Great video Austin. I used to be a Muslim, but I then left Islam for Orthodoxy. From my studies, the theology of Orthodoxy is sound and based in history. The spiritual life also, as an Orthodox Christian, is… indescribable (and that is an understatement). May God guide and bless us all! God bless you.
Beautiful brother!! Please what led you to Orthodoxy? Would love to hear your story. I know there are also many similarities Bcz Orthodox we also do prostrations when praying, we face certain directions 🧭 (East) when praying or attending liturgy and also our churches face East and are sometimes dome shape like in Islam. And lots of fasting. Mohammad copied many things from early Christianity which he admired. He was just an Iconoclast and didn’t agree with icons (seeing it as idolatry) so he invented his new religion (or a satanic apparition appeared to him), but either way. We also do lots of prayers throughout our day or week. Would love to also hear your comparison of it.
Becoming orthodox is probably one of the most difficult things any westerner, especially Protestant, will do. It will cost you everything. Your community, your career, your Family, Former friends, “brothers and sister in Christ” and those who have said they love you will reject and persecute you. Calling you an idol worshiper, and Mary worshiper, they no longer understand you and don’t relate to you. You are weird, and doing some other thing now, “we should pray for him, he’s lost” They will tell you what you believe and make you defend it. You mostly likely will feel alone from all this. Orthodoxy in America is not like the comfortable evangelical community in America with a church on every corner and you pick your favorite. In any social setting someone might ask where you go to church and as soon as you say “st….” They have judged you and categorized you as “ReLiGioUS” in other social settings they will make jokes at your expense, because they are right and you are wrong. You will be challenged. It will cost you what you believe to be your ticket to heaven. You go from knowing you are saved, to seeking Gods true forgiveness with every prayer Your pride will be broke from everything you thought you knew. It’s is a humble and meek journey.I know with certainty It was the best decision i made correctly that the Lord led me to. He tells us to leave everything and follow him. We are called to worship according to his will regardless of how we like or feel about it. Contrary to what I always believed as a Protestant, it’s not about me. It is all about the Lord Jesus Christ. I pray God has mercy on me, a sinner.
Your write up reminds me of my journey from being Roman Catholic. I was never confirmed but was told by my mom this is something for me to figure out and to decide but that I will be accepted either way. When I became orthodox and then when my brother wanted to be received into orthodoxy she was very defensive. He was crossing himself in the orthodox manner and was disturbed telling him hes wrong and that we are idol worshipers. She thought my conversion was due to having some strange obsession with Russia. The scriptures talks about what happens when we love Christ. And when I heard that I knew I was home in his Church, in communion with him. My mother eventually came around, She hasn't gone to any church in the last 10 years but said that we are Roman Catholic and we go to a Roman Catholic Church. The people who react this way know little about their own faith and have little affiliation with it and turn their unbelief around to make us look crazy or lost. I would be delighted to speak with you and pray you receive love from your Orthodox brothers and sisters.
I love this comment. I feel the same experience from my protestant family, but they don't talk religion with me at all anymore. They did come to my Orthodox wedding though and respected it. Being that my particular area has such a big Roman Catholic presence (The Roman Bishop being 25 minutes away) I find myself befriending many Catholics and us having a common respect for each other and our traditions.
@@theworldbeforeus1775 This rings so true... I have to remain calm and understand the ignorance my family members have. Unfortunately, they hurl accusations at me way before trying to understand the situation. They also thing I have an obsession with Russia, and maybe it is true, only to the extent that it is the current guardian of the Orthodox faith in the world.
The Orthodox Church is the toughest thing I have ever participated in. I wouldn't trade that for anything. My Mormon relatives hate me. My Southern Baptist relatives scratch their heads and wonder why I didn't become one of them. My wife, half of my kids, and now some of my grandchildren hold this as the true Pearl of Great Price.
When I came to the Orthodox Church I went from a legalist fearing that I was a spider hanging over hell. To a church where God is a lover of mankind and desires a deepening and growing relationship and it is on me to work at it.
I've been cautiously approaching Orthodoxy, and I love this aspect that you pointed out, but what's terrifying is the idea that God's love really does seem conditional on being a part of the Canonical Church, at least, as far as Church canons have spoken, as well as Ss. Cyprian and Augustine. I look at a Coptic or Syrian Oriental Orthodox, and I simply can't see how it is that one Eucharist is the life-giving Body of Christ and the other (as St. John of Shanghai/San Francisco called it,) "demon food". It is an incredibly massive cognitive dissonance that has given me months of existential terror: Protestant/Catholic notions of penal substitution are barbaric and incomplete and lack the love Christ has for us, and simultaneously all those "Christians" might as well be damned because none of their sacraments have any efficacy, regardless of how much those "Christians" might genuinely weep with joy for what Christ has done for them (but really hasn't because they are not actually in the Church).
@@j.athanasius9832 good thing the only thing one needs to be a Christian is believing in Christ and Him being your Lord and Savior. The elements are good and all, but they aren’t a requirement for Heaven.
I heard a description a while back of the true relationship between us and God. I know its in the bible as well We are like a ragged whore destitute and abandoned. In that state the king begins to woo us. Most of us are so broken we flee to our drunken abusers, but the king follows and continues to woo us. When we give in he binds our wounds and dresses us. And then we fall back into our whorish ways and he woos us back again.
_God is a lover of mankind_ As someone who is learning about orthodoxy, this statement doesn't entirely jive with the fact that some Orthodox Christians believe that other Nicean believing, apostles' and Athanasian creed affirming Christians are going to hell because they're not part of their church
As a Protestant or Catholic or any other religion, you are not part of the Church Christ created on the day of Pentacost. The only salvation WE KNOW OF is in the one catholic and apostolic church, the Eastern Orthodox church. But God can do anything. Look at the thief on the cross. It is not for an Orthodox Christian to know if someone else is saved, or not. Only God knows who He will save outside of the Church and what His criteria are.
As far as your concern about not being able to be western to be Orthodox, listen to St. John of Xianghai, "One must never feel that he has to be Eastern to be Orthodox. The West was Orthodox for 1000 years". Far from being strange or disingenuous, the Orthodox Church IS part of the heritage of the West too :D
Cope. Eastern Orthodoxy lacks relevance. It plays a very small part on the world stage. It’s obvious Catholicism is the true church and even non-believers recognize that and treat the Catholic Church as such.
Austin, you mentioned that "the journey is far from over" in the description for this video concerning Orthodoxy, so pleased to see that. I can tell you (personally speaking) that once one does make the decision to become Orthodox, the journey remains very far from being over; in so many ways it is just the beggining.
Whatever your reflections on Orthodoxy are at the moment, you've been a wonderful facilitator in introducing many great minds to this Orthodox convert. I will be forever touched by your interview with the sweet and loving Fr. Seraphim Aldea of Mull Monastery. Christ is risen!
That interview killed my Evangelical positivist, rationalist, intellectual arguments in opposition to Holy Orthodoxy. I knew that whatever he was doing was clearly working and what I was doing wasn't. I've never seen Christ-like love like that in another human being as clearly than in that monk. Clearly the Orthodox Church shows the way to Theosis.
As a person who grew up Roman Catholic, lived a robust life of participation in the RCC, including four years of monastic life and over a decade as a lay ecclesial minister, who then, after almost two decades of being drawn to deeper engagement with the entire tradition of Orthodox Christianity, finally became an orthodox Christian about a decade ago, I want to say that I really like the way you talk about this. I also appreciate from my perspective as a pastoral psychotherapist. The process of unmooring from the tradition in which you grew up and were formed to seek, follow and know Christ is profoundly disturbing, and I would not recommend it unless you have forged a profound commitment to following Christ wherever Christ leads. That said, I also don’t think it is a good idea to become a catechumen until and unless you are doing so from a movement of joy at what you’ve seen in the Orthodox church, and are driven by love to give yourself fully to Christ in and through his Body, which you have become convinced is the Orthodox Church. I’ve learned over the past decade that there is vastly more difference than I thought between Orthodox Christianity and even Roman Catholicism, and that I still have so much more to learn. Whether you want to be Orthodox or not is not something I can know, and I don’t think anyone should do so without first having recognized that it is a way of surrendering reliance on one’s own ability to “think it through.” I mean, we should definitely think with sobriety and diligence about such weighty matters, but ultimately, the faith is more given than figured out. I applaud your investigation of how one best goes about being a disciple of Jesus, and appreciate your sharing your journey and thoughts. May your search lead you ever more fully into the arms of our loving God!
Thank you for sharing your experience. I grew up a fundamentalist Baptist, although through my teen years my mother no longer attended any church. I converted to an Apostolic Pentecostal church in my twenties, but quickly fell away... "All fire, but no fireplace," as Fr. Barnabas Powell says. I spent my thirties as an atheist, then Taoist, Buddhist, occultist, finally ending up a more or less agnostic deist in my mid-forties. All through all of that, I couldn't get away from Jesus- I could always sense Him there, waiting in the wings, so to speak. I denied His very existence, refuted Him, denounced Him, insulted Him, mocked His Holy Name (God forgive me), and still in moments of dire need I would feel the urge to speak to Him in prayer. In the past few years, I sought to figure out what I believed. About a year ago, I asked God, if He was real, and really there listening, to let me know Who He was. And slowly I felt Him returning into my heart and mind, over months, as I opened up and prayed a little more often... Still unsure who I was even talking to, not wanting to believe, yet being led little by little. Finally, in September of this year, I was completely broken by a personal loss in my family. I confessed to God my belief in Him, I asked Him to forgive me, although I was still hesitant and stiff-necked, my heart still mostly hardened against Him. At the end of October, I experienced another breaking moment, and my heart was shattered. Not so much for myself this time, but for the world, and what I saw happening in it. I hit my knees, literally, for the first time in decades, and wept before God, begging His forgiveness, to please help us all, to help me be what He wanted. I began to read the Scriptures again for the first time in a very, very long time. I prayed every night before sleep that He show me which way to go-- I didn't want to go back to a Pentecostal church; I had spent a couple of years recently as a hired musician in a Methodist church, and while I admired the simple love of others in the congregants, there was a worldliness there that I found unappealing... But I was willing to go wherever He wanted me. "Unwillingly willing," one might say lol. Exactly a week later, I spoke with my oldest friend, someone who is like a brother to me whom I've known all my life, but who I didn't talk to very often any more. We'd last spoken several months to a year prior, and I remembered at the time he'd said he was exploring "Orthodoxy"-- I didn't ask at the time what exactly that meant. I knew nothing about the Orthodox Church, except that there was an episode of 'Seinfeld' where it featured, and I had some vague ideas about Eastern European "national" churches but was unsure what it entailed, despite having been interested in religion and spiritual traditions since childhood. My old friend was emailing me to let me know that a mutual, older friend of ours had passed away in an accident. We commiserated over his passing briefly, and then began to talk about other things. Specifically, I told him that I'd begun to pray again, had rededicated myself to Christ. He told me that he was a catechumen in the Orthodox Church now, and that he was preparing for chrismation in December if all went well. I asked him what it was all about. He briefly laid out their doctrines (after warning me that he himself was still a babe in the faith, and really had no business teaching) on original sin, Man's relationship to God, how the Fall affected that, the Atonement, God's plan for us. It hit me like a 10-ton spiritual sledgehammer. In a good - a VERY good- way. So many things that I had idly speculated about throughout the years, whenever my mind would wander to my then-former Christian beliefs, thoughts and ideas where I would think, "If the faith were like THAT, then maybe I could have held onto it", half-formed musings at the time, or so I thought... His explanation of Orthodoxy reinforced all that, as though I had been an archaeologist digging in the dirt, occasionally partially uncovering a bit here, a bit there, and suddenly all the concealing dirt was blown away in an instant, and I saw my half-formed ideas shown as they really were, and that they were all connected parts of a greater whole that was more perfect and more beautiful than I could have ever imagined. While I didn't have a full vision, I kept seeing in my mind's eye a vague representation of a heavy cloth covered in dust and dirt, being snatched away to uncover what was beneath, and what was beneath was me, it was being pulled away from covering my face and letting in a breath of the sweetest, freshest air and a golden light... That kept replaying in my head, as I tried consciously to come to grips with everything, my mind reeling and joyous and absolutely smitten with the simple yet profound beauty of what I had read. I kept re-reading his email, wondering if it was too good to be true? Was there a catch somewhere? How had I never been taught this before? God really WASN'T an angry tyrant who nailed his son to a tree and then pointed to him, saying to humanity "See what you made me do?!?" That was a little more than a month ago. I have felt the Holy Spirit leading me onwards, as I've read and learned, pondered and studied and argued with myself, for hours on end, nearly every single day. I praise God that He has kept His Church secure and full of His Light throughout the ages. I'm still learning, getting ready to attend a service for the first time, and looking forward to becoming a catechumen myself soon. I have seen more and more people expressing an interest in Orthodoxy, seemingly out of nowhere, and it blows my mind. Finding guys in a black metal chat group suddenly popping up declaring their newfound love for Christ, asking if anyone knows about Orthodoxy... In a group formerly full of avowed pagans, satanists, atheists, most of whom would previously only spoken of *burning* churches, and now they're looking for one to attend 😃 God is indeed great. Praise the Lord Jesus Christ, and THANK YOU GOD, for your Holy Spirit, moving across the world like a mighty flood in these dark days.
@@aleisterbroley900 glory to God... Unknown are the ways God uses to draw the souls to Him... Go ahead without looking back... Come home... Praise the Lord for His mercy .. His Holy Spirit guides you to His true Church... Blessings🙏
@@casparbrock7441 same. Grew up Roman Catholic... Did nothing for me. Then I went through my agnostic atheist phase in high school, dove right afterward pretty hard into Zen Buddhism for about 10 years. This was great for me at the time since it didn't throw hardly any dogma at me, but did show me the importance of ritual; I still value the techniques for watching my thoughts that I picked up during this phase. Early to mid 20s I dabbled around a little with Chaos Magick, tarot, psychedelics, etc. Never got too hard into all that thankfully, but it did confirm to me that there was a metaphysical reality behind the curtain of the present reality, and helped shatter my materialism. Thus, I also tried to adopt Asatru and Odinism for a couple years. I still find it fascinating to learn about my ancestors and what they believed, but as a spiritual pursuit of truth, it was simply a dead end. Finally, orthodoxy came to me, quite literally as a calling. That is honestly the best way I can describe it... I had no interests at all in being a weird Jesus freak, but it was a series of powerful synchronicities I couldn't ignore know which directly put me into a church. So I got curious, went down the rabbit hole, and realized that everything I thought I knew about Christianity in the West was just about completely wrong; I still continue to learn more and more and more about the faith the deeper I dig... It's never ending. I've been a part of the Antiochan Orthodox Church for almost 4 years now (this Pascha), and I've never felt more at home.
I still remember my senior telling me that her Christian group in University was curious about Church history and other matters. By the end of the 4 years, 5 of them became Catholic (with 1 becoming a religious sister), and 2 of them becoming Orthodox (1 Russian 1 Greek). None of them remained a “mere Christian” or whatever they started off with. That story made a lasting impact on me.
@@mariaathanassiou5264 "Praise the LORD from the earth, ye dragons, and all deeps: Fire, and hail; snow, and vapour; stormy wind fulfilling his word: Mountains, and all hills; fruitful trees, and all cedars: *Beasts, and all cattle; creeping things, and flying fowl* ..." and " *Let every thing that hath breath praise the LORD* . Praise ye the LORD." -- Psalms
@@protestant7778 the word also says one man considers one day holy and another considers all holy. Both do so unto the Lord. Paul in Romans 14 5 One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. 6 Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God; and whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God. 7 For none of us lives for ourselves alone, and none of us dies for ourselves alone. 8 If we live, we live for the Lord; and if we die, we die for the Lord. So, whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord. The Church came together on the first day of the week to honor the Resurrection not because of the Pope. So be sure you know what the heck you’re talking about before you start making claims. Acts 20:7 On the first day of the week we came together to break bread. Paul spoke to the people and, because he intended to leave the next day, kept on talking until midnight. 1 Corinthians 16 1 Now about the collection for the Lord’s people: Do what I told the Galatian churches to do. 2 On the first day of every week, each one of you should set aside a sum of money in keeping with your income, saving it up, so that when I come no collections will have to be made. 3 Then, when I arrive, I will give letters of introduction to the men you approve and send them with your gift to Jerusalem.
Totality of Scripture The entire book of Romans does NOT mention the word "sabbath" even once! What Romans ch.14 is speaking of is 👉FASTING for the Lord 👉(Romans 14:6) a day of fasting! Of which I understand we are at liberty to choose what day to fast or not! NOWHERE in the Bible is the sabbath day, a day of the week to pick or choose !!!!
Because of your interview with Father Josiah Trenham, I began searching for an Orthodox Church to attend. Growing up low-church Protestant, there are definitely some dogmas that I struggled with. Especially the Marian dogmas of perpetual virginity and assumption. As time went on, these things were explained to me in a way that just made sense. I can thank my priest for that. The Orthodox life is also a strict one. Lenten fasts and prayer regimen are basically the antithesis of western life. But in all honesty, it's the rigorous work that makes me appreciate Orthodoxy more. I may not be able to earn my salvation, that was already bought for me when Christ made the ultimate sacrifice, but I feel like I'm putting my money where my mouth is in terms of faith. I became a catechumen in August of this year. I can proudly say that I will be able to share this deep and ancient faith tradition with my children when they are born. That alone makes all the hard work worth it. Thank you for introducing me to Orthodoxy. I'm but one of the many lives you've touched with your content. May God bless you and keep you!
I converted a couple years ago to EO after roughly 20 years as a protestant. I applaud you for being willing to make this journey, and to do so in such a public forum! You may have misunderstood what was said about the exclusivity of Orthodoxy. What the Orthodox hold fast to, what we draw hard lines on, is what the church is. We believe that the EO church is the church created by Jesus and the Apostles. I converted in large part due to the historical accuracy of this claim. However, even though we are bold in our claims about the church, the sacraments are still a mystery, even to us within the EO church. We can't claim to know how salvation works - we just know what we are supposed to do in the practice of the church. As a result, I have actually found that it is less likely than any other form of Christianity for those in the EO church to point the finger and claim that other people are not saved. In fact, when an Orthodox person is completely honest, they will likely say that they don't know for certain that they themselves are saved. This is actually the most honest approach to salvation - only God knows; it is our job to follow the traditions of His church. This isn't an acceptance of Universalism, it is just to say we don't know who else could be saved, and it's not our place to know. We continue the traditions that have been passed down to us. With regards to the other forms of Christianity, some EO may be bold enough to say they aren't Christian, but this is different than saying we know they are not saved. We simply know that they are not following the traditions formed by Christ and the Apostles. They are following traditions that have Christian elements, but they are not in the church. This is hard for us westerners to grapple with because we grew up in a multi-denominational world, but consider the EO perspective: the EO have maintained the pre-schism traditions as closely as possible. This is a perspective that comes from a time when there was truly one church, and not a bunch of denominations to sort through. The EO have held to that while the rest of the world changed. This is why the EO would not say that all Christians are "Orthodox." As bold as the EO claim is, when I look back on all I was taught as a protestant (I also have a Master's degree in theology from an Evangelical college), I feel that the Protestant/Evangelical churches actually make much bolder claims. In these western forms of Christianity, where sola scriptura and sola fide are the cornerstone of theology, pastors will not only claim to know how salvation works, but also who is saved and who is not. Believe the correct interpretation and say the right prayer and you're saved. Never heard the teaching nor said the prayer? Damned for eternity. This view seems much bolder to me, and this theology has incredibly harsh consequences to those who are outside of the Protestant world. How could so many people be damned by God? One of the few "outs" that Western Christians have to this quandary is to resort to Calvinism - personally I found that spiritual paradigm too dark to bear. Sorry if this was too long. I encourage you to keep inquiring. More than anything, I try to stress to other Christians how different Eastern Orthodoxy is. It is a total theological shift that should not be underestimated, and even if you choose to convert sometime in the future, you will need to pace yourself and give yourself time. One good thing about EO is that it's not really based on head knowledge (western thought), but rather it is based on experiential knowledge (eastern thought) ie being part of the life of the Church. So if you really want to understand EO, just keep visiting services as the EO go through the liturgical cycle. Highly recommended services: Forgiveness Vespers and of course, Pascha. God Bless, peace be with you.
Former Protestant here as well. The “a journey to fullness of the faith” DVD series, introduction to orthodoxy, a 101 if you will, by Father Barnabas Powell a former Pentecostal, really helped me navigate some of these issues, as I similarly struggled with whether I really was a Christian as a Protestant. Well, we are all on different paths and responsible for what is laid before us and what we do with it. The title itself which mentions the FULLNESS of the faith was in itself helpful. I believe he said that as a Protestant his faith was just “too small”. This made sense to me. I just plain didn’t know. But once I found out, I choose to follow where the truth would lead me so as to grow INTO the fullness of my faith, which for me is the Orthodox Church.
This was extremely well put. In my experience, Orthodox are the only Christians who don't automatically assume all Muslims/Buddhists/Hindus/etc. go to hell because they haven't prayed the Sinner's Prayer. Rather, God will judge us based on how what we know and how we respond - and that goes for heterodox Christians as well. If anything, becoming Orthodox really raises the bar of what God expects from you; a higher risk, higher reward situation. A Hindu woman who unknowingly exhibits a Christlike life might end up saved and occupy a better place in eternity than the lousy Orthodox Christian (like me!) But if she had known the fullness of the Christian faith in Orthodoxy she would be equipped with the tools to reach a far greater degree of holiness (and eternal reward.) That is why we must spread the Gospel and the fullness of the Church - to say nothing of those people consumed by sin who would have repented if they had been exposed to Christ. To be without the Church is not hopeless, but to be with it offers far greater hope than you'd have otherwise.
I agree with all the points you've made here. Spot on. I attended a Baptist church and found the judgemental attitude there about what the true way is far stronger than anything I have seen in any Orthodox church. I think such things are definitely very subjective and yoi raised many important points
Did not have time to read all of this, but I want to later. What you said about it being less likely for EO to claim other people are not saved is something that Fr. Trenham mentioned in a homily. He said that the orthodox say they hope to be saved, while they are more likely to believe others are saved rather than themselves. Interesting remark. Hope to read the rest!
Im a Sikh, who has been studying Theology at a postgraduate level for several years. I have been tracing your journey for the past year and have been inspired by your honesty, openness as well as the recourses that you have shared. Perhaps one of the ways of overcoming your challenge with what (at least to me) perhaps seems like a “cultural shock” is the fact that Christianity really is a middle eastern tradition which has for so long been claimed by a western hermeneutical experience, mainly due to the way western culture has formed in the reception of Christian ideals, teachings and traditions.
@@kimberlymoore8172 These guys remind me of the disciples of Christ arguing about who is the greatest. Merry Christmas everyone. Hope to meet all Orthodox & Catholics in heaven.
I am a devoted Roman Catholic but I have learned a lot about the Orthodox Church through your channel. I am not sure if I would have been exposed to it otherwise. I am richer for having read some of their texts and will continue to do so in the future. Thank you for your channel.
17:30 in my experience, Orthodoxy doesn't teach that there is no salvation outside the Church. Rather, the Church is where you find the true doctrine being taught and the whole apostolic tradition preserved, but we don't judge the salvation of anyone, not even ourselves. God Himself is the final judge, and we can pray for His mercy upon anyone, but we cannot say whether anyone is saved or not since we don't know their heart as God does. Thief on the cross and whatnot.
I'm British and feel like I have returned to Orthodoxy. These lands were originally Orthodox before the schism so it feels like a reconnection to my ancient heritage
That's true. There were even English speaking warriors and generals from Britain who acted as the Emperor's bodyguard in Byzantium and alot of them having fled there after the conquest of William the Bastard
@@XDomyX The English Church was considered canonically Orthodox until the Norman conquests.Harold of England is viewed as the Last Orthodox King of England and some even considered him a martyr saint.
@@zaccheusanton9470 Firstly, there was no english church. Like there was no french or german church. There was the Catholic church, or the Church of Rome, which was the patriarchy for the West. It is really funny to read comments from protestants that deny this well known fact. Now protestant converts to orthodoxy push this silly story again, but now that early “english church” was orthodox, whereas before that was protestant. Every serious historian can only laugh at this. You must understand that christianity in England before the 16th century was part of the Catholic church, part of the Patriarchy of Rome with western rites. Period. What we will have in future? When a protestant decides to become a Jehovah witness, he will claim that the early christians in England were like them haha. England must be anything but catholic 🤣
@@XDomyX I meant that the English church was considered canonical . Yes they had a western rite like Western Orthodox (or "Catholic" in the pre-schismatic sense). The Western Church was considered Orthodox before the schism. There is an Orthodox western rite today in terms of liturgics and they have the same beliefs as the rest of the Church. I don't know how Protestantism factors into what I said.
I completely understand the whole comfort in protestantism thing. I struggled with it as well. I was born into a non-denominational Protestant church and I struggled for about a year with making the decision of converting to orthodoxy. All my family is Protestant, all my wife's family including my wife is Protestant. All my friends are Protestant. I was even a member of the worship band in my old church so I have an idea of the thought process you are going through. However it came to a point where I felt I had to be honest with myself and my family so I made the decision to convert. While I personally don't agree with the statement that there is no salvation outside the Orthodox Church, for me it felt like my salvation was on the line simply because I was being dishonest with myself and my family. On January 16th it will be a year since I baptized into the Orthodox Church. My wife and my kids are still struggling with my decision but I personally do not regret it. It feels weird though going to church alone now because my family still attends the Protestant church but I have peace that I'm being honest with myself and everyone. My wife at least recognized that I have improved as a person, a husband, and a father since converting. That has helped her in accepting my decision.
You are on your own walk with God, and I understand that. However, as someone who grew up in a broken household, going to church every sunday without one parent can be very damaging to a child's social-emotional well being. Think of it from a child's perspective. If Sunday, is the day that we're supposed to worship God, but is also when mommy and daddy separate. It changes the view of the sabbath from something holy to something divisive and upsetting. And personally, I would ask you to look into yourself and see how much of your decision was to satisfy your own desires both spiritually and emotionally at the expense of your family's? Again, only God knows your heart, but do not mistake selfish desire for closure for personal salvation.
Many Catholics easily stray away from the faith that they received. What are the reasons for their falling into complacency, becoming indifferent and even hostile towards Christ and the Christian Faith? The fault with many Catholics is that they think baptism is a graduation from having acquired knowledge and understanding of their faith. After completing their catechism classes or RCIA journey, they no longer seek out opportunities to continue growing their faith, both doctrinally and spiritually. Their only occasion to grow in faith is the one-hour Mass that they attend every Sunday. This is hardly enough to sustain the life of a Catholic. Those who do not grow in their faith are already losing their faith. There is no neutrality. How, then, can we grow in our faith? Firstly, we need to deepen our intimacy with God through Christ. In Christ, we come to know and love the Father. Secondly, we must be rooted in the Word of God. We cannot grow in our faith without deepening our love and appreciation for the Word of God through bible study and most of all, a prayerful reading and sharing of the Word of God. Thirdly, we must seek the support of the Christian community. A Catholic without the support of his fellow Catholics will eventually fall out from the faith, especially when he undergoes the trials and challenges of life, the influence of secularism, and the materialistic, individualistic and atheistic views of the world. Fourthly, to grow our faith, we need to evangelise and be a witness to Christ. We evangelise ourselves by evangelising others. By sharing our faith with others, we strengthen our own faith. By teaching our faith to others, we grow in understanding and clarity in what we believe in. Finally, growing in faith is to grow in our Christian life. This is the most effective form of witnessing. It means that those of us who are baptised must live a life of holiness and purity, free from sin and a bad conscience. A life of holiness and charity are the fruits of a strong spiritual life and a life of hope founded in the promises of God. If the Catholic Church is accused of being satanic, that is no more than its Founder, Jesus Christ, was accused of. When our Lord was on earth, he had the same problem. He was driving demons out, and some said he was doing this by the power of the devil. How did Jesus respond? He said, “How can Satan drive out Satan? If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. And if a house is divided against itself, that house will not be able to stand. And if Satan has risen up against himself and is divided, he cannot stand; that is the end of him” (Mk 3:23-26). The Catholic Church drives out the devil, too. This practice is called exorcism. No one can deny that the Catholic Church has been doing exorcisms on people and driving out Satan for nearly two millennia. Therefore, we must reason like Jesus: If the Catholic Church were from the devil, it could not drive the devil out. We shouldn’t be surprised when such charges are made against the Catholic Church. Jesus told us, “A disciple is not above his teacher, nor a servant above his master; it is enough for the disciple to be like his teacher and the servant like his master. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebul, how much more will they malign those of his household” (Mt 10:24-25).
@@GospelSimplicity thank you, it was your videos of touring the Orthodox church and interviewing the priest that first exposed me to orthodoxy, I probably never would have found it if it wasn't for you.
Former Protestant myself, my wife and I will celebrate our third year since our chrismation on April 14. It’s been an interesting journey. I could say so much about what was essentially a 4 -5 year process. It has upset some family members to varying degrees. But it’s a decision we had to make. I like what Father Barnabas Powell said. He said something like the following: It’s like you have been living in this tiny room your entire life and then one day you opened the door to this huge mansion full of beauty and experienced the fullness of this Faith that has been preserved for 2,000 years. And you are just like “wow!” Many years!
I was an evangelical pastor and educated through the Vineyard Institute and have as of this year become a catechumen in the Greek Orthodox church. Would love to chat with you about this at some point regarding your questions/issues (for lack of a better term). I think I can bring knowledge from the best of both worlds and give light as to why I went east. Certainly, visiting cities like Thessaloniki and Corinth, going to the Republic of Georgia, and learning about the history and continuity of the church in these places helped tremendously. Also, learning about how ancient people think and viewed the world was really helpful to understanding Orthodox "thinking". Anyways, would love to chat, I think it would be valuable for both of us!
Testimonies like yours are most valuable, since who knows better Protestantism than its pastors? , more than laity... So you can help our friend with his hesitation... In fact this phenomenon of whole protestant congregations with their pastors converting to Orthodoxy is unique... God bless you brother and may enlighten Austin to feel the certainty about Holy Orthodoxy in his heart... Blessings
You can read Becoming Orthodox by former evangelical pastor Peter Gillquist. Former non practicing Protestant here, being Orthodox since 25 years, after 2 years after finding it.
@@zealousideal Wow, what a powerful testimony from you and the OP. I'm Catholic, but I believe Orthodox also shares apostolic authority unlike Protestantism, with all due respect to the latter. I tolerate and respect -- love even -- the erring (which I believe to be Protestants), but I have nothing for the error (primarily "Protestantism" and its heretical teachings that vary from one denomination to another). That might not sound charitable, but on the contrary, I'm saying that out of love and charity. While I personally believe that Catholic Church has the fullness of truth, don't get me wrong, Orthodox is infinitely better than Protestantism. The fact that there are far, far, far more pastors or more learned Protestants, usually after undergoing serious study, that leave their denominations for the Catholic or Orthodox faith than priests going the other way round (coincidentally or not, are usually those that have been deposed from office too because of abuses from what I've seen so far), while not proof by itself, should give anyone a pause. It's usually the laity (usually by reason of feelings) that leave Catholic/Orthodox faith for Protestantism. On the other hand, the Protestant "laity" usually leave by reason of "reason," and emotions are only secondary.
My family and I were baptized into the Orthodox Church three years ago. It was a beautiful journey out of western Protestantism. Bless you on your journey 🙏🏻 💕
I’m an Orthodox Christian and I appreciate your feedback. It’s respectful and I completely understand how foreign it would seem to you. I often feel like Protestant churches are very foreign to me.
I have been in Protestant churches my entire 49 years on earth. The last 15-18 years have brought so much denegration in those churches, so much worldliness being welcomed in. I, too, feel like a foreigner in the Protestant churches. Unfortunately, most have turned their backs on Christ and His teachings, and walked away.
I am Orthodox and I really appreciated this! Your point about the way that Orthodoxy doesn't feel "genuine" to a westerner and seems like a modern thing to be able/willing to convert to an eastern Christian tradition at all, that really resonates with me. I've been Orthodox now for many years and it is still a thought that crosses my mind. The idea of "personal preference" is really difficult. It's something, though, that I think is part and parcel with the "conversion" mindset itself, not just Orthodoxy. Anyone who converts from one religion to another is sort of a strange person in that regard since religion is not so much a collection of dogmas and ideas as it is a way of living and the foundation/language of culture itself. So to change from one to another, especially one that is so different from your cultural context, completely throws you off balance in a way. You're treading totally new territory, looking at the world in new ways, and all the while carrying along the history and "baggage" of your previous identity. I think the only way I really manage that is through a narrative about the west that convinces me I can't stay. I need my children and grandchildren to have the best possible shot at maintaining a deep, meaningful relationship with Christ and when I look around at what western culture has become, I'm convinced that can't happen if I don't leave it behind (at least insofar as I can). It's a sad thing, not something I like to dwell on, but it's the truth of where I am and how I landed here. I don't think you quite understand the exclusivity aspects, but I think you will in time if you talk to more Orthodox about that. It's all part and parcel with the ontological soteriology of the church. A lot of the conflict you describe I think is really just a misunderstanding of terms and perhaps a misunderstand of the stakes at play. There are Christians outside of Orthodoxy, but also there aren't, because salvation is ontological and there is only one baptism. Anyway, thank you for this video! I appreciated it!
I have really appreciated your honesty, openness, and charity throughout your discussions with Orthodox Christians. Thank you for that! I converted to Orthodoxy from a lifetime of non-denom evangelicalism about a year and a half back, and had many of your same hesitations and concerns. In the end, it felt like Orthodoxy (led by God, of course) chose me, rather than the reverse. I just couldn't deny its truth anymore. No one else in my family made the jump, so I'll tell you what I've said to them: Seek God and His Truth and He will lead you right where He wants you. God bless you, and thanks again for your videos!
Huge respect for your honesty. As a Orthodox Christian growing up in the West, and therefore being influenced by Western Christianity, I understand where you're coming from. I will pray for you that God leads you to the truth. God bless you and your family 🙏🏼
Jeff cavins an ex evangelical pastor convert to RCC. Said we can not replace the true presence of Jesus with better music that makes us “feel good”. Our emotions can and do lie to us. If we base our faith on how we feel then we will be deceived every day
As an Orthodox convert I appreciate your honesty. Do take your time. Unfortunately, some convert too quickly and you may have seen some of the fruits of that, especially online. I too struggled with many of the same things you did before I finally converted. I also resisted converting for a long time. I hope and wish you the best. Keep on journeying!
Austin, I have really enjoyed your videos exploring the historical branches of Christianity. They were helpful to me when I was inquiring into Orthodoxy, and as I moved into the catechumenate. While I admit I had less mental deliberation than you-which I admire, and I really respect the careful thought you've given to the most important aspect of your life-I empathize with your hesitancy when it comes to ecumenism and heterodox Christians. My whole family is Protestant; most of my friends are Protestant; all my ancestors were Protestant. My family has asked me if I think they're not saved, and they're not really reassured when I tell them I don't know if *I'm* even saved, LOL. But here are my unsolicited thoughts on the matter, and I hope at least some of it is edifying and beneficial to you. You know the goal of the Christian's life is theosis: "Blessedness, or, what is the same thing, the kingdom of heaven or of God...but also to receive an influx of the divine, and, as it were, to suffer deification" (St. Theodoros the Great Ascetic). Our whole lives must be oriented to Christ, with the hope of becoming as much like Him as is possible in this life. Our first command is to love God with all our hearts, souls, minds, and strength; we are responsible for working out our own salvation with the grace and assistance of Christ. Because we view and know the Church to be the sure deposit of the Faith, with the omnipresent and transcendent grace of God, we know the Church to be a sure vehicle of attaining salvation. This is not to say that all in the Church will be saved (and we cannot know who is or is not saved), but it is truly the Body of Christ, and our faithful participation in His Body is what saves us. We have the means of forgiveness and absolution; we consume the Body and Blood of Christ and participate in His energies; we abide in the company of the saints gone before us. For the heterodox Christian, attaining theosis without the Church is like swimming upstream in a rushing river. You do not have the proper "equipment" or support structure to complete the task at hand. You may be exceedingly dedicated your whole life, and you may make significant progress given your circumstances. But you are ultimately operating without all the tools available to you. Salvation is by no means an easy process, even when one is *in* the Orthodox Church; outside her, it is even more difficult. Says St. Maximus the Confessor, "Created things are not by nature able to accomplish deification, since they cannot grasp God. To bestow a consonant measure of deification on created beings is within the power of divine grace alone." We know, however, that God examines the hearts of every man and desires that all be saved (1 Tim. 2:4), showing mercy to whom He will (Rom. 9:18). He does not "[wish] that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance" (2 Pet. 3:9). St. Peter of Damascus says that "alike before the Law, under the Law, and under grace, there have been many righteous men-men who preferred the knowledge of God and His will to their own thoughts and wishes." In the book of Jeremiah (17:10), God says, "I, the Lord, search the heart, I test the mind, even to give every man according to his ways, according to the fruit of his doings." We know God judges us on our works, which are an outpouring of our faithfulness to Him, and the orientation of our hearts to Him. So ecclesiologically, we can say with certainty that the heterodox are not members of the Body of Christ. We cannot, however, make comment on the eternal destination of the heterodox, for we are not God and do not know their hearts, nor His mercies. This is often seen as a cop-out answer, but I think that comes from a (very understandable) desire to be certain of our salvation. Again, though, we are not responsible for the salvation of anyone but ourselves. As St. Theophan the Recluse said, "You ask, will the heterodox be saved…Why do you worry about them? They have a Savior Who desires the salvation of every human being. He will take care of them. You and I should not be burdened with such a concern. Study yourself and your own sins…I will tell you one thing, however: should you, being Orthodox and possessing the Truth in its fullness, betray Orthodoxy, and enter a different faith, you will lose your soul forever." It is not our job, nor our right, nor even an option for us to speculate on the salvation of any individual, even ourselves. Our job is simply to love God, love others, and pray for our mutual salvation and unity with Christ. Prayer for another's salvation-Orthodox, heterodox, or non-Christian-is a more fruitful and loving choice than worrying about salvation or arguing who can or can't be saved. This isn't an easy thing to accept-God only knows how much I have agonized over the souls of people I know-but it is our calling as Christians, Orthodox or not.
@Ben De Maria It’s not our place to say who’s to be saved and who’s not. Everyone can be saved even up to the last minute. Remember the thief on the cross. The key word here is repentance.
The official teaching of the Eastern Orthodox Church is that all who are not inside of it are damned and doomed. '' No salvation outside of the church '' '' If you are not in the ark you will be drowned. '' Of course reality testifies against that, the evidence of the work of the Holy Spirit is manifest and visible. New births, healings, renewals with people who hated Christ becoming born again and changing completely, people delivered from homosexuality and given totally a new heart, these works of the Spirit happen every day and they happen outside of that organization which says that the Spirit only works within its walls. It is only recently that they have started subtely changing their teaching on this, and we can understand that, as the world becomes globalized and more people enter in contact with other denominations where you see just as much faith, virtue, and devotion to Christ, it becomes difficult to explain how everyone else is a hellbound heretic so the discourse slightly changes toward the '' we don't know, we can't really say '' making a small room for rare exceptions when these are not even exceptions but rules. And if the teaching is problematic, the shift in the teaching toward moderation is even more problematic because the Eastern Orthodox church stakes its entire credibility on never changing its teachings and never erring into falsehood, but by changing their line on the destiny of the '' heterodox '' they admit that they can change their teachings and the change itself admits a correction which implies errancy into falsehood. And if they can err on that question, what other question have they erred about ? Suffice it to say that as someone who considered orthodoxy, this makes the title of the '' one true church '' untenable and not credible.
I must tell you......I'm not surprised; saw this coming! I came into the Orthodox Church 5 years after drawing closer and closer for 15 years.....The Orthodox Service takes us back closer to the time of Jesus and the Apostles. The spirit is drawing you in! God bless you!
Austin, I am in a very similar place as you. Coming from a similar "low church Evangelical Protestant" background, I actively started exploring the Orthodox church about 5 years ago. I have been very drawn to it, but have the same reservations as you. All this is to say, your channel has been an incredibly helpful resource for me as I navigate these questions. Thank you so much for having the courage to do all of this online with an audience - it must not be easy. Much love and appreciation, brother! God bless.
Such a wonderful and vulnerable episode. You are right about the exclusivity of Orthodoxy. It was a stumbling block for me for quite a while after I converted (in 1994). Before that, I was a pastor, missionary, and seminary professor. I was ALSO very comfortable where I was at and ultimately DID suffer social, familial, financial, and several other kinds of temptations and negative consequences when I converted. That said, nothing in my life has been more worthy. I deeply regret my own sins and failures, but never for a moment have I regretted becoming Orthodox. A quick correction... we don't say that ANYONE is "unsaved," since we are all on our journeys TOWARD salvation. I would be so bold as to say that this is as close to being "official" and "universal" as it gets... it is not our job, not our right, not within our purview, to even SPECULATE about another's salvation. The moment the thought would cross our minds about so-and-so not being Orthodox and therefore is not "saved," the Orthodox inclination would be to cross ourselves and say the Jesus prayer... lest we lose our own souls. In fact, we are HOPEFUL and even optimistic about the salvation of our Baptist parents and even our Mormon neighbors, not because those systems are not soul destroying (to varying degrees), but because of the love and mercy of God... and because of His indulgence in answering our unworthy prayers for them. We are LESS confident about our own salvation (Yes, hopeful and trusting, but never presumptuous)... never taking it for granted, always returning to our knees in repentance, fully recognizing the abject sin in our own lives and hearts (yet, blinding ourselves to others' sins). Salvation is a process which culminates at the Great Judgment when our resurrected bodies are glorified and we are welcomed into eternity. Until then, any talk about who is "saved" and who is "not saved" is just silly. At the same time, we are bold in proclaiming what is Orthodox teaching and practice and what is heretical, what is the Church, the Body of Christ, and what is not. To Protestant ears, it might sound like we are condemning individuals to hell, denying the work of God in their lives, etc., but this is NOT the case. As to ecumenism... so much could be said here. It took me quite a while to reject this "practice"/inclination as contrary to the very goals I thought I was furthering through ecumenism, but it eventually clicked. I'd be willing to dialog further on this, but it seems to me that it is more of a conviction that grows with the challenging of preconceptions, definitions, etc., and this through experience with the fruit of the exercise. My only advice at this point would be to pray for wisdom, love everyone, and follow your conscience (which I am convinced you are already doing). You might find that ecumenism isn't exactly what you think and the Orthodox rejection of ecumenism isn't exactly what you perceive it to be, either. I'm a big fan, supporter, and recommender of your channel... and that whether you take the plunge or not. :D
Wonderful! I was protestant for 60 years - The many different churches in my small hometown confused me as a child. When God brought me to O. it all became clear to me that He did “establish His church” …. The “other Christians” issue is, for me, totally in His Loving Hands - and I have loads of family & friends in that camp. I just have peace after years of wondering: “why so many churches?” God bless you🙏🏻
I converted from non denominational to Eastern Catholic. It was extremely challenging for my whole family! Fast forward 5 years, my wife and kids have all been baptized and joined me in the church! Praise God ☦️
Austin, I've been following your channel quite awhile now and really enjoyed it, including this review of Orthodoxy one year later. I'm an Orthodox convert and went through many of the struggles you are, especially those about what the consequences would be to my family, friends in former Protestant church, job(s), etc. I appreciate very much your candid thoughts and honesty in trying to deal with the intellectual questions and emotional/psychological responses. You're doing fine, my friend - keep doing what you're doing by trying your best to follow Christ. Don't let anything pressure you to do anything in *any* direction before you're ready. Keep up the good work.
I really relate with you, Austin. I’ve been studying and contemplating both Catholicism and Orthodoxy for nearly 7 years now and it’s been a struggle. I’ve called Anglicanism home for a while but I have this constant nagging existential spiritual fight that I haven’t been able to fully reconcile. I just keep praying “Jesus, no matter what, let me find you, and not just an ecclesiology.”
Same here! Was Anglican and had this nagging "incomplete" feeling that didn't go away until I was made a catechumen in the Orthodox Church :) was a 10 year journey for me lol!
Same here. Baptized R. Catholic (but no catechism), Baptist 20 years, Anglican 30 years, have been attending Orthodox and RC for a couple of years. Finishing up my RC formation (just did first confession), but I attend all three churches. Will never abandon Anglicanism. The BCP is too beautiful. (Book of Common Prayer)
I live North of Pittsburgh and am thinking about attending services. Can you recommend the churches in Pittsburgh, especially eastern side, to me? Greatly appreciated 🙏
If “real Orthodoxy” isn’t as historically rich, theologically sound, and unapologetically proud of the gospel as it seems online, then I don’t want it.
Thanks for speaking to the existential tension I'm currently living in! Studying church history has been both enlightening and exhausting. I appreciate your hard work and honest words. God bless you, brother.
What you said about divine liturgy. I will never forget my first liturgy. Absolutely transformative. God absolutely touched my heart and said "welcome home." Growing up post novus ordo rc and reaching a crisis where I couldn't shake that somewhere midway between high church protestantism and traditional catholicism was the Truth. Orthodoxy healed that wound.
Your video reflections are deep and thought provoking, and - having been baptized into the Orthodox Faith 3 weeks ago - I’d have to say not uncommon. I struggled for 7 years before making the decision to convert. Belonging to a very small church which consists entirely of converts, most grapple with a number of things such as the matters which you question. Converting to the Orthodox “phronema” is not the same as switching denominational labels from one Protestant Church to another. May you be blessed in your journey wherever the Holy Spirit leads you. Your videos are amazing! Keep up the good work.
The thing about conversion to Orthodoxy that I’ve noticed is this: No one comes banging on your door or Red/Blue Pill you into an existential crisis of decision to convert. Normally people, like Moses, happens upon the mystery of a burning bush as it were, and inquire as to “what is this?” Then the journey begins. And oft they find that, “This is the Pearl of Great Price.” True Evangelism is attraction through truth & light.
I was baptized into the Orthodox Church (Antiochian) over a year ago. This video is presented with so much authenticity and intelligence. And you have a very kind and gentle nature which is refreshing, especially with the plethora of arguments and “Ortho-Bros” on TH-cam. We welcome our Protestant friends and families to “come and see” at anytime. God Bless You, brother!
I am on a journey looking into Orthodoxy, and I must say, you gave a voice to the questions in the back of my mind that I didn’t even know how to verbalize! Thank you for always making such honest, humble, and respectful videos on these topics.
Raised as a Protestant by wonderful , genuinely Christian parents; fell away as a young adult (very common), then experienced a desire to come to God. Stumbled onto the Orthodox church. The earthshaking experience was my first confession given before a very wise Orthodox priest. The spiritual reward of that confession was overwhelmingly beautiful and indescribable. Since then, I consider confession and the Eucharist to be a wonderful gift very directly to the believer. It was moving from a two-dimensional spiritual life to a three-dimensional spiritual life.
Most pressing point for my conversion from Protestantism to Orthodoxy was my decision to subordinate my personal understanding of God and the Scripture and the Faith in general to the teachings of the Church. It required a form of intellectual humility (well-deserved and highly needed). This ended up actually being a relief; it was in some sense the end of a burden and struggle.Note my natural personality is very assertive and pro-active so this was a big change.
@@kansashoneybadger7899 I actually couldn’t relate MORE to your story. The details which you gave are basically identical to my own story. I am forever grateful for my upbringing because without it I wouldn’t be here, but it’s certainly not where I expected to be. I also have found the same solace in realizing that I don’t have to “lean on my own understanding” (if you will) in order to fully accept and comprehend God, Scripture, and the Church. My fiancé and I are being chrismated May 10th and will be married in the church June 1st! Praise God!
The rather complicated but well expressed concern about a westerner becoming Orthodox is actually quite profound. I grew up low church and became Orthodox, but it took 25 years. Keep seeking and working through these deep objective and subjective issues.
For Austin and anyone interested: yesterday Kabane released a discussion in two parts with Orthodox philosopher, theologian, and apologist Perry Robinson of Energetic Procession. Perry is a brilliant exponent of the Orthodox faith- and of intellectually responsible habits in general. Many of a protestant questions and hesitations about Orthodoxy are answered so beautifully by an ex-protestant who after years of wandering in various protestant branches finally found Holy Orthodoxy...It will be very helpful I think,even for Orthodox fellows ...so many precious matters discussed regarding the process of converting to Orthodoxy and what problems one has to face...First part on Becoming Orthodox, Christology, and Personhood second part on Monergism, Apostolic Succession, and Staying Orthodox.. P.S: in 42:20 of the first part he gives some very good advice about how to deal with things you do not like in the church... I think you must have Perry Robinson in your channel too,Austin
First of all, thank you for being so vulnerable and open with us. That is beautiful. Secondly, thank you for sharing these wonderful conversations with us and acting as a proxy on our behalf so that we can all learn together! I have been an Orthodox Catachumen going on 2 years now. I have listened to many podcasts and watched many youtube videos, as well as reading books, and talking with my priest. I can relate to many of the struggles and complications that you mention, and honestly some of that is why I am still a Catachumen after so long. But the draw towards Orthodoxy (especially the Divine Liturgy) is undeniable, at least for me, and I am continuing to move forward patiently learning- trusting that love is patient and God is Love. May God continue to bless you on your journey, wherever it leads.
Hi, Austin! As a devout Catholic, I can honestly say that I appreciate what you have shared with us over the past year or so. As I have said before, I accept you as my brother in Christ regardless of whether you convert to Catholicism. I also love and accept our Orthodox brothers and sisters. We all have our differences, just as members of any family do, but we are all family.
@Ben De Maria heh! Hating Protestants doesn't make one a better Catholic. If you really were a good Catholic, you'd be delirious in the love of your faith, living it's glory everyday and loving others like yourself as Jesus said. I'm Catholic too but I have Protestants and Orthodox Christians as close friends. Though we agree and disagree on many beliefs and traditions we do not hate one another.
@Ben De Maria true, but why hold present day Protestants responsible for what happened years ago. If Protestants do mock Catholics, it's mostly out of ignorance. But as a Catholic, my advice would be to highlight what is good in our faith rather than point out what's wrong in theirs.
@Ben De Maria You are confused and a confused Catholic makes a bad Catholic. You don't want to be a bad Catholic do you? Realize that all Christians when they are baptized, even if they are baptized in a Protestant church, they are Baptized into the Catholic Church since there is only one Christ and One Church. They are brothers and sisters in Christ by way of Baptism through Christ, even in their heretical ways for which they may not be culpable. Remember, God won't ask you if you are Catholic when you die. He will ask you how did you observe the 2 greatest commandments?
Like some Protestant pastor said and a Greek priest. We are all Christians , if we follow Jesus by also having a personal relationship with him as well we have a good chance to go to heaven. An Orthodox Christian may have an upper hand on the level area of heaven of where they go, but they too have to follow his/her faith orthodox truthfully and completely as well. He/she doesn't have a free ticket because they are Orthodox. We all have to work for God. Just like on earth we want money we have to work hard for it. Same goes to faith. We want to go to heaven and have joy. Continue your relationship with God and do a lot of praying and fasting. As I said Above somewhere. An Orthodox member who does not follow their faith or converts out, is doomed to a place in hell worse than someone who was never Orthodox!!!😉
As an Orthodox Christian, I just want to say that I can totally see how you would experience a sense of exclusivity in Orthodoxy. Many close members of my family are Protestant and my parents grew up in Protestant missionary families before converting to Orthodoxy, so the feeling of that sentiment hits close to home for me. However I think that for whatever reason, there seems to be a disproportionate number of "online" Orthodox Christians who ardently (and unfortunately) reflect this sentiment along with a firm anti-ecumenical stance that doesn't at all reflect my own experience as an Orthodox Christian having moved multiple times to different states and been a part of a number of different communities. Ecumenism is certainly a hot topic in the Church and there are some very strong opinions on it on BOTH sides of the spectrum. But I think these opinions fall within the realm of theologoumenon and not an official stance of the Church. If anything, we've seen some significant ecumenical events between multiple patriarchs of the church and the Pope -- and I do appreciate that the Church allows for more wiggle room to figure these kinds of things out. There is definitely a strong feeling that the West has strayed from the Church of the Fathers that was whole for so long, and that we don't want to compromise in the wrong ways, but we also pray for "the unity of the faith" at almost every service. Also in terms of salvation not existing outside the Orthodox Church, I don't think this is a widely held belief either. I think salvation and theosis sometimes get mixed up in this case, when the two aren't the same thing (if everyone had to reach theosis in their lifetime to be saved, we'd all be in a lot of trouble hahah). There is certainly the commonly held view that one must be inside the Church to have the possibility of fully cleansing their nous and heart, and ultimately attaining theosis, but this isn't the same as salvation. The number of Orthodox Christians we recognize have reached theosis in this life (aka the Saints) is such a small fraction of the rest of us who more often than not spend our whole lives in that first phase of cleansing our nous. In terms of salvation itself, I don't think we as a church tend to concern ourselves as much with whether or not those around us are saved, because we see salvation as a lifelong process with no guarantees for ourselves despite the fact that we are a part of the Orthodox Church. We just hope that when we see Christ, that we will experience His love as paradise and not as hell -- and we can't nor shouldn't ever make claims for what this experience will be like for others (with the exception of the Saints).
Ecuminism is very heretical and demonic, every Eastern orthodox saint and church father was against ecuminism. Ecuminism goes against what our Early church taught as well. It is essentially a precursor to the Antichrist. It is the type of worldly religion the Antichrist will eventually bring about whenever the End times start (look up the videos by Father Spyridon Bailey/Fr. Peter Heers and quotes from Orthodox saints regarding this topic). The only way a unity between Rome/other Christian denominations and the Eastern orthodox can begin is if the RCC and protestants get rid of all their heretical dogma that deviates from Orthodox doctrine/teachings (catholic divine simplicity, Catholic change to the fililoque, papal infallibility,etc). Ecuminism will just make a watered down, lukewarm, worldy and heretical chrsitianity that deviates from the early church and what was passed down from the first apostles. Also when you talked about recent unity between the two denominations, you have to know that ecumenical patriarch Bartholemew is subverting Orthodoxy, he wants to essentially be the pope of the East, and what he is doing goes against orthodox teachings. Also the Eastern orthodox church is the only way to achieve salvation, and you can't achieve salvation through any of the other Christian denominations.
How can one outside the EO Church get saved, if it is not participating to the sacraments of the EO Church, which are to be given only through the EO priests, respectively through apostolic succession found only in the EO Church ?
@Kiwi Connoisseur Well, I agree! But it seems to me that the claims of exclusivity to God's Grace are expressed in doctrines like those mentioned in my questions.
Hello, brother. I don’t think there is a single Saint in the Orthodox Church that stood up for ecumenism; meanwhile, one could quote multiple saints that opposed it sternly (and Austin is probably aware of that already by this). While I do hold that a pan-orthodox synod should be held about the matter in order for an universal condemnation to be issued, I do not think this matter is that much of a theolegumenon at all. Certainly there is some “wiggle room” but I believe it is not as wide as you may be trying to express. About salvation outside the Church, it is pretty clear that one must be united to the Church in order to be saved. St. Cyprian affirmed it, and I don’t think a single church father ever hinted suggesting otherwise. This doesn’t mean all non-orthodox are damned though.
@Kiwi Connoisseur I grew up in an eastern orthodox majority country and got the opposite of what you are saying from EO. Actually, I am surprised to hear your position and I am wondering if what people get in the west is more like a "missionary" form of eastern orthodoxy, where these claims of supremacy over God's Grace are kind of downplayed. The way it was explained to me even by practicing orthodox and even priests, these EO doctrines like apostolic succession, sacraments, priesthood, doctrine about Church are inherently exclusivist. In the EO paradigm, the way a non-orthodox can come to salvation outside of the EO Church is rather the exception from the Gospel, not the rule.
Thank you Austin for this video! I know it's hard to talk about these things in front of thousands of people yet you do it with great humbleness and honesty.
My pleasure! I look forward to discussing some of this on your channel soon! I find I express myself better in dialogues, so it's likely that if people enjoyed this, they'll really enjoy whatever goes on your channel
@@GospelSimplicity looking forward to our discussion too! Thank you for your kind words:) I am surprised if anyone finds something valuable coming from a Greek but who knows, God can use a donkey if he wants to
As for those encouraging you to convert to Orthodoxy, especially my fellow Orthodox, pay no attention to the crowd behind the curtain! This is something that you and God will work out. It took me almost 10 years attending Orthodox services before I finally officially entered the church although I was following an Orthodox way of life before. (Or should I say trying to) I do not pray that you convert to an Orthodox or Catholic or any other Western Christian spirituality. I pray that you remain a firmly rooted Christian as you are now. Please continue your work and God bless you and your soon-to-be wife! CHRIST IS IN OUR MIDST! HE IS IN EVERY SHALL BE!
After 3.5 years of looking into Orthodoxy, my family and i will be chrismated in our local Orthodox church in the fall, God willing. It's a massive shift but it feels like home and we're trusting this leading is of the Holy Spirit. Coming from Assembly of God. Glory to God . Thanks for making these videos and going through all this effort. It has been so very valuable
I'm an Orthodox convert from being a Baptist(non-cavinist). I converted early this year during Pascha, after attending and researching for a year. My priest did a great job and continues to do a great job in my opinion of guiding me and helping me make the decision. He is of the opinion that conversion should be very cautious, and we should be careful when making such a huge decision, and it is a huge decision. It is a hard thing to deal with. I felt a comfort here, that I know my tradition has answers to my questions and makes so much sense to me. I believe Christ is here. I hold the opinion that we know where the Holy Spirit is, but we don't know where it isn't. I believe there are Catholics and Protestants with Christ and the Saints in heaven for sure. I do, however, believe Orthodox is the Church and the fulfillment of the Christian faith. I definitely understand where you're coming from, and I fully encourage your decision to be very careful when converting to anything. I wish you nothing but the best and I will pray for you. Conversion is not something taken lightly and out Faith is the most important decision in our lives. My family didn't take my conversion particularly well, and it has a subtle tension to it when I go visit them. I have, however, come to respect and understand a lot of faith traditions better. May God be with you.
Dude, between this video, and the video about Catholicism, which, by the way are the only two videos I’ve ever seen from you you described exactly where I’m at in my thinking on this as a protestant struggling through these issues, and it was very refreshing to hear someone talk gracefully about these topics
Thank you for sharing. It's been great to follow your journey ever since your "Protestant visits a Catholic Church" video came up as a recommendation on my feed over a year ago. Keep studying and keep reading, there's no rush to make a decision today. It took three and a half years to finally come to Orthodoxy. The journey is hard, but you'll find your way after enough struggle, Austin! Everyone who's walked a similar path as you has struggled with Mary and the saints but when/if that ever finally clicks its a satisfying feeling. Keep up the great work and the great content.
Congratulations on your first year of “investigation.” It took me three years to work through many similar concerns. Enjoy the journey. (SWBTS grad now EO)
Thank you for sharing all of this. Your hesitations match my own. I’m continuing to get to know Orthodoxy, and your interviews and insights have been very encouraging.
I share the same hesitations. I’m trying to learn and understand but I struggle with many of the same things he mentions and also the prayer to saints through icons, and even the whole “not knowing if you’re saved” makes no sense as the NT seems clear, like in John, that we can know we are saved. But I love orthodoxy. I love the vibe, the art, the devotion, the ancient practices, the emphasis on having a prayer life, the experiential over head knowledge thing, and also how important it is to actually pick up your cross and follow Christ. I so badly want to convert but I can’t do it honestly while I have so many issues, I would just be a hypocrite and I can’t do that.
@@DavidMartinez-vx7zb I agree with you David. About all the Orthodox Christians I talk with seem to scratch John 3:16 and Ephesians 2:8-9 making it seem as if it is works and faith. Also, I find that the claim that God only works in a single church and by that I mean claiming that He only works in the Orthodox Church strikes me a little rough. I mean it’s probably the most clear thing that God works in more than jsut one church - more than just orthodoxy and more than just protestantism
I was raised RC and converted to EO. I still lose sleep questioning things and am faced with these existential crisis. You are not alone. Even though I am overjoyed that you are researching and looking for the ancient Church, all things must start with a love of Christ, which any outsider should be able to see shine through your words and actions. You are a light, no matter what tradition you may follow. Thank you for all of what you do. May Lord truly have Mercy. 🙏🏻
I grew up in a rather cultural Orthodox household and considered giving up on the Tradition I happened to be born into, if it should turn out to be a less than optimal representation of Truth. I don't know if this radical approach was instinctive or engrained into my genetical code by the more pious among my ancestors. Maybe it was God Himself challenging my young conscience to test all spirits, but in any case I was greatly relieved after years of research to have discovered nothing even remotely comparable to Orthodoxy. I can only imagine the tremendous loss and mourning of having to admit the fullness of Truth is not in that place which has been most near and dear to your heart for so long, and I deeply admire the bravery it takes to make that step. I think I can also relate to your sentiment that it's not fair to dismiss so many good and nice people outside the Church, and that isn't necessary, at all. There are for sure many Protestants and Roman-Catholics who make much better Christians than me, but their good conduct can't make up for false or incomplete doctrine, as much as my misconduct doesn't make Orthodoxy any less valid. There are also Buddhists and Muslims who are humble, meek and loving, but it's none of our business to judge the state of their souls. God is just and merciful towards all, and He will ask of each according to how much was given to them. You seem to be a very careful and well-reflected person, much more than me when I was younger. I have almost had adopted a new age mindset before I seriously studied and consciously embraced Orthodoxy, because I was very focused on what is common good between all traditions. The critical turning point came when I started focusing on the differences, on what makes each and every communion special, unique and irreplaceable.
First of all, thank you for an amazing series. I am a convert to Orthodoxy. I feel you brother. I went through the same objections, reservations, doubts, etc. It is not the end of your journey though. I read somewhere that God does not punish the absence of Truth. He punishes the rejection of It.
The intercession of the saints did not click for me until I understood the eschatological dimension of the Church, in other words, "what is the Kingdom of God?". I realize you have not touched upon this "third rail" of theology, but, it might be of help to review: 1. All of the Apostolic Churches (those whose origins are pre-reformation) hold to the intercession of the saints. 2. All of the Apostolic Churches hold to Realized Millenialism in thier eschatology (called "Amillenialism" by 'low church' Protestants, who mostly hold pre-millenial views, though many 'high church' Protestants still mostly adhere to Realized Millenialism). 3. Realized Millenialism states that (1) Jesus is presently and at this very moment reigning from Heaven, seated at the right hand of the Father, (2) that before the ascension, all authority in Heaven and on Earth had already been given to Christ, and that (3) There is no 'literal, physical specific 1,000 years of rule with Christ upon his return", for "His Kingdom shall have no end", in other words, that Kingdom is now, it has been "realized". 4. Orthodoxy (and from what I understand, all the Apostolic churches) hold that the dead in Christ know what is happening on earth. In Revelation 6:9-11, they clamour impatiently for judgment to be poured out on their oppressors. 5. The concept of "soul sleep", temporary abeyance, or "limbo" for the dead in Christ is not found in Orthodox thought. 6. Christ states "...have you not read what was spoken to you by God, saying, ‘I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.” 7. As revealed in the transfiguration, although Moses had died and Elijah had been taken up to heaven centuries before, they now live in the presence of God, and that the same return to life applies to all who have faith in Christ. Moses and Elijah were and are alive - so much so that the Apostles asked if they could build Moses and Elijah tents to stay in for the night. 8. Those in heaven are “like the angels,” Christ says. Those in heaven surround us as a “great cloud of witnesses” (Heb. 12:1). 9. In Luke 16:19-31, the rich man shows concern for his family on earth, even though he is dead. If a person such as the rich man has such concern for those still alive after being dead, are those who have passed away in Christ also able to be concerned for the living. Can they do anything about their concerns? Are we to believe that those that are dead in Christ denied or silent? 10. The Kingdom of God is available to us right now, if we choose to access it. Those that are dead in Christ are already a part of the Kingdom of God that will come down with Christ at the end of the age. It is one Kingdom; we are connected to those that are dead in Christ through Christ himself. "Too often modern Christians forget that the Church is not just an institution, but the Kingdom of God that is here but is still to come. The Church is described as the Bride of Christ. We are betrothed to Christ. The second coming is the wedding day and the final consummation. Therefore, we live this present life in two dimensions: as saved and yet hoping for salvation; as betrothed to Christ and yet in anticipation and anxiety for the consummation of the marriage; as joyful and yet penitent; as having everything and yet possessing nothing; as living in this world and yet “having here no continuing city”; as in the world yet not of the world; as being members of Christ’s Church, receiving the new life of baptism and eternal life in the Eucharist; and yet as striving to be made worthy of the Kingdom to come. This double character of Christian life is absolutely essential" - Fr. Vassilios Papavassiliou
Christ says that you must be ready to abandon country, friends and even your family for Him. Austin says he can't be Orthodox because it's "foreign;" because it's too "exclusive;" because it isn't fair that others didn't have an opportunity to be Orthodox. Well Austin, you have an opportunity to be Orthodox. The only thing that matters is whether or not it's true.
He still has the opportunity. Please allow him the time and grace to find his way in his time. How gracious and merciful is God towards us? Ought we not to be the same?
Being orthodox is not a requirement for salvation. We will be judged with what we know and how we behave in this world. But if we are given the truth and deny it that is a different story. To have the opportunity to be orthodox is something that must be and that must be taken as a gift. I was raised Roman Catholic and I have been orthodox for a year. It's an incredible gift to be bestowed.
Probably there are some presuppositions there that lead to different views. Especially in the way we should see the church. A protestant will see the application of those Bible verses differently, which makes the way you are putting that only in the eastern orthodox context, strange and mostly irrelevant.
I love your opinions. I am Greek orthodox and I love it. I also love visiting other Christian churches as well. I like to learn all peoples ways that they worship and praise God. I love it. I feel the holy spirit in all Christian churches that truly worship him
Fr. Seraphim of Rogue River, Oregon, a former Protestant pastor, gave me the shove I needed to finally become Orthodox about 12 years after our meeting. Thank You, Father.
I went tô my first liturgy last sunday, it was so pure and só amazing, was so difficult tô believe i was still on this Earth during the mass, i never thought a church could be so pure and sincere. I want tô be part of this, i need tô.
Glory to God....the same feeling had the representatives of the Tsar when they visited Hagia Sophia in Constantinople:''we do not know if we are on earth or in heaven' they said and that's how the Russian nation was baptised Orthodox
“The Whole Council of God” and “The Lord of Spirits” are two podcast that have started to help me with my own secular materialism. They have brought me to a place where I see Christ differently. (I was raised Baptist, the Vineyard, Mainstream Evangelical, Bible College Grad (Prairie Bible College: AB Canada) Now an Orthodox Christian 4 years.
Everyone, please stop with the arguments about him joining orthodoxy or Catholicism. He did a fantastic job of researching what each group believes and left it for us to decide what to think about each one. He gave his personal opinions on each and left it at that. No one should be messing with him on what he needs to do. He is a grown man who can make his own decisions. So in other words, shut up about what he needs to do. Not trying to be rude, im just saying.
Not sure I see any arguing in any of the comments. Austin is an adult and I'm sure he can take comments in stride. That being said, let's all be nice to one another!
I resonate with your comment. I am a little sad at all the “convincing” I feel like people are trying to do in these comments. Especially after a video like this I just feel like this is not the place.
Speaking of faithful Christians outside of the Orthodox Church, our priest says, "We know where the Church is, we don't know where it isn't." Many of us who converted know bone-deep that Christ has always been with us, and that He shines so brightly in those who love Him, whichever faith tradition they happen to belong to.
It’s so interesting how different people struggle with different concepts. I find it fascinating! When I started studying into Orthodoxy praying to Saints felt natural, whereas relics felt other worldly. We all have unique reasons, beliefs and presuppositions I guess that create these big things to wrestle with.
I'm Orthodox and I really appreciate your videos. Regarding the point about whether someone who is non-Orthodox is actually a Christian, I agree that there are hard-liners in our Church. However, it is Evangelical Protestants in the US who would have us believe that Catholics are different than Christians. I have found that to be much more prevalent (to the point that some Catholics believe it).
I was chrismated 5 years ago into the Greek Orthodox Church. It has been the most blessed event that I have done in my life. I was raised Missouri synod Lutheran and that was very important to me as well as my family who had Catholic roots but after a tragic family event I went looking for something more I needed something more and I found it in the Orthodox Church. My husband is also a catacuman now and praying for when he can be fully part of our church family.
I watched the debate you referenced on According to John. This is one of my stumbling blocks too. My more difficult thing is not being able to put my late Father's name down for prayer during Eucharist because he was not Orthodox. I understand it's like they are vicariously participating in Eucharist so only people who could take it while living can participate from the other side. If you had a debate with an atheist who told you it was uncharitable to say Jesus is the only way, you might come off the same way of seeming mean or cruel. Protestants actually sometimes accuse Catholics and Orthodox of not being real Christians because they haven't had some huge emotional experience or believe in salvation purely through faith. That being said, I had been reading the lives of the Saints for a year and then attended a Divine Liturgy. I went to a Greek Orthodox church first, but when I attended a Serbian Orthodox church made up of almost 100% converts, I had the feeling, "I'm home." When they said I could be baptized again (to them the first "real" baptism) I had hope for a fresh start. The complicating things like my husband's lack of agreement, my mother thinking we worship icons, etc, has delayed my becoming a catechumen. I feel like the Orthodox church has explanations for scriptures I've never understood, it has antidotes for our sins and passions. It's like joining the marines to learn how to do warfare, except it's spiritual warfare. Thank you for your channel and your honesty.
I pray for you and your family. I’m in the same boat, my wife thinks orthodoxy is “creepy and weird”. But now that I’ve seen it, I can’t unsee it. Our new church is independent baptist; wonderful people with large families who love the Lord and love children, but my soul feels like it doesn’t get the food and drink it needs.
@@noblegamer8740 Thank you. Prayers for you and your family as well. We actually started visiting the Greek church again, and it's easier for my family to feel accepted. The Serbian parish was so concerned about anti-Ecuminism that they ended up offending my husband, teens and mom many times. The Greek Orthodox Church is so much more open, and they don't jump to saying your actual legitimate experiences with Christ were not real or something. I think the Serbian priest (an American convert) had not really experienced Christ as a Protestant, while the Greek priest (also a convert) had been entirely sold out to the Lord and knew Him extremely well before becoming Orthodox. The Holy Spirit is everywhere present and fills all things as it says in the morning prayers. He really does work inside all the other churches. I still think Orthodoxy is almost perfect. Humans always make things messy, but the doctrine is so sound and the Liturgy is so sublime. I really don't think I can do anything else. My family now attends the Greek church weekly as well as Catechumen class. It's going well. Thanks again for the prayers!
@@dimitripaizis5456 I'm so glad. I just think I had ended up in a very traditional parish that had separate lists for Orthodox and non-Orthodox. Technically they are not supposed to read the names and take particles of the bread while saying the names of non-Orthodox. They pray over them at the proskomedia table. I really shouldn't be this much of an expert but believe me, I've majored in the minors far too much! I've met other Orthodox people whose parishes don't have separate lists. I guess it's up to the Bishops and the Patriarch? My Dad's name was Hugh if you want to pray for him. He died when I was 13. He was such a good man. He even had a vision of Christ when he was in the hospital. I know he's with the Lord. I still pray because our prayers apply back in time at the judgement and because I love him.
@@noblegamer8740 If I might make a suggestion, my kids and I read the Lives of the Saints from an app and it really touched my oldest son. It's been really beneficial to see all those people willing to lay down their lives for Christ. Perhaps if you did a daily devotional that included the lives of the martyrs it would touch your wife's heart. When I found out that the Orthodox Church knew where Lazarus went and where he was a Bishop, and that St. Longinus was the soldier at the foot of the cross, I practically wept. I can't believe how much we've lost. The app I used is called Daily Readings. I think it's the Greek church that puts it out. It just has a blue cross icon. The scripture readings sometimes match the Saint of the Day, which is really wonderful.
Austin, it is awesome getting to see you on the journey brother! I still encourage you to talk with more of us eastern Catholics and go to a liturgy at some point!
Dear Austin, I have been following your channel for some time and I really appreciate the effort and commitment you have towards your work, it is truly admirable! Regarding the video, I will allow myself to share certain comments from my position as a converted Orthodox Christian since 15 years ago. In the Church there are several branches of study, for example, threre is the Theology, Patristics, Eschatology, Hymnography, etc., and one of them is the Ecclesiology, which is the understanding of what the Church is, although the proclamation that the Orthodox Church is The Church founded by Christ and sown by the Apostles is bold, she as a set of beliefs and traditions is nothing more than the manifestation of the Holy Spirit, it is a revelation given to us by God and that we have as a duty to take care of it to pass it intact to the next generation, an act that sums up our mission on earth; But even if ecclesiologically we understand the Orthodox Church as the only Church, that does not mean that all Orthodox are saved or that we have the monopoly of salvation, since salvation comes from God Who sees through our hearts and has known us since He created us, no sin we commit is greater than God's mercy and only He knows our final destiny because He knows us and loves us, I would dare to say that even we as Orthodox have a greater responsibility since on the day of the judgment God will question us based on what we knew and did not do, because God is a Just Judge Who will not judge a good Buddhist with the same harshness as an evil and hyoccritical Orthodox Christian. I am not going to go depth about your personal decisions of possible conversions or not, since it is a decision solely yours and which must be respected, I will only mention that our hereditary background is not an impediment to approach Orthodoxy, it tells you someone from the West like you and a Latino in a third world country without a true presence of the Orthodox Church. Everything can be done if that is your desire and the Will of the Lord. Likewise there is a reason why we oppose ecumenism and it goes from hand in hand with our Ecclesiology, we can get along well with everyone, but neither do I see ourselves discarding unique aspects of the Church and legacies from apostolic times for being "well" with everyone, not to mention the liturgical problems that this would propose, any change It will be not done by our decision since the Church belongs to God, and she does not belong to us. We are servants by God's mercy and not by our own merit, we are the simple guests at the Wedding, not the King Who celebrates the wedding of His Son, and with respect to give up everything remember Luke 14, 25-33, with nothing more to add I say goodbye not without first congratulating you again for your great work, keep going!
Thank you for your videos! I admire and am drawn to Orthodoxy for the very same reasons, and the same hesitations keep me from leaving my comfortable Protestantism... Honestly, mostly the impact it would have on my family (I am married with young children and that makes it feel like just a whole other kind of decision .) but I have felt drawn to the Orthodox Church for many years now. Your interviews with Orthodox theologians have helped clarify some theological questions and the interview w FMG on the Jesus Prayer has been truly transformative. That prayer has not only impacted my life but I am seeing the ripple effects in my husband’s and children‘a lives as well. Christ be with you, brother!
Austin, if you truly have a deep interest in Orthodoxy and if you feel that you are being drawn towards the Church in any way, you should speak with a local priest about the issues you are having. He may be able to walk you through these issues pastorally, and you may might find great comfort in his counsel. it is a journey for all new converts and the process is different for each one of us, but I think many of us have experienced the things you are describing in one way or another. A good priest would definitely be able to help you through these issues and give you guidance on how to approach the struggles you are having and the current situations in your personal life.
If you haven’t yet explored Fr. Georges Florovsky, I think you would appreciate his writings and work. He was a magnificent Orthodox theologian whose Orthodoxy and traditionalism was beyond reproach, who was also very involved with the WCC.
A couple of things freaked me out when I was looking into Orthodoxy. One was learning how in places in Europe and the Middle East how the Orthodox leader forbid the Christians in their congregations from giving copies of the Bible to unbelievers. And to go into membership a person has to renounce the Protestant Reformation, and how this leads the Orthodox to distance themselves from fellowship with other Christians, and it creates a posture of making other Christians come crawling in order to share fellowship and ideas with them. I believer that such sectarianism is demonic and is contrary to the spirit of Jesus Christ. I'm also no into such a high view of Mary. While I do recognize her significance in her role in the Kingdom, I will not pray to her and revere her as highly as the Orthodox and Roman Catholics do. I find no biblical support for these positions.
There are many thoughts and responses that come to mind after listening, but I will keep it to this. After years of wandering in the Protestant world, including being raised as a Protestant and earning a BS in biblical studies, it was and still is TOTALLY worth having my world turned up side down forsaking all else (not that my life and faith comes anywhere close to biblical followers of Jesus) to accept the One True Church and practice the original Christian faith. "Ask and you shall receive, knock and the door shall be opened unto you, SEEK AND YOU SHALL FIND." "The way is narrow and few there be that find it." Godspeed to you on your journey.
You are an honest young man. I was in a similar place as you as a senior in college on my way to seminary. I'm glad I didn't go through this publicly like you. I took a sociology of religion class that focused on conversion and I was very weary of converting fast or needlessly. So I appreciate your nuanced first answer that has that same concern. As for the rest. 1. Christ communed with the saints just as they did in maccabees. He talked to Moses and Elijah and said he knew Abraham. 2. Dr Ortland is incorrect. Please explore the ecumenical councils and their response to receiving converts from other denominations. Also, the willingness of the saints to die side by side with the non Orthodox. 3. The type of ecumenism that the Orthodox are weary of is the kind that seems to have taken hold. A brushing away of distinctives has lead to a thining of theological depth. Unity at the expense of truth is not helpful. However we are clearly involved in the ecumenical movement. I know for a fact that as a Methodist I knew the same Christ I know now as an Orthodox Priest. But the truth of the Church and the sacraments became too important. I came to a place where I wanted the depth of worship and had to convert. Much love and prayers for you my dear brother in Christ.
Would you mind elaborating on the ecumenical councils and non-orthodox Christians? Are protestant/catholic converts treated as new Christians (baptized)? Or are they just Chrismated (what is Chrismation)?
@@etheretherether the Ecumenical Councils give different lists for who needs to be Baptized and who doesn't in order to join the Church. Council to council these lists differ. This is because the denominations in question changed over time. Chrismation is the Eastern equivalent of confirmation. In modern times different Orthodox Churches apply these canons in different ways. Some Baptize almost everyone, others Baptize only those who come from non Trinitarian backgrounds. It is however becoming more difficult to be assured that a person comes from a Trinitarian background. Even if they come from denominations that previously would have been a sure thing. So if someone comes from somewhere like the Episcopal Church or Evangelical Lutherans we would not have baptized them 50 years ago. Now it is a sure thing that they probably need to be baptized. Unless they are from the older generation.
I'm not orthodox, but a church community here in Denmark is working side by side with an oriental orthodox monastery in Egypt, on several projects, and there's a strong bond and love between these respected communities.
Six year journey from charismatic, American evangelical, Protestant to Antiochian Orthodox. Many of the parishioners I’m in community with are converts. One of the parish priests is a convert. The saints and the Theotokos were areas that I had to wrap my head around, but the Holy Spirit truly revealed these to me. Like you said, do I have to forsake all my comfortable thoughts and ideas (apologies if that wasn’t the right thought), after the Holy Spirit revealed these things to me, I took the plunge. I see it. I work in ministry where most are of the Protestant faith. Christ is the center of the Orthodox faith and that is where I stay working those I do. I do believe the “non-orthodox Christians” are saved out of the sincerity of their heart in their confession. I converted on Holy Saturday of this year. I’m so happy that I did.
Thank you Austin, for your honesty! As an Orthodox Christian myself - I must say, Orthodox Christians should NOT be saying who is saved and who isn't. That decision is for God! Even Saint Paul himself did not claim to be saved. I don't know that there is really an 'official' stance on Christians outside of the Church, aside from the fact that we can't receive sacraments like the Eucharist together - simply because we don't know if we believe the same thing, and it would be dangerous for the one outside of the Church to come on contact with God in this manner. It also means that one might be received differently if they converted, depending on their background - baptism and chrismation, or just chrismation, and occasionally just confession. Anyway PLEASE keep doing what you are doing. You go where you find Christ - He is what it's all about. I'd have to profess that the fulness of the Christian faith was best preserved in the Orthodox Church - but that does not mean that anyone outside of the Church isn't Christian. You might find people who say that, but you can find people who say a lot of things! Anyway, you need to go where God puts you, because you are clearly a blessing to many of us. 🙏
Thank you for those incredible insights into Orthodoxy. I am in the throes of contemplation and prayer right now in regards to this. I was Seventh Day Adventist for 47 years (my husband still is) left and spent 6 years looking for the "right" Protestant church, left those and became Catholic 9 years ago. I am a searcher and I love my Lord, I only want to do what is pleasing to Him. Been looking into Orthodoxy for about a month through TH-cam, websites, books and my husband and I met with an Orthodox Priest, Your video resonated with my own thoughts and brought up points I hadn't considered. My husband has been a sincere Christian all his life and has been very patient with my struggles, even somewhat supporting where I am today (he could not do that with Catholicism).
First of all, I admire your courage in making this video with complete honesty. I also deeply appreciate how seriously you take your spiritual journey, and I recognize and sympathize with how stressful and confusing it can be. I am an Orthodox Christian myself. My entire household & I practiced wicca when I was a young person in high school, and I converted to Orthodoxy about 3 years after I graduated from high school. I want to give my unsolicited opinion on the some of the things you struggle with. It’s nice to share joy in the things we agree on, but real ecumenism is working out our salvation with fear and trembling as a group of believers, which includes bearing the cross of disagreement and differences. First thing I would mention is that I can relate to the feeling of novelty surrounding the ‘option’ that is Orthodoxy, within the greater western Christian landscape. When I think about this though, I often think about how some pagans in western europe must have felt when Christianity began to spread rapidly after it’s decriminalization in Rome. I mean, this was likely to them just another god being worshipped by people that were extremely foreign to them, and who brought an Idea which was extremely ‘Eastern’ in comparison to their religious traditions. I know that the analogy isn’t perfect, but the feeling of novelty in regards to Orthodoxy is something that I think is more of a reaction caused by insider/outsider bias, a natural inclination to be weary of things which are new and do not heavily resemble that which we subconciously have come to know and trust. In regards to the feeling of Orthodoxy seeming somewhat dis-ingenuous, I honestly think that it may have something to do with the insider/outsider problem as well. We view Orthodox reverence and practice through our Western lenses, see extreme acts of reverence and foreign traditions such as fasting, or even just the extremely serious nature in which the clergy approaches liturgical worship, and we see it as foreign, and sometimes we see a lack of the very charismatic, outwardly emotional behavior that until now we have subconciously associated with genuine reverence. I hope this comes across as simply a suggestion for thought, and I love you and your channel, and will be here supporting you no matter where you go from here. May God have mercy on me a sinner, and please pray for me. Thanks again! ☦️
I, as a Catholic, have great respect for my Orthodox brothers and sisters and their Church Fathers. Of course we have our differences but we are from the same root and we are one in Christ.
Halfway isn’t enough for my brothers and sisters in Christ; I want the fullest of the faith for them! Out of charity, I pray for full conversion to the One Holy Apostolic Faith found in the Catholic Church. ✝️🙏
@@traditionalgirl3943 How so? Catholics declared Pope as head of the church while original Christians, orthodox kept its theology, dogmatics as it was back than and di not change anything. Go learn history and then brag about who is deceieved
Born and raised atheist, became catholic, now orthodox. Very happy. Spiritually rich and at spiritual peace. The west used to be orthodox. St Patrick was orthodox. There was no orthodox/catholic split until 1000s, and officially until 1200s. No one in the west wouldn’t have known they weren’t in one apostolic church until the 1200s. Christ was pretty strict about people not being saved if they didn’t follow him. If orthodoxy is true, is necessary.
After attending a Divine Liturgy, I was driving home and suddenly felt this warm, burning in my heart. I knew then it was the church for me. As far ecumenism goes, the path is narrow 😂 that doesn’t bother me at all.
Great video Austin.
I used to be a Muslim, but I then left Islam for Orthodoxy. From my studies, the theology of Orthodoxy is sound and based in history. The spiritual life also, as an Orthodox Christian, is… indescribable (and that is an understatement). May God guide and bless us all!
God bless you.
Amazing to hear your testemony brother, thank you for sharing! May the peace of Christ and his love continue to be with you!!
Axios!
I'm so happy for you and I wish you a happy life, may god bless you
Beautiful brother!! Please what led you to Orthodoxy? Would love to hear your story.
I know there are also many similarities Bcz Orthodox we also do prostrations when praying, we face certain directions 🧭 (East) when praying or attending liturgy and also our churches face East and are sometimes dome shape like in Islam. And lots of fasting. Mohammad copied many things from early Christianity which he admired. He was just an Iconoclast and didn’t agree with icons (seeing it as idolatry) so he invented his new religion (or a satanic apparition appeared to him), but either way. We also do lots of prayers throughout our day or week. Would love to also hear your comparison of it.
What made you convert?
Becoming orthodox is probably one of the most difficult things any westerner, especially Protestant, will do. It will cost you everything. Your community, your career, your Family, Former friends, “brothers and sister in Christ” and those who have said they love you will reject and persecute you. Calling you an idol worshiper, and Mary worshiper, they no longer understand you and don’t relate to you. You are weird, and doing some other thing now, “we should pray for him, he’s lost”
They will tell you what you believe and make you defend it. You mostly likely will feel alone from all this. Orthodoxy in America is not like the comfortable evangelical community in America with a church on every corner and you pick your favorite. In any social setting someone might ask where you go to church and as soon as you say “st….” They have judged you and categorized you as “ReLiGioUS” in other social settings they will make jokes at your expense, because they are right and you are wrong. You will be challenged. It will cost you what you believe to be your ticket to heaven. You go from knowing you are saved, to seeking Gods true forgiveness with every prayer
Your pride will be broke from everything you thought you knew. It’s is a humble and meek journey.I know with certainty It was the best decision i made correctly that the Lord led me to. He tells us to leave everything and follow him. We are called to worship according to his will regardless of how we like or feel about it. Contrary to what I always believed as a Protestant, it’s not about me. It is all about the Lord Jesus Christ. I pray God has mercy on me, a sinner.
Your write up reminds me of my journey from being Roman Catholic. I was never confirmed but was told by my mom this is something for me to figure out and to decide but that I will be accepted either way. When I became orthodox and then when my brother wanted to be received into orthodoxy she was very defensive. He was crossing himself in the orthodox manner and was disturbed telling him hes wrong and that we are idol worshipers. She thought my conversion was due to having some strange obsession with Russia. The scriptures talks about what happens when we love Christ. And when I heard that I knew I was home in his Church, in communion with him. My mother eventually came around, She hasn't gone to any church in the last 10 years but said that we are Roman Catholic and we go to a Roman Catholic Church. The people who react this way know little about their own faith and have little affiliation with it and turn their unbelief around to make us look crazy or lost. I would be delighted to speak with you and pray you receive love from your Orthodox brothers and sisters.
I love this comment. I feel the same experience from my protestant family, but they don't talk religion with me at all anymore. They did come to my Orthodox wedding though and respected it. Being that my particular area has such a big Roman Catholic presence (The Roman Bishop being 25 minutes away) I find myself befriending many Catholics and us having a common respect for each other and our traditions.
@@theworldbeforeus1775 This rings so true... I have to remain calm and understand the ignorance my family members have. Unfortunately, they hurl accusations at me way before trying to understand the situation. They also thing I have an obsession with Russia, and maybe it is true, only to the extent that it is the current guardian of the Orthodox faith in the world.
Beautiful
The Orthodox Church is the toughest thing I have ever participated in. I wouldn't trade that for anything. My Mormon relatives hate me. My Southern Baptist relatives scratch their heads and wonder why I didn't become one of them. My wife, half of my kids, and now some of my grandchildren hold this as the true Pearl of Great Price.
My wife and I are being formally admitted to the (Russian) Orthodox Church this coming Saturday (20.11.2021) Previously Baptists
Welcome ☺
May the Holy Trinity bless you and cause His Face to shine upon you! Welcome Home from one previous baptist to another.
On the power of the laity in Orthodoxy. th-cam.com/video/Amp4vI-RkHw/w-d-xo.html
Congratulations!
God bless both of you. Greetings from Greece.
When I came to the Orthodox Church I went from a legalist fearing that I was a spider hanging over hell. To a church where God is a lover of mankind and desires a deepening and growing relationship and it is on me to work at it.
I've been cautiously approaching Orthodoxy, and I love this aspect that you pointed out, but what's terrifying is the idea that God's love really does seem conditional on being a part of the Canonical Church, at least, as far as Church canons have spoken, as well as Ss. Cyprian and Augustine. I look at a Coptic or Syrian Oriental Orthodox, and I simply can't see how it is that one Eucharist is the life-giving Body of Christ and the other (as St. John of Shanghai/San Francisco called it,) "demon food". It is an incredibly massive cognitive dissonance that has given me months of existential terror: Protestant/Catholic notions of penal substitution are barbaric and incomplete and lack the love Christ has for us, and simultaneously all those "Christians" might as well be damned because none of their sacraments have any efficacy, regardless of how much those "Christians" might genuinely weep with joy for what Christ has done for them (but really hasn't because they are not actually in the Church).
@@j.athanasius9832 good thing the only thing one needs to be a Christian is believing in Christ and Him being your Lord and Savior. The elements are good and all, but they aren’t a requirement for Heaven.
I heard a description a while back of the true relationship between us and God. I know its in the bible as well
We are like a ragged whore destitute and abandoned. In that state the king begins to woo us. Most of us are so broken we flee to our drunken abusers, but the king follows and continues to woo us. When we give in he binds our wounds and dresses us. And then we fall back into our whorish ways and he woos us back again.
_God is a lover of mankind_
As someone who is learning about orthodoxy, this statement doesn't entirely jive with the fact that some Orthodox Christians believe that other Nicean believing, apostles' and Athanasian creed affirming Christians are going to hell because they're not part of their church
As a Protestant or Catholic or any other religion, you are not part of the Church Christ created on the day of Pentacost. The only salvation WE KNOW OF is in the one catholic and apostolic church, the Eastern Orthodox church. But God can do anything. Look at the thief on the cross. It is not for an Orthodox Christian to know if someone else is saved, or not. Only God knows who He will save outside of the Church and what His criteria are.
As far as your concern about not being able to be western to be Orthodox, listen to St. John of Xianghai, "One must never feel that he has to be Eastern to be Orthodox. The West was Orthodox for 1000 years". Far from being strange or disingenuous, the Orthodox Church IS part of the heritage of the West too :D
Maybe it's more about abandoning the modern mind.
@@triscat I fully agree. Not joining the true Church because you think it's "not your culture" is just ridiculous.
Cope. Eastern Orthodoxy lacks relevance. It plays a very small part on the world stage. It’s obvious Catholicism is the true church and even non-believers recognize that and treat the Catholic Church as such.
Christians are not of this world! We cannot serve God and mammon...etc...
Austin, you mentioned that "the journey is far from over" in the description for this video concerning Orthodoxy, so pleased to see that.
I can tell you (personally speaking) that once one does make the decision to become Orthodox, the journey remains very far from being over; in so many ways it is just the beggining.
On the power of the laity in Orthodoxy. th-cam.com/video/Amp4vI-RkHw/w-d-xo.html
Whatever your reflections on Orthodoxy are at the moment, you've been a wonderful facilitator in introducing many great minds to this Orthodox convert. I will be forever touched by your interview with the sweet and loving Fr. Seraphim Aldea of Mull Monastery. Christ is risen!
Fr Seraphim Aldea is wonderful.
On the power of the laity in Orthodoxy. th-cam.com/video/Amp4vI-RkHw/w-d-xo.html
He is risen indeed
Indeed He is risen!
That interview killed my Evangelical positivist, rationalist, intellectual arguments in opposition to Holy Orthodoxy. I knew that whatever he was doing was clearly working and what I was doing wasn't. I've never seen Christ-like love like that in another human being as clearly than in that monk. Clearly the Orthodox Church shows the way to Theosis.
As a person who grew up Roman Catholic, lived a robust life of participation in the RCC, including four years of monastic life and over a decade as a lay ecclesial minister, who then, after almost two decades of being drawn to deeper engagement with the entire tradition of Orthodox Christianity, finally became an orthodox Christian about a decade ago, I want to say that I really like the way you talk about this. I also appreciate from my perspective as a pastoral psychotherapist. The process of unmooring from the tradition in which you grew up and were formed to seek, follow and know Christ is profoundly disturbing, and I would not recommend it unless you have forged a profound commitment to following Christ wherever Christ leads. That said, I also don’t think it is a good idea to become a catechumen until and unless you are doing so from a movement of joy at what you’ve seen in the Orthodox church, and are driven by love to give yourself fully to Christ in and through his Body, which you have become convinced is the Orthodox Church. I’ve learned over the past decade that there is vastly more difference than I thought between Orthodox Christianity and even Roman Catholicism, and that I still have so much more to learn. Whether you want to be Orthodox or not is not something I can know, and I don’t think anyone should do so without first having recognized that it is a way of surrendering reliance on one’s own ability to “think it through.” I mean, we should definitely think with sobriety and diligence about such weighty matters, but ultimately, the faith is more given than figured out. I applaud your investigation of how one best goes about being a disciple of Jesus, and appreciate your sharing your journey and thoughts. May your search lead you ever more fully into the arms of our loving God!
What a beautiful response!
Thank you for sharing your experience.
I grew up a fundamentalist Baptist, although through my teen years my mother no longer attended any church. I converted to an Apostolic Pentecostal church in my twenties, but quickly fell away... "All fire, but no fireplace," as Fr. Barnabas Powell says.
I spent my thirties as an atheist, then Taoist, Buddhist, occultist, finally ending up a more or less agnostic deist in my mid-forties.
All through all of that, I couldn't get away from Jesus- I could always sense Him there, waiting in the wings, so to speak. I denied His very existence, refuted Him, denounced Him, insulted Him, mocked His Holy Name (God forgive me), and still in moments of dire need I would feel the urge to speak to Him in prayer.
In the past few years, I sought to figure out what I believed. About a year ago, I asked God, if He was real, and really there listening, to let me know Who He was. And slowly I felt Him returning into my heart and mind, over months, as I opened up and prayed a little more often... Still unsure who I was even talking to, not wanting to believe, yet being led little by little.
Finally, in September of this year, I was completely broken by a personal loss in my family. I confessed to God my belief in Him, I asked Him to forgive me, although I was still hesitant and stiff-necked, my heart still mostly hardened against Him.
At the end of October, I experienced another breaking moment, and my heart was shattered. Not so much for myself this time, but for the world, and what I saw happening in it. I hit my knees, literally, for the first time in decades, and wept before God, begging His forgiveness, to please help us all, to help me be what He wanted.
I began to read the Scriptures again for the first time in a very, very long time. I prayed every night before sleep that He show me which way to go-- I didn't want to go back to a Pentecostal church; I had spent a couple of years recently as a hired musician in a Methodist church, and while I admired the simple love of others in the congregants, there was a worldliness there that I found unappealing... But I was willing to go wherever He wanted me. "Unwillingly willing," one might say lol.
Exactly a week later, I spoke with my oldest friend, someone who is like a brother to me whom I've known all my life, but who I didn't talk to very often any more. We'd last spoken several months to a year prior, and I remembered at the time he'd said he was exploring "Orthodoxy"-- I didn't ask at the time what exactly that meant. I knew nothing about the Orthodox Church, except that there was an episode of 'Seinfeld' where it featured, and I had some vague ideas about Eastern European "national" churches but was unsure what it entailed, despite having been interested in religion and spiritual traditions since childhood.
My old friend was emailing me to let me know that a mutual, older friend of ours had passed away in an accident. We commiserated over his passing briefly, and then began to talk about other things. Specifically, I told him that I'd begun to pray again, had rededicated myself to Christ. He told me that he was a catechumen in the Orthodox Church now, and that he was preparing for chrismation in December if all went well. I asked him what it was all about. He briefly laid out their doctrines (after warning me that he himself was still a babe in the faith, and really had no business teaching) on original sin, Man's relationship to God, how the Fall affected that, the Atonement, God's plan for us.
It hit me like a 10-ton spiritual sledgehammer. In a good - a VERY good- way. So many things that I had idly speculated about throughout the years, whenever my mind would wander to my then-former Christian beliefs, thoughts and ideas where I would think, "If the faith were like THAT, then maybe I could have held onto it", half-formed musings at the time, or so I thought... His explanation of Orthodoxy reinforced all that, as though I had been an archaeologist digging in the dirt, occasionally partially uncovering a bit here, a bit there, and suddenly all the concealing dirt was blown away in an instant, and I saw my half-formed ideas shown as they really were, and that they were all connected parts of a greater whole that was more perfect and more beautiful than I could have ever imagined.
While I didn't have a full vision, I kept seeing in my mind's eye a vague representation of a heavy cloth covered in dust and dirt, being snatched away to uncover what was beneath, and what was beneath was me, it was being pulled away from covering my face and letting in a breath of the sweetest, freshest air and a golden light... That kept replaying in my head, as I tried consciously to come to grips with everything, my mind reeling and joyous and absolutely smitten with the simple yet profound beauty of what I had read. I kept re-reading his email, wondering if it was too good to be true? Was there a catch somewhere? How had I never been taught this before? God really WASN'T an angry tyrant who nailed his son to a tree and then pointed to him, saying to humanity "See what you made me do?!?"
That was a little more than a month ago. I have felt the Holy Spirit leading me onwards, as I've read and learned, pondered and studied and argued with myself, for hours on end, nearly every single day. I praise God that He has kept His Church secure and full of His Light throughout the ages. I'm still learning, getting ready to attend a service for the first time, and looking forward to becoming a catechumen myself soon.
I have seen more and more people expressing an interest in Orthodoxy, seemingly out of nowhere, and it blows my mind. Finding guys in a black metal chat group suddenly popping up declaring their newfound love for Christ, asking if anyone knows about Orthodoxy... In a group formerly full of avowed pagans, satanists, atheists, most of whom would previously only spoken of *burning* churches, and now they're looking for one to attend 😃
God is indeed great. Praise the Lord Jesus Christ, and THANK YOU GOD, for your Holy Spirit, moving across the world like a mighty flood in these dark days.
@@aleisterbroley900 glory to God... Unknown are the ways God uses to draw the souls to Him... Go ahead without looking back... Come home... Praise the Lord for His mercy .. His Holy Spirit guides you to His true Church... Blessings🙏
God bless you and keep you! 💕☦️💕
@@casparbrock7441 same. Grew up Roman Catholic... Did nothing for me. Then I went through my agnostic atheist phase in high school, dove right afterward pretty hard into Zen Buddhism for about 10 years. This was great for me at the time since it didn't throw hardly any dogma at me, but did show me the importance of ritual; I still value the techniques for watching my thoughts that I picked up during this phase. Early to mid 20s I dabbled around a little with Chaos Magick, tarot, psychedelics, etc. Never got too hard into all that thankfully, but it did confirm to me that there was a metaphysical reality behind the curtain of the present reality, and helped shatter my materialism. Thus, I also tried to adopt Asatru and Odinism for a couple years. I still find it fascinating to learn about my ancestors and what they believed, but as a spiritual pursuit of truth, it was simply a dead end. Finally, orthodoxy came to me, quite literally as a calling. That is honestly the best way I can describe it... I had no interests at all in being a weird Jesus freak, but it was a series of powerful synchronicities I couldn't ignore know which directly put me into a church. So I got curious, went down the rabbit hole, and realized that everything I thought I knew about Christianity in the West was just about completely wrong; I still continue to learn more and more and more about the faith the deeper I dig... It's never ending.
I've been a part of the Antiochan Orthodox Church for almost 4 years now (this Pascha), and I've never felt more at home.
I still remember my senior telling me that her Christian group in University was curious about Church history and other matters. By the end of the 4 years, 5 of them became Catholic (with 1 becoming a religious sister), and 2 of them becoming Orthodox (1 Russian 1 Greek). None of them remained a “mere Christian” or whatever they started off with.
That story made a lasting impact on me.
One thing I know for sure: everyone who genuinely seeks Christ is found by Him.
I didn't or wasn't. Just had a feeling of calmeness, but no Jesus you're speaking of.
@@terminusadquem6981 Why is calmness so highly esteemed? considering that many farm animals also remain calm before the slaughter.
@@terminusadquem6981 God lies in silence
@@Troy-Moses Animals are not senseless of their Creator
@@mariaathanassiou5264 "Praise the LORD from the earth, ye dragons, and all deeps: Fire, and hail; snow, and vapour; stormy wind fulfilling his word: Mountains, and all hills; fruitful trees, and all cedars: *Beasts, and all cattle; creeping things, and flying fowl* ..." and " *Let every thing that hath breath praise the LORD* . Praise ye the LORD." -- Psalms
I'm an Orthodox Catechumen, and I really enjoy your show Austin. Would love to have you as a guest on MINE! 😃
What is your site?
@Mark it's here on TH-cam. A Devotional Heart 🌿
Subbed! God Bless!!!
The WORD says the 7th day is holy
The WORLD says the 1st day is holy
JESUS says Sabbath is holy
POPE says Sunday is holy
🤔WHO DO YOU OBEY?
To: A devotional heart I'm happy you have a channel helping others. Keep up the good work.'
I'm personally excited for this one as I've been on a journey studying orthodoxy myself
Me too
God bless you, me too!
The WORD says the 7th day is holy
The WORLD says the 1st day is holy
JESUS says Sabbath is holy
POPE says Sunday is holy
🤔WHO DO YOU OBEY?
@@protestant7778 the word also says one man considers one day holy and another considers all holy. Both do so unto the Lord. Paul in Romans 14
5 One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. 6 Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God; and whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God. 7 For none of us lives for ourselves alone, and none of us dies for ourselves alone. 8 If we live, we live for the Lord; and if we die, we die for the Lord. So, whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord.
The Church came together on the first day of the week to honor the Resurrection not because of the Pope. So be sure you know what the heck you’re talking about before you start making claims.
Acts 20:7
On the first day of the week we came together to break bread. Paul spoke to the people and, because he intended to leave the next day, kept on talking until midnight.
1 Corinthians 16
1 Now about the collection for the Lord’s people: Do what I told the Galatian churches to do. 2 On the first day of every week, each one of you should set aside a sum of money in keeping with your income, saving it up, so that when I come no collections will have to be made. 3 Then, when I arrive, I will give letters of introduction to the men you approve and send them with your gift to Jerusalem.
Totality of Scripture
The entire book of Romans does NOT mention the word "sabbath" even once!
What Romans ch.14 is speaking of is 👉FASTING for the Lord
👉(Romans 14:6) a day of fasting!
Of which I understand we are at liberty to choose what day to fast or not!
NOWHERE in the Bible is the sabbath day, a day of the week to pick or choose !!!!
Because of your interview with Father Josiah Trenham, I began searching for an Orthodox Church to attend. Growing up low-church Protestant, there are definitely some dogmas that I struggled with. Especially the Marian dogmas of perpetual virginity and assumption. As time went on, these things were explained to me in a way that just made sense. I can thank my priest for that. The Orthodox life is also a strict one. Lenten fasts and prayer regimen are basically the antithesis of western life. But in all honesty, it's the rigorous work that makes me appreciate Orthodoxy more. I may not be able to earn my salvation, that was already bought for me when Christ made the ultimate sacrifice, but I feel like I'm putting my money where my mouth is in terms of faith. I became a catechumen in August of this year. I can proudly say that I will be able to share this deep and ancient faith tradition with my children when they are born. That alone makes all the hard work worth it. Thank you for introducing me to Orthodoxy. I'm but one of the many lives you've touched with your content. May God bless you and keep you!
I converted a couple years ago to EO after roughly 20 years as a protestant. I applaud you for being willing to make this journey, and to do so in such a public forum!
You may have misunderstood what was said about the exclusivity of Orthodoxy. What the Orthodox hold fast to, what we draw hard lines on, is what the church is. We believe that the EO church is the church created by Jesus and the Apostles. I converted in large part due to the historical accuracy of this claim. However, even though we are bold in our claims about the church, the sacraments are still a mystery, even to us within the EO church. We can't claim to know how salvation works - we just know what we are supposed to do in the practice of the church. As a result, I have actually found that it is less likely than any other form of Christianity for those in the EO church to point the finger and claim that other people are not saved. In fact, when an Orthodox person is completely honest, they will likely say that they don't know for certain that they themselves are saved. This is actually the most honest approach to salvation - only God knows; it is our job to follow the traditions of His church. This isn't an acceptance of Universalism, it is just to say we don't know who else could be saved, and it's not our place to know. We continue the traditions that have been passed down to us.
With regards to the other forms of Christianity, some EO may be bold enough to say they aren't Christian, but this is different than saying we know they are not saved. We simply know that they are not following the traditions formed by Christ and the Apostles. They are following traditions that have Christian elements, but they are not in the church. This is hard for us westerners to grapple with because we grew up in a multi-denominational world, but consider the EO perspective: the EO have maintained the pre-schism traditions as closely as possible. This is a perspective that comes from a time when there was truly one church, and not a bunch of denominations to sort through. The EO have held to that while the rest of the world changed. This is why the EO would not say that all Christians are "Orthodox."
As bold as the EO claim is, when I look back on all I was taught as a protestant (I also have a Master's degree in theology from an Evangelical college), I feel that the Protestant/Evangelical churches actually make much bolder claims. In these western forms of Christianity, where sola scriptura and sola fide are the cornerstone of theology, pastors will not only claim to know how salvation works, but also who is saved and who is not. Believe the correct interpretation and say the right prayer and you're saved. Never heard the teaching nor said the prayer? Damned for eternity. This view seems much bolder to me, and this theology has incredibly harsh consequences to those who are outside of the Protestant world. How could so many people be damned by God? One of the few "outs" that Western Christians have to this quandary is to resort to Calvinism - personally I found that spiritual paradigm too dark to bear.
Sorry if this was too long. I encourage you to keep inquiring. More than anything, I try to stress to other Christians how different Eastern Orthodoxy is. It is a total theological shift that should not be underestimated, and even if you choose to convert sometime in the future, you will need to pace yourself and give yourself time. One good thing about EO is that it's not really based on head knowledge (western thought), but rather it is based on experiential knowledge (eastern thought) ie being part of the life of the Church. So if you really want to understand EO, just keep visiting services as the EO go through the liturgical cycle. Highly recommended services: Forgiveness Vespers and of course, Pascha.
God Bless, peace be with you.
Former Protestant here as well. The “a journey to fullness of the faith” DVD series, introduction to orthodoxy, a 101 if you will, by Father Barnabas Powell a former Pentecostal, really helped me navigate some of these issues, as I similarly struggled with whether I really was a Christian as a Protestant. Well, we are all on different paths and responsible for what is laid before us and what we do with it. The title itself which mentions the FULLNESS of the faith was in itself helpful. I believe he said that as a Protestant his faith was just “too small”. This made sense to me. I just plain didn’t know. But once I found out, I choose to follow where the truth would lead me so as to grow INTO the fullness of my faith, which for me is the Orthodox Church.
This was extremely well put. In my experience, Orthodox are the only Christians who don't automatically assume all Muslims/Buddhists/Hindus/etc. go to hell because they haven't prayed the Sinner's Prayer. Rather, God will judge us based on how what we know and how we respond - and that goes for heterodox Christians as well. If anything, becoming Orthodox really raises the bar of what God expects from you; a higher risk, higher reward situation. A Hindu woman who unknowingly exhibits a Christlike life might end up saved and occupy a better place in eternity than the lousy Orthodox Christian (like me!) But if she had known the fullness of the Christian faith in Orthodoxy she would be equipped with the tools to reach a far greater degree of holiness (and eternal reward.) That is why we must spread the Gospel and the fullness of the Church - to say nothing of those people consumed by sin who would have repented if they had been exposed to Christ.
To be without the Church is not hopeless, but to be with it offers far greater hope than you'd have otherwise.
I agree with all the points you've made here. Spot on. I attended a Baptist church and found the judgemental attitude there about what the true way is far stronger than anything I have seen in any Orthodox church. I think such things are definitely very subjective and yoi raised many important points
Awesome response. Thank you for taking the time to write that out.
Did not have time to read all of this, but I want to later. What you said about it being less likely for EO to claim other people are not saved is something that Fr. Trenham mentioned in a homily. He said that the orthodox say they hope to be saved, while they are more likely to believe others are saved rather than themselves. Interesting remark. Hope to read the rest!
Im a Sikh, who has been studying Theology at a postgraduate level for several years.
I have been tracing your journey for the past year and have been inspired by your honesty, openness as well as the recourses that you have shared.
Perhaps one of the ways of overcoming your challenge with what (at least to me) perhaps seems like a “cultural shock” is the fact that Christianity really is a middle eastern tradition which has for so long been claimed by a western hermeneutical experience, mainly due to the way western culture has formed in the reception of Christian ideals, teachings and traditions.
@Ben De Maria If you say so!
@Ben De Maria My understanding though is that Limbo is not a Catholic dogma. So I don't think that should be part of the list.
I hope you don't hold the West's interpretation against Christ.
@@kimberlymoore8172 These guys remind me of the disciples of Christ arguing about who is the greatest. Merry Christmas everyone. Hope to meet all Orthodox & Catholics in heaven.
Absolutely spot on
Please consider interviewing Fr. Spyridon :)
Can you imagine how peaceful having those two on one show would be? Pure 🤌🏻
I couldnt really see father Spyridon doing something like that
Fr Spyridon Bailey
@@brendandoshi629 most peaceful interview ever
@@Luka-lw5tl Why? He uploads on youtube weekly and has many books on Amazon, he's not some luddite
I am a devoted Roman Catholic but I have learned a lot about the Orthodox Church through your channel. I am not sure if I would have been exposed to it otherwise. I am richer for having read some of their texts and will continue to do so in the future. Thank you for your channel.
Come visit your Eastern Catholic brothers! You will fall in love😁
@@ephesiansbrowne5982 I am sure that would be quite an experience!
same here, there's no way all these early churches were wrong about apostolic succession
@@ephesiansbrowne5982 I went to roman catholic schools and we use to go on field trips to eastern orthodox catholic churches
Same here :)
17:30 in my experience, Orthodoxy doesn't teach that there is no salvation outside the Church. Rather, the Church is where you find the true doctrine being taught and the whole apostolic tradition preserved, but we don't judge the salvation of anyone, not even ourselves. God Himself is the final judge, and we can pray for His mercy upon anyone, but we cannot say whether anyone is saved or not since we don't know their heart as God does. Thief on the cross and whatnot.
I'm British and feel like I have returned to Orthodoxy. These lands were originally Orthodox before the schism so it feels like a reconnection to my ancient heritage
That's true. There were even English speaking warriors and generals from Britain who acted as the Emperor's bodyguard in Byzantium and alot of them having fled there after the conquest of William the Bastard
England was Orthodox before 1054? Hahaha You really can read everything on internet.
@@XDomyX The English Church was considered canonically Orthodox until the Norman conquests.Harold of England is viewed as the Last Orthodox King of England and some even considered him a martyr saint.
@@zaccheusanton9470 Firstly, there was no english church. Like there was no french or german church. There was the Catholic church, or the Church of Rome, which was the patriarchy for the West. It is really funny to read comments from protestants that deny this well known fact. Now protestant converts to orthodoxy push this silly story again, but now that early “english church” was orthodox, whereas before that was protestant. Every serious historian can only laugh at this. You must understand that christianity in England before the 16th century was part of the Catholic church, part of the Patriarchy of Rome with western rites. Period. What we will have in future? When a protestant decides to become a Jehovah witness, he will claim that the early christians in England were like them haha. England must be anything but catholic 🤣
@@XDomyX I meant that the English church was considered canonical . Yes they had a western rite like Western Orthodox (or "Catholic" in the pre-schismatic sense). The Western Church was considered Orthodox before the schism. There is an Orthodox western rite today in terms of liturgics and they have the same beliefs as the rest of the Church. I don't know how Protestantism factors into what I said.
I completely understand the whole comfort in protestantism thing. I struggled with it as well. I was born into a non-denominational Protestant church and I struggled for about a year with making the decision of converting to orthodoxy. All my family is Protestant, all my wife's family including my wife is Protestant. All my friends are Protestant. I was even a member of the worship band in my old church so I have an idea of the thought process you are going through. However it came to a point where I felt I had to be honest with myself and my family so I made the decision to convert. While I personally don't agree with the statement that there is no salvation outside the Orthodox Church, for me it felt like my salvation was on the line simply because I was being dishonest with myself and my family. On January 16th it will be a year since I baptized into the Orthodox Church. My wife and my kids are still struggling with my decision but I personally do not regret it. It feels weird though going to church alone now because my family still attends the Protestant church but I have peace that I'm being honest with myself and everyone. My wife at least recognized that I have improved as a person, a husband, and a father since converting. That has helped her in accepting my decision.
You are on your own walk with God, and I understand that. However, as someone who grew up in a broken household, going to church every sunday without one parent can be very damaging to a child's social-emotional well being. Think of it from a child's perspective. If Sunday, is the day that we're supposed to worship God, but is also when mommy and daddy separate. It changes the view of the sabbath from something holy to something divisive and upsetting. And personally, I would ask you to look into yourself and see how much of your decision was to satisfy your own desires both spiritually and emotionally at the expense of your family's? Again, only God knows your heart, but do not mistake selfish desire for closure for personal salvation.
Thanks for the post! Totally get it…
May God Bless you my Brother and Lord have mercy on us all.
God bless you and your family
@@sansbazinga9821What an odd thing to say. A mixed religious household is not "broken" and not comparable to a divorced family.
My wife and I are becoming catechumens this coming Sunday
Wow! Best of luck on the journey
Many Catholics easily stray away from the faith that they received. What are the reasons for their falling into complacency, becoming indifferent and even hostile towards Christ and the Christian Faith?
The fault with many Catholics is that they think baptism is a graduation from having acquired knowledge and understanding of their faith. After completing their catechism classes or RCIA journey, they no longer seek out opportunities to continue growing their faith, both doctrinally and spiritually. Their only occasion to grow in faith is the one-hour Mass that they attend every Sunday. This is hardly enough to sustain the life of a Catholic. Those who do not grow in their faith are already losing their faith. There is no neutrality.
How, then, can we grow in our faith? Firstly, we need to deepen our intimacy with God through Christ. In Christ, we come to know and love the Father. Secondly, we must be rooted in the Word of God. We cannot grow in our faith without deepening our love and appreciation for the Word of God through bible study and most of all, a prayerful reading and sharing of the Word of God.
Thirdly, we must seek the support of the Christian community. A Catholic without the support of his fellow Catholics will eventually fall out from the faith, especially when he undergoes the trials and challenges of life, the influence of secularism, and the materialistic, individualistic and atheistic views of the world. Fourthly, to grow our faith, we need to evangelise and be a witness to Christ. We evangelise ourselves by evangelising others. By sharing our faith with others, we strengthen our own faith. By teaching our faith to others, we grow in understanding and clarity in what we believe in.
Finally, growing in faith is to grow in our Christian life. This is the most effective form of witnessing. It means that those of us who are baptised must live a life of holiness and purity, free from sin and a bad conscience. A life of holiness and charity are the fruits of a strong spiritual life and a life of hope founded in the promises of God.
If the Catholic Church is accused of being satanic, that is no more than its Founder, Jesus Christ, was accused of. When our Lord was on earth, he had the same problem. He was driving demons out, and some said he was doing this by the power of the devil. How did Jesus respond? He said, “How can Satan drive out Satan? If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. And if a house is divided against itself, that house will not be able to stand. And if Satan has risen up against himself and is divided, he cannot stand; that is the end of him” (Mk 3:23-26).
The Catholic Church drives out the devil, too. This practice is called exorcism. No one can deny that the Catholic Church has been doing exorcisms on people and driving out Satan for nearly two millennia. Therefore, we must reason like Jesus: If the Catholic Church were from the devil, it could not drive the devil out.
We shouldn’t be surprised when such charges are made against the Catholic Church. Jesus told us, “A disciple is not above his teacher, nor a servant above his master; it is enough for the disciple to be like his teacher and the servant like his master. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebul, how much more will they malign those of his household” (Mt 10:24-25).
God bless you... Praise the Lord that he has led you to His true Church... Blessings
@@GospelSimplicity thank you, it was your videos of touring the Orthodox church and interviewing the priest that first exposed me to orthodoxy, I probably never would have found it if it wasn't for you.
Former Protestant myself, my wife and I will celebrate our third year since our chrismation on April 14. It’s been an interesting journey. I could say so much about what was essentially a 4 -5 year process. It has upset some family members to varying degrees. But it’s a decision we had to make. I like what Father Barnabas Powell said. He said something like the following:
It’s like you have been living in this tiny room your entire life and then one day you opened the door to this huge mansion full of beauty and experienced the fullness of this Faith that has been preserved for 2,000 years. And you are just like “wow!”
Many years!
I was an evangelical pastor and educated through the Vineyard Institute and have as of this year become a catechumen in the Greek Orthodox church. Would love to chat with you about this at some point regarding your questions/issues (for lack of a better term). I think I can bring knowledge from the best of both worlds and give light as to why I went east.
Certainly, visiting cities like Thessaloniki and Corinth, going to the Republic of Georgia, and learning about the history and continuity of the church in these places helped tremendously. Also, learning about how ancient people think and viewed the world was really helpful to understanding Orthodox "thinking". Anyways, would love to chat, I think it would be valuable for both of us!
Testimonies like yours are most valuable, since who knows better Protestantism than its pastors? , more than laity... So you can help our friend with his hesitation... In fact this phenomenon of whole protestant congregations with their pastors converting to Orthodoxy is unique... God bless you brother and may enlighten Austin to feel the certainty about Holy Orthodoxy in his heart... Blessings
Both of the local priests at my church are Protestant pastor converts. Welcome!
You can read Becoming Orthodox by former evangelical pastor Peter Gillquist.
Former non practicing Protestant here, being Orthodox since 25 years, after 2 years after finding it.
@@zealousideal Wow, what a powerful testimony from you and the OP. I'm Catholic, but I believe Orthodox also shares apostolic authority unlike Protestantism, with all due respect to the latter. I tolerate and respect -- love even -- the erring (which I believe to be Protestants), but I have nothing for the error (primarily "Protestantism" and its heretical teachings that vary from one denomination to another). That might not sound charitable, but on the contrary, I'm saying that out of love and charity. While I personally believe that Catholic Church has the fullness of truth, don't get me wrong, Orthodox is infinitely better than Protestantism. The fact that there are far, far, far more pastors or more learned Protestants, usually after undergoing serious study, that leave their denominations for the Catholic or Orthodox faith than priests going the other way round (coincidentally or not, are usually those that have been deposed from office too because of abuses from what I've seen so far), while not proof by itself, should give anyone a pause. It's usually the laity (usually by reason of feelings) that leave Catholic/Orthodox faith for Protestantism. On the other hand, the Protestant "laity" usually leave by reason of "reason," and emotions are only secondary.
@david Glory to God ☦️🙏 may God bless you and your family!
My family and I were baptized into the Orthodox Church three years ago. It was a beautiful journey out of western Protestantism. Bless you on your journey 🙏🏻 💕
I’m an Orthodox Christian and I appreciate your feedback. It’s respectful and I completely understand how foreign it would seem to you. I often feel like Protestant churches are very foreign to me.
On the power of the laity in Orthodoxy. th-cam.com/video/Amp4vI-RkHw/w-d-xo.html
I have been in Protestant churches my entire 49 years on earth. The last 15-18 years have brought so much denegration in those churches, so much worldliness being welcomed in. I, too, feel like a foreigner in the Protestant churches. Unfortunately, most have turned their backs on Christ and His teachings, and walked away.
I am Orthodox and I really appreciated this! Your point about the way that Orthodoxy doesn't feel "genuine" to a westerner and seems like a modern thing to be able/willing to convert to an eastern Christian tradition at all, that really resonates with me. I've been Orthodox now for many years and it is still a thought that crosses my mind. The idea of "personal preference" is really difficult. It's something, though, that I think is part and parcel with the "conversion" mindset itself, not just Orthodoxy. Anyone who converts from one religion to another is sort of a strange person in that regard since religion is not so much a collection of dogmas and ideas as it is a way of living and the foundation/language of culture itself. So to change from one to another, especially one that is so different from your cultural context, completely throws you off balance in a way. You're treading totally new territory, looking at the world in new ways, and all the while carrying along the history and "baggage" of your previous identity.
I think the only way I really manage that is through a narrative about the west that convinces me I can't stay. I need my children and grandchildren to have the best possible shot at maintaining a deep, meaningful relationship with Christ and when I look around at what western culture has become, I'm convinced that can't happen if I don't leave it behind (at least insofar as I can). It's a sad thing, not something I like to dwell on, but it's the truth of where I am and how I landed here.
I don't think you quite understand the exclusivity aspects, but I think you will in time if you talk to more Orthodox about that. It's all part and parcel with the ontological soteriology of the church. A lot of the conflict you describe I think is really just a misunderstanding of terms and perhaps a misunderstand of the stakes at play. There are Christians outside of Orthodoxy, but also there aren't, because salvation is ontological and there is only one baptism.
Anyway, thank you for this video! I appreciated it!
I have really appreciated your honesty, openness, and charity throughout your discussions with Orthodox Christians. Thank you for that! I converted to Orthodoxy from a lifetime of non-denom evangelicalism about a year and a half back, and had many of your same hesitations and concerns. In the end, it felt like Orthodoxy (led by God, of course) chose me, rather than the reverse. I just couldn't deny its truth anymore. No one else in my family made the jump, so I'll tell you what I've said to them: Seek God and His Truth and He will lead you right where He wants you. God bless you, and thanks again for your videos!
@@778FraxK Time to end the Great Schism, brother!
@@JonGabriel @Tomás Same boat, just the same direction as Tomás for my wife and I. God bless you both and may this schism end soon.
I have converted to Orthodoxy thanks to your interview with Fredericka M. Green. Thanks!
On the power of the laity in Orthodoxy. th-cam.com/video/Amp4vI-RkHw/w-d-xo.html
That is so beautiful. Glory to God!
Huge respect for your honesty. As a Orthodox Christian growing up in the West, and therefore being influenced by Western Christianity, I understand where you're coming from. I will pray for you that God leads you to the truth. God bless you and your family 🙏🏼
Jeff cavins an ex evangelical pastor convert to RCC. Said we can not replace the true presence of Jesus with better music that makes us “feel good”. Our emotions can and do lie to us. If we base our faith on how we feel then we will be deceived every day
As an Orthodox convert I appreciate your honesty. Do take your time. Unfortunately, some convert too quickly and you may have seen some of the fruits of that, especially online. I too struggled with many of the same things you did before I finally converted. I also resisted converting for a long time. I hope and wish you the best. Keep on journeying!
Austin, I have really enjoyed your videos exploring the historical branches of Christianity. They were helpful to me when I was inquiring into Orthodoxy, and as I moved into the catechumenate. While I admit I had less mental deliberation than you-which I admire, and I really respect the careful thought you've given to the most important aspect of your life-I empathize with your hesitancy when it comes to ecumenism and heterodox Christians. My whole family is Protestant; most of my friends are Protestant; all my ancestors were Protestant. My family has asked me if I think they're not saved, and they're not really reassured when I tell them I don't know if *I'm* even saved, LOL. But here are my unsolicited thoughts on the matter, and I hope at least some of it is edifying and beneficial to you.
You know the goal of the Christian's life is theosis: "Blessedness, or, what is the same thing, the kingdom of heaven or of God...but also to receive an influx of the divine, and, as it were, to suffer deification" (St. Theodoros the Great Ascetic). Our whole lives must be oriented to Christ, with the hope of becoming as much like Him as is possible in this life. Our first command is to love God with all our hearts, souls, minds, and strength; we are responsible for working out our own salvation with the grace and assistance of Christ. Because we view and know the Church to be the sure deposit of the Faith, with the omnipresent and transcendent grace of God, we know the Church to be a sure vehicle of attaining salvation. This is not to say that all in the Church will be saved (and we cannot know who is or is not saved), but it is truly the Body of Christ, and our faithful participation in His Body is what saves us. We have the means of forgiveness and absolution; we consume the Body and Blood of Christ and participate in His energies; we abide in the company of the saints gone before us.
For the heterodox Christian, attaining theosis without the Church is like swimming upstream in a rushing river. You do not have the proper "equipment" or support structure to complete the task at hand. You may be exceedingly dedicated your whole life, and you may make significant progress given your circumstances. But you are ultimately operating without all the tools available to you. Salvation is by no means an easy process, even when one is *in* the Orthodox Church; outside her, it is even more difficult. Says St. Maximus the Confessor, "Created things are not by nature able to accomplish deification, since they cannot grasp God. To bestow a consonant measure of deification on created beings is within the power of divine grace alone."
We know, however, that God examines the hearts of every man and desires that all be saved (1 Tim. 2:4), showing mercy to whom He will (Rom. 9:18). He does not "[wish] that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance" (2 Pet. 3:9). St. Peter of Damascus says that "alike before the Law, under the Law, and under grace, there have been many righteous men-men who preferred the knowledge of God and His will to their own thoughts and wishes." In the book of Jeremiah (17:10), God says, "I, the Lord, search the heart, I test the mind, even to give every man according to his ways, according to the fruit of his doings." We know God judges us on our works, which are an outpouring of our faithfulness to Him, and the orientation of our hearts to Him. So ecclesiologically, we can say with certainty that the heterodox are not members of the Body of Christ. We cannot, however, make comment on the eternal destination of the heterodox, for we are not God and do not know their hearts, nor His mercies. This is often seen as a cop-out answer, but I think that comes from a (very understandable) desire to be certain of our salvation. Again, though, we are not responsible for the salvation of anyone but ourselves.
As St. Theophan the Recluse said, "You ask, will the heterodox be saved…Why do you worry about them? They have a Savior Who desires the salvation of every human being. He will take care of them. You and I should not be burdened with such a concern. Study yourself and your own sins…I will tell you one thing, however: should you, being Orthodox and possessing the Truth in its fullness, betray Orthodoxy, and enter a different faith, you will lose your soul forever."
It is not our job, nor our right, nor even an option for us to speculate on the salvation of any individual, even ourselves. Our job is simply to love God, love others, and pray for our mutual salvation and unity with Christ. Prayer for another's salvation-Orthodox, heterodox, or non-Christian-is a more fruitful and loving choice than worrying about salvation or arguing who can or can't be saved. This isn't an easy thing to accept-God only knows how much I have agonized over the souls of people I know-but it is our calling as Christians, Orthodox or not.
very good elaboration of the Orthodox faith ...God bless you..!!
@Ben De Maria It’s not our place to say who’s to be saved and who’s not. Everyone can be saved even up to the last minute. Remember the thief on the cross. The key word here is repentance.
Blessings
The official teaching of the Eastern Orthodox Church is that all who are not inside of it are damned and doomed. '' No salvation outside of the church '' '' If you are not in the ark you will be drowned. '' Of course reality testifies against that, the evidence of the work of the Holy Spirit is manifest and visible. New births, healings, renewals with people who hated Christ becoming born again and changing completely, people delivered from homosexuality and given totally a new heart, these works of the Spirit happen every day and they happen outside of that organization which says that the Spirit only works within its walls. It is only recently that they have started subtely changing their teaching on this, and we can understand that, as the world becomes globalized and more people enter in contact with other denominations where you see just as much faith, virtue, and devotion to Christ, it becomes difficult to explain how everyone else is a hellbound heretic so the discourse slightly changes toward the '' we don't know, we can't really say '' making a small room for rare exceptions when these are not even exceptions but rules. And if the teaching is problematic, the shift in the teaching toward moderation is even more problematic because the Eastern Orthodox church stakes its entire credibility on never changing its teachings and never erring into falsehood, but by changing their line on the destiny of the '' heterodox '' they admit that they can change their teachings and the change itself admits a correction which implies errancy into falsehood. And if they can err on that question, what other question have they erred about ? Suffice it to say that as someone who considered orthodoxy, this makes the title of the '' one true church '' untenable and not credible.
I must tell you......I'm not surprised; saw this coming! I came into the Orthodox Church 5 years after drawing closer and closer for 15 years.....The Orthodox Service takes us back closer to the time of Jesus and the Apostles. The spirit is drawing you in! God bless you!
Looking forward to hearing your thoughts! You have had some great conversations with wonderful Orthodox Christian guests.
On the power of the laity in Orthodoxy. th-cam.com/video/Amp4vI-RkHw/w-d-xo.html
Austin, I am in a very similar place as you. Coming from a similar "low church Evangelical Protestant" background, I actively started exploring the Orthodox church about 5 years ago. I have been very drawn to it, but have the same reservations as you. All this is to say, your channel has been an incredibly helpful resource for me as I navigate these questions. Thank you so much for having the courage to do all of this online with an audience - it must not be easy. Much love and appreciation, brother! God bless.
I resonate with this too sister. Thanks for sharing.
What have you decided?
Such a wonderful and vulnerable episode. You are right about the exclusivity of Orthodoxy. It was a stumbling block for me for quite a while after I converted (in 1994). Before that, I was a pastor, missionary, and seminary professor. I was ALSO very comfortable where I was at and ultimately DID suffer social, familial, financial, and several other kinds of temptations and negative consequences when I converted. That said, nothing in my life has been more worthy. I deeply regret my own sins and failures, but never for a moment have I regretted becoming Orthodox.
A quick correction... we don't say that ANYONE is "unsaved," since we are all on our journeys TOWARD salvation. I would be so bold as to say that this is as close to being "official" and "universal" as it gets... it is not our job, not our right, not within our purview, to even SPECULATE about another's salvation. The moment the thought would cross our minds about so-and-so not being Orthodox and therefore is not "saved," the Orthodox inclination would be to cross ourselves and say the Jesus prayer... lest we lose our own souls. In fact, we are HOPEFUL and even optimistic about the salvation of our Baptist parents and even our Mormon neighbors, not because those systems are not soul destroying (to varying degrees), but because of the love and mercy of God... and because of His indulgence in answering our unworthy prayers for them. We are LESS confident about our own salvation (Yes, hopeful and trusting, but never presumptuous)... never taking it for granted, always returning to our knees in repentance, fully recognizing the abject sin in our own lives and hearts (yet, blinding ourselves to others' sins). Salvation is a process which culminates at the Great Judgment when our resurrected bodies are glorified and we are welcomed into eternity. Until then, any talk about who is "saved" and who is "not saved" is just silly. At the same time, we are bold in proclaiming what is Orthodox teaching and practice and what is heretical, what is the Church, the Body of Christ, and what is not. To Protestant ears, it might sound like we are condemning individuals to hell, denying the work of God in their lives, etc., but this is NOT the case.
As to ecumenism... so much could be said here. It took me quite a while to reject this "practice"/inclination as contrary to the very goals I thought I was furthering through ecumenism, but it eventually clicked. I'd be willing to dialog further on this, but it seems to me that it is more of a conviction that grows with the challenging of preconceptions, definitions, etc., and this through experience with the fruit of the exercise. My only advice at this point would be to pray for wisdom, love everyone, and follow your conscience (which I am convinced you are already doing). You might find that ecumenism isn't exactly what you think and the Orthodox rejection of ecumenism isn't exactly what you perceive it to be, either.
I'm a big fan, supporter, and recommender of your channel... and that whether you take the plunge or not. :D
well said...testimonies like yours count a lot..
Wonderful!
I was protestant for 60 years - The many different churches in my small hometown confused me as a child. When God brought me to O. it all became clear to me that He did “establish His church” ….
The “other Christians” issue is, for me, totally in His Loving Hands - and I have loads of family & friends in that camp.
I just have peace after years of
wondering: “why so many churches?” God bless you🙏🏻
I converted from non denominational to Eastern Catholic. It was extremely challenging for my whole family! Fast forward 5 years, my wife and kids have all been baptized and joined me in the church! Praise God ☦️
That's not Orthodoxy but ok
@@gregcoogan8270 I like to call it Catholic with heavy Orthodox flavours 😂
This is true, it is not Orthodoxy. However, liturgically, it is very similar.
@@frankflammini6935 might as well become orthodox tbh
Ignore the haters, it is Orthodoxy. We just want mom and dad to get back together. :D
Austin, I've been following your channel quite awhile now and really enjoyed it, including this review of Orthodoxy one year later. I'm an Orthodox convert and went through many of the struggles you are, especially those about what the consequences would be to my family, friends in former Protestant church, job(s), etc. I appreciate very much your candid thoughts and honesty in trying to deal with the intellectual questions and emotional/psychological responses. You're doing fine, my friend - keep doing what you're doing by trying your best to follow Christ. Don't let anything pressure you to do anything in *any* direction before you're ready. Keep up the good work.
I really relate with you, Austin. I’ve been studying and contemplating both Catholicism and Orthodoxy for nearly 7 years now and it’s been a struggle. I’ve called Anglicanism home for a while but I have this constant nagging existential spiritual fight that I haven’t been able to fully reconcile. I just keep praying “Jesus, no matter what, let me find you, and not just an ecclesiology.”
What makes you believe in a god? I'm curious. 🙂
Same here! Was Anglican and had this nagging "incomplete" feeling that didn't go away until I was made a catechumen in the Orthodox Church :) was a 10 year journey for me lol!
Well, thank God that Orthodoxy more than _just_ an ecclesiology!
Can I recommend a book by a well known former Anglican? The Early Papacy by Adrian Fortescue.
Same here. Baptized R. Catholic (but no catechism), Baptist 20 years, Anglican 30 years, have been attending Orthodox and RC for a couple of years. Finishing up my RC formation (just did first confession), but I attend all three churches. Will never abandon Anglicanism. The BCP is too beautiful. (Book of Common Prayer)
By the way, never judge the Orthodox Church by online Orthodox. I know Orthodox communities around Pittsburgh and they are very loving, very gracious.
I live North of Pittsburgh and am thinking about attending services. Can you recommend the churches in Pittsburgh, especially eastern side, to me? Greatly appreciated 🙏
If “real Orthodoxy” isn’t as historically rich, theologically sound, and unapologetically proud of the gospel as it seems online, then I don’t want it.
Thanks for speaking to the existential tension I'm currently living in! Studying church history has been both enlightening and exhausting. I appreciate your hard work and honest words. God bless you, brother.
Me too brother. I resonate with your comment. God bless!!
What you said about divine liturgy. I will never forget my first liturgy. Absolutely transformative. God absolutely touched my heart and said "welcome home." Growing up post novus ordo rc and reaching a crisis where I couldn't shake that somewhere midway between high church protestantism and traditional catholicism was the Truth. Orthodoxy healed that wound.
I cannot find words to describe my first liturgy but yours went a little way, thank you brother.
@@DaFooling Glory to God, brother ☦🙏🏻
Your video reflections are deep and thought provoking, and - having been baptized into the Orthodox Faith 3 weeks ago - I’d have to say not uncommon. I struggled for 7 years before making the decision to convert. Belonging to a very small church which consists entirely of converts, most grapple with a number of things such as the matters which you question. Converting to the Orthodox “phronema” is not the same as switching denominational labels from one Protestant Church to another. May you be blessed in your journey wherever the Holy Spirit leads you. Your videos are amazing! Keep up the good work.
Glory to God, waiting 7 years is beautiful.
The thing about conversion to Orthodoxy that I’ve noticed is this: No one comes banging on your door or Red/Blue Pill you into an existential crisis of decision to convert. Normally people, like Moses, happens upon the mystery of a burning bush as it were, and inquire as to “what is this?” Then the journey begins. And oft they find that, “This is the Pearl of Great Price.”
True Evangelism is attraction through truth & light.
I was baptized into the Orthodox Church (Antiochian) over a year ago. This video is presented with so much authenticity and intelligence. And you have a very kind and gentle nature which is refreshing, especially with the plethora of arguments and “Ortho-Bros” on TH-cam. We welcome our Protestant friends and families to “come and see” at anytime. God Bless You, brother!
I am on a journey looking into Orthodoxy, and I must say, you gave a voice to the questions in the back of my mind that I didn’t even know how to verbalize! Thank you for always making such honest, humble, and respectful videos on these topics.
Raised as a Protestant by wonderful , genuinely Christian parents; fell away as a young adult (very common), then experienced a desire to come to God. Stumbled onto the Orthodox church. The earthshaking experience was
my first confession given before a very wise Orthodox priest. The spiritual reward of that confession was
overwhelmingly beautiful and indescribable. Since then, I consider confession and the Eucharist to be
a wonderful gift very directly to the believer. It was moving from a two-dimensional spiritual life to a
three-dimensional spiritual life.
Most pressing point for my conversion from Protestantism to Orthodoxy was my decision to subordinate my personal
understanding of God and the Scripture and the Faith in general to the teachings of the Church. It required a
form of intellectual humility (well-deserved and highly needed). This ended up actually being a relief; it was
in some sense the end of a burden and struggle.Note my natural personality is very assertive and pro-active so this was a big change.
@@kansashoneybadger7899 I actually couldn’t relate MORE to your story. The details which you gave are basically identical to my own story. I am forever grateful for my upbringing because without it I wouldn’t be here, but it’s certainly not where I expected to be. I also have found the same solace in realizing that I don’t have to “lean on my own understanding” (if you will) in order to fully accept and comprehend God, Scripture, and the Church.
My fiancé and I are being chrismated May 10th and will be married in the church June 1st! Praise God!
The rather complicated but well expressed concern about a westerner becoming Orthodox is actually quite profound. I grew up low church and became Orthodox, but it took 25 years. Keep seeking and working through these deep objective and subjective issues.
For Austin and anyone interested:
yesterday Kabane released a discussion in two parts with Orthodox philosopher, theologian, and apologist Perry Robinson of Energetic Procession. Perry is a brilliant exponent of the Orthodox faith- and of intellectually responsible habits in general. Many of a protestant questions and hesitations about Orthodoxy are answered so beautifully by an ex-protestant who after years of wandering in various protestant branches finally found Holy Orthodoxy...It will be very helpful I think,even for Orthodox fellows ...so many precious matters discussed regarding the process of converting to Orthodoxy and what problems one has to face...First part on Becoming Orthodox, Christology, and Personhood second part on Monergism, Apostolic Succession, and Staying Orthodox..
P.S: in 42:20 of the first part he gives some very good advice about how to deal with things you do not like in the church...
I think you must have Perry Robinson in your channel too,Austin
Those were excellent shows, highly recommended.
Looking forward for a 10 years later video! A long white bearded Austin talking about Orthodoxy... :)
First of all, thank you for being so vulnerable and open with us. That is beautiful. Secondly, thank you for sharing these wonderful conversations with us and acting as a proxy on our behalf so that we can all learn together! I have been an Orthodox Catachumen going on 2 years now. I have listened to many podcasts and watched many youtube videos, as well as reading books, and talking with my priest. I can relate to many of the struggles and complications that you mention, and honestly some of that is why I am still a Catachumen after so long. But the draw towards Orthodoxy (especially the Divine Liturgy) is undeniable, at least for me, and I am continuing to move forward patiently learning- trusting that love is patient and God is Love. May God continue to bless you on your journey, wherever it leads.
Regarding your exclusivity concern please read the letter by Fr. Seraphim Rose "Salvation of Christians Outside the Orthodox Church"
Where can one find this? Thank you.
Never heard anyone who was more respect full then you and it’s rely nice to see
Hi, Austin! As a devout Catholic, I can honestly say that I appreciate what you have shared with us over the past year or so. As I have said before, I accept you as my brother in Christ regardless of whether you convert to Catholicism. I also love and accept our Orthodox brothers and sisters. We all have our differences, just as members of any family do, but we are all family.
@Ben De Maria heh! Hating Protestants doesn't make one a better Catholic. If you really were a good Catholic, you'd be delirious in the love of your faith, living it's glory everyday and loving others like yourself as Jesus said. I'm Catholic too but I have Protestants and Orthodox Christians as close friends. Though we agree and disagree on many beliefs and traditions we do not hate one another.
@Ben De Maria true, but why hold present day Protestants responsible for what happened years ago. If Protestants do mock Catholics, it's mostly out of ignorance. But as a Catholic, my advice would be to highlight what is good in our faith rather than point out what's wrong in theirs.
@Ben De Maria You are confused and a confused Catholic makes a bad Catholic. You don't want to be a bad Catholic do you? Realize that all Christians when they are baptized, even if they are baptized in a Protestant church, they are Baptized into the Catholic Church since there is only one Christ and One Church. They are brothers and sisters in Christ by way of Baptism through Christ, even in their heretical ways for which they may not be culpable. Remember, God won't ask you if you are Catholic when you die. He will ask you how did you observe the 2 greatest commandments?
How very inquisition of you, Ben.
Like some Protestant pastor said and a Greek priest. We are all Christians , if we follow Jesus by also having a personal relationship with him as well we have a good chance to go to heaven. An Orthodox Christian may have an upper hand on the level area of heaven of where they go, but they too have to follow his/her faith orthodox truthfully and completely as well. He/she doesn't have a free ticket because they are Orthodox. We all have to work for God. Just like on earth we want money we have to work hard for it. Same goes to faith. We want to go to heaven and have joy. Continue your relationship with God and do a lot of praying and fasting. As I said Above somewhere. An Orthodox member who does not follow their faith or converts out, is doomed to a place in hell worse than someone who was never Orthodox!!!😉
As an Orthodox Christian, I just want to say that I can totally see how you would experience a sense of exclusivity in Orthodoxy. Many close members of my family are Protestant and my parents grew up in Protestant missionary families before converting to Orthodoxy, so the feeling of that sentiment hits close to home for me. However I think that for whatever reason, there seems to be a disproportionate number of "online" Orthodox Christians who ardently (and unfortunately) reflect this sentiment along with a firm anti-ecumenical stance that doesn't at all reflect my own experience as an Orthodox Christian having moved multiple times to different states and been a part of a number of different communities.
Ecumenism is certainly a hot topic in the Church and there are some very strong opinions on it on BOTH sides of the spectrum. But I think these opinions fall within the realm of theologoumenon and not an official stance of the Church. If anything, we've seen some significant ecumenical events between multiple patriarchs of the church and the Pope -- and I do appreciate that the Church allows for more wiggle room to figure these kinds of things out. There is definitely a strong feeling that the West has strayed from the Church of the Fathers that was whole for so long, and that we don't want to compromise in the wrong ways, but we also pray for "the unity of the faith" at almost every service.
Also in terms of salvation not existing outside the Orthodox Church, I don't think this is a widely held belief either. I think salvation and theosis sometimes get mixed up in this case, when the two aren't the same thing (if everyone had to reach theosis in their lifetime to be saved, we'd all be in a lot of trouble hahah). There is certainly the commonly held view that one must be inside the Church to have the possibility of fully cleansing their nous and heart, and ultimately attaining theosis, but this isn't the same as salvation. The number of Orthodox Christians we recognize have reached theosis in this life (aka the Saints) is such a small fraction of the rest of us who more often than not spend our whole lives in that first phase of cleansing our nous.
In terms of salvation itself, I don't think we as a church tend to concern ourselves as much with whether or not those around us are saved, because we see salvation as a lifelong process with no guarantees for ourselves despite the fact that we are a part of the Orthodox Church. We just hope that when we see Christ, that we will experience His love as paradise and not as hell -- and we can't nor shouldn't ever make claims for what this experience will be like for others (with the exception of the Saints).
Ecuminism is very heretical and demonic, every Eastern orthodox saint and church father was against ecuminism. Ecuminism goes against what our Early church taught as well. It is essentially a precursor to the Antichrist. It is the type of worldly religion the Antichrist will eventually bring about whenever the End times start (look up the videos by Father Spyridon Bailey/Fr. Peter Heers and quotes from Orthodox saints regarding this topic). The only way a unity between Rome/other Christian denominations and the Eastern orthodox can begin is if the RCC and protestants get rid of all their heretical dogma that deviates from Orthodox doctrine/teachings (catholic divine simplicity, Catholic change to the fililoque, papal infallibility,etc). Ecuminism will just make a watered down, lukewarm, worldy and heretical chrsitianity that deviates from the early church and what was passed down from the first apostles. Also when you talked about recent unity between the two denominations, you have to know that ecumenical patriarch Bartholemew is subverting Orthodoxy, he wants to essentially be the pope of the East, and what he is doing goes against orthodox teachings. Also the Eastern orthodox church is the only way to achieve salvation, and you can't achieve salvation through any of the other Christian denominations.
How can one outside the EO Church get saved, if it is not participating to the sacraments of the EO Church, which are to be given only through the EO priests, respectively through apostolic succession found only in the EO Church ?
@Kiwi Connoisseur Well, I agree! But it seems to me that the claims of exclusivity to God's Grace are expressed in doctrines like those mentioned in my questions.
Hello, brother. I don’t think there is a single Saint in the Orthodox Church that stood up for ecumenism; meanwhile, one could quote multiple saints that opposed it sternly (and Austin is probably aware of that already by this). While I do hold that a pan-orthodox synod should be held about the matter in order for an universal condemnation to be issued, I do not think this matter is that much of a theolegumenon at all. Certainly there is some “wiggle room” but I believe it is not as wide as you may be trying to express.
About salvation outside the Church, it is pretty clear that one must be united to the Church in order to be saved. St. Cyprian affirmed it, and I don’t think a single church father ever hinted suggesting otherwise. This doesn’t mean all non-orthodox are damned though.
@Kiwi Connoisseur I grew up in an eastern orthodox majority country and got the opposite of what you are saying from EO. Actually, I am surprised to hear your position and I am wondering if what people get in the west is more like a "missionary" form of eastern orthodoxy, where these claims of supremacy over God's Grace are kind of downplayed. The way it was explained to me even by practicing orthodox and even priests, these EO doctrines like apostolic succession, sacraments, priesthood, doctrine about Church are inherently exclusivist. In the EO paradigm, the way a non-orthodox can come to salvation outside of the EO Church is rather the exception from the Gospel, not the rule.
Thank you Austin for this video! I know it's hard to talk about these things in front of thousands of people yet you do it with great humbleness and honesty.
My pleasure! I look forward to discussing some of this on your channel soon! I find I express myself better in dialogues, so it's likely that if people enjoyed this, they'll really enjoy whatever goes on your channel
@@GospelSimplicity looking forward to our discussion too! Thank you for your kind words:) I am surprised if anyone finds something valuable coming from a Greek but who knows, God can use a donkey if he wants to
As for those encouraging you to convert to Orthodoxy, especially my fellow Orthodox, pay no attention to the crowd behind the curtain! This is something that you and God will work out. It took me almost 10 years attending Orthodox services before I finally officially entered the church although I was following an Orthodox way of life before. (Or should I say trying to)
I do not pray that you convert to an Orthodox or Catholic or any other Western Christian spirituality. I pray that you remain a firmly rooted Christian as you are now. Please continue your work and God bless you and your soon-to-be wife!
CHRIST IS IN OUR MIDST!
HE IS IN EVERY SHALL BE!
Well, your message reflects for me true unity in Christ. The only one that we must and can achieve. God bless!
Your view is in the minority view but it warms my heart as a Protestant.
After 3.5 years of looking into Orthodoxy, my family and i will be chrismated in our local Orthodox church in the fall, God willing. It's a massive shift but it feels like home and we're trusting this leading is of the Holy Spirit. Coming from Assembly of God. Glory to God . Thanks for making these videos and going through all this effort. It has been so very valuable
Glory to God and welcome.!
I'm an Orthodox convert from being a Baptist(non-cavinist). I converted early this year during Pascha, after attending and researching for a year. My priest did a great job and continues to do a great job in my opinion of guiding me and helping me make the decision. He is of the opinion that conversion should be very cautious, and we should be careful when making such a huge decision, and it is a huge decision. It is a hard thing to deal with. I felt a comfort here, that I know my tradition has answers to my questions and makes so much sense to me. I believe Christ is here. I hold the opinion that we know where the Holy Spirit is, but we don't know where it isn't. I believe there are Catholics and Protestants with Christ and the Saints in heaven for sure. I do, however, believe Orthodox is the Church and the fulfillment of the Christian faith. I definitely understand where you're coming from, and I fully encourage your decision to be very careful when converting to anything. I wish you nothing but the best and I will pray for you. Conversion is not something taken lightly and out Faith is the most important decision in our lives. My family didn't take my conversion particularly well, and it has a subtle tension to it when I go visit them. I have, however, come to respect and understand a lot of faith traditions better. May God be with you.
Dude, between this video, and the video about Catholicism, which, by the way are the only two videos I’ve ever seen from you you described exactly where I’m at in my thinking on this as a protestant struggling through these issues, and it was very refreshing to hear someone talk gracefully about these topics
Glad it was refreshing!
Thank you for sharing. It's been great to follow your journey ever since your "Protestant visits a Catholic Church" video came up as a recommendation on my feed over a year ago.
Keep studying and keep reading, there's no rush to make a decision today. It took three and a half years to finally come to Orthodoxy. The journey is hard, but you'll find your way after enough struggle, Austin!
Everyone who's walked a similar path as you has struggled with Mary and the saints but when/if that ever finally clicks its a satisfying feeling.
Keep up the great work and the great content.
Congratulations on your first year of “investigation.” It took me three years to work through many similar concerns. Enjoy the journey. (SWBTS grad now EO)
Thank you for sharing all of this. Your hesitations match my own. I’m continuing to get to know Orthodoxy, and your interviews and insights have been very encouraging.
I share the same hesitations. I’m trying to learn and understand but I struggle with many of the same things he mentions and also the prayer to saints through icons, and even the whole “not knowing if you’re saved” makes no sense as the NT seems clear, like in John, that we can know we are saved. But I love orthodoxy. I love the vibe, the art, the devotion, the ancient practices, the emphasis on having a prayer life, the experiential over head knowledge thing, and also how important it is to actually pick up your cross and follow Christ. I so badly want to convert but I can’t do it honestly while I have so many issues, I would just be a hypocrite and I can’t do that.
@@DavidMartinez-vx7zb I agree with you David. About all the Orthodox Christians I talk with seem to scratch John 3:16 and Ephesians 2:8-9 making it seem as if it is works and faith. Also, I find that the claim that God only works in a single church and by that I mean claiming that He only works in the Orthodox Church strikes me a little rough. I mean it’s probably the most clear thing that God works in more than jsut one church - more than just orthodoxy and more than just protestantism
I was raised RC and converted to EO. I still lose sleep questioning things and am faced with these existential crisis. You are not alone. Even though I am overjoyed that you are researching and looking for the ancient Church, all things must start with a love of Christ, which any outsider should be able to see shine through your words and actions. You are a light, no matter what tradition you may follow. Thank you for all of what you do. May Lord truly have Mercy. 🙏🏻
Thanks!
I grew up in a rather cultural Orthodox household and considered giving up on the Tradition I happened to be born into, if it should turn out to be a less than optimal representation of Truth. I don't know if this radical approach was instinctive or engrained into my genetical code by the more pious among my ancestors. Maybe it was God Himself challenging my young conscience to test all spirits, but in any case I was greatly relieved after years of research to have discovered nothing even remotely comparable to Orthodoxy. I can only imagine the tremendous loss and mourning of having to admit the fullness of Truth is not in that place which has been most near and dear to your heart for so long, and I deeply admire the bravery it takes to make that step. I think I can also relate to your sentiment that it's not fair to dismiss so many good and nice people outside the Church, and that isn't necessary, at all. There are for sure many Protestants and Roman-Catholics who make much better Christians than me, but their good conduct can't make up for false or incomplete doctrine, as much as my misconduct doesn't make Orthodoxy any less valid. There are also Buddhists and Muslims who are humble, meek and loving, but it's none of our business to judge the state of their souls. God is just and merciful towards all, and He will ask of each according to how much was given to them.
You seem to be a very careful and well-reflected person, much more than me when I was younger. I have almost had adopted a new age mindset before I seriously studied and consciously embraced Orthodoxy, because I was very focused on what is common good between all traditions. The critical turning point came when I started focusing on the differences, on what makes each and every communion special, unique and irreplaceable.
Great video! It's so amazing to hear and see how Orthodoxy is touching so many lives! ☦️🔥🔥
First of all, thank you for an amazing series.
I am a convert to Orthodoxy. I feel you brother. I went through the same objections, reservations, doubts, etc. It is not the end of your journey though. I read somewhere that God does not punish the absence of Truth. He punishes the rejection of It.
God bless you Austin 🙏 may God enlighten your path ☦ (From an Orthodox Christian)
you definitely put the right sponsor for your Orthodox viewers lol I love Catina Bible
Catina is great
The intercession of the saints did not click for me until I understood the eschatological dimension of the Church, in other words, "what is the Kingdom of God?". I realize you have not touched upon this "third rail" of theology, but, it might be of help to review:
1. All of the Apostolic Churches (those whose origins are pre-reformation) hold to the intercession of the saints.
2. All of the Apostolic Churches hold to Realized Millenialism in thier eschatology (called "Amillenialism" by 'low church' Protestants, who mostly hold pre-millenial views, though many 'high church' Protestants still mostly adhere to Realized Millenialism).
3. Realized Millenialism states that (1) Jesus is presently and at this very moment reigning from Heaven, seated at the right hand of the Father, (2) that before the ascension, all authority in Heaven and on Earth had already been given to Christ, and that (3) There is no 'literal, physical specific 1,000 years of rule with Christ upon his return", for "His Kingdom shall have no end", in other words, that Kingdom is now, it has been "realized".
4. Orthodoxy (and from what I understand, all the Apostolic churches) hold that the dead in Christ know what is happening on earth. In Revelation 6:9-11, they clamour impatiently for judgment to be poured out on their oppressors.
5. The concept of "soul sleep", temporary abeyance, or "limbo" for the dead in Christ is not found in Orthodox thought.
6. Christ states "...have you not read what was spoken to you by God, saying, ‘I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.”
7. As revealed in the transfiguration, although Moses had died and Elijah had been taken up to heaven centuries before, they now live in the presence of God, and that the same return to life applies to all who have faith in Christ. Moses and Elijah were and are alive - so much so that the Apostles asked if they could build Moses and Elijah tents to stay in for the night.
8. Those in heaven are “like the angels,” Christ says. Those in heaven surround us as a “great cloud of witnesses” (Heb. 12:1).
9. In Luke 16:19-31, the rich man shows concern for his family on earth, even though he is dead. If a person such as the rich man has such concern for those still alive after being dead, are those who have passed away in Christ also able to be concerned for the living. Can they do anything about their concerns? Are we to believe that those that are dead in Christ denied or silent?
10. The Kingdom of God is available to us right now, if we choose to access it. Those that are dead in Christ are already a part of the Kingdom of God that will come down with Christ at the end of the age. It is one Kingdom; we are connected to those that are dead in Christ through Christ himself.
"Too often modern Christians forget that the Church is not just an institution, but the Kingdom of God that is here but is still to come. The Church is described as the Bride of Christ. We are betrothed to Christ. The second coming is the wedding day and the final consummation. Therefore, we live this present life in two dimensions: as saved and yet hoping for salvation; as betrothed to Christ and yet in anticipation and anxiety for the consummation of the marriage; as joyful and yet penitent; as having everything and yet possessing nothing; as living in this world and yet “having here no continuing city”; as in the world yet not of the world; as being members of Christ’s Church, receiving the new life of baptism and eternal life in the Eucharist; and yet as striving to be made worthy of the Kingdom to come. This double character of Christian life is absolutely essential"
- Fr. Vassilios Papavassiliou
Thank you for this!
This is wonderful. Though I'd heard most of these, it was only after reading #6 (Mtw 22:32) that it really clicked for me
Christ says that you must be ready to abandon country, friends and even your family for Him. Austin says he can't be Orthodox because it's "foreign;" because it's too "exclusive;" because it isn't fair that others didn't have an opportunity to be Orthodox. Well Austin, you have an opportunity to be Orthodox. The only thing that matters is whether or not it's true.
This is probably the most important comment on here.
Bravo
He still has the opportunity. Please allow him the time and grace to find his way in his time. How gracious and merciful is God towards us? Ought we not to be the same?
Being orthodox is not a requirement for salvation. We will be judged with what we know and how we behave in this world. But if we are given the truth and deny it that is a different story. To have the opportunity to be orthodox is something that must be and that must be taken as a gift. I was raised Roman Catholic and I have been orthodox for a year. It's an incredible gift to be bestowed.
Probably there are some presuppositions there that lead to different views. Especially in the way we should see the church. A protestant will see the application of those Bible verses differently, which makes the way you are putting that only in the eastern orthodox context, strange and mostly irrelevant.
Glory to God! Orthodoxy has been such a beautiful path for myself and our family.
I love your opinions. I am Greek orthodox and I love it. I also love visiting other Christian churches as well. I like to learn all peoples ways that they worship and praise God. I love it. I feel the holy spirit in all Christian churches that truly worship him
Glad to hear that!
Fr. Seraphim of Rogue River, Oregon, a former Protestant pastor, gave me the shove I needed to finally become Orthodox about 12 years after our meeting. Thank You, Father.
I went tô my first liturgy last sunday, it was so pure and só amazing, was so difficult tô believe i was still on this Earth during the mass, i never thought a church could be so pure and sincere.
I want tô be part of this, i need tô.
Glory to God....the same feeling had the representatives of the Tsar when they visited Hagia Sophia in Constantinople:''we do not know if we are on earth or in heaven' they said and that's how the Russian nation was baptised Orthodox
“The Whole Council of God” and “The Lord of Spirits” are two podcast that have started to help me with my own secular materialism. They have brought me to a place where I see Christ differently. (I was raised Baptist, the Vineyard, Mainstream Evangelical, Bible College Grad (Prairie Bible College: AB Canada) Now an Orthodox Christian 4 years.
Glory to God....
Everyone, please stop with the arguments about him joining orthodoxy or Catholicism. He did a fantastic job of researching what each group believes and left it for us to decide what to think about each one. He gave his personal opinions on each and left it at that. No one should be messing with him on what he needs to do. He is a grown man who can make his own decisions. So in other words, shut up about what he needs to do. Not trying to be rude, im just saying.
Not sure I see any arguing in any of the comments. Austin is an adult and I'm sure he can take comments in stride. That being said, let's all be nice to one another!
@Kiwi Connoisseur I do already
No one is arguing I've scrolled through hundreds of comments almost none are arguing.
I resonate with your comment. I am a little sad at all the “convincing” I feel like people are trying to do in these comments. Especially after a video like this I just feel like this is not the place.
@@mcoburn5 look at my picture again. I’m not a woman
Speaking of faithful Christians outside of the Orthodox Church, our priest says, "We know where the Church is, we don't know where it isn't." Many of us who converted know bone-deep that Christ has always been with us, and that He shines so brightly in those who love Him, whichever faith tradition they happen to belong to.
The orthodox call it 'invisible church' and in my experience you will find members of it in every dominations.
It’s so interesting how different people struggle with different concepts. I find it fascinating! When I started studying into Orthodoxy praying to Saints felt natural, whereas relics felt other worldly.
We all have unique reasons, beliefs and presuppositions I guess that create these big things to wrestle with.
What makes you believe in a god? I am curious. 🙂
What makes anyone believe in anything?
How about praying to God?
I'm Orthodox and I really appreciate your videos. Regarding the point about whether someone who is non-Orthodox is actually a Christian, I agree that there are hard-liners in our Church. However, it is Evangelical Protestants in the US who would have us believe that Catholics are different than Christians. I have found that to be much more prevalent (to the point that some Catholics believe it).
I was chrismated 5 years ago into the Greek Orthodox Church. It has been the most blessed event that I have done in my life. I was raised Missouri synod Lutheran and that was very important to me as well as my family who had Catholic roots but after a tragic family event I went looking for something more I needed something more and I found it in the Orthodox Church. My husband is also a catacuman now and praying for when he can be fully part of our church family.
I watched the debate you referenced on According to John. This is one of my stumbling blocks too. My more difficult thing is not being able to put my late Father's name down for prayer during Eucharist because he was not Orthodox. I understand it's like they are vicariously participating in Eucharist so only people who could take it while living can participate from the other side. If you had a debate with an atheist who told you it was uncharitable to say Jesus is the only way, you might come off the same way of seeming mean or cruel. Protestants actually sometimes accuse Catholics and Orthodox of not being real Christians because they haven't had some huge emotional experience or believe in salvation purely through faith. That being said, I had been reading the lives of the Saints for a year and then attended a Divine Liturgy. I went to a Greek Orthodox church first, but when I attended a Serbian Orthodox church made up of almost 100% converts, I had the feeling, "I'm home." When they said I could be baptized again (to them the first "real" baptism) I had hope for a fresh start. The complicating things like my husband's lack of agreement, my mother thinking we worship icons, etc, has delayed my becoming a catechumen. I feel like the Orthodox church has explanations for scriptures I've never understood, it has antidotes for our sins and passions. It's like joining the marines to learn how to do warfare, except it's spiritual warfare. Thank you for your channel and your honesty.
We do not pray only for the Orthodox but for people who have passed on. They need our prayers even more than OC members do.
I pray for you and your family. I’m in the same boat, my wife thinks orthodoxy is “creepy and weird”. But now that I’ve seen it, I can’t unsee it. Our new church is independent baptist; wonderful people with large families who love the Lord and love children, but my soul feels like it doesn’t get the food and drink it needs.
@@noblegamer8740 Thank you. Prayers for you and your family as well. We actually started visiting the Greek church again, and it's easier for my family to feel accepted. The Serbian parish was so concerned about anti-Ecuminism that they ended up offending my husband, teens and mom many times. The Greek Orthodox Church is so much more open, and they don't jump to saying your actual legitimate experiences with Christ were not real or something. I think the Serbian priest (an American convert) had not really experienced Christ as a Protestant, while the Greek priest (also a convert) had been entirely sold out to the Lord and knew Him extremely well before becoming Orthodox. The Holy Spirit is everywhere present and fills all things as it says in the morning prayers. He really does work inside all the other churches. I still think Orthodoxy is almost perfect. Humans always make things messy, but the doctrine is so sound and the Liturgy is so sublime. I really don't think I can do anything else. My family now attends the Greek church weekly as well as Catechumen class. It's going well. Thanks again for the prayers!
@@dimitripaizis5456 I'm so glad. I just think I had ended up in a very traditional parish that had separate lists for Orthodox and non-Orthodox. Technically they are not supposed to read the names and take particles of the bread while saying the names of non-Orthodox. They pray over them at the proskomedia table. I really shouldn't be this much of an expert but believe me, I've majored in the minors far too much! I've met other Orthodox people whose parishes don't have separate lists. I guess it's up to the Bishops and the Patriarch? My Dad's name was Hugh if you want to pray for him. He died when I was 13. He was such a good man. He even had a vision of Christ when he was in the hospital. I know he's with the Lord. I still pray because our prayers apply back in time at the judgement and because I love him.
@@noblegamer8740 If I might make a suggestion, my kids and I read the Lives of the Saints from an app and it really touched my oldest son. It's been really beneficial to see all those people willing to lay down their lives for Christ. Perhaps if you did a daily devotional that included the lives of the martyrs it would touch your wife's heart. When I found out that the Orthodox Church knew where Lazarus went and where he was a Bishop, and that St. Longinus was the soldier at the foot of the cross, I practically wept. I can't believe how much we've lost. The app I used is called Daily Readings. I think it's the Greek church that puts it out. It just has a blue cross icon. The scripture readings sometimes match the Saint of the Day, which is really wonderful.
Austin, it is awesome getting to see you on the journey brother! I still encourage you to talk with more of us eastern Catholics and go to a liturgy at some point!
L-O-V-E THIS! Thank you for your authenticity & courage Austin.
Dear Austin, I have been following your channel for some time and I really appreciate the effort and commitment you have towards your work, it is truly admirable! Regarding the video, I will allow myself to share certain comments from my position as a converted Orthodox Christian since 15 years ago. In the Church there are several branches of study, for example, threre is the Theology, Patristics, Eschatology, Hymnography, etc., and one of them is the Ecclesiology, which is the understanding of what the Church is, although the proclamation that the Orthodox Church is The Church founded by Christ and sown by the Apostles is bold, she as a set of beliefs and traditions is nothing more than the manifestation of the Holy Spirit, it is a revelation given to us by God and that we have as a duty to take care of it to pass it intact to the next generation, an act that sums up our mission on earth; But even if ecclesiologically we understand the Orthodox Church as the only Church, that does not mean that all Orthodox are saved or that we have the monopoly of salvation, since salvation comes from God Who sees through our hearts and has known us since He created us, no sin we commit is greater than God's mercy and only He knows our final destiny because He knows us and loves us, I would dare to say that even we as Orthodox have a greater responsibility since on the day of the judgment God will question us based on what we knew and did not do, because God is a Just Judge Who will not judge a good Buddhist with the same harshness as an evil and hyoccritical Orthodox Christian. I am not going to go depth about your personal decisions of possible conversions or not, since it is a decision solely yours and which must be respected, I will only mention that our hereditary background is not an impediment to approach Orthodoxy, it tells you someone from the West like you and a Latino in a third world country without a true presence of the Orthodox Church. Everything can be done if that is your desire and the Will of the Lord. Likewise there is a reason why we oppose ecumenism and it goes from hand in hand with our Ecclesiology, we can get along well with everyone, but neither do I see ourselves discarding unique aspects of the Church and legacies from apostolic times for being "well" with everyone, not to mention the liturgical problems that this would propose, any change It will be not done by our decision since the Church belongs to God, and she does not belong to us. We are servants by God's mercy and not by our own merit, we are the simple guests at the Wedding, not the King Who celebrates the wedding of His Son, and with respect to give up everything remember Luke 14, 25-33, with nothing more to add I say goodbye not without first congratulating you again for your great work, keep going!
Thank you for your videos! I admire and am drawn to Orthodoxy for the very same reasons, and the same hesitations keep me from leaving my comfortable Protestantism... Honestly, mostly the impact it would have on my family (I am married with young children and that makes it feel like just a whole other kind of decision .) but I have felt drawn to the Orthodox Church for many years now. Your interviews with Orthodox theologians have helped clarify some theological questions and the interview w FMG on the Jesus Prayer has been truly transformative. That prayer has not only impacted my life but I am seeing the ripple effects in my husband’s and children‘a lives as well. Christ be with you, brother!
Austin, if you truly have a deep interest in Orthodoxy and if you feel that you are being drawn towards the Church in any way, you should speak with a local priest about the issues you are having. He may be able to walk you through these issues pastorally, and you may might find great comfort in his counsel. it is a journey for all new converts and the process is different for each one of us, but I think many of us have experienced the things you are describing in one way or another. A good priest would definitely be able to help you through these issues and give you guidance on how to approach the struggles you are having and the current situations in your personal life.
If you haven’t yet explored Fr. Georges Florovsky, I think you would appreciate his writings and work. He was a magnificent Orthodox theologian whose Orthodoxy and traditionalism was beyond reproach, who was also very involved with the WCC.
On the power of the laity in Orthodoxy. th-cam.com/video/Amp4vI-RkHw/w-d-xo.html
Dig up Fr. John Behr's talks on Orthodox Faith, especially the ones on "Becoming Fully Human."
@@dorothydeyev3493 YES!
A couple of things freaked me out when I was looking into Orthodoxy. One was learning how in places in Europe and the Middle East how the Orthodox leader forbid the Christians in their congregations from giving copies of the Bible to unbelievers.
And to go into membership a person has to renounce the Protestant Reformation, and how this leads the Orthodox to distance themselves from fellowship with other Christians, and it creates a posture of making other Christians come crawling in order to share fellowship and ideas with them. I believer that such sectarianism is demonic and is contrary to the spirit of Jesus Christ.
I'm also no into such a high view of Mary. While I do recognize her significance in her role in the Kingdom, I will not pray to her and revere her as highly as the Orthodox and Roman Catholics do.
I find no biblical support for these positions.
There are many thoughts and responses that come to mind after listening, but I will keep it to this. After years of wandering in the Protestant world, including being raised as a Protestant and earning a BS in biblical studies, it was and still is TOTALLY worth having my world turned up side down forsaking all else (not that my life and faith comes anywhere close to biblical followers of Jesus) to accept the One True Church and practice the original Christian faith. "Ask and you shall receive, knock and the door shall be opened unto you, SEEK AND YOU SHALL FIND." "The way is narrow and few there be that find it." Godspeed to you on your journey.
If you haven't, listen to Lord of Spirits by Fr. Stephen de Young and Fr. Andrew Stephen Damick
It clears up the Mary and Saints stuff
I'm excited for this one!
Agreed! Glory be to God!
How come, your comment is "2 weeks" ago, when this video is uploaded 5 hours ago?
I am the only one who see "2 weeks ago"?
@@SoSo-et5cd The video was "pre" uploaded a couple weeks before actually being viewable. That way subscribers know it's on the way 🙂
You are an honest young man. I was in a similar place as you as a senior in college on my way to seminary. I'm glad I didn't go through this publicly like you. I took a sociology of religion class that focused on conversion and I was very weary of converting fast or needlessly. So I appreciate your nuanced first answer that has that same concern. As for the rest.
1. Christ communed with the saints just as they did in maccabees. He talked to Moses and Elijah and said he knew Abraham.
2. Dr Ortland is incorrect. Please explore the ecumenical councils and their response to receiving converts from other denominations. Also, the willingness of the saints to die side by side with the non Orthodox.
3. The type of ecumenism that the Orthodox are weary of is the kind that seems to have taken hold. A brushing away of distinctives has lead to a thining of theological depth. Unity at the expense of truth is not helpful. However we are clearly involved in the ecumenical movement.
I know for a fact that as a Methodist I knew the same Christ I know now as an Orthodox Priest. But the truth of the Church and the sacraments became too important. I came to a place where I wanted the depth of worship and had to convert.
Much love and prayers for you my dear brother in Christ.
Well said
Thank you Fr. David. Love seeing Orthodox clergy on here commenting.
Would you mind elaborating on the ecumenical councils and non-orthodox Christians? Are protestant/catholic converts treated as new Christians (baptized)? Or are they just Chrismated (what is Chrismation)?
@@etheretherether the Ecumenical Councils give different lists for who needs to be Baptized and who doesn't in order to join the Church. Council to council these lists differ. This is because the denominations in question changed over time. Chrismation is the Eastern equivalent of confirmation. In modern times different Orthodox Churches apply these canons in different ways. Some Baptize almost everyone, others Baptize only those who come from non Trinitarian backgrounds. It is however becoming more difficult to be assured that a person comes from a Trinitarian background. Even if they come from denominations that previously would have been a sure thing. So if someone comes from somewhere like the Episcopal Church or Evangelical Lutherans we would not have baptized them 50 years ago. Now it is a sure thing that they probably need to be baptized. Unless they are from the older generation.
I'm not orthodox, but a church community here in Denmark is working side by side with an oriental orthodox monastery in Egypt, on several projects, and there's a strong bond and love between these respected communities.
Six year journey from charismatic, American evangelical, Protestant to Antiochian Orthodox. Many of the parishioners I’m in community with are converts. One of the parish priests is a convert. The saints and the Theotokos were areas that I had to wrap my head around, but the Holy Spirit truly revealed these to me. Like you said, do I have to forsake all my comfortable thoughts and ideas (apologies if that wasn’t the right thought), after the Holy Spirit revealed these things to me, I took the plunge. I see it. I work in ministry where most are of the Protestant faith. Christ is the center of the Orthodox faith and that is where I stay working those I do. I do believe the “non-orthodox Christians” are saved out of the sincerity of their heart in their confession. I converted on Holy Saturday of this year. I’m so happy that I did.
Thank you Austin, for your honesty! As an Orthodox Christian myself - I must say, Orthodox Christians should NOT be saying who is saved and who isn't. That decision is for God! Even Saint Paul himself did not claim to be saved. I don't know that there is really an 'official' stance on Christians outside of the Church, aside from the fact that we can't receive sacraments like the Eucharist together - simply because we don't know if we believe the same thing, and it would be dangerous for the one outside of the Church to come on contact with God in this manner. It also means that one might be received differently if they converted, depending on their background - baptism and chrismation, or just chrismation, and occasionally just confession. Anyway PLEASE keep doing what you are doing. You go where you find Christ - He is what it's all about. I'd have to profess that the fulness of the Christian faith was best preserved in the Orthodox Church - but that does not mean that anyone outside of the Church isn't Christian. You might find people who say that, but you can find people who say a lot of things! Anyway, you need to go where God puts you, because you are clearly a blessing to many of us. 🙏
Thank you for those incredible insights into Orthodoxy. I am in the throes of contemplation and prayer right now in regards to this. I was Seventh Day Adventist for 47 years (my husband still is) left and spent 6 years looking for the "right" Protestant church, left those and became Catholic 9 years ago. I am a searcher and I love my Lord, I only want to do what is pleasing to Him. Been looking into Orthodoxy for about a month through TH-cam, websites, books and my husband and I met with an Orthodox Priest, Your video resonated with my own thoughts and brought up points I hadn't considered. My husband has been a sincere Christian all his life and has been very patient with my struggles, even somewhat supporting where I am today (he could not do that with Catholicism).
Are you still Catholic?
First of all, I admire your courage in making this video with complete honesty. I also deeply appreciate how seriously you take your spiritual journey, and I recognize and sympathize with how stressful and confusing it can be.
I am an Orthodox Christian myself. My entire household & I practiced wicca when I was a young person in high school, and I converted to Orthodoxy about 3 years after I graduated from high school.
I want to give my unsolicited opinion on the some of the things you struggle with. It’s nice to share joy in the things we agree on, but real ecumenism is working out our salvation with fear and trembling as a group of believers, which includes bearing the cross of disagreement and differences.
First thing I would mention is that I can relate to the feeling of novelty surrounding the ‘option’ that is Orthodoxy, within the greater western Christian landscape. When I think about this though, I often think about how some pagans in western europe must have felt when Christianity began to spread rapidly after it’s decriminalization in Rome. I mean, this was likely to them just another god being worshipped by people that were extremely foreign to them, and who brought an Idea which was extremely ‘Eastern’ in comparison to their religious traditions.
I know that the analogy isn’t perfect, but the feeling of novelty in regards to Orthodoxy is something that I think is more of a reaction caused by insider/outsider bias, a natural inclination to be weary of things which are new and do not heavily resemble that which we subconciously have come to know and trust.
In regards to the feeling of Orthodoxy seeming somewhat dis-ingenuous, I honestly think that it may have something to do with the insider/outsider problem as well. We view Orthodox reverence and practice through our Western lenses, see extreme acts of reverence and foreign traditions such as fasting, or even just the extremely serious nature in which the clergy approaches liturgical worship, and we see it as foreign, and sometimes we see a lack of the very charismatic, outwardly emotional behavior that until now we have subconciously associated with genuine reverence.
I hope this comes across as simply a suggestion for thought, and I love you and your channel, and will be here supporting you no matter where you go from here.
May God have mercy on me a sinner, and please pray for me. Thanks again! ☦️
I, as a Catholic, have great respect for my Orthodox brothers and sisters and their Church Fathers. Of course we have our differences but we are from the same root and we are one in Christ.
Halfway isn’t enough for my brothers and sisters in Christ; I want the fullest of the faith for them! Out of charity, I pray for full conversion to the One Holy Apostolic Faith found in the Catholic Church. ✝️🙏
Body of christ can not be divided, great schism happened, Catholics left body of christ.
@@mr.actapus4069, you have been deceived.
@@traditionalgirl3943 How so? Catholics declared Pope as head of the church while original Christians, orthodox kept its theology, dogmatics as it was back than and di not change anything. Go learn history and then brag about who is deceieved
@@mr.actapus4069, like I said, you have been deceived.
Born and raised atheist, became catholic, now orthodox. Very happy. Spiritually rich and at spiritual peace.
The west used to be orthodox. St Patrick was orthodox. There was no orthodox/catholic split until 1000s, and officially until 1200s. No one in the west wouldn’t have known they weren’t in one apostolic church until the 1200s.
Christ was pretty strict about people not being saved if they didn’t follow him. If orthodoxy is true, is necessary.
After attending a Divine Liturgy, I was driving home and suddenly felt this warm, burning in my heart. I knew then it was the church for me.
As far ecumenism goes, the path is narrow 😂 that doesn’t bother me at all.