAurelius Grond? Yes it is. There is mention of it being enchanted with "Spells of Ruin", whatever that means, but the implication is that it is in some way magical.
@@rafaszejny5470 But since when has Mordor been famous for its perfectly armored troops? They're not tanks so I don't know what your stupid way of thinking expects.
@@rafaszejny5470 The trolls did withstand damage. The only way they were killed was with arrows to the neck. Damrod died barely 5 minutes into battle. And Saurons trolls were much higher in number. It's not about quality it's about quantity. Quality has never won a battle alone. Quantity has.
I would like to add to the impact Grond had on something I never thought would be connected. There's a game named foxhole, basically WWI and WWII on one and I remember we were assaulting a fortified city and couldn't get through with hundreds of men and armor. After hours of this I saw the chat fill with chants: GROND GROND GROND. Every chat channel was filled with it as massive canons started barging the city and breaking their defences. Till this day, whenever GROND is deployed the chants don't stop until GROND stops
I also really appreciate how not only did Grond terrify Gandalf and the defenders, it also really inspired the orcs, pretty impressive acting on behalf of those extras that you can sense their awe and fervour behind all those prosthetics and makeup
The creators of South Park did a college lecture where they explained plot dynamics and script writing. Their whole point was that a plot and a script is not just a series of events, but a chain of causality. Thing one happens, which CAUSES thing two to happen, then BECAUSE thing two happened, thing three happens, THEREFORE thing four happens, BUT thing five is happening, which complicates thing four, and THEREFORE thing six happens, and so on. They joked that many amateur scripts, and even many Hollywood scripts, are just "thing one happened, and then thing two happened, and then thing three happened, and then-" without a clear chain of causality, continuity, or complication between story beats and events that thickens the plot or ups the ante. You established a microcosm of this perfectly. The orcs are trying to take the city, BUT Gandalf and the defenders are putting up a good fight, THEREFORE the orcs try numerous different strategies to mixed success, HOWEVER they cannot breach the main gate, THEREFORE their attack has stalled out. BECAUSE they're not making progress quickly enough, they bring up Grond, and THOUGH the defenders fight valiantly, Grond breaks the gate. BECAUSE Grond breaks the gate, the defenders are now desperately fighting for their lives in the main courtyard and now they MUST abandon the lowest level and retreat further up into the city. At every point, there is clear causality, the overall tension rises, and the consequences of failure become greater and greater. This even leads into smaller moments, side beats, and breaks from the action. BECAUSE the orcs are trying to breach the gate to the second level, Pippin confides in Gandalf that he's afraid of dying here and now, THEREFORE Gandalf tells him about the peacefulness of the afterlife that awaits him, comforting him and giving the audience a gentle, emotionally intimate scene between the two, BUT we are brought back to reality by the orcs threatening to bust down the gate, and the story continues from there. I haven't gotten around to watching Rings of Power, but every single thing I see makes me feel like the writers/directors/producers have all these ideas for story beats and epic scenes but they don't bother to connect them. It's just "and then, and then, and then, and then" without that continuity and causality that makes it a STORY. It's just a series of scenes, so the audience has no attachment to the motivations of the characters, and no pulse on the plot.
Same thing that went wrong in later seasons GOT: things happened, but there was little stringing it together. And 'moments of reflection' like that scene with Pippin and Gandalf, jsut didn't happen anymore. I call that History Channel cinema, where you are informed on the facts and the order that events happened but not on the why.
@@alejandroelluxray5298 time constraints. Movie is already plenty long for a theatre release, they had to cut some parts out. And although the Grond scene is well made and serves a purpose, it overall isn't needed for the story overall. So it got cut.
"Great engines crawled across the field; and in the midst was a huge ram, great as a forest-tree a hundred feet in length, swinging on mighty chains. Long had it been forging in the dark smithies of Mordor, and its hideous head, founded of black steel, was shaped in the likeness of a ravening wolf; on it spells of ruin lay. Grond they named it, in memory of the Hammer of the Underworld of old. Great beasts drew it, orcs surrounded it, and behind walked mountain-trolls to wield it." The Orcs of Mordor bellow and chant to Grond as if it was a living god of war.
the trolls in the lotr trilogy are 1000 times scarier and dangerous, remember that cavetroll in the first movie he wasn't even any armored killing machine forged by sauron, it was just a cavetroll and when he came bursting through that door it was a massive "OH SHIT" moment. the amored trolls in minas also tirith didn't only burst through the first line of defence like it wasn't even there, they were leading the charge capturing the entire city and if it wasn't for aragorns cursed army arriving last second they would have captured the city without problem, trolls basically carried the entire siege.
Yah I think one thing both the Hobbit trilogy and RoP failed with is not making the trolls scary. They are big but also borderline silly in their actions and pretty common to see. In the original trilogy trolls were big, behaved more feral than silly, and were rare. You would only come close to them a handful of times and they were always scary when you did
@@tylerjohn4607 To be fair, the hobbit the 3 trolls at the start were supposed to be silly and squabeling. since it is a children book. The battle of 5 armies trolls were just straight up silly for no reason however, since they werent even supossed to be there to begin with
I dont know it is fully canon perse but BFME2: Rise of the Witch King portrays Trolls and Olag-Hais to be wayyyy smarter and also with bloodlust rather than feral and dummy which makes them super scary consedering that there was a Troll Swordsman whom was a master of using swords lead his race to serve Witch King of Angmar. In Return of the King they were good, but in hobbit and this cesspit naaaaah. I guess they forgot how to "troll" pun intended.
@Kloakentaucher They should have let Peter Jackson do the work. He at least can get the job done. He had some flaws in the hobbit films but still he at least didn't cheap out on the orcs.
Yes totally, at this point not only Sauron, but many other factions are meant to be far more powerful than in LOTR. Númenor especially, in ROP they look like a tiny port city, while in the lore, Númenor was extremely mighty and powerful. In this war Sauron's army would be utterly crushed, leaving a few at most , while late in the Second Age Sauron's massive armies would flee just at the sight of Númenor's army, so that should say a lot.
@ThalattaHaralus Exactly. Especially after the war of wrath which in itself sunk Beleriand. Morgoth lost his army but that was mostly his legions of balrogs, dragons, and other large beasts. Orcs were still in crazy abundance. Sauron had a vast army of the morgul host at his disposal.
I feel blessed that I was a kid when Peter Jackson created his Magnum Opus in 2001. Nothing will get near it in the foreseeable future but Rings of Power? Not even close.
There's another great detail in ROTK that Silmarillion fans will notice: Grond was the name of Morgoth's hammer, and Sauron imbued it with some dark magic if I recall correctly. So the orcs are chanting the name of the bludgeoning weapon of an evil old god while the imposing hammer creeps steadily towards the last defense of the world of men. It's no wonder Gandalf decided it was all hands on deck for this weapon in that moment. Crucially, the audience not only doesn't need to know this to appreciate the dread, but we *don't need it to be explained to us*
@@Tamajyn69 No, iirc, the gates in the book that are made of mithril and enchanted by dwarves are gates gifted by the dwarves to Gondor after the end of the war of the ring to replace the iron gate that was broken during the battle of the pelennor fields
totally agree, i came accross a youtube clip of damrod when he asks for Sauron, so i imagined him to be a very powerful creature, then i watched this scene and i was like... what he dies do a couple arrows and 2 sword hits ????
I'm just constantly in awe of how RoP managed to make every orc, troll, or any other creature look SO DERPY. I laughed audibly the first time we got a good look at a RoP Warg. It looked more like a hyena from the Lion King cartoon than a ferocious beast. This big troll boy was such a disappointment, and he just looked so stupid
The humanising of the orcs and giving them a family aspect was crazy, i much prefer them crawling from mudpits craving flesh then what ROP did with them.
"KATMUNDA" "GOROSH" "KATMUNDA" "GOROSH" "KATMUNDA" "GOROSH CHADAR" That set the tone for The Battle of Minas Tirith The scene is like 50sec long and in my opinion its easily in the top 10 most epic scenes in Lotr :)
An entertaing battle scene is back-and forth, a good villain should be dynamic and dangerous, so naturally our heroes must be too. Moments of heroism, strategy, tragedy and bravery all make for a good film battle. After all the fight itself is secondary, the characters and the stakes at risk is what makes it exciting, otherwise you just get the dull satisfaction of a 'cool fight'. Safe to say, ROP doesn't even offer that. It is good fun to watch Amazon throw their money in a big hole though.
Even the name Grond likely strikes fear into the men of Gondor who heard it from the ancient elves. Grond was the name of Melkor's warhammer, Sauron's master and the greatest dark lord. That name alone would strike fear into the elves and high men of gondor as much as glamdring the foehammer does to the goblins
Also the armored troll charged in and started a bloodbath. Here the troll seems to nonchalantly walk toward the wall, playing baseball with an elf or an orc. Like, is it friday's last shift? He looks a bit done with all this mess
There were so many way Damrod could’ve been cool and intimidating/terrifying, instead he died like a chump (by the way why did the writers think I’d make sense to give the ‘oh shi moment’ no armor? Yeah a hill troll is strong but it can’t take an onslaught of arrows for long butt naked)
Yeah. He looks like he's drunk and in a pissy mood, and has been kicked out of the house to go for a walk and cool off. Not taking things seriously only makes an enemy intimidating if they have the power to back it up, which Damrod absolutely did not.
You could even throw the Berserker Uruk-hai who breached the Deeping Wall as another comparison. Peter Jackson got it right twice in a row (except for maybe the whole Legolas thing).
I like the way they kind ahalf revealed the troll, the flaming catapult firing to illuminate the silhouette of this large beast in the distant coming out of the woods towards them is a nice entrance leading up to what should have been a better reveal. However literally what would solve all the problems you mentioned about adding suspense, progression, cause and solution to the lack of progression in the seige and why the orks are running, adding tension and raising the stakes and showcasing scale AND be a dope badass scene... Is simply add like 15+ more trolls allong that tree line, with only a couple being illuminated to showcase the imminent threat while also not revealing it all to early...
Great content, I hope your channel takes off! I've never seen this travesty of a show so this was super helpful. Also wtf is with studios doing all these nighttime battles with ZERO lighting. Who's out here asking for this garbage?
Remember in LOTR when one single unarmed and unarmored cave took the whole cast combined to bring down and even then they really only managed it by luck? Then later in Minas Tirith you see ARMORED AND ARMED TROLLS burst through the gates and mow through a small army with ease and you are personally TERRIFIED by the fact that something that is already that big a threat CAN STILL BE A BIGGER THREAT? This isn't that. It really isn't. This Damrod guy is just a basic level mook in a troll suit.
@@GuukanKitsune Tolkien did not write DnD or videogames, this makes no difference. The WK went down in a few seconds with 2 hits. Saruman by a stab with a knife, pippins Olog Hai with one hit
I always wondered, why they did not use the Software "MASSIVE", that Jackson used back in the day to simulate the huge battles that LotR was so known for... In comparison it always looks silly.
I no nothing about MASSIVE, but this sounds like a case of the tech just being lost, or locked in someones vault, like the Nemesis System, speaking of LOTR.
Really cool video. Summed up my thoughts pretty well. RoP's battle had no sense of stakes, it felt like something attempting to tick items off a list, not caring much whether they fit together or not.
The evilforces were larger back in time then in the attack of Minas tirith... So... If Sauron had that amount of trolls in minas tirith.... If Azog had the amount of trolls in the hobbit.... Adar should have had fukn 80 Trolls he could have used in this fukn fight!
The elves of ERRRRRrrrrrrregion being invaded by millions of orcs was like "I hear something. Must've been the wind." Whenever I see RaNgS oF pOwER, I cleanse my eyes, brain, body, and soul by watching more Lord of the Rings.
"He will kill our own!" In the battle for Helm's Deep, they bring a battering ram up through the centre of the uruk-hai on the stone ramp, but because their ranks fill the ramp side to side, they intentionally knock off a bunch of them to bring the ram forward. I feel like a scene as simple as this demonstrates just how uncaring the forces of mordor are for their own in the aim of ultimate victory. Meanwhile, in the rings of power, you have a scene of an ork taking care of his ork baby and ork wife whilst complaining about rations. ???
LotR has what is in my opinion a very odd issue. Basically, the Orcs and Uruks and Trolls in LotR are "shadow creatures". They're not real, they're not people, they're evil monsters. This serves the plot fine, but it gets tangled in a lot of ways pre and post, both the setting and real world. Basically, we now dont really like "all orc bad" because it feels (and arguably is) problematic. Rings of Power keeps doing something much worse though, which is that they will *attempt* to nuance the monsters, but not bother to do it well or to spend any time with them. Imagine if Damrod had actually been a huge problem for Sauron, because he just wanted to live in a cave but Sauron forced him out, so he nearly kills Sauron with his immense strength. Imagine if he had breached the walls of the elf city single handedly, but only in order to gain the reputation required to meet Sauron so that he could try to kill him. Or, imagine if we *never* saw him opposed to Sauron, and he functioned as a formidable evil force and nothing more. Either of those would be much better than what we got. Orcs *cant* care about rations or babies or anything because if they do then they are people, and if theyre people you have to consider *why* they're doing this, what we do after Sauron is defeated, if we could convince them there's a better way, etc. Trolls *cant* be opposed to Sauron, because if they are then they have thoughts and feelings that must be considered.
@@eloryosnak4100 Indeed. Tolkien himself lamented his regret at not charactering the orcs and other forces of Mordor with more nuance and realism, but by then such a revision was just too much of a task and upset to him. In other words he didn't want them to be throw away shadow creatures with no moral considerations regarding their treatment.
Don't assume what you don't know. Tolkien only expressed his regret upon making orcs one dimensional evil creatures, but he didn't explain exactly what other way he would have them
What's with the Asian elf? Is she an Avari from the Far East around Dorwinon? Oh wait that would require the writers to have the bare understanding of the Lore, she's just another diversity insert
@@excursor4296 No you see these people don't actually care about black people and Eastern/African culture. (As we can see in the actual show when they do go south to the Harad region and they run into white people). They don't actually want to properly represent each culture, just sho horn in what they think society should be like
Grond's buildup was so fantastic. It's clear that the Orcs see it not as a macine, but as an infallible idol of destruction worthy of a name and acclaim. The unstoppable force to topple the immovable object that is Minas Tirith. The fact that they only deploy it in times of great need is proof of its history, exposing the super-weapon to battle is a risk that isn't taken lightly.
I think also think the semi real siege contraptions such as siege towers, catapults and even some trebuchets seen in "Return of the King" shows something similar to an ACTUAL battle. Even in helms deep with ladders being used more as the first tactic rather than blowing up the wall which they eventually do and takes a good chunk of time before it even happens. MOST sieges of castles or great cities are invaded using breaches in the wall, going underneath them or going over them rather than just DESTROYING the wall. Which is MILLIONS of times harder than people think. Obviously it's in a mythical land but doesn't mean it shouldn't lack any common sense. ESPECIALLY in a world that does have walls and castles that work in a similar way too most irl examples. To make a siege interesting or even just successful there NEEDS to be a plan, resources and TIME. There's only so much time you have to invade before you run out firepower, soldiers, money, food and keeping your men alive for the trip back to your homes. Idk this whole battle makes no sense even for orcs which have been shown that they need to eat, drink and have a plan made for them with siege weapons and firepower.
I think part of the problem is that the siege is supposed to be an actual siege. Not simply a storming like Minas Tirith was So, when we are told the wall is taking long to fall, and then is nearly breached, it's because the show was cutting over several days if not weeks of fighting Except, they fail to make it clear through dialogues or cues The elven army outside the wall flr example, is clearly engaging in raids and skyrmishes, with the scenes playing much alike to Dune montages of Fremen raids. But it's almost always night, we are never shown the elves setting up camp far away and then sortieing out and returning bloodied On the orc and city defenses side, the show fails to explicit the ebbs and flows of battle. It is normal for the elves to stand around doing nothing, but only if we had been previously shown the orcs stopping their assault to formulare a new plan This is all how real sieges went, but realism only works if you show it. Otherwise it just seems a very incoherent single battle
It freaked me out when they were talking thoughtfully on the very front wall. There are so many conflicting events in this series that harm credibility etc
Grond had other implications for those that had read the Silmarilion too, that was the name of Morgoth's personal weapon. It is said by some that this battering ram is the pommel of his mace, the presence of that ominous piece of history brought a lot more than mass to bear upon those gates. Hence the look of utter horror on Gandalf's face. I would also be scared if a piece of the literal origin of all evil and doom was about to come knocking at my door. Damrod on the other hand was just some dude. 🤣even an extraordinarily large and fierce hill troll would have been barely a threat to a mustered army of the elves of Eregion, their weapons pierced such creatures well. Although J.R.R. and his son after him Christopher never wrote the story of Eregion's fall in detail and to completion they were pretty clear that; a) it was not a protracted campaign of set piece battles, but rather whole kingdom was taken by surprise and storm b) Sauron was there in 'person' to punish Celebrimbor and his people. Which he did, brutally.
I think that's what makes Grond so compelling. It's intimidating on its own as a powerful siege weapon (and an example of orc ingenuity when it comes to making war) but if you know the history you truly understand WHY this is a big deal. Its not just a big ram, it's an embodiment of evil that echoes all the way back to the original dark lord. Like you said, it's no wonder it inspires such fear in Gandalf. And after writing this, we must ask, how did Amazon manage to make a BATTERING RAM more interesting than any of their actual characters? 😂
Too many idiots trying to write a scene will never pay off, because they'll just faceplant from tripping over one another's feet, and ruin the scenes more and more, trying to one up another
So the grond from rings of power is a troll and the Grond in return of the king is a giant battering ram that requires not only four huge beasts to move it but giant trolls to weild it. Which one is more impressive?
Its actually astounding just how terrible rings of power really is. It honestly seems like the writers all got together and said "how can we make the worse adaptation of Tolkiens work possible?" its insane
Common theme for cheeping out on action sequences and giant battles is having them at night so you don’t have to worry about crappy CGI. One of the biggest tv show budgets in history and it’s straight aids.
2:39 this part does strike me as a little weird tho. he is standing right next to the gate, so close hes might get hit by a stray arrow even. and, then he order them to bring up the real battering ram. what was it not there from the go to? is there an even stronger gate than the main gate of gondor they were saving it for? the scene looks cool im just not sure if it makes perfect sense.
What I find especially off-putting in these newer flicks is these low light battle scenes which are clearly just to save money on details - yeah, I don't need to worry about the background if no one can see anything
I hear all of medieval europe cringe at the idea of having a reversed ballista pull metal rods out of a castle wall, thinking that will do anything at all.
This is what happens when the motivation for making a show is simply financial, and nothing else. Watch the behind-the-scenes from Peter Jackson's LoTR. You can see the people that work on it truly believed in what they were doing. There was real passion, excitement and pride. But perhaps most important of all, Peter Jackson had a strong creative vision for the movies. He, and his team, were focused on that throughout the process. Christopher Lee was walking around with a copy of the novels and would quote stuff from it at Peter Jackson like it was the fucking bible whenever he disagreed with a creative decision. THEY CARED. A LOT. The Rings of Power feels.. Half-assed. They don't really care. It just has to make money. It lacks cohesion and vision. I strong suspect important creative decisions are made in the Amazon boardroom by executives, not by any creative like a director. It has that copied-homework with a few words changed feel to it. It's kinda sorta similar to LoTR. But it doesn't understand any of the elements that made it great. You can almost literally hear the executives in the boardroom go 'Just add some trolls and fire and shit.' And so the director, like a good little serf, adds 'some trolls and fire and shit'. And they get headpats for doing a great job, because it made money.
it just goes to show that Tolkien was a fantastic builder of tension in terms of writing. Peter jackson was able to take the Grond scene from the book and provide it visuals that most people who read the book agreed is how they imagined the scene when reading it. The rings of power is a cash grab that is using tiny snippets from the Return of king appendices as its only source and then attempting to just mimic the Jackson trilogies, but we all know Mimicry while flattery, often is far lesser than its inspiration.
NGL I actually felt bad for Damrod. When he first comes on the battlefield I felt like he was strolling through living his best life. I actually went aww when they hit his knee and I was like “Man they did not achieve what they wanted to with this dude, if I'm feeling bad for him.” 😂😂😂
Speaking of the siege ladders in "Rings of Power" in the show you showed and the dialog thereafter we can actually see how NOONE climbs those ladders. Or how the siege engie they blew up looked NOTHING like the "Ravageur".
the lighting did so much, i actually think the actors were good in both, but i could only see the faces and reactions of three or four of them in Rings of power, but i can see the reactions of everyone in LotR
What i find so bizarre is how small Rings of Power feels. The budget doesn’t translate to the end result at all. The Lord of the Rings is so much cheaper, and looks and feels massive. Where Rings of Power feels like small skirmishes for the big battles in both seasons
Feels like the good old Disney strategy! Copy the old movies and if people dislike the scene, blame the originals because it's their fault people don't like that scene.
@WestonBaraglia Its objectively not a decent show, even if it wasn't based on Tolkiens work. But, because it is based on Tolkiens work, and heavily borrows lines and even entire scenes from the PJ trilogy, it HAS to be compared. And when it is compared, it becomes even worse.
@@chopthatpanda ok fair enough, but you have to give it props where props is needed, the images are beautiful, some actors are doing great, and the visual makeup on orcs is amazing.
@WestonBaraglia where it's a great show? There are so many plotholes and irregularities inside, it's not fun to watch even when you dont know the silmarillion. Not to mention that the concept of time is not a thing inside the series. If the fact, for the most expensive series, that they got decent orc makeup and relative good cgi make it a decent show, your standards are pretty low...
"He finally makes it to the siege weapon, which he slams into the wall twice before dying."
What a payoff.
Dam, even in the hobbit 3rd movie the self deleting troll that headbutt the wall managed to do a better job
I expected nothing yet I am still disappointed.
We had multiple articles from the usual 'news' sites hyping up Damrod the troll, who the creators were so proud of, talking about how awesome he'd be and dropping the usual meaningless Breaking Bad references because that's like the only show these people have watched
His theme song gets more actual screen time than he does.....
that's not even a joke.
it's really hard to wrap your head around the incompetence of his show sometimes.
@@dorogundam At least that was comical and wasn't making an attempt at being serious
@andrewmeyer3599 whoever designed the blind stitched troll with no arms and legs was a fking sadist tho.
NO ONE learned that overly dark battles scenes don't tend to work from the battle of winter fell?
LOL
To be fair: It makes sense in the lore. Orcs are weakend by the sun and this time the orcs don't have the Nazghul or Sauron to block out the sun like in the battle of Minas Tirith.
@AlphariusCLH oh thats a load of pants
in two towers and return of the king we get night fights, but we also get to see whats going on too. and thats the same setting this is *supposed* to be in
so it doesnt make sense, its just lazy
They make it this way so they hide their chip CGIs
@@lordlossize That's fair, but the blueish night fights don't really fit in 2024. Night fights are nasty to make, Peter Jacksons solution was the blue filter but again: It's not very fitting for the current time. They still should have shown the true scales of both sides, it's not like that more realistic lighting would make that impossible. I still think it was a bad scene, I'm just saying that it makes sense that it was a night battle.
“Nothing can breach it”
“Let’s try my 100ft magical battering ram”
Siiii !!!
Irony is that given the fact that Rings of Power is set in the 2nd Age in a part of the Cannon that is underdeveloped they literally could have summoned a wide variety of of monsters to break the wall. It could have been a fucking Wingless fire, Drake. Instead we got a single Troll, one of the most well used siege weapons in Lord of The Rings by Mordor.
Can you imagine (in a world where they had competent writers so 90% of the story is different but the City is still being besieged by Orcs- they are still failing to break the wall.
The orc General calls for his "special weapon" (i would come up with some other euphemism such as "our guest" or "our pet" or "our companion") and a dragon comes walking out (a wingless Dragon which are pretty common in Tolkien)
The orc officers protests would make more sense as the dragon would roast and trample anything in its path paying zero respect for orc losses.
Basically, using the Dragon is like using a tacticl Nuke.
It's not magical
@@BartimaeusAurelius Grond? Yes it is. There is mention of it being enchanted with "Spells of Ruin", whatever that means, but the implication is that it is in some way magical.
@@MrChickennugget360
Only if believability goes out the window, show me any dragon who served Sauron
Those Mordor armoured trolls despite having less screen time were much more intimidating than damrod.
and these heavily armored trolls withstood less damage than Damrod. Why would they need a panxerz if a volley of arrows could defeat them?
@@rafaszejny5470 But since when has Mordor been famous for its perfectly armored troops? They're not tanks so I don't know what your stupid way of thinking expects.
@@rafaszejny5470 The trolls did withstand damage. The only way they were killed was with arrows to the neck. Damrod died barely 5 minutes into battle. And Saurons trolls were much higher in number. It's not about quality it's about quantity. Quality has never won a battle alone. Quantity has.
@@Mephisto579 Battle of Montgisard says otherwise
@@chickenmanman1015 One battle≠broad spectrum of statistics of said battles won by quantity alone.
I would like to add to the impact Grond had on something I never thought would be connected. There's a game named foxhole, basically WWI and WWII on one and I remember we were assaulting a fortified city and couldn't get through with hundreds of men and armor. After hours of this I saw the chat fill with chants: GROND GROND GROND. Every chat channel was filled with it as massive canons started barging the city and breaking their defences.
Till this day, whenever GROND is deployed the chants don't stop until GROND stops
That's terrifying
No, the sound of 300m artillerie shooting is scary, but the sound of getting hit is definitly worse
@FaucheurBis oh yeah but seeing all of chat being GROND GRIND GRON and a few ppl asking what is happening is just something
Foxhole mentioned, let the warden glazing begin
Fucking beautiful
I also really appreciate how not only did Grond terrify Gandalf and the defenders, it also really inspired the orcs, pretty impressive acting on behalf of those extras that you can sense their awe and fervour behind all those prosthetics and makeup
Glaze
Jackson did make tons of retakes because he wanted reactions and expressions to be just right.
The creators of South Park did a college lecture where they explained plot dynamics and script writing. Their whole point was that a plot and a script is not just a series of events, but a chain of causality. Thing one happens, which CAUSES thing two to happen, then BECAUSE thing two happened, thing three happens, THEREFORE thing four happens, BUT thing five is happening, which complicates thing four, and THEREFORE thing six happens, and so on. They joked that many amateur scripts, and even many Hollywood scripts, are just "thing one happened, and then thing two happened, and then thing three happened, and then-" without a clear chain of causality, continuity, or complication between story beats and events that thickens the plot or ups the ante.
You established a microcosm of this perfectly. The orcs are trying to take the city, BUT Gandalf and the defenders are putting up a good fight, THEREFORE the orcs try numerous different strategies to mixed success, HOWEVER they cannot breach the main gate, THEREFORE their attack has stalled out. BECAUSE they're not making progress quickly enough, they bring up Grond, and THOUGH the defenders fight valiantly, Grond breaks the gate. BECAUSE Grond breaks the gate, the defenders are now desperately fighting for their lives in the main courtyard and now they MUST abandon the lowest level and retreat further up into the city. At every point, there is clear causality, the overall tension rises, and the consequences of failure become greater and greater. This even leads into smaller moments, side beats, and breaks from the action. BECAUSE the orcs are trying to breach the gate to the second level, Pippin confides in Gandalf that he's afraid of dying here and now, THEREFORE Gandalf tells him about the peacefulness of the afterlife that awaits him, comforting him and giving the audience a gentle, emotionally intimate scene between the two, BUT we are brought back to reality by the orcs threatening to bust down the gate, and the story continues from there.
I haven't gotten around to watching Rings of Power, but every single thing I see makes me feel like the writers/directors/producers have all these ideas for story beats and epic scenes but they don't bother to connect them. It's just "and then, and then, and then, and then" without that continuity and causality that makes it a STORY. It's just a series of scenes, so the audience has no attachment to the motivations of the characters, and no pulse on the plot.
Agreed, well said.
Thanks for this , i could use this well for my worldbuilding
@@kgb976 I encourage you to go look up the lecture they gave. It's only a few minutes long, but it's very good advice for writing.
Jesus Christ this is well said, you're dead right
Same thing that went wrong in later seasons GOT: things happened, but there was little stringing it together. And 'moments of reflection' like that scene with Pippin and Gandalf, jsut didn't happen anymore. I call that History Channel cinema, where you are informed on the facts and the order that events happened but not on the why.
When a deleted scene is better than a whole episode
*better than 2 whole seasons
WHY was it even deleted?
@@alejandroelluxray5298 not really deleted, it's just only available on the extended edition
amen.
@@alejandroelluxray5298 time constraints. Movie is already plenty long for a theatre release, they had to cut some parts out.
And although the Grond scene is well made and serves a purpose, it overall isn't needed for the story overall. So it got cut.
"Great engines crawled across the field; and in the midst was a huge ram, great as a forest-tree a hundred feet in length, swinging on mighty chains. Long had it been forging in the dark smithies of Mordor, and its hideous head, founded of black steel, was shaped in the likeness of a ravening wolf; on it spells of ruin lay. Grond they named it, in memory of the Hammer of the Underworld of old. Great beasts drew it, orcs surrounded it, and behind walked mountain-trolls to wield it."
The Orcs of Mordor bellow and chant to Grond as if it was a living god of war.
the trolls in the lotr trilogy are 1000 times scarier and dangerous, remember that cavetroll in the first movie he wasn't even any armored killing machine forged by sauron, it was just a cavetroll and when he came bursting through that door it was a massive "OH SHIT" moment.
the amored trolls in minas also tirith didn't only burst through the first line of defence like it wasn't even there, they were leading the charge capturing the entire city and if it wasn't for aragorns cursed army arriving last second they would have captured the city without problem, trolls basically carried the entire siege.
Yah I think one thing both the Hobbit trilogy and RoP failed with is not making the trolls scary. They are big but also borderline silly in their actions and pretty common to see.
In the original trilogy trolls were big, behaved more feral than silly, and were rare. You would only come close to them a handful of times and they were always scary when you did
@@tylerjohn4607 To be fair, the hobbit the 3 trolls at the start were supposed to be silly and squabeling. since it is a children book.
The battle of 5 armies trolls were just straight up silly for no reason however, since they werent even supossed to be there to begin with
My boi really just call Olog-Hai simple armored trolls. . . . .HR will hear of this.
100% true, that first cavetroll in Fellowship takes a TEAM of legendary warriors and a wizard to defeat!
I dont know it is fully canon perse but BFME2: Rise of the Witch King portrays Trolls and Olag-Hais to be wayyyy smarter and also with bloodlust rather than feral and dummy which makes them super scary consedering that there was a Troll Swordsman whom was a master of using swords lead his race to serve Witch King of Angmar. In Return of the King they were good, but in hobbit and this cesspit naaaaah. I guess they forgot how to "troll" pun intended.
Eregion was supposed to have millions of orcs. ROP for having such a large budget sure did cheap out on the numbers.
All money vent to diversity division
I HATE how small RoP feels. Middle-earth feels like a tiny place with a few villages here and there.
@Kloakentaucher They should have let Peter Jackson do the work. He at least can get the job done. He had some flaws in the hobbit films but still he at least didn't cheap out on the orcs.
Yes totally, at this point not only Sauron, but many other factions are meant to be far more powerful than in LOTR. Númenor especially, in ROP they look like a tiny port city, while in the lore, Númenor was extremely mighty and powerful. In this war Sauron's army would be utterly crushed, leaving a few at most , while late in the Second Age Sauron's massive armies would flee just at the sight of Númenor's army, so that should say a lot.
@ThalattaHaralus Exactly. Especially after the war of wrath which in itself sunk Beleriand. Morgoth lost his army but that was mostly his legions of balrogs, dragons, and other large beasts. Orcs were still in crazy abundance. Sauron had a vast army of the morgul host at his disposal.
Get into reading, kids. TV and movies are gonna suck for many years to come.
Indeed. Sadly, that's what it looks like.
Surprisingly, I haven't heard or read a bad book so far (Just started on the Wild Robot). It really is TV or movie adaptations that sucks hard XD
@@joshidejjmany books were wrote in a time when writers actually cared about making an story and not complacing the 1% of the population
AI books. Get into reading old books.
Pretentious elitism nonsense. There are plenty of good movies and shows being made today, you muppets are just more vocal about the bad stuff.
I’m just saying, I started chanting for Grond too
It's muscle memory for me at this point. It just happens automatically.
ROP was truly horrendous
It continues to surprise me. lol
Truly
Facts
ROP needs an E rope so I can hang myself :/ worst adaptation of anything ever
@@SoppysTakes Honesly I like Witcher 3 trolls better
I feel blessed that I was a kid when Peter Jackson created his Magnum Opus in 2001. Nothing will get near it in the foreseeable future but Rings of Power? Not even close.
There's another great detail in ROTK that Silmarillion fans will notice: Grond was the name of Morgoth's hammer, and Sauron imbued it with some dark magic if I recall correctly. So the orcs are chanting the name of the bludgeoning weapon of an evil old god while the imposing hammer creeps steadily towards the last defense of the world of men. It's no wonder Gandalf decided it was all hands on deck for this weapon in that moment. Crucially, the audience not only doesn't need to know this to appreciate the dread, but we *don't need it to be explained to us*
Grond also had magic attributes
It was enchanted by the Witch King and destroyed the gate of Minas Tirith in a single hit.
3 hits, also Minas Tirith Gate was made of iron, not wood like in movie
Iirc in the books the gates of minas tirith are made of mithril and embued with dwarven runes
@@Tamajyn69 the gate of Minas Tirith was replaced into Mithril after the events of Sauron's demise.
@@Tamajyn69 No, iirc, the gates in the book that are made of mithril and enchanted by dwarves are gates gifted by the dwarves to Gondor after the end of the war of the ring to replace the iron gate that was broken during the battle of the pelennor fields
This video popped off for you, well done!
Thank you ☺
totally agree, i came accross a youtube clip of damrod when he asks for Sauron, so i imagined him to be a very powerful creature, then i watched this scene and i was like... what he dies do a couple arrows and 2 sword hits ????
It's so anti-climatic.
so pretty much an elephant sized ant searching for an ant sized elephant 🤣
lol I actually felt bad for the dude. He felt more like blundering doofus to me but in a likable way.
I'm just constantly in awe of how RoP managed to make every orc, troll, or any other creature look SO DERPY. I laughed audibly the first time we got a good look at a RoP Warg. It looked more like a hyena from the Lion King cartoon than a ferocious beast. This big troll boy was such a disappointment, and he just looked so stupid
The humanising of the orcs and giving them a family aspect was crazy, i much prefer them crawling from mudpits craving flesh then what ROP did with them.
"KATMUNDA" "GOROSH"
"KATMUNDA" "GOROSH"
"KATMUNDA" "GOROSH CHADAR"
That set the tone for The Battle of Minas Tirith
The scene is like 50sec long and in my opinion its easily in the top 10 most epic scenes in Lotr :)
LOTR : DEATH TO MEN!
ROP : I LOVE YOU MEN!
this was so good cant believe this is just her 3rd vid, aunt need more subs
An entertaing battle scene is back-and forth, a good villain should be dynamic and dangerous, so naturally our heroes must be too. Moments of heroism, strategy, tragedy and bravery all make for a good film battle. After all the fight itself is secondary, the characters and the stakes at risk is what makes it exciting, otherwise you just get the dull satisfaction of a 'cool fight'.
Safe to say, ROP doesn't even offer that. It is good fun to watch Amazon throw their money in a big hole though.
It's truly astounding they couldn't come up with any of that.
"Wasn't even that spectacular to watch, it was really pretty pathetic" I am glad I stopped after season 1...
That was a good call
I like d it
I will say season 2 was a lot better than season 1, but it wasn't good or great by any means.
I couldnt even finish episode one… i stopped at the ‘why do boats sink while stones float’ or whatever bullshit
Oh my god so THIS is the extended editions content .... Iv been so ignorant to how much lord of the rings iv missed
yo you need to see the extended LOTR stat
The extended versions are soooo good man
@@Dr.HeimskrThe theatrical versions are better.
Even the name Grond likely strikes fear into the men of Gondor who heard it from the ancient elves. Grond was the name of Melkor's warhammer, Sauron's master and the greatest dark lord. That name alone would strike fear into the elves and high men of gondor as much as glamdring the foehammer does to the goblins
"He Wields The Foe Hammer! The Beater Bright as Daylight!"
-Goblin King.
Also the armored troll charged in and started a bloodbath.
Here the troll seems to nonchalantly walk toward the wall, playing baseball with an elf or an orc.
Like, is it friday's last shift? He looks a bit done with all this mess
There were so many way Damrod could’ve been cool and intimidating/terrifying, instead he died like a chump (by the way why did the writers think I’d make sense to give the ‘oh shi moment’ no armor? Yeah a hill troll is strong but it can’t take an onslaught of arrows for long butt naked)
Yeah. He looks like he's drunk and in a pissy mood, and has been kicked out of the house to go for a walk and cool off. Not taking things seriously only makes an enemy intimidating if they have the power to back it up, which Damrod absolutely did not.
You could even throw the Berserker Uruk-hai who breached the Deeping Wall as another comparison. Peter Jackson got it right twice in a row (except for maybe the whole Legolas thing).
I like the way they kind ahalf revealed the troll, the flaming catapult firing to illuminate the silhouette of this large beast in the distant coming out of the woods towards them is a nice entrance leading up to what should have been a better reveal. However literally what would solve all the problems you mentioned about adding suspense, progression, cause and solution to the lack of progression in the seige and why the orks are running, adding tension and raising the stakes and showcasing scale AND be a dope badass scene... Is simply add like 15+ more trolls allong that tree line, with only a couple being illuminated to showcase the imminent threat while also not revealing it all to early...
Rings of power is like bunch of 5y old kids trying to tell a story whole interrupting each other all the time.
Great content, I hope your channel takes off! I've never seen this travesty of a show so this was super helpful. Also wtf is with studios doing all these nighttime battles with ZERO lighting. Who's out here asking for this garbage?
Remember in LOTR when one single unarmed and unarmored cave took the whole cast combined to bring down and even then they really only managed it by luck?
Then later in Minas Tirith you see ARMORED AND ARMED TROLLS burst through the gates and mow through a small army with ease and you are personally TERRIFIED by the fact that something that is already that big a threat CAN STILL BE A BIGGER THREAT?
This isn't that. It really isn't. This Damrod guy is just a basic level mook in a troll suit.
Not all Trolls are equal
and in the book they stapped him and he retreated
@thodan467 I know. But, uh, this ain't even a troll. This is just an orc that looks like a troll but goes down easy as an orc.
@
Remember how Pippin slew and Olog Hai.
The Mistake is to think every Orc , Troll etc must be good at fighting....
@thodan467 Yeah, but orcs don't chant your darn name excitedly and play hype man for a mook who goes down in two rounds.
@@GuukanKitsune
Tolkien did not write DnD or videogames, this makes no difference.
The WK went down in a few seconds with 2 hits.
Saruman by a stab with a knife, pippins Olog Hai with one hit
I always wondered, why they did not use the Software "MASSIVE", that Jackson used back in the day to simulate the huge battles that LotR was so known for... In comparison it always looks silly.
I no nothing about MASSIVE, but this sounds like a case of the tech just being lost, or locked in someones vault, like the Nemesis System, speaking of LOTR.
Really cool video. Summed up my thoughts pretty well. RoP's battle had no sense of stakes, it felt like something attempting to tick items off a list, not caring much whether they fit together or not.
The evilforces were larger back in time then in the attack of Minas tirith... So... If Sauron had that amount of trolls in minas tirith.... If Azog had the amount of trolls in the hobbit.... Adar should have had fukn 80 Trolls he could have used in this fukn fight!
Damond is that one neighbor that always mows shirtless during the summer
Oh I love battles in pitch black darkness. /s
You know know we were able to see everything in the battle for helms deep even though it was nighttime.
That hill troll is so pathetic that it makes Dreamworks trolls look like formidable beasts of battle
1 milliard for empty scene ...
In businessmens pocket
That series is scam
This was very well done, and made me subscribe to your channel. I hope you continue to have such success.
The elves of ERRRRRrrrrrrregion being invaded by millions of orcs was like "I hear something. Must've been the wind." Whenever I see RaNgS oF pOwER, I cleanse my eyes, brain, body, and soul by watching more Lord of the Rings.
It was a sort of funny plot hole in LOTR that they brought a gigantic battering ram to the battle and seemingly forgot about it
It's generally wise to test the enemies defences before deploying all your options, especially when you have numbers to spare.
"He will kill our own!"
In the battle for Helm's Deep, they bring a battering ram up through the centre of the uruk-hai on the stone ramp, but because their ranks fill the ramp side to side, they intentionally knock off a bunch of them to bring the ram forward. I feel like a scene as simple as this demonstrates just how uncaring the forces of mordor are for their own in the aim of ultimate victory.
Meanwhile, in the rings of power, you have a scene of an ork taking care of his ork baby and ork wife whilst complaining about rations.
???
LotR has what is in my opinion a very odd issue. Basically, the Orcs and Uruks and Trolls in LotR are "shadow creatures". They're not real, they're not people, they're evil monsters.
This serves the plot fine, but it gets tangled in a lot of ways pre and post, both the setting and real world.
Basically, we now dont really like "all orc bad" because it feels (and arguably is) problematic.
Rings of Power keeps doing something much worse though, which is that they will *attempt* to nuance the monsters, but not bother to do it well or to spend any time with them.
Imagine if Damrod had actually been a huge problem for Sauron, because he just wanted to live in a cave but Sauron forced him out, so he nearly kills Sauron with his immense strength.
Imagine if he had breached the walls of the elf city single handedly, but only in order to gain the reputation required to meet Sauron so that he could try to kill him.
Or, imagine if we *never* saw him opposed to Sauron, and he functioned as a formidable evil force and nothing more.
Either of those would be much better than what we got.
Orcs *cant* care about rations or babies or anything because if they do then they are people, and if theyre people you have to consider *why* they're doing this, what we do after Sauron is defeated, if we could convince them there's a better way, etc.
Trolls *cant* be opposed to Sauron, because if they are then they have thoughts and feelings that must be considered.
@@eloryosnak4100
Indeed. Tolkien himself lamented his regret at not charactering the orcs and other forces of Mordor with more nuance and realism, but by then such a revision was just too much of a task and upset to him. In other words he didn't want them to be throw away shadow creatures with no moral considerations regarding their treatment.
Damb, you couldve written "I'm gay" in so many ways but you chose this elaborate one
Don't assume what you don't know. Tolkien only expressed his regret upon making orcs one dimensional evil creatures, but he didn't explain exactly what other way he would have them
@
Watch as nobody takes you seriously 🙂
Great video! Couldn’t agree more
Thanks! ☺
What's with the Asian elf? Is she an Avari from the Far East around Dorwinon?
Oh wait that would require the writers to have the bare understanding of the Lore, she's just another diversity insert
When I heard "Black Elfs" I got so stoked that there would be Harrad, the Blue Wizards, what kind of elven realm would exist there. . . . . . .
@@excursor4296 No you see these people don't actually care about black people and Eastern/African culture. (As we can see in the actual show when they do go south to the Harad region and they run into white people). They don't actually want to properly represent each culture, just sho horn in what they think society should be like
@@excursor4296 same xD
Grond's buildup was so fantastic. It's clear that the Orcs see it not as a macine, but as an infallible idol of destruction worthy of a name and acclaim. The unstoppable force to topple the immovable object that is Minas Tirith.
The fact that they only deploy it in times of great need is proof of its history, exposing the super-weapon to battle is a risk that isn't taken lightly.
I think also think the semi real siege contraptions such as siege towers, catapults and even some trebuchets seen in "Return of the King" shows something similar to an ACTUAL battle. Even in helms deep with ladders being used more as the first tactic rather than blowing up the wall which they eventually do and takes a good chunk of time before it even happens. MOST sieges of castles or great cities are invaded using breaches in the wall, going underneath them or going over them rather than just DESTROYING the wall. Which is MILLIONS of times harder than people think.
Obviously it's in a mythical land but doesn't mean it shouldn't lack any common sense. ESPECIALLY in a world that does have walls and castles that work in a similar way too most irl examples. To make a siege interesting or even just successful there NEEDS to be a plan, resources and TIME. There's only so much time you have to invade before you run out firepower, soldiers, money, food and keeping your men alive for the trip back to your homes. Idk this whole battle makes no sense even for orcs which have been shown that they need to eat, drink and have a plan made for them with siege weapons and firepower.
perfect perfect analysis!!!! thanks!
Guess we got trolled.
I think part of the problem is that the siege is supposed to be an actual siege. Not simply a storming like Minas Tirith was
So, when we are told the wall is taking long to fall, and then is nearly breached, it's because the show was cutting over several days if not weeks of fighting
Except, they fail to make it clear through dialogues or cues
The elven army outside the wall flr example, is clearly engaging in raids and skyrmishes, with the scenes playing much alike to Dune montages of Fremen raids. But it's almost always night, we are never shown the elves setting up camp far away and then sortieing out and returning bloodied
On the orc and city defenses side, the show fails to explicit the ebbs and flows of battle. It is normal for the elves to stand around doing nothing, but only if we had been previously shown the orcs stopping their assault to formulare a new plan
This is all how real sieges went, but realism only works if you show it. Otherwise it just seems a very incoherent single battle
It freaked me out when they were talking thoughtfully on the very front wall. There are so many conflicting events in this series that harm credibility etc
I remember thinking the Hobbit movies were a letdown. Holy shit how times have changed.
At this point, if the ROP was at the same level as the Hobbit movies I'd be fine with that lol
Grond had other implications for those that had read the Silmarilion too, that was the name of Morgoth's personal weapon. It is said by some that this battering ram is the pommel of his mace,
the presence of that ominous piece of history brought a lot more than mass to bear upon those gates. Hence the look of utter horror on Gandalf's face. I would also be scared if a piece of the literal origin of all evil and doom was about to come knocking at my door.
Damrod on the other hand was just some dude. 🤣even an extraordinarily large and fierce hill troll would have been barely a threat to a mustered army of the elves of Eregion, their weapons pierced such creatures well.
Although J.R.R. and his son after him Christopher never wrote the story of Eregion's fall in detail and to completion they were pretty clear that; a) it was not a protracted campaign of set piece battles, but rather whole kingdom was taken by surprise and storm b) Sauron was there in 'person' to punish Celebrimbor and his people. Which he did, brutally.
Agreed.
@@SoppysTakes
I think that's what makes Grond so compelling. It's intimidating on its own as a powerful siege weapon (and an example of orc ingenuity when it comes to making war) but if you know the history you truly understand WHY this is a big deal. Its not just a big ram, it's an embodiment of evil that echoes all the way back to the original dark lord. Like you said, it's no wonder it inspires such fear in Gandalf.
And after writing this, we must ask, how did Amazon manage to make a BATTERING RAM more interesting than any of their actual characters? 😂
Too many idiots trying to write a scene will never pay off, because they'll just faceplant from tripping over one another's feet, and ruin the scenes more and more, trying to one up another
damrod is less threatening than any of the random trolls during LOTR
An excellent video!
thank you :)
4:15 If not Shelob then this was the moment that scared me the most as a kid.
The troll from the Rings of Power just looks embarrassed to even be there
Damrod only served to make discount Legolas look cool and that was it.
So the grond from rings of power is a troll and the Grond in return of the king is a giant battering ram that requires not only four huge beasts to move it but giant trolls to weild it. Which one is more impressive?
When a literal inanimate object has more personality and is better written than the entirety of your show, you know it's bad.
Its actually astounding just how terrible rings of power really is. It honestly seems like the writers all got together and said "how can we make the worse adaptation of Tolkiens work possible?" its insane
Common theme for cheeping out on action sequences and giant battles is having them at night so you don’t have to worry about crappy CGI. One of the biggest tv show budgets in history and it’s straight aids.
I couldn’t see anything during the Rings of Power fight I thought they were shadows 😂
Lol wait what? Orcs melting in the sunlight? since when? At most they get weak from it(woozy and wobbly) only stone trolls turn to stone at sunrise.
Great vid, subbed ❤
97 Subscribers, thought this was full-time professional channel, high quality !
soppy, that was a pretty good take
thanks man 😄
2:39 this part does strike me as a little weird tho. he is standing right next to the gate, so close hes might get hit by a stray arrow even. and, then he order them to bring up the real battering ram. what was it not there from the go to? is there an even stronger gate than the main gate of gondor they were saving it for? the scene looks cool im just not sure if it makes perfect sense.
They waited because grond took sevral hours to get there and trying with a normal ram cant hurt and if it works it would save lots of time
Why does Eregeon even have a “thinnest part”? The wall was built by the elves it shouldn’t have a weakest part lmfao
What I find especially off-putting in these newer flicks is these low light battle scenes which are clearly just to save money on details - yeah, I don't need to worry about the background if no one can see anything
Sadest part is that this battle is by far the best scene in ring of power so far - idk y but this show just doesn’t have a lot of soul at least rn
Just bland and soulless
Even the battering ram troll from The Hobbit was MUCH better lmao
Lmao, I had to up the brightness when scenes of rings of power were shown, oh how cinematography has fallen
do his lips not move??? did they have to put his audio over because he didnt act at all???
I hear all of medieval europe cringe at the idea of having a reversed ballista pull metal rods out of a castle wall, thinking that will do anything at all.
I have never been so happy, that I quit a show after 10 minutes.
Damrod, unlike Grond, did not crawl on.
This is what happens when the motivation for making a show is simply financial, and nothing else. Watch the behind-the-scenes from Peter Jackson's LoTR. You can see the people that work on it truly believed in what they were doing. There was real passion, excitement and pride. But perhaps most important of all, Peter Jackson had a strong creative vision for the movies. He, and his team, were focused on that throughout the process. Christopher Lee was walking around with a copy of the novels and would quote stuff from it at Peter Jackson like it was the fucking bible whenever he disagreed with a creative decision. THEY CARED. A LOT.
The Rings of Power feels.. Half-assed. They don't really care. It just has to make money. It lacks cohesion and vision. I strong suspect important creative decisions are made in the Amazon boardroom by executives, not by any creative like a director. It has that copied-homework with a few words changed feel to it. It's kinda sorta similar to LoTR. But it doesn't understand any of the elements that made it great. You can almost literally hear the executives in the boardroom go 'Just add some trolls and fire and shit.' And so the director, like a good little serf, adds 'some trolls and fire and shit'. And they get headpats for doing a great job, because it made money.
Agreed.
it just goes to show that Tolkien was a fantastic builder of tension in terms of writing. Peter jackson was able to take the Grond scene from the book and provide it visuals that most people who read the book agreed is how they imagined the scene when reading it. The rings of power is a cash grab that is using tiny snippets from the Return of king appendices as its only source and then attempting to just mimic the Jackson trilogies, but we all know Mimicry while flattery, often is far lesser than its inspiration.
Agreed
What’s hilarious is that we know Amazon has a budget, yet they can’t manage to give us a compelling battle scene.
you'd think the battle sequences would at least be good with that big of a budget lol
I hope you make more videos
NGL I actually felt bad for Damrod. When he first comes on the battlefield I felt like he was strolling through living his best life. I actually went aww when they hit his knee and I was like “Man they did not achieve what they wanted to with this dude, if I'm feeling bad for him.” 😂😂😂
Agreed hahaha, that's how sad and pathetic his whole role was
Speaking of the siege ladders in "Rings of Power" in the show you showed and the dialog thereafter we can actually see how NOONE climbs those ladders.
Or how the siege engie they blew up looked NOTHING like the "Ravageur".
good vid
Great comparison
Cool video, I haven’t felt the need to watch this show yet. I hear nothing good.
Good call.
the lighting did so much, i actually think the actors were good in both, but i could only see the faces and reactions of three or four of them in Rings of power, but i can see the reactions of everyone in LotR
I wish we got to see more of the olog-hai in lord of the rings
Well. What could we expect from fanfiction!? 😂
That whole battle sequence in RoP is a mess
What i find so bizarre is how small Rings of Power feels. The budget doesn’t translate to the end result at all. The Lord of the Rings is so much cheaper, and looks and feels massive. Where Rings of Power feels like small skirmishes for the big battles in both seasons
What is it with these newer series and the absolute lack of light. First game of thrones season 8 and now this??
One battle cost less then the other altogether, guess which one?
Feels like the good old Disney strategy! Copy the old movies and if people dislike the scene, blame the originals because it's their fault people don't like that scene.
This is the thinnest part of the wall (previous episode, what wall?)
Eregion felt empty
fog of war, error judgement, incompetence, panic
So ROP is waist of time, that's unfortunate
yeeep, it is really unfortunate.
It’s a decent show, people just hate on it cause it has to live up to lord of the rings.
@WestonBaraglia Its objectively not a decent show, even if it wasn't based on Tolkiens work. But, because it is based on Tolkiens work, and heavily borrows lines and even entire scenes from the PJ trilogy, it HAS to be compared. And when it is compared, it becomes even worse.
@@chopthatpanda ok fair enough, but you have to give it props where props is needed, the images are beautiful, some actors are doing great, and the visual makeup on orcs is amazing.
@WestonBaraglia where it's a great show? There are so many plotholes and irregularities inside, it's not fun to watch even when you dont know the silmarillion. Not to mention that the concept of time is not a thing inside the series.
If the fact, for the most expensive series, that they got decent orc makeup and relative good cgi make it a decent show, your standards are pretty low...
they are still making this shit?