ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 พ.ค. 2022
- I put a 48v battery in a 36v ebike - This is what happened
what happens if you change the battery of an electric bike?
I took the 48 volt battery from the Engwe EP-2 Pro and put it into the Ado A20F. Did it work? Did it make it faster? Lets find out.
Original Engwe EP-2 Pro review:
• The BEST Cheap & FAST ...
Original Ado A20F review:
• The BEST CHEAP Ebike 2...
Fantastic Engwe E-Bikes (affiliate links):
M20:
shrsl.com/3ytu5 (US)
shrsl.com/3ytu4 (UK)
shrsl.com/3ytu2 (EU)
M20 review: • AMAZING Value Super73 ...
Engine Pro:
shrsl.com/3tcqq (US)
shrsl.com/44qgq (UK)
shrsl.com/44qh0 (EU)
Engine Pro Review: • The BEST Value E-bike ...
EP-2 Pro:
shrsl.com/3jgco (US)
shrsl.com/44qgr (UK)
shrsl.com/44qgt (EU)
EP-2 Pro review: • The BEST Cheap & FAST ...
C20 PRO:
shrsl.com/3tcqg (US)
shrsl.com/3tcqa (UK)
shrsl.com/44qgv (EU)
C20 Review: • The BEST VALUE Budget ...
P26:
shrsl.com/3xe2h (USA)
shrsl.com/3xe2f (UK)
shrsl.com/3xe25 (EU)
E-VRC is the sister channel to the VR and Tech channel VRC (VRCauldron). Here I'll be testing all sorts of personal electric vehicles.
Subscribe and join the ride!
Here's me learning the EUC over a rainy weekend:
• I had 2 days to learn ...
Here is the full review of the ADO A20F on my main channel:
• The BEST CHEAP Ebike 2...
An awesome CHEAP e-scooter:
• The CHEAPEST Electric ...
Instagram & Tiktok: @alfordVRC
Twitter: @TheEVRC
Virtual Reality channel: / vrcauldron
Business contact: VRCauldron@gmail.com
My Gear (The Amazon links are affiliate links)
E-Bikes:
DYU:
DYU KING 750 a BEAST of a bike:
shrsl.com/45z72 (UK/EU)
shrsl.com/45z74 (USA)
King750 Review:
DYU D3F (small cheap ebike):
Purchase the DYU D3F here:
shrsl.com/40z6v (UK/EU)
shrsl.com/40z77 (USA)
D3F Review: • The CHEAPEST and SMALL...
ADO A20F
Original Ado A20F review:
• The BEST CHEAP Ebike 2...
Ado A20F affiliate link at Futuraride:
futuraride.com/?ref=alexford3
iScooter website: iScooter UK Store: www.iscooterglobal.co.uk/
iScooter US Store: www.iscooterglobal.com/
iScooter i9 bit.ly/3fYlwmn
iScooter iX4 Off-Road Scooter: bit.ly/3rVFYd6
Save an Extra 30GBP with Code: 30VRC
Camera:
Insta360 One R Twin Edition:
amzn.to/3t8r2si (UK)
amzn.to/3DFUDOD (USA)
Mic Adapter:
amzn.to/2WHM0m7 (UK)
GoPro Hero 9:
amzn.to/3OPvdlU (USA)
amzn.to/3OPEzhn (UK)
Insta 360 one X2:
amzn.to/3SbILuY (USA)
amzn.to/3OH0DuF (UK)
Triple8 Brainsaver EPS Helmet:
amzn.to/3BwpFd0 (USA)
amzn.to/3cKCPst (UK)
Full Face Helmet:
Lazer Phoenix+
amzn.to/3zFXKU9 (UK)
www.halfords.com/search?q=laz...
Cheap but decent Motorcycle Goggles:
amzn.to/38HW00X (UK)
amzn.to/3BLfAFW (USA)
Rear view mirror:
amzn.to/3BKyxc4 (UK)
amzn.to/2VfPGdQ (USA)
RockBros Saddle Bag:
amzn.to/38GVq3k (UK)
amzn.to/3BGk7ti (USA)
amzn.to/3DOef38 (USA from different seller)
RockBros Crossbar Bag:
amzn.to/2WVoLVn (UK)
Bike Lock:
amzn.to/3kTYjDH (UK)
amzn.to/3kTBd05(USA)
Rear kids seat:
amzn.to/3BdMr98 (UK)
amzn.to/3QkxSVA (USA)
#ebike #ebikes #adoa20f - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
I generally explain it this way. I'm disregarding the unknowns of the controller for now. If you change your battery to a larger voltage battery, such as swapping a 48V to a 52V, it's like putting a bigger engine in your car, or adding a cam etc. You'll get a little more power (torque). If you swap to a larger amp/hr battery, such as swapping to a 20ah battery from a 13ah battery, it's like adding a bigger gas tank to you car. Watt hours is how to measure a battery pack's energy capacity. Multiply the voltage by the amp hours of the pack. A 48V, 13ah battery pack has 624 watt hours (48 X 13 = 624). Each mile you travel will cost you between 20-25 watt hours. Therefore a 624 watt hour pack should get you around 25 miles without any pedal assist.
Watt hours determine the range of your bike, depending on your weight, the bike's weight, how and where you ride. The range can vary. Generally bigger is better, but it gets exponentially more expensive. FYI, on one of my eBikes I had a 48V x 13ah battery. I never tested the range with that battery, but I usually went from 5 bars on my battery meter to 4 bars after 25 kms (using pedal assist). I believe my range might be around 65-70 kms. I bought a 48V x 20ah battery. Now I go from 5 bars on the meter to 4 bars after 42 kms. Yesterday I went 132 kms and I was down to 1 bar on the meter. I'm pretty sure I can get at least 140 kms on this 20ah battery. So...bigger is better, but more expensive. Your choice.
i bought a 48v 13Ah battery for my 1000 watt front wheel hub, i only get about 30 km / 18.6 miles, on a full charge. am i doing something wrong? where am i losing that extra 10 km?
@@redzepplin7397 Yea something doesn't seem right. Unless you weigh 400+ lbs, which might explain some of it. Since my last comment here's more I found out. With my 48V x 13ah battery using PAS2 most of the time except for short busts to PAS5 when I come to a hill, I can get 80-90 kms (up to 56 miles) and with my 48V x 20ah battery on PAS2 also, I can get minimum 140kms (87 miles). I weigh 200 lbs and I don't carry extra junk around except for a 1.0m chain and lock. The brand of battery might be a factor also. I read yesterday at an eBike forum where a guy bought a no-name battery on eBay that was supposed to be a 52V x 25ah battery and he actually got less range from it than his original 48V x 13ah battery. I have one Himiway Cruiser and another which is a Trinx M500. Both use Hailong batteries. Hailong are supposed to use Samsung, Panasonic and LG cells, so are quality batteries. But you still need to be careful because disreputable aftermarket Chinese sellers can still put a Hailong logo on a shitty battery. Especially with eBay you need to be careful. All I can say is good luck...
@@redzepplin7397 That's a great range, the other guy is talking 💩
You gain a few more revolutions of the motor, but you sacrifice torque.
Think of a motor as a seesaw. On one side its speed, on the other is torque.
The only way you get more of both is by getting a bigger seesaw.
You can increase the speed of the motor, but you'll decrease torque for any given speed.
It is unlikely he is making use of the full torque of the engine in his tests so this may even be a desirable outcome.
Its still a 500w motor, instead of drawing 14A at peak power. It's drawing 10A.
Where do you come up with "Each mile you travel will cost you 20-25 watt hours"?
Hi there, what you did is called Overvolting. It’s quite a common practice.
Modern brushless motors don’t have a fixed wattage. The controller creates and limits the wattage of the motor.
If you just connected the battery directly to the brushless motor it would just draw the maximum available current and spin as fast as possible until it over heated and failed, or until the battery exploded.
The recommended wattage for the motor is normally based on how much heat the motor can withstand before it starts to degrade. Generally speaking you don’t want the motor getting over 80c.
Only overvolting by 12v is usually ok heat wise though, if worried just monitor the heat of the motor with a laser thermometer to be safe.
The motors wattage is just the volts x amps (or amps x volts lol) and that’s limited by the controller. Generally speaking though more voltage equals a higher top speed and more amperage equals more torque and faster acceleration.
That’s why overvolting by 12v only affected your top speed and not your acceleration. To improve the acceleration you’d need to increase the amperage of the controller by buying a different one or performing a shunt style modification to the controller.
You could have a 500w motor controller programed with higher amperage then voltage and it would have lower top speed but higher torque and acceleration, or with higher voltage than amperage for not as much acceleration or torque but a higher top speed and both would still be 500w.
In your case overvolting the 500w motor by 12v turns it into 750w (roughly) motor, as long as the controller is rated
to allow the full 12v extra.
To be honest though, I think your controller is still limiting the volts a little bit as well though or you’d probably get an even slightly higher top speed than you did. That’s also probably why the company said it may burn out the controller faster because most controllers have fixed physical limitations.
Usually (but not always, especially with the really cheap stuff) the rated wattage is the nominal power and not peak power so a 750w motor could be drawing as much as 1000ish watts when under maximum load or on a steep hill.
Hopefully this is helpful to someone.
Thanks for the info. Pinning for others to read 👍
Happy to help!
You can only overvolt by a few. The 36v Moffett will short out,fire probable!
Umm...no. There's a lot of "close enough" information here, but there's plenty enough that misses the mark.
Brushless motors such as these are 3-phase motors. There are 3 main wires going to the motor; you can't just connect the battery to the motor and have it spin. It reuqires the controller to convert the DC from the battery in to 3-phase, alternating current. Hooking the battery directly to the motor would only use 2 wires and the motor would rotate a few degrees, at most, and lock in place. Since it's not rotating, it would have no back EMF and draw as much power as it could...at which place the BMS on a lithium pack would trip it's over-current protection and disconnect the battery. If there was no BMS, you'd fry the motor windings that are currently active. Don't try it.
Increasing battery voltage will give you both more low end torque and top speed. At the low end of things, the coils on the motor are, to simplify it, converting the higher voltage, low current battery pulses in to lower voltage - and more importantly - higher current in the windings. Think of it more like how many watts you're putting in; if you're putting in the same amps, but higher voltage, you'll get more watts. Current(amps in the windings) = torque. You'd get nowhere in a hurry on take-off if this didn't happen. Winding currents are easily 3x as much as battery current. Higher quality controllers will limit coil winding amps to this 3x to prevent over-heating/burning up said windings. A brand-name 150A controller will thus monitor and limit winding current to 450A.
I agree that the controller is dialing back the power; the OP should have seen better results. 15mph@ 36v should have seen 20mph at 48v. Perhaps changing the settings to 48v is what told the controller to dial back.
I have a folding ebike almost identical to these. It came with an 8 amp controller in it; it wasn't working because the display had gotten water in to it, and, stupid design as they are, you can't use the controller unless the display works. It was rated at 350w, so i tossed in a cheap - no display - controller rated for 350w, but the difference was that it had a current limit of 18A. These cheap controllers will put out the 18A for a few seconds, meaning it's putting out ~650W on take off, and will do it briefly when hill climbing. The rest of the time it will run at half that, 325w. With a fully charged battery (42v), it can out out about 750w. It really scoots around! Totally out performs what I just watched in this video. Yes, the top speed is similar...35km/h....but it gets there in the first hundred feet or so, and will stay close to that up minor hills. With pedalling, it won't drop below 30 except on the steepest of hills. There's a chance that the original controller's "8A" was capabale of doubling that rating, but after watching this, I would have to say that 8A is 8A, period. The controller was half the size of the 18A one I put in.
Smaller controllers have higher internal resistances, which will add to the limitations you're experiencing. More MOSFETs will reduce said resitances, allowing for more/better current handling. The 18A controller has 9 FETs in it, the original had 6. Physically it was almost twice as big...it barely fit in the frame with all that mess of unnecessarily long wiring. The 500w/32A/48V controllers typically have 12 FETs, my 800w/38A/48V has 15, the 1500w/45A/72V has 18....and my 3000w has 24 much larger FETs and copper bus-bars; it's a work of art inside.
For anyone building their own...bigger is better, when it comes to motors (and batteries). I'm using the 1500w @ 48v, so it's more of a 1000w(2000w peak) controller on a 3000w motor, so you'd expect it to be a bit lack-luster...but the bigger motor is much more efficient/better at making torque; If I don't have my weight over the handlebars, it will wheelie from a start if you give it the beans, and tops out at a bit over 50km/hr, limited by the relatively low wattage. It's also much more efficient at high loads than a smaller motor that is being pushed past it's limits, though it's presumably less efficient at lighter loads.
You need batteries that can keep up with your motor or controller, so, honestly, you're better off building a battery yourself if you have the means...it will cost half as much as one that comes pre-built and you can guarantee that it's rated for the power demands you're going to put on it. Don't expect a cheap ebay battery to last long if you're pulling 1500w from it. Don't believe them when they say they have samsung cells in them, either. Expensive packs from well-known ebike brands should be what they say they are, but, again, they're expensive. If you're using chinese cells, stick to Liitokala, and even then, watch for fakes. LiFePO4 cells are a bit more of a pain to work with, but they're also safer and, if you don't cheap out on the BMS, live a lot longer; they're generally also high-drain without the extra cost that you'll get with samsung high-drain Li-ion.
So, yes, bigger is better with batteries. I'd advise having a pack with a watt-hour of equal to or higher than your controller's watt rating, so that you get a decent range and can keep up with demand. Even low-drain batteries can keep up if you have equal or greater watt-hours to watts out; they're generally rated at "1C" or, if you're lucky, "3C" - 1 or 3 times their capacity. If you have a 30ah battery, it won't care if you're pulling 15 amps out of it non-stop. Even the 1C cells will be fine at 30 amps in a 30ah battery. I've got 1000 watt-hours worth of cells on the way for a bike I'm building for a buddy, which will probably be run at 800w, but they're 4C, so he'll be able to run more power than the 1500w motor is rated for, if he gets the urge. About $350 US for the cells and a fancy "smart" BMS.
As to over-volting...they'll generally take it if you're only really increasing the voltage. Higher voltage will raise your top speed. It will still consume the same amount of power at the same speed you were going before. On my first ebike, which had a 400w direct-drive motor, I put a 1500w controller on it. It sucked compared to my 3000w running at 1000w, but it took it...it would only pull 1200w up a long, decently steep hill, while managing 40km/h, and was only cozy-warm to the touch after, and this was a real cheap turd of a motor. Bumping up 50% power with a 50% voltage increase ought not to bother most motors. Maybe in San Francisco, or if you're climbing over a mountain it will over-heat it, but where you're in reasonable terrain, no problem. The same probably can't be said for big motors that are already running close to their limits, though they tend to have temp sensors to prevent issues.
They also sell the exact same motors with higher wattage ratings when coupled with higher voltage controllers. No differences otherwise.
As to blowing FETs...yes, if you do a shunt mod wrong, you'll blow your FETs. If you're over-volting, then that depends. The capacitors have a habit of not being rated to take much more voltage, and will generally blow at a lower voltage than the FETs. Both have common voltages they are rated for....and that voltage is NOT the same as the NOMINAL voltage of your battery pack. Put a multimeter on your charger and see what it puts out...that's the peak voltage of your battery pack, and that's what the caps and FETs have to handle. Most 48v controllers have 63v caps and 75v MOSFETs...the FETs can handle a 60v pack, but the capacitors can not, as the peak voltage is somewhere around 72v. Most 36v controllers will have the same components in them, but not all...you have to open up the controller and look up the specs on the mosfets, and you can read the specs right off the capacitors. A 24v will generally take a 36v battery, but the capacitors will only handle 50v, so a 48v pack (57 odd volts fully charged) will kill it. The internal voltage regulators on the lower voltage ones might not handle it and fry, even if the other main components can. I killed a watt-meter that was rated up to 60v by putting 61v to it. Oops. If you're not comfortable potentially blowing your controller or unsure, just buy a higher voltage controller to go with the higher voltage pack. Only an issue/expensive if you want the extra functions you get with a screen.
Take aways...
A little over-volting won't kill your motor.
Bigger is better, for batteries and motors.
There's a huge price-gap between low-power(street legal in most places) components and high-power ones; be ready to pay through the nose for the latter, unless you DIY it.
Don't connect the battery directly to your brushless motor unless you're just looking for an excuse to replace it.
"350w" on a folding ebike is quite enough to have fun while getting around.
Don't eat yellow snow.
this help me! thank you
I built a 48v 12.5 AH, 1200 Watt motor, 20 inch wheels, Top speed 34 MPH, Range (full throttle) 22 miles.
The formula:
More volts = more speed
More current (amps) = more torque
More capacity (amp-hours) = more range.
48vx12.5 is 600 Watt hours. That's 27.27 wpm so 47 minutes of ride time, assuming your average mph was 28MPH. Very rough guestimating. Is that about what you'd experienced in practice? About 3.5 hours of ride time from 85% down to 15% of battery capacity
I changed a 36 volt battery in the nakto pony ebike to a 48 volt; the bike went from top speed of about 20 mph, to 32 mph. Big difference on my bike. Paul from Boston, Mass., USA.
There are two factors, the controller and the motor. The controller will only allow so much current through based on the Moffats. If you know what you are doing you can mod them to draw more current. You were fortunate in having a dual voltage controller which you could switch in the settings, in most cases you would have to get a new controller. The other factor is the motor, where the higher voltage may result in more speed but it wont improve torque. So hill climbs wont improve by that much, but speeds on the flat, or going down hill should improve. So whilst you can increase the voltage to improve the speed of the motor, you would do better with a motor actually built for the higher voltages as they should also have improved torque.
For more power you don't mod the mosfets, you do what's called a shunt mod. Generally you need an amp meter to do this to check the current draw before and affer modding.
@@spinnanz yeah the Shunt mod, where you put more solder on the shunt, so it draws a greater current. Too much current can blow the moffats so make sure those are properly heat sinked.
Mosfet 🤣
Hello, if you can answer me... I have new Engwe C20 PRO 500W 36V 19,2Ah model . I look at controller, there is written: batt. voltage 48V; cutoff voltage 39V; current limit 18A (it is delivered with my bike). On motor is signed 36V500W. I tested voltage on my battery when is full 42V, also 42Vx18A = 756 Watt (elementary mathematic U (V)x I(A)=P(W). Ithink that 48V battery when is fully charged reach 54V? With my display unit (same as for ENGWE 48V models) i can easy adjust voltage levels for 48 V batt. Want more speed and torque, but will motor overheat and burn? BR Neno
@@nenobujas6567 Hi Neno I’ve seen a few reactions of yours on C20 Pro videos, allow me to ask you a question. I recently received my C20 Pro 500w but with a 16ah battery (which they describe as having more cells). They promised me it would be a 48v battery but it’s 36v according to the label. Motor is 36v also. It’s feels like a scam after their promise. What is your top speed and milage? Did you discover anything to improve it? Many thanks
just finished my ebike build, mid mounted 48v 1000 watt motor, did a test run just to make sure the breaks and everything worked i got in just a short run 45 km top speed with me using all the gears on the bike,,
I think you are seeing an effect of not only the voltage, but also the amps that the battery pack can put out plus the overall increased capacity of the pack. Ah X V = Wh. Therefore, the one pack is capable of 374.4 Watt Hours, and the other is 614.4 Watt Hours. I would suspect that not only is the cells in the 36V pack lesser in quantity, it's possibly lower quality as well; and this is an area where most assemblers can make the MOST money, and that's in the battery pack itself. Many consider all battery packs as "equals", but reality is that batteries are an IMPORTANT consideration. While many might equivocate the amp hour rating of the battery pack as the equivalent of a fuel tank, it's far more than that. A 48 V pack is a 12 cells in series, with the amps coming from a number of cells in parallel as well, something like 12S5P ( 60 x 18650 batteries) ; and the 36V pack is 10 cells in series, again, with the amps coming from a number of cells in parallel as well, and I suspect a lesser number here - like 10S4P ( 48 x 18650 batteries ) . Generally speaking, while the voltage comes from the series connections, your overall amp output comes from the cells that are in parallel- and more cells of the same capacity - in parallel, tends to equate to more available power available from that particular pack. A 5P pack is going to output more current sustained easier than a 4P pack.. That definitely can affect performance.. Far more complicated than a tank of gas, eh ? Also far more important than most realize too.
Some of the newer packs support newer batteries, where many older packs will use 18650's, some newer ones might be using, say , 21700's. 21700's work similarly- but the cell counts should be far less as less cells in parallel would be needed. One thing I didn't mention earlier, because it's sort of confusing, is that a 48V pack technically could have the same number of cells in it as a 36V pack by using lower capacity 18650's in the same pack, wired differently- a cheaper alternative. And if made in China, I sort of expect "INFLATED" numbers..
Another area where pack sizing comes into play is the lifetime of the pack. If I use 9 to 10 amp hours on a daily basis, for my daily ride, a 10.4 amp hour pack should work, right ? Yes, but- it will shorten the battery packs life considerably because I'm using by fully discharging it.. A 15 amp hour or 20 amp hour pack will have a happier, longer life .. Simply put, a larger battery pack works less hard, and will last longer.
No, the manufacturers aren't going to advertise how they cut corners- they'll advertise price as budget minded individuals see, more than any other spec, price. Manufacturers will instead advertise an improved model with a better battery pack at a premium. Even if the motor or other components are the same, this is where manufacturers will "boast" about the capabilities of this model, etc..
Another aspect often not thought about is - for the same wattage output, a motor ran at 48V is simply going to draw less amps than the same setup at 36V.
is it worth upgrading your pack ? If your pack is still good, not likely, but perhaps. Reality is, it should have been one of the things considered while purchasing. IF the pack is starting to fail, or has failed, and you were going to buy another pack - well, that's a no-brainer..
As others have suggested, it'd be wise to check out, with a temp gun, how warm the controllers and motors get during use- at both 36V and at 48V and see if the temperature is "safe" .. That said, you probably should also check how warm the battery is as well ..
Like someone else mentioned in the comments, swapping batteries is sort of like swapping your old engine out for a better engine; reality is that any electric vehicle is comprised of many key components, like the wiring, the battery pack, the working voltage, the peak amps, sustained amps & the overall capacity of the battery, the motor itself and the controller. Limit ANY ONE of these, and you limit the rest of the subsystems.
48 nominal volt it a 13 S
I love the time you've spent to explain this to everyone. I have a 36/48 kit and I've had both batteries on there. The 48 reaches 26-27mph, the 36 22mph fully charged. acceleration is better with the 48, and so is range! Same amp hours. But more watt hours! By comparison, my 20s5p 72v samsung 40t home-built pack takes my 80amp bike around 40 miles on throttle only mixed riding, and 23 miles at full throttle full speed. Luckily my friend has a house 22 miles away and I rode wide open the whole way there, hung out for the day, charged the battery up, let people try it, and took it easy back home. I had gone down to 74v from 84 by taking it easy.
Just wanted to share since you know quite a bit.
Your motor will be rated to do so many revolutions per minute, for every volt you give it (This is known as KV Rating). So adding a higher voltage pack will increase the spin speed of your motor (more speed). In your case, your controller lacks the current (amps) to push it up to higher speeds. Hence you are getting 22+ mph down hill but lower speeds on flat or uphill sections. I shunt modded my controller so it had better up hill pulling power, I.E it provided more amps to the motor. Obviously there are other factors involved, like voltage sag that can effect top speed, for example if your battery is really cold or just has poor performance battery cells then the voltage will sag down when applying throttle, and you will get less spin speed as motors will spin slower the less volts you give it. Find someone who can work a soldering iron and get them to put solder about half way across the shunt, it will give a lot more zip, but try and keep the controller cool as it will generate more heat!
So many aspects that would prevent the higher voltage from outperforming. The motor gears limit top speed in top gear. Your Controller limits the top speed of the throttle. Your controller limits the wattage or amperage. I do assume you are getting faster acceleration . That gives you the ability to take advantage of any slopes if you hit them at top speed vs a few miles below top speed due to the motor not reaching top speed yet.
Thanks for making the video bro!
No problem 👍
The controller is programmed to calculate the rpm of the wheel from hall sensors withing the motor. The programmed cut off for the class of the bike comes from there. A second point is the max amp, the MOSFET inside can deliver, this is printed on the controller label.
@@jayson3775 Sure that can be done, if the bike is used aside official ways and roads. Here in europe you loose every insurance and permission for traffic through manipulation.
Range with the old 36v as well as the 48v version...
I have the 36v tested on range in #2 peddling assist mode.
Between 72-75 km distance, so that's pretty good.
Greetings from Leeds.I like your content and style . both VR and e mobility in fact I got the I9 pro scooter after watching one of your video reviews and now in synchronicity. I have just ordered the ADO A20 F after a friend got one and recommended it .. . I then noticed your review and video's using the bike. very useful That was the final piece in the jigsaw .May I ask where your wing mirror is from? looks practical and useful to me
Thanks very much! The wing mirror was from amazon there's a link in the description. VERY useful 👍
Most of your controlers the capasiter os what determins sight volate change so if it quita and you find it in the controller open it up and you'll usualy see the capsiter top has bubbled or split the three split makes into of the capassiter . The split makes are there just for that reson so it does'nt explode .
The 48V battery installed in the 36V bike might not work to its full potential but it would interesting to compare two batteries, 36V and 48V same Amperage/hour, in a 36V bike and see the max range.
Hmm. Just be careful. I would always check the controller out first if it could take that 48v. But really with that battery in. It will take out for more rang and speed. But what I always check out first is the NM of toque of the motor. For hill climbs as the area I am is quite hilly. Then of course the batter AH for the distances I go for.
Yeah i didn't plan on keeping the battery in for long. Would be interesting to find out what controller is in there. Some can take 2 different voltages but since the speed change was so small maybe this one doesn't take 48. Then again if an extra 250 watts usually gives around 5mph more maybe an extra 2mph going from 36 to 48 is about right.
Interested to know the range difference
Wow interesting experiment .😁
Hello, your opinion which bike looks more cool, more "muscle" and more fun to drive?
I didn't know this was going to turn into a scenic route video thanks a lot I thought it was going to be mostly getting into the specs on the batteries how much run time you got how you could upgrade the bikes to get longer run time next time I want to take a scenic tour I'll get on my tread Mill
Feel free to ask. I only promised to tell you 'what happened' when I did it. That's what happened. Higher capacity batteries get more range though so yeah you'd get more range. But best stick with the same voltage as the original battery as you could burn out the motor.
How long before the motor went toast? or is it still going?
Playing with fire bro... quite possibly literally.
is the controller unlock/ speed set to 100? i dont have that kind of bike so i dont know if it has settings for that
The power is limited by the current draw from the battery through the controller, so I guess that is what is limiting it.
I bought a 350 watt gear motor 6 months ago. I just bought a 500 watt gear motor and the 500 is half an inch radious bigger then the 350watt. Makes sense of needing larger gear wheels to have more power.
How much weight can the back seat of the EP-2 Pro hold? I see you've put a seat on it and I was thinking of doing the same.
Good question. I have my 6 yr old son on it and it's fine. He's big for his age too. He's also well over the recommended weight for it which I'm sure was about 20kgs
As I understand it, it depends on the capacitors in the controller. Many are rated at 63V permitting upgrade of the battery with no worries, as peak charge voltage might be 54.4 for LiMn or 58.2 for LiFPO4 or 58.8 for LiNCA types. (Terminal charge voltage, as represented on the label of the charger). Running 48V nominal packs should work with most controllers , with all 48V nominal chemistries. Your mileage may vary if those those capacitors are rated less. Otherwise change out the controller for a 48V nominal one.
It may be possible that damage to controller re the amps, i dont know this but wonder if its possible
Scary fast your gutsy how much did it cost?
If I up the 48v battery to a 52v on my 500watt fat tire, will I need bigger controller to make it faster
Ah! the voltage vs Amps fight! 'may I have this dance'.
If your in the UK 🇬🇧 how do you get around the 250W limit? Thanks :)
surprised you didn't fry the controller.
Everybody in the comments has missed the most important factor. What is the new battery BMS amperage draw cut off point, i.e. at what amperage does the BMS shut the battery off to protect the cells? Once you know that, then you install a controller just underneath this amperage so the battery won't shut off at full throttle. You change the controller to a higher amp controller 'based upon the BMS amperage cut off of the battery. Batteries built with better cells can flow more amps and have a higher amp BMS.
Once you match the controller amperage to the battery, you enjoy the bike with new found power from higher voltage battery and higher amp controller with little regard for the motor. After a hard run or two, you feel the rear hub motor to see if its toasty. If you are like me, you run it until it runs no more and then your replace the rear hub motor to something like 1500-2000 watts which can handle 50 amps and 52-72 volts for 40mph+ top speed. All this stuff is sacrificial. No ebike components last forever. Adjust the components for the power level you like. If you want more life out of your battery, choose a large size in terms of amp-hrs so that you don't have to charge it max every time you ride for adequate range. Also voltage sag will be less with more cells inside the battery case which equates to more amp-hrs and range.
Acceleration seemed faster with the 48v vs the 36 which is almost cooler than simply topping out at a slightly higher speeds. You should do a 0-20 acceleration test since I think the speed of the bike might be limited regardless of voltage... Like the slightly higher speed could just be ballistic from faster acceleration. Just my novice 2 cents.
Good idea 💡
@@e-VRC hi, did you try this already or during testing feel any diffrence in acceleration I’m really curious. Thanks
@@Tom-vg2qx check out part 2 👍
@@e-VRC oohhh sorry I did check but apparently didn’t see it I see it now thanks
More Voltage draws more Current through the circuit. More current means more Torque as it is proportional. Any acceleration you feel is the effect of Torque moving you forward by spinning the wheel. Top speed on the other hand is achieved when you are not accelerating any more and is related proportionally to max RPM achieved by the higher voltage input.
I asked ADO if I can change the 36v battery to the 48v one you used and they said no it could eventually burn out the controller. So I guess the takeaway from this is it’s okay for a quick try but don’t leave it in the long term if you don’t want to burn out your controller in the ADO A20F. Oh and thanks for the test was great to see the results.
No problem. Shame they don't just start selling it as a 48v
@@e-VRC some controller have 36/48v is mean it can take it
@@justynssagan6156 i think theirs might be 24/36v
@@e-VRC you have to change the 36v motor to 48v not just the battery
@@justynssagan6156 Not true, a 36 volt motor cant take much higher voltatge than its rating. its amps that will fry the motor not voltage
If you change the controller too you would likely get a lot more power, the motors windings are optimised for 36v though so overheating might be an issue.
Better to just buy a 48v setup if that's what you want, I can tell you 48v has much more power when done correctly, my bikes are all 48v apart from one 36v,
36v get me to about 17mph, 48v goes to 30 and a lot more acceleration too.
Yeah I do take the controller out in the next video and it's not great although it is rated for 48v
Hi Mate, thank u for u videos, let me ask u, where do u buy the back seat??? Thanks
Amazon it's the Shayson toddler seat. I put a link down below but it's unavailable in the uk right now.
Most electric motors come in 3-5 stages. ie. 350-750w category 36v may be able to interchange batteries but the on the on benefit for the lower tier purchase is and charge stiffness and battery life every thing is being regulated to the advertised output just manageable from
Higher Amps 50 Amp BMS @ 48volts would be fun ! What amp is the controller ?
Good stuff
I thought in the UK ebikes couldn't have throttle control. With a throttle the bike has to be registered etc as a motorcycle?
Would a 48 volt 17.5ah work in the ADO A20 ??
Hi. I am the owner of the ADOA20F bike and therefore I have a question. Is there a chance to replace or modify the shock absorbers because the originals are terrible?
Thank you for your ADO A20F videos.
I've not tried but I'm sure there is a way.
done this on my bike i have ado a20 and suspension springs from any suspension bike will work just put a rachet down to loosen the forks
how much higher can you run the voltage? it seems you can adjust it on the bike computer, can it go to 72v?
If the motor is rated for 36 volts and you go to 48 you would be fine. The eventual problems that could arise could be overheating when in continuous top speed use. Also make sure u change the settings in the menu. If you don't you could over drain the battery.
what settings
Hello, if you can answer me... I have new Engwe C20 PRO 500W 36V 19,2Ah model . I look at controller, there is written: batt. voltage 48V; cutoff voltage 39V; current limit 18A (it is delivered with my bike). On motor is signed 36V500W. I tested voltage on my battery when is full 42V, also 42Vx18A = 756 Watt (elementary mathematic U (V)x I(A)=P(W). Ithink that 48V battery when is fully charged reach 54V? With my display unit (same as for ENGWE 48V models) i can easy adjust voltage levels for 48 V batt. Want more speed and torque, but will motor overheat and burn? BR Neno
The display settings Google your display and find out how to get into the advance settings or try to download the manual for your display good luck
Assuming the 48v battery costs more than a comparable 36v the first consideration is the extra 2mph worth the additional cost , Secondary as you stated will the change affect the longer life term usage of the bike , some interesting questions which I suggest needs further investigation and another video .
my huffy ebike hits 20 on flatland easy 36v battery. I am looking to extend so I can go further. its slow up very steep hill. Be careful. the weight is why you should drive slow and be cautious on those.
There is more to it. Swapping controllers made a 500 watt bike into a 750 watt bike. And upping the current limit greatly increased the torque. For about $80, I'm much happier with the bike. It's the ancheer 26" 500 watt " mountain" bike. Now full class 2.
Hello, I have ADO A20Plus with 36V and 10.4Ah ... basically you can tell me if "I have to" replace the battery and control unit, or just 48V battery and change in the display menu .. very briefly .. thank you very much!
The control unit in the ado a20f is able to cope with 48v. But I'm not sure if the motor will like it for long periods of time
WE DID IT AGAIN, LOOKED AT THE CONTROLLER AND TESTED ACCELERATION and also compared it with the 750w Engwe EP-2 Pro
th-cam.com/video/FdfwfKyd5o8/w-d-xo.html
Don't forget if you love ebikes, escooters, electric unicycles and electric skateboards.... you should definitely hit that subscribe button for more content delivered straight to your phone 😉
The wattage of the motor is just a nominal figure. I think I heard that it's the amount the motor can take with no degradation. Remember, watts=amps x volts
Is it possibld to put the ep2 pro battery inside the c20 pro ?
Try to get the most without destroying the system?
Si può installare ado A20+f una batteria da 48v 12/17 amper ?
Hi, me again. can you post a film about the A20F and the front fork suspension how you can adjust this and possibly replace it with an air front fork. I can do it myself but I'd rather someone else do it on his own a20f first hahahah. I also wonder if you can place a random front suspension, are the front fork suspension sizes of fatbikes all the same?
Haha not something I'd planned on doing. Interesting thought though. Would be nice to switch out to a system that can be locked.
Try keeping the voltage on 36v while putting in 48v to see if there is an increase in power and speed.
I remember doing this years ago ,now I always make sure I buy kits with Juliet Connections, this way I can swap esc's/controllers on my bikes, most 250w kits are 10-15 amp 36/48v ,so a purchase of a 22amp controller will give you a significant boot/torque, even better is a high amperage controller and a quality lcd display that you can set the amount of amp's the controller will receive, makes like cycle analyst although expensive you can swap it around with all your bikes if you get the right Connections, all this soldering is very fiddly as the wires are tiny 😮
The controller in the A20f is 7-13 amp which is crazy considering it's marketed as a 500w bike. Should be sold as 250 really. Engwe sent me a 23amp (max) controller from an engine pro to swap in so I'm hoping that the connectors will all be the same 🤞🤞
@@e-VRCYou gotta be an ebike specialist by now ,they are the best thing ever ,I still chuckle when I get to a steep Derbyshire hill I'm in no1 or 2 nearly all the time but if she's steep I press 5 and I'm laughing 😂🤟🤠💯🇬🇧
@@ianmangham4570 learning every day 😂 but agreed they're brilliant.
i"m disappointed it did'nt even catch on fire. i have removed a controller on a 30amp set up, i replaced the controller with used a 40amp car relay. it made heaps more power to the wheel.
I have also used 12v on a 6v kids motobike and burned out the motor, but it was fun while it lasted . . . all of about 10 min :D
I have a fiido q1s stock but wish to upgrade the battery from 36v 10ah to 52v 21ah , the hub motor is stock 250w 36v, do I have to upgrade the hub motor too and will it destroy the hub motor?
I would definitely like to see more testing and I just subscribe to your channel hoping that you will do so cuz I am thinking about going from a 48 to a 52 volt on my bike which is a completely different bike but with all the details that have helped me make a better decision I kind of figured I'd pick up about 1 to 3 miles an hour on the top speed but I would definitely like to see the difference in range that can be the final decision maker of what I'm going to do not only that I'm probably going to end up running tool batteries because my bicycle is my main source of transportation I got it on February 15th of this year and I'm about to crack 4,000 miles
for the range test to be accurate though both batteries would have to have the same amp hour rating so if it's a 36 volt 10 amp hour you need a 48 volt 10 amp hour
Think about the results of this test. 36v versus 48v. That is a 33% increase in voltage. From 48v to 52v there is about 10% increase in voltage. These numbers are kind of misleading. A 36v battery at full charge is actually around 42 volts and a 48v battery fully charged is over 54 volts.
So realistically, the little bars or percentage gauges on the displays don't tell an accurate story.
Voltage is the better indicator of the state of charge contained in one of these batteries.
Because as the voltage decreases during use, the amount the voltage tends to sag more as the state of charge lessens.
This guy gained about a mile or two per hour from using a 48v on a 36v motor.
I tend to doubt you'd pick up as much or more top end with only a fraction of the voltage increase.
But I would expect the range would probably improve.
Depends too on what drive system, hub vs. mid drive. Mid drives make much better use of your pedalling input through a range of gear ratios that can be matched to terrain vs. the one gear ratio hub motor.
@@RoadtrekRich from all the research i have done you will gain faster acceleration with a higher voltage battery and a little top end but you can lower the amount of amps you are running to minimise heat but some ebike kits can handle them all day generally speaking it is safe to upgrade batteries but it is the controller you have to worry about not the motor itself as if the volts exceed what the caps in the controller can handle it will blow the controller up
@@FATTY1990 good point
I expect the controller config is the limiting factor. You would need to check the documentation to be sure.
Can you change your amp setting on your controller.?
I’ve got a similar controller and change the amp setting max at 20amp
Setting 14 in the computer is set to 15 and can be changed but I didn't. I get the controller out in the next video.
i have a question will it be unhealthy to run my bike motor from 48v to 26v I can change it in the settings on my ebike I do see a differents in power and time I can spend on 26v I just don't know if its worth it running on 26v
Which one is the better bike? ADO is bettter looking I think. And what is that bag installed in your ADO that looks great. Can you tell me what bag is that?
Engwe is certainly faster and has greater range. It also comes with mud guards and luggage rack. The bag is from Rockbros there's a uk link to it in the description.
@@e-VRC Thank you very much.
Will it burn the controller and motor ?
This is interesting. Because its the ONLY thing stopping the ADO A20F being the best fat tyre ebike in the universe. ADO should have given it 48v power to start with. But the controller is an issue too. You should get 40 to 42kph on the flat with a 48v battery. My FIIDO M1 pro gives me 40 to 42kph on the flat 24.8 to 26mph.
Is the fiido 500 or 750?
@@e-VRC Fiido is 500w
That must be an extremely scary and awesome experience... Achieving speeds ALMOST HALF AS FAST as a tour de France pedal bicycle Rider.
Ikr i had to mute the screams. You should check out my escooter drag race video 😂🐌🦔
Seen many people slip 48v into 36v. It's harder on the motor, whether it lessens the lifespan or not, I don't know. I do know if you run a bike that doesn't let you set the voltage you will have to find another way to read the battery because the charge display will not drop till the battery is dead because 48v batteries are considered dead at a higher voltage than 36v. So you might end up damaging your battery because the bike will drain everything it can from that 48
A range test would be appreciated.
I really want to know whether the change to higher voltage battery will have impact on the bike motor or not or whether the motor will be damaged or has higher heat
If the watts produced is greater than what the motor is rated for over a sustained period of time then yeah it could.
Usually you can tell if it's peak power or not, the advertising usually shows nominal, with bezior engwe and so forth, specifications usually show peak, but sometimes u can tell between 500w being peak and or more, most of the smaller cheaper ebikes are 36v with 16-20a controllers peak, if it's advertised as 500w 48v, usually peak power is 750ish dependant on the controller.
This is very important to know cuz engwe has the L20 and they are 250w 48v, but cuz they factory limited to 250w and stamped with aprovavly and marked for 250watts they can sell it and u can legally ride it, so u can unlock it and get 500-750w(peak) and the cops if they ever stop u they check the sticker or imprint and it's in spec of 250w they are doing the same with some of their 750w ebikes now, so it's really important to check ebike voltages. 250-500w is a bit hard to tell peak Cuz usually they try stay hard in the law
Ahr give you torque/acceleration V give you top speed, the reason the difference was small was because it was taking longer to accelerate, if the road was longer and level the difference would grow over time but both would eventually reach their top speed, I would expect to see around 5mph at least
Is the speed not legally capped at around 15mph in the U.K. and Europe.
In the USA they allow up-to 25mph.
As you can change the battery voltage settings on the bike yo7 shouldn’t have any problems.
hey man, i love my bike but i have learned one thing. if you buy dealer bikes in order to unlock the potential you must replace controller. usually that also means replacing a few other things the company decided to set. as im typing this you say exactly what im talking about. lol
😂😂😂
Hi there ,,, loving your videos on the Ado A20F ,,, Looks such a great bike, my question is that i am 6ft 6inches tall or 1.98 would the Ado be big enough for me to ride for me ,,many thanks :)
Hey thanks, glad you're enjoying them. Ooh.good question. You're quite a bit taller than me however the seat can go quite far. If you're particularly heavy though you might prefer the engwe. I'm heavy for my height at around 100kgs and the ado is fine but you definitely notice the difference with the engwe. Ado looks cooler though.
How about is limited to 18 miles per hour?What to do.
@@calinrusu9213 if it's the ado then press up and down buttons together to enter settings. Go to setting 8 and set it to what you want. Also setting 12 is the acceleration strength.
Speed is determined by the drive phase on the controller frequency = RPM = MPH.
The ebike controller has another option when you can change controller speed and current limit usually P8 and P14 values in configuration menu
What can be max. Ah for 36 v 250 w ?thanks
The current factory setting is 15ah. Can i up it to 18 maybe for extra torque ?
@@oissende 250 / 36 = 7A, the max should be 14A or you might burn the motor
@@javierarcvae you right ,thank you bro.👌
So I have an escooter with 1000w motor, 36v battery. I wanted to upgrade to a 48v battery, got a 48v controller rated for a 1000w motor. but the motor is a 36v, 1000w motor. Will this work ? Or do I HAVE to get a 48v motor ?
You should be careful to only use batteries with a BMS, because a 36V controller will have a 28V voltage cutoff, but a 48V li-ion battery is already fully discharged at 36.4V so you could damage the battery without a BMS that cuts the power beforehand.
Then there's the issue with the controllers over voltage cutoff and it's condensator voltage rating.
My research told me that most 36V and 48V controllers have a condensator voltage rating of 60V, with a 48V battery peaking at 57V this works but not all 36V might have 60V Condensators, some might only be 52V rated.
I drove my friends tesla, and he said push the peddle to the floor, and i could feel the electric power it delivered. It put me in the seat. And after that ,I've been so interested in this power it brings. Now I just really wunt this power to be placed on a stand up scooter. Such lite structure, with Lipo power being shot to the hub motor, all you can do is get ready, and hold on tight. Mite feel an out of body experience for a min, but that's ok. 😁
Reliability is the biggest question
would it push a scion box car or quad?
Mate seriously what is the better bike out the 2? with out sounding rude if your mrs was on the ADO bike and you was on the ep2 would you still pull on the ADO bike? Your other half left you in the bike test
She's a friend not my other half. But yeah she did. If we swapped bikes it would be more even but the ado had a dodgy brake that day so i rode it myself. The Engwe is undoubtedly faster. I have speed tests of both bikes on the channel.
@@e-VRC sorry on the miss understanding buddy 😬. I’m not a simple Simon by any means my biggest problem is if I get problems from the police with the ep2. I understand they have actually brought a new one called ENGENE X it’s basically a ep2/pro but labelled up on the motor as 250w but sadly no stock till August:( now I can get the ADO 20f XE now but seriously don’t no if it’s worth me just hanging on till August ha! I’m a hgv driver so I do have to think out the box with the stupid rules on them mate if I didn’t drive for a living I would just go with what ever bike and not worry so much on the 250w
The rage now seems to be dual motors and batteries like the AR Grizzly. You have me thinking, 1) What if you add a 52V18AH battery to a 48V bike? Running the 48V and 52V parallel should yield 50V and more AH's... 2) What if you add a 36V500W front motor to the bike with a 48V500W rear motor? (Upping the controller of course for the higher load) - Now, Put 1) and 2) together with selector switches on both motors to extend range. Say, downhill with a tailwind, front motor only. And on the flat, 2-500W motors should perform as well as a 1000W rear hub but get better traction!
I've been looking into different methods of having a dual motor set up as I'd love to upgrade the a20f so it has the power to match its looks. I imagine a 2x500 has the potential to be more efficient than a 1x1000 possibly with similar or better acceleration but lower top end speed.
@@e-VRC Sry 4 d slo response. Your vid shows 48V on 36V bike = more speed. I'm betting a 48V30A controller on 2 - 36V500W motors would SPANK a single 48V1000W motor and be better in sand!
how fast can you go using the motor and peddling in high gear?.
so, theoretical i can put in a higher capacy battery in the a20+ too? you can change to 48v too, but the motor is only 350watts.
Theoretically. I don't know the specs of the controller and current battery of the a20+ but you'd think since they're trying to pass a max of 350 watts through the motor the big battery would make a larger difference. However it would also more likely cause damage over time.
can you put a accelerator on to a hit way b6 ebike ?
The battery output on the Engve is 614.4 Watts and the Ado battery output is 374.4 watts.
I have a 36v Critter tricycle can you put a 52 v Battery on it?
Yeah I'm doing the same thing what I'm worried about is the controller handling it going from lead acid 24v to lithium 36v bike experts here on TH-cam say it's only like putting more gas in the tank the controller won't let it do much more
Look inside the controller at the little black capacitors ,they're labelled in voltage.
@@ianmangham4570 no it's an old monster of a bike Ezip trails 36 volt battery didn't work the controller is in aluminum box disguised as a bicycle rack in the rear I bought a new bike and then found a 24 volt lithium battery wasn't even looking
I have the ADO A16 which is 36v 350w and the battery life is shocking. They even supplied me with a second battery but I get the same result. On fairly flat landscape I can do about 14 miles if I pedal which is poor. Would 48volt help this significantly does anyone know? Cheers
If You want more range you need to add more AH, A 10 AH battery is roughly half a 20AH battery but you won't get double the range but you would get better range. Maybe at a guess 75 % more range, depending on how you use the extra storage capacity.
You could put two batteries in parallel, I don't know how easy this would be on this bike as I don't have this bike.
upgrading the controller is a Big one but most 36v ebike controllers can handle 48v my ebike is 48 and i am going to upgrade it to a 52 possibly 72 but main upgrade is your controller as it judges the amp out put more amps more power!!!!
2:15 Dude, great video, but I really want to peel the plastic off that display, lol 😆
Haha thanks. I always keep 'em on as long as possible 😂
After building custom ebikes, I forgot how terribly slow factory Ebikes are.
Range difference is very important; if going faster shortens range, I would not favor the switch.
And yes, if the switch results in more repair costs and shortens useful life of the bike, I would not favor the switch either.
But these are the kind of real-world things I'd like to learn before I make any purchase .... right now I only have a regular pedal-only bike, but due to my advancing age I'm considering an e-bike. .
Get one..... you will have to control your smile when riding..... I liken it to piloting a jet... Stay on your toes for sure... So much fun...
@@isawit9722 that was posted 11 months ago; I have had an Aventon Aventure 2, for about a month now. It has torque sensor rather than cadence sensor for drive system, which I'm not enthused about because more leg effort is required, but it isn't as bad as expected so I'm ok with it. The standard rear rack and turn signals/brake lights, and a color I like better, were the reasons I took the 2 over the Aventure 1 (which had cadence). I've touched 29 mph once (briefly, on a down slope). It is generally comfortable to keep it between 19-23 mph in turbo mode. But battery drain is fast in turbo mode, so I ride in sport mode.
Heh, I'm looking at all the talk about high speed. Are the breaks going to work at 30mph for ebike sold for 15mph. Also the thing about bike and vehicle incidents. Not many car drivers expect a bike to be doing 30mph at intersections. That is one of the things I've noticed over 40yrs of bike riding. Car drivers don't see you and don't expect you to be fast. Like the Hill St cop show said, be careful out there people.
Ello. Greeny here. I really wonder what changing voltage does to acceleration, as I would like to find ways to get a bit more range on my Engine Pro. Right now I can drive 2 times to work and back. But day 2 I lag a lot of performance due to low battery. I would like to even this out a bit
U need more amp hours.
@@regun2434 Thats the expensive solution haha
Running a 36v motor with a 48v battery!!!!
I think the motor will burn out. right?
I have a 36v dc motor and a 42v scooter battery, can i use them together?
Do you have a link to the 48v battery?
It's just the battery taken from my engwe ep2 pro