If eric Cortina uses clr and a barrel maker says voids warranty then stop buying their barrels. Hecan put some pressure on them to justify their position. No good logical reason? Either cover the warranty of lose business. Remington won't care, ooooh, lose one guy and his followers. But lower volume custom barrel makers need support in their buyers small circles.
Just about every firearm I've purchased had a statement in the manual that said shooting handloads would void the warranty... So that warranty shit was out the window before I ever cleaned the gun the first time anyway.
@@jsol4477 if he wouldn’t of had a borescope he would of thought that barrel was clean!!! Just funning with you. A borescope is the only way to tell if you have them clean.
I have used CLR now for 3 years straight. Absolutely zero damage or accuracy issues . I will keep using it. Also in my tests if i clean with wipe out only until the patches are white then run another patch through with CLR it is black again. CLR works. Yes I have a bore scope.
I am curious what the barrel manufacturers are concerned about. For decades the BR community has used everything imaginable to clean barrels. Off the top of my head I can’t recall one that caused problems with the barrel.
I started using CLR after watching you and it works well. I'm not worried about voiding any warranty because the guns I've been using it on, well, the newest one is 40ish years old and the oldest about 123, LOL...I think those warranties have somewhat lapsed. My newer guns I have been using a carbon cleaner from Spartan but it takes a little more work. as always, Thanks.
Techron fuel injector cleaner cleans carbon from engine top ends. I've used it, and my buddies dad used it on my recommendation after basically everything wouldn't take out the ring. He let it 5-10 minutes on a soaked patch around a brush came back and 1 patch of patch out after and it was gone immediately.
"Don't use CLR. If you do, we're going to void your warranty." "Did you clean it with CLR? You're gonna say yes Guess what they're going to void your warranty. Even if the issue they have wasn't caused by CLR" Sounds to me like some manufacturers need to read up on the Magnuson Moss Warranty Act here in the US. Because that's not an acceptable way to void a warranty. Would be like you installing some aftermarket tires on your car, then the manufacturer denying coverage on your heated seats that stop working... BS! Why so much hate for poor old CLR here! lol
For those in the US needing warranty, just quote the Magnuson-Moss Act. Voiding warranty for these reasons is illegal, unless they prove it to be the cause of damage.
@@El_Peto it's not a civil issue, it's a legal federal issue. You report them to the FTC and they lose the ability to do business. Simply expressing knowledge about consumer rights is enough to get your warranty fullfilled 99% of the time.
@@El_Peto it's only a civil issue if you the consumer choose to sue. The manufacturer choosing to violate the law is not a civil issue. Go back to school. I didn't go to law school but i know how to use my brain and a basic search function. www.ftc.gov/legal-library/browse/statutes/magnuson-moss-warranty-federal-trade-commission-improv
After years of cleaning barells for benchrest and testing it all. Thorro is the minimum of effort and time and give best perfect result to a low cost in my opinion. You make great videos Erik!
Another one: Flitz bore cleaner. Kind of messy but not abrasive and works very well. Had a terrible carbon ring on a rifle and spun a bronze brush around and around for a few minutes, cleaned the flitz out. Put in the borescope…no more ring. But it’s a little messy. So now I try to clean every time and if I do C4 takes care of it easily😊
I use almost the same "procedure", including IOSSO paste and Carb-out (no CLR though, don't need it). I put procedure in parenthesis because I adjust what I'm doing as needed. If IOSSO doesn't get it the first time I usually wrap a patch around a brush and put IOSSO paste on the patch if the borescope finds something. I'm going to cut back to one IOSSO cycle and soak with carb out. I'm also going to add the triple action oil step. The borescope, this channel, and the forum were game changers for me. I don't shoot competitively but I like the resulting small groups and the simpler loading and cleaning procedures that are discussed in all three places.
As a rifle builder, I tend to assemble my rifles from a list of components. so my rifles are never going back to "the factory" anyway. On the off chance I buy a completed rifle from someone else, they've got exacting one chance to get it right, after that I'll be taking care of whatever problems arise. Besides that, in my opinion, barrels are consumables, just like brake pads on a race car. Therefore, I will continue to use CLR for My Stainless Steel barrels as it has given excellent results.
It takes a big man to admit when he's wrong, and I am a giant among men in that regard...Thanks for giving a solution to the problem and the demonstration.
Not sure why you worded your comment as Erik being wrong? If you buy good barrels use your head when using CLR…it works very well. It really comes down each individual shooting level. What works great for me, you may not want to use.
Personally I think the barrel companies just want to use an excuse to throw someone under the bus. And avoid any responsibility. No different than saying a bronze brush can damage the barrel that made from steel 10x’s stronger
I generally just use the foam Wipe Out product and leave it to soak overnight - everything appears to come out pretty clean when I look with my borescope. But obviously I don’t have the time demands that you have. Thank you for the great tips as always!!
This one the best videos on barrel cleaning. I have been bore scoping for about 20 years and just looking at patches will stir you wrong a lot. Thank you
I appreciate how the barrel manufacturers may feel about CLR. But with that said I reload a lot of old brass that I find at the range and restore for practice hunting loads and shooting time at the range. I soak the old brass in a bucket that I top off with CLR. And let me just say it cleans up the brass inside like no other and its cheap enough to really top off half or more of a 5 gallon bucket, even if you need to reduce some of the CLR with water just to save on volume.
I love those triangular patches for my 6.5 Creedmoor. Though I never see anyone else using them. At the range all the other precision shooters are using traditional square patches. Glad to see "the Expert" also uses the triangular ones.
FYI: that is not how warranty law works. The manufacturer is responsible to prove in court that using CLR caused the issue that you are making a warranty claim on. This was a change in precedent in an auto warranty case a few years ago. Barrel manufacturers are just trying to get out of claims
Man, all that and still have a carbon ring. I use C4 carbon remover, let it sit in the chamber for 10 minutes, give it a few twists with the patch, pull it out the chamber and then run one wet patch, two dry patches and it comes out perfectly clean with no carbon.
I like the Boretech products a bunch but man CLR works better then anything I've ever used... just don't be a dummy and soak your barrel down and leave it in there for long periods of time. Great video as always keepem coming brother!!!
@@zgennaro Yeah man that's some good stuff and I use it also... if I haven't shot to many rounds and clean it every time it works great but I tend to shoot a bunch and don't clean my barrels every time like I should so I really like CLR for that along with abrasives just because it seems like it's speeds things along...
I've been using Iosso on all my firearms. And I use the Iosso triple action to clean and lube some of the areas on my presses as well because of how light of a lube it leaves behind.
I love wipeout I’ve been using it for years! Will continue using it. I don’t use the accelerator I just let it sit overnight. Works great for my hunting rifles when Time between cleans is not an issue. Just clean carbon out first then oil after the wipeout it’s beautiful. Extremely clean and safe
If your rifle has a stainless steel barrel, you can use a lead cleaning cloth. It's really effective for carbon and lead, but it also works on copper fouling. Just cut off the right size and run it down the barrel. I use it on my stainless steel pistol also. I've cleaned the barrel with hoppe's and a brush...then clean patches thinking it is clean. Then run the lead cloth and it comes out with carbon on it.
After watching one of your videos I used CLR to clean a suppressor brake that had tons of build up. CLR cleaned it like a champ. Cleaned the finish off the YHM brake also. Such is life.
Would half expect that a manufacturer that would void a warranty before ever examining a allegedly defective product, as a out, lack efficacy and integrity, and would predispose me to never doing business with them again, and probably others, as word does get around.
I alternate CLR patch and bronze brush around 5-8 times… until way less black on patch. Then alternate patch out/accelerator and bronze brush around 5-8 times. Then borescope. Usually that’s enough… if not then I might apply JB bore paste on a patch. If warranties keep you awake at night don’t use CLR. But if you want carbon out quick… CLR and bronze brush… go quick and limit dwell time. Alcohol and dry patches between different solvents. I finish my barrel with 2 wet patches of G96 CLP then a dry patch. Cleaning is way faster and easier after 50rds than after 250rds !!!! I like fast and easy.
I use CLR for taking out the carbon in my ARs. It is the only thing I have found that will clean the bolt and barrel extension. It does not damage nitriding. It WILL remove bluing.
I've commented on this before, so I'll do it again; CLR does NOT ruin bores, ESPECIALLY stainless; I used to MAKE phosphoric acid amongst others at a plant, trust me. Phos acid WAS the primary acid in most cleaners that remove rust and other grime. I've called CLR a few months ago and they told me they quit using phos acid in the calcium, lime and rust remover 13 years ago. (NOT CLR. CLR is NOW the COMPANY name, NOT the chemical inside the containers. if you want the chemical that actually removes calcium lime AND rust you have to buy the container MARKED calcium lime and rust remover, not just any old clr bottle) The acid they now use in the calcium lime and rust remover is a natural acid (the actual name escapes me) that is really mild and wont hurt SHIT. A lot of people don't realize that the actual acid was taken out of CLR a long time ago. ALTHOUGH, even IF they STILL RETAINED the phosphoric acid in there, at the concentration that it came in, it STILL wouldn't have ruined your barrels lol. Guys, these barrel makers are probably assuming there's still phosphoric acid in CLR, and I'm assuming that's why they say it's bad for your bores. Trust me, I use it CONSTANTLY for cleaning parts in my garage, and it is NOT harmful lol. There's no way it's harming your bore. If you don't believe me, 1. call CLR, they'll tell you. and 2. try it out on various metals in your garage-leave it on some metals for hours, see what happens. I betcha nothing.
Keith from winning in the Wind did a short video on this by soaking part of a barrel in CLR for over 24 hours if I remember right. It caused some corrosion on a stainless barrel.
I'd like to know what sort of stainless that is; The tech support at CLR said you could even ingest this stuff and it wouldn't be as bad as you think. Call 'em. I soak things in this to clean them and not a single damaged part. @@beauderoy7745
My wife and I used CLR for several years when we first married. Over those years we noticed that the bath tub was getting dul, I had to reseal the garage floor several times, the floor drain in my garage was rotting out etc. This was before the internet was in everyone's homes but we put 2 and 2 together and realized that sheet was slowly destroying everything it touched. It never crossed my mind, to clean my guns with it and I never will, considering the damage it's done on the things we used it on. I see a lot of "well I use it and it works great for me". Well good for them I guess but I hope I never buy their used guns. We're always trying to make things easier and I'm no different. I found that carb cleaner does a great job of removing carbon in my barrels. I've been using it for years and don't see any damage from it. That said, I guess my son or grandkids will find out.
@@arcticwhitepaintI don't know what state you live in but I can buy sulfuric acid from my local hardware store and use it occasionally to open the washing machine drain. There are lots of very corrosive products on the market for anyone to buy. CLR is very corrosive to ceramic coatings, steel, concrete, laminated wood etc. A simple Google search will prove that. I don't care what you use on your own stuff but you've clearly full of bull
@@StuninRubyou can use sulfuric acid if you want. I guarantee that'll clean the carbon and copper out of your barrels faster than anything you've tried. I just stated my experience on various things with CLR, which is why I would not use it
A manufacturer that offers a warranty in the United States cannot summarily void a warranty. It is literally against federal law. If CLR attacked the metal in the barrel, then I could see a voided warranty, but just voiding a warranty because you did something a manufacturer didn't like and was unrelated to the failure, is against the law and I'm shocked any manufacturer would be stupid enough to publicly make a statement like that. The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act covers this in no uncertain terms. BTW I manufacture cleaning chems and this would be a really easy thing to test.
Hi Eric I’ve never tried CLR but carb out as you say is great it softens the carbon so it can then be brushed out like you I use the nylon brush, do you ever use a bronze brush? Great video keep them coming 👍
Unless the warranty has a spec (which CLR can't meet) for what should be used to clean the barrel or has an exclusion in writing that says you can't use CLR, they can't just void your warranty because you used it.
I would like to know the reasoning for voiding warranties if CLR has been used - it's not like they have 100% tested every other product on the market, so I wonder if they actually did some testing with CLR and found some kind of issue?
@@jessewerner4067 true, not by barrel makers for custom rifles, but there are millions of production rifles made with coated/blued/parkerized/etc barrels
I have used Iosso cleaner for sometime now and really like using it. After watching your video with Speedy I started using Patch-out in conjunction with it. I have had fantastic results since, especially on first round impacts after cleaning.
I've been using bore tech c4 carbon remover.put some on a patch let it soak on your carbon ring and it's gone .haven't had to scrub a carbon ring .best I've used yet.
DAM! I bought CLR in a 44 gallon barrel just to clean my barrels. Just kidding, but I bet you that the ingredients in CLR are most likely very similar to your typical cleaners. Love it when manufactures just void your warranty over products they haven't tested or may know very little in terms of how it reacts with their products.
What about “Butch’s Bore Shine”? Do have any experience with it? I’ve used it for years. It was recommended to me by someone who also shoots competitions.
Don’t tell them. Magnus and moss warranty act requires THEM to prove you caused the damage to void a warranty express or implied. ‘I was operating the tool as intended and cleaning it as directed.’
I think everyone knows that most warranties don't cover anything. All of the small print protects every manufacturer with their warranty claims. It basically comes down to your warranty will be voided if you even put around through the barrel
@@sonnyburnett2417I'm surprised by that...works like magic for me. It doesn't remove copper though, only carbon. You will have to use a different product for copper.
I use Boretech Eliminator, it removes carbon and copper. I've used just about everything else and haven't found anything better. I've used Eliminator after I've cleaned my bore with every cleaner I have and it has removed the rest of the copper left behind. I never use a brush, just weed whip line and patches. Some of my barrels need to sit awhile before pulling dry patches to get completely clean.
I thought Boretech C4 and Eliminator were great until I ran one patch of CLR through barrel and it came out black. Now I use them to “clean” the barrel after CLR.
I understand the accuracy potential of my barrel before the first cleaning. Then I use CLR as necessary lol. I just can’t imagine a situation wherein I’d have already cleaned the barrel and afterward be going in for the warranty claim.
I wouldn’t tell them I used it. Simple as that. Just like hand loads. No way am I getting stuck with the bill for something that was faulty on their end.
I've always wondered if the purple cleaner called SuperClean would take the carbon out better. You'd have to wear gloves because it takes all the oil out of your skin real deep. It worked good cleaning an engine one time. It's a definite way to get rid of oils for sure and it does go after carbon but not sure how well on a barrel.
Those are all the products I use. I never tried CLR but if they decided to rebrand it "Tactical CLR" and sell it at gun stores, it would no longer void your warranty.
I've met a lot of old shooters with some very weird cancers and illnesses. It may be worth protecting oneself from skin absorption of these hard chemicals.
Hello. First time watching you or your video(s). Good "Show and Tell" type explanation & instruction. What I do not understand is why you do not use a wire bristle bore brush to clean out the carbon? It is your You Tube channel and your rifles so you can do what you want to. Cloth patches should be used after some passes with the bore brush. Cloth patches and liquid cleaner could take a very long time. In the USMC and later in the Army we used wire bristle bore brushes, liquid bore / chamber cleaner, and then cloth patches. We shot many more rounds than single-shot Benchrest shooters do.
@@redrock425 ummm? How does wanting small groups at 1,000 yards justify not using a wire bristle bore brush? Especially after he saw there was still carbon in the barrel after only using liquid cleaner and cloth patches. The Palma Matches are shot at 800, 900 and at 1,000 yards and those are shot by military riflemen from The U.K., U.S.A. and Canada.
A manufacturer cannot simply say using CLR will void their warranty. I’d like to see them call out the warranty language that specifically indicates this. I’d call BS on this.
I'm not convinced this is not some elaborate troll... for real though, before I bought a bore scope I had been "cleaning" with hoppes elite, but when I got the scope I realized how useless my prior method was. 3 minutes with CLR and the barrel looked brand new
Hey Eric... Got me thinking , WHY does CLR void WARRANTY.. if you have old old ( trash ) barrel, cut it in pieces and do a Control testing. .... Or go to your local pawn shop and get an old 100 dollar rifle , cut it up and do some testing.. see what the big deal is with CLR or are Manufacturers fishing for EXCUSES
I'm shocked that barrel manufacturers have this attitude towards CLR. Coming from the suppressor end of the shooting world, they are completely in love with CLR. Like literally, just let stuff soak in CLR for a day.
THERE IS NOTHING ON THE MARKET THAT GETS RID OF CARBON EASILY! If someone says his stuff does then you will find out he doesnt have a bore scope. Iosso paste is the only thing that removes carbon resonably well .But it is worrisome that its too agressive.Someone needs to test Iosso to see if it damages barrels. If you want to make multi millions of dollars invent a carbon destroying chemical that actually works without hurting barrels or voiding warranties
We need to fund a study using a lab to see if CLR hurts the stainless barrels. Also run a test on iosso paste and oil to see if any damage occurs …..these are the only products tha remove baked on carbon “EASILY”.I think you do more damage running brushes through over and over and over to scape off baked carbon with weak products
I wonder what carburetor carb cleaner would do? I spray that stuff on carbs, injectors and even EGR valves. It takes the carbon and gunk off of all that stuff.
Sounds to me like the attorneys and basic greed have taken root in those companies. I would ask the question of those companies "What are you hiding? Is there a problem with your barrels your not informing the public about? Have you switched to a less expensive (cheaper) grade of steel that is more susceptible to corrosion?" As for warranties, why worry? Most firearms are as is purchases right? Those warranties are never any good unless a court forces them to honor it.
If you need to use a warranty on your barrel, say nothing. If you don't use it like a moron theres no way to ruin a barrel with CLR. Kroil works just as good if not better. We use it to clean carbon on big turbine half joints. If its safe for those its safe for a barrel. Clean out with alcohol after you're done and youre good to go
Used only ThorroClean at the last Super Shoot in St Louis. Had the guy from Hakaye how was there look through my barrel, and his remarks were it was very clean without any copper or carbon. At the time this barrel had 1500 rounds thru it. I clean after every group. Another reason to use Thorro is it is very mild on your skin. that is a bigger reason for me to use it.
Amazing Eric👍👍 I've been using Sharp Shooter products and alcohol as the primary cleaner for barrels for years with a patch of Hoppe's #9 at the end just for the smell😉and haven't had any problems keeping barrels clean. Iosso brushes are the best, something about that blue color just makes em' work better. CLR works good in my coffee machine, no reason to doubt its effectiveness in a gun barrel. Voided warranty....Hogwash!
I've tried several bore cleaning products and they all came up short. Recently I used Montana Extreme products, their Copper Killer and their Bore Solvent. I was so hopeful that these would work perfectly, especially since it contains Ammonia which is supposed to dissolve copper. It wasn't to be of course. I've let them sit in the barrel for over 2 hours and still it didn't do any better than anything else. I was very disappointed. I can't return it so I'll just use it up and find something else. Kroil + JB is the only thing I've found that will TRULY clean out a bore. I would just rather have a chemical process as opposed to a mechanical one, but Kroil + JB is the best I've found so far. 30 to 50 strokes is all that's needed, and I don't have to let things soak for mins or hours.
@@PkwyDrive13 On a rough bore you'll need that many, maybe more. On my precision rifles it doesn't need nearly that many strokes because the bore is already smoother and sort of polished so fouling is much less anyways.
Think about it.. CLR is how cheap for that big bottle and gun brand products are very expensive by the Oz. I’ll keep using CLR and deny to any manufacture that ask. Allways clean out the bore with 91% alcohol then follow my bore tech cleaning.
Some of those spots you point out as carbon with the bore scope sure look like corrosion pits to me. Although I'm watching this on my phone so perhaps I'm not getting the best view. I'm a nerdy Ph.D. scientist with a more than average knowledge of corrosion and all I'll say is "use what you want" but I won't be using CLR on my barrels. 😁
@El_Peto , I use Berryman Chem-Dip (part # 0905). It's metal safe and turns carbon to goo that can be patched out easily. Just run a soaked patch through the bore, wait 10-20 minutes, then dry patch out the residue. It is often used in the auto industry to clean engine parts. There is a "new" formula that is also available, and it still works, but not as well as the old formula that I mentioned above. Also, the new formula is bad on aluminum parts and some plastics, so if you use a bore guide, I'd remove it after applying the new formula stuff and wipe out the bore guide while you wait for the bore to soak.
@@DocJustinT i actually have some of that berryman at home already. I already use brake and carburetor clean on heavily fouled guns, but now I'll try the berryman as well. It does dissolve all sorts of messes inside carburetors, fuel tanks, and whatever else
Seems like I have used everything under the sun. A long time ago I bought a tube of IOSSO, like a tube of tooth paste. It worked better than anything else I had ever used. I still have some of it, gotta be 20 years old. But lately I have been using the patch-out/Wipeout.
If a manufacturer says CLR voids the warranty without giving a reason, they are just looking for ways to avoid the cost of warranty.
100%. Looks like I have new targets to investigate to figure out who are scamming customers.
If eric Cortina uses clr and a barrel maker says voids warranty then stop buying their barrels. Hecan put some pressure on them to justify their position. No good logical reason? Either cover the warranty of lose business.
Remington won't care, ooooh, lose one guy and his followers. But lower volume custom barrel makers need support in their buyers small circles.
Kreiger: Did you clean your barrel with CLR?
Me: Hell NO! Who do you think I, am Erik Cortina! Hoppes #9 is ALL I NEED!🤣
Just about every firearm I've purchased had a statement in the manual that said shooting handloads would void the warranty... So that warranty shit was out the window before I ever cleaned the gun the first time anyway.
That’s a very good point
I’ll stick with with CLR it is pretty quick and if I need warranty work I’ve never heard of CLR.
Same lol😂
You need to get rid of that bore scope, I figured that thing would of been sparkling clean until you had to get that scope out!!! 😂
@@charleywalker2982 what?
@@jsol4477 if he wouldn’t of had a borescope he would of thought that barrel was clean!!! Just funning with you. A borescope is the only way to tell if you have them clean.
Right... How would anyone know if the barrel had CLR in it at one point? Ridiculous. Just tell them "no, why would anyone use CLR on a gun?!"
I have used CLR now for 3 years straight. Absolutely zero damage or accuracy issues . I will keep using it. Also in my tests if i clean with wipe out only until the patches are white then run another patch through with CLR it is black again. CLR works. Yes I have a bore scope.
I am curious what the barrel manufacturers are concerned about. For decades the BR community has used everything imaginable to clean barrels. Off the top of my head I can’t recall one that caused problems with the barrel.
@@richardbriscoe8563The name begins like something Homer Simpson chokes.
I started using CLR after watching you and it works well. I'm not worried about voiding any warranty because the guns I've been using it on, well, the newest one is 40ish years old and the oldest about 123, LOL...I think those warranties have somewhat lapsed. My newer guns I have been using a carbon cleaner from Spartan but it takes a little more work. as always, Thanks.
Techron fuel injector cleaner cleans carbon from engine top ends. I've used it, and my buddies dad used it on my recommendation after basically everything wouldn't take out the ring. He let it 5-10 minutes on a soaked patch around a brush came back and 1 patch of patch out after and it was gone immediately.
"Don't use CLR. If you do, we're going to void your warranty."
"Did you clean it with CLR?
You're gonna say yes
Guess what they're going to void your warranty. Even if the issue they have wasn't caused by CLR"
Sounds to me like some manufacturers need to read up on the Magnuson Moss Warranty Act here in the US. Because that's not an acceptable way to void a warranty. Would be like you installing some aftermarket tires on your car, then the manufacturer denying coverage on your heated seats that stop working... BS!
Why so much hate for poor old CLR here! lol
For those in the US needing warranty, just quote the Magnuson-Moss Act. Voiding warranty for these reasons is illegal, unless they prove it to be the cause of damage.
THIS ^^
Go ahead and enforce that in civil court.
@@El_Peto it's not a civil issue, it's a legal federal issue. You report them to the FTC and they lose the ability to do business. Simply expressing knowledge about consumer rights is enough to get your warranty fullfilled 99% of the time.
@@danielrouw2593 it's a civil issue. Guess you missed that portion of law school
@@El_Peto it's only a civil issue if you the consumer choose to sue. The manufacturer choosing to violate the law is not a civil issue. Go back to school.
I didn't go to law school but i know how to use my brain and a basic search function.
www.ftc.gov/legal-library/browse/statutes/magnuson-moss-warranty-federal-trade-commission-improv
I will continue to use CLR, it works great and see absolutely no reason to quit
Eds Red works great, is cheap, and easy to mix up. Unfortunately, most folks think if you don't pay 50 bucks for a 4 ounce bottle, it's no good.
I get brake cleaner and carb cleaner, 7 dollars for 2 12 ounces cans
@El_Peto Now don't you be telling everyone our secret! 😉
@@doghousedon1 entire g damned battalion comes by for a spray to clean out their machine gun chambers
Entirely worth that 7 dollars
After years of cleaning barells for benchrest and testing it all. Thorro is the minimum of effort and time and give best perfect result to a low cost in my opinion. You make great videos Erik!
Thank you. Thorro is made by IOSSO.
Thorroclean is amazing. I bounce between it and Bortech C4/Cu+2
Another one: Flitz bore cleaner. Kind of messy but not abrasive and works very well. Had a terrible carbon ring on a rifle and spun a bronze brush around and around for a few minutes, cleaned the flitz out. Put in the borescope…no more ring. But it’s a little messy. So now I try to clean every time and if I do C4 takes care of it easily😊
I have used Seafoam on really hard to remove carbon.
@fergusonlandmanagementweld1039 Interesting. What's your process, use it like any old bore cleaner ?
I use almost the same "procedure", including IOSSO paste and Carb-out (no CLR though, don't need it). I put procedure in parenthesis because I adjust what I'm doing as needed. If IOSSO doesn't get it the first time I usually wrap a patch around a brush and put IOSSO paste on the patch if the borescope finds something. I'm going to cut back to one IOSSO cycle and soak with carb out. I'm also going to add the triple action oil step. The borescope, this channel, and the forum were game changers for me. I don't shoot competitively but I like the resulting small groups and the simpler loading and cleaning procedures that are discussed in all three places.
As a rifle builder, I tend to assemble my rifles from a list of components. so my rifles are never going back to "the factory" anyway. On the off chance I buy a completed rifle from someone else, they've got exacting one chance to get it right, after that I'll be taking care of whatever problems arise. Besides that, in my opinion, barrels are consumables, just like brake pads on a race car. Therefore, I will continue to use CLR for My Stainless Steel barrels as it has given excellent results.
It takes a big man to admit when he's wrong, and I am a giant among men in that regard...Thanks for giving a solution to the problem and the demonstration.
Humble too
@@JamesPettinatolol
@@JamesPettinato Like I said, I could be wrong.
Not sure why you worded your comment as Erik being wrong? If you buy good barrels use your head when using CLR…it works very well. It really comes down each individual shooting level. What works great for me, you may not want to use.
Personally I think the barrel companies just want to use an excuse to throw someone under the bus. And avoid any responsibility. No different than saying a bronze brush can damage the barrel that made from steel 10x’s stronger
Bore cleaning videos are the best videos of Erik. It's like watching a tibetan monk practicing a meditation.
Wow, thanks! 😂
I generally just use the foam Wipe Out product and leave it to soak overnight - everything appears to come out pretty clean when I look with my borescope.
But obviously I don’t have the time demands that you have. Thank you for the great tips as always!!
This one the best videos on barrel cleaning. I have been bore scoping for about 20 years and just looking at patches will stir you wrong a lot. Thank you
I appreciate how the barrel manufacturers may feel about CLR. But with that said
I reload a lot of old brass that I find at the range and restore for practice hunting loads and shooting time at the range. I soak the old brass in a bucket that I top off with CLR. And let me just say it cleans up the brass inside like no other and its cheap enough to really top off half or more of a 5 gallon bucket, even if you need to reduce some of the CLR with water just to save on volume.
Going to be honest I rarely clean barrels (and get better results because I'm not chasing perfection, just
I love those triangular patches for my 6.5 Creedmoor. Though I never see anyone else using them. At the range all the other precision shooters are using traditional square patches. Glad to see "the Expert" also uses the triangular ones.
It'd make a nice video to talk about the useful bore to patch size ratio.
Where you get those patches?
I picked up some bore tech eliminator and that stuff works amazing compared to clp or anything else I've tried
I've used it for years, it's my go to and harmless really, nothing gets carbon and copper out along with everything else like Eliminator
I used to use Kroils for carbon removal but it's gotten expensive. CRC makes a penetrating oil called Knocker Loose that is better than Kroils.
@jamesdean8809. Thanks for the tip. going to try it tonight
FYI: that is not how warranty law works. The manufacturer is responsible to prove in court that using CLR caused the issue that you are making a warranty claim on.
This was a change in precedent in an auto warranty case a few years ago.
Barrel manufacturers are just trying to get out of claims
Man, all that and still have a carbon ring. I use C4 carbon remover, let it sit in the chamber for 10 minutes, give it a few twists with the patch, pull it out the chamber and then run one wet patch, two dry patches and it comes out perfectly clean with no carbon.
I like the Boretech products a bunch but man CLR works better then anything I've ever used... just don't be a dummy and soak your barrel down and leave it in there for long periods of time. Great video as always keepem coming brother!!!
If I use C4 at low round count or right after shooting I have noticed C4 works extremely well with minimal effort. At least in my rifle
@@zgennaro Yeah man that's some good stuff and I use it also... if I haven't shot to many rounds and clean it every time it works great but I tend to shoot a bunch and don't clean my barrels every time like I should so I really like CLR for that along with abrasives just because it seems like it's speeds things along...
I've been using Iosso on all my firearms. And I use the Iosso triple action to clean and lube some of the areas on my presses as well because of how light of a lube it leaves behind.
I usually worry about a warranty if it pertains to electronics or moving parts,not a piece of steel.
I love wipeout I’ve been using it for years! Will continue using it. I don’t use the accelerator I just let it sit overnight. Works great for my hunting rifles when Time between cleans is not an issue. Just clean carbon out first then oil after the wipeout it’s beautiful. Extremely clean and safe
If your rifle has a stainless steel barrel, you can use a lead cleaning cloth. It's really effective for carbon and lead, but it also works on copper fouling.
Just cut off the right size and run it down the barrel.
I use it on my stainless steel pistol also. I've cleaned the barrel with hoppe's and a brush...then clean patches thinking it is clean. Then run the lead cloth and it comes out with carbon on it.
After watching one of your videos I used CLR to clean a suppressor brake that had tons of build up. CLR cleaned it like a champ. Cleaned the finish off the YHM brake also. Such is life.
Would half expect that a manufacturer that would void a warranty before ever examining a allegedly defective product, as a out, lack efficacy and integrity, and would predispose me to never doing business with them again, and probably others, as word does get around.
I alternate CLR patch and bronze brush around 5-8 times… until way less black on patch. Then alternate patch out/accelerator and bronze brush around 5-8 times. Then borescope. Usually that’s enough… if not then I might apply JB bore paste on a patch.
If warranties keep you awake at night don’t use CLR. But if you want carbon out quick… CLR and bronze brush… go quick and limit dwell time. Alcohol and dry patches between different solvents. I finish my barrel with 2 wet patches of G96 CLP then a dry patch.
Cleaning is way faster and easier after 50rds than after 250rds !!!! I like fast and easy.
I use CLR for taking out the carbon in my ARs. It is the only thing I have found that will clean the bolt and barrel extension. It does not damage nitriding. It WILL remove bluing.
I've commented on this before, so I'll do it again; CLR does NOT ruin bores, ESPECIALLY stainless; I used to MAKE phosphoric acid amongst others at a plant, trust me. Phos acid WAS the primary acid in most cleaners that remove rust and other grime. I've called CLR a few months ago and they told me they quit using phos acid in the calcium, lime and rust remover 13 years ago. (NOT CLR. CLR is NOW the COMPANY name, NOT the chemical inside the containers. if you want the chemical that actually removes calcium lime AND rust you have to buy the container MARKED calcium lime and rust remover, not just any old clr bottle) The acid they now use in the calcium lime and rust remover is a natural acid (the actual name escapes me) that is really mild and wont hurt SHIT. A lot of people don't realize that the actual acid was taken out of CLR a long time ago. ALTHOUGH, even IF they STILL RETAINED the phosphoric acid in there, at the concentration that it came in, it STILL wouldn't have ruined your barrels lol. Guys, these barrel makers are probably assuming there's still phosphoric acid in CLR, and I'm assuming that's why they say it's bad for your bores. Trust me, I use it CONSTANTLY for cleaning parts in my garage, and it is NOT harmful lol. There's no way it's harming your bore. If you don't believe me, 1. call CLR, they'll tell you. and 2. try it out on various metals in your garage-leave it on some metals for hours, see what happens. I betcha nothing.
I'm wondering if its more for protecting the Bluing, given it is technically rust
I been using vinegar/grease remover for parts cleaning. Its a great combo.
How dare you speak from experience!
Keith from winning in the Wind did a short video on this by soaking part of a barrel in CLR for over 24 hours if I remember right. It caused some corrosion on a stainless barrel.
I'd like to know what sort of stainless that is; The tech support at CLR said you could even ingest this stuff and it wouldn't be as bad as you think. Call 'em. I soak things in this to clean them and not a single damaged part. @@beauderoy7745
My wife and I used CLR for several years when we first married. Over those years we noticed that the bath tub was getting dul, I had to reseal the garage floor several times, the floor drain in my garage was rotting out etc. This was before the internet was in everyone's homes but we put 2 and 2 together and realized that sheet was slowly destroying everything it touched. It never crossed my mind, to clean my guns with it and I never will, considering the damage it's done on the things we used it on. I see a lot of "well I use it and it works great for me". Well good for them I guess but I hope I never buy their used guns.
We're always trying to make things easier and I'm no different. I found that carb cleaner does a great job of removing carbon in my barrels. I've been using it for years and don't see any damage from it. That said, I guess my son or grandkids will find out.
@@arcticwhitepaintI don't know what state you live in but I can buy sulfuric acid from my local hardware store and use it occasionally to open the washing machine drain. There are lots of very corrosive products on the market for anyone to buy. CLR is very corrosive to ceramic coatings, steel, concrete, laminated wood etc. A simple Google search will prove that.
I don't care what you use on your own stuff but you've clearly full of bull
By the time it does enough damage, you would need to have replaced the barrel 5 to 6 times already.
@@StuninRubyou can use sulfuric acid if you want. I guarantee that'll clean the carbon and copper out of your barrels faster than anything you've tried. I just stated my experience on various things with CLR, which is why I would not use it
@@justanobserver530 Sounds like you have been huffing too much sulfuric acid on your end.
@@StuninRubsounds like you've been huffing CLR. What idiot reads warning labels, am I right? 😮
"Why, NO, I'm not sure what CLR even is..." That's all you have to do.
Wait, we have a warranty? Hows that work? I have a bunch of barrels that have 1800 to 3000 rounds on them that no longer perform as they once did.
LOL Right!!
A manufacturer that offers a warranty in the United States cannot summarily void a warranty. It is literally against federal law. If CLR attacked the metal in the barrel, then I could see a voided warranty, but just voiding a warranty because you did something a manufacturer didn't like and was unrelated to the failure, is against the law and I'm shocked any manufacturer would be stupid enough to publicly make a statement like that. The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act covers this in no uncertain terms.
BTW I manufacture cleaning chems and this would be a really easy thing to test.
Hi Eric I’ve never tried CLR but carb out as you say is great it softens the carbon so it can then be brushed out like you I use the nylon brush, do you ever use a bronze brush? Great video keep them coming 👍
Unless the warranty has a spec (which CLR can't meet) for what should be used to clean the barrel or has an exclusion in writing that says you can't use CLR, they can't just void your warranty because you used it.
I would like to know the reasoning for voiding warranties if CLR has been used - it's not like they have 100% tested every other product on the market, so I wonder if they actually did some testing with CLR and found some kind of issue?
My thoughts exactly Spencer.
Any excuse they can find to not provide warranty works. Especially barrel manufacturers
It will remove the finish from a black barrel and you know some idiot will leave it in too long and blame the barrel maker.
@@o2wow finishes are generally not put on by the barrel manufacturers.
@@jessewerner4067 true, not by barrel makers for custom rifles, but there are millions of production rifles made with coated/blued/parkerized/etc barrels
No worries here, I’m sticking with CLR.
After bore is cleaned use a final film of Hoppes
I have used Iosso cleaner for sometime now and really like using it. After watching your video with Speedy I started using Patch-out in conjunction with it. I have had fantastic results since, especially on first round impacts after cleaning.
I've been using bore tech c4 carbon remover.put some on a patch let it soak on your carbon ring and it's gone .haven't had to scrub a carbon ring .best I've used yet.
You should have tried the Lou Merdica drill method and showed us the bore scope pics. Many used gm top engine cleaner for carbon in Benchrest.
DAM! I bought CLR in a 44 gallon barrel just to clean my barrels. Just kidding, but I bet you that the ingredients in CLR are most likely very similar to your typical cleaners. Love it when manufactures just void your warranty over products they haven't tested or may know very little in terms of how it reacts with their products.
I use CLR on all my rifles, followed by alcohol, then CPL.
I patch out, each time, and finish with Lanox ( an Australian product )
What about “Butch’s Bore Shine”? Do have any experience with it? I’ve used it for years. It was recommended to me by someone who also shoots competitions.
Don’t tell them. Magnus and moss warranty act requires THEM to prove you caused the damage to void a warranty express or implied. ‘I was operating the tool as intended and cleaning it as directed.’
C4 boretech carbon remover works great.
I think everyone knows that most warranties don't cover anything. All of the small print protects every manufacturer with their warranty claims. It basically comes down to your warranty will be voided if you even put around through the barrel
"some manufacturers" Which ones? Beyond that I use CLR to clear lime off my bathtub or toilet. Never thought of using lime remover in a gun barrel.
Diesel cleans carbon out like no other.
Boretech c4 works really good for straight carbon.
Boretech C4 is absolutely the best carbon remover that I've ever used.
It doesn't work for me at all.
@@sonnyburnett2417I'm surprised by that...works like magic for me. It doesn't remove copper though, only carbon. You will have to use a different product for copper.
I use Boretech Eliminator, it removes carbon and copper. I've used just about everything else and haven't found anything better. I've used Eliminator after I've cleaned my bore with every cleaner I have and it has removed the rest of the copper left behind. I never use a brush, just weed whip line and patches. Some of my barrels need to sit awhile before pulling dry patches to get completely clean.
I thought Boretech C4 and Eliminator were great until I ran one patch of CLR through barrel and it came out black. Now I use them to “clean” the barrel after CLR.
I understand the accuracy potential of my barrel before the first cleaning. Then I use CLR as necessary lol. I just can’t imagine a situation wherein I’d have already cleaned the barrel and afterward be going in for the warranty claim.
I wouldn’t tell them I used it. Simple as that. Just like hand loads. No way am I getting stuck with the bill for something that was faulty on their end.
So no CLR, what about Free All? I use it and it incredibly effective on carbon, loosens it up and get a bunch out on first patch.
I've always wondered if the purple cleaner called SuperClean would take the carbon out better. You'd have to wear gloves because it takes all the oil out of your skin real deep. It worked good cleaning an engine one time. It's a definite way to get rid of oils for sure and it does go after carbon but not sure how well on a barrel.
Simple green works well also and is biodegradable..
Those are all the products I use. I never tried CLR but if they decided to rebrand it "Tactical CLR" and sell it at gun stores, it would no longer void your warranty.
They would say it stands for carbon long range cleaner 🤣
Can any of you recommend a borescope that will fit inside a .177 barrel?
I've met a lot of old shooters with some very weird cancers and illnesses. It may be worth protecting oneself from skin absorption of these hard chemicals.
Correct you are. Indoor ranges are deadly. Wear gloves and a respirator when needed.
I still have lots of the old Barnes Copper remover. CLR CANT be harsher than Barnes?? Been using it 25 years and no issues.
Hello. First time watching you or your video(s). Good "Show and Tell" type explanation & instruction.
What I do not understand is why you do not use a wire bristle bore brush to clean out the carbon? It is your You Tube channel and your rifles so you can do what you want to.
Cloth patches should be used after some passes with the bore brush. Cloth patches and liquid cleaner could take a very long time. In the USMC and later in the Army we used wire bristle bore brushes, liquid bore / chamber cleaner, and then cloth patches. We shot many more rounds than single-shot Benchrest shooters do.
I imagine he is working on why be more aggressive than necessary. Also they'd like to get groups of a few inches at 1000yds not minute of man.
@@redrock425 ummm? How does wanting small groups at 1,000 yards justify not using a wire bristle bore brush? Especially after he saw there was still carbon in the barrel after only using liquid cleaner and cloth patches.
The Palma Matches are shot at 800, 900 and at 1,000 yards and those are shot by military riflemen from The U.K., U.S.A. and Canada.
The video quality is excellent. Stepping up your game!
A manufacturer cannot simply say using CLR will void their warranty. I’d like to see them call out the warranty language that specifically indicates this. I’d call BS on this.
0:57 you're going to say what's CLR??? Problem solved 😂
EXACTLY
I'm not convinced this is not some elaborate troll...
for real though, before I bought a bore scope I had been "cleaning" with hoppes elite, but when I got the scope I realized how useless my prior method was. 3 minutes with CLR and the barrel looked brand new
Hey Eric... Got me thinking , WHY does CLR void WARRANTY.. if you have old old ( trash ) barrel, cut it in pieces and do a Control testing. .... Or go to your local pawn shop and get an old 100 dollar rifle , cut it up and do some testing.. see what the big deal is with CLR or are Manufacturers fishing for EXCUSES
I'm shocked that barrel manufacturers have this attitude towards CLR. Coming from the suppressor end of the shooting world, they are completely in love with CLR. Like literally, just let stuff soak in CLR for a day.
I have been testing Kroil oil for cleaning , thoughts I have good results !
I've been using Kroil for over 40 years. Works great even on stubborn black powder residue.
Black powder residue is pretty much water-soluble.@@William_Charles_Baker
I have been using this stuff to clean the cylinder on my stainless revolver for a few years with no problems.
Ive never seen a bore need CLR to be cleaned if run through regularly with solvent then oil. Dont do weird shlt to your guns. That is all.
Kroil penetrating oil plus iosso soak a half hr, works good
THERE IS NOTHING ON THE MARKET THAT GETS RID OF CARBON EASILY! If someone says his stuff does then you will find out he doesnt have a bore scope. Iosso paste is the only thing that removes carbon resonably well .But it is worrisome that its too agressive.Someone needs to test Iosso to see if it damages barrels. If you want to make multi millions of dollars invent a carbon destroying chemical that actually works without hurting barrels or voiding warranties
I too use Carb out and patch out
I've never known a barrel maker to have a warranty. Maybe an accuracy gaurantee, but even those aren't much of a gaurantee.
We need to fund a study using a lab to see if CLR hurts the stainless barrels. Also run a test on iosso paste and oil to see if any damage occurs …..these are the only products tha remove baked on carbon “EASILY”.I think you do more damage running brushes through over and over and over to scape off baked carbon with weak products
Great suggestion!
I wonder what carburetor carb cleaner would do? I spray that stuff on carbs, injectors and even EGR valves. It takes the carbon and gunk off of all that stuff.
Blink twice if you are in danger, Erik...
😂😂😂
I just use a steel brush and a drill
Sounds to me like the attorneys and basic greed have taken root in those companies. I would ask the question of those companies "What are you hiding? Is there a problem with your barrels your not informing the public about? Have you switched to a less expensive (cheaper) grade of steel that is more susceptible to corrosion?" As for warranties, why worry? Most firearms are as is purchases right? Those warranties are never any good unless a court forces them to honor it.
Baking soda and vinegar. Add Dawn to clean patch it out
Not that I am anything special I use ballistol for general cleaning and then butch’s bore shine for severe copper fouling.
Great video thanks for sharing how to clean a rifle and the products to use.
If you need to use a warranty on your barrel, say nothing. If you don't use it like a moron theres no way to ruin a barrel with CLR. Kroil works just as good if not better. We use it to clean carbon on big turbine half joints. If its safe for those its safe for a barrel. Clean out with alcohol after you're done and youre good to go
Used only ThorroClean at the last Super Shoot in St Louis. Had the guy from Hakaye how was there look through my barrel, and his remarks were it was very clean without any copper or carbon. At the time this barrel had 1500 rounds thru it. I clean after every group. Another reason to use Thorro is it is very mild on your skin. that is a bigger reason for me to use it.
Sweets Solvent and Hoppe’s #9
Amazing Eric👍👍 I've been using Sharp Shooter products and alcohol as the primary cleaner for barrels for years with a patch of Hoppe's #9 at the end just for the smell😉and haven't had any problems keeping barrels clean. Iosso brushes are the best, something about that blue color just makes em' work better. CLR works good in my coffee machine, no reason to doubt its effectiveness in a gun barrel. Voided warranty....Hogwash!
I've tried several bore cleaning products and they all came up short. Recently I used Montana Extreme products, their Copper Killer and their Bore Solvent. I was so hopeful that these would work perfectly, especially since it contains Ammonia which is supposed to dissolve copper. It wasn't to be of course. I've let them sit in the barrel for over 2 hours and still it didn't do any better than anything else. I was very disappointed. I can't return it so I'll just use it up and find something else.
Kroil + JB is the only thing I've found that will TRULY clean out a bore. I would just rather have a chemical process as opposed to a mechanical one, but Kroil + JB is the best I've found so far. 30 to 50 strokes is all that's needed, and I don't have to let things soak for mins or hours.
30 to 50 strokes? Geez that's a lot, you must not clean them very often
@@PkwyDrive13 On a rough bore you'll need that many, maybe more. On my precision rifles it doesn't need nearly that many strokes because the bore is already smoother and sort of polished so fouling is much less anyways.
Don't worry about warranty, you all ways can lie
Think about it.. CLR is how cheap for that big bottle and gun brand products are very expensive by the Oz. I’ll keep using CLR and deny to any manufacture that ask. Allways clean out the bore with 91% alcohol then follow my bore tech cleaning.
Some of those spots you point out as carbon with the bore scope sure look like corrosion pits to me. Although I'm watching this on my phone so perhaps I'm not getting the best view.
I'm a nerdy Ph.D. scientist with a more than average knowledge of corrosion and all I'll say is "use what you want" but I won't be using CLR on my barrels. 😁
Im listening
What do you recommend?
@El_Peto , I use Berryman Chem-Dip (part # 0905). It's metal safe and turns carbon to goo that can be patched out easily. Just run a soaked patch through the bore, wait 10-20 minutes, then dry patch out the residue. It is often used in the auto industry to clean engine parts. There is a "new" formula that is also available, and it still works, but not as well as the old formula that I mentioned above. Also, the new formula is bad on aluminum parts and some plastics, so if you use a bore guide, I'd remove it after applying the new formula stuff and wipe out the bore guide while you wait for the bore to soak.
@@DocJustinT i actually have some of that berryman at home already. I already use brake and carburetor clean on heavily fouled guns, but now I'll try the berryman as well.
It does dissolve all sorts of messes inside carburetors, fuel tanks, and whatever else
After seeing how well it worked for you I have tried and it works amazingly. I don’t care about the warranty. I’m still using it. Plus it’s cheap.
Seems like I have used everything under the sun. A long time ago I bought a tube of IOSSO, like a tube of tooth paste. It worked better than anything else I had ever used. I still have some of it, gotta be 20 years old. But lately I have been using the patch-out/Wipeout.
In tha USAF during firearms training we used CLR to clean. Of course nothing was blued on an AR. I don’t actually use CLR.
Anybody notice if you use boretech c4 at very low round count the barrels cleans up very easily? Like less than 100 shots before cleanings.
CLR would have cleaned that stubborn carbon the first time. Less damage using CLR than all the mechanical cleaning.