J. Krishnamurti & David Bohm - Brockwood Park 1980 - The Ending of Time - Conversation 11
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ก.ย. 2024
- J. Krishnamurti & David Bohm - Brockwood Park 1980 - 11: The liberation of insight
Summary:
Can insight wipe away, banish or dissolve the whole movement of being tied, attached, dependent and lonely?
Is there an order which is not man-made?
Measurement can exist only where there is disorder.
We live in a man-made world, we are the result of man-made minds. Can the mind uncondition itself so completely that it's no longer man-made?
What is the relationship between love and hatred?
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I’ve noticed that K liked D Bohm a lot. In other videos with other people included, K always looked to him for his insight. It seems they were both always on the same page about the conversation. It flowed very smooth. K never got frustrated with him like he did with other people he conversed with.
David Bohm's intelligence was off the charts, on the same level as Einstein and other greats, I'm sure K. realized that.
@@josephb4235 Yes
This is called same level of consciousness
yeah i agree from this particular point a particular brain cant go further and how beautifully krishnaji explains it to david
Bhom kept dragging K back into condition & thought only, not letting him inquire beyond
1:39 - What is origin of all human movement?
8:50 - Is societal order a small affair compared to something larger?
15:20 - What is insight?
25:38 - We seek the absolute through the limited
33:17 - Meditation as a measure
41:20 - Is there something beyond, that is not touched by thought?
1:01:44 - Is there a mind not man-made?
1:08:27 - Can love understand the origin of non-love?
his talks with Dr. bohm really worth watching again and again , thank you sooo much
When I listen to the nature sounds which some great people have recorded for TH-cam, then my mind begins to relax and the obsessive thinking settles down. I listen to bubbling geysers and forest streams and frogs at night in bed in order to sleep better. These sounds are nature and nature in a pristine form is that non human made mind. It is order and it orders your thoughts and heals your body.
What is, is not - what was, was not - all is, yet is not - just so, it is.
The path is no path - the past is dead - the future are skeletons of the past - the here and now knows none and yet knows all.
Beyond duality - beyond description - seeing the world for what ‘is’ - just so - tathata - no hands to lay on - nothing to clutch.
Leaves falling - winter comes - spring is here - and summer, who knows - no one to notice - just so.
A smile - a tear - no one to see - a star in the sky.
The sun - a rainy day - just so - life.
One hour - a hundred years - knowing the end - no rush to get there.
What a lovely poetry. Thank you
Mind blowing. David Bohm is just a great channel for the master to flow with. The master needs no channel - I am saying D Bohm has done a phenomenal service here by completely flowing with that giant presence, the great fire, K if that nameless be called.
Thank You for uploading the video recordings in this series. The audio versions are among my favorites. ❤🙏🏼
Amazing! At the beginning, K struggles to remember what they talked about last time. He totally forgets because when they talked last time he was so intensely and directly perceiving that there was no one there remembering....
th-cam.com/play/PL1n30s-LKus4MyNuceRoFAes5teZS_guW.html
now i could see my conditioned mind brain very clearly and conflicts in my relationships. once i got rid of the present state, universal mind thru its intelligence brought order in my life. VERY CLEAR TO ME.this is not illusion but result of constant listening toJ. krishnamurti ,bohm,anderson as well as result of j krishnamurtis biography written by PUPUL JAYAKAR.MANY THANKS TO ALL AND THE CHANNEL FOR UPLOADING SUCH LIFE CHANGING WISDOM...
These talks are so great! I deeply appreciate Dr. Bohm’s questions which sort of draw out a bit more detailed, more specific answers out of JK. Deep gratitude for this ❤
Fantastic dialogue. In the end, I think they make a bit of a mess. Mind (with capital letters) and "human-made mind" are the same totality, but in different states. The human-made mind is, strictly speaking, thought. Thought is the fragmented state of Mind. Being fragmented, gelled, the Mind does not flow, it is not operative. When the perception of thought occurs, this represents the change of state from the fragmented state (gel, blocked) to the non-fragmented state, which we simply call "the Mind" (liquid, flowing, free). For this reason, only when fragmentation ceases, does the Mind emerge. Mind is perception of all that is, therefore, Mind perceives its own fragmentation when the change of state happens.
This mutation is beyond all effort or will, because is the Mind itself that changes its state, and its reasons escape all understanding, prediction or measure.
In quantum terms, very useful to express all this subject matter, we will say that thought represents the collapse of the total wave function of the Cosmos - that is, the Mind, the totality. The collapse of the wave function is observation with separation; obviously, this is thought, as we have indicated above.
The total wave function is Mind, the totality, the coexistence of everything in superposition, without any separation. Thought involves the isolation of definite entities, fragments, which gives rise to an infinity of possible combinations between them, based on causality.
As an interesting conclusion: the "mind made by the human being" is, in fact, strictly speaking, the human being itself, it is thought.
Therefore, the mutation of the Mind is the profound transformation of the human being. We would say that the human being has been a proposal of the cosmic intelligence (the Mind) and, now, this proposal is giving way to something different, perhaps to the absence of any concrete proposal... (This need not mean the extinction of the humankind, but a total reconfiguration of its nature). In astrology, this great transformation of the Mind is known as the Aquarian Age, which was clearly entered in 2020.
My friend thank you for your beautiful explanation
When J.K talks with close his eyes, it feels like ❤❤❤❤
I just thought about it and I instantly saw this comment 😱😍🤩
Perhaps, it's a s state of meditation !!!
yes BOHM SIR U R RIGHT IN SAYING "MIND THAT IS NOT MAN MADE has a relationship with man made mind in understanding his real nature.since wisdom is covered by ignorance, we all come from the same source.
very well explained.a determined mind can certainly do it. thanks k thanks bohm
When the heart is pure and mind is clean and clear then the REAL TRUTH IS HERE.
Statements like above suck such big time. Pure heart according to what, clean mind ?? What does it mean ?
If there is such thing as "living truth", we are witnessing it here. We are so fortunate.
Truth, a pathless land where giants tread and we little, 3-dimensional, time-space bounded beings could only imagine we understand! How few and rare that humans transcend this egoic mind with no "I" nor "my" and live in absolute, incorruptible Truth!
Its not as rare as you seem to think .
corpus Callosum sir or madam i feel there are many of them who thread through the absolute truth. But the fact is that only few are noticed. You might know lao tzu quoting "He who says do not know and he who knows do not say".There are only few who try to give what the absolute truth is. That's why I see I have heard jiddu Krishnamurti many times telling "one realises but how to put that in words " What do you day sir?????
Would you consider math, science, and logic absolute, incorruptible truth?
@@luked445 knowledge which is an activity of thought is always fragmented therefore no
"A mind that is free of desire, That Is natural mind" K says ... "... that is the mind not caught in illusion."
Am I, have I been living in illusions and have the "man-made mind'? What are those illusions? What is the root of my illusions?
Incredible how an old man is able to immediately deal, guide and correct the scientists' self-protecting statements!
The conversations in Ojha ( Audio 1-8) reached a very important conclusion in the last audio no.8. The discussions after video 8 don’t continue along same line..
The amount of insight these talks generate in daily life can not be meassured. I often wonder what is the secret to the power of this transmission.
While K has been pouring his heart out to move those scientists, Dr. Bohm says, :We talked about it in a great depth and length" ....
Philosophers and religious people share common characteristics that
they talk and talk endlessly but never act, then the others
pray and pray endlessly but never act........!
An Eye opener... Thank You.
I actually feel bad trying to imagine what his mind is like, in place of mine, I cannot account for how holy it is, and his undying commitment to life.
Bleh don’t put anyone up like that, it defines you as lesser. He’s trying to engage them with him, not elevate above. Don’t kick him upstairs.
I think there is no relationship between human mind and That(absolute). Becoz they are one and the same, the very human mind transforms into absolute in such a way that human mind doesn't even exist any longer. If there are two people one with man-made mind and other with absolute. There can only be little help from absolute as the human mind itself has to go thru it's own conditioning and see the truth.
That silence at 42:25. Priceless.
To be absolutely serious in inquiry is self-evident. The immeasurable. K and Bohm here would seem that be more than partially concerned with having a particular language that is revolutionary, because of the desire to free humanity. This is of course led by Krishnamurti. Yet not....
To be absolutely free. But having a method toward that end? That's a trap. To see the predicament of the trap, of the limited stuff; of the conditioned, man-made mind. SEEING the limitation of this, ergo, limited mind would seem to be EVERYTHING.
Time is a verse within the universe
Mas obrigado canal do Krishinamurti
The suffering of Dr. Bohm caused by US goverment and his father(search for his biografi) Brought us a clarifier of Krishnamurti' mind
Lord Maitreya 1 ko mera pranam🙏
The ground is simply infinite potential
The order of the universe lies in the fact it is..
Are we willing to have an insight?
21:00 disorder
24:33 order
Viver em si!!!
🙏🏻
Do you have the first 8 talks of this series from Ojai?
Unfortunately the first 8 talks weren't recorded on video. They do however exist as audio and you can listen them here: bit.ly/2k7guor
@@KFoundation They are equally good with very clear Audio, I never felt a Video is a dire need for the replacement
Looks like Conversations 11 and 12 are not part of the book "The Ending of Time".
35:26, 36:40, 45:23, 51:57
9:00
35:30
48:30
Tem mtos diálogos bons aqui pena que não é legendado para o português
Sad that Bohm kept going back into thought & condition.
where is conversation 10?
th-cam.com/play/PL1n30s-LKus4MyNuceRoFAes5teZS_guW.html
Is krishnamurti sort of nietzchean?
Rather sane, not too committed to positive psychology, and far more interested in the subtle body I would imagine, but just as seriously willing
Why compare.
Very well observed.
There is no thought playing here sir. No description is needed. K is indicating things that we must see, not focus on what he says. To focus to what he says is to get lost. See what he is pointing to.
The British word 'meditation' might mean 'measurement'. But that's not the meaning of the Indian word 'dhyan' which we translate as 'meditation'. Personally I don't think Krishnamurti's insight are quite as original as he claims. And if he looked more into all the mystics and saints which he dismiss he might realize that. This is perhaps the flip side of distancing yourself from all traditions.
You made a sense out of those things and are judging things based on them, thinking you understood. Go into yourself without the words of other people. Stop comparing. Nothing is set in stone as it may seem in books.
YEP
Division is order.
Cannot have bad without good, vise versa. Eww bad yay good! You say what benefits you is order? Under a misapprehension
Division is disorder. Division means that things are separated. Therefore there is no whole.
@@Larsmons no he's right the whole implicate the division, the problem comes when you confuse division with the whole (like the 'me' with the absolute being)
@@emanuellopez8578 There lies a whole which is not related to division, or the opposite of division, which the mind cannot grasp. That is what K talks about. The unnamable, unspeakable.